British people tap the side of their nose with their right index finger to indicated that something is a secret ('Hush hush! Don’t pass it on!'). At least, they used to - I have not seen the younger generation do it. (But then they are not so secretive).

Valerie J Roebuck
Manchester, UK



On 23 Oct 2016, at 08:37, Nagaraj Paturi <nagarajpaturi@gmail.com> wrote:

Completing the incomplete last sentence:

So time ca. late 17th century and the region and cultural group of Viśvanātha Cakravartin is important.       



On Sun, Oct 23, 2016 at 12:44 PM, Nagaraj Paturi <nagarajpaturi@gmail.com> wrote:
Finger on nose is almost a universal gesture. Whenever 'finger on nose is mentioned while describing gestures, in most of the cases, it is the index finger which is kept in mind. That gesture could have variegated semiotics in each of the cultures where it is used.  What the thread initiator said he was looking for was the specific cultural connotation in the context that he cited, Viśvanātha Cakravartin's commentary (ca. late 17th century) on the Bhāgavata Purāṇa 10.9.7 (uttārya gopī...). 

There are two bases of context here, the verses  before and after 10.9.7. 
BhP_10.09.006/1 sañjāta-kopaḥ sphuritāruṇādharaṃ sandaśya dadbhir dadhi-mantha-bhājanam
BhP_10.09.006/3 bhittvā mṛṣāśrur dṛṣad-aśmanā raho jaghāsa haiyaṅgavam antaraṃ gataḥ
BhP_10.09.007/1 uttārya gopī suśṛtaṃ payaḥ punaḥ praviśya saṃdṛśya ca dadhy-amatrakam
BhP_10.09.007/3 bhagnaṃ vilokya sva-sutasya karma taj jahāsa taṃ cāpi na tatra paśyatī

Second, the cultural background of the user of the expression Viśvanātha Cakravartin and his period:ca. late 17th century.

Why I say period is the following:
 

Among the Telugu speakers, apart from the universal meaning of "silence!" there is the meaning of intense surprise/amazement found in expressions such as mukkuna vēlēsukunnāru = they put (past) the finger on the nose, meaning they were all amazed at what happened or at what they saw/heard. 

But I observed another finger on nose gesture in my previous generation, in which the index finger moved from the tip of the nose vertically straight upwards upto the forehead while waving the head horizontally, showing the tongue out usually folded with its tip upwards or downwards, to communicate the meaning (usually expressed in words immediately after removing the tongue part of the gesture), " Oh! nno! is it not so wrong, so inappropriate?" 

This expression is no longer found used. It seems to get considered as oldish.

So time ca. late 17th century and the region and cultural group of Viśvanātha Cakravartin .      





On Sun, Oct 23, 2016 at 8:48 AM, rajam <rajam@earthlink.net> wrote:
Not sure if it would help, but there’s a reference in Old Tamil literature to women’s gossip around town about a woman’s relationship with a man. The reference is “mūkkin ucci cuṭṭu viral cērtti (மூக்கின் உச்சி சுட்டுவிரல் சேர்த்தி). Women talk about the relationship between an unmarried woman and a man, and their gesture is indicated by ‘touching the tip of their nose with their index finger.’

Recently, when I was watching a music event on YouTube where Prince Rama Varma was teaching a group of students he touched the tip of his nose with his index finger, perhaps to express ‘shame shame’ or something like that. I’d have to search for that video again.

So I guess it was a practice in the south.

Regards,
rajam


On Oct 22, 2016, at 7:26 PM, Nityanand Misra <nmisra@gmail.com> wrote:



On 20 October 2016 at 07:44, Buchta, David <david_buchta@brown.edu> wrote:
Dear colleagues,

I hope someone might have insight (or better yet a textual reference) for a cultural convention.
In Viśvanātha Cakravartin's commentary (ca. late 17th century) on the Bhāgavata Purāṇa 10.9.7 (uttārya gopī...), where Yaśodā finds the curd-pot that Kṛṣṇa had broken, he adds a comment that she touched the tip of her nose with her left index finger (vāmatarjjanyā nāsāgraṃ spṛṣṭveti jñeyam).
Can anyone identify the significance of this? Does it indicate exasperation? Surprise?


Not a definitive answer, but some pointers which may help.

Compare the use of nāsāgrārpitatarjjanī in the following verse from Prabodhānanda Sarasvatī’s Vṛndāvanamahimāmṛtam (15.33)

mithyāvādinī kiṃ mudhā pralapasi pratyakṣametatkathaṃ sakhyaḥ paśyata kiṃ tadāha yadiyaṃ kiṃvā’haha sā pṛcchyatām
evaṃ satyamidaṃ kathaṃ prakupitāsyevaṃ sakhīnāṃ girā nāsāgrārpitatarjjanī kamahasadrādhā śiraḥkampinī

There is an idiom in Hindi: नाक पर उँगली रखना (nāka para um̐galī rakhanā). I do not have my Hindi Muhavara Kosh with me now, but I have heard the idiom being used in Hindi to convey a feminine gesture of embarrassment, bashfulness, or no longer being able to remain angry [at somebody or something] upon realizing something. 

Wiktionary lists the meaning of this idiom from an unnamed dictionary under https://hi.wiktionary.org/wiki/नाक as
नाक पर उँगली रखकर बात करना = औरतों की तरह बात करना

While the Chambers English Hindi Dictionary gives नाक पर उँगली रखना as the idiomatic translation of make a long nose [?]


PS: The comment by Viśvanātha Cakravartin is also to be found in Vaṃśīdhara Bhāvārthadīpikāprakāśa: vilokya vāmatarjjanyā nāsāgraṃ spṛṣṭveti bhāvaḥ

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-- 
Nagaraj Paturi
 
Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA.
 
Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies
 
FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,
 
(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )
 
 
 



-- 
Nagaraj Paturi
 
Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA.
 
Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies
 
FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,
 
(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )
 
 
 
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