Re: [INDOLOGY] all-pervasive puruṣa in classical Sāṃkhya

[Nagaraj Paturi]

What reality (real life) examples do you have in mind for purusha or
purushas ?

What  reality (real life) examples do you have in mind for prakriti?

--------------------------

Paradoxes are usual in spiritual /advanced philosophical statements.

Paradox is a figure of speech, where contradiction is apparent and not
real.

On Tue, Jun 19, 2018 at 2:19 AM, Edeltraud Harzer via INDOLOGY <
indology at list.indology.info> wrote:

> Hello Lubomíre,
>
> Even though your initial inquiry is about Sāṅkhya ontological questions,
> we can draw from some of the epistemological material of the YD, which
> shows that puruṣa has no connection with vyakta, such as
> instruments/faculties engaged in the operation of acquiring knowledge. See
> YD on SK 36 (Wezler/Motegi edition), p. 223, l.1ff.
>
> tayā cādhyavasāyarūpāpannayā cetanāśaktir anugṛhyate. na karaṇāntarasya
> puruṣeṇa sambandho ’sti…
>
> The intellect acquired the form of non-doubting awareness (adhyavasāya)
> having accepted the conscious power/power of consciousness. There is no
> connection/bond of an internal instrument with the unintentional
> consciousness (puruṣa)…
>
>  Of course, there is more to be said.
>
> A little note: I would like to suggest that sometime we need to play a
> little with the way how we choose translating: viparyāsa, viparīta, etc.,
> which may be understood as “contrast” and not necessarily “opposite.”
>
> Edeltraud Harzer.
>
> PS Jayamaṅgalā is suspected sometime that there might be other influences.
>
> On Jun 18, 2018, at 11:04 AM, Lubomír Ondračka via INDOLOGY <
> indology at list.indology.info> wrote:
>
> Dear Dan,
>
> thanks for this reference. As you say, this reflects a pre-classical or
> proto-Sāṃkhya teaching; in classical Sāṃkhya all puruṣas are the same,
> there are no different types or kinds of puruṣas.
>
> Jayamaṅgalā is probably the latest among the pre-Kaumudī commentaries and
> stays a bit apart from other commentaries. Sure, it might reflect some
> older teaching that survived outside the Sāṃkhya mainstream. But the
> question whether each puruṣa is all-pervasive all the time or only when
> liberated seems to me rather crucial. All commentaries apparently take it
> for granted that puruṣas are all-pervasive all the time, only Jayamaṅgalā
> for some reason distinguishes between liberated and non-liberated puruṣa.
> This puzzles me.
>
> I simply do not understand how could puruṣa (being an absolutely passive,
> reflective consciousness devoid of any activity) have any capacity for
> changing itself?
>
> Best,
> Lubomir
>
>
> On Sun, 17 Jun 2018 20:54:32 -040;
> Dan Lusthaus <prajnapti at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Dear Lubomír,
>
> If I understand correctly what you are asking, then one place to look
> would be the Bhagavad Gītā, XV.16-19 (though the Gītā reflects a
> pre-classical form of Sāṃkhya, in which, e.g., puruṣa is still causal)
> which mentions three types of puruṣa: Kṣara puruṣa, Akṣara puruṣa, and
> Puruṣottama (only the last is equivalent to Paramātman).
>
> best wishes,
> Dan
>
> On Jun 17, 2018, at 5:42 PM, Lubomír Ondračka via INDOLOGY <
> indology at list.indology.info> wrote:
>
> This is surprising. According to this commentary, puruṣa is all-pervasive
> only when liberated, otherwise he is not all-pervasive and in this sense
> similar to vyakta. I cannot answer the question of my students how could
> puruṣa (who is absolutely passive etc.) change itself so dramatically? And
> where does this concept occur in classical Sāṃkhya? Could you please help
> me with these answers? I am not a specialist in Sāṃkhya, we have this
> seminar just for fun, so I probably missed something in Sāṃkhya teaching on
> puruṣa. I promised to my students that I will ask this learned forum to get
> the right answers.
>
>
>
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-- 
Nagaraj Paturi

Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA.


BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra

BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala

Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies

FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of  Liberal Education,

(Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA )


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