Re: [INDOLOGY] Was Aśoka an iconoclast?

[Nagaraj Paturi]

Artur-ji,

Dr Ambedkar's

 Asoka said, "As I venerate the Buddha, the Enlightened One, there is no
need to worship any other deity"

need not be taken too literally Asoka said it in so many words in an edict
or such document.

It is just a narration style, communicating the intention of a character
behind his actions  in the narrative by describing as though he expressed
the intention. So looking for an edict or such document with these words or
asking for such a document may not be a fruitful exercise.

You say,

"The question of 'the emergence of images and idols in India" apart what
can be seen here is an example of falsification of historical record, done
purposefully, with political agenda in mind."

What do you think is the agenda ?

To me, it all seems to be simple : 1. Whether the quoted words indicate
replacement of older deities with Buddha, the Enlightened one or removal of
idols is not clear.

If the qoted words are to be interpreted as indicating removal of idols,
then the logic is :  Dr Ambedkar was opposed to idol worship. He liked
Buddhism and Asoka. He thought his favorites Buddhism and Asoka were also
like himself opposed to idol worship.

2. Dr Ambedkar's focus was on how Brahmin influence on State affairs,
alleged and theorized by him as the result of belief of queens in Village
deities etc., was reduced from the time of Asoka.

On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 10:14 PM, Artur Karp <karp at uw.edu.pl> wrote:

> Dear Matthew,
>
> >> Asoka after embracing Buddhism discontinued this practice and removed
> the idols of such deities.
>
> The meanig of the sentence is clear. According to Dr. Ambedkar Aśoka
> 'removed the idols of such deities'.
>
> Removed - gently?
>
> The problem is that no edict mentions Aśoka stating:  "As I venerate the
> Buddha, the Enlightened One, there is no need to worship any other deity".
>
> The question of 'the emergence of images and idols in India" apart what
> can be seen here is an example of falsification of historical record, done
> purposefully, with political agenda in mind.
>
> Artur
>
> 2017-05-26 18:21 GMT+02:00 Matthew Kapstein <mkapstei at uchicago.edu>:
>
>> I have no idea about just what Dr. Ambedkar may have had in mind in
>> regard to Asoka,
>> but I do think that the question of the emergence of images and idols in
>> India should be empirically focused.
>>
>> See, for instance, Michael Willis,
>> The Archeology of Hindu Ritual: Temples and the Establishment of the Gods
>> (Cambridge 2009).
>>
>> Although Willis prudently avoids the question of beginnings, some
>> interesting suggestions may be gleaned
>> from section 2.7 "From Private Sacrifice to Public Spectacle," pp.
>> 113-122.
>>
>> One may also wish to consult, for evidence of deity-worship in early
>> Buddhism, Robert DeCaroli,
>> Haunting the Buddha: Indian Popular Religion and the Formation of
>> Buddhism (OUP 2004).
>>
>> Matthew
>>
>> Matthew Kapstein
>> Directeur d'études,
>> Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes
>>
>> Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies,
>> The University of Chicago
>> ------------------------------
>>
>>
>


-- 
Nagaraj Paturi

Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA.


BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra

BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala

Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies

FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,

(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )


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