https://youtu.be/isTVFCIPGlI

On Tue, Nov 1, 2016 at 7:56 PM, stella sandahl <ssandahl@sympatico.ca> wrote:

Many thanks for this interesting and detailed information. Most illuminating.

But I don't understand your point 8: How does one rotate around oneself?

Best

Stella Sandahl

On Nov 1, 2016, at 5:28 AM, Nagaraj Paturi <nagarajpaturi@gmail.com> wrote:

Following the advice of Prof. Dominik Vujastyk sometime ago. I wanted to take my typos easy. But at some places this time they seemed to be horrible. So let me resend it with corrections highlighted. :

What Prof. Patrick J Olivelle was asking for was a textual reference. If it is the question of the details of the actual ritual, its altogether a different big story.

 

1. Touching the ears is not just a ritual as part of worship of a deity. It is a gesture as part of daily speech adopted into the ritual. In north India, it is a common practice even today to pull one's own ear with one's own hand infinitesimally slightly down to indicate 'I apologise'. This has many complex nuances including those of expressions in romance in which case the gesture is made along with a mischievous smile.

 

2. This gesture has a variation of criss-crossing the hands to hold the lower tip of the ear of the  left ear with the right hand and vice versa. This is similar to the criss-crossing of hands by a Vaidika male for self introduction with gotra etc. But the semiotics here is that of obedience rather than that of  asking for forgiveness. The gesture too is little different . In the self introduction, the ear is closed with the back of the palms ,with the tips of the fingers facing upwards.

 

3. In south India, the variation of criss-crossing the hands to hold the lower tip of the ear of the    left ear with the right hand and vice versa is part of the ritual of  considered to be typical of Ganesha worship and is performed even during the briefest of Darshan of Ganesha. But here, this gesture is essentially part of sit-stand series expressing asking for forgiveness. 

 

4. In any case, touching the ground is not part of these gestures or rituals employing them. 

 

5. What probably is being viewed as touching the ground is sAshTAnga namaskAra which is an expression of surrender rather than asking for forgiveness. These two rituals are different from each other. 

 

6. To show that surrender ritual and ritual for asking for forgiveness are different, I am providing this link to a general popular description of a Devi-worship ritual: 

 

which has

 

15) क्षमायाचना :-

आवाहनं न जानामि न जानामि विसर्जनम् ।

पूजां चैव न जानामि क्षम्यतां परमेश्वरि ॥

मंत्रहीनं क्रियाहीनं भक्तिहीनं सुरेश्वरि ।

यत्पूजितं मया देवि परिपूर्ण तदस्तु मे ॥३॥

पापोहं पापकर्माहं पापात्मा पाप संभव: ॥

त्राहि मां पर्मेशानी सर्वपापहरा भव॥४॥

अपराधसहस्त्राणि क्रियंतेऽहर्निशं मया ।

दासोऽयमिति मां मत्वा क्षमस्व परमेश्वरी ॥

16)आत्मसमर्पण मंत्र :- एक आचमनी जल लेकर निम्न मंत्र पढ़कर सामने पात्र मे छोड़ दं -

इत: पूर्वं प्राणबुद्धिदेह धर्माधिकारतो जाग्रतस्वप्न सुषुप्त्य- वस्थासु मनसा वाचा कर्मणा हस्ताभ्यां पद्भ्यामुदरेण शिश्ना यत् कृतं यत् स्मृतं यदुक्तं तत्सर्वं ब्रह्मार्पणं भवतु, मां मदीयं सकलमाद्या कालीपदाम्भो अर्पयामि ॐ तत्सत् |( महानिर्वाण तंत्र) 

7. The gesture of pulling the lower tip of the ear with or without criss-crossed hands has its origin in the mild punishment method of pinching the ear. This gesture has the semiotics of self-punishment. Series of sit-stand movements too has a similar  -punishment to self-punishment- 'derivation'. 

 

8. Rotating around oneself is also part of  क्षमायाचना. But it has a different semiotic 'derivation'.

 

Thanks for your patience.

On Tue, Nov 1, 2016 at 9:49 AM, Nagaraj Paturi <nagarajpaturi@gmail.com> wrote:

What Prof. Patrick J Olivelle was asking for was a textual reference. If it is the question of the details of the actual ritual, its altogether different big story.

 

1. Touching the ears is not just a ritual as part of worship of a deity. It is a gesture as part of daily speech adopted into the ritual. In north India, it is a common practice even today to pull one's own ear with one's own hand infinitesimally slightly down to indicate 'I apologise'. This has many complex nuances including those of expressions in romance in which case the gesture is made along with a mischievous smile.

