From wujastyk at gmail.com Tue Apr 3 00:51:39 2018 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Mon, 02 Apr 18 18:51:39 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] New issue of HSSA published today Message-ID: ?*Transmutations: Rejuvenation, Longevity, and Immortality Practices in South and Inner Asia* Guest editors: Dagmar Wujastyk, Suzanne Newcombe, and Christ?le Barois - hssa-journal.org With papers by - Dagmar Wujastyk, - Christ?le Barois - Philipp Maas - Suzanne Newcombe - Ilona Barbara K?dzia - Anna Sehnalova - Cathy Cantwell - Barbara Gerke - Projit Bihari Mukharji ? -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk ?,? Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity ?,? Department of History and Classics ?,? University of Alberta, Canada ?.? South Asia at the U of A: ?sas.ualberta.ca? ?? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Tue Apr 3 02:13:36 2018 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Mon, 02 Apr 18 20:13:36 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Indoskript 2.0 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Simply wonderful. An extraordinary project, now with a new life. Thank you, Oliver and Harry! ? -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk ?,? Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity ?,? Department of History and Classics ?,? University of Alberta, Canada ?.? South Asia at the U of A: ?sas.ualberta.ca? ?? > On 2018. 03. 25. 20:35, Oliver Hellwig via INDOLOGY wrote: > >> Dear list members, > >> > >> for those interested in Indian paleography: an online version of the > Indoskript project is now available at > >> > >> http://www.indoskript.org/ > >> > >> More details on the start page of the website! > >> > >> Best, Oliver > >> > >> --- > >> Oliver Hellwig, SFB 991 (D?sseldorf) / IVS (Zurich) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jpo at austin.utexas.edu Tue Apr 3 14:31:23 2018 From: jpo at austin.utexas.edu (Olivelle, J P) Date: Tue, 03 Apr 18 14:31:23 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Citation Message-ID: <9A47FC93-7927-4089-886A-6F8330D8A705@austin.utexas.edu> Friends: Can anyone help me identify this citation from ?a?guru?i?ya? I could not find it in his commentary of K?ty?yana?s Sarv?nukrama?? (but I only have Macdonnell?s edition, which only has extracts. I also could not find it in his commentary on the Aitareya Br?hma?a. Thanks. Patrick ???? ????????????: ? ??????????? ???????? ??? ????? ????????? ? ???? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rrocher at sas.upenn.edu Tue Apr 3 14:34:38 2018 From: rrocher at sas.upenn.edu (rrocher) Date: Tue, 03 Apr 18 10:34:38 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Samskrita Pratibha Vol. 4 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: For future reference, I confirm that volume 4 of Samskrita Pratibha is on the shelves of the University of Pennsylvania's Van Pelt Library (third floor East). Ashok Aklujkar's offer of a scan from the volume in his own collection is, of course, preferable. Rosane Rocher On 3/29/18 7:29 PM, rrocher via INDOLOGY wrote: > > Yes, the Penn library's Franklin catalog shows Samskrita Pratibha Vol. > 4 (1963-64) as "on shelf." I'll check it next time I go to the > library, which won't be before next Tuesday. Benji, you are closer to > it than I am. Could you check earlier if possible? > > Rosane Rocher > Professor Emerita of South Asia Studies > University of Pennsylvania > > On 3/29/18 6:33 PM, Preston, Charles via INDOLOGY wrote: >> Dear Colleagues, >> >> I?ve been looking in vain for Samskrita Pratibha vol. 4, issues no. 1 >> and 2. Few libraries in the US appear to have vol. 4, and I have >> been unsuccessful in ordering it on interlibrary loan. WorldCat >> thinks it might be at UT Austin and University of Pennsylvania >> libraries, but I can?t afford to fly those places in hopes that >> WorldCat is right. If any of you out there know where I can find >> vol. 4, or could check the shelves at one of those two libraries to >> see if they do indeed have it (PK401.S32, vol. 4), that would be >> awesome. If anyone could possibly scan some small portions of vol. >> 4 for me, that would be even more helpful. If vol. 4 really is at >> either of those libraries, I?ll plan a journey there to read or scan >> more of it whenever I might have a travel budget, but there are some >> bits I?d love to read sooner rather than later. >> >> Thanks so much for any assistance in tracking this down! >> >> -Charles >> >> Charles S. Preston, PhD >> Teaching Fellow in Religious Studies >> Millsaps College >> prestcs at millsaps.edu >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be Tue Apr 3 15:17:44 2018 From: christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be (Christophe Vielle) Date: Tue, 03 Apr 18 17:17:44 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Citation In-Reply-To: <9A47FC93-7927-4089-886A-6F8330D8A705@austin.utexas.edu> Message-ID: <73903696-EDDC-4A00-A7DC-8D40AAA11C3E@uclouvain.be> It is in the introductory portion of the Ved?rthad?pik? (com. to the Sarv?nukrama??) which was not included in the Anecdota Oxoniensia ed. by Macdonell ; a provisory edition of the vv. 25-56ab of the text was provided by F. Max M?ller in his Hist. of Ancient Sanskrit Lit., see p. 238 line 8, here https://archive.org/stream/historyofancient00mlle#page/238/mode/2up For another (this time complete, but rare) edition of the text, see https://copac.jisc.ac.uk/search?title=K?ty?yan?ya-R?ksarv?nukrama??%20%3A%20?adguru?i?ya-viracitay?%20k?tsnav?tty?%20sahit? K?ty?yan?ya-R?ksarv?nukrama?? : ?adguru?i?ya-viracitay? k?tsnav?tty? sahit? , / samp?daka? Vijayap?la?, Kalakatt? : S?vitrodev? B?gariya ?ras?a 1985 > Le 3 avr. 2018 ? 16:31, Olivelle, J P via INDOLOGY a ?crit : > > Friends: > > Can anyone help me identify this citation from ?a?guru?i?ya? I could not find it in his commentary of K?ty?yana?s Sarv?nukrama?? (but I only have Macdonnell?s edition, which only has extracts. I also could not find it in his commentary on the Aitareya Br?hma?a. > > Thanks. > > Patrick > > > ???? ????????????: ? > ??????????? ???????? ??? ????? ????????? ? ???? > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) ??????????????????? Christophe Vielle Louvain-la-Neuve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be Tue Apr 3 15:21:31 2018 From: christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be (Christophe Vielle) Date: Tue, 03 Apr 18 17:21:31 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Citation In-Reply-To: <9A47FC93-7927-4089-886A-6F8330D8A705@austin.utexas.edu> Message-ID: <2351AE5C-73CC-4730-97E4-F6C5C179C308@uclouvain.be> Sorry, I was wrong, in reading too fast only the beginnings of verses... It is in the introductory portion of the Ved?rthad?pik? (com. to the Sarv?nukrama??) which was not included in the Anecdota Oxoniensia ed. by Macdonell ; a provisory edition of the vv. 25-56ab of the text was provided by F. Max M?ller in his Hist. of Ancient Sanskrit Lit., see p. 238 line 8, here https://archive.org/stream/historyofancient00mlle#page/238/mode/2up For another (this time complete, but rare) edition of the text, see https://copac.jisc.ac.uk/search?title=K?ty?yan?ya-R?ksarv?nukrama??%20%3A%20?adguru?i?ya-viracitay?%20k?tsnav?tty?%20sahit? K?ty?yan?ya-R?ksarv?nukrama?? : ?adguru?i?ya-viracitay? k?tsnav?tty? sahit? , / samp?daka? Vijayap?la?, Kalakatt? : S?vitrodev? B?gariya ?ras?a 1985 > Le 3 avr. 2018 ? 16:31, Olivelle, J P via INDOLOGY > a ?crit : > > Friends: > > Can anyone help me identify this citation from ?a?guru?i?ya? I could not find it in his commentary of K?ty?yana?s Sarv?nukrama?? (but I only have Macdonnell?s edition, which only has extracts. I also could not find it in his commentary on the Aitareya Br?hma?a. > > Thanks. > > Patrick > > > ???? ????????????: ? > ??????????? ???????? ??? ????? ????????? ? ???? > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) ??????????????????? Christophe Vielle Louvain-la-Neuve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Tue Apr 3 16:02:26 2018 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Tue, 03 Apr 18 16:02:26 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Vijayar=C4=81ja_Vajr=C4=81c=C4=81rya?= Message-ID: Dear friends, Might anyone have current contact information for Vijayar?ja Vajr?c?rya, who was affiliated some years ago with the Central Institute for HIgher Tibetan Studies in Sarnath? He is not now listed on the CIHTS website. (I imagine that the usual romanized spelling of his name is Bijay Raj Bajracharya, a name that seems relatively common in Nepal.) with thanks in advance, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From toke.knudsen at hum.ku.dk Thu Apr 5 10:53:40 2018 From: toke.knudsen at hum.ku.dk (Toke Lindegaard Knudsen) Date: Thu, 05 Apr 18 10:53:40 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Cart-shaped,_=C5=9Baka=E1=B9=AD=C4=81k=C4=81ra?= Message-ID: <9C481F30-687A-465D-8111-2EA73D68FC97@hum.ku.dk> Hi all, In a passage of interest to me, the author attributes to ?some? the idea that the earth resembles or is shaped like a cart (bhuvam ? ?aka??k?r?m). I?m trying to understand (1) what precisely is understood by ?cart-shaped? (?aka??k?ra or ?aka??k?ti) and (2) how the earth can have the shape of a cart. In Phanindra Nath Bose?s _Principles of Indian Silpasastra_ from 1926, ?aka??k?ti is explained (p. 75) as, ?cart-shaped or quadrangular, with a long triangular projection on one side.? In the ?ilpa-prak??a (Alice Boner and Sad??iva Rath ?arm??s edition, translation, and study, second revised edition, 2005), a list of shapes of building sites is given. One such shape is ?aka??k?ti (verse 1.39), which is translated as ?a tapering bullock-cart (?aka??k?ti ku?cita).? The book contains facsimiles of the palm leaf pages of a manuscript, which includes drawings to illustrate the building-site shapes (plate I). The drawing of the cart-shaped building site doesn?t look like what Bose describes (see above), but rather looks like an isosceles trapezoid. I also found that ?cart-shaped? is included in a list of possible shapes of the sacred ??lagr?ma stones. This particular shape is undesirable. Would any of you have any clues or thoughts on which geometrical figure (or figures) ?cart-shaped? refers to? Or further references in this regard? Best wishes, Toke ----- Toke Lindegaard Knudsen, Ph.D. Associate Professor and Marie Sk?odowska-Curie Fellow Department of Cross-Cultural and Regional Studies University of Copenhagen From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Thu Apr 5 11:15:19 2018 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Thu, 05 Apr 18 11:15:19 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_Cart-shaped,_=C5=9Baka=E1=B9=AD=C4=81k=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: <9C481F30-687A-465D-8111-2EA73D68FC97@hum.ku.dk> Message-ID: Dear Toke. I've never seen this referring to "the earth." But in Buddhist sources frequently to the triangular or trapezoidal shape attributed to Jambudv?pa, the southern continent. best, Matthew Matthew Kapstein EPHE Get Outlook for Android ________________________________ From: INDOLOGY on behalf of Toke Lindegaard Knudsen via INDOLOGY Sent: Thursday, April 5, 2018 12:53:40 PM To: Indology Subject: [INDOLOGY] Cart-shaped, ?aka??k?ra Hi all, In a passage of interest to me, the author attributes to ?some? the idea that the earth resembles or is shaped like a cart (bhuvam ? ?aka??k?r?m). I?m trying to understand (1) what precisely is understood by ?cart-shaped? (?aka??k?ra or ?aka??k?ti) and (2) how the earth can have the shape of a cart. In Phanindra Nath Bose?s _Principles of Indian Silpasastra_ from 1926, ?aka??k?ti is explained (p. 75) as, ?cart-shaped or quadrangular, with a long triangular projection on one side.? In the ?ilpa-prak??a (Alice Boner and Sad??iva Rath ?arm??s edition, translation, and study, second revised edition, 2005), a list of shapes of building sites is given. One such shape is ?aka??k?ti (verse 1.39), which is translated as ?a tapering bullock-cart (?aka??k?ti ku?cita).? The book contains facsimiles of the palm leaf pages of a manuscript, which includes drawings to illustrate the building-site shapes (plate I). The drawing of the cart-shaped building site doesn?t look like what Bose describes (see above), but rather looks like an isosceles trapezoid. I also found that ?cart-shaped? is included in a list of possible shapes of the sacred ??lagr?ma stones. This particular shape is undesirable. Would any of you have any clues or thoughts on which geometrical figure (or figures) ?cart-shaped? refers to? Or further references in this regard? Best wishes, Toke ----- Toke Lindegaard Knudsen, Ph.D. Associate Professor and Marie Sk?odowska-Curie Fellow Department of Cross-Cultural and Regional Studies University of Copenhagen _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From toke.knudsen at hum.ku.dk Thu Apr 5 11:52:29 2018 From: toke.knudsen at hum.ku.dk (Toke Lindegaard Knudsen) Date: Thu, 05 Apr 18 11:52:29 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_Cart-shaped,_=C5=9Baka=E1=B9=AD=C4=81k=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Matthew, Thanks. It?s certainly possible that the author of my source misunderstood the opinion he paraphrases and took ?cart-shaped? to refer to the entire earth, whereas only a portion of the earth was intended. In Hindu cosmography, Jambudv?pa refers to a circular continent surrounded by annular oceans and continents. Since the author rejects that the earth is cart-shaped, it?s possibly a refutation of a Buddhist idea. The triangular or trapezoidal shape in the Buddhist sources you refer to agrees with the drawing in the ?ilpa-prak??a manuscript. I?m not sure where Bose got ?quadrangular, with a long triangular projection on one side? from. This begs the question, of course, of whether carts in ancient India were generally trapezoidal-shaped? Best wishes, Toke > On Apr 5, 2018, at 13:15, Matthew Kapstein wrote: > > Dear Toke. > > I've never seen this referring to "the earth." But in Buddhist sources frequently to the triangular or trapezoidal shape attributed to Jambudv?pa, the southern continent. > > best, > Matthew > > Matthew Kapstein > EPHE > > Get Outlook for Android > > From: INDOLOGY on behalf of Toke Lindegaard Knudsen via INDOLOGY > Sent: Thursday, April 5, 2018 12:53:40 PM > To: Indology > Subject: [INDOLOGY] Cart-shaped, ?aka??k?ra > > Hi all, > > In a passage of interest to me, the author attributes to ?some? the idea that the earth resembles or is shaped like a cart (bhuvam ? ?aka??k?r?m). I?m trying to understand (1) what precisely is understood by ?cart-shaped? (?aka??k?ra or ?aka??k?ti) and (2) how the earth can have the shape of a cart. > > In Phanindra Nath Bose?s _Principles of Indian Silpasastra_ from 1926, ?aka??k?ti is explained (p. 75) as, ?cart-shaped or quadrangular, with a long triangular projection on one side.? > > In the ?ilpa-prak??a (Alice Boner and Sad??iva Rath ?arm??s edition, translation, and study, second revised edition, 2005), a list of shapes of building sites is given. One such shape is ?aka??k?ti (verse 1.39), which is translated as ?a tapering bullock-cart (?aka??k?ti ku?cita).? The book contains facsimiles of the palm leaf pages of a manuscript, which includes drawings to illustrate the building-site shapes (plate I). The drawing of the cart-shaped building site doesn?t look like what Bose describes (see above), but rather looks like an isosceles trapezoid. > > I also found that ?cart-shaped? is included in a list of possible shapes of the sacred ??lagr?ma stones. This particular shape is undesirable. > > Would any of you have any clues or thoughts on which geometrical figure (or figures) ?cart-shaped? refers to? Or further references in this regard? > > Best wishes, > Toke > > ----- > Toke Lindegaard Knudsen, Ph.D. > > Associate Professor and Marie Sk?odowska-Curie Fellow > Department of Cross-Cultural and Regional Studies > University of Copenhagen > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) From a.murugaiyan at wanadoo.fr Thu Apr 5 14:05:12 2018 From: a.murugaiyan at wanadoo.fr (a.murugaiyan) Date: Thu, 05 Apr 18 16:05:12 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] ritual and religious aspects of milk in Tamil Message-ID: Dear colleagues, A friend of mine working on the Tamil (old) diaspora would like to know whether there would be any text on the ritual and religious aspects of milk in Tamil if not in Sanskrit or other Indian languages. I would be thankful for any guidance or reference. The response may be addressed offline: a.murugaiyan at wanadoo.fr Thank you in advance. Sincerely Appasamy Murugaiyan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aparpola at gmail.com Fri Apr 6 08:45:12 2018 From: aparpola at gmail.com (Asko Parpola) Date: Fri, 06 Apr 18 11:45:12 +0300 Subject: [INDOLOGY] ritual and religious aspects of milk in Tamil In-Reply-To: Message-ID: A good study of ritual and religious aspects of milk in Tamil and other Indian sources is: Eichinger Ferro-Luzzi, Gabriella, 1987. The self-milking cow and the bleeding lingam: Criss-cross of motifs in Indian temple legends. Wiesbaden: Otto Harrassowitz. xxiv, 254 pp., ill. With best wishes, On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 5:05 PM, a.murugaiyan via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > > Dear colleagues, > > A friend of mine working on the Tamil (old) diaspora would like to know > whether there would be any text on the ritual and religious aspects of milk > in Tamil if not in Sanskrit or other Indian languages. I would be thankful > for any guidance or reference. The response may be addressed offline: > a.murugaiyan at wanadoo.fr > > Thank you in advance. > Sincerely > > Appasamy Murugaiyan > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Asko Parpola, aparpola at gmail.com http://www.helsinki.academia.edu/AskoParpola -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aparpola at gmail.com Fri Apr 6 09:06:14 2018 From: aparpola at gmail.com (Asko Parpola) Date: Fri, 06 Apr 18 12:06:14 +0300 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_Cart-shaped,_=C5=9Baka=E1=B9=AD=C4=81k=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I have a longer (42 pp.) article entitled "On ancient Indian ox-carts, biers, beds and thrones: ? propos of Sanskrit ?aka??- / ?aka?a- and its etymology" forthcoming shortly in: Indology's pulse: Arts in context (Doris M. Srinivasan Festschrift), edited by Corinna Wessels-Mevissen and Gerd J. R. Mevissen, New Delhi: Aryan Books International. There I discuss in detail the contexts in which the word ?aka?a- occurs in Vedic and epic (and selectively other Sanskrit) literature. The following extract concerns the ?ulvas?tras: Context XV: Carts and the shapes of brickbuilt fire altars (citi). The K?ty?yana-?ulvas?tra mentions a citi shaped like the triangular-shaped ?mouth? of a cart (1,18 ?aka?amukhasya caivam). This is synonymous with the prau?ga-citis used in rites of sorcery which are described in ?pastamba-?ulvas?tra (12,4 prau?ga? cinv?ta bhr?t?vyav?n iti vij??yate ...), cf. the commentaries of Kapardisv?min (ed. Srinivasachar & Narasimhachar 1931: 202): prau?ga? ?aka?ap?rvabh?ga?, and Sundarar?ja (ibid.: 205): prau?ga? ?aka?asya mukha? triko?a? tadvac c?yata iti prau?gacit. In addition, the ?pastamba-?ulvas?tra also describes a rhombus-shaped twofaced prau?ga-citi for annihilating existing enemies and those yet to be born (12,7 ubhayata?prau?ga? cinv?ta ya? k?mayeta praj?t?n bhr?t?vy?n nudeya pratijani?yam???n iti vij??yate): it looks like two carts/fore-parts of carts (joined together), with their fronts facing different directions (12,8 yath? vimukhe ?aka?e), cf. the commentaries of Karavinda (ibid.: 208): vimukhe n?n?mukhe ?aka?e yath? p???he sa?hite ti??hete t?d?g?k?r?m ubhayatra prau?ga? tath? cinv?tety artha?, and Sundarar?ja (ibid.: 209): vimukhe viparyastamukhe pr?kpa?c?nmukhe yath? ?aka?abh?ge t?d?g e?o ?gnir bhavati. With best regards, On Thu, Apr 5, 2018 at 2:52 PM, Toke Lindegaard Knudsen via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Dear Matthew, > > Thanks. It?s certainly possible that the author of my source misunderstood > the opinion he paraphrases and took ?cart-shaped? to refer to the entire > earth, whereas only a portion of the earth was intended. > > In Hindu cosmography, Jambudv?pa refers to a circular continent surrounded > by annular oceans and continents. Since the author rejects that the earth > is cart-shaped, it?s possibly a refutation of a Buddhist idea. > > The triangular or trapezoidal shape in the Buddhist sources you refer to > agrees with the drawing in the ?ilpa-prak??a manuscript. I?m not sure where > Bose got ?quadrangular, with a long triangular projection on one side? from. > > This begs the question, of course, of whether carts in ancient India were > generally trapezoidal-shaped? > > Best wishes, > Toke > > > > > On Apr 5, 2018, at 13:15, Matthew Kapstein > wrote: > > > > Dear Toke. > > > > I've never seen this referring to "the earth." But in Buddhist sources > frequently to the triangular or trapezoidal shape attributed to Jambudv?pa, > the southern continent. > > > > best, > > Matthew > > > > Matthew Kapstein > > EPHE > > > > Get Outlook for Android > > > > From: INDOLOGY on behalf of Toke > Lindegaard Knudsen via INDOLOGY > > Sent: Thursday, April 5, 2018 12:53:40 PM > > To: Indology > > Subject: [INDOLOGY] Cart-shaped, ?aka??k?ra > > > > Hi all, > > > > In a passage of interest to me, the author attributes to ?some? the idea > that the earth resembles or is shaped like a cart (bhuvam ? ?aka??k?r?m). > I?m trying to understand (1) what precisely is understood by ?cart-shaped? > (?aka??k?ra or ?aka??k?ti) and (2) how the earth can have the shape of a > cart. > > > > In Phanindra Nath Bose?s _Principles of Indian Silpasastra_ from 1926, > ?aka??k?ti is explained (p. 75) as, ?cart-shaped or quadrangular, with a > long triangular projection on one side.? > > > > In the ?ilpa-prak??a (Alice Boner and Sad??iva Rath ?arm??s edition, > translation, and study, second revised edition, 2005), a list of shapes of > building sites is given. One such shape is ?aka??k?ti (verse 1.39), which > is translated as ?a tapering bullock-cart (?aka??k?ti ku?cita).? The book > contains facsimiles of the palm leaf pages of a manuscript, which includes > drawings to illustrate the building-site shapes (plate I). The drawing of > the cart-shaped building site doesn?t look like what Bose describes (see > above), but rather looks like an isosceles trapezoid. > > > > I also found that ?cart-shaped? is included in a list of possible shapes > of the sacred ??lagr?ma stones. This particular shape is undesirable. > > > > Would any of you have any clues or thoughts on which geometrical figure > (or figures) ?cart-shaped? refers to? Or further references in this regard? > > > > Best wishes, > > Toke > > > > ----- > > Toke Lindegaard Knudsen, Ph.D. > > > > Associate Professor and Marie Sk?odowska-Curie Fellow > > Department of Cross-Cultural and Regional Studies > > University of Copenhagen > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > INDOLOGY mailing list > > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options > or unsubscribe) > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Asko Parpola, aparpola at gmail.com http://www.helsinki.academia.edu/AskoParpola -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wright.samuel at gmail.com Fri Apr 6 15:35:03 2018 From: wright.samuel at gmail.com (Samuel Wright) Date: Fri, 06 Apr 18 11:35:03 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Help with source of quotation Message-ID: Dear List, I?m trying to track down the source of a quotation but not having much luck. The quotation is ?nitya? vij??nam ?nanda? brahma?. I?m inclined to read this as a variation of Brhadaranyaka Upanisad (3.9.28): 'vij??nam ?nanda? brahma....' But, I?m wondering if the inclusion of ?nityam? is found anywhere. The texts in which I have encountered this quotation are all later than 1550 CE. Many thanks, Sam -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From glhart at berkeley.edu Fri Apr 6 15:52:48 2018 From: glhart at berkeley.edu (George Hart) Date: Fri, 06 Apr 18 11:52:48 -0400 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_Cart-shaped,_=C5=9Baka=E1=B9=AD=C4=81k=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0234801C-2551-4B10-9AC1-B6A0E088DC3F@berkeley.edu> Akan????u 301 (100-300 CE?) has the following: n?r v?? mutalai ?vitta??a 6 ?rai v?ynta a?ai v?y caka?attu 7 ?r i?tu e???ar t?tu il v??kkai 8 Here is the whole poem, which is memorable. Note that ?aka?am is probably from Dravidian (caka?am in this poem). It is conceivable that it is the sound of the crocodiles rather than the shape of the opening that is meant ? anyone in Florida knows the alligators make a kind of rattling sound to attract a mate, though their sound is made only once every two or three minutes and is quite short. The Tamil word here is ?vittu, "to open the mouth so as to express loudly 2 to sigh, as expressing grief 3 to gape, yawn? (Lexicon). It seems to me that it is almost certainly the shape that is meant because the openings of the cart do not make noise. 301. Pa?lai 301. P?lai The friend, who has changed (grown thin and pale) in separation (from the hero) speaks to the friend who is consoling her. You tell me, friend, that for a short while I should simply stop thinking and worrying about the man who left me to wither in pain like a field in drought. Performers live eating their scant food as soon as others give it, saving nothing. They go in noisy wagons whose openings, 5 covered by mats, look like the gaping mouths of crocodiles. Their lives are free of trouble, they never have to say a village is their home. In the wasteland, they leave their troubles beneath the trees. Their clear, sweet-sounding ki?ai drums sound, 10 and as they dance, they wear on their heads fetching garlands of dense clusters of round erukku flowers. On the lovely breasts of their women, garlands of bright ?virai flowers from the forest sway in the light of the roaring flames burning on their firewood. 15 Their horns, large and small, sound like the trumpeting of an elephant and his mate who walks with measured steps, as the mu?avu drum sounds along with them and the rhythm is beaten out like the croaking of frogs over the water when clouds roar in the monsoon. 20 With their many small instruments sounding in short bursts, they go to towns, dancing, and then move on quickly, tying their bags on their heads so they sway as they walk. When those performers, with their large retinue, leave a place and when people of an old town 25 see the empty performing field, they feel sad. That is how I feel in the evening, and so how could I forget the love my man showed, since it will not go away. Atiya? Vi??atta??r This fine poem is the first of the third part of the Akan????u, entitled Nittilakk?vai. 2. ?Stop thinking and worrying? is pa?ar mika ci?u na?i ???ikam, ?as pain grows, become wellsettled a little.? 5. This might also mean that the noise of the wagons sounds like the cry of crocodiles. 9. Literally, ?at the bases of trees.? 15. In Tamil, this line is mu?arit t?yi? mu?a?ku a?al vi?akkattu and it could also mean, ?In the flight of the roaring flames of forest fires.? Mu?ari can mean ?jungle? or ?firewood,? and it is not clear here whether the fires meant are wild forest fires or fires made by the performers with firewood. 21. ?Short bursts? translates cil ari. The meaning of ari is not certain, but one of its meanings is ?interval.? 22. ?Move on? is added. 23. This line is talai pu?arttu acaitta pal tokai kalappaiyar. K. says this means that they tie up in bags many instruments together with the heads (of the instruments?), while K2 says it means they put many instruments in bags and fasten the flaps (talai) of the bags. Both pu?ar and acai can mean ?tie, fasten,? but acai can also mean ?make shake or move.? V. S. Rajam suggested to me that the poet may mean the bags are tied to the heads of the musicians?people in India often carry things on their heads. It was my suggestion that acai may mean that the bags shake as the performers travel carrying them on their heads. 27. Evening is often thought to be empty. 28. ?Since it will not go away? is based on K2?s interpretation of n??u i??u. UVS interprets this as ?without delay? and says it means viraintu: ?(how could I forget) without delay (i.e. quickly).? Much better is the sense of ?except that it lasts long (i.e. it will last long and), I cannot forget it.? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From arlogriffiths at hotmail.com Sat Apr 7 06:52:43 2018 From: arlogriffiths at hotmail.com (Arlo Griffiths) Date: Sat, 07 Apr 18 06:52:43 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_e-texts_of_Pi=E1=B9=85gala's_Chanda=E1=B8=A5=C5=9B=C4=81stra_and_=C4=81g=C4=81rjuna's_Ratn=C4=81val=C4=AB?= Message-ID: Dear colleagues, GRETIL does not seem to have any e-text for the Chanda???stra. Does anyone have an e-text of s?tras with/without commentary that can be shared? I also have the impression that the files for N?g?rjuna's Ratn?val? on GRETIL are not based on Hahn's edition and don't cover the 5th chapter. Does anyone have an e-text of the complete Ratn?val? based on Hahn's edition? Thank you. Arlo Griffiths -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aparpola at gmail.com Sat Apr 7 08:50:52 2018 From: aparpola at gmail.com (Asko Parpola) Date: Sat, 07 Apr 18 11:50:52 +0300 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_e-texts_of_Pi=E1=B9=85gala's_Chanda=E1=B8=A5=C5=9B=C4=81stra_and_=C4=81g=C4=81rjuna's_Ratn=C4=81val=C4=AB?