[INDOLOGY] Mind and moon

Sun Jul 31 09:52:30 UTC 2016

Dear colleagues,

I assume that, when Renou associated etymologically *candramas* with *manas*,
he may have had Senart’s explanation in his mind. Senart had explained this
association as being based on a play on the roots √*mā* in *candramās*
“moon” and √*man* in *manas*: Émile Senart, *Essai sur la légende du
Buddha: Son caractère et ses origines*, 2e éd., revue et suivie d’un index,
Paris 1882: E. Leroux, p. 94, n. 3 "Jeu de mots sur *mans *et *candrama*,
radical *man *et radical *ma* (sic)".

Cf. also Paul Deussen, *Allgemeine Geschichte der Philosophie: Mit
besonderer Berücksichtigung der Religionen*, Leipzig 1920: F.A. Brockhaus,
(4. Auflage), I, 1, p. 156, “dass endlich sein *Manas* zum Monde wird, hat
vielleicht seinen Grund darin, dass die ruhige Klarheit des Mondlichts
(welches ja auch nach Goethe „die Seele löst“) als Symbol des
Intellektuellen erschien.”

The best article on this topic is probably: Jan Gonda, “Mind and
Moon”, in: *Deyadharma,
Studies in Memory of Dr. D.C. Sircar*, edited by Gouriswar Bhattacharya,
Delhi: Sri Satguru Publications, distributed by Indian Book Center, 1986
(Sri Garib Dass Oriental Series ; no. 33), pp. 147-160 = *Selected Studies*,
Leiden *et* *al.* 1991: Brill, vol. VI, pt. 2, pp. 423-436.

With best regards,

Seishi Karashima
2016-07-28 17:35 GMT+09:00 <dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk>:

> Thanks, Valerie, for the Varahamihira quote. It shows an extension of the
> microcosm idea to
> the planets, keeping the mind-moon pair (but not the eye-sun one). The
> mind-moon pair is
> one of the most stable of these pairings, as well as the least explicable.
>
> Verbal similarities can be very profound, especially in the Brahmanas. But
> in this case I'm not
> sure there is much verbal similarity: in RV 10.90.13 the words are manas
> and candramas (in
> Brhadaranyaka Up. 3.2.13 it's manas and candra, which is even less
> similar). It's not a
> similarity of the same order as indra-indha (Satapatha Br 6.1.1.2; Brh Up
> 4.2.2). That made
> me wonder whether Renou, in invoking word-play as an explanation, was
> misled by his
> knowledge of the Indo-European cognates of Skt mas and manas.
>
> With best wishes,
>
> Dermot
>
> On 28 Jul 2016 at 7:45, Valerie Roebuck wrote:
>
> I think it's meant to be a bit more profound than a verbal similarity -
> though of course these
> were widely thought not to be merely coincidental. We find the same
> correspondence in
> astrological texts, too, e.g. in Varahamihira's Bhajjataka, Chapter 2 v.
> 1a, where the seven
> planets of the ancient world are placed on the macrocosmic man of Time.
>
> kalatma dina-krn manas tuhinagu satva kujo jño vaco jivo jñana-sukhe
> sita´s ca madano
> dukha dine´satmaja  /
>
>
> The Sun ['Day-maker'] is the self (atman) of Time, the Moon ['Cool-rayed']
> his mind (manas),
> Mars ['Earth-born'] his courage, Mercury ['Knower'] his speech, Jupiter
> ['Life'] his knowledge
> and happiness, Venus ['White One'] his desire, and Saturn ['Son of the
> Lord of Day'] his
> suffering.
>
> The Moon has a very important place in Indian astrology, but here perhaps
> it is regarded as
> representing a less profound (because more changeable?) level of being
> than the Sun.
>
> Valerie J Roebuck
> Manchester, UK
>
>     On 28 Jul 2016, at 06:32, naresh keerthi <nakeerthi at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>     Renou Etudes Vediques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words.
>
>     I don't have access to this source, but is it possible that this
> conjecture is based on the
>     similarity of mati = mind [Sanskrit, but also used in Tamil] and mati
> = moon in Tamil?
>
>
>
>     Best,
>     Naresh Keerthi
>     National Institute of Advanced Studies,
>     Bangalore
>
>
>
>
>
>     ------------------------------
>
>     Message: 2
>     Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2016 10:47:45 +0100
>     From: dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk
>     To: indology at list.indology.info
>     Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon
>     Message-ID: <57988341.1727.8FD05B at dermot.grevatt.force9.co.uk>
>     Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
>     Can anyone explain why the mind is the microcosmic counterpart of the
> moon?
>     The
>     correspondence appears in Rgveda 10.90.13 and in countless passages of
> the
>     Brahmanas
>     and Upanisads, but it's not obvious like breath and wind.
>
>     Renou ?tudes V?diques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. I find
> that hard
>     to accept,
>     because the words (candra-mas and manas) are not very similar (they
> are in
>     Latin, but the
>     sages didn't have access to an Indo-European comparative dictionary).
>
>     Could the connection be through soma (often linked or identified with
> the moon),
>     since the
>     mind is called a pavitra through which poetic insight (dhI) flows and
> becomes
>     offerings
>     (Gonda Vision of the Vedic Poets pp. 278-9)?
>
>     Or is it that the mind, like the moon, is constant though its content
> continually
>     changes?
>
>     --
>     Dermot Killingley
>     9, Rectory Drive,
>     Gosforth,
>     Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT
>     Phone (0191) 285 8053
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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> --
> Dermot Killingley
> 9, Rectory Drive,
> Gosforth,
> Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT
> Phone (0191) 285 8053
>
>
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