[INDOLOGY] R: warriors v soldiers

Sun Oct 16 23:40:06 UTC 2016

Dear Patrick, and All,

Caṇḍālas are said to have served as perimeter guardians of the army of the famed king Jayāpīḍa, as attested in Kalhaṇa's _Rājataraṅgiṇī_ (at RT 4.516).  Not all who would have fought were kṣatriya-s.

John

________________________________
From: INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info] on behalf of Nagaraj Paturi [nagarajpaturi at gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, October 14, 2016 10:59 PM
To: Paolo Eugenio Rosati
Cc: Indology List
Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] R: warriors v soldiers

Patrick,

I was able to see the table due to your offline help. I expected a community-wise classification in the table.

In any case, it is common place knowledge among Indologists who studied varNa and caste systems that varNa is, to a large extent, textual and what is real is in fact caste. Kshatriya is a varNa category drawn from older Sanskritic texts and used to attribute to individuals of several different tribes and castes who took over roles similar to the ones enlisted as the dharma of the Kshatriyas in the Sanskrit texts. The roles that these tribes and castes took over range from the foot soldier to the emperor. In other words, most of the kings, emperors, soldiers, military officials of all ranks hailed from not the Kshatriya varNa but several different tribes and castes.

Kshatriyization of tribes and castes, its role in the upward mobility of tribes and castes, the concept of Sachchhudras floated during medieval times to 'explain' the Brahma-Kshatriya behaviour and the Kshatriya roles of different 'S'udra' communities, etc. are all beaten track among the Indology and Indian history discussions.

I shall provide you specific examples and references, depending on your purpose and question.

Since it is such a beaten track, many other members of the list may also be able to help you.

On Sat, Oct 15, 2016 at 1:41 AM, Paolo Eugenio Rosati <paoloe.rosati at gmail.com<redir.aspx?REF=JkysT_nBa-9XJJYmzq8s2ipqDEevXmm-8OymgzNtuOc0k3PpHPbTCAFtYWlsdG86cGFvbG9lLnJvc2F0aUBnbWFpbC5jb20.>> wrote:
Patrick, I can say that Pallava and Cola rulers probably used Tribal people as soldiers as testified by some sculptural reliefs of "victorious Durga", where two worshippers at her sides are represented with somatic traits of Tribals---and self-cutting their heads or flesh from their thigh. I think your question is interesting.

Paolo

Paolo E. Rosati
Oriental Archaeologist
PhD candidate in Civilisations of Asia & Africa
Section: South Asia
Dep. Italian Institute of Oriental Studies (ISO)
'Sapienza' University of Rome

paoloe.rosati at uniroma1.it<redir.aspx?REF=C-Tl8JqMf_AYXyOfZan7p5Wcp2Xt05Gbph-VAImJrVA0k3PpHPbTCAFtYWlsdG86cGFvbG9lLnJvc2F0aUB1bmlyb21hMS5pdA..>
paoloe.rosati at gmail.com<redir.aspx?REF=JkysT_nBa-9XJJYmzq8s2ipqDEevXmm-8OymgzNtuOc0k3PpHPbTCAFtYWlsdG86cGFvbG9lLnJvc2F0aUBnbWFpbC5jb20.>
Mobile: (+39) 3387383472
Skype: paoloe.rosati
________________________________
Da: patrick mccartney<redir.aspx?REF=If-4w1xLEjpegJlYkjn3TTMzTqT7oCUscIakUNLdFa40k3PpHPbTCAFtYWlsdG86cHNkbWNjYXJ0bmV5QGdtYWlsLmNvbQ..>
Inviato: ‎14/‎10/‎2016 03:30
A: Indology List<redir.aspx?REF=4q9IuKY5x1Sqs0syYjZH22eeqCbZR-Z6RDzX2rSZwriW9HXpHPbTCAFtYWlsdG86aW5kb2xvZ3lAbGlzdC5pbmRvbG9neS5pbmZv>
Oggetto: [INDOLOGY] warriors v soldiers

Dear Friends,

Please forgive the possibly naive nature of this question, but was it the case that all warriors were considered to be of the same kṣatriya class? Or, was it possible that the 'officers' were kṣatriyas and the 'foot soldiers' were perhaps of a different caste, i.e. enslaved śudras forced to fight? Is there any discussion of the militiary organisation according to ranks, size  and hierarchy similar to the table below?

Thanks in advance.