 

2. This gesture has a variation of criss-crossing the hands to hold the lower tip of the ear of the left ear with the right hand and vice versa. This is similar to the criss-crossing of hands by a Vaidika male for self introduction with gotra etc. But the semiotics here is that of obedience rather than asking for forgiveness. The gesture too is little different . In the self introduction the ear is closed with the back of the palm with the tips of the fingers facing upwards.

 

3. In south India, the variation of criss-crossing the hands to hold the lower tip of the ear of the left ear with the right hand and vice versa is part of the ritual of considered to be typical of Ganesha worship and is performed even during the briefest of Darshan of Ganesha. But here, this gesture is essentially part of sit-stand series expressing asking for forgiveness. 

 

4. In any case, touching the ground is not part of these gestures or rituals employing them. 

 

5. What probably is being viewed as touching the ground is sAshTAnga namaskAra which is an expression of surrender rather than asking for forgiveness. These two rituals are different from each other. 

 

6. To show that surrender ritual and ritual for asking for forgiveness are different, I am providing this link to a general popular description of a Devi-worship ritual: 

 

which has

 

15) क्षमायाचना :-

आवाहनं न जानामि न जानामि विसर्जनम् ।

पूजां चैव न जानामि क्षम्यतां परमेश्वरि ॥

मंत्रहीनं क्रियाहीनं भक्तिहीनं सुरेश्वरि ।

यत्पूजितं मया देवि परिपूर्ण तदस्तु मे ॥३॥

पापोहं पापकर्माहं पापात्मा पाप संभव: ॥

त्राहि मां पर्मेशानी सर्वपापहरा भव॥४॥

अपराधसहस्त्राणि क्रियंतेऽहर्निशं मया ।

दासोऽयमिति मां मत्वा क्षमस्व परमेश्वरी ॥

16)आत्मसमर्पण मंत्र :- एक आचमनी जल लेकर निम्न मंत्र पढ़कर सामने पात्र मे छोड़ दं -

इत: पूर्वं प्राणबुद्धिदेह धर्माधिकारतो जाग्रतस्वप्न सुषुप्त्य- वस्थासु मनसा वाचा कर्मणा हस्ताभ्यां पद्भ्यामुदरेण शिश्ना यत् कृतं यत् स्मृतं यदुक्तं तत्सर्वं ब्रह्मार्पणं भवतु, मां मदीयं सकलमाद्या कालीपदाम्भो अर्पयामि ॐ तत्सत् |( महानिर्वाण तंत्र) 

7. The gesture of pulling the lower tip of the ear with or without criss-crossed hands has its origin in the mild punishment method of pinching the ear. This gesture has the semiotics of self-punishment. Series of sit-stand movements too has a similar punishment to self-punishment 'derivation'. 

8. Rotating around oneself is also part of  क्षमायाचना. But it has a different semiotic 'derivation'.

Thanks for your patience.

 

  

On Tue, Nov 1, 2016 at 12:54 AM, Herman Tull <hermantull@gmail.com> wrote:

There is a lovely (short) scene in the newly released documentary, Gurukulam (http://www.gurukulamfilm.com/) that shows this ritual sequence of events (bowing to the floor, touching of the ears). 

Herman Tull

On Sun, Oct 30, 2016 at 11:37 AM, stella sandahl <ssandahl@sympatico.ca> wrote:

Dear Madhav and Patrick,

I understood that touching the ground first is also part of the "ritual", not just the ears.

Best to all

Stella

On Oct 30, 2016, at 9:15 AM, Madhav Deshpande <mmdesh@umich.edu> wrote:

Dear Patrick,

     Take a look at the attached page (28) from Lanman's Sanskrit Reader, line 2 from bottom.

Madhav

On Sun, Oct 30, 2016 at 9:01 AM, Olivelle, J P <jpo@austin.utexas.edu> wrote:

A colleague asked me about the practice of holding one’s ear, especially in asking forgiveness. Are there textual sources for it? I have seen this practice in texts, but cannot find them right now. If, off the top of your heads, you can find one, do let me know. Thanks.

Patrick
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--

Nagaraj Paturi

 

Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA.

 

Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies

 

FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,

 

(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )

 

 

 

--

Nagaraj Paturi

 

Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA.

 

Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies

 

FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,

 

(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )

 

 

 

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--

Nagaraj Paturi

 

Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA.

 

Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies

 

FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,

 

(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )