[INDOLOGY] Metrically restored Rgveda and traditional recitation

Tue Jan 13 12:58:41 UTC 2015

[resending, bec. it did not seem to come through last night]

Madhav,

AiB may be referring to other cases of hypometric or hypermetric verse than the sort arising when a dissyllabic ia/iya or ua/uva is reduced by sandhi to ya or va.  In fact, I'd say AiB *must* be referring to other cases, since there is no way for the kṣaipra sandhi to produce a hypermetric (adhikabhāva, in AiB) stanza.

Tim

Timothy Lubin
Professor of Religion and Adjunct Professor of Law
Washington and Lee University
Lexington, Virginia 24450

http://home.wlu.edu/~lubint
http://wlu.academia.edu/TimothyLubin
https://twitter.com/TimothyLubin
ḷ

From: Madhav Deshpande <mmdesh at umich.edu<mailto:mmdesh at umich.edu>>
Date: Monday, January 12, 2015 8:11 PM
To: Tim Lubin <lubint at wlu.edu<mailto:lubint at wlu.edu>>, "indology at list.indology.info<mailto:indology at list.indology.info>" <indology at list.indology.info<mailto:indology at list.indology.info>>
Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Metrically restored Rgveda and traditional recitation

Hello Tim,

     I myself was surprised by the statement from the Aitareya Brāhmaṇa that I have cited.  How to bridge that statement and the treatment in the Prātiśākhyas that you refer to is an important question.  One possibility is that the analytical tradition of the Prātiśākhyas became consciously aware of the metrical deviations and tried to account for them, while the tradition represented by the AB did not much care for this issue.  This is perhaps analogous to the earliest oral traditions of the Veda did produce variant branch Samhitās with different readings, but with the later development of the rigorous methods of recitation like the various permutational Vikṛtipāṭhas, further splitting of the Saṃhitās was arrested.  With metrical deviations, there is a similar possibility.  That is just my guess.  Best,

Madhav

On Tue, Jan 13, 2015 at 6:26 AM, Lubin, Tim <LubinT at wlu.edu<mailto:LubinT at wlu.edu>> wrote:
But, Madhav, isn't it the case that the Prātiśākhyas (e.g., Ṛkpr. 8.22 and 17.14) recognize that in Vedic hymns y and v must often be pronounced i and u?  Isn't indeed the Taittirīya convention of writing, e.g., suvar an explicit acknowledgement that it is dissyllabic, despite the convention elsewhere (where, nevertheless, a dissyllabic pronunciation might tacitly be acknowledged -- albeit this is a special case, a fixed form in TS.

Tim

Timothy Lubin
Professor of Religion and Adjunct Professor of Law
Washington and Lee University
Lexington, Virginia 24450

http://home.wlu.edu/~lubint
http://wlu.academia.edu/TimothyLubin
https://twitter.com/TimothyLubin
ḷ

From: Madhav Deshpande <mmdesh at umich.edu<mailto:mmdesh at umich.edu>>
Date: Monday, January 12, 2015 6:43 PM
To: Dipak Bhattacharya <dipak.d2004 at gmail.com<mailto:dipak.d2004 at gmail.com>>
Cc: Indology <indology at list.indology.info<mailto:indology at list.indology.info>>
Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Metrically restored Rgveda and traditional recitation

It is not clear how much the tradition was bothered by metrical inconsistencies.  There is an interesting passage in the Aitareya Brāhmana that says: na vā ekenākṣareṇa chandāṃsi viyanti na dvābhyām.  Even by a deviation of up to  two syllables, the tradition did not consider the meter to be violated.  The text titled Vedavicāra (19th century) that I am editing and translating cites this passages and extends it further: ekena dvābhyām ity upalakṣaṇam, tasmād akṣaranyūnādhikabhāvena chandāṃsi nānyathā bhavanti.  Thus, it seems to be that "metrically restored RV" is a purely modern creation.  If the Brāhmaṇa texts were not bothered by deviations of meters up to two syllables, can we be so certain that the authors of the Vedic hymns were so bothered.  There is a possibility that "metrically restoring texts" could be something like a modern hyper-correction.  Modern reciters of the Vedas that I am familiar with do not seem to worry about reciting a metrically correct text.  While they seem to show interest in reciting the various Pāṭhas and their permutations, I am not at all certain that they are scanning the recited text for metrical deviations.

Madhav Deshpande

On Mon, Jan 12, 2015 at 8:46 PM, Dipak Bhattacharya <dipak.d2004 at gmail.com<mailto:dipak.d2004 at gmail.com>> wrote:
It is the metrically restored text which the Ṛk-Prātiśākhya enjoins for recitation. I have heard the disyllabic recitation from at least two Vedic reciters and was myself advised to do so with the few verses that I had to learn to utter as a child. But I have not examined each and every case of recitation.  I hope Professor Deshpande has the same experience
Best
DB

On Mon, Jan 12, 2015 at 8:12 PM, Harry Spier <hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com<mailto:hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com>> wrote:
Dear list members,

Do any members know if when the Rg Veda is recited by Vaidikas if that recitation agrees with the metrically restored Rg Veda or if they recite it like the written text with the metrical anomalies.

Thanks,
Harry Spier

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--
Madhav M. Deshpande
Professor of Sanskrit and Linguistics
Department of Asian Languages and Cultures
202 South Thayer Street, Suite 6111
The University of Michigan
Ann Arbor, MI 48104-1608, USA

--
Madhav M. Deshpande
Professor of Sanskrit and Linguistics
Department of Asian Languages and Cultures
202 South Thayer Street, Suite 6111
The University of Michigan
Ann Arbor, MI 48104-1608, USA

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