[Inline image 1]

All the best,

Patrick McCartney, PhD
Fellow
School of Culture, History & Language
College of the Asia-Pacific
The Australian National University
Canberra, Australia, 0200

Skype - psdmccartney
Phone + Whatsapp:  +61 414 954 748<tel:%2B61%20414%20954%20748>
Twitter - @psdmccartney

academia<redir.aspx?REF=72lPAoL14jF-arhTW7lMhO9P1kgkeSLW23TkUhOo_7KW9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwczovL2FudS1hdS5hY2FkZW1pYS5lZHUvcGF0cmlja21jY2FydG5leQ..>

  *

Linkedin<redir.aspx?REF=DdoPwRrgjKj7YttUEu2zNT0lcSR8nFvfaXQ8xf2LLlCW9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwczovL3d3dy5saW5rZWRpbi5jb20vcHJvZmlsZS92aWV3P2lkPTI0MTc1Njk3OCZ0cms9bmF2X3Jlc3BvbnNpdmVfdGFiX3Byb2ZpbGU.>

Edanz<redir.aspx?REF=_t9K8wdT3SsLJ5nSRG_WOftLpbSILY8yb8wcp_R7-yuW9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwczovL3d3dy5lZGFuemVkaXRpbmcuY29tL2V4cGVydC9hbnRocm9wb2xvZ3kvcGF0cmljay1tY2NhcnRuZXk.>

#yogabodyANU2016 symposium<redir.aspx?REF=s9RrZVr6r8nK6GEuOXDkt5Krq1HdAliNTovCGcQpBdCW9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwczovL3d3dy55b3V0dWJlLmNvbS93YXRjaD92PVg4MEt4VzJiYjB3> <redir.aspx?REF=lGx81EdaMhqCDJ8rcstdvtQ6dCy92s0x1WVWEYd28IaW9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwOi8vY2hsLmFudS5lZHUuYXUvbmV3cy1ldmVudHMvZXZlbnRzLzY1OC95b2dhLWFuZC1ib2R5LXBhc3QtYW5kLXByZXNlbnQtc3ltcG9zaXVtPyN0YWI.>

Ep1 - Imagining Sanskrit Land<redir.aspx?REF=YOHWYVPsw7-ew9A-0cHKqF0gPP347TTqXdXM3tGKCNKW9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwczovL3lvdXR1LmJlL2pNaTd0a1BCYko0>

Ep 2 - Total-am<redir.aspx?REF=ewcLurhrZF-R_WlUd_SDqnVChaLovKFuMzqq3pIoHC-W9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwczovL3lvdXR1LmJlLzd0QXA4bTlSSFBV>

Ep 3 - Jalam ≠ Chillum<redir.aspx?REF=Wai5hrrEtwTKvy0xSfgOMELfbhJPATQlO_nbZq_D-SmW9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwczovL3lvdXR1LmJlL2NMWmV1Q1RfbXdR>

Ep 4 - It's Time to get Married<redir.aspx?REF=HsHd0EJaG9C6ftrk_O8Oaw0WE0UGV69zRf7Eudjcl9qW9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwczovL3d3dy55b3V0dWJlLmNvbS93YXRjaD92PV9CM3VuN2FIRUFj>

A Day in our Ashram<redir.aspx?REF=B0WFI6yx9F4LcE0m-j-p1RXYXwXWz-IzAB-r3JI7ezuW9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwczovL3d3dy55b3V0dWJlLmNvbS9yZXN1bHRzP3NlYXJjaF9xdWVyeT1laytkaW4raGFtYWFyZSthc2hyYW0rbWVpbg..>

Stop animation short film of Shakuntala <redir.aspx?REF=NW8iR4ybzHAzZ12fuhWBt-ck4zzPfn-z7iDXmJqn5gmW9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwczovL3d3dy55b3V0dWJlLmNvbS93YXRjaD92PUxWcUJEXzJQNFBn>

Forced to Clean Human Waste<redir.aspx?REF=zxK9HEwVVvK3lo8Bk2lnTb0-NDUIIvls7n_dQLKvhaCW9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwOi8veW91dHUuYmUveTNYZmpid3FDX2c.>

One of my favourite song<redir.aspx?REF=_4mHmhF2MtjL2ZvBMKAW0dEXQGGVPIZ2yZxYBe_qpk-W9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwOi8vdHJpbml0eXJvb3RzLmJhbmRjYW1wLmNvbS90cmFjay9hbGwtd2UtYmU.>s

_______________________________________________
INDOLOGY mailing list
INDOLOGY at list.indology.info<redir.aspx?REF=v3IzTo8DxT2310YDlam42PI_AP58nvVrNzur99qo7CCW9HXpHPbTCAFtYWlsdG86SU5ET0xPR1lAbGlzdC5pbmRvbG9neS5pbmZv>
indology-owner at list.indology.info<redir.aspx?REF=lrVYc6WAT8sLn9LKdGA4ZYc9sAWRGaPHId6_Cjafc82W9HXpHPbTCAFtYWlsdG86aW5kb2xvZ3ktb3duZXJAbGlzdC5pbmRvbG9neS5pbmZv> (messages to the list's managing committee)
http://listinfo.indology.info<redir.aspx?REF=rCLPeTfT1A4VBM61_1wqxD_8nGRSDK5TcKtgKUB6aPyW9HXpHPbTCAFodHRwOi8vbGlzdGluZm8uaW5kb2xvZ3kuaW5mbw..> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe)

--
Nagaraj Paturi

Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA.

Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies

FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,

(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <https://list.indology.info/pipermail/indology/attachments/20161016/a97f245e/attachment.htm>