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: https://ia700307.us.archive.org/28/items/ChhandaSutra-Pingala/chhanda_sutram_-_pingala_text.pdf Best wishes, Asko On Sat, Apr 7, 2018 at 9:52 AM, Arlo Griffiths via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Dear colleagues, > > > GRETIL does not seem to have any e-text for the Chanda???stra. > > > Does anyone have an e-text of s?tras with/without commentary that can be > shared? > > > I also have the impression that the files for N?g?rjuna's Ratn?val? on > GRETIL are not based on Hahn's edition and don't cover the 5th chapter. Does > anyone have an e-text of the complete Ratn?val? based on Hahn's edition? > > > Thank you. > > > Arlo Griffiths > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Asko Parpola, aparpola at gmail.com http://www.helsinki.academia.edu/AskoParpola -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lavanyavemsani at gmail.com Sun Apr 8 15:11:17 2018 From: lavanyavemsani at gmail.com (Lavanya Vemsani) Date: Sun, 08 Apr 18 11:11:17 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Announcing Journal launch: AJIS Message-ID: <24A4158F-821C-4713-BB57-0E9778A7D11F@gmail.com> Hello All, Happy to announce the launch of American Journal of Indic Studies (AJIS) today on The Buddha Jayanti: https://journals.library.unt.edu/index.php/indicstudies/index Please check it out and request your libraries to subscribe. With the help of our Executive Editor, Prof. Pankaj Jain, AJIS is hosted on University of North Texas Libraries on OJS system in free and publicly accessible format. On this happy occasion I would like to thank our editorial team (https://journals.library.unt.edu/index.php/indicstudies/about/editorialTeam), Contributing authors, and UNT libraries for their support. We also invite your articles as well as book/media reviews for our next issue scheduled for early Fall. Thank you. Lavanya Lavanya Vemsani Ph.D (History) Ph.D. (Religious Studies) Professor, Dept. of Social Sciences Shawnee State University Portsmouth OH 45662 Phone: 740-351-3233 Co-founder, American Academy of Indic Studies Editor-in-Chief American Journal of Indic Studies -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From psdmccartney at gmail.com Mon Apr 9 03:43:02 2018 From: psdmccartney at gmail.com (patrick mccartney) Date: Mon, 09 Apr 18 12:43:02 +0900 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fwd: Yogascapes conference CfP deadline extension 15 June 2018 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Friends, The Call for Papers Deadline for the Y*oga, Movement and Space Conference, Kyoto, Japan 2-3 November 2018*, has been extended to *15 June 2018. * Below, you can find more information. This conference seeks to foster an interdisciplinary exchange between anthropologists, sociologists, historians, indologists, scholars of religion, philosophers, philologists and linguists. And, also, yoga practitioners and members of the general public interested in attending. The intention is to facilitate a leisurely and collegial two-day interdisciplinary conference, which is thematically anchored around the broad theme of *yoga as movement*, particularly in relation to the imaginative consumption of tourism and pilgrimage within the multi-trillion-dollar global wellness industry (which defines wellness as a *state of complete physical, mental, and social well-being*). Building upon a 'serious leisure perspective *'* (SLP), participants are free to discuss how movement can be understood as that which occurs *on and off the yoga mat. *This includes the imaginative movement that occurs in meditation, the physical movement to and within one?s local yoga studio, or travel to exotic, distant lands. Aspects of which are inherent in the creation and consumption yoga-inflected lifestyles. We will also explore how the subjective, embodied experience of the yoga practitioner is mediated through internal movements of aspiration, expectation, and imagination. This includes textual-historical and ethnographic analysis of how imaginative interiorisation is used to traverse an internal sacred-scape, such as a*m?nasa-t?rtha* (mind-passage), a process that is arguably as important as physical movement through time and space. This development and management of imaginary landscapes, where the imagined *-scape* is interpolated onto a physical place, may hold more epistemological and ontological importance than the physical location one finds themselves in (See McCartney 2017 ). This notion of ?movement? allows for the exploration of how the pursuit of self-improvement and purification may consequently produce different types of environmental and social 'pollution'; and how participation in the global yoga tribe might potentially reify both, global and local, social and economic networks and hierarchies. Thus, 'movement', also relates to cultural conflict related to the social-political issues of manipulating cultural narratives, cultural appropriation, 'white-washing', and the building of cultural nationalisms. Therefore, there is space within the conference for us to discuss the steps required to practically decolonise yoga , both from the colonial and post-colonial/neo-liberal masters. ?If you would like to read more about the ideas inspiring this conference, click here . To register, click here . ?Thank you, for your interest in this conference. All the best, ????? ??????? Patrick McCartney, PhD JSPS Fellow - Graduate School of Global Environmental Studies, Kyoto University, Japan Research Associate - Nanzan University Anthropological Institute, Nagoya, Japan Visiting Fellow - South and South-east Asian Studies Department, Australian National University Skype - psdmccartney Phone + Whatsapp: +81-80-9811-3235 Twitter - @psdmccartney *bodhap?rvam calema* ;-) Yogascapes in Japan Academia - Linkedin Edanz Modern Yoga Research -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kelleragathe600 at gmail.com Mon Apr 9 13:50:14 2018 From: kelleragathe600 at gmail.com (Agathe Keller) Date: Mon, 09 Apr 18 15:50:14 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] sUcI-kaTAha-nyAya Message-ID: Dear all, I find this expression (s?c?-ka??ha-ny?ya) in an early 17th century mathematical commentary (K???a?s commentary on Bh?skara?s Bijaga?ita), and Monier Williams tells me that this is the ?rule of the needle and the caldron? by which easier things are done first. Can anyone tell me the story behind this expression, and also if you have met this phrase in other scholarly contexts? any insights and references will certainly be helpful yours, Agathe From krishnaprasadah.g at gmail.com Mon Apr 9 13:53:21 2018 From: krishnaprasadah.g at gmail.com (Krishnaprasad G) Date: Mon, 09 Apr 18 13:53:21 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] sUcI-kaTAha-nyAya In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Please refer A handful of popular maxims current in Sanskrit literature Available on Archives.org in 3 parts combined to one On Mon 9 Apr, 2018, 7:20 PM Agathe Keller via INDOLOGY, < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Dear all, > > I find this expression (s?c?-ka??ha-ny?ya) in an early 17th century > mathematical commentary (K???a?s commentary on Bh?skara?s Bijaga?ita), and > Monier Williams tells me that this is the ?rule of the needle and the > caldron? by which easier things are done first. Can anyone tell me the > story behind this expression, and also if you have met this phrase in other > scholarly contexts? > > any insights and references will certainly be helpful > > yours, > > > Agathe > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ashok.aklujkar at gmail.com Tue Apr 10 00:29:34 2018 From: ashok.aklujkar at gmail.com (Ashok Aklujkar) Date: Mon, 09 Apr 18 17:29:34 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] sUcI-kaTAha-nyAya In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > On Apr 9, 2018, at 6:50 AM, Agathe Keller via INDOLOGY wrote: > I find this expression (s?c?-ka??ha-ny?ya) in an early 17th century mathematical commentary (K???a?s commentary on Bh?skara?s Bijaga?ita), and Monier Williams tells me that this is the ?rule of the needle and the caldron? by which easier things are done first. Can anyone tell me the story behind this expression, and also if you have met this phrase in other scholarly contexts? Someone first places an order with a blacksmith for the production of a cauldron and then places an order for the production of a needle. The blacksmith, considering the second production to be less time-consuming attends to it first. The sequence in which the orders were received is set aside. (Similarly, a commentator/elucidator coming across a long or complex sentence first gets simpler expressions in or around it out of his way and thus clears the way to attack the difficult statement.) See Mishra, Chhabinath. 1978. Ny?yokti-ko?a: a Dictionary of Ny?yas (Sayings) in Sanskrit ??stras. Dill?: Ajanta Publications. p. 97, which, in turn, refers to (Ny?ya?)S?hasr? 198. a.a. From alanus1216 at yahoo.com Tue Apr 10 04:02:58 2018 From: alanus1216 at yahoo.com (Allen Thrasher) Date: Tue, 10 Apr 18 04:02:58 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] expert on Ramatankas alias temple tokens? In-Reply-To: <605523821.1063035.1523332978336.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <605523821.1063035.1523332978336@mail.yahoo.com> I have four temple tokens which I bought some years ago which the last time I checked were unpublished.? Is there anyone on the list or known to anyone on the list who is an expert or keeps up on the subject, so that I could send them images so that if they were already published they could tell me and save me the effort of going through the literature published since the last time I looked?? If they are unpublished I would publish them in one of the journals of Indian numismatics. Thanks, Allen -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kelleragathe600 at gmail.com Tue Apr 10 05:21:20 2018 From: kelleragathe600 at gmail.com (Agathe Keller) Date: Tue, 10 Apr 18 07:21:20 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] sUcI-kaTAha-nyAya In-Reply-To: <791E598B-409A-42A8-A15C-A093F1E2E258@uclouvain.be> Message-ID: Dear colleagues, in and off list, **many many thanks** Agathe > On 9 Apr 2018, at 18:26, Christophe Vielle wrote: > > It is in the vol. 1 p. 53: > https://archive.org/stream/handfulofpopular01jacoiala#page/52/mode/2up > > Cf. > JACOB George [pt. 1]. A handful of popular maxims current in Sanskrit literature. 1907 -- https://archive.org/details/handfulofpopular01jacoiala > [pt. 2]. A second handful of popular maxims current in Sanskrit literature. 1909.-- https://archive.org/details/handfulofpopular02jacoiala -- > > [pt. 3]. A third handful of popular maxims current in Sanskrit literature. 1911.-- https://archive.org/details/handfulofpopular03jacoiala > > This ny?ya is not given in Kane's list, HdhS 5/2, pp. 1339-1351 (section VII - Puurvamiimaa.msaa and Dharmazaastra, pp. 1152-1351, Appendix on Nyaayas) > https://archive.org/stream/HistoryOfDharmasastraancientAndMediaevalReligiousAndCivilLawV.5.2/Kane_A-History-of-Dharmasastra-v5-2_1962#page/n667/mode/2up > Nor in Kishori Lal Sarkar, The Mimamsa Rules of Interpretation as Applied to Hindu Law, Tagore Law Lectures for 1905, Calcutta, 1909 > > But see no. 387 here: > https://sanskritdocuments.org/doc_z_misc_major_works/nyaayaavalii.html?lang=sa > which corresponds to what is said in the list given in APTE Practical dictionary, Appendix E (A Collection of Sanskrit Popular Maxims). > >> Le 9 avr. 2018 ? 15:53, Krishnaprasad G via INDOLOGY > a ?crit : >> >> Please refer >> A handful of popular maxims current in Sanskrit literature >> Available on Archives.org in 3 parts combined to one >> >> On Mon 9 Apr, 2018, 7:20 PM Agathe Keller via INDOLOGY, > wrote: >> Dear all, >> >> I find this expression (s?c?-ka??ha-ny?ya) in an early 17th century mathematical commentary (K???a?s commentary on Bh?skara?s Bijaga?ita), and Monier Williams tells me that this is the ?rule of the needle and the caldron? by which easier things are done first. Can anyone tell me the story behind this expression, and also if you have met this phrase in other scholarly contexts? >> >> any insights and references will certainly be helpful >> >> yours, >> >> >> Agathe >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > ??????????????????? > Christophe Vielle > Louvain-la-Neuve > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From toke.knudsen at hum.ku.dk Tue Apr 10 07:45:54 2018 From: toke.knudsen at hum.ku.dk (Toke Lindegaard Knudsen) Date: Tue, 10 Apr 18 07:45:54 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_Cart-shaped,_=C5=9Baka=E1=B9=AD=C4=81k=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: <9C481F30-687A-465D-8111-2EA73D68FC97@hum.ku.dk> Message-ID: Many thanks to all who replied, both on and off the list, to my inquiry about the word ?aka??k?ra, ?cart-shaped.? I greatly appreciate it. Best wishes, Toke From wujastyk at gmail.com Tue Apr 10 15:42:02 2018 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Tue, 10 Apr 18 09:42:02 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Indian Council of Philosophical Research orders postponement of conference on religious pluralism because 'there are some papers on tribal religious practices, some papers are by foreign scholars.' Message-ID: In yet another disturbing development, an academic conference at JNU has been cancelled by the Indian Council of Philosophical Research on the grounds that it included papers on tribal religion and papers to be delivered by foreigners. This is shameful. The ICPR head, Prof. S. R. Bhatt, defended the decision with a series of transparently feeble arguments. - https://thewire.in/education/objecting-to-papers-on-adivasi-religion-government-body-cans-philosophy-meet I was shocked to learn that JNU even had to submit conference planning to the ICPR for vetting and approval in the first place. It is a fundamental tenet that a university should be intellectually independent. Dominik Wujastyk ? -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk ?,? Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity ?,? Department of History and Classics ?,? University of Alberta, Canada ?.? South Asia at the U of A: ?sas.ualberta.ca? ?? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From raffaele.torella at uniroma1.it Tue Apr 10 17:00:52 2018 From: raffaele.torella at uniroma1.it (Raffaele Torella) Date: Tue, 10 Apr 18 19:00:52 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= Message-ID: <227A7A24-0484-44FF-8A0A-DF4E9260E719@uniroma1.it> Dear colleagues, I am looking for early (i.e. pre-?nandavardhana) occurrences of the term camatk?ra. Thanks for any help. Raffaele Torella Prof. Raffaele Torella Chair of Sanskrit Sapienza University of Rome www.academia.edu/raffaeletorella -- ___________________________________________ *Il tuo?5?diventa 1000* Fai crescere la tua universit? Dona il?5?per?mille?alla Sapienza Codice fiscale:?*80209930587* https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-universita-con-il-cinque-mille -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Tue Apr 10 18:12:36 2018 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Tue, 10 Apr 18 23:42:36 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: <227A7A24-0484-44FF-8A0A-DF4E9260E719@uniroma1.it> Message-ID: Studies on Some Concepts of Alankara Shastra by V Raghavan at https://archive.org/download/in.ernet.dli.2015.495255/2015.495255.STUDIES-ON.pdf has a chapter on Chamatkaara On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 10:30 PM, Raffaele Torella via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Dear colleagues, > > I am looking for early (i.e. pre-?nandavardhana) occurrences of the term > camatk?ra. > > Thanks for any help. > Raffaele Torella > > Prof. Raffaele Torella > Chair of Sanskrit > Sapienza University of Rome > www.academia.edu/raffaeletorella > > > > > > ___________________________________________ > *Il tuo 5 diventa 1000* > Fai crescere la tua universit? > Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza > Codice fiscale: *80209930587* > https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-univer > sita-con-il-cinque-mille > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dxs163 at case.edu Tue Apr 10 20:14:48 2018 From: dxs163 at case.edu (Deepak Sarma) Date: Tue, 10 Apr 18 16:14:48 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Indian Council of Philosophical Research orders postponement of conference on religious pluralism because 'there are some papers on tribal religious practices, some papers are by foreign scholars.' In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2A3568EE-980E-4C51-A892-2B0CDD8A203C@case.edu> It is indeed disturbing. The ICPR had at least 6 weeks to evaluate the conference (it was submitted to the ICPR, in part, I believe, to get funding). I found out the day before my flight. I understand from my colleagues at JNU that such cancelations and meddling is not very unusual. One JNU faculty member was not surprised and mentioned that "we are facing this kind of ridiculous censorship and suppression daily at the University.? The irony here, though, is palpable --xenophobia, nativism, and religio-poliical ideology preventing a conversion about Religion and Pluralism. I wonder how such an cancellation fits in with the prevailing political ideology of Hindutva and Hindu ?tolerance? that they so merrily profess. Dr. Deepak Sarma Professor of Religious Studies Professor of Bioethics (secondary appointment) School of Medicine, Case Western Reserve University Curatorial Consultant, Department of Asian Art Cleveland Museum of Art Mailing Address: Department of Religious Studies Tomlinson Hall 2121 MLK Jr. Drive Case Western Reserve University Cleveland, OH 44106-7112 office: 216-368-4790 deepak.sarma at case.edu deepaksarma.com > On Apr 10, 2018, at 11:42 AM, Dominik Wujastyk via INDOLOGY wrote: > > In yet another disturbing development, an academic conference at JNU has been cancelled by the Indian Council of Philosophical Research on the grounds that it included papers on tribal religion and papers to be delivered by foreigners. This is shameful. The ICPR head, Prof. S. R. Bhatt, defended the decision with a series of transparently feeble arguments. > ? https://thewire.in/education/objecting-to-papers-on-adivasi-religion-government-body-cans-philosophy-meet > I was shocked to learn that JNU even had to submit conference planning to the ICPR for vetting and approval in the first place. It is a fundamental tenet that a university should be intellectually independent. > > > > Dominik Wujastyk > > ?-- > Professor Dominik Wujastyk?,? > Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity?,? > Department of History and Classics?,? > University of Alberta, Canada?.? > South Asia at the U of A: ?sas.ualberta.ca??? > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) From hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com Wed Apr 11 00:56:51 2018 From: hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com (Harry Spier) Date: Tue, 10 Apr 18 20:56:51 -0400 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Raffaele, If you do a search of the Muktabodha digital library e-text collection. http://muktalib5.org/digital_library_secure_entry.htm and do a search of the e-texts for (Note the < and > in the search term tell the digital library you are using Kyoto-Harvard transliteration.) you will get a large number of references to camatkAra. Most are later than the date you are asking about but its possible some might be earlier if you are lucky. Best wishes, Harry Spier On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 2:12 PM, Nagaraj Paturi via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Studies on Some Concepts of Alankara Shastra by V Raghavan at > > https://archive.org/download/in.ernet.dli.2015.495255/2015. > 495255.STUDIES-ON.pdf > > has a chapter on Chamatkaara > > On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 10:30 PM, Raffaele Torella via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > >> Dear colleagues, >> >> I am looking for early (i.e. pre-?nandavardhana) occurrences of the term >> camatk?ra. >> >> Thanks for any help. >> Raffaele Torella >> >> Prof. Raffaele Torella >> Chair of Sanskrit >> Sapienza University of Rome >> www.academia.edu/raffaeletorella >> >> >> >> >> >> ___________________________________________ >> *Il tuo 5 diventa 1000* >> Fai crescere la tua universit? >> Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza >> Codice fiscale: *80209930587* >> https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-univer >> sita-con-il-cinque-mille >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > > -- > Nagaraj Paturi > > Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. > > > BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra > > BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala > > Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies > > FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, > > (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aparpola at gmail.com Wed Apr 11 05:40:15 2018 From: aparpola at gmail.com (Asko Parpola) Date: Wed, 11 Apr 18 08:40:15 +0300 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Shulman, David, 2010. Notes on Camatk?ra. Pp. 249-276 in: David Shulman (ed.), Language, ritual and poetics in ancienty India and Iran. Jerusalem: Israel Academy of Sciences and Humanities. On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 3:56 AM, Harry Spier via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Dear Raffaele, > > If you do a search of the Muktabodha digital library e-text collection. > http://muktalib5.org/digital_library_secure_entry.htm > and do a search of the e-texts for > (Note the < and > in the search term tell the digital library you are > using Kyoto-Harvard transliteration.) you will get a large number of > references to camatkAra. Most are later than the date you are asking about > but its possible some might be earlier if you are lucky. > > Best wishes, > Harry Spier > > > > On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 2:12 PM, Nagaraj Paturi via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > >> Studies on Some Concepts of Alankara Shastra by V Raghavan at >> >> https://archive.org/download/in.ernet.dli.2015.495255/2015.4 >> 95255.STUDIES-ON.pdf >> >> has a chapter on Chamatkaara >> >> On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 10:30 PM, Raffaele Torella via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >> >>> Dear colleagues, >>> >>> I am looking for early (i.e. pre-?nandavardhana) occurrences of the term >>> camatk?ra. >>> >>> Thanks for any help. >>> Raffaele Torella >>> >>> Prof. Raffaele Torella >>> Chair of Sanskrit >>> Sapienza University of Rome >>> www.academia.edu/raffaeletorella >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ___________________________________________ >>> *Il tuo 5 diventa 1000* >>> Fai crescere la tua universit? >>> Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza >>> Codice fiscale: *80209930587* >>> https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-univer >>> sita-con-il-cinque-mille >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Nagaraj Paturi >> >> Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. >> >> >> BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra >> >> BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala >> >> Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies >> >> FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, >> >> (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Asko Parpola, aparpola at gmail.com http://www.helsinki.academia.edu/AskoParpola -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Wed Apr 11 15:26:46 2018 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Wed, 11 Apr 18 15:26:46 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Is a PDF of the article available? Matthew T. Kapstein EPHE, Paris The University of Chicago ________________________________ From: INDOLOGY on behalf of Asko Parpola via INDOLOGY Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2018 7:40:15 AM To: Harry Spier Cc: Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra Shulman, David, 2010. Notes on Camatk?ra. Pp. 249-276 in: David Shulman (ed.), Language, ritual and poetics in ancienty India and Iran. Jerusalem: Israel Academy of Sciences and Humanities. On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 3:56 AM, Harry Spier via INDOLOGY > wrote: Dear Raffaele, If you do a search of the Muktabodha digital library e-text collection. http://muktalib5.org/digital_library_secure_entry.htm and do a search of the e-texts for (Note the < and > in the search term tell the digital library you are using Kyoto-Harvard transliteration.) you will get a large number of references to camatkAra. Most are later than the date you are asking about but its possible some might be earlier if you are lucky. Best wishes, Harry Spier On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 2:12 PM, Nagaraj Paturi via INDOLOGY > wrote: Studies on Some Concepts of Alankara Shastra by V Raghavan at https://archive.org/download/in.ernet.dli.2015.495255/2015.495255.STUDIES-ON.pdf has a chapter on Chamatkaara On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 10:30 PM, Raffaele Torella via INDOLOGY > wrote: Dear colleagues, I am looking for early (i.e. pre-?nandavardhana) occurrences of the term camatk?ra. Thanks for any help. Raffaele Torella Prof. Raffaele Torella Chair of Sanskrit Sapienza University of Rome www.academia.edu/raffaeletorella ___________________________________________ Il tuo 5 diventa 1000 Fai crescere la tua universit? Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza Codice fiscale: 80209930587 https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-universita-con-il-cinque-mille _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- Asko Parpola, aparpola at gmail.com http://www.helsinki.academia.edu/AskoParpola -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mrinalkaul81 at gmail.com Wed Apr 11 15:44:51 2018 From: mrinalkaul81 at gmail.com (Mrinal Kaul) Date: Wed, 11 Apr 18 21:14:51 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Here is the PDF. Thanks. Mrinal ------ Mrinal Kaul, Ph.D. Assistant Professor - Manipal Centre for Philosophy and Humanities (MCPH) Coordinator - Centre for Religious Studies (CRS) Dr TMA Pai Planetarium Complex Alevoor Road, Manipal 576 104 Karnataka, INDIA Tel +91-820-29-23567 Extn: 23567 https://iuo.academia.edu/MrinalKaul email: mrinal.kaul at manipal.edu On 11 April 2018 at 20:56, Matthew Kapstein via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Is a PDF of the article available? > > Matthew T. Kapstein > EPHE, Paris > The University of Chicago > > ------------------------------ > *From:* INDOLOGY on behalf of Asko > Parpola via INDOLOGY > *Sent:* Wednesday, April 11, 2018 7:40:15 AM > *To:* Harry Spier > *Cc:* > *Subject:* Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra > > Shulman, David, 2010. Notes on Camatk?ra. Pp. 249-276 in: David Shulman > (ed.), Language, ritual and poetics in ancienty India and Iran. Jerusalem: Israel > Academy of Sciences and Humanities. > > On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 3:56 AM, Harry Spier via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > >> Dear Raffaele, >> >> If you do a search of the Muktabodha digital library e-text collection. >> http://muktalib5.org/digital_library_secure_entry.htm >> and do a search of the e-texts for >> (Note the < and > in the search term tell the digital library you are >> using Kyoto-Harvard transliteration.) you will get a large number of >> references to camatkAra. Most are later than the date you are asking about >> but its possible some might be earlier if you are lucky. >> >> Best wishes, >> Harry Spier >> >> >> >> On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 2:12 PM, Nagaraj Paturi via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >> >>> Studies on Some Concepts of Alankara Shastra by V Raghavan at >>> >>> https://archive.org/download/in.ernet.dli.2015.495255/2015.4 >>> 95255.STUDIES-ON.pdf >>> >>> has a chapter on Chamatkaara >>> >>> On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 10:30 PM, Raffaele Torella via INDOLOGY < >>> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >>> >>>> Dear colleagues, >>>> >>>> I am looking for early (i.e. pre-?nandavardhana) occurrences of the >>>> term camatk?ra. >>>> >>>> Thanks for any help. >>>> Raffaele Torella >>>> >>>> Prof. Raffaele Torella >>>> Chair of Sanskrit >>>> Sapienza University of Rome >>>> www.academia.edu/raffaeletorella >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ___________________________________________ >>>> *Il tuo 5 diventa 1000* >>>> Fai crescere la tua universit? >>>> Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza >>>> Codice fiscale: *80209930587* >>>> https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-univer >>>> sita-con-il-cinque-mille >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>> committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>>> or unsubscribe) >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Nagaraj Paturi >>> >>> Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. >>> >>> >>> BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra >>> >>> BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala >>> >>> Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies >>> >>> FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, >>> >>> (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > > -- > Asko Parpola, aparpola at gmail.com > http://www.helsinki.academia.edu/AskoParpola > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ShulmanCamatkra.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 1422069 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Wed Apr 11 16:49:17 2018 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Wed, 11 Apr 18 16:49:17 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks to all who have responded. The wonderful Indologists have so far sent me one copy for each of the three eyes of ?iva! Camatk?ra indeed! Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________________ From: INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info] on behalf of Matthew Kapstein via INDOLOGY [indology at list.indology.info] Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2018 10:26 AM To: Harry Spier; Asko Parpola Cc: Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra Is a PDF of the article available? Matthew T. Kapstein EPHE, Paris The University of Chicago ________________________________ From: INDOLOGY on behalf of Asko Parpola via INDOLOGY Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2018 7:40:15 AM To: Harry Spier Cc: Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra Shulman, David, 2010. Notes on Camatk?ra. Pp. 249-276 in: David Shulman (ed.), Language, ritual and poetics in ancienty India and Iran. Jerusalem: Israel Academy of Sciences and Humanities. On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 3:56 AM, Harry Spier via INDOLOGY > wrote: Dear Raffaele, If you do a search of the Muktabodha digital library e-text collection. http://muktalib5.org/digital_library_secure_entry.htm and do a search of the e-texts for (Note the < and > in the search term tell the digital library you are using Kyoto-Harvard transliteration.) you will get a large number of references to camatkAra. Most are later than the date you are asking about but its possible some might be earlier if you are lucky. Best wishes, Harry Spier On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 2:12 PM, Nagaraj Paturi via INDOLOGY > wrote: Studies on Some Concepts of Alankara Shastra by V Raghavan at https://archive.org/download/in.ernet.dli.2015.495255/2015.495255.STUDIES-ON.pdf has a chapter on Chamatkaara On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 10:30 PM, Raffaele Torella via INDOLOGY > wrote: Dear colleagues, I am looking for early (i.e. pre-?nandavardhana) occurrences of the term camatk?ra. Thanks for any help. Raffaele Torella Prof. Raffaele Torella Chair of Sanskrit Sapienza University of Rome www.academia.edu/raffaeletorella ___________________________________________ Il tuo 5 diventa 1000 Fai crescere la tua universit? Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza Codice fiscale: 80209930587 https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-universita-con-il-cinque-mille _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- Asko Parpola, aparpola at gmail.com http://www.helsinki.academia.edu/AskoParpola From anurupa.n at ifpindia.org Thu Apr 12 07:26:44 2018 From: anurupa.n at ifpindia.org (Anurupa Naik) Date: Thu, 12 Apr 18 12:56:44 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_New_book_jointly_published_by_the_Institut_Fran=C3=A7ais_de_Pondich=C3=A9ry_and_the_Ecole_fran=C3=A7aise_d=E2=80=99Extr=C3=AAme-Orient?= Message-ID: <72d861ca-40c3-6f6b-5f80-87eb9f6dd70c@ifpindia.org> *JUST RELEASED* */Domestic Rituals of the Atharvaveda in the Paippal?da Tradition of Orissa: ?r?dhara?s Viv?h?dikarmapa?jik?. /**/Volume I: Book One, Part One: General Prescriptions. /* Edited with an Introduction by*Arlo Griffiths*& *Shilpa Sumant*, Collection Indologie n? 135, Institut Fran?ais de Pondich?ry / Ecole fran?aise d?Extr?me-Orient, 2018, cxxxiii, 172 p. Language: Sanskrit, English. 800 Rs (35 ?). ISBN: 978-81-8470-224-8 (IFP) / 978-2-85539-227-1 (EFEO). The /Karmapa?jik?/ is a manual for the domestic rituals of the Paippal?da tradition. Claiming to follow a S?tra of Pai?h?nasi, the text was composed by an otherwise unknown ?r?dhara in Orissa in the 16th century CE. His work is a precious late-medieval witness to the Atharvavedic tradition, preserving archaic features dating from the Vedic period, but also showing much influence from various non-Vedic traditions that have been prevalent in this part of eastern India. The critical edition, which will be complete in three volumes, is based on six palm-leaf manuscripts written in Oriya script. This first volume contains an extensive introduction followed by the first nine chapters of text that describe the general paradigms of domestic ritual in this tradition. *About the editors* *Arlo Griffiths*received his PhD in Sanskrit from Leiden University in 2004. After holding a position as lecturer in Indian Religions at the University of Groningen (2004?05), and holding the chair of Sanskrit at Leiden University (2005?08), he joined the EFEO in 2008 as Professor of Southeast Asian History. He was posted at the EFEO?s Jakarta Centre from 2009 through 2014, and now teaches in Paris and Lyons. *Shilpa Sumant*received her PhD in Sanskrit from Tilak Maharashtra Vidyapeeth (Pune) in 2007. Since 2009, she is Sub-editor in the Sanskrit Dictionary Project of the Deccan College Post Graduate and Research Institute, Pune. Since 2014, she is a member of the Regulating Council of the Bhandarkar Oriental Research Institute and is one of the editors of its /Annals/. ---------------- *Institut Fran?ais de Pondich?ry * P. B. 33, 11, St. Louis Street, Pondicherry-605001, INDIA Ph: +91-413-2231660 / 661. Fax: +91 413-2231605 E-mail: _library at ifpindia.org _ Website: http://www.ifpindia.org/bookstore-list *Ecole fran?aise d?Extr?me-Orient * P.O. Box 151,16 & 19, Dumas Street Pondicherry - 605001,INDIA Ph: +91-413-2334539. Fax +91-413-2330886 E-mail: shanti at efeo-pondicherry.org -- Ms. Anurupa Naik Head, Library and Publication Division French Institute of Pondicherry (IFP) UMIFRE 21 CNRS-MAEE P.B. 33 11, St. Louis Street Pondicherry-605 001, INDIA Tel: 91-413-2231660 Fax: 91-413-2231605 e-mail:anurupa.n at ifpindia.org website:www.ifpindia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From buescherhartmut at gmail.com Thu Apr 12 13:38:07 2018 From: buescherhartmut at gmail.com (Hartmut Buescher) Date: Thu, 12 Apr 18 15:38:07 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Having thanks to the quick availability of David Shulman's "Notes on Camatk?ra" been able to go through the article, I noticed that, although *en passant* touching on the meaning of this term in the philosophical system of Pratyabhij??, he predominantly concentrates on its originally (thanks to Abhinavagupta) not altogether unrelated employment in later *ala?k?ra* contexts. For the sake of scholars with a considerable interest in comparative philosophy, such as Matthew Kapstein (who requested a pdf of the article in the present context), it may be remarked that the most important reference provided in *T?ntrik?bhidh?nako?a* II: 231 under the lemma *camatk**?ra* is actually to note 23 of Prof. Torella's *The **??varapratyabhij* *??k?rik? of Utpaladeva * *with the** Author's V?tti* (1994: 118f.). Unfortunately, Shulman does not display any awareness of Torella's masterful work. In the context of Utpaladeva's Pratyabhij?? philosophy *camatk**?ra*, as Torella explains, has a profound significance in connection with realizing/re-cognizing one's Self, one that "goes beyond that relative and momentary transcendence that one has in the aesthetic experience of poetry and the theatre" (*ibid*.). He provides a number of adumbrative terms, introducing these by saying "[t]he terms with which it is glossed or with which it is closely related may be grouped according to its principal components: cognition, bliss, wonder." Given Matthew's primary field, let me add that *camatk**?ra* in the Pratyabhij?? context closely resembles that of *?o mtshar* as employed by Klo? chen pa and other rDzogs chen philosopher in the Tibetan context. Aware of the largely common geographical origin of modes of thinking that subsequently was turned into parallel systematic philosophical developments, this may not be altogether surprising. Naturally, this sphere has received hardly any independent attention by Western philosophers. Yet, there actually is a rather astonishing focus in one of Heidegger's works. In volume 45 *Grundfragen der Philosophie. Ausgew?hlte "Probleme" der "Logik" * of Martin Heidegger, *Gesamtausgabe*, (II. Abteilung: Vorlesungen 1925-1944), those interested in this ontologically attuned aesthetico-phenomenological context will find a long ? 38 with 15 subsections (pp. 165-181) titled: "Das Wesen des Er-staunens als der in die Notwendigkeit des anf?nglichen Denkens n?tigenden Grundstimmung". Best wishes, Hartmut Buescher . On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 6:49 PM, Matthew Kapstein via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Thanks to all who have responded. The wonderful Indologists have so far > sent me one copy for each of the three eyes of ?iva! > Camatk?ra indeed! > > Matthew > > Matthew Kapstein > Directeur d'?tudes, > Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes > > Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, > The University of Chicago > > ________________________________________ > From: INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info] on behalf of Matthew > Kapstein via INDOLOGY [indology at list.indology.info] > Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2018 10:26 AM > To: Harry Spier; Asko Parpola > Cc: > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra > > Is a PDF of the article available? > > Matthew T. Kapstein > EPHE, Paris > The University of Chicago > > ________________________________ > From: INDOLOGY on behalf of Asko > Parpola via INDOLOGY > Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2018 7:40:15 AM > To: Harry Spier > Cc: > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra > > Shulman, David, 2010. Notes on Camatk?ra. Pp. 249-276 in: David Shulman > (ed.), Language, ritual and poetics in ancienty India and Iran. Jerusalem: > Israel Academy of Sciences and Humanities. > > On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 3:56 AM, Harry Spier via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Dear Raffaele, > > If you do a search of the Muktabodha digital library e-text collection. > http://muktalib5.org/digital_library_secure_entry.htm > and do a search of the e-texts for > (Note the < and > in the search term tell the digital library you are > using Kyoto-Harvard transliteration.) you will get a large number of > references to camatkAra. Most are later than the date you are asking about > but its possible some might be earlier if you are lucky. > > Best wishes, > Harry Spier > > > > On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 2:12 PM, Nagaraj Paturi via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Studies on Some Concepts of Alankara Shastra by V Raghavan at > > https://archive.org/download/in.ernet.dli.2015.495255/2015. > 495255.STUDIES-ON.pdf > > has a chapter on Chamatkaara > > On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 10:30 PM, Raffaele Torella via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Dear colleagues, > > I am looking for early (i.e. pre-?nandavardhana) occurrences of the term > camatk?ra. > > Thanks for any help. > Raffaele Torella > > Prof. Raffaele Torella > Chair of Sanskrit > Sapienza University of Rome > www.academia.edu/raffaeletorella > > > > > > ___________________________________________ > Il tuo 5 diventa 1000 > Fai crescere la tua universit? > Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza > Codice fiscale: 80209930587 > https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua- > universita-con-il-cinque-mille > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info > (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > > -- > Nagaraj Paturi > > Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. > > > BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra > > BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala > > Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies > > FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, > > (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info > (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info > (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > > -- > Asko Parpola, aparpola at gmail.com > http://www.helsinki.academia.edu/AskoParpola > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From psdmccartney at gmail.com Fri Apr 13 01:05:30 2018 From: psdmccartney at gmail.com (patrick mccartney) Date: Fri, 13 Apr 18 01:05:30 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote Message-ID: Hello, I'm curious about this quote as I am writing about the use of phrases related to ,,journeys to self,,. In a google search for examples, I came across this "Yoga is the journey of the self , through the self, to the self ~ The Bhagavad Gita" Might anyone know which chapter and verse this translation is? I do not recognise it. Thanks, Patrick https://www.downtownyoga.net/single-post/2016/09/26/Yoga-is-the-journey-of-the-self-through-the-self-to-the-self-The-Bhagavad-Gita -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dnreigle at gmail.com Fri Apr 13 02:21:34 2018 From: dnreigle at gmail.com (David and Nancy Reigle) Date: Thu, 12 Apr 18 20:21:34 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Patrick, This may be a loose rendering of verse 6.20: yatroparamate citta? niruddha? yogasevay? yatra caiv?tman?tm?na? pa?yann ?tmani tu?yati I do not know what other verse it could be. It would pretty much have to have the phrase, ?tman?tm?nam, and this verse is the only one of the six having this phrase that also has the word yoga. Best regards, David Reigle Colorado, U.S.A. On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 7:05 PM, patrick mccartney via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Hello, > > I'm curious about this quote as I am writing about the use of phrases > related to ,,journeys to self,,. In a google search for examples, I came > across this > > "Yoga is the journey of the self , through the self, to the self ~ The > Bhagavad Gita" > > Might anyone know which chapter and verse this translation is? I do not > recognise it. > > Thanks, Patrick > > https://www.downtownyoga.net/single-post/2016/09/26/Yoga- > is-the-journey-of-the-self-through-the-self-to-the-self-The-Bhagavad-Gita > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From psdmccartney at gmail.com Fri Apr 13 03:37:03 2018 From: psdmccartney at gmail.com (patrick mccartney) Date: Fri, 13 Apr 18 12:37:03 +0900 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thank you, David, for taking the time to respond. I have followed an interesting trail to get to the "source" of this quote. By that, I mean the website from which the person who wrote the article I found it in used as a source. So far, neither of these authors has responded, so I put this quote into google and it is used in a surprising number of instances. One comment on Reddit suggests that it might come from 6.5 It is interesting that I am not the first person to wonder where, exactly, this quote is found in the BhG, or possibly more correctly, which verse inspires this loose translation, if we can even call it that. Perhaps, paraphrasing is more accurate? I personally find the ways knowledge from texts is reconstituted and retransmitted around yogaland to be fascinating. All the best, ????? ??????? Patrick McCartney, PhD JSPS Fellow - Graduate School of Global Environmental Studies, Kyoto University, Japan Research Associate - Nanzan University Anthropological Institute, Nagoya, Japan Visiting Fellow - South and South-east Asian Studies Department, Australian National University Skype - psdmccartney Phone + Whatsapp: +81-80-9811-3235 Twitter - @psdmccartney *bodhap?rvam calema* ;-) Yogascapes in Japan Academia - Linkedin Edanz Modern Yoga Research On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 11:21 AM, David and Nancy Reigle wrote: > Dear Patrick, > > This may be a loose rendering of verse 6.20: > > yatroparamate citta? niruddha? yogasevay? > yatra caiv?tman?tm?na? pa?yann ?tmani tu?yati > > I do not know what other verse it could be. It would pretty much have to > have the phrase, ?tman?tm?nam, and this verse is the only one of the six > having this phrase that also has the word yoga. > > Best regards, > > David Reigle > Colorado, U.S.A. > > On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 7:05 PM, patrick mccartney via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> I'm curious about this quote as I am writing about the use of phrases >> related to ,,journeys to self,,. In a google search for examples, I came >> across this >> >> "Yoga is the journey of the self , through the self, to the self ~ The >> Bhagavad Gita" >> >> Might anyone know which chapter and verse this translation is? I do not >> recognise it. >> >> Thanks, Patrick >> >> https://www.downtownyoga.net/single-post/2016/09/26/Yoga-is- >> the-journey-of-the-self-through-the-self-to-the-self-The-Bhagavad-Gita >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From eastwestcultural at yahoo.com Fri Apr 13 04:20:36 2018 From: eastwestcultural at yahoo.com (Dean Michael Anderson) Date: Fri, 13 Apr 18 04:20:36 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <56149480.2599411.1523593236134@mail.yahoo.com> l was also going to suggest 6.5 might be an option but I decided David's suggestion was closer. I think it is likely that the person paraphrased from memory and thus conflated more than one verse. Like Hinduism itself, it is often impossible to locate the "one source".? :-) Best, Dean From: patrick mccartney via INDOLOGY To: David and Nancy Reigle Cc: Indology List Sent: Friday, April 13, 2018 9:08 AM Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote Thank you, David, for taking the time to respond. I have followed an interesting trail to get to the "source" of this quote. By that, I mean the website from which the person who wrote the article I found it in used as a source.?So far, neither of these authors has responded, so I put this quote into google and it is used in a surprising number of instances.?One comment on Reddit suggests that it might come from 6.5It is interesting that I am not the first person to wonder where, exactly, this quote is found in the BhG, or possibly more correctly, which verse inspires this loose translation, if we can even call it that. Perhaps, paraphrasing is more accurate? I personally find the ways knowledge from texts is reconstituted and retransmitted around yogaland to be fascinating.? All the best, ????? ??????? Patrick McCartney, PhDJSPS Fellow - Graduate School of Global Environmental Studies, Kyoto University, JapanResearch Associate - Nanzan University Anthropological Institute, Nagoya, JapanVisiting Fellow - South and South-east Asian Studies Department,?Australian National University Skype - psdmccartneyPhone + Whatsapp: ?+81-80-9811-3235Twitter - @psdmccartney bodhap?rvam calema ;-) Yogascapes in Japan Academia - Linkedin Edanz Modern Yoga Research On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 11:21 AM, David and Nancy Reigle wrote: Dear Patrick, This may be a loose rendering of verse 6.20: yatroparamate citta? niruddha? yogasevay? yatra caiv?tman?tm?na? pa?yann ?tmani tu?yati? I do not know what other verse it could be. It would pretty much have to have the phrase, ?tman?tm?nam, and this verse is the only one of the six having this phrase that also has the word yoga. Best regards, David Reigle Colorado, U.S.A. On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 7:05 PM, patrick mccartney via INDOLOGY wrote: Hello,? I'm curious about this quote as I am writing about the use of phrases related to ,,journeys to self,,. In a google search for examples, I came across this "Yoga is the journey of the self , through the self, to the self ~ The Bhagavad Gita" Might anyone know which chapter and verse this translation is? I do not recognise it. Thanks, Patrick?? https://www.downtownyoga.net/s ingle-post/2016/09/26/Yoga-is- the-journey-of-the-self-throug h-the-self-to-the-self-The- Bhagavad-Gita ______________________________ _________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.i nfo (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From anurupa.n at ifpindia.org Fri Apr 13 06:31:16 2018 From: anurupa.n at ifpindia.org (Anurupa Naik) Date: Fri, 13 Apr 18 12:01:16 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_New_book_jointly_published_by_the_Ecole_fran=C3=A7aise_d=E2=80=99Extr=C3=AAme-Orient_and_the_Institut_Fran=C3=A7ais_de_Pondich=C3=A9ry?= Message-ID: <09fd4127-203d-4a77-a8b9-b3d752be5b76@ifpindia.org> **JUST RELEASED** */A Critical Edition and an Annotated Translation of the Akan????u/**//**/(Part 1 - Ka?i??iy??ainirai). /**???????? ??????? ?????????? ?????? ?????????? **- **??????????????? (**1 ? 120) **[ 3 vols]*Volume I : Introduction, Invocation ? 50 ; Volume II: 51-120; Vololume III : Old Commentary on Ka?i??iy??ainirai KV - 90 & Word index of Akan?????KV ? 120. *Eva Wilden*, Collection Indologie n? 134; NETamil Series 1.1, 1.2, 1.3; Critical Texts of Ca?kam Literature ? 4.1, 4.2, 4.3, Ecole fran?aise d?Extr?me-Orient / Institut Fran?ais de Pondich?ry, 2018, i-cxlix + 1-787; 1-470 p. Language: Tamil, English. *3000 Rs (130 ?) [set price]. *ISBN: 978-81-8470-219-4 (IFP) / 978 2 85539 2257 (EFEO). The /Akan????u/ is an anthology of four hundred long poems (12-30 lines) on love (/akam) /that belongs to the Eight Collections (/e??uttokai) of the Classical Tamil Ca?kam corpus. /Its//first book, Ka?i??iy??ainirai (?Row of Bull Elephants?), comprising the first one-hundred twenty poems, is here critically re-edited on the basis of the surviving eight manuscripts ? among which five are fairly old palm-leaf copies ? and of the numerous quotations found in the grammatical tradition. A special layout has been developed to allow the synoptic representation of both extant transmission strands. The edition is accompanied by an interlinear English version and by an annotated translation. The introduction (in English and in Tamil) discusses in detail the history of the text and the editing procedure. Volume 3 comprises an edition of the old commentary, a complete analytical concordance, a glossary and several indexes. *About the editor and translator* *Eva Wilden *has been a scientific member (ma?tre de conf?rences) of the EFEO since 2003, working on the critical re-edition and the transmission history of the Tamil Ca?kam corpus. Since 2014, she heads the ERC project ?NETamil: ?Going fr om Hand to Hand ? Networks of Intellectual Exchange in the Tamil Learned Traditions? ?, jointly hosted by the University of Hamburg and the EFEO. In 2015 she received the Indian presidential award ?Kural Peetam?. Since June 2017 she is a professor of Tamil and Manuscript Studies at the University of Hamburg. ---------------- *Institut Fran?ais de Pondich?ry * P. B. 33, 11, St. Louis Street, Pondicherry-605001, INDIA Ph: +91-413-2231660 / 661. Fax: +91 413-2231605 E-mail: _library at ifpindia.org _ Website: http://www.ifpindia.org/bookstore-list *Ecole fran?aise d?Extr?me-Orient * P.O. Box 151,16 & 19, Dumas Street Pondicherry - 605001,INDIA Ph: +91-413-2334539. Fax +91-413-2330886 E-mail: shanti at efeo-pondicherry.org -- -- Ms. Anurupa Naik Head, Library and Publication Division French Institute of Pondicherry (IFP) UMIFRE 21 CNRS-MAEE P.B. 33 11, St. Louis Street Pondicherry-605 001, INDIA Tel: 91-413-2231660 Fax: 91-413-2231605 e-mail: anurupa.n at ifpindia.org website: www.ifpindia.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From andrew.nicholson at stonybrook.edu Fri Apr 13 16:26:37 2018 From: andrew.nicholson at stonybrook.edu (Andrew Nicholson) Date: Fri, 13 Apr 18 12:26:37 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote Message-ID: Dear Patrick, I have enjoyed and referred my students to the "Fake Buddha Quotes" website: https://fakebuddhaquotes.com/ Perhaps it's time for one of us to launch "Fake Bhagavad Gita Quotes" (or "Fake Veda Quotes"? The possibilities are endless, as *avidy? *is seemingly endless). a Andrew J. Nicholson, Ph.D. Associate Professor Asian & Asian American Studies Stony Brook University Stony Brook, NY 11794-5343 USA (631) 632-4030 http://philosophicalrasika.com/ On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 12:00 PM, wrote: > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: patrick mccartney > To: Indology List > Cc: > Bcc: > Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2018 01:05:30 +0000 > Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote > Hello, > > I'm curious about this quote as I am writing about the use of phrases > related to ,,journeys to self,,. In a google search for examples, I came > across this > > "Yoga is the journey of the self , through the self, to the self ~ The > Bhagavad Gita" > > Might anyone know which chapter and verse this translation is? I do not > recognise it. > > Thanks, Patrick > > https://www.downtownyoga.net/single-post/2016/09/26/Yoga- > is-the-journey-of-the-self-through-the-self-to-the-self-The-Bhagavad-Gita > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Fri Apr 13 18:01:10 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Fri, 13 Apr 18 11:01:10 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Sanskrit verse Message-ID: Reading the beautiful Sanskrit poems of Shankar Rajaraman, I am inspired to write a verse of my own: ????? ??????? ?????????? ?? ??? ????????? ? ?????????? ???????? ????????? ????????? ?? "O Dullard, having attained M?dhava [Krishna, Lord], don't keep on running [m? dh?va] after that. Having found the wish-fulfilling tree, what is the purpose in going after the caster-oil shrub? Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From raffaele.torella at uniroma1.it Fri Apr 13 18:25:07 2018 From: raffaele.torella at uniroma1.it (Raffaele Torella) Date: Fri, 13 Apr 18 20:25:07 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I wish to thank all the colleagues who kindly responded to my query (also off-list). Let me add some short remarks: Nagaraj Paturi refers me to the chapter ?Camatk?ra? in Raghavan?s Some Concepts? It was one of the first things I read when I started taking interest in this subject. A bit disappointing, I should say, particularly because the learned author seems to think that four pages are enough for this intriguing concept. David Mellins refers me to Prat?k?ra-Indhur?ja?s commentary on Bh?maha?s K?vy?la?k?rasa?graha for a pre-?nanda occurrence of camatk?ra, quoting De about the date of Prat?k?ra-Indhur?ja. I rather cling to the position of Kane, who after a lenghty discussion arrives at a later date (925-950). And even later, if we identify Prat?k?ra-Indhur?ja with the Indhur?ja who taught the Dhvany?loka to Abhinava. Harry Spier advises me to search the database of Muktabodha, which however hardly contains early texts. Asko Parpola suggests me to read Shulman?s paper. I had read it, but it mainly focuses on later developments (like the Camatk?racandrik?). Of course, he also refers to some passages from Abhinavagupta (following Gnoli?s translations), but perhaps it would have not been out of place to point out that the abrupt entrance of this seminal concept in Indian philosophy occurs not with Abhinava, but with his paramaguru Utpaladeva (the very important passages on camatk?ra in the ?PVV are after all comments on what Utpaladeva wrote in no more extant Viv?ti passages). Indeed worth reading is Heidegger?s essay, suggested by Hartmut Buescher. Many thanks again! Raffaele > Il giorno 12 apr 2018, alle ore 15:38, Hartmut Buescher via INDOLOGY ha scritto: > > Having thanks to the quick availability of David Shulman's "Notes on Camatk?ra" > been able to go through the article, I noticed that, although en passant touching on > the meaning of this term in the philosophical system of Pratyabhij??, he predominantly > concentrates on its originally (thanks to Abhinavagupta) not altogether unrelated > employment in later ala?k?ra contexts. For the sake of scholars with a considerable > interest in comparative philosophy, such as Matthew Kapstein (who requested a pdf > of the article in the present context), it may be remarked that the most important > reference provided in T?ntrik?bhidh?nako?a II: 231 under the lemma camatk?ra is > actually to note 23 of Prof. Torella's The ??varapratyabhij??k?rik? of Utpaladeva > with the Author's V?tti (1994: 118f.). > Unfortunately, Shulman does not display any awareness of Torella's masterful work. > In the context of Utpaladeva's Pratyabhij?? philosophy camatk?ra, as Torella explains, > has a profound significance in connection with realizing/re-cognizing one's Self, > one that "goes beyond that relative and momentary transcendence that one has in > the aesthetic experience of poetry and the theatre" (ibid.). He provides a number > of adumbrative terms, introducing these by saying "[t]he terms with which it is > glossed or with which it is closely related may be grouped according to its principal > components: cognition, bliss, wonder." > > Given Matthew's primary field, let me add that camatk?ra in the Pratyabhij?? context > closely resembles that of ?o mtshar as employed by Klo? chen pa and other > rDzogs chen philosopher in the Tibetan context. > Aware of the largely common geographical origin of modes of thinking that > subsequently was turned into parallel systematic philosophical developments, > this may not be altogether surprising. > > Naturally, this sphere has received hardly any independent attention > by Western philosophers. Yet, there actually is a rather astonishing focus > in one of Heidegger's works. In volume 45 > Grundfragen der Philosophie. Ausgew?hlte "Probleme" der "Logik" > of Martin Heidegger, Gesamtausgabe, (II. Abteilung: Vorlesungen 1925-1944), > those interested in this ontologically attuned aesthetico-phenomenological context > will find a long ? 38 with 15 subsections (pp. 165-181) titled: > "Das Wesen des Er-staunens als der in die Notwendigkeit des anf?nglichen Denkens > n?tigenden Grundstimmung". > > Best wishes, > > Hartmut Buescher > . > > > > On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 6:49 PM, Matthew Kapstein via INDOLOGY > wrote: > Thanks to all who have responded. The wonderful Indologists have so far sent me one copy for each of the three eyes of ?iva! > Camatk?ra indeed! > > Matthew > > Matthew Kapstein > Directeur d'?tudes, > Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes > > Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, > The University of Chicago > > ________________________________________ > From: INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info ] on behalf of Matthew Kapstein via INDOLOGY [indology at list.indology.info ] > Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2018 10:26 AM > To: Harry Spier; Asko Parpola > Cc: > > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra > > Is a PDF of the article available? > > Matthew T. Kapstein > EPHE, Paris > The University of Chicago > > ________________________________ > From: INDOLOGY > on behalf of Asko Parpola via INDOLOGY > > Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2018 7:40:15 AM > To: Harry Spier > Cc: > > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra > > Shulman, David, 2010. Notes on Camatk?ra. Pp. 249-276 in: David Shulman (ed.), Language, ritual and poetics in ancienty India and Iran. Jerusalem: Israel Academy of Sciences and Humanities. > > On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 3:56 AM, Harry Spier via INDOLOGY >> wrote: > Dear Raffaele, > > If you do a search of the Muktabodha digital library e-text collection. http://muktalib5.org/digital_library_secure_entry.htm > and do a search of the e-texts for > (Note the < and > in the search term tell the digital library you are using Kyoto-Harvard transliteration.) you will get a large number of references to camatkAra. Most are later than the date you are asking about but its possible some might be earlier if you are lucky. > > Best wishes, > Harry Spier > > > > On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 2:12 PM, Nagaraj Paturi via INDOLOGY >> wrote: > Studies on Some Concepts of Alankara Shastra by V Raghavan at > > https://archive.org/download/in.ernet.dli.2015.495255/2015.495255.STUDIES-ON.pdf > > has a chapter on Chamatkaara > > On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 10:30 PM, Raffaele Torella via INDOLOGY >> wrote: > Dear colleagues, > > I am looking for early (i.e. pre-?nandavardhana) occurrences of the term camatk?ra. > > Thanks for any help. > Raffaele Torella > > Prof. Raffaele Torella > Chair of Sanskrit > Sapienza University of Rome > www.academia.edu/raffaeletorella > > > > > > > ___________________________________________ > Il tuo 5 diventa 1000 > Fai crescere la tua universit? > Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza > Codice fiscale: 80209930587 > https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-universita-con-il-cinque-mille > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > > indology-owner at list.indology.info > (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > > -- > Nagaraj Paturi > > Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. > > > BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra > > BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala > > Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies > > FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, > > (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > > indology-owner at list.indology.info > (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > > indology-owner at list.indology.info > (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > > -- > Asko Parpola, aparpola at gmail.com > > http://www.helsinki.academia.edu/AskoParpola > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- ___________________________________________ *Il tuo?5?diventa 1000* Fai crescere la tua universit? Dona il?5?per?mille?alla Sapienza Codice fiscale:?