Dear all,

I think the general caveat for use of AI holds here, too: never ask an AI about something where you don't know what you want the answer to be, because if you do, you will have no way of knowing whether the answer is correct or just convincing. 

In this case I'd assume that the esteemed colleagues involved in this conversation are fully able to check whether the claims made by Claude et al. are correct or not; but here, too, one ought not to assume that something is actually the case just because an AI has claimed it to be so.

All my best,

      Antonia

On Fri, 8 Aug 2025 at 20:47, Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY <indology@list.indology.info> wrote:

Dear Rolf,

     I am not an expert in all these languages. But from the information provided by Open.AI and Claude.AI, it seems to me that the Persian jigar is cognate with Sanskrit yakr̥t. The reason I am reluctant to think jagrī coming from Persian jigar, is that such a borrowing does not explain the ī at the end of jagrī, and then we have to assume that somehow the i of jigar changed to a of jagrī. That requires too many ad hoc changes. On the other hand, in numerous modern IA languages, the y of Sanskrit is replaced with j, and the r̥ is routinely pronounced as rī in North India. The loss of final Sanskrit consonants is a common feature of all Prakrit languages. Given these considerations, I see more of a clear line of connection between Sanskrit yakr̥t and your jagrī, than to the Persian word. This is my thinking.

Madhav

Madhav M. Deshpande

Professor Emeritus, Sanskrit and Linguistics

University of Michigan, Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA

Senior Fellow, Oxford Center for Hindu Studies

Adjunct Professor, National Institute of Advanced Studies, Bangalore, India

[Residence: Campbell, California, USA]

On Fri, Aug 8, 2025 at 9:57 AM Rolf Heinrich Koch <rolfheiner.koch@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear Madhav,

just learning the Open.ai system, I asked Open.ai exactly the same as you did with Claude.ai.

This is the answer (which I cannot fully understand):

The Persian word jigar (جگر), meaning “liver”, has a well-established history within the Indo-Iranian branch of the Indo-European language family. Here’s the full etymological breakdown:

---

🔹 1. Persian jigar (جگر) – meaning: liver

• In Classical Persian, jigar refers both to:

  • The anatomical liver, and

  • Metaphorical qualities like courage, passion, and deep emotion — much like how “heart” is used in English.

---

🔹 2. Etymology: from Middle and Old Iranian

• Middle Persian:

  • The word appears as jigar (same as modern) or jekar.

• Old Persian:

  • The word is not directly attested, but is reconstructed based on related Avestan and Indo-Iranian forms.

---

🔹 3. Reconstructed Indo-Iranian and Proto-Indo-European (PIE) roots

• Avestan (East Iranian):

  • yakarə (liver) – a clear cognate.

• Proto-Iranian:

  • Reconstructed as jigar or jakar, derived from an earlier Indo-Iranian form.

• Proto-Indo-Iranian:

  • Reconstructed as yákṛt (same as Sanskrit yakṛt = liver)

• Proto-Indo-European (PIE) root:

  • *iék̂wṛ̥ → This is the PIE word for “liver”, and it gives rise to many cognates across Indo-European languages.

---

🔹 4. Cognates in other Indo-European languages

Language	Word for "liver"	Notes
Sanskrit	yakṛt (यकृत्)	Exact Indo-Aryan match
Avestan	yakarə	East Iranian cognate
Latin	iecur	PIE root preserved (with changes)
Ancient Greek	hēpar (ἧπαρ)	Different root, not cognate (likely non-IE origin)
Old English	lifere → liver	Possibly unrelated, or influenced by metaphorical use ("life-organ")

---

🔹 5. Semantic development in Persian

• In Persian and later Urdu and Hindi, jigar became highly metaphorical:

  • jigar-dil = “liver-hearted” → brave

  • jigar-pāra (lit. “a piece of liver”) = a beloved person

  • jigar khun hona (“liver bleeding”) = intense grief

This is cultural — just as the heart became the seat of emotion in European traditions, the liver was seen in Persianate culture as the seat of strong emotions, especially courage and deep love.

---

✅ Summary:

• Jigar (جگر) is an authentic Iranian word, descending from Proto-Indo-European *iék̂wṛ̥ via Indo-Iranian *yakṛt.

• It is cognate with Sanskrit yakṛt, Latin iecur, and Avestan yakarə.

• The metaphorical richness of the word in Persianate cultures (courage, love, pain) is a later cultural development, not etymological.

Would you like a linguistic family tree of this word across Indo-European languages?

Am 08.08.2025 um 16:59 schrieb Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY:

https://claude.ai/share/2fe502db-185f-447d-b742-88e87ff1c17c

Some interesting connections of the Persian word jigar to Sanskrit word taker for liver. 

Madhav Deshpande 

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www.rolfheinrichkoch.wordpress.com

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