Word for Heart

[RM. Krishnan]

At 10:47 AM 11/24/00 +0100, André Signoret <sanskrit at CLUB-INTERNET.FR> wrote:

>You are quite right and all attempts to derive Skt "hRd-" from, say,
>Dravidian, is nothing but romance !
>"Modern" linguistics, just like modern music, art, etc. indulge in somewhat
>provoking theories ! The "esprit critique" seems to have left our world...

It is not out of romance but out of seriousness, I made my 
statement.  Tamil poet Bharathi once said,"there is no point in talking 
about ancient stories among ourselves secretly; if there is a talented 
scholarship, even foreigners have to know and appreciate it".

I would greatly appreciate and learn, if someone establishes the etymology 
through Indo-European the connection of the word 'hRdaya' with the meaning 
related to 'blood', and not just sound changes.

I do not have to quote Monier-Williams here about the standard derivation. 
I am sure that you are aware.


>Innovation is quite necessary but must be kept within "reasonable" limits. A
>linguist is not a poet even if there is a pinch of poetry in a number of
>etymological commentaries. For instance, Basque "BIHOTZ" (heart) = two
>ticks, two sounds (BI + OTS) !
>
>Etymology IMO has three functions :
>
>1° A normal one. Such is the sequence hRd-, cor, etc...
>2° A mnemotechnical one. i.e Engl. "jump" and Skt. "jhampaa-"
>3° A letter-game as interesting as Scrabble or others.

Such condescending remarks do not take us further, unless we want to 
restrict Indology with Sanskritology (which would be a great loss for the 
subject). I get a feeling as if I am a country bumpkin in a hall of 
Pandits. Otherwise, How do I understand the value judgement given above? 
Perhaps the Pundits can enlighten or correct a country bumpkin, once in a 
while.



>----- Original Message -----
>From: Valerie J Roebuck <vjroebuck at APPLEONLINE.NET>
>To: <INDOLOGY at LISTSERV.LIV.AC.UK>
>Sent: Friday, November 24, 2000 9:21 AM
>Subject: Re: Word for Heart
>
>
> > Surely Sanskrit hRdaya, "heart", is a suffixed form of hRd, with the same
> > meaning, representing the IE root found in e.g. Latin cor, cordis, Greek
> > ker and kardia, and the English word "heart" itself?
> >
> > Valerie J Roebuck
> > Manchester, UK

V. Iyer asked :

a) Are there any examples where the word-initial k-
from Dravidian changes to h- in Sanskrit?

I think there are many. I will list them in the following week. Please bear 
with me till then.

b) The medical discovery that that heart is a pump for
blood circulation is fairly recent and, ancients
naming the heart in any language may not have taken
this factor into consideration.

I did not say that they knew that the heart is a pump; I only said that we 
get the meaning of an organ handling blood in this way of looking (which is 
quite scientific).

These kind of words like kuruthi, kuruthayam must have predated the well 
developed civilization ( Mullai, Marutham and Neythal) . I think they 
belong to the most primitive life in Kurinji. When a primitive man, over 
extended time, has named blood as kuruthi, and he sees animals attacking 
humans (or the other way round) at the chest and the bleeding heart gets 
exposed as a result, the bleeding would continue at least for a few 
seconds. If the association of the word 'bleeding' with the word' blood' 
can be accepted in an Indo-European tongue English, why not kuruthi with 
kuruthayam in Tamil?

In those tougher times, men getting killed must be  a frequent phenomenon 
for a band of Homo Sapiens. I find it to be natural that heart is named 
kuruthayam by extension from kuruthi. One does not have to understand the 
pumping mechanism for naming. Just bleeding is enough.

With regards,
irAma.ki