*80209930587* https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-universita-con-il-cinque-mille -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jknutson at hawaii.edu Fri Apr 13 18:40:34 2018 From: jknutson at hawaii.edu (Jesse Knutson) Date: Fri, 13 Apr 18 08:40:34 -1000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Sanskrit verse In-Reply-To: Message-ID: ?????????, ????????? ??????? ?????????????????????????????????????? ????? ???????????? ?????? ????????????? ???????????????????????????? ??????,?? On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 8:01 AM, Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Reading the beautiful Sanskrit poems of Shankar Rajaraman, I am inspired > to write a verse of my own: > > ????? ??????? ?????????? ?? ??? ????????? ? > ?????????? ???????? ????????? ????????? ?? > "O Dullard, having attained M?dhava [Krishna, Lord], don't keep on running > [m? dh?va] after that. Having found the wish-fulfilling tree, what is the > purpose in going after the caster-oil shrub? > > Madhav Deshpande > Campbell, California > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- ------------------------------------------------------------------ Jesse Ross Knutson PhD Associate Professor of Sanskrit Language and Literature Department of Indo-Pacific Languages and Literatures University of Hawai'i at M?noa 461 Spalding -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Sat Apr 14 04:01:02 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Fri, 13 Apr 18 21:01:02 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?B?UmU6IFtJTkRPTE9HWV0ge+CkreCkvuCksOCkpOClgOCkr+CkteCkv+CkpuCljeCkteCkpOCljeCkquCksOCkv+Ckt+CkpOCljX0gU2Fuc2tyaXQgdmVyc2U=?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thank you, ?iva Senaniji. Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 8:30 PM, Sivasenani Nori wrote: > Or, having obtained [the poetry of Sri] Madhava [Deshpande], don't keep on > running [for more] after that.... > > Or, it is just a continuation of the old tradition of including the poet's > name either in a bandhakaavya or in plain sight - like the Vaaggeyakaaras. > > Nice triple play (abhanga slesha, followed by sabhanga slesha) on the word > Madhava, Sir. ? > > Regards > N Siva Senani > > Before somebody cites ???? ????, some read the avyaya ?? in the caadigaNa, > it may be noted. > > On Fri 13 Apr, 2018, 11:31 PM Madhav Deshpande, wrote: > >> Reading the beautiful Sanskrit poems of Shankar Rajaraman, I am inspired >> to write a verse of my own: >> >> ????? ??????? ?????????? ?? ??? ????????? ? >> ?????????? ???????? ????????? ????????? ?? >> "O Dullard, having attained M?dhava [Krishna, Lord], don't keep on >> running [m? dh?va] after that. Having found the wish-fulfilling tree, what >> is the purpose in going after the caster-oil shrub? >> >> Madhav Deshpande >> Campbell, California >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "???????????????????" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to bvparishat+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> To post to this group, send email to bvparishat at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "???????????????????" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to bvparishat+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to bvparishat at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Sat Apr 14 04:14:04 2018 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Sat, 14 Apr 18 09:44:04 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Excellent idea! False Quotes itself can be very good web domain name that can accommodate false Einstein quotes, false Freud quotes, false Marx quotes, false Shakespeare quotes, false Mahatma Gandhi quotes etc. That can not probably have quotes from the holy books of religions of books. But such a collection will be a very good source for folklore research, research on informal communication, research on popular spread of knowledge etc. On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 9:56 PM, Andrew Nicholson via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Dear Patrick, > > I have enjoyed and referred my students to the "Fake Buddha Quotes" > website: https://fakebuddhaquotes.com/ > > Perhaps it's time for one of us to launch "Fake Bhagavad Gita Quotes" (or > "Fake Veda Quotes"? The possibilities are endless, as *avidy? *is > seemingly endless). > > a > > Andrew J. Nicholson, Ph.D. > Associate Professor > Asian & Asian American Studies > Stony Brook University > Stony Brook, NY 11794-5343 USA > (631) 632-4030 > http://philosophicalrasika.com/ > > > On Fri, Apr 13, 2018 at 12:00 PM, > wrote: > >> >> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >> From: patrick mccartney >> To: Indology List >> Cc: >> Bcc: >> Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2018 01:05:30 +0000 >> Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote >> Hello, >> >> I'm curious about this quote as I am writing about the use of phrases >> related to ,,journeys to self,,. In a google search for examples, I came >> across this >> >> "Yoga is the journey of the self , through the self, to the self ~ The >> Bhagavad Gita" >> >> Might anyone know which chapter and verse this translation is? I do not >> recognise it. >> >> Thanks, Patrick >> >> https://www.downtownyoga.net/single-post/2016/09/26/Yoga-is- >> the-journey-of-the-self-through-the-self-to-the-self-The-Bhagavad-Gita >> >> > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Sat Apr 14 14:54:55 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sat, 14 Apr 18 07:54:55 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] My Sanskrit verses this morning Message-ID: My Sanskrit verses this morning. This is a conversation between Krishna and Rukmini: ????????? ???? ??????? ???? ???????????? ? ?????: ??????? ?? ???? ??????? ???????? ????? ?? After Krishna often blurted the name of R?dh? at night in dream, the worried Rukmi?? asked him in the morning: "who is she?" ?????????? ??????: ?????? ?????? ?: ? ????????????? ??? ???????? ????????????? ?? Trying to hide the memory of R?dh?, he said: "I said some syllables while dreaming." ???? [?+???] ??? ???????? ???? [?+???] ?????? ????????? ? ?????? ????????????? ??? ?????? ????????? ?? "R is your own name, and Dh means I hold it in my mind. Day and night I repeat the name of Rukmi?? as R?dh?." ??????????? ???? ?????? ???????? ????????? ? ???? ????? ? ??? ???? ????????? ???: ???: ?? Having heard those words, Rukmi?? was pleased and she embraced Krishna, and he said to her the word R?dh? again and again. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From toke.knudsen at hum.ku.dk Sat Apr 14 16:56:35 2018 From: toke.knudsen at hum.ku.dk (Toke Lindegaard Knudsen) Date: Sat, 14 Apr 18 16:56:35 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Siddh=C4=81nta=C5=9Bekhara,_Manomanigrantham=C4=81l=C4=81?= Message-ID: Hi all, I?m looking for an ?gama text entitled Siddh?nta?ekhara (not the jyotis text of that name composed by ?r?pati). In Wayne Edward Surdam?s doctoral dissertation (UC Berkely, 1984), ?South Indian ?aiva Rites Of Initiation: The D?k??vidhi of Aghora?iv?c?rya?s Kriy?kramodyotik??? Available here: https://archive.org/stream/SouthIndianSaivaRitesOfInitiationDikshaVidhiOfAghoraShivacharyasKriyakramadyotik/South%20Indian%20Saiva%20Rites%20of%20Initiation%20Diksha%20Vidhi%20of%20Aghora%20Shivacharyas%20Kriyakramadyotika%20Wayne%20Edward%20Surdam%20%28Thesis%29#page/n5/mode/2up ?I found the following entry in the bibliography of primary sources: Siddh?nta?ekhara, by Vi?van?tha, Manomanigrantham?l? no.20, Bangalore, 1971. This might be the text I?m seeking. However, I can?t flocate the book nor can I find any further information Manomanigrantham?l? book series. Does anyone know about this series? Maybe about this particular publication? Of course, any information on the Siddh?nta?ekhara (the ?gama text) would be greatly appreciated. All best wishes, Toke ----- Toke Lindegaard Knudsen, Ph.D. Associate Professor and Marie Sk?odowska-Curie Fellow Department of Cross-Cultural and Regional Studies University of Copenhagen From raffaele.torella at uniroma1.it Sat Apr 14 20:13:25 2018 From: raffaele.torella at uniroma1.it (Raffaele Torella) Date: Sat, 14 Apr 18 22:13:25 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Sorry for taken up this trend again, but I wish to acknowledge some interesting responses received *after* my last reply: Jesse Kutson suggests (after Pollock) that camatk?ti in Dhv? might be an interpolation. Yes, in principle anything might be an interpolation. Only, apart from the mechanical inclusion into the text of a scribal gloss, a conscious interpolation should have a motivation. In the case at issue, ki? prayojanam? Ashok Aklujkar corrects my Indhu- to Indu (of course, Ashok you are right...) Madhav Deshpande points out that in Marathi, words related to Sanskrit camatk?ra have ?wonder? as their central meaning (along with other interesting shades). In fact, this would have been my second question: why practically in all modern Indic languages the words related to camatk?ra mean ?wonder, surprise, astonishment?, while it is not so with the Trika authors who introduced this word into philosophical-aesthetic terminology. Contrary to the communis opinio, I am convinced that the meaning of camatk?ra in all Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja?s works has nothing (or at least very little) to do with ?wonder?. Warm regards Raffaele > Il giorno 13 apr 2018, alle ore 21:12, Ashok Aklujkar ha scritto: > > Dear Raffaele, > > >David Mellins refers me to Prat?k?ra-Indhur?ja?s commentary on Bh?maha?s K?vy?la?k?rasa?graha for a pre-?nanda occurrence of camatk?ra, quoting De about the date of Prat?k?ra-Indhur?ja. I rather cling to the position of Kane, who after a lenghty discussion arrives at a later date (925-950). And even later, if we identify Prat?k?ra-Indhur?ja with the Indhur?ja who taught the Dhvany?loka to Abhinava.< > > Should the phrasing not be "Prat?h?rendu-r?ja's [note transliteration] commentary on Udbha?a?s K??.? > > a.a. -- ___________________________________________ *Il tuo?5?diventa 1000* Fai crescere la tua universit? Dona il?5?per?mille?alla Sapienza Codice fiscale:?*80209930587* https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-universita-con-il-cinque-mille -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jknutson at hawaii.edu Sat Apr 14 21:17:06 2018 From: jknutson at hawaii.edu (Jesse Knutson) Date: Sat, 14 Apr 18 21:17:06 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Raffaele, Just to clarify, I wasn't advancing a position, but simply drawing your attention to the article (on vyakti) I sent you. Best,J On Sat, Apr 14, 2018, 10:14 AM Raffaele Torella via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Sorry for taken up this trend again, but I wish to acknowledge some > interesting responses received *after* my last reply: > > Jesse Kutson suggests (after Pollock) that camatk?ti in Dhv? might be an > interpolation. Yes, in principle anything might be an interpolation. Only, > apart from the mechanical inclusion into the text of a scribal gloss, a > conscious interpolation should have a motivation. In the case at issue, ki? > prayojanam? > > Ashok Aklujkar corrects my Indhu- to Indu (of course, Ashok you are > right...) > > Madhav Deshpande points out that in Marathi, words related to Sanskrit > camatk?ra have ?wonder? as their central meaning (along with other > interesting shades). In fact, this would have been my second question: why > practically in all modern Indic languages the words related to camatk?ra > mean ?wonder, surprise, astonishment?, while it is not so with the Trika > authors who introduced this word into philosophical-aesthetic terminology. > Contrary to the communis opinio, I am convinced that the meaning of > camatk?ra in all Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja?s works has nothing (or > at least very little) to do with ?wonder?. > > Warm regards > Raffaele > > > Il giorno 13 apr 2018, alle ore 21:12, Ashok Aklujkar < > ashok.aklujkar at gmail.com> ha scritto: > > Dear Raffaele, > > >David Mellins refers me to Prat?k?ra-Indhur?ja?s commentary on Bh?maha?s > K?vy?la?k?rasa?graha for a pre-?nanda occurrence of camatk?ra, quoting De > about the date of Prat?k?ra-Indhur?ja. I rather cling to the position of > Kane, who after a lenghty discussion arrives at a later date (925-950). And > even later, if we identify Prat?k?ra-Indhur?ja with the Indhur?ja who > taught the Dhvany?loka to Abhinava.< > > Should the phrasing not be "Prat?h?rendu-r?ja's [note transliteration] > commentary on Udbha?a?s K??.? > > a.a. > > > > > ___________________________________________ > *Il tuo 5 diventa 1000* > Fai crescere la tua universit? > Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza > Codice fiscale: *80209930587* > > https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-universita-con-il-cinque-mille > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ashok.aklujkar at gmail.com Sat Apr 14 21:32:06 2018 From: ashok.aklujkar at gmail.com (Ashok Aklujkar) Date: Sat, 14 Apr 18 14:32:06 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Raffaele, I mainly wished to correct ?Bh?maha? to "Udbha?a?. The other error, which pertains to transliteration, is even less significant. Best. ashok > On Apr 14, 2018, at 1:13 PM, Raffaele Torella wrote: > > Madhav Deshpande points out that in Marathi, words related to Sanskrit camatk?ra have ?wonder? as their central meaning (along with other interesting shades). In fact, this would have been my second question: why practically in all modern Indic languages the words related to camatk?ra mean ?wonder, surprise, astonishment?, while it is not so with the Trika authors who introduced this word into philosophical-aesthetic terminology. Contrary to the communis opinio, I am convinced that the meaning of camatk?ra in all Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja?s works has nothing (or at least very little) to do with ?wonder?. From mmdesh at umich.edu Sun Apr 15 03:20:46 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sat, 14 Apr 18 20:20:46 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Verse_for_M=C4=81dhava_this_evening?= Message-ID: One more verse for M?dhava this evening: ?????? ????? ??????????????? ???????????? ??????? ? ????????? ?? ?????, ???? ?? ??? ?? ??? ?? Having seen a female deer wandering in the forest, O Mukunda, why are following her. The Deer-Eyed [R?dh?] is right next to you. O M?dhava, stop running [m? dh?va], stop running [m? dh?va]. Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Sun Apr 15 08:46:16 2018 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Sun, 15 Apr 18 14:16:16 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > I am convinced that the meaning of camatk?ra in all Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja?s works has nothing (or at least very little) to do with ?wonder?. ---- Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja view of chamatkaara is rooted in pratyabhijnaa and its application /extension to Rasa as abhivyakti is obviously a sudden re-cognition. The suddenness and lack of its previous awareness (at a 'conscious' level ) leads to a surprise in the experiencing individual. Part of the ecstatic tingling or tingling ecstasy is characterised by this flash and surprise aspect. On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 3:02 AM, Ashok Aklujkar via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Dear Raffaele, > > I mainly wished to correct ?Bh?maha? to "Udbha?a?. The other error, which > pertains to transliteration, is even less significant. > > Best. > > ashok > > > On Apr 14, 2018, at 1:13 PM, Raffaele Torella < > raffaele.torella at uniroma1.it> wrote: > > > > Madhav Deshpande points out that in Marathi, words related to Sanskrit > camatk?ra have ?wonder? as their central meaning (along with other > interesting shades). In fact, this would have been my second question: why > practically in all modern Indic languages the words related to camatk?ra > mean ?wonder, surprise, astonishment?, while it is not so with the Trika > authors who introduced this word into philosophical-aesthetic terminology. > Contrary to the communis opinio, I am convinced that the meaning of > camatk?ra in all Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja?s works has nothing > (or at least very little) to do with ?wonder?. > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Sun Apr 15 15:58:19 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sun, 15 Apr 18 08:58:19 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Verse for Radha Message-ID: Verse for Radha: ???? ??????????? ?????? ?? ??? ???? ???? ????? ? ???? ?? ?????? ????? ???? ????? ????????? ?? O R?dh?, smitten with love, don?t run here and there in the forest. M?dhava is hiding. Find him in your heart. Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From raffaele.torella at uniroma1.it Sun Apr 15 22:19:50 2018 From: raffaele.torella at uniroma1.it (Raffaele Torella) Date: Mon, 16 Apr 18 00:19:50 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <7D9B7734-451D-4735-8A0B-3F8B8C5B0184@uniroma1.it> Dear colleagues, only a final short note (along with my grateful thanks for the interesting suggestions, including those sent to me off-list by Roland Steiner and Christophe Vielle): - I apologize to Ashok and Jesse for partly misrepresenting their comments. - Nagaraj Paturi?s is precisely an apt statement of that communis opinio about the meaning of camatk?ra I don?t agree on. But I am afraid that the Indology list (indeed a wonderful resource!) is not the right place to delve into complex philological investigations? Warmly, Raffaele > Il giorno 15 apr 2018, alle ore 10:46, Nagaraj Paturi ha scritto: > > > I am convinced that the meaning of camatk?ra in all Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja?s works has nothing (or at least very little) to do with ?wonder?. > > ---- Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja view of chamatkaara is rooted in pratyabhijnaa and its application /extension to Rasa as abhivyakti is obviously a sudden re-cognition. The suddenness and lack of its previous awareness (at a 'conscious' level ) leads to a surprise in the experiencing individual. Part of the ecstatic tingling or tingling ecstasy is characterised by this flash and surprise aspect. > > On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 3:02 AM, Ashok Aklujkar via INDOLOGY > wrote: > Dear Raffaele, > > I mainly wished to correct ?Bh?maha? to "Udbha?a?. The other error, which pertains to transliteration, is even less significant. > > Best. > > ashok > > > On Apr 14, 2018, at 1:13 PM, Raffaele Torella > wrote: > > > > Madhav Deshpande points out that in Marathi, words related to Sanskrit camatk?ra have ?wonder? as their central meaning (along with other interesting shades). In fact, this would have been my second question: why practically in all modern Indic languages the words related to camatk?ra mean ?wonder, surprise, astonishment?, while it is not so with the Trika authors who introduced this word into philosophical-aesthetic terminology. Contrary to the communis opinio, I am convinced that the meaning of camatk?ra in all Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja?s works has nothing (or at least very little) to do with ?wonder?. > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > > -- > Nagaraj Paturi > > Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. > > > BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra > > BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala > > Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies > > FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, > > (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) > > > -- ___________________________________________ *Il tuo?5?diventa 1000* Fai crescere la tua universit? Dona il?5?per?mille?alla Sapienza Codice fiscale:?*80209930587* https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-universita-con-il-cinque-mille -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Mon Apr 16 00:00:01 2018 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Sun, 15 Apr 18 18:00:01 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Patrick, In 1937 the editor and scholar Jivaram Kalidas Shastri published an augmented Bhagavadgita (worldcat permalink ). I've got a copy in a box somewhere. I went to Gondal in the early 90s (with Peter Schreiner), and met Jivaram's son, Ghanashyamji, and we discussed his father's work and legacy. The 1937 Bhagavadgita publication was based on a birchbark manuscript of the work that was - if I recall - given to Jivaram by someone in Varanasi. The MS still exists, and is today in the library of the Gujarat Ayurvedic University in Jamnagar, together with all of Jivaram's extensive MS collection. I visited Jamnagar on the same trip, and examined the Bhagavadgita MS that was behind the edition. It was transparently a forgery. That is to say, it was a modern production, physically speaking, and plainly so. The birchbark pages were made of pieces cut very squarely and glued together in a patchwork, and the handwriting was large and student-like. Since Jivaram was an experienced MS collector and editor, I am surprised that he took the object seriously as a new and important manuscript. The publication claims to contain verses that appear in no other transmitted version of the Gita, and therefore to be a better and more true version of the sacred work. I haven't checked, but it is possible that your verse is in that version of the Gita. Best, Dominik ? -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk ?,? Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity ?,? Department of History and Classics ?,? University of Alberta, Canada ?.? South Asia at the U of A: ?sas.ualberta.ca? ?? On 12 April 2018 at 19:05, patrick mccartney via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Hello, > > I'm curious about this quote as I am writing about the use of phrases > related to ,,journeys to self,,. In a google search for examples, I came > across this > > "Yoga is the journey of the self , through the self, to the self ~ The > Bhagavad Gita" > > Might anyone know which chapter and verse this translation is? I do not > recognise it. > > Thanks, Patrick > > https://www.downtownyoga.net/single-post/2016/09/26/Yoga- > is-the-journey-of-the-self-through-the-self-to-the-self-The-Bhagavad-Gita > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From psdmccartney at gmail.com Mon Apr 16 02:01:42 2018 From: psdmccartney at gmail.com (patrick mccartney) Date: Mon, 16 Apr 18 02:01:42 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Dominik, this is a fascinating story and interesting lead. Please let me know if you find that book in a box. Patrick On Mon., 16 Apr. 2018, 9:00 am Dominik Wujastyk, wrote: > Dear Patrick, > > In 1937 the editor and scholar Jivaram Kalidas Shastri published an > augmented Bhagavadgita (worldcat permalink > ). I've got a copy in a box > somewhere. I went to Gondal in the early 90s (with Peter Schreiner), and > met Jivaram's son, Ghanashyamji, and we discussed his father's work and > legacy. The 1937 Bhagavadgita publication was based on a birchbark > manuscript of the work that was - if I recall - given to Jivaram by someone > in Varanasi. The MS still exists, and is today in the library of the > Gujarat Ayurvedic University in Jamnagar, together with all of Jivaram's > extensive MS collection. I visited Jamnagar on the same trip, and examined > the Bhagavadgita MS that was behind the edition. It was transparently a > forgery. That is to say, it was a modern production, physically speaking, > and plainly so. The birchbark pages were made of pieces cut very squarely > and glued together in a patchwork, and the handwriting was large and > student-like. Since Jivaram was an experienced MS collector and editor, I > am surprised that he took the object seriously as a new and important > manuscript. > > The publication claims to contain verses that appear in no other > transmitted version of the Gita, and therefore to be a better and more true > version of the sacred work. I haven't checked, but it is possible that > your verse is in that version of the Gita. > > Best, > Dominik > > > ? > -- > Professor Dominik Wujastyk > ?,? > > Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity > ?,? > > Department of History and Classics > > ?,? > University of Alberta, Canada > ?.? > > South Asia at the U of A: > > ?sas.ualberta.ca? > ?? > > > On 12 April 2018 at 19:05, patrick mccartney via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> I'm curious about this quote as I am writing about the use of phrases >> related to ,,journeys to self,,. In a google search for examples, I came >> across this >> >> "Yoga is the journey of the self , through the self, to the self ~ The >> Bhagavad Gita" >> >> Might anyone know which chapter and verse this translation is? I do not >> recognise it. >> >> Thanks, Patrick >> >> >> https://www.downtownyoga.net/single-post/2016/09/26/Yoga-is-the-journey-of-the-self-through-the-self-to-the-self-The-Bhagavad-Gita >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Mon Apr 16 02:09:06 2018 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Mon, 16 Apr 18 07:39:06 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: <7D9B7734-451D-4735-8A0B-3F8B8C5B0184@uniroma1.it> Message-ID: >In fact, this would have been my second question: why practically in all modern Indic languages the words related to camatk?ra mean ?wonder, surprise, astonishment?, while it is not so with the Trika authors who introduced this word into philosophical-aesthetic terminology. ----- You expressed a question. The answer to that is :the origin of the widely prevalent meaning in practically in all, modern Indic, not all, but north Indian, languages seems to be connected to the *communis opinio * only. Waiting for a chamatkaara of *communis opinio* from your philological investigation. Is it already published? On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 3:49 AM, Raffaele Torella < raffaele.torella at uniroma1.it> wrote: > Dear colleagues, > only a final short note (along with my grateful thanks for the interesting > suggestions, including those sent to me off-list by Roland Steiner and > Christophe Vielle): > > - I apologize to Ashok and Jesse for partly misrepresenting their comments. > > - Nagaraj Paturi?s is precisely an apt statement of that communis opinio > about the meaning of camatk?ra I don?t agree on. But I am afraid that the > Indology list (indeed a wonderful resource!) is not the right place to > delve into complex philological investigations? > > Warmly, > Raffaele > > > > Il giorno 15 apr 2018, alle ore 10:46, Nagaraj Paturi < > nagarajpaturi at gmail.com> ha scritto: > > > I am convinced that the meaning of camatk?ra in all > Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja?s works has nothing (or at least very > little) to do with ?wonder?. > > ---- Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja view of chamatkaara is rooted in > pratyabhijnaa and its application /extension to Rasa as abhivyakti is > obviously a sudden re-cognition. The suddenness and lack of its previous > awareness (at a 'conscious' level ) leads to a surprise in the experiencing > individual. Part of the ecstatic tingling or tingling ecstasy is > characterised by this flash and surprise aspect. > > On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 3:02 AM, Ashok Aklujkar via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > >> Dear Raffaele, >> >> I mainly wished to correct ?Bh?maha? to "Udbha?a?. The other error, which >> pertains to transliteration, is even less significant. >> >> Best. >> >> ashok >> >> > On Apr 14, 2018, at 1:13 PM, Raffaele Torella < >> raffaele.torella at uniroma1.it> wrote: >> > >> > Madhav Deshpande points out that in Marathi, words related to Sanskrit >> camatk?ra have ?wonder? as their central meaning (along with other >> interesting shades). In fact, this would have been my second question: why >> practically in all modern Indic languages the words related to camatk?ra >> mean ?wonder, surprise, astonishment?, while it is not so with the Trika >> authors who introduced this word into philosophical-aesthetic terminology. >> Contrary to the communis opinio, I am convinced that the meaning of >> camatk?ra in all Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja?s works has nothing >> (or at least very little) to do with ?wonder?. