Re: [INDOLOGY] Patañjali's syntax

[Adriano Aprigliano]

Right, Hans,

This usage is also referred to by MW (ततो देवा एतं वज्रं ददृशुर् यद् अपः , " the gods then saw this thunderbolt, to wit , the water " S3Br.)

It seems to be the best possibility so far, but hard to interpret, always confusing this use of yad...

Thanks to all

Prof. Dr. Adriano Aprigliano
Área de Língua e Literatura Latina
 
Faculdade de Filosofia, Letras e Ciências Humanas
Universidade de São Paulo
São Paulo, Brasil








Em 30/10/2013, às 12:21, Hock, Hans Henrich escreveu:

> Dear All,
> 
> A clue as to how to interpret yad apazabdaH may lie in the morphology of apabhASitavai, which is a Vedic formation; not also the Vedic particles ha vai. This may make it possible to interpret the passage mleccho ha vai eSo yad apazabdaH as an instance of what I have termed the "invariable yad-construction" (see the grammatical notes in my UpaniSadic Reader); so the translation would be something like this 'That indeed is barbarous [taking mleccha as adjective], namely/viz. incorrect speech.'
> 
> All the best,
> 
> Hans Henrich Hock
> 
> 
> 
> On 30 Oct 2013, at 09:06, Adriano Aprigliano wrote:
> 
>> Thanks to Dominik W. and Lars F. for the propositions. 
>> 
>> I think yad is the main problem in fact... and still. It is solved by Lars as 'because': the syntax becomes smooth in terms of order, but still taking apazabdah as bahuvriihi sounds to me quite strange. 
>> 
>> As for Naageza's explanation brought up by Dominik, it leaves yad out, as far as I could gather from the translation. 
>> 
>> Understanding mleccha as an adjective of apazabda, albeit uncommon, as noted by Naageza himself, seems rather ok. But next the text goes: mlecchaah maa bhumety adhyeyam vyaakaranam. 
>> 
>> So it seems to me that maybe the commentators were a bit at lost with that construction themselves, don't you think?
>> 
>> Best
>> 
>> (first response went just to D. Wujastyk, sorry)
>> 
>> Prof. Dr. Adriano Aprigliano
>> Área de Língua e Literatura Latina
>>  
>> Faculdade de Filosofia, Letras e Ciências Humanas
>> Universidade de São Paulo
>> São Paulo, Brasil
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Em 30/10/2013, às 11:40, Dominik Wujastyk escreveu:
>> 
>>> This exact point was discussed in the Pradīpa and clarified further in the Uddyota.   One might think, Nāgeśa said, that the word mleccha would usually refer to a person or a place; how could it refer to a bad word?  But in this case it is a term of criticism.  "A bad word (apaśabda) is really despicable (mleccha)."  
>>> 
>>> ("Bad word" is of course probably not one's final choice for translating apaśabda.)
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Dr Dominik Wujastyk
>>> Department of South Asia, Tibetan and Buddhist Studies,
>>> University of Vienna,
>>> Spitalgasse 2-4, Courtyard 2, Entrance 2.1
>>> 1090 Vienna, Austria
>>> and 
>>> Adjunct Professor, 
>>> Division of Health and Humanities,
>>> St. John's Research Institute, Bangalore, India.
>>> Project | home page | HSSA | PGP
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 30 October 2013 13:38, Adriano Aprigliano <aprigliano at usp.br> wrote:
>>> Dear colleagues,
>>> 
>>> I have been having doubts on how to translate this MBhāṣ sentence (Kielhorn, p.2, line 8):
>>> 
>>> te'surāḥ. te surā helayo helaya iti kurvantaḥ parābabhūvuḥ. tasmād brāhmaṇena na mlecchitavai nāpabhāṣitavai. mleccho ha vā eṣa yad apaśabdaḥ.
>>> 
>>> The problem is on the last sentence, what to make of that yad apaśabdaḥ. I start with ' for this one/he is indeed a mleccha...". 
>>> 
>>> Any suggestions?
>>> 
>>> best wishes
>>> 
>>> Prof. Dr. Adriano Aprigliano
>>> Área de Língua e Literatura Latina
>>>  
>>> Faculdade de Filosofia, Letras e Ciências Humanas
>>> Universidade de São Paulo
>>> São Paulo, Brasil
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> INDOLOGY mailing list
>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info
>>> http://listinfo.indology.info
>>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> INDOLOGY mailing list
>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info
>> http://listinfo.indology.info
> 



-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <https://list.indology.info/pipermail/indology/attachments/20131030/85a4cca3/attachment.htm>