[INDOLOGY] Claude

[Agnes Korn]

Dear all,

I agree with Hans Henrich that Hindi-Urdu jigar is probably a Persian 
borrowing.

In Persian, jigar is regular from a preform such as yakar-(+ending).
Other IE cognates can be found in EWAia 
(https://archive.org/details/mayrhofer-EWA/Mayrhofer_EWA%20v2%20%28na-ha%29%201996/), 
of course.

The statement in "Claude" that "The initial *h₁y- became "y" in Iranian 
languages" is true for Persian and some other Ir. languages, but NOT 
true for Iranian in general.
Likewise incorrect are Middle Persian forms cited in this thread that 
preserve the middle -k-. This changed to -g- before MP texts start to be 
attested.

y- also changed to j- in some on IA, I think, but I don't know whether 
any IA language would have regular jagr- from yakr.(t)-.
Here's the entry from Turner: 
https://dsal.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/app/soas_query.py?page=601

Best,
Agnes

Le 08/08/2025 à 18:56, Matthew Kapstein via INDOLOGY a écrit :
> No one said it is from Arabic. It could be from any of a number of 
> languages. The point is that the west to east movement is plausible 
> long before the Delhi Sultanate- something that is confirmed by 
> numerous examples without awaiting my minor contribution.
> Matthew
>
>
>
> On Fri, Aug 8, 2025 at 18:51, Hock, Hans Henrich <hhhock at illinois.edu 
> <mailto:On Fri, Aug 8, 2025 at 18:51, Hock, Hans Henrich <<a href=>> 
> wrote:
>> OK, but jagri cannot be from Arabic, which has kbd
>>
>>> On Aug 8, 2025, at 11:19, Matthew Kapstein <mattkapstein at proton.me> 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>> Overall, I am not sure. In an article that I will share with the 
>>> list when it’s done, I think I demonstrate quite conclusively a west 
>>> Semitic, probably Arabic, input in a 10th c Sanskrit text from 
>>> Kashmir, with which there was some intertextuality with the KCT. But 
>>> of course I do not ask that you accept my arguments until you have 
>>> seen them.
>>>
>>> best,
>>> Matthew
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Aug 8, 2025 at 17:44, Hock, Hans Henrich via INDOLOGY < 
>>> indology at list.indology.info <mailto:On Fri, Aug 8, 2025 at 17:44, 
>>> Hock, Hans Henrich via INDOLOGY <<a href=>> wrote:
>>>> Overall, I think Madhav’s suggestion that jagri is a vernacularized 
>>>> form of yak.rt, (re)borrowed into Sanskrit, makes the best sense. 
>>>> Hindi-Urdu jigar, by contrast, is most likely one of the many 
>>>> Persian words that came into the language during the extended 
>>>> period of Persianate Muslim rule
>>>>
>>>> Best wishes
>>>>
>>>> Hans Henrich
>>>>
>>>>> On Aug 8, 2025, at 10:15, Madhav Deshpande <mmdesh at umich.edu> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> 
>>>>> It is indeed!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Aug 8, 2025 at 8:13 AM Hock, Hans Henrich < 
>>>>> hhhock at illinois.edu> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>     Shouldn’t that be yak.rt?
>>>>>
>>>>>>     On Aug 8, 2025, at 09:59, Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY <
>>>>>>     indology at list.indology.info> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>     https://claude.ai/share/2fe502db-185f-447d-b742-88e87ff1c17c
>>>>>>     <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://claude.ai/share/2fe502db-185f-447d-b742-88e87ff1c17c__;!!DZ3fjg!_WKarraAktCE2BosanC9Ju9VfbwFiIzLmd1OK4_ZcSR4merfVrsNbd2ofD1GOkmBQaMN1ZxVE5C40zKvmwL_gcXzDILU$>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>     Some interesting connections of the Persian word jigar to
>>>>>>     Sanskrit word taker for liver.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>     Madhav Deshpande
>>>>>>
>>>>>>     _______________________________________________
>>>>>>     INDOLOGY mailing list
>>>>>>     INDOLOGY at list.indology.info
>>>>>>     https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://list.indology.info/mailman/listinfo/indology__;!!DZ3fjg!_W
>>>>>
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