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > > -- > Nagaraj Paturi > > Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. > > > BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra > > BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala > > Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies > > FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, > > (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________ > *Il tuo 5 diventa 1000* > Fai crescere la tua universit? > Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza > Codice fiscale: *80209930587* > https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-univer > sita-con-il-cinque-mille > > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Mon Apr 16 02:25:44 2018 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Mon, 16 Apr 18 07:55:44 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote In-Reply-To: Message-ID: There is an old discussion on other recensions of Gita than the popular ones: http://list.indology.info/pipermail/indology_list. indology.info/1998-January/010296.html One fine scholar Prof. Vishal Agarwal said on another list during the discussion on the so called 'original Bhagavadgita' as follows: The critical text of Gita recording all textual variants has already been published within the MBH critical text by BORI, and the same has been published separately. In addition, Vasudeva Sharan Agrawala published a Hindi as well as an English translation of this critical text noting the major textual variants in footnotes. The opinion of Dr Belvalkar was that the extra 14 odd verses in the Kashmirian recension were later editions (something that I disagree with), but he was also firm that the Suddha Dharma Mandala version containing 745 verses in 26 chapters was also fake. He was also of the firm opinion that the Geetamaana shlokas giving the extent of the Geeta were also later insertions because the manuscript authority does not support their authenticity. If one counts the verses using the letter count of anushtup as the basis, and also count the letters of 'shri bhagavan uvaacha' etc., then you come close to 743 (I did that exercise a few years back, but it might not have been 100% accurate, although close to it). Some of the so called Kashmirian verses are also found in the extant portion of Bhaskarabhatta's commentary. In one case, he notes 5 extra verses that occur in the 3rd chapter, but says, "These verses are found only in the Samkhyan commentaries of the Gita, and therefore we will not comment on them." In the Shri Vaishnava tradition, Venkatanatha notes that these same 5 verses were accepted by Narayanarya, following the commentary of Yadava Prakasha. Dr Veda Vyasa too published a 745 verse version of the Gita, which is not much dissimilar from the Gondal version published earlier. Those who have seen the 'unique manuscript' on which the Gondal edition was based state that the orthography is modern Devanagari even though the paper on which is written is old. I have eCopies of the Gondal edition, E Vedavyas edition as well as the Suddha Dharma Mandala editions, but I am not convinced entirely of their claims. On the other hand, there are texts that attribute to the Gita things that are not found therein. For instance, the Brihatkathashlokasamgraha of Buddhaswamin quotes a passage and says that it is from our Bhagavad Gita, but it is not present therein. I have also read that the manuscript library of the Baroda Oriental Institute has an old commentary Lasiki on the Gita, that incorporates within it a preShankara commentary of Vasugupta (~500 AD ?). On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 7:31 AM, patrick mccartney via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Dear Dominik, this is a fascinating story and interesting lead. Please let > me know if you find that book in a box. > > Patrick > > > > On Mon., 16 Apr. 2018, 9:00 am Dominik Wujastyk, > wrote: > >> Dear Patrick, >> >> In 1937 the editor and scholar Jivaram Kalidas Shastri published an >> augmented Bhagavadgita (worldcat permalink >> ). I've got a copy in a box >> somewhere. I went to Gondal in the early 90s (with Peter Schreiner), and >> met Jivaram's son, Ghanashyamji, and we discussed his father's work and >> legacy. The 1937 Bhagavadgita publication was based on a birchbark >> manuscript of the work that was - if I recall - given to Jivaram by someone >> in Varanasi. The MS still exists, and is today in the library of the >> Gujarat Ayurvedic University in Jamnagar, together with all of Jivaram's >> extensive MS collection. I visited Jamnagar on the same trip, and examined >> the Bhagavadgita MS that was behind the edition. It was transparently a >> forgery. That is to say, it was a modern production, physically speaking, >> and plainly so. The birchbark pages were made of pieces cut very squarely >> and glued together in a patchwork, and the handwriting was large and >> student-like. Since Jivaram was an experienced MS collector and editor, I >> am surprised that he took the object seriously as a new and important >> manuscript. >> >> The publication claims to contain verses that appear in no other >> transmitted version of the Gita, and therefore to be a better and more true >> version of the sacred work. I haven't checked, but it is possible that >> your verse is in that version of the Gita. >> >> Best, >> Dominik >> >> >> ? >> -- >> Professor Dominik Wujastyk >> ?,? >> >> Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity >> ?,? >> >> Department of History and Classics >> >> ?,? >> University of Alberta, Canada >> ?.? >> >> South Asia at the U of A: >> >> ?sas.ualberta.ca? >> ?? >> >> >> On 12 April 2018 at 19:05, patrick mccartney via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >> >>> Hello, >>> >>> I'm curious about this quote as I am writing about the use of phrases >>> related to ,,journeys to self,,. In a google search for examples, I came >>> across this >>> >>> "Yoga is the journey of the self , through the self, to the self ~ The >>> Bhagavad Gita" >>> >>> Might anyone know which chapter and verse this translation is? I do not >>> recognise it. >>> >>> Thanks, Patrick >>> >>> https://www.downtownyoga.net/single-post/2016/09/26/Yoga- >>> is-the-journey-of-the-self-through-the-self-to-the-self- >>> The-Bhagavad-Gita >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >> >> > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dnreigle at gmail.com Mon Apr 16 03:09:40 2018 From: dnreigle at gmail.com (David and Nancy Reigle) Date: Sun, 15 Apr 18 21:09:40 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Since this topic has come up, it may be worthwhile to point out that Jivaram Kalidas Shastri published two different versions of the BG. The 1937 edition is based on a manuscript having 21 additional verses over the standard 700. In 1941 he published an edition based on a different manuscript that he had discovered in the interim having 745 verses. I do not know which one of the two Gondal editions, of 1937 or of 1941, is based on the manuscript that Dominik described. Best regards, David Reigle Colorado, U.S.A. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Mon Apr 16 04:41:26 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sun, 15 Apr 18 21:41:26 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_More_verses_on_M=C4=81dhava?= Message-ID: Here are some more verses on M?dhava this evening: ???? ?? ??????????????????????? ????? ??? ? ?????? ??????? ????: ??????? ????? ???????????? ?? O M?dhava, when I become anxious to drink the sweet nectar of the sound of your flute, with my eyes closed, I see your beautiful and generous figure in front of me. ??????????????????????????????????????? ? ?????????????????? ?? ???? ????? ?? ??????? ?? This Mukunda left for Mathur?, with his feet washed with the tears of the residents of Gokula. May he never leave my heart. ???? ?? ???????????????????????????? ? ????? ??? ????? ?????????????? ??? ???? ?? O M?dhava, my mind, compassionate with the heart aches of the milkmaids [of Gokula] due to separation from you, runs around in the world to find you. ???? ?????? ???? ????????? ????????: ????? ? ???????? ???????? ?????? ???????? ?? ?????? ?? O heartless M?dhava, you have conquered everyone with the bonds of your M?y?. Those who are caught in your bond delight, and those who are free want to be bound. ?????????????? ????? ?????? ??? ?????? ?????? ? ??? ???? ???? ???? ??? ?? ?????? ????????? ?? O Krishna, how can run around to find you in the thick jungle of my mind? O compassionate M?dhava, show mercy and quickly enter the mirror of my mind. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rpjain1903 at gmail.com Mon Apr 16 06:15:57 2018 From: rpjain1903 at gmail.com (Rajeev P. Jain) Date: Mon, 16 Apr 18 11:45:57 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] (no subject) Message-ID: What is the current email id of Raffael Torella.Whenever I send a mail it is returnes. Rajeev Jain 10 A Rajniwas Marg Civil Lines 'ANANDA'-villa # 7 Delhi-110054 (INDIA) (011)23983983 From anurupa.n at ifpindia.org Mon Apr 16 09:03:39 2018 From: anurupa.n at ifpindia.org (Anurupa Naik) Date: Mon, 16 Apr 18 14:33:39 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_New_book_jointly_published_by_the_Institut_Fran=C3=A7ais_de_Pondich=C3=A9ry_and_the_Ecole_fran=C3=A7aise_d=E2=80=99Extr=C3=AAme-Orient?= Message-ID: <6f60661f-f21e-6233-b93c-f8961249d21e@ifpindia.org> *JUST RELEASED* *S?ks?m?gama. Volume III. Chapters 54 to 85.* Critical edition*: S. Sambandha?iv?c?rya, B. Dagens, M.-L. Barazer-Billoret and T. Ganesan *with the collaboration of*J.-M. Creism?as*, Collection Indologie n? 114.3, Institut Fran?ais de Pondich?ry / Ecole fran?aise d?Extr?me-Orient, 2018, cxcviii, 348 p. Language: Sanskrit, English. *1200 Rs (52 ?)*. ISBN: 978-81-8470-218-7 (IFP) / 978-2-85539-224-0 (EFEO). This third volume of the /S?ks?m?gama/ critical edition contains descriptions of a variety of rites and ceremonies concerning ?iva and the Goddess and for the welfare of the society. Many of them are in the form of installations of a ?ivali?ga, of the image of the Goddess and of the provisional temple. Others include festivals such as the collecting of pearls from the sea, the chariot festival, the offering of a golden crown to the Li?ga, the installation of the temple kitchen, tank, well and of the monastery. The performance of atonement rites in order to make up for omissions in various rites, the installation of N?ga and that of the altars inside the temple for bali-offering are also treated in detail. This volume has been prepared and published with the financial assistance from Sri Sambamurthy Sivacharyar Foundation, Chennai and Sadyojat Samskrita Prakashan, Cuddalore. *About the Editors*** *S. Sambandha?iv?c?rya *has been working in the French Institute of Pondicherry since 1969 in the project of critically editing the ?aiv?gama-s. Coming from a family of temple priests, well- versed in the domain of temple rituals and with a long experience in reading various ancient scripts, he has made significant contributions to the first critical editions of ?gama-s such as the /Mata?gap?rame?vara/, /S?rdhatri?atik?lottara/, /Rauravottara, Ajita/ and /D?pt?gama/. *Bruno Dagens *(Professor emeritus, Universit? Paris-IIISorbonne nouvelle, member of UMR 7528 and associated researcher at the IFP), has translated /Mayamata /and authored several studies about Indian tradition in South and Southeast Asia. *Marie-Luce Barazer-Billoret *(Senior lecturer, Universit? Paris-III Sorbonne nouvelle, member of UMR 7528 and associated researcher at the IFP), is specialist of Southern ?aivism; she has authored several articles and co-authored the translation of the /Raurav?gama/, the critical edition of the /D?pt?gama /and a book on//?iva. *T. Ganesan *has been working as a Senior Researcher in the French Institute of Pondicherry since 1985. Under his current research project ?A Comprehensive History of ?aivasiddh?nta in Tamilnadu?, he has published a monograph entitled /Two ?aiva Teachers of the sixteenth century. Nigamaj??na I and his disciple Nigamaj??na II. /He also has published a first critical edition of the /Varu?apaddhati/, an ancient ?aiva text, along with the unpublished commentary of Nigamaj??na II. He has authored several articles on ?aivism in general and ?aivasiddh?nta. *Jean-Michel Creism?as *has been awarded Ph.D in 2015 by the Universit? Paris III ? Sorbonne nouvelle for his thesis ?The Yoga of Mata?gap?rame?varatantrain the light of the commentary of Bha??a R?maka??ha?. ---------------- *Institut Fran?ais de Pondich?ry * P. B. 33, 11, St. Louis Street, Pondicherry-605001, INDIA Ph: +91-413-2231660 / 661. Fax: +91 413-2231605 E-mail: _library at ifpindia.org _ Website: http://www.ifpindia.org/bookstore-list *Ecole fran?aise d?Extr?me-Orient * P.O. Box 151,16 & 19, Dumas Street Pondicherry - 605001,INDIA Ph: +91-413-2334539. Fax +91-413-2330886 E-mail: shanti at efeo-pondicherry.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Mon Apr 16 16:57:37 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Mon, 16 Apr 18 09:57:37 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_More_M=C4=81dhava_verses_this_morning?= Message-ID: Here are some verses I composed this morning: ?????? ???? ????? ???????? ????? ???????????? ? ?? ???? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ???????????? ?? O M?dhava, you play the flute softly and playfully enliven the wheels of the world. Don?t make me run around in the world. Let me rest. ??????? ?? ???????: ?????? ????????????? ????? ? ???? ?? ???????? ?????????? ?????????????? Sitting in my heart, O M?dhava, you play and pull strings and bring up my voice. In this wine-house [of your world] I constantly drink your sweet nectar. ???? ?? ??????? ????????? ???? ????? ? ?????? ??? ????? ?????: ????????? ???: ?? O M?dhava, this wine is yours, and, O Lord, this house of wine is also yours. Bearing your name, I have become a drinker, the server and the cup. ??????? ???? ?????????? ?????? ??? ?? ?? ???? ? ???????? ??????? ?????? ???? ? ??????????? ?? O M?dhava, born from you, and standing in you, I rest at your feet. I run to you, even though you are not far from me. ???? ????? ?????? ????? ??????? ??? ???????? ? ???? ???? ?????? ???????????? ????????? ?? O M?dhava, who are you and where are you? How would I recognize you in many forms. On the stage of this world, you act and make all others act. ???? ??????? ???? ????: ???????????? ??????? ? ????? ????? ????? ????????????? ?????????? ?? O M?dhava, you are everywhere, in front and behind, and yet you are hidden. O Honey-Bee, you are playing a game, you run and make others run. Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dharmaprof108 at yahoo.com Mon Apr 16 23:34:14 2018 From: dharmaprof108 at yahoo.com (Jeffery Long) Date: Mon, 16 Apr 18 23:34:14 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Call for Papers: Mid-Atlantic Regional Association for Asian Studies In-Reply-To: <1929274155.1018404.1523921654629.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1929274155.1018404.1523921654629@mail.yahoo.com> Dear Colleagues, ? I would like to call the following to your attention, especially if you are located in the Mid-Atlantic region of the US.? Please direct questions to Dr. Mahua Bhattacharya (bhattacharm at etown.edu). ? Peace in Asia:? Past, Present, and Possible Call for papers Deadline for paper submissions MAY 1, 2018 Elizabethtown College and the Mid-Atlantic Region of the Association of Asian Studies announce the call for papers for the 47th annual regional conference.? The conference theme ?Peace in Asia: Past, Present, and Possible? lends itself to interesting scholarly approaches including energy, environment, public health, territorial issues, migration, popular culture, gender, sexuality, religious practices, and more. We encourage proposals from any discipline. We welcome participation from faculty, students, independent scholars, and professionals, and especially encourage panels with innovative combinations of individuals and fields. Further details and online applications are available at?http://maraas.org/ ? 47th Annual Mid-Atlantic Region Association for Asian Studies Conference November 3-4, 2018 Elizabethtown College, Elizabethtown, PA ? Program Manager: Mahua Bhattacharya, Associate Professor of Japanese and Asian Studies Elizabethtown College bhattacharm at etown.edu All the best, Jeff ? Dr. Jeffery D. Long Professor of Religion and Asian Studies Elizabethtown CollegeElizabethtown, PA https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong Series Editor,?Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, Ethical, and PhilosophicalLexington Books "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials of life." ?(Holy Mother Sarada Devi) "We are a way for the Cosmos to know itself." (Carl Sagan) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 1860-MARAASConference.FINAL31.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 1727401 bytes Desc: not available URL: From anurupa.n at ifpindia.org Tue Apr 17 07:09:54 2018 From: anurupa.n at ifpindia.org (Anurupa Naik) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 18 12:39:54 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_New_book_jointly_published_by_the_Ecole_fran=C3=A7aise_d=E2=80=99Extr=C3=AAme-Orient_and_the_Institut_Fran=C3=A7ais_de_Pondich=C3=A9ry?= Message-ID: *JUST RELEASED* ** **/My Sapphire-hued Lord, my Beloved! /**** **A complete, annotated translation of Kulac?kara ??v?r?s /Perum?? Tirumo?i /and of its medieval Ma?iprav??a commentary by Periyav?cc?? Pi??ai, with an introduction. *Suganya Anandakichenin*, Collection Indologie n? 136; NETamil Series n?2, Ecole fran?aise d?Extr?me-Orient/ Institut Fran?ais de Pondich?ry, 2018, xi, 604 p. Language: English, Tamil. *1500 Rs (65 ?)*. ISBN: 978-81-8470-225-5 (IFP) / 978-2-85539-226-4 (EFEO). *** About the book * This book is a complete annotated translation of a 9^th -century Tamil bhakti poetic work known as the /Perum?? Tirumo?i/, by Kulac?kara ??v?r, as well as of its medieval ?r?vai??ava commentary in Sanskrit-Tamil Ma?iprav??am by Periyav?cc?? Pi??ai (13^th c.). The /Perum?? Tirumo?i /is now part of the Tamil ?r?vai??ava canon called the /N?l?yira tivviya pirapantam /(/N?l?yira Divyaprabandham/, or ?The Four Thousand Divine Compositions?), and is composed of ten decades dedicated to different forms of Vi??u. This book also includes an introduction, which seeks to find out who Kulac?kara ??v?r really was, given his mysterious ? and often disputed ? identity. *About the Translator* Suganya Anandakichenin, a ?professeur agr?g?? in English, did her PhD in Indology at Hamburg University, focusing on Tamil Vai??ava bhakti poetry, especially on Kulac?kara ??v?r?s. Since 2014, she has worked as a research scholar in the Vai??ava group of the NETamil project, based at the EFEO in Pondicherry, specialising further in both Tamil bhakti poetry and medieval ?r?vai??ava Ma?iprav??a writings, especially commentary literature. -------------------------------- *Institut Fran?ais de Pondich?ry * P. B. 33, 11, St. Louis Street, Pondicherry-605001, INDIA Ph: +91-413-2231660 / 661. Fax: +91 413-2231605 E-mail: _library at ifpindia.org _ Website: http://www.ifpindia.org/bookstore-list *Ecole fran?aise d?Extr?me-Orient * P.O. Box 151,16 & 19, Dumas Street Pondicherry - 605001,INDIA Ph: +91-413-2334539. Fax +91-413-2330886 E-mail: shanti at efeo-pondicherry.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From raffaele.torella at uniroma1.it Tue Apr 17 08:40:43 2018 From: raffaele.torella at uniroma1.it (Raffaele Torella) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 18 10:40:43 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <89047DE6-F90B-4F0F-AC9D-4193AA2C79A6@uniroma1.it> > Il giorno 16 apr 2018, alle ore 04:09, Nagaraj Paturi ha scritto: > > >In fact, this would have been my second question: why practically in all modern Indic languages the words related to camatk?ra mean ?wonder, surprise, astonishment?, while it is not so with the Trika authors who introduced this word into philosophical-aesthetic terminology. > > ----- You expressed a question. The answer to that is :the origin of the widely prevalent meaning in practically in all, modern Indic, not all, but north Indian, languages seems to be connected to the communis opinio only. As Christophe Vielle pointed out to me in a personal mail, also the Malayalam word deriving from Sanskrit camatk?ra has this meaning. > > Waiting for a chamatkaara of communis opinio from your philological investigation. > > Is it already published? In fact, it is still to be written? I have taken interest in camatk?ra (and other crucial concepts) in the course of my ongoing research on aesthetic speculation as the basis of Utpala-Abhinava?s philosophical-religious thought (not viceversa). Two articles on this more general topic are forthcoming. Yes, ?philological' investigation, provided that we take ?philology? in its highest meaning of historical-hermeneutic-linguistic discipline dealing with ?texts? (in this regard, you might see my JAOS article of few years ago). Raffaele > > On Mon, Apr 16, 2018 at 3:49 AM, Raffaele Torella > wrote: > Dear colleagues, > only a final short note (along with my grateful thanks for the interesting suggestions, including those sent to me off-list by Roland Steiner and Christophe Vielle): > > - I apologize to Ashok and Jesse for partly misrepresenting their comments. > > - Nagaraj Paturi?s is precisely an apt statement of that communis opinio about the meaning of camatk?ra I don?t agree on. But I am afraid that the Indology list (indeed a wonderful resource!) is not the right place to delve into complex philological investigations? > > Warmly, > Raffaele > > > >> Il giorno 15 apr 2018, alle ore 10:46, Nagaraj Paturi > ha scritto: >> >> > I am convinced that the meaning of camatk?ra in all Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja?s works has nothing (or at least very little) to do with ?wonder?. >> >> ---- Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja view of chamatkaara is rooted in pratyabhijnaa and its application /extension to Rasa as abhivyakti is obviously a sudden re-cognition. The suddenness and lack of its previous awareness (at a 'conscious' level ) leads to a surprise in the experiencing individual. Part of the ecstatic tingling or tingling ecstasy is characterised by this flash and surprise aspect. >> >> On Sun, Apr 15, 2018 at 3:02 AM, Ashok Aklujkar via INDOLOGY > wrote: >> Dear Raffaele, >> >> I mainly wished to correct ?Bh?maha? to "Udbha?a?. The other error, which pertains to transliteration, is even less significant. >> >> Best. >> >> ashok >> >> > On Apr 14, 2018, at 1:13 PM, Raffaele Torella > wrote: >> > >> > Madhav Deshpande points out that in Marathi, words related to Sanskrit camatk?ra have ?wonder? as their central meaning (along with other interesting shades). In fact, this would have been my second question: why practically in all modern Indic languages the words related to camatk?ra mean ?wonder, surprise, astonishment?, while it is not so with the Trika authors who introduced this word into philosophical-aesthetic terminology. Contrary to the communis opinio, I am convinced that the meaning of camatk?ra in all Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja?s works has nothing (or at least very little) to do with ?wonder?. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> >> >> >> -- >> Nagaraj Paturi >> >> Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. >> >> >> BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra >> >> BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala >> >> Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies >> >> FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, >> >> (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) >> >> >> > > > > ___________________________________________ > Il tuo 5 diventa 1000 > Fai crescere la tua universit? > Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza > Codice fiscale: 80209930587 > https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-universita-con-il-cinque-mille > > > > > -- > Nagaraj Paturi > > Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. > > > BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra > > BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala > > Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies > > FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, > > (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) > > > -- ___________________________________________ *Il tuo?5?diventa 1000* Fai crescere la tua universit? Dona il?5?per?mille?alla Sapienza Codice fiscale:?*80209930587* https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-universita-con-il-cinque-mille -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Tue Apr 17 14:31:58 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 18 07:31:58 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Continuing_M=C4=81dhava_verses?= Message-ID: Dear friends, here are more M?dhava verses this morning: ?????????? ?????????? ???????? ?????? ? ???? ?? ???????? ??????? ???????????? ?? Delight of the World, Son of Ya?od?, a Cowherd Child performing his plays, O M?dhava, your sweetness turns this whole world into Gokula. ???????????????? ?????? ?????? ????????? ? ?????? ???????? ???????????????????? ????? ?? O Shining Dark Blue Cloud with new water wandering in the sky of Gokula, assuming the form of M?dhava you produce immense delight, O reliever of suffering. ???? ?? ?????????????? ??????? ??????? ? ????? ?? ???? ????? ???????? ????? ?????? ?? Your shade, destroying the scorching, pleases the world. O Blue Cloud, wander slowly. O Delight of the World, spread in all directions. ???? ?????????? ????? ????????????????? ? ?????? ????? ????????? ?????? ???? ??????? ?? O M?dhava, you crush the pride of Cupid with your own delicate beauty. Again, assuming the form of Cupid you tease stealing hearts. ??? ?????? ? ????????????? ???? ?????? ????????? ? ???????????? ????????????????? ??????: ?? Not satisfied with stealing yoghurt, you steal everyone?s hearts. You, the Great Thief, also stole the clothes of the milkmaids. ???????????????? ??????????? ???? ???????????? ? ????????? ?? ????? ??????? ??????? ??? ????????: ?? O Dweller on the bank of Yamun?, the water of Yamun? became darkened by your touch. O Dark One, your darkness spreads everywhere. What can we do? ??? ??? ?? ???? ???? ???? ????????? ?????? ? ???????????? ?????? ????????? ?? ????? ??????? ?? ?Run, run, O M?dhava. The angry R?dh? left the bower. She waited for you for a long time. Why did you cheat on her?? ????? ????? ??????? ???? ?? ??? ??? ????????? ? ???? ??????? ???????????? ?????? ????? ?? ?Wait, wait, O Dear-Eyed R?dh?, don?t run and don?t leave me. O Compassionate One, My Refuge, please pardon my transgression. I have come to your feet.? ???? ???? ????????? ?? ???? ????? ??? ???? ????? ? ????? ???? ????????? ??????: ??????????? ?? ?Where you are, there I am. I am you. How can I go somewhere else? O R?dh?, know me, M?dhava, to be always near you.? ??????? ??????? ???? ????????????? ????? ????????? ? ???????? ????? ??????? ???? ?????????? ?? O R?dh?, occasionally, for a short time I become distanced by some trees. Please pardon that loss of view of mine. I have not gone anywhere else.? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zysk at hum.ku.dk Tue Apr 17 15:06:32 2018 From: zysk at hum.ku.dk (Kenneth Gregory Zysk) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 18 15:06:32 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Help In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <363679393C2EB44480CDA76B2F23C9F77D7B7C76@P2KITMBX06WC03.unicph.domain> I should appreciate it if someone could send me a pdf of the following: Vijayasi?has?ri?s Bhuvanasundar? vv 1923-1961. Many thanks in advance, Best, Ken Kenneth Zysk, PhD, DPhil Professor and Head of Indology Department of Cross-Cultural and Regional Studies University of Copenhagen 1 Karen Blixens Vej, Bygn. 10, DK-2300 Copenhagen S Denmark Ph: +45 3532 8951; H: +45 41981047 Email: zysk at hum.ku.dk From: INDOLOGY [mailto:indology-bounces at list.indology.info] On Behalf Of Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY Sent: 17. april 2018 16:32 To: Indology; Bharatiya Vidvat parishad; e-shabda-charcha-peeth; Ranjana Date; Antonia Ruppel; Manik; Jayaram Sethuraman Subject: [INDOLOGY] Continuing M?dhava verses Dear friends, here are more M?dhava verses this morning: ?????????? ?????????? ???????? ?????? ? ???? ?? ???????? ??????? ???????????? ?? Delight of the World, Son of Ya?od?, a Cowherd Child performing his plays, O M?dhava, your sweetness turns this whole world into Gokula. ???????????????? ?????? ?????? ????????? ? ?????? ???????? ???????????????????? ????? ?? O Shining Dark Blue Cloud with new water wandering in the sky of Gokula, assuming the form of M?dhava you produce immense delight, O reliever of suffering. ???? ?? ?????????????? ??????? ??????? ? ????? ?? ???? ????? ???????? ????? ?????? ?? Your shade, destroying the scorching, pleases the world. O Blue Cloud, wander slowly. O Delight of the World, spread in all directions. ???? ?????????? ????? ????????????????? ? ?????? ????? ????????? ?????? ???? ??????? ?? O M?dhava, you crush the pride of Cupid with your own delicate beauty. Again, assuming the form of Cupid you tease stealing hearts. ??? ?????? ? ????????????? ???? ?????? ????????? ? ???????????? ????????????????? ??????: ?? Not satisfied with stealing yoghurt, you steal everyone?s hearts. You, the Great Thief, also stole the clothes of the milkmaids. ???????????????? ??????????? ???? ???????????? ? ????????? ?? ????? ??????? ??????? ??? ????????: ?? O Dweller on the bank of Yamun?, the water of Yamun? became darkened by your touch. O Dark One, your darkness spreads everywhere. What can we do? ??? ??? ?? ???? ???? ???? ????????? ?????? ? ???????????? ?????? ????????? ?? ????? ??????? ?? ?Run, run, O M?dhava. The angry R?dh? left the bower. She waited for you for a long time. Why did you cheat on her?? ????? ????? ??????? ???? ?? ??? ??? ????????? ? ???? ??????? ???????????? ?????? ????? ?? ?Wait, wait, O Dear-Eyed R?dh?, don?t run and don?t leave me. O Compassionate One, My Refuge, please pardon my transgression. I have come to your feet.? ???? ???? ????????? ?? ???? ????? ??? ???? ????? ? ????? ???? ????????? ??????: ??????????? ?? ?Where you are, there I am. I am you. How can I go somewhere else? O R?dh?, know me, M?dhava, to be always near you.? ??????? ??????? ???? ????????????? ????? ????????? ? ???????? ????? ??????? ???? ?????????? ?? O R?dh?, occasionally, for a short time I become distanced by some trees. Please pardon that loss of view of mine. I have not gone anywhere else.? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From martingansten at gmail.com Tue Apr 17 18:47:34 2018 From: martingansten at gmail.com (Martin Gansten) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 18 20:47:34 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Locating a Voice of India article Message-ID: I should be grateful for any help in finding an article by Yeshwant K. Pradhan published in /Voice of India /on 4 February, 1924. I haven't been able to find any digital archive for this publication. Martin Gansten -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Tue Apr 17 22:25:23 2018 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 18 16:25:23 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote In-Reply-To: Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Lyne Bansat-Boudon To: David and Nancy Reigle Cc: Indology List Bcc: Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2018 13:21:25 +0000 Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote Dear all, This is indeed an intricate question, which requires further investigation. Regarding the Kashmirian recension, allow me to draw your attention on the ongoing project undertaken by Judit T?rzs?k and myself of editing (with new manuscript material) and translating Abhinavagupta?s Giitaarthasamgraha on the Kashmirian Giitaa. A co-signed paper on the topic has recently been published in the *Journal of Indian Philosophy*: Bansat-Boudon, Lyne et Judit To?rzso?k (2018). ? Abhinavagupta on the Kashmirian Gi?ta?. Announcement of the First Critical Edition of the Gi?ta?rthasam?graha, with the Reconstruction of the Text of the Kashmirian Gi?ta? as Abhinavagupta Probably Read It and a French Translation of Both Texts ?. In : Journal of Indian Philosophy 46.1, p. 31?64. The paper is on line on each author?s Academia page. With best regards, Lyne Bansat-Boudon ? -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk ?,? Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity ?,? Department of History and Classics ?,? University of Alberta, Canada ?.? South Asia at the U of A: ?sas.ualberta.ca? ?? On 15 April 2018 at 21:09, David and Nancy Reigle via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Since this topic has come up, it may be worthwhile to point out that > Jivaram Kalidas Shastri published two different versions of the BG. The > 1937 edition is based on a manuscript having 21 additional verses over the > standard 700. In 1941 he published an edition based on a different > manuscript that he had discovered in the interim having 745 verses. I do > not know which one of the two Gondal editions, of 1937 or of 1941, is based > on the manuscript that Dominik described. > > Best regards, > > David Reigle > Colorado, U.S.A. > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Wed Apr 18 05:03:43 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Tue, 17 Apr 18 22:03:43 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_New_verses_on_M=C4=81dhava_this_evening?