[INDOLOGY] iti in Sanskrit

Sun Nov 13 21:32:53 UTC 2022

Since Matthew mentioned MIA, I suppose I can share this presentation on
clausal complements in Middle Indic, which also contains some observations
on the use of iti in Sanskrit (and eṉ- and its cognates in Dravidian
languages):

https://www.dropbox.com/s/t6kq9y55x3oj6k8/presentation.pdf?dl=0

This is a talk I gave at Chicago in 2018. The work is still unpublished.

Andrew

On Sun, Nov 13, 2022 at 3:26 PM Sudalaimuthu Palaniappan via INDOLOGY <
indology at list.indology.info> wrote:

> Indology list archive is a valuable repository of knowledge. But the lack
> of proper search facility makes the information as good as lost and we have
> to repeat questions/discussions that are already in the archive. See
> https://list.indology.info/pipermail/indology/2015-July/041594.html. If a
> good search feature is enabled, all the past discussions will become
> accessible.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Palaniappan
>
>
>
>
>
> *From: *INDOLOGY <indology-bounces at list.indology.info> on behalf of
> Indology List <indology at list.indology.info>
> *Reply-To: *"George L. HART" <glhart at berkeley.edu>
> *Date: *Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 1:12 PM
> *To: *Indology List <indology at list.indology.info>
> *Subject: *Re: [INDOLOGY] iti in Sanskrit
>
>
>
> V.S. Rajam’s book is an essential one for students of classical Tamil,
> covering syntax, meter, morphology, etc. What I meant is that to my
> knowledge no one has made a substantial study of every use of eṉ in Sangam
> literature. Such a study might include uses of iti in early Sanskrit. For
> example, in modern Tamil we often find ēṉ eṉṟāl, “If you ask why,” which
> corresponds exactly to Sanskrit "kuta iti cet.” One wonders how old this
> usage is in both languages. George Hart
>
>
>
> On Nov 12, 2022, at 6:07 PM, rajam <rajam at earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> Dear List Members,
>
>
>
> George Hart said:
>
>
>
> /// I am sure many have noted that in Tamil, the word eṉ, which has
> equivalents in other Dravidian languages (an in Telugu, for example), is
> far more productive than Sanskrit iti. It occurs in various forms —
> adjective (eṉṉum), adverb (eṉṟu), noun (eṉpatu), finite verb (e.g.
> eṉkiṟārkaḷ), while in Sanskrit iti is only adverbial. It would be
> interesting to analyze the uses of eṉ in Sangam literature — I’m not sure
> anyone has done this. ///
>
>
>
> Just to kindle your memory …
>
>
>
> Please look into my book “A Reference Grammar of Classical Tamil Poetry,
> V.S. Rajam, American Philosophical Society, 1992”
>
>
>
> Thanks and regards,
>
> V.S. Rajam
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Nov 12, 2022, at 12:54 PM, George L. HART via INDOLOGY <
> indology at list.indology.info> wrote:
>
>
>
> I am sure many have noted that in Tamil, the word eṉ, which has
> equivalents in other Dravidian languages (an in Telugu, for example), is
> far more productive than Sanskrit iti. It occurs in various forms —
> adjective (eṉṉum), adverb (eṉṟu), noun (eṉpatu), finite verb (e.g.
> eṉkiṟārkaḷ), while in Sanskrit iti is only adverbial. It would be
> interesting to analyze the uses of eṉ in Sangam literature — I’m not sure
> anyone has done this. Of course, the use of this construction could be an
> areal phenomenon — it is not necessarily true that its presence in early
> Sanskrit is due to Dravidian, though I think it is highly likely, given its
> richness in Dravidian languages. George Hart
>
>
>
> On Nov 12, 2022, at 1:08 PM, Tieken, H.J.H. (Herman) via INDOLOGY <
> indology at list.indology.info> wrote:
>
>
>
> I do not know if the question was about *iti *as an areal phenomenon. If
> so, see F.B.J. Kuiper, "The Genesis of a Linguistic Area", IIJ 1968, where,
> if I remember well, he compares Skt *iti* with Tamil *eṉṟu*.
>
> Herman
>
>
>
> Herman Tieken
>
> Stationsweg 58
>
> 2515 BP Den Haag
>
> The Netherlands
>
> 00 31 (0)70 2208127
>
> website: hermantieken.com
> ------------------------------
>
> *Van:* INDOLOGY <indology-bounces at list.indology.info> namens Madhav
> Deshpande via INDOLOGY <indology at list.indology.info>
> *Verzonden:* zaterdag 12 november 2022 17:34
> *Aan:* Olivelle, Joseph P <jpo at austin.utexas.edu>
> *CC:* indology at list.indology.info <indology at list.indology.info>
> *Onderwerp:* Re: [INDOLOGY] iti in Sanskrit
>
>
>
> If I remember correctly, the possibility of the "iti" constructions being
