[INDOLOGY] The Buddhist term sutta

Tue May 11 19:44:05 UTC 2021

  Hello Artur,

  I see your point, and it resonates with things I have thought. In the
period in which I am most interested, the exact original etymon of MIA
*sutta* is largely irrelevant—what is crucial is knowing how the term was
understood in the period, namely as equivalent to Sanskrit *sūtra*—and
therefore I have not intervened in the discussion. I believe in the
philological method, and in the absolute need for its technical rigor and
intricacy. At the same time, I personally envision philology as a tool, a
wonderful tool but a tool after all, that can allow us to enrich and deepen
our knowledge of a social, historical, or linguistic past. I understand,
though, that other people do treat philology as a goal in itself, and I
have no objection to that.
  However, I am not sure whether this is exactly the case here. In the
specific case of the etymology of MIA *sutta*, I would argue that knowing
what exactly the practitioners of the śramaṇic religions viewed as closest
to their sacred discourses can indeed tell us about ancient social
understandings, affinities, or tensions (did they envision their texts as
more akin to the Vedic hymns or to the orthodox ritual manuals?) and about
the chronology of those dynamics.
   I wish, though, that when engaging not only with the general public but
with the field itself, we could be more explicit about the social,
historical, or linguistic relevance of a given philological problem. What
exactly is at stake behind a technical conundrum is not always
crystal-clear even to the professional.

  *namaskaromi*,

  Diego

On Tue, May 11, 2021 at 2:04 PM Artur Karp <karp at uw.edu.pl> wrote:

> I have long asked myself about the point of doing Indology in its purely
> philological guise.
>
> The Angulimala-sutta conveys the images of violence and offers suggestions
> for resolving conflicts - irrespective of whether the Pali suffix -sutta is
> derived from the OIA -su-ukta or -sutra.
>
> But, perhaps, this differentiation affects our understanding of the text?
>
> Artur
>
>
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> wt., 11 maj 2021 o 19:12 Artur Karp <karp at uw.edu.pl> napisał(a):
>
>> Dear colleagues,
>> the question of the etymology of the Pali term sutta is interesting in
>> itself.
>>
>> But - can its resolution broaden our understanding of the institution of
>> slavery in ancient India?
>> Would it help us to better understand the ideological bases of genocidal
>> practices directed against tribal communities?
>> The phenomenon of untouchability?
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Artur
>>
>>
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>>
>> wt., 11 maj 2021 o 18:47 Rupert Gethin via INDOLOGY <
>> indology at list.indology.info> napisał(a):
>>
>>> Could someone confirm the wider Prakrit evidence?
>>>
>>> Tim commented with reference to the Pali commentarial explanation of
>>> *sutta* as *suvutta*:
>>>
>>> But this is not really much to support *sutta* < *sūkta*, since the
>>> regular Pāli form parallel to *sūkta* includes the glide -v-, as Skt
>>> *ukta* ~ Pāli *vutta* and similarly in other MIA languages, which all
>>> seem to preserve the initial v- of the verbal root **vac*- (Pischel
>>> §337), despite the vowel change a > u before a labial (§104).
>>>
>>>
>>> But unless I am misreading something here, Pischel (§337) notes that
>>> Jaina Śaurasenī, Śaurasenī and Māgadhī all have utta < ukta
>>>
>>> And Turner’s* A comparative dictionary of the Indo-Aryan languages *
>>> includes Prakrit *sutta* under *sūkta*:
>>>
>>> 13545 *sūktá* ʻ well recited ʼ RV., ʻ eloquent ʼ MatsyaP. [su -- 2,
>>> uktá -- ]
>>> Pk. *sutta* -- ʻ handsomely said ʼ; OG. *sūta* ʻ speaking properly ʼ.
>>>
>>> https://dsal.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/app/soas_query.py?page=780
>>>
>>> Rupert
>>> --
>>> *Rupert Gethin*
>>> Professor of Buddhist Studies
>>>
>>> University of Bristol
>>> Department of Religion and Theology
>>> 3 Woodland Road
>>> Bristol BS8 1TB, UK
>>>
>>> Email: Rupert.Gethin at bristol.ac.uk <Rupert.Gethin at bristol.ac.uk>
>>>
>>>
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>>
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