= Message-ID: Here are some further verses on M?dhava I composed today: ?????? ?? ???? ?????????? ?????????? ??????? ? ?????????? ???? ?????? ???? ?????? ?? ????? ?????? O Blue Cloud, your beautiful form spreads in all directions. The water of Yamun? has become blue. The sky has become blue. And my mind has become blue. ????????????????? ???????? ???????? ?????? ? ?????????????????????? ??? ????? ????????? ?????? Adorned with jewels of innumerable virtues, soaked in delight, with beautiful attire, O Lord of Mathur?, sprinkle the world with nectar that competes with the joy of Brahman. ?????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ????? ?????????? ? ???? ????? ??????? ?????? ???????????????: ?????? Let us set aside the Brahman which is beyond view, bereft of virtues, without any sweetness and clad in emptiness. O M?dhava, dancing in the world you offer a pot of joy to those who ask for it. ???? ??? ????? ???????????????? ?????? ????? ? ?????????????????????? ??????? ?????? ?????? O M?dhava, this beautiful name of your with sweet sounds flows into my ears, and it satisfies my heart with continuous torrents of sweetness. ?????????? ????? ???? ???? ????????? ????? ???????? ? ?????? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ????? ?????? This world is the Gokula, where you [the naughty boy] go from home to home to break pots. But if you find butter, you fill the pots with honey. ????? ??????????? ????????? ???????? ??? ????? ???? ? ?????? ?????????: ??????????????? ?????????: ?????? O Krishna, my Honey-Bee, you wander among flowers drinking honey, and you offer it to drink to your good-hearted friends. ????? ???? ?????? ???????????? ?? ??????????? ? ????????? ??????? ?????? ???????? ?????? ?????? O M?dhava, my Honey-Bee, you roam among bunches of flowers, and making the minds of good-hearted folks in all direction bloom with the touch of your feet, O Lord of Mathur?. ??????????? ?????? ???? ????????? ??? ?????? ? ????? ??? ????? ???????? ?? ???? ?? ???? ?????? O M?dhava, I welcome you. I have constructed this house of flowers [of good heart]. Please come in and accept my honey. Don?t walk away. Don?t walk away. ???????? ?? ?? ?????????? ?????: ???????? ? ?????? ??? ??????? ????? ?? ???? ?????? ?????? Don?t tell lies. Consuming honey in other homes, you are a cheat. But if you are going to drink honey, then take me along to all those places. ????????? ?????? ????? ????: ??????????????? ? ????? ????? ????? ??????? ??????? ??????? ?????? You play with your cowherd friends in the sweet Spring, and you also play in my heart removing all negativities. ????? ????? ?? ????? ???? ??????? ?????? ?????? ? ?????????????? ?????????: ?????? ???? ?????? When you play in my heart, O M?dhava, I see your plays spreading around me in the world here and there and everywhere. ???? ?????? ???? ??????? ????????? ?????????: ? ???? ??? ?? ????? ?? ???????? ?????? ??????? ?????? O M?dhava, the Spring spreads to all the places you roam about. Do roam always in my heart. Let the summer heat not scorch your friend. Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California ????? ???? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???????? ? ????? ??????? ????? ??????? ??? ?????? ????? ?????? Come and go or run, O M?dhava, wherever you wish. [But] I will bind you in my heart, and shall see how you run away from me. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Wed Apr 18 16:04:13 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Wed, 18 Apr 18 09:04:13 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?B?UmU6IFtJTkRPTE9HWV0ge+CkreCkvuCksOCkpOClgOCkr+CkteCkv+CkpuCljeCkteCkpOCljeCkquCksOCkv+Ckt+CkpOCljX0gTmV3IHZlcnNlcyBvbiBNxIFkaGF2YSB0aGlzIGV2ZW5pbmc=?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Friends, I am thankful to Shri Janardan Hegde for suggesting a correction in the line "?????? ?????????: ??????????????? ?????????: ??????". The line has now been revised to "?????? ????????? ?????? ???? ?????????? ??????". Again I acknowledge my indebtedness to members of this group who have been forthcoming in their appreciation and encouragement, and occasionally correct me when needed. I now have a concluding batch of verses which I will post in a while. With this concluding batch of verses, I now have completed my ?????????????. All this was originally inspired by reading the beautiful poetry of Shri Shankar Rajaraman. Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California On Wed, Apr 18, 2018 at 8:50 AM, Saroja Bhate wrote: > Madhav, live demo of.???????????????? ???????? > > On 18 Apr 2018 18:47, "Madhav Deshpande" wrote: > > Dear Rukmanitai, > > Thank you so much for your appreciation of my poetry. When it > arrives in my mind, it flows out like a stream. Sometimes I get up in the > middle of the night to write down verses in my head before I forget them by > morning. With best regards, > > Madhav > > 2018-04-18 0:04 GMT-07:00 Trichur Rukmani : > >> Madhav I am enjoying the beautiful and aesthetic compositions that you >> generously share on this forum. What is impressive for me is the easy style >> and simple beauty of the similes used. >> Thanks >> om >> rukmani >> >> 2018-04-18 10:33 GMT+05:30 Madhav Deshpande : >> >>> Here are some further verses on M?dhava I composed today: >>> >>> ?????? ?? ???? ?????????? ?????????? ??????? ? >>> >>> ?????????? ???? ?????? ???? ?????? ?? ????? ?????? >>> >>> O Blue Cloud, your beautiful form spreads in all directions. The water >>> of Yamun? has become blue. The sky has become blue. And my mind has >>> become blue. >>> >>> >>> ????????????????? ???????? ???????? ?????? ? >>> >>> ?????????????????????? ??? ????? ????????? ?????? >>> >>> Adorned with jewels of innumerable virtues, soaked in delight, with >>> beautiful attire, O Lord of Mathur?, sprinkle the world with nectar that >>> competes with the joy of Brahman. >>> >>> >>> ?????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ????? ?????????? ? >>> >>> ???? ????? ??????? ?????? ???????????????: ?????? >>> >>> Let us set aside the Brahman which is beyond view, bereft of virtues, >>> without any sweetness and clad in emptiness. O M?dhava, dancing in the >>> world you offer a pot of joy to those who ask for it. >>> >>> >>> ???? ??? ????? ???????????????? ?????? ????? ? >>> >>> ?????????????????????? ??????? ?????? ?????? >>> >>> O M?dhava, this beautiful name of your with sweet sounds flows into my >>> ears, and it satisfies my heart with continuous torrents of sweetness. >>> >>> >>> ?????????? ????? ???? ???? ????????? ????? ???????? ? >>> >>> ?????? ??? ???? ?????? ???? ????? ????? ?????? >>> >>> This world is the Gokula, where you [the naughty boy] go from home to >>> home to break pots. But if you find butter, you fill the pots with >>> honey. >>> >>> >>> ????? ??????????? ????????? ???????? ??? ????? ???? ? >>> >>> ?????? ?????????: ??????????????? ?????????: ?????? >>> >>> O Krishna, my Honey-Bee, you wander among flowers drinking honey, and >>> you offer it to drink to your good-hearted friends. >>> >>> >>> ????? ???? ?????? ???????????? ?? ??????????? ? >>> >>> ????????? ??????? ?????? ???????? ?????? ?????? >>> >>> O M?dhava, my Honey-Bee, you roam among bunches of flowers, and making >>> the minds of good-hearted folks in all direction bloom with the touch of >>> your feet, O Lord of Mathur?. >>> >>> >>> ??????????? ?????? ???? ????????? ??? ?????? ? >>> >>> ????? ??? ????? ???????? ?? ???? ?? ???? ?????? >>> >>> O M?dhava, I welcome you. I have constructed this house of flowers [of >>> good heart]. Please come in and accept my honey. Don?t walk away. Don?t >>> walk away. >>> >>> >>> ???????? ?? ?? ?????????? ?????: ???????? ? >>> >>> ?????? ??? ??????? ????? ?? ???? ?????? ?????? >>> >>> Don?t tell lies. Consuming honey in other homes, you are a cheat. But >>> if you are going to drink honey, then take me along to all those places. >>> >>> >>> ????????? ?????? ????? ????: ??????????????? ? >>> >>> ????? ????? ????? ??????? ??????? ??????? ?????? >>> >>> You play with your cowherd friends in the sweet Spring, and you also >>> play in my heart removing all negativities. >>> >>> >>> ????? ????? ?? ????? ???? ??????? ?????? ?????? ? >>> >>> ?????????????? ?????????: ?????? ???? ?????? >>> >>> When you play in my heart, O M?dhava, I see your plays spreading around >>> me in the world here and there and everywhere. >>> >>> >>> ???? ?????? ???? ??????? ????????? ?????????: ? >>> >>> ???? ??? ?? ????? ?? ???????? ?????? ??????? ?????? >>> >>> O M?dhava, the Spring spreads to all the places you roam about. Do >>> roam always in my heart. Let the summer heat not scorch your friend. >>> >>> >>> Madhav Deshpande >>> >>> Campbell, California >>> >>> >>> ????? ???? ???? ??? ???? ???? ???????? ? >>> >>> ????? ??????? ????? ??????? ??? ?????? ????? ?????? >>> >>> Come and go or run, O M?dhava, wherever you wish. [But] I will bind >>> you in my heart, and shall see how you run away from me. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "???????????????????" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to bvparishat+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >>> To post to this group, send email to bvparishat at googlegroups.com. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "???????????????????" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to bvparishat+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> To post to this group, send email to bvparishat at googlegroups.com. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "???????????????????" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to bvparishat+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to bvparishat at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "???????????????????" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to bvparishat+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to bvparishat at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Wed Apr 18 16:55:24 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Wed, 18 Apr 18 09:55:24 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Concluding Verses Message-ID: Dear Friends, Here now are the concluding verses of my M?dhava-Pa?c??ik?: ???? ???? ?????????? ?????? ????? ???????????? ? ??????????? ??????????? ??????????? ??????????????? ?????? O M?dhava, Great Actor, you created the drama of Mah?bh?rata on the battlefield of Kuruk?etra. You are Vy?sa. You are Arjuna. You are Kr???a, and you are the holder of strings. ???? ?????????? ????? ??? ???????????? ? ??????? ????????????? ????? ???????? ??????????? ?????? O M?dhava, where did your Godhood go on the battlefield of Mah?bh?rata? Why did you not restrain your own people from their destruction? ????? ?????????????????? ????? ??????? ? ?????????? ?: ????, ????? ???? ????? ??????????? ?????? O Lord, I think that you produced this imaginary drama to always teach us the lesson: ?Don?t you ever act like this.? ?????????????? ???? ??????? ????????????????? ? ?????? ???? ?????????? ????? ????????? ?????? Dancing in the forest of Vr?nd?vana, you bring upon a rain of sweetness. M?dhava, you yourself teach the proper duty on the battlefield of Mah?bh?rata. ???? ???? ?????? ?? ???????????????: ? ?????? ???????? ??????? ????????????: ?????? O M?dhava, fill my cup with torrents of your sweet nectar. Having a full drink, I shall offer it all to others. ????????? ?? ????? ???? ???????? ???????????? ?? ? ?? ?? ?????????? ????? ???? ?? ?????????? ?????? I am content with your honey, O M?dhava, and I do not wish for anything else from you. Do always live in my house of wine, and don?t go anywhere else. Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California ?????????? ?? ???? ??????????????????? ? ??????? ?? ?????????? ???????? ??????????: ?????? O M?dhava, bearing your name and taking just a droplet of your honey, I offer it at your feet. Have your compassionate gaze on me. ???????? ??????????? ????????????????? ? ?????????? ??????? ?????????????? ???????? ?????? I, named Madhav, the son of Murlidhar and the grandson of Vasudeo, composed these heartfelt fifty verses for M?dhava for [his] delight. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Wed Apr 18 17:01:34 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Wed, 18 Apr 18 10:01:34 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Concluding_verses_of_my_M=C4=81dhava-Pa=C3=B1c=C4=81=C5=9Bik=C4=81?= Message-ID: Dear Friends, Here now are the concluding verses of my M?dhava-Pa?c??ik?: ???? ???? ?????????? ?????? ????? ???????????? ? ??????????? ??????????? ??????????? ??????????????? ?????? O M?dhava, Great Actor, you created the drama of Mah?bh?rata on the battlefield of Kuruk?etra. You are Vy?sa. You are Arjuna. You are Kr???a, and you are the holder of strings. ???? ?????????? ????? ??? ???????????? ? ??????? ????????????? ????? ???????? ??????????? ?????? O M?dhava, where did your Godhood go on the battlefield of Mah?bh?rata? Why did you not restrain your own people from their destruction? ????? ?????????????????? ????? ??????? ? ?????????? ?: ????, ????? ???? ????? ??????????? ?????? O Lord, I think that you produced this imaginary drama to always teach us the lesson: ?Don?t you ever act like this.? ?????????????? ???? ??????? ????????????????? ? ?????? ???? ?????????? ????? ????????? ?????? Dancing in the forest of Vr?nd?vana, you bring upon a rain of sweetness. M?dhava, you yourself teach the proper duty on the battlefield of Mah?bh?rata. ???? ???? ?????? ?? ???????????????: ? ?????? ???????? ??????? ????????????: ?????? O M?dhava, fill my cup with torrents of your sweet nectar. Having a full drink, I shall offer it all to others. ????????? ?? ????? ???? ???????? ???????????? ?? ? ?? ?? ?????????? ????? ???? ?? ?????????? ?????? I am content with your honey, O M?dhava, and I do not wish for anything else from you. Do always live in my house of wine, and don?t go anywhere else. ?????????? ?? ???? ??????????????????? ? ??????? ?? ?????????? ???????? ??????????: ?????? O M?dhava, bearing your name and taking just a droplet of your honey, I offer it at your feet. Have your compassionate gaze on me. ???????? ??????????? ????????????????? ? ?????????? ??????? ?????????????? ???????? ?????? I, named Madhav, the son of Murlidhar and the grandson of Vasudeo, composed these heartfelt fifty verses for M?dhava for [his] delight. Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Wed Apr 18 17:21:19 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Wed, 18 Apr 18 10:21:19 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?B?UmU6IFtJTkRPTE9HWV0ge+CkreCkvuCksOCkpOClgOCkr+CkteCkv+CkpuCljeCkteCkpOCljeCkquCksOCkv+Ckt+CkpOCljX0gQ29uY2x1ZGluZyB2ZXJzZXMgb2YgbXkgTcSBZGhhdmEtUGHDsWPEgcWbaWvEgQ==?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks to a quick suggestion from Vidyut Aklujkar, here is a verse with minor metrical improvement: ???? ???? ?????? ?? ??????????????????: ? ?????? ???????? ??????? ????????????: ?????? Madhav Deshpande, Campbell, California 2018-04-18 10:01 GMT-07:00 Madhav Deshpande : > Dear Friends, > > Here now are the concluding verses of my M?dhava-Pa?c??ik?: > > ???? ???? ?????????? ?????? ????? ???????????? ? > ??????????? ??????????? ??????????? ??????????????? ?????? > > O M?dhava, Great Actor, you created the drama of Mah?bh?rata on the > battlefield of Kuruk?etra. You are Vy?sa. You are Arjuna. You are Kr???a, > and you are the holder of strings. > > ???? ?????????? ????? ??? ???????????? ? > ??????? ????????????? ????? ???????? ??????????? ?????? > > O M?dhava, where did your Godhood go on the battlefield of Mah?bh?rata? > Why did you not restrain your own people from their destruction? > > ????? ?????????????????? ????? ??????? ? > ?????????? ?: ????, ????? ???? ????? ??????????? ?????? > > O Lord, I think that you produced this imaginary drama to always teach us > the lesson: ?Don?t you ever act like this.? > > ?????????????? ???? ??????? ????????????????? ? > ?????? ???? ?????????? ????? ????????? ?????? > > Dancing in the forest of Vr?nd?vana, you bring upon a rain of sweetness. > M?dhava, you yourself teach the proper duty on the battlefield of > Mah?bh?rata. > > ???? ???? ?????? ?? ???????????????: ? > ?????? ???????? ??????? ????????????: ?????? > > O M?dhava, fill my cup with torrents of your sweet nectar. Having a full > drink, I shall offer it all to others. > > ????????? ?? ????? ???? ???????? ???????????? ?? ? > ?? ?? ?????????? ????? ???? ?? ?????????? ?????? > > I am content with your honey, O M?dhava, and I do not wish for anything > else from you. Do always live in my house of wine, and don?t go anywhere > else. > > ?????????? ?? ???? ??????????????????? ? > ??????? ?? ?????????? ???????? ??????????: ?????? > > O M?dhava, bearing your name and taking just a droplet of your honey, I > offer it at your feet. Have your compassionate gaze on me. > > ???????? ??????????? ????????????????? ? > ?????????? ??????? ?????????????? ???????? ?????? > > I, named Madhav, the son of Murlidhar and the grandson of Vasudeo, > composed these heartfelt fifty verses for M?dhava for [his] delight. > > Madhav Deshpande > Campbell, California > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "???????????????????" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to bvparishat+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to bvparishat at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Wed Apr 18 18:58:06 2018 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Wed, 18 Apr 18 12:58:06 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BhG quote In-Reply-To: Message-ID: 1937 edition: - https://archive.org/details/BhagawadGitaWithSiddhiDatriRajvaidyaJivaramKalidasShastri1937_201802 - https://archive.org/details/BhagawadGitaWithSiddhiDatriRajvaidyaJivaramKalidasShastri1937 - https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.311709 - https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.325552 - https://archive.org/details/in.ernet.dli.2015.405292 ? -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk ?,? Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity ?,? Department of History and Classics ?,? University of Alberta, Canada ?.? South Asia at the U of A: ?sas.ualberta.ca? ?? On 15 April 2018 at 21:09, David and Nancy Reigle via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Since this topic has come up, it may be worthwhile to point out that > Jivaram Kalidas Shastri published two different versions of the BG. The > 1937 edition is based on a manuscript having 21 additional verses over the > standard 700. In 1941 he published an edition based on a different > manuscript that he had discovered in the interim having 745 verses. I do > not know which one of the two Gondal editions, of 1937 or of 1941, is based > on the manuscript that Dominik described. > > Best regards, > > David Reigle > Colorado, U.S.A. > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pankajaindia at gmail.com Wed Apr 18 22:51:51 2018 From: pankajaindia at gmail.com (=?utf-8?B?UGFua2FqIEphaW4g4KSq4KSC4KSV4KScIOCknOCliOCkqA==?=) Date: Wed, 18 Apr 18 17:51:51 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fwd: Report on the Conference on Jainism & Environment at UNT Sat. Apr 14th In-Reply-To: Message-ID: My colleague Prof. George James wanted to share this: "On April 14, the Bhagwan Adinath Professorship in Jain Studies at the University of North Texas held a one day conference on the topic of Jainism and the Environment. The event featured the work of established scholars in the field of Jainism and Ecology as well as Jain Art and Architecture, History and Iconography, as well as the work of younger scholars opening new areas of research in Jain Studies. The event was well attended by students and faculty from UNT and neighboring Universities as well as members of the Jain community in the Dallas/Fort Worth area. It ended with a dinner recognizing local donors to the Bhagwan Adinath Professorship in Jain Studies, featuring a keynote address by the eminent scholar of Jain Studies Christopher Key Chapple". More info about abstracts and bios of the speakers: http://jainstudies.unt.edu/events/conference-jainism-and-env ironment-apr-14-2018 ------------------------------------------------------------ ---------------------- Dr. Pankaj Jain ???? ??? Associate Professor, Dept of Philosophy and Religion Co-chair, India Initiative Group University of North Texas Co-founder, American Academy of Indic Studies Editor, Encyclopedia of Hinduism unt.academia.edu/PankajJain/, @ProfPankajJain Two Books: 1. Dharma & Ecology of Hindu Communities (Routledge, 2011) 2. Science and Socio-Religious Revolution in India (Routledge, 2017) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be Thu Apr 19 09:01:44 2018 From: christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be (Christophe Vielle) Date: Thu, 19 Apr 18 11:01:44 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_New_Book_on_=C5=9A=C4=81likan=C4=81tha's_Prakara=E1=B9=87apa=C3=B1cik=C4=81?= Message-ID: <17CDC13A-FC46-457B-9C0F-027CEE751496@uclouvain.be> Dear List, it is an honor for me to announce the release of the 'new' book (started in the 1980s) by Jean-Marie Verpoorten (1938-), in Pr?bh?kara M?m??s?, being the French translation with thorough commentary of ??likan?tha's Prakara?apa?cik? 'chapter 6, section 1', namely the 1st pariccheda (on the definitions of pram??a and pratyak?a) in the epistemological prakara?a entitled Pram??ap?r?ya?a (a segmented transliteration of the whole Sanskrit text has been added by myself for accompanying the translation). Reference : Jean-Marie Verpoorten, La Prakara?apa?cik? de ??likan?tha, chapitre 6, section 1: le moyen de connaissance valide et la perception. Trait? M?m??saka d??pist?mologie, pr?sent?, traduit et comment?, Louvain-la-Neuve: Universit? catholique de Louvain - Peeters, Publications de l?Institut orientaliste de Louvain 70 (Textes philosophiques sanskrits, t. 1, ed. C. Vielle), 2018, xxii + 215 pp. isbn: 978-90-429-3497-9 (http://www.peeters-leuven.be/boekoverz.asp?nr=10534 ) The cover with an abstract is attached here below. The detailed table of contents is available at: http://www.peeters-leuven.be/toc/9789042934979.pdf Scholars interested by reviewing this book in an Indological periodical are invited to contact me off-list. Best wishes, Christophe Vielle ??????????????????? Christophe Vielle Louvain-la-Neuve Editor, Publications de l'Institut Orientaliste de Louvain series - Last Indological issues: PIOL nos 53 , 60 , 63 , 64 , 65 - Still available: Mah?praj??p?ramit???stra (vols 1 -2 -3 -4 -5 ), Asa?ga's Mah?y?nasa?graha , Vimalak?rtinirde?a , Lamotte's History of Indian Buddhism , etc. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 99685_Verpoorten_PIOL70_00_Cover.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 587165 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From astridzotter at yahoo.de Thu Apr 19 16:57:56 2018 From: astridzotter at yahoo.de (Astrid Zotter) Date: Thu, 19 Apr 18 16:57:56 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] new publication In-Reply-To: <87344074.3617561.1524157076884.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <87344074.3617561.1524157076884@mail.yahoo.com> Cubelic, Simon, AxelMichaels and Astrid Zotter (eds.): Studiesin Historical Documents from Nepal and India, Heidelberg: HeidelbergUniversity Publishing, 2018 (Documenta Nepalica ? Book Series, Vol. 1). Fully open access eBook with print on demand; permanently available here: DOI: 10.17885/heiup.331.454 This volume is the outcome of the conference ?StudyingDocuments in Premodern South Asia and Beyond: Problems and Perspectives?, heldin October 2015 in Heidelberg. In bringing together experts from differentfields?including Indology, Tibetology, History, Anthropology, ReligiousStudies, and Digital Humanties?it aims at exploring and rethinking issues ofdiplomatics and typology, the place of documents in relation to other texts andliterary genres, methods of archiving and editing documents, as well as their?social life?, i.e. the role they play in social, religious and politicalconstellations, the agents and practices of their use, and the norms andinstitutions they embody and constitute. The book is the first volume of the Documenta Nepalica ? Book Series, published by the?Heidelberg Academy of Sciences and Humanities in collaboration with the National Archives, Nepal. Table of Contents: Foreword by Saubhagya Pradhananga, Chief of the NationalArchives of Nepal Editors' Preface Simon Cubelic, Axel Michaels, Astrid Zotter: StudyingDocuments of South Asia: An Introduction Diplomatics Timothy Lubin: Towards a South Asian Diplomatics:Cosmopolitan Norms and Regional Idioms in the Use of Documents Georg Vogeler: Digital Diplomatics: The Evolution of aEuropean Tradition or a Generic Concept? Charles Ramble: Producing ?South Asian? Tibetan Documentsin Highland Nepal, 19th to 20th Centuries: The Evolution of a EuropeanTradition or a Generic Concept? Documentary Practice Yogesh Raj: Waking History Up from the ChronologicalNightmares: A Perspective from the Medieval Newari Historiography Alexander von Rospatt: The Collective Sponsorship of theRenovations of the Svayambh?caitya in the Later Malla Era, and ItsDocumentation in Historical Records Christiane Sibille: Networking Digital Documents Legal Practice Diwakar Acharya: Poet Va??ama?i Pays off His Share in the Father?sDebt: A 17th-Century Debt-Clearance Certificate from Mithil? Rosalind O?Hanlon: Documents of Property Right in EarlyModern Western India Rajan Khatiwoda: Documented Evidence Relating to theImplementation of the Muluk? Ain in Mid-19th Century Nepal Axel Michaels: Are Hindu Women Allowed to Erect a ?ivali?ga?A Question Asked in a Letter to Ja?ga Bah?dura R???, Dated 1863 CE Simon Cubelic: Governing Economic Life in R??? Nepal: TheTender Process for the Gambling License at the Market Square of Asan in 1902 Administration Maheshwar P. Joshi, Madan Mohan Joshi: Some UnpublishedGorkhali Documents and Early British Records: The Example of the Se?? Jo??s Gis?le Krauskopff: The Silent History of the Tharu Farmers:Peasant?s Mobility and Jungle Frontiers in the Light of Written Archives Manik Bajracharya: Muns?s in the Courts of Early ??ha andR??? Rulers: The Career of Lak?m?d?sa Pradh?na State and Religion Monika Horstmann: The M?lik in R?m?nand? Documents of the18th and 19th Centuries Christof Zotter: Ascetics in Administrative Affairs:Documents on the Central Overseers of Jog?s and Sa?ny?s?s in Nepal Astrid Zotter: Conquering Navar?tra: Documents on theReorganisation of a State Festival Notes on Contributors With best wishesAstrid --- Dr. Astrid Zotter Researcher and Project Coordinator Unit "Historical Documents of Pre-modern Nepal" Heidelberg Academy of Sciences and Humanities South Asia Institute Im Neuenheimer Feld 330 69120 Heidelberg +49-6221-544940+49-6221-544940 http://www.haw.uni-heidelberg.de/forschung/forschungsstellen/nepal/index.en.htmlCallSend SMSAdd to SkypeYou'll need Skype CreditFree via Skype -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbagchee at gmail.com Thu Apr 19 18:08:43 2018 From: jbagchee at gmail.com (Joydeep) Date: Thu, 19 Apr 18 20:08:43 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Hartmut, why do you find the focus in *GA* 45 "rather astonishing"? Heidegger mentions *Erstaunen/Staunen* consistently in his career, e.g., in *2* 229; *5* 9; *7* 255f; *11* 14, 22f; *12*183f; *13* 74; *15* 331; *29/30* 531; *35* 265; *45* 155?58, 162?74, 180, 184, 197; *54* 150; *55* 61; *56/57* 67; *65* 15, 20, 46, 483; *66* 209, 236, 271ff; *71* 25, 222; *73* 593; *74*47; *75* 205; *77* 37, 157; *78* 84f; *79* 97; *97* 482f. He also mentions *Verwunderung*, his alternative translation of *thaumazein*, in *2* 229; *9* 121; *19* 126; *21* 76; *26* 14; *33*83; *45* 157f, 162f, 166; *55* 234; *62* 95, 308; *66* 273; *77* 163. Behind them is, of course, his understanding of Greek *thaumzein*, discussed, e.g., in *2* 229; *11* 23; *15*331; *19* 125f; *45* 155ff, 159, 162f; *56/57* 67; *62* 37f; *73* 593; *74* 14; *78* 84. (I give the *GA* numbers in bold.) In my view, a terminological difference between *Erstaunen *and *Verwunderung *cannot be identified before 1937/38, e.g., in *56/57* (?Staunen und Sich-verwundern?; earliest reference, 1919!), *62 *(?Bestaunen und Erstauntsein? and ?sich verwundern?), and *26* (?Staunen, Verwunderung?). Except for *54?55*, *66*, *71*, *77?79*, and *97*, all these volumes precede *45*; *65* is partly earlier and *5?15 *are collections from 1910?73 (the dates of the articles differ; I can check these for you?*9* 121, for instance, is 1929, and yet related to the 1937/38 discussion). Heidegger?s claim that, in its first beginning, Western philosophy emerged from *Staunen/Verwunderung *has, of course, in view the celebrated passage in *Theaetetus *155d, but more germanely, the genealogy of scientific, theoretical comportment that Aristotle traces in *Met.