> an areal phenomena have been discussed  for many decades. The best person
> to provide information regarding this topic may be Hans Hock. I will see if
> I can locate any of these older publications.
>
>
> Madhav M. Deshpande
>
> Professor Emeritus, Sanskrit and Linguistics
>
> University of Michigan, Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA
>
> Senior Fellow, Oxford Center for Hindu Studies
>
> Adjunct Professor, National Institute of Advanced Studies, Bangalore, India
>
>
>
> [Residence: Campbell, California, USA]
>
>
>
>
>
> On Sat, Nov 12, 2022 at 6:28 AM Olivelle, Joseph P via INDOLOGY <
> indology at list.indology.info> wrote:
>
> See the many explanations of ‘iti’ in Gary Tubb and Emery Boose’s book
> “Scholastic Sanskrit”.
>
> Patrick
>
>
>
>
> > On Nov 12, 2022, at 8:10 AM, Brendan S. Gillon, Prof. via INDOLOGY <
> indology at list.indology.info> wrote:
> >
> > Dear colleagues,
> >
> > I am wondering if any of you know of articles on the use of `iti' in
> > Sanskrit.
> >
> > Best wishes,
> >
> > Brendan
> >
> > --
> >
> > Brendan S. Gillon                       email: brendan.gillon at mcgill.ca
> > Department of Linguistics
> > McGill University                       tel.:  001 514 398 4868
> > 1085, Avenue Docteur-Penfield
> > Montreal, Quebec                        fax.:  001 514 398 7088
> > H3A 1A7  CANADA
> >
> > webpage:
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwebpages.mcgill.ca%2Fstaff%2Fgroup3%2Fbgillo%2Fweb%2F&data=05%7C01%7C%7C40005a48e3d64c7af97308dac4b84054%7C31d7e2a5bdd8414e9e97bea998ebdfe1%7C0%7C0%7C638038592882519039%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=SHfWYYtZKaf%2FjbNNUQwJhnoaLp8V7WAqPSZGcXaH2xU%3D&reserved=0
> <https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwebpages.mcgill.ca%2Fstaff%2Fgroup3%2Fbgillo%2Fweb%2F&data=05%7C01%7Ch.j.h.tieken%40hum.leidenuniv.nl%7C295db7e7b8714862742908dac4cbed9c%7Cca2a7f76dbd74ec091086b3d524fb7c8%7C0%7C0%7C638038677398630127%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=yyUoPrr6Ns2Gi1p2wTJO5kICrdegnoY5Ox6uJigVykk%3D&reserved=0>
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > INDOLOGY mailing list
> > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info
> >
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flist.indology.info%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Findology&data=05%7C01%7C%7C40005a48e3d64c7af97308dac4b84054%7C31d7e2a5bdd8414e9e97bea998ebdfe1%7C0%7C0%7C638038592882519039%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=GhfFm1DiIXicrk1S%2Fzv%2F6so6YoU5TCCdm0kHp6esElI%3D&reserved=0
> <https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flist.indology.info%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Findology&data=05%7C01%7Ch.j.h.tieken%40hum.leidenuniv.nl%7C295db7e7b8714862742908dac4cbed9c%7Cca2a7f76dbd74ec091086b3d524fb7c8%7C0%7C0%7C638038677398630127%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=wsgOjkowtEL%2FaruE2IcKVJP181LGzqIrImXVewIbXaM%3D&reserved=0>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> INDOLOGY mailing list
> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info
> https://list.indology.info/mailman/listinfo/indology
> <https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flist.indology.info%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Findology&data=05%7C01%7Ch.j.h.tieken%40hum.leidenuniv.nl%7C295db7e7b8714862742908dac4cbed9c%7Cca2a7f76dbd74ec091086b3d524fb7c8%7C0%7C0%7C638038677398630127%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=wsgOjkowtEL%2FaruE2IcKVJP181LGzqIrImXVewIbXaM%3D&reserved=0>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> INDOLOGY mailing list
> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info
> https://list.indology.info/mailman/listinfo/indology
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> INDOLOGY mailing list
> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info
> https://list.indology.info/mailman/listinfo/indology
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list
> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info
> https://list.indology.info/mailman/listinfo/indology
>
> _______________________________________________
> INDOLOGY mailing list
> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info
> https://list.indology.info/mailman/listinfo/indology
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <https://list.indology.info/pipermail/indology/attachments/20221113/0dcf8aa9/attachment.htm>