* A2.982b11?24. Given the continued significance of *thaumazein* thereafter (and even before, cp. *thauma idesthai *in Emp. DK 31B35.16?17), I?m not sure the observation, ?Naturally, this sphere has received hardly any independent attention by Western philosophers,? is correct (accepting, of course, your translation of *camatk?ra* by *Erstaunen/thaumazein*). Heidegger?s analysis that the first beginning of philosophy in *Staunen* led via *episteme* and *scientia* to modern *ratio *and his critique of ratiocinative/calculative thinking in technology and the humanities is, of course, taken up in *The Nay Science* (430?32 and see the Prologue for an alternative to a merely technical ?philology?). Both in the text you cite and elsewhere (see, e.g., *9* 312 for Heidegger's discussion of the relationship of philosophy to the sciences), he draws the opposite conclusion from you: because it arose in *thauma*, i.e., wonder at beings, Western philosophy ends up in positivism and technicity, rather than pondering the essence of Being or how "it gives" beings (see *The Nay Science*, ch. 5 and conclusion). Best, Joydeep Dr. Joydeep Bagchee Ludwig-Maximilians-Universit?t M?nchen Academia.edu Homepage The Nay Science Argument and Design Reading the Fifth Veda When the Goddess Was a Woman Transcultural Encounters between Germany and India German Indology on OBO Hinduism ___________________ What, then, is Philosophy? Philosophy is the supremely precious. Plotinus, Enneads I.III.5 On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 3:38 PM, Hartmut Buescher via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Having thanks to the quick availability of David Shulman's "Notes on > Camatk?ra" > > been able to go through the article, I noticed that, although *en passant* > touching on > > the meaning of this term in the philosophical system of Pratyabhij??, he > predominantly > > concentrates on its originally (thanks to Abhinavagupta) not altogether > unrelated > > employment in later *ala?k?ra* contexts. For the sake of scholars with a > considerable > > interest in comparative philosophy, such as Matthew Kapstein (who > requested a pdf > > of the article in the present context), it may be remarked that the most > important > > reference provided in *T?ntrik?bhidh?nako?a* II: 231 under the lemma > *camatk**?ra* is > > actually to note 23 of Prof. Torella's *The **??varapratyabhij* > *??k?rik? of Utpaladeva * > > *with the** Author's V?tti* (1994: 118f.). > > Unfortunately, Shulman does not display any awareness of Torella's > masterful work. > > In the context of Utpaladeva's Pratyabhij?? philosophy *camatk**?ra*, as > Torella explains, > > has a profound significance in connection with realizing/re-cognizing > one's Self, > > one that "goes beyond that relative and momentary transcendence that one > has in > > the aesthetic experience of poetry and the theatre" (*ibid*.). He > provides a number > > of adumbrative terms, introducing these by saying "[t]he terms with which > it is > > glossed or with which it is closely related may be grouped according to > its principal > > components: cognition, bliss, wonder." > > > Given Matthew's primary field, let me add that *camatk**?ra* in the > Pratyabhij?? context > > closely resembles that of *?o mtshar* as employed by Klo? chen pa and > other > > rDzogs chen philosopher in the Tibetan context. > > Aware of the largely common geographical origin of modes of thinking that > > subsequently was turned into parallel systematic philosophical > developments, > > this may not be altogether surprising. > > > Naturally, this sphere has received hardly any independent attention > > by Western philosophers. Yet, there actually is a rather astonishing focus > > in one of Heidegger's works. In volume 45 > > *Grundfragen der Philosophie. Ausgew?hlte "Probleme" der "Logik" * > > of Martin Heidegger, *Gesamtausgabe*, (II. Abteilung: Vorlesungen > 1925-1944), > > those interested in this ontologically attuned aesthetico-phenomenological > context > > will find a long ? 38 with 15 subsections (pp. 165-181) titled: > > "Das Wesen des Er-staunens als der in die Notwendigkeit des anf?nglichen > Denkens > > n?tigenden Grundstimmung". > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Hartmut Buescher > > . > > > > > On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 6:49 PM, Matthew Kapstein via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > >> Thanks to all who have responded. The wonderful Indologists have so far >> sent me one copy for each of the three eyes of ?iva! >> Camatk?ra indeed! >> >> Matthew >> >> Matthew Kapstein >> Directeur d'?tudes, >> Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes >> >> Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, >> The University of Chicago >> >> ________________________________________ >> From: INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info] on behalf of >> Matthew Kapstein via INDOLOGY [indology at list.indology.info] >> Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2018 10:26 AM >> To: Harry Spier; Asko Parpola >> Cc: >> Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra >> >> Is a PDF of the article available? >> >> Matthew T. Kapstein >> EPHE, Paris >> The University of Chicago >> >> ________________________________ >> From: INDOLOGY on behalf of Asko >> Parpola via INDOLOGY >> Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2018 7:40:15 AM >> To: Harry Spier >> Cc: >> Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra >> >> Shulman, David, 2010. Notes on Camatk?ra. Pp. 249-276 in: David Shulman >> (ed.), Language, ritual and poetics in ancienty India and Iran. Jerusalem: >> Israel Academy of Sciences and Humanities. >> >> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 3:56 AM, Harry Spier via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >> Dear Raffaele, >> >> If you do a search of the Muktabodha digital library e-text collection. >> http://muktalib5.org/digital_library_secure_entry.htm >> and do a search of the e-texts for >> (Note the < and > in the search term tell the digital library you are >> using Kyoto-Harvard transliteration.) you will get a large number of >> references to camatkAra. Most are later than the date you are asking about >> but its possible some might be earlier if you are lucky. >> >> Best wishes, >> Harry Spier >> >> >> >> On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 2:12 PM, Nagaraj Paturi via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >> Studies on Some Concepts of Alankara Shastra by V Raghavan at >> >> https://archive.org/download/in.ernet.dli.2015.495255/2015.4 >> 95255.STUDIES-ON.pdf >> >> has a chapter on Chamatkaara >> >> On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 10:30 PM, Raffaele Torella via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >> Dear colleagues, >> >> I am looking for early (i.e. pre-?nandavardhana) occurrences of the term >> camatk?ra. >> >> Thanks for any help. >> Raffaele Torella >> >> Prof. Raffaele Torella >> Chair of Sanskrit >> Sapienza University of Rome >> www.academia.edu/raffaeletorella >> >> >> >> >> >> ___________________________________________ >> Il tuo 5 diventa 1000 >> Fai crescere la tua universit? >> Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza >> Codice fiscale: 80209930587 >> https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-univer >> sita-con-il-cinque-mille >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info> .indology.info> (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> >> >> >> -- >> Nagaraj Paturi >> >> Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. >> >> >> BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra >> >> BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala >> >> Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies >> >> FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, >> >> (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info> .indology.info> (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info> .indology.info> (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> >> >> >> -- >> Asko Parpola, aparpola at gmail.com >> http://www.helsinki.academia.edu/AskoParpola >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From buescherhartmut at gmail.com Thu Apr 19 20:14:44 2018 From: buescherhartmut at gmail.com (Hartmut Buescher) Date: Thu, 19 Apr 18 22:14:44 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Keeping in mind that this is not a Heidegger-list, my point was merely to draw attention to a philosophical attempt by Heidegger to elucidate a particular onto-phenomenological mode of aware-being that resembles *camatk**?ra* as employed "in all Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja?s works" (Torella) with a meaning that differs from the meaning that became the communis opinion. Referring in fact to Torella's adumbration of the connotative aspects of *camatk**?**ra* (in his famous note: 1994: 118f.), I did not translate this term by *Erstaunen*, but indicated that Heidegger, in the noted section, tried to convey what he means by the "Wesen des Er-staunens". However, I resisted to imitate Heidegger's mode of marking a *non-**communis-opinion* employment of a term by writing myself, e.g., "as-tonishing". Hence my "rather astonishing" should somehow indicate that he does not talk of *Erstaunen* in the ordinary sense of *Staunen/Verwunderung*, hence not in a sense that may be traced back to Greek sources. To mix up these at least two different connotations by referring to a bunch of passages in Heidegger's works does little ? beyond usefully hinting at passages that may be studied for that purpose ? to differentiate these. Naturally, I consider it as fairly inappropriate to continue discussing Heidegger on this Indology-list. Best wishes, Hartmut Buescher . On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 8:08 PM, Joydeep wrote: > Dear Hartmut, > > > why do you find the focus in *GA* 45 "rather astonishing"? Heidegger > mentions *Erstaunen/Staunen* consistently in his career, e.g., in *2* > 229; *5* 9; *7* 255f; *11* 14, 22f; *12*183f; *13* 74; *15* 331; *29/30* > 531; *35* 265; *45* 155?58, 162?74, 180, 184, 197; *54* 150; *55* 61; > *56/57* 67; *65* 15, 20, 46, 483; *66* 209, 236, 271ff; *71* 25, 222; *73* > 593; *74*47; *75* 205; *77* 37, 157; *78* 84f; *79* 97; *97* 482f. He > also mentions *Verwunderung*, his alternative translation of *thaumazein*, > in *2* 229; *9* 121; *19* 126; *21* 76; *26* 14; *33*83; *45* 157f, 162f, > 166; *55* 234; *62* 95, 308; *66* 273; *77* 163. Behind them is, of > course, his understanding of Greek *thaumzein*, discussed, e.g., in *2* > 229; *11* 23; *15*331; *19* 125f; *45* 155ff, 159, 162f; *56/57* 67; *62* > 37f; *73* 593; *74* 14; *78* 84. (I give the *GA* numbers in bold.) In > my view, a terminological difference between *Erstaunen *and > *Verwunderung *cannot be identified before 1937/38, e.g., in *56/57* (?Staunen > und Sich-verwundern?; earliest reference, 1919!), *62 *(?Bestaunen und > Erstauntsein? and ?sich verwundern?), and *26* (?Staunen, Verwunderung?). > Except for *54?55*, *66*, *71*, *77?79*, and *97*, all these volumes > precede *45*; *65* is partly earlier and *5?15 *are collections from > 1910?73 (the dates of the articles differ; I can check these for you?*9* 121, > for instance, is 1929, and yet related to the 1937/38 discussion). > Heidegger?s claim that, in its first beginning, Western philosophy emerged > from *Staunen/Verwunderung *has, of course, in view the celebrated > passage in *Theaetetus *155d, but more germanely, the genealogy of > scientific, theoretical comportment that Aristotle traces in *Met.* A2.982b11?24. > Given the continued significance of *thaumazein* thereafter (and even > before, cp. *thauma idesthai *in Emp. DK 31B35.16?17), I?m not sure the > observation, ?Naturally, this sphere has received hardly any independent > attention by Western philosophers,? is correct (accepting, of course, your > translation of *camatk?ra* by *Erstaunen/thaumazein*). Heidegger?s > analysis that the first beginning of philosophy in *Staunen* led via > *episteme* and *scientia* to modern *ratio *and his critique of > ratiocinative/calculative thinking in technology and the humanities is, of > course, taken up in *The Nay Science* (430?32 and see the Prologue for an > alternative to a merely technical ?philology?). Both in the text you cite > and elsewhere (see, e.g., *9* 312 for Heidegger's discussion of the > relationship of philosophy to the sciences), he draws the opposite > conclusion from you: because it arose in *thauma*, i.e., wonder at > beings, Western philosophy ends up in positivism and technicity, rather > than pondering the essence of Being or how "it gives" beings (see *The > Nay Science*, ch. 5 and conclusion). > > > Best, > > Joydeep > > Dr. Joydeep Bagchee > Ludwig-Maximilians-Universit?t M?nchen > Academia.edu Homepage > > The Nay Science > > Argument and Design > > Reading the Fifth Veda > When the Goddess Was a Woman > Transcultural Encounters between Germany and India > > German Indology on OBO Hinduism > > ___________________ > What, then, is Philosophy? > Philosophy is the supremely precious. > > Plotinus, Enneads I.III.5 > > On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 3:38 PM, Hartmut Buescher via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > >> Having thanks to the quick availability of David Shulman's "Notes on >> Camatk?ra" >> >> been able to go through the article, I noticed that, although *en >> passant* touching on >> >> the meaning of this term in the philosophical system of Pratyabhij??, he >> predominantly >> >> concentrates on its originally (thanks to Abhinavagupta) not altogether >> unrelated >> >> employment in later *ala?k?ra* contexts. For the sake of scholars with a >> considerable >> >> interest in comparative philosophy, such as Matthew Kapstein (who >> requested a pdf >> >> of the article in the present context), it may be remarked that the most >> important >> >> reference provided in *T?ntrik?bhidh?nako?a* II: 231 under the lemma >> *camatk**?ra* is >> >> actually to note 23 of Prof. Torella's *The **??varapratyabhij* >> *??k?rik? of Utpaladeva * >> >> *with the** Author's V?tti* (1994: 118f.). >> >> Unfortunately, Shulman does not display any awareness of Torella's >> masterful work. >> >> In the context of Utpaladeva's Pratyabhij?? philosophy *camatk**?ra*, as >> Torella explains, >> >> has a profound significance in connection with realizing/re-cognizing >> one's Self, >> >> one that "goes beyond that relative and momentary transcendence that one >> has in >> >> the aesthetic experience of poetry and the theatre" (*ibid*.). He >> provides a number >> >> of adumbrative terms, introducing these by saying "[t]he terms with which >> it is >> >> glossed or with which it is closely related may be grouped according to >> its principal >> >> components: cognition, bliss, wonder." >> >> >> Given Matthew's primary field, let me add that *camatk**?ra* in the >> Pratyabhij?? context >> >> closely resembles that of *?o mtshar* as employed by Klo? chen pa and >> other >> >> rDzogs chen philosopher in the Tibetan context. >> >> Aware of the largely common geographical origin of modes of thinking that >> >> subsequently was turned into parallel systematic philosophical >> developments, >> >> this may not be altogether surprising. >> >> >> Naturally, this sphere has received hardly any independent attention >> >> by Western philosophers. Yet, there actually is a rather astonishing >> focus >> >> in one of Heidegger's works. In volume 45 >> >> *Grundfragen der Philosophie. Ausgew?hlte "Probleme" der "Logik" * >> >> of Martin Heidegger, *Gesamtausgabe*, (II. Abteilung: Vorlesungen >> 1925-1944), >> >> those interested in this ontologically attuned >> aesthetico-phenomenological context >> >> will find a long ? 38 with 15 subsections (pp. 165-181) titled: >> >> "Das Wesen des Er-staunens als der in die Notwendigkeit des anf?nglichen >> Denkens >> >> n?tigenden Grundstimmung". >> >> >> >> Best wishes, >> >> >> >> Hartmut Buescher >> >> . >> >> >> >> >> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 6:49 PM, Matthew Kapstein via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >> >>> Thanks to all who have responded. The wonderful Indologists have so far >>> sent me one copy for each of the three eyes of ?iva! >>> Camatk?ra indeed! >>> >>> Matthew >>> >>> Matthew Kapstein >>> Directeur d'?tudes, >>> Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes >>> >>> Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, >>> The University of Chicago >>> >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info] on behalf of >>> Matthew Kapstein via INDOLOGY [indology at list.indology.info] >>> Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2018 10:26 AM >>> To: Harry Spier; Asko Parpola >>> Cc: >>> Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra >>> >>> Is a PDF of the article available? >>> >>> Matthew T. Kapstein >>> EPHE, Paris >>> The University of Chicago >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> From: INDOLOGY on behalf of Asko >>> Parpola via INDOLOGY >>> Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2018 7:40:15 AM >>> To: Harry Spier >>> Cc: >>> Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra >>> >>> Shulman, David, 2010. Notes on Camatk?ra. Pp. 249-276 in: David Shulman >>> (ed.), Language, ritual and poetics in ancienty India and Iran. Jerusalem: >>> Israel Academy of Sciences and Humanities. >>> >>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 3:56 AM, Harry Spier via INDOLOGY < >>> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >>> Dear Raffaele, >>> >>> If you do a search of the Muktabodha digital library e-text collection. >>> http://muktalib5.org/digital_library_secure_entry.htm >>> and do a search of the e-texts for >>> (Note the < and > in the search term tell the digital library you are >>> using Kyoto-Harvard transliteration.) you will get a large number of >>> references to camatkAra. Most are later than the date you are asking about >>> but its possible some might be earlier if you are lucky. >>> >>> Best wishes, >>> Harry Spier >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 2:12 PM, Nagaraj Paturi via INDOLOGY < >>> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >>> Studies on Some Concepts of Alankara Shastra by V Raghavan at >>> >>> https://archive.org/download/in.ernet.dli.2015.495255/2015.4 >>> 95255.STUDIES-ON.pdf >>> >>> has a chapter on Chamatkaara >>> >>> On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 10:30 PM, Raffaele Torella via INDOLOGY < >>> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >>> Dear colleagues, >>> >>> I am looking for early (i.e. pre-?nandavardhana) occurrences of the term >>> camatk?ra. >>> >>> Thanks for any help. >>> Raffaele Torella >>> >>> Prof. Raffaele Torella >>> Chair of Sanskrit >>> Sapienza University of Rome >>> www.academia.edu/raffaeletorella>> > >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ___________________________________________ >>> Il tuo 5 diventa 1000 >>> Fai crescere la tua universit? >>> Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza >>> Codice fiscale: 80209930587 >>> https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-univer >>> sita-con-il-cinque-mille >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info>> .indology.info> (messages to the list's managing committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Nagaraj Paturi >>> >>> Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. >>> >>> >>> BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra >>> >>> BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala >>> >>> Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies >>> >>> FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, >>> >>> (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info>> .indology.info> (messages to the list's managing committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info>> .indology.info> (messages to the list's managing committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Asko Parpola, aparpola at gmail.com >>> http://www.helsinki.academia.edu/AskoParpola >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From buescherhartmut at gmail.com Thu Apr 19 20:41:59 2018 From: buescherhartmut at gmail.com (Hartmut Buescher) Date: Thu, 19 Apr 18 22:41:59 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_camatk=C4=81ra?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Correction: sorry for overlooking the "autocorrection" of my writing *communis opinio* to the faulty *communis opinion* and *non-communis-opinio* to *non-* *communis-opinion*. HB On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 10:14 PM, Hartmut Buescher < buescherhartmut at gmail.com> wrote: > Keeping in mind that this is not a Heidegger-list, my point was merely to > draw > > attention to a philosophical attempt by Heidegger to elucidate a > particular > > onto-phenomenological mode of aware-being that resembles *camatk**?ra* as > > employed "in all Utpaladeva-Abhinavagupta-K?emar?ja?s works" (Torella) with > > > a meaning that differs from the meaning that became the communis opinion. > > Referring in fact to Torella's adumbration of the connotative aspects of > *camatk**?**ra* > > (in his famous note: 1994: 118f.), I did not translate this term by > *Erstaunen*, > > but indicated that Heidegger, in the noted section, tried to convey what > he means > > by the "Wesen des Er-staunens". However, I resisted to imitate Heidegger's > mode > > of marking a *non-**communis-opinion* employment of a term by writing > myself, > > e.g., "as-tonishing". Hence my "rather astonishing" should somehow > indicate > > that he does not talk of *Erstaunen* in the ordinary sense of > *Staunen/Verwunderung*, > > hence not in a sense that may be traced back to Greek sources. > > To mix up these at least two different connotations by referring to a > bunch > > of passages in Heidegger's works does little ? beyond usefully hinting at > passages > > that may be studied for that purpose ? to differentiate these. > > > > Naturally, I consider it as fairly inappropriate to continue > > discussing Heidegger on this Indology-list. > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Hartmut Buescher > > . > > > > > > > On Thu, Apr 19, 2018 at 8:08 PM, Joydeep wrote: > >> Dear Hartmut, >> >> >> why do you find the focus in *GA* 45 "rather astonishing"? Heidegger >> mentions *Erstaunen/Staunen* consistently in his career, e.g., in *2* >> 229; *5* 9; *7* 255f; *11* 14, 22f; *12*183f; *13* 74; *15* 331; *29/30* >> 531; *35* 265; *45* 155?58, 162?74, 180, 184, 197; *54* 150; *55* 61; >> *56/57* 67; *65* 15, 20, 46, 483; *66* 209, 236, 271ff; *71* 25, 222; >> *73* 593; *74*47; *75* 205; *77* 37, 157; *78* 84f; *79* 97; *97* 482f. >> He also mentions *Verwunderung*, his alternative translation of >> *thaumazein*, in *2* 229; *9* 121; *19* 126; *21* 76; *26* 14; *33*83; >> *45* 157f, 162f, 166; *55* 234; *62* 95, 308; *66* 273; *77* 163. Behind >> them is, of course, his understanding of Greek *thaumzein*, discussed, >> e.g., in *2* 229; *11* 23; *15*331; *19* 125f; *45* 155ff, 159, 162f; >> *56/57* 67; *62* 37f; *73* 593; *74* 14; *78* 84. (I give the *GA* numbers >> in bold.) In my view, a terminological difference between *Erstaunen * >> and *Verwunderung *cannot be identified before 1937/38, e.g., in *56/57* (?Staunen >> und Sich-verwundern?; earliest reference, 1919!), *62 *(?Bestaunen und >> Erstauntsein? and ?sich verwundern?), and *26* (?Staunen, >> Verwunderung?). Except for *54?55*, *66*, *71*, *77?79*, and *97*, all >> these volumes precede *45*; *65* is partly earlier and *5?15 *are >> collections from 1910?73 (the dates of the articles differ; I can check >> these for you?*9* 121, for instance, is 1929, and yet related to the >> 1937/38 discussion). Heidegger?s claim that, in its first beginning, >> Western philosophy emerged from *Staunen/Verwunderung *has, of course, >> in view the celebrated passage in *Theaetetus *155d, but more germanely, >> the genealogy of scientific, theoretical comportment that Aristotle traces >> in *Met.* A2.982b11?24. Given the continued significance of *thaumazein* thereafter >> (and even before, cp. *thauma idesthai *in Emp. DK 31B35.16?17), I?m not >> sure the observation, ?Naturally, this sphere has received hardly any >> independent attention by Western philosophers,? is correct (accepting, of >> course, your translation of *camatk?ra* by *Erstaunen/thaumazein*). >> Heidegger?s analysis that the first beginning of philosophy in *Staunen* led >> via *episteme* and *scientia* to modern *ratio *and his critique of >> ratiocinative/calculative thinking in technology and the humanities is, of >> course, taken up in *The Nay Science* (430?32 and see the Prologue for >> an alternative to a merely technical ?philology?). Both in the text you >> cite and elsewhere (see, e.g., *9* 312 for Heidegger's discussion of the >> relationship of philosophy to the sciences), he draws the opposite >> conclusion from you: because it arose in *thauma*, i.e., wonder at >> beings, Western philosophy ends up in positivism and technicity, rather >> than pondering the essence of Being or how "it gives" beings (see *The >> Nay Science*, ch. 5 and conclusion). >> >> >> Best, >> >> Joydeep >> >> Dr. Joydeep Bagchee >> Ludwig-Maximilians-Universit?t M?nchen >> Academia.edu Homepage >> >> The Nay Science >> >> Argument and Design >> >> Reading the Fifth Veda >> When the Goddess Was a Woman >> >> Transcultural Encounters between Germany and India >> >> German Indology on OBO Hinduism >> >> ___________________ >> What, then, is Philosophy? >> Philosophy is the supremely precious. >> >> Plotinus, Enneads I.III.5 >> >> On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 3:38 PM, Hartmut Buescher via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >> >>> Having thanks to the quick availability of David Shulman's "Notes on >>> Camatk?ra" >>> >>> been able to go through the article, I noticed that, although *en >>> passant* touching on >>> >>> the meaning of this term in the philosophical system of Pratyabhij??, he >>> predominantly >>> >>> concentrates on its originally (thanks to Abhinavagupta) not altogether >>> unrelated >>> >>> employment in later *ala?k?ra* contexts. For the sake of scholars with >>> a considerable >>> >>> interest in comparative philosophy, such as Matthew Kapstein (who >>> requested a pdf >>> >>> of the article in the present context), it may be remarked that the >>> most important >>> >>> reference provided in *T?ntrik?bhidh?nako?a* II: 231 under the lemma >>> *camatk**?ra* is >>> >>> actually to note 23 of Prof. Torella's *The **??varapratyabhij* >>> *??k?rik? of Utpaladeva * >>> >>> *with the** Author's V?tti* (1994: 118f.). >>> >>> Unfortunately, Shulman does not display any awareness of Torella's >>> masterful work. >>> >>> In the context of Utpaladeva's Pratyabhij?? philosophy *camatk**?ra*, >>> as Torella explains, >>> >>> has a profound significance in connection with realizing/re-cognizing >>> one's Self, >>> >>> one that "goes beyond that relative and momentary transcendence that one >>> has in >>> >>> the aesthetic experience of poetry and the theatre" (*ibid*.). He >>> provides a number >>> >>> of adumbrative terms, introducing these by saying "[t]he terms with >>> which it is >>> >>> glossed or with which it is closely related may be grouped according to >>> its principal >>> >>> components: cognition, bliss, wonder." >>> >>> >>> Given Matthew's primary field, let me add that *camatk**?ra* in the >>> Pratyabhij?? context >>> >>> closely resembles that of *?o mtshar* as employed by Klo? chen pa and >>> other >>> >>> rDzogs chen philosopher in the Tibetan context. >>> >>> Aware of the largely common geographical origin of modes of thinking >>> that >>> >>> subsequently was turned into parallel systematic philosophical >>> developments, >>> >>> this may not be altogether surprising. >>> >>> >>> Naturally, this sphere has received hardly any independent attention >>> >>> by Western philosophers. Yet, there actually is a rather astonishing >>> focus >>> >>> in one of Heidegger's works. In volume 45 >>> >>> *Grundfragen der Philosophie. Ausgew?hlte "Probleme" der "Logik" * >>> >>> of Martin Heidegger, *Gesamtausgabe*, (II. Abteilung: Vorlesungen >>> 1925-1944), >>> >>> those interested in this ontologically attuned >>> aesthetico-phenomenological context >>> >>> will find a long ? 38 with 15 subsections (pp. 165-181) titled: >>> >>> "Das Wesen des Er-staunens als der in die Notwendigkeit des anf?nglichen >>> Denkens >>> >>> n?tigenden Grundstimmung". >>> >>> >>> >>> Best wishes, >>> >>> >>> >>> Hartmut Buescher >>> >>> . >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 6:49 PM, Matthew Kapstein via INDOLOGY < >>> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >>> >>>> Thanks to all who have responded. The wonderful Indologists have so far >>>> sent me one copy for each of the three eyes of ?iva! >>>> Camatk?ra indeed! >>>> >>>> Matthew >>>> >>>> Matthew Kapstein >>>> Directeur d'?tudes, >>>> Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes >>>> >>>> Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, >>>> The University of Chicago >>>> >>>> ________________________________________ >>>> From: INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info] on behalf of >>>> Matthew Kapstein via INDOLOGY [indology at list.indology.info] >>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2018 10:26 AM >>>> To: Harry Spier; Asko Parpola >>>> Cc: >>>> Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra >>>> >>>> Is a PDF of the article available? >>>> >>>> Matthew T. Kapstein >>>> EPHE, Paris >>>> The University of Chicago >>>> >>>> ________________________________ >>>> From: INDOLOGY on behalf of Asko >>>> Parpola via INDOLOGY >>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2018 7:40:15 AM >>>> To: Harry Spier >>>> Cc: >>>> Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] camatk?ra >>>> >>>> Shulman, David, 2010. Notes on Camatk?ra. Pp. 249-276 in: David Shulman >>>> (ed.), Language, ritual and poetics in ancienty India and Iran. Jerusalem: >>>> Israel Academy of Sciences and Humanities. >>>> >>>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 3:56 AM, Harry Spier via INDOLOGY < >>>> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >>>> Dear Raffaele, >>>> >>>> If you do a search of the Muktabodha digital library e-text collection. >>>> http://muktalib5.org/digital_library_secure_entry.htm >>>> and do a search of the e-texts for >>>> (Note the < and > in the search term tell the digital library you are >>>> using Kyoto-Harvard transliteration.) you will get a large number of >>>> references to camatkAra. Most are later than the date you are asking about >>>> but its possible some might be earlier if you are lucky. >>>> >>>> Best wishes, >>>> Harry Spier >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 2:12 PM, Nagaraj Paturi via INDOLOGY < >>>> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >>>> Studies on Some Concepts of Alankara Shastra by V Raghavan at >>>> >>>> https://archive.org/download/in.ernet.dli.2015.495255/2015.4 >>>> 95255.STUDIES-ON.pdf >>>> >>>> has a chapter on Chamatkaara >>>> >>>> On Tue, Apr 10, 2018 at 10:30 PM, Raffaele Torella via INDOLOGY < >>>> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >>>> Dear colleagues, >>>> >>>> I am looking for early (i.e. pre-?nandavardhana) occurrences of the >>>> term camatk?ra. >>>> >>>> Thanks for any help. >>>> Raffaele Torella >>>> >>>> Prof. Raffaele Torella >>>> Chair of Sanskrit >>>> Sapienza University of Rome >>>> www.academia.edu/raffaeletorella>>> faeletorella> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ___________________________________________ >>>> Il tuo 5 diventa 1000 >>>> Fai crescere la tua universit? >>>> Dona il 5 per mille alla Sapienza >>>> Codice fiscale: 80209930587 >>>> https://www.uniroma1.it/it/pagina/fai-crescere-la-tua-univer >>>> sita-con-il-cinque-mille >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info>>> .indology.info> (messages to the list's managing committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>>> or unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Nagaraj Paturi >>>> >>>> Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. >>>> >>>> >>>> BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra >>>> >>>> BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala >>>> >>>> Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies >>>> >>>> FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, >>>> >>>> (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info>>> .indology.info> (messages to the list's managing committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>>> or unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info>>> .indology.info> (messages to the list's managing committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>>> or unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Asko Parpola, aparpola at gmail.com >>>> http://www.helsinki.academia.edu/AskoParpola >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>> committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>>> or unsubscribe) >>>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk Fri Apr 20 16:02:14 2018 From: camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk (Camillo Formigatti) Date: Fri, 20 Apr 18 16:02:14 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] new publication In-Reply-To: <87344074.3617561.1524157076884@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <0C647B6E904DBB4BAD3A28D522DC731523C3EAC8@MBX05.ad.oak.ox.ac.uk> Dear Astrid, Congratulations for the wonderful book! Best wishes, Camillo ________________________________ Dr Camillo A. Formigatti John Clay Sanskrit Librarian Bodleian Libraries The Weston Library Broad Street, Oxford OX1 3BG Email: camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk Tel. (office): 01865 (2)77208 www.bodleian.ox.ac.uk GROW YOUR MIND in Oxford University?s Gardens, Libraries and Museums www.mindgrowing.org From: Astrid Zotter [mailto:astridzotter at yahoo.de] Sent: 19 April 2018 17:58 To: indology at list.indology.info Subject: [INDOLOGY] new publication Cubelic, Simon, Axel Michaels and Astrid Zotter (eds.): Studies in Historical Documents from Nepal and India, Heidelberg: Heidelberg University Publishing, 2018 (Documenta Nepalica ? Book Series, Vol. 1). Fully open access eBook with print on demand; permanently available here: DOI: 10.17885/heiup.331.454 This volume is the outcome of the conference ?Studying Documents in Premodern South Asia and Beyond: Problems and Perspectives?, held in October 2015 in Heidelberg. In bringing together experts from different fields?including Indology, Tibetology, History, Anthropology, Religious Studies, and Digital Humanties?it aims at exploring and rethinking issues of diplomatics and typology, the place of documents in relation to other texts and literary genres, methods of archiving and editing documents, as well as their ?social life?, i.e. the role they play in social, religious and political constellations, the agents and practices of their use, and the norms and institutions they embody and constitute. The book is the first volume of the Documenta Nepalica ? Book Series, published by the Heidelberg Academy of Sciences and Humanities in collaboration with the National Archives, Nepal. Table of Contents: Foreword by Saubhagya Pradhananga, Chief of the National Archives of Nepal Editors' Preface Simon Cubelic, Axel Michaels, Astrid Zotter: Studying Documents of South Asia: An Introduction Diplomatics Timothy Lubin: Towards a South Asian Diplomatics: Cosmopolitan Norms and Regional Idioms in the Use of Documents Georg Vogeler: Digital Diplomatics: The Evolution of a European Tradition or a Generic Concept? Charles Ramble: Producing ?South Asian? Tibetan Documents in Highland Nepal, 19th to 20th Centuries: The Evolution of a European Tradition or a Generic Concept? Documentary Practice Yogesh Raj: Waking History Up from the Chronological Nightmares: A Perspective from the Medieval Newari Historiography Alexander von Rospatt: The Collective Sponsorship of the Renovations of the Svayambh?caitya in the Later Malla Era, and Its Documentation in Historical Records Christiane Sibille: Networking Digital Documents Legal Practice Diwakar Acharya: Poet Va??ama?i Pays off His Share in the Father?s Debt: A 17th-Century Debt-Clearance Certificate from Mithil? Rosalind O?Hanlon: Documents of Property Right in Early Modern Western India Rajan Khatiwoda: Documented Evidence Relating to the Implementation of the Muluk? Ain in Mid-19th Century Nepal Axel Michaels: Are Hindu Women Allowed to Erect a ?ivali?ga? A Question Asked in a Letter to Ja?ga Bah?dura R???, Dated 1863 CE Simon Cubelic: Governing Economic Life in R??? Nepal: The Tender Process for the Gambling License at the Market Square of Asan in 1902 Administration Maheshwar P. Joshi, Madan Mohan Joshi: Some Unpublished Gorkhali Documents and Early British Records: The Example of the Se?? Jo??s Gis?le Krauskopff: The Silent History of the Tharu Farmers: Peasant?s Mobility and Jungle Frontiers in the Light of Written Archives Manik Bajracharya: Muns?s in the Courts of Early ??ha and R??? Rulers: The Career of Lak?m?d?sa Pradh?na State and Religion Monika Horstmann: The M?lik in R?m?nand? Documents of the 18th and 19th Centuries Christof Zotter: Ascetics in Administrative Affairs: Documents on the Central Overseers of Jog?s and Sa?ny?s?s in Nepal Astrid Zotter: Conquering Navar?tra: Documents on the Reorganisation of a State Festival Notes on Contributors With best wishes Astrid --- Dr. Astrid Zotter Researcher and Project Coordinator Unit "Historical Documents of Pre-modern Nepal" Heidelberg Academy of Sciences and Humanities South Asia Institute Im Neuenheimer Feld 330 69120 Heidelberg +49-6221-544940+49-6221-544940 http://www.haw.uni-heidelberg.de/forschung/forschungsstellen/nepal/index.en.html Call Send SMS Add to Skype You'll need Skype CreditFree via Skype -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From huesken at uni-heidelberg.de Mon Apr 23 10:58:34 2018 From: huesken at uni-heidelberg.de (=?utf-8?Q?Ute_H=C3=BCsken?=) Date: Mon, 23 Apr 18 12:58:34 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Fwd:_Stellenausschreibung:_Fremdsprachenlektorin/Fremdsprachenlektor_f=C3=BCr_Urdu_am_S=C3=BCdasien-Institut/_Job_announcement:_Urdu_lecturer_at_SA?= In-Reply-To: <02b401d3daf1$2d259e90$8770dbb0$@uni-heidelberg.de> Message-ID: <5dfa2fe5-8a96-6e74-4a75-7a1c86a2645b@uni-heidelberg.de> Dear list members, please find below the *Job announcement: Urdu lecturer, SAI, Heidelberg University*in German and English**. * * Best wishes Ute Huesken -------- Weitergeleitete Nachricht -------- Betreff: Stellenausschreibung: Fremdsprachenlektorin/Fremdsprachenlektor f?r Urdu am S?dasien-Institut/ Job announcement: Urdu lecturer at SA Datum: Mon, 23 Apr 2018 12:52:30 +0200 Von: Jennifer Landes Antwort an: Jennifer Landes An: SAI-LISTE at LISTSERV.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE *Fremdsprachenlektorin/Fremdsprachenlektor f?r Urdu* In der Abteilung Neusprachliche S?dasienstudien des S?dasien-Instituts der Universit?t Heidelberg ist ab 1. Oktober 2018 die Stelle einer/eines Fremdsprachenlektorin/Fremdsprachenlektors f?r Urdu zun?chst f?r zwei Jahre befristet zu besetzen. Eine sp?tere Entfristung ist m?glich. Das S?dasien-Institut ist das deutschlandweit gr??te Zentrum der interdisziplin?ren S?dasienforschung, das auch ?ber umfangreiche Lehrangebote auf BA- und MA-Niveau verf?gt. Urdu wird neben Bengali, Hindi und Tamil grundst?ndig an der Abteilung f?r Neusprachliche S?dasienstudien (Leitung: Hans Harder) gelehrt. Der Umfang der Lehrverpflichtungen betr?gt 18 Semesterwochenstunden und umfasst Sprachunterricht auf Anf?nger- und Fortgeschrittenenniveau sowie Lekt?ren und Seminare zu Literatur, Film, Kultur und Gesellschaft S?dasiens (besonders Pakistan und Indien). Dar?ber hinaus wird die Bereitschaft erwartet, die seit Jahren in Kooperation mit der Universit?t Erfurt organisierte Urdu Summer School weiter zu f?hren. Bewerberinnen und Bewerber f?r diese Stelle sollten ?ein mit gutem Ergebnis abgeschlossenes Studium in einem m?glichst eng mit den Anforderungen der Stelle verbundenen Fach vorweisen k?nnen; ??ber sehr gute aktive Kenntnisse des Urdu in Wort und Schrift verf?gen; ?Lehrerfahrung an Universit?ten oder in der Erwachsenenbildung sowie p?dagogisch-didaktische Qualifikationen mitbringen; ?origin?res Interesse an wissenschaftlicher Forschung auf dem Gebiet des Urdu bzw. der s?dasiatischen Regionalsprachen haben; ?auf die lebhafte und flexible Sprachvermittlung Wert legen; ??ber sehr solide Deutsch- und Englischkenntnisse verf?gen (Deutsch ist Unterrichtssprache im Anf?ngerunterricht, Englisch bisweilen in h?heren Semestern, auf Tagungen usw.); ?die Motivation mitbringen, produktiv mit den Sprachlektoren des Hauses und der interdisziplin?ren Kollegenschaft am Institut zusammenzuarbeiten; ?die Bereitschaft hegen, Lehrmaterialien zu erarbeiten; ?bereit sein, ihren Wohnsitz nach Heidelberg zu verlegen. Die Verg?tung erfolgt nach TV-L. Bewerbungen mit den ?blichen Unterlagen (Anschreiben, Lebenslauf, ggf. Publikationsverzeichnis, Zeugnisse, Empfehlungsschreiben usw.) sind bis zum *29. Mai 2018*, vorzugsweise in elektronischer Form (m?glichst im PDF-Format), zu richten an den Leiter der Abteilung Neusprachliche S?dasienstudien des S?dasien-Instituts, Herrn Professor Dr. Hans Harder, Im Neuenheimer Feld 330, 69120 Heidelberg. Bitte benutzen Sie (auch f?r R?ckfragen) die Sekretariats-email: *m91 at ix.urz.uni-heidelberg.de * Wir bitten um Verst?ndnis, dass eingegangene Bewerbungsunterlagen nicht zur?ckgesandt werden. Die Universit?t Heidelberg strebt in den Bereichen, in denen Frauen unterrepr?sentiert sind, die Erh?hung des Frauenanteils an und bittet daher qualifizierte Frauen nachdr?cklich um ihre Bewerbung. Schwerbehinderte werden bei gleicher Eignung vorrangig eingestellt. http://adb.zuv.uni-heidelberg.de/info/INFO_FDB$.startup?MODUL=LS&M1=1&M2=0&M3=0&PRO=25330 *Job announcement: Urdu lecturer, SAI, Heidelberg University* The Department of Modern South Asian Languages and Literatures at the South Asia Institute, University of Heidelberg, invites applications for a full time position as an Urdu language lecturer to be filled by October 1, 2018. The initial contract is for two years. After this period and on the basis of a positive evaluation, the position can be converted into a long-term status. The lectureship will be remunerated up to TVL-13 on the salary scale for employees, depending on the applicant?s experience and following the Baden-W?rttemberg emolument. The South Asia Institute is a leading center for interdisciplinary research on South Asia and offers a variety of B.A. and M.A. programs. Urdu is one of the major languages of South Asia and is taught at the Department of Modern South Asian Languages and Literatures (headed by Hans Harder) together with Bengali, Hindi and Tamil. The position?s primary responsibility covers 18 hours of teaching per week and includes beginner and intermediate classes as well as seminars and reading courses on topics such as literature, film, culture, and society in South Asia (particularly in Pakistan and India). Furthermore, the applicant needs to play an active role in the Urdu Summer School that has for years been held in cooperation with Erfurt University. Core requirements are: ?an excellent degree in a subject closely related to the job description; ?outstanding active knowledge of the Urdu language in speaking and writing; ?experience in teaching at a University or any other similar teaching facility, and didactic skills; ?an interest in scientific research in the field of the Urdu language or in the broader field of South Asian languages; ?a creative and flexible approach to teaching; ?a solid knowledge in German and English (beginners? classes? medium of instruction is German, English knowledge is necessary for engaging with international and M.A. students and for active participation at conferences); ?an interest to engage with other lecturers and colleagues at the SAI in interdisciplinary teaching and research projects; ?the readiness to shift the permanent residence to Heidelberg. Applications including the usual material (cover letter, CV, list of publications if available, academic certificates, letters of recommendation, etc.) should be received by *the 29th of May 2016*. They may be submitted in electronic form (if possible in pdf) via e-mail to Prof. Dr. Hans Harder. For submission as well as further information please write to: *m91 at ix.urz.uni-heidelberg.de *. Heidelberg University seeks to increase the proportion of women among its staff in areas in which they are underrepresented and therefore urges qualified women to apply. Disabled applicants shall be appointed with priority if equally qualified. http://adb.zuv.uni-heidelberg.de/info/INFO_FDB$.startup?MODUL=LS&M1=1&M2=0&M3=0&PRO=25330 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kauzeya at gmail.com Wed Apr 25 07:04:57 2018 From: kauzeya at gmail.com (Jonathan Silk) Date: Wed, 25 Apr 18 09:04:57 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Perhaps "no comment" is best? Message-ID: https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2018/04/india-ancient-internet/558725/ -- J. Silk Leiden University Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b 2311 BZ Leiden The Netherlands copies of my publications may be found at https://leidenuniv.academia.edu/JASilk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From toke.knudsen at hum.ku.dk Thu Apr 26 08:05:33 2018 From: toke.knudsen at hum.ku.dk (Toke Lindegaard Knudsen) Date: Thu, 26 Apr 18 08:05:33 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Etymology of mukura / makura Message-ID: <9D070C0D-77B0-43FF-A8DB-E1DC4F4B81F9@hum.ku.dk> Hi all, The two Sanskrit words mukura and makura both mean ?mirror.? I?m trying to understand their etymology. Other meanings given in MW are ?the stick or handle of a potter's wheel? and ?a bud, blossom.? Turner?s _A Comparative Dictionary of the Indo-Aryan Languages_ connects the words to mukula and bakula, meaning ?bud? and ?the tree Mimusops elengi,? respectively. Burrow and Emeneau?s _Dravidian Etymological Dictionary_ (entry 4619), also connects the two words with Mimusops elengi. How did mukura and makura come to mean ?mirror? in Sanskrit? Many thanks in advance. All best wishes, Toke ----- Toke Lindegaard Knudsen, Ph.D. Associate Professor and Marie Sk?odowska-Curie Fellow Department of Cross-Cultural and Regional Studies University of Copenhagen From audrey.truschke at gmail.com Thu Apr 26 13:27:41 2018 From: audrey.truschke at gmail.com (Audrey Truschke) Date: Thu, 26 Apr 18 09:27:41 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, I would like to share this insightful, brave piece written by a PhD student at Columbia University about her experience pursuing a rape charge against Mahmood Farooqui in the Indian judicial system. I think it is relevant for Indologists, especially for sending students to conduct research abroad, dealing with our own instances of sexual misconduct in the field, and thinking about gender and power dynamics. https://scroll.in/article/876788/healing-myself-a-woman- recounts-her-struggles-after-a-court-acquitted-the-man-she-accused-of-rape Audrey Audrey Truschke Assistant Professor Department of History Rutgers University-Newark -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From arlogriffiths at hotmail.com Thu Apr 26 14:54:24 2018 From: arlogriffiths at hotmail.com (Arlo Griffiths) Date: Thu, 26 Apr 18 14:54:24 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_studies_on_Pi=E1=B9=87=E1=B8=8Da_in_Jainism?= Message-ID: Dear colleagues, Would anyone be able to help me access these works in pdf form? 1. R.P. Jain, Pi??asuddhi: Das sechste Kapitel von Va??akeras M?l?c?ra und der ?h?kamma-Abschnitt der Pi??a-nijjutti. New Delhi 1983. 2. Muni U.K. Jain, Jaina Sects and Schools. Delhi 1975. 3. A. Mette, Pi??'esa??. Das Kapitel der Oha-nijjutti ?ber den Bettelgang. Mainz 1973. Particularly, I am searching textual precedent for the expression any?dyapi??a, possibly meaning 'whose alms are [only leftovers of] the food of others', that I find in an inscription of ca. 500 CE that seems to record a donation to Jaina monks. Thank you. Arlo Griffiths -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Fri Apr 27 04:06:18 2018 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 18 09:36:18 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Discussion on Sita being made into a rabid feminist to call him a 'pig' Message-ID: Some of you might be interested in https://swarajyamag.com/culture/the-scholar-whom-audrey-truschke-cites-finds-her-tweet-shocking -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Fri Apr 27 04:09:31 2018 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 18 09:39:31 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Discussion on Sita being made into a rabid feminist to call him a 'pig' In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Title has 'him' , it should be Sri Rama Discussion on Sita being made into a rabid feminist to call Sri Rama a 'pig' On Fri, Apr 27, 2018 at 9:36 AM, Nagaraj Paturi wrote: > Some of you might be interested in > > https://swarajyamag.com/culture/the-scholar-whom- > audrey-truschke-cites-finds-her-tweet-shocking > > -- > Nagaraj Paturi > > Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. > > > BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra > > BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala > > Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies > > FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, > > (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) > > > > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From slaje at kabelmail.de Fri Apr 27 07:32:36 2018 From: slaje at kabelmail.de (Walter Slaje) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 18 09:32:36 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research In-Reply-To: Message-ID: There is also this: https://www.ndtv.com/opinion/mahmood-farooqui-and-his-acquittal-in-rape-case-1803070 And this: https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/mahmood-farooqui-rape-acquittal-extremely-well-decided-says-supreme-court-dismissing-appeal-against-earlier-verdict/articleshow/62566322.cms The Mah?tm? moreover stated: ?I have always held that it is physically impossible to violate a woman against her will. [ . . . ] If she cannot meet the assailant's physical might, her purity will give her the strength to die before he succeeds in violating her. [ . . . ] I know that women are capable of throwing away their lives for a much lesser purpose. Only a few days ago a young girl of twenty burnt herself to death as she felt she was being persecuted for refusing to go in for ordinary studies. And she perished with such cool courage and determination. She ignited her sari with an ordinary oil-light and did not so much as raise a cry, so that the people in the neighbouring room were unaware of the happening until all was over.? *Harijan*, 25-8-1940 and 1-9-1940. (Quoted from M. K. GANDHI, The Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi (Electronic Book). 98 volumes. New Delhi: Publications Division Government of India 1999. [http://www.gandhiserve.org/ cwmg/ cwmg.html] 79, Nr. 130: 126 f). Modern American and traditional Indian notions of rape, honour, consent and ?sexual interaction? (e.g., the exchange of kisses can count as such) seem to differ widely. It is well known that ?secret intercourse with a woman who is asleep, drunk, or mentally deranged? is categorized as a form of ?marriage? in ancient Indian law books. Manu (3.34) uses ?*upa-gam*? ? *inire feminam* (pw) / to approach a woman sexually (MW) ? for the consummation of ?marriage?. *upa-gam* is a common verb for ?having sex? in a general sense. In the given context, recent English translations use however ?to rape? as an equivalent (see Olivelle 2005, p. 110). Interpretations follow suit: ?Tantamount to rape? (Jamison in Olivelle & Davis (ed.), Hindu Law 2017, p. 130). Unless supported by unambiguous evidence, such readings should be treated as notionally anachronistic interpretations reflexively projected onto ancient India. What appears to be ?rape?, or to be ?tantamount to rape?, in the eyes of 21st century Western Indologists, does not necessarily represent the viewpoint of a (pre)modern Indian society. With regard to its connotation, Doniger (1991: 46) and Michaels (2010: 49) offer neutral and therefore more faithful translations of *upa-gam*: ?to have sex with? and ?Beischlaf?. Actually, we are in dire need of a substantial investigation into the history of the notions of ?rape? as they prevailed in premodern India. This will help to understand and assess their (dis)continuation also in the thinking of today. Best, WS ----------------------------- Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 D-99425 Weimar Deutschland 2018-04-26 15:27 GMT+02:00 Audrey Truschke via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info>: > Dear Colleagues, > > I would like to share this insightful, brave piece written by a PhD > student at Columbia University about her experience pursuing a rape charge > against Mahmood Farooqui in the Indian judicial system. I think it is > relevant for Indologists, especially for sending students to conduct > research abroad, dealing with our own instances of sexual misconduct in the > field, and thinking about gender and power dynamics. > > https://scroll.in/article/876788/healing-myself-a-woman-reco > unts-her-struggles-after-a-court-acquitted-the-man-she-accused-of-rape > > Audrey > > Audrey Truschke > Assistant Professor > Department of History > Rutgers University-Newark > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Fri Apr 27 13:51:54 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 18 06:51:54 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] My Sanskrit verse today Message-ID: My Sanskrit verse today: ???????????????? ????????? ?????????? ??? ???????: ??????????????????? ????????????? ?????? ? ?????????????????????????? ????????? ?????? ????? ??????????? ??????? ???????? ??????? ?? Playing on the banks of K?lind?, the drops of sweat on his forehead produced by his exertion shine like pearls. The world itself shines by the scattering light of his infinite virtues. May this love of Gokula constantly shine in my mind. Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Fri Apr 27 14:49:37 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 18 07:49:37 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] My Sanskrit verse today In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I am told by a few friends that they see in the second line of my verse the word "mukt?duyati?". The Devanagari on my MacBook clearly reads "mukt?dyuti?." So there is some issue in how Devanagari Unicode typed on a MacBook gets displayed elsewhere. I don't have a way of solving this dilemma. I would appreciate if anyone has suggestions. Best, Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California 2018-04-27 6:51 GMT-07:00 Madhav Deshpande : > My Sanskrit verse today: > > ???????????????? ????????? ?????????? ??? > ???????: ??????????????????? ????????????? ?????? ? > ?????????????????????????? ????????? ?????? > ????? ??????????? ??????? ???????? ??????? ?? > > Playing on the banks of K?lind?, the drops of sweat on his forehead > produced by his exertion shine like pearls. The world itself shines by the > scattering light of his infinite virtues. May this love of Gokula > constantly shine in my mind. > > Madhav Deshpande > Campbell, California > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk Fri Apr 27 16:49:44 2018 From: camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk (Camillo Formigatti) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 18 16:49:44 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0C647B6E904DBB4BAD3A28D522DC731523C410EC@MBX05.ad.oak.ox.ac.uk> Dear colleagues, If I may put my two cents in, although I am personally very interested in politics and latest news, I thought that this is a scholarly forum, not political or of social critique, so I do not see the point in discussing this terrible event here. I do understand that issues of power and gender influence the entirety of our lives, we experience them every day at home, at work, basically everywhere. I have my own personal opinion about gender inequality as well as many other political and social topics (including the case discussed in this thread), as I?m sure all of us have. Please forgive me if I sound a bit na?ve or maybe not engaged enough. I am well aware that academia too is political, yet I really think that this is not the right forum to discuss this kind of topic. Best wishes, Camillo ________________________________ Dr Camillo A. Formigatti John Clay Sanskrit Librarian Bodleian Libraries The Weston Library Broad Street, Oxford OX1 3BG Email: camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk Tel. (office): 01865 (2)77208 www.bodleian.ox.ac.uk GROW YOUR MIND in Oxford University?s Gardens, Libraries and Museums www.mindgrowing.org From: Walter Slaje [mailto:slaje at kabelmail.de] Sent: 27 April 2018 08:33 To: indology at list.indology.info Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research There is also this: https://www.ndtv.com/opinion/mahmood-farooqui-and-his-acquittal-in-rape-case-1803070 And this: https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/mahmood-farooqui-rape-acquittal-extremely-well-decided-says-supreme-court-dismissing-appeal-against-earlier-verdict/articleshow/62566322.cms The Mah?tm? moreover stated: ?I have always held that it is physically impossible to violate a woman against her will. [ . . . ] If she cannot meet the assailant's physical might, her purity will give her the strength to die before he succeeds in violating her. [ . . . ] I know that women are capable of throwing away their lives for a much lesser purpose. Only a few days ago a young girl of twenty burnt herself to death as she felt she was being persecuted for refusing to go in for ordinary studies. And she perished with such cool courage and determination. She ignited her sari with an ordinary oil-light and did not so much as raise a cry, so that the people in the neighbouring room were unaware of the happening until all was over.? Harijan, 25-8-1940 and 1-9-1940. (Quoted from M. K. GANDHI, The Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi (Electronic Book). 98 volumes. New Delhi: Publications Division Government of India 1999. [http://www.gandhiserve.org/ cwmg/ cwmg.html] 79, Nr. 130: 126 f). Modern American and traditional Indian notions of rape, honour, consent and ?sexual interaction? (e.g., the exchange of kisses can count as such) seem to differ widely. It is well known that ?secret intercourse with a woman who is asleep, drunk, or mentally deranged? is categorized as a form of ?marriage? in ancient Indian law books. Manu (3.34) uses ?upa-gam? ? inire feminam (pw) / to approach a woman sexually (MW) ? for the consummation of ?marriage?. upa-gam is a common verb for ?having sex? in a general sense. In the given context, recent English translations use however ?to rape? as an equivalent (see Olivelle 2005, p. 110). Interpretations follow suit: ?Tantamount to rape? (Jamison in Olivelle & Davis (ed.), Hindu Law 2017, p. 130). Unless supported by unambiguous evidence, such readings should be treated as notionally anachronistic interpretations reflexively projected onto ancient India. What appears to be ?rape?, or to be ?tantamount to rape?, in the eyes of 21st century Western Indologists, does not necessarily represent the viewpoint of a (pre)modern Indian society. With regard to its connotation, Doniger (1991: 46) and Michaels (2010: 49) offer neutral and therefore more faithful translations of upa-gam: ?to have sex with? and ?Beischlaf?. Actually, we are in dire need of a substantial investigation into the history of the notions of ?rape? as they prevailed in premodern India. This will help to understand and assess their (dis)continuation also in the thinking of today. Best, WS ----------------------------- Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 D-99425 Weimar Deutschland 2018-04-26 15:27 GMT+02:00 Audrey Truschke via INDOLOGY >: Dear Colleagues, I would like to share this insightful, brave piece written by a PhD student at Columbia University about her experience pursuing a rape charge against Mahmood Farooqui in the Indian judicial system. I think it is relevant for Indologists, especially for sending students to conduct research abroad, dealing with our own instances of sexual misconduct in the field, and thinking about gender and power dynamics. https://scroll.in/article/876788/healing-myself-a-woman-recounts-her-struggles-after-a-court-acquitted-the-man-she-accused-of-rape Audrey Audrey Truschke Assistant Professor Department of History Rutgers University-Newark _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk Fri Apr 27 17:12:04 2018 From: camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk (Camillo Formigatti) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 18 17:12:04 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Discussion on Sita being made into a rabid feminist to call him a 'pig' Message-ID: <0C647B6E904DBB4BAD3A28D522DC731523C41116@MBX05.ad.oak.ox.ac.uk> There is also this (apologies for stealing this line from a reply to another thread about rape in India): https://thewire.in/religion/the-many-criticisms-of-rama-and-the-anger-of-the-hindu-right Again, if I may put my two cents in, this is clearly a political, not a scholarly discussion. For what is worth, I think that every scholar has the right to interpret any kind of text in any way she or he wants and if somebody is offended by this interpretation, that?s not the scholar?s problem. In this specific case, the only question to be asked in my opinion is whether the interpretation and rendering of this passage is sound and not anachronistic. I do think for instance that the concept of misogyny applied to this Ramayana passage is completely anachronistic and thus this interpretation is not sound, but at the same time I do not really understand the problem in criticizing Rama?s behaviour, whatever the choice of words. Let?s call this issue for what it really is, namely the umpteenth attempt of right-winged Hindu supporters to silence any possible interpretation of sacred texts that is in contrast with their own interpretation. This is what really scares me and I believe that all of us should be really scared and outraged reading the reactions to Audrey Truschke?s tweet, they are awful. Best wishes, Camillo ________________________________ Dr Camillo A. Formigatti John Clay Sanskrit Librarian Bodleian Libraries The Weston Library Broad Street, Oxford OX1 3BG Email: camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk Tel. (office): 01865 (2)77208 www.bodleian.ox.ac.uk GROW YOUR MIND in Oxford University?s Gardens, Libraries and Museums www.mindgrowing.org From: Nagaraj Paturi [mailto:nagarajpaturi at gmail.com] Sent: 27 April 2018 05:06 To: Indology Subject: [INDOLOGY] Discussion on Sita being made into a rabid feminist to call him a 'pig' Some of you might be interested in https://swarajyamag.com/culture/the-scholar-whom-audrey-truschke-cites-finds-her-tweet-shocking -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hermantull at gmail.com Fri Apr 27 17:23:36 2018 From: hermantull at gmail.com (Herman Tull) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 18 17:23:36 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research In-Reply-To: <0C647B6E904DBB4BAD3A28D522DC731523C410EC@MBX05.ad.oak.ox.ac.uk> Message-ID: Speaking for myself, I was grateful for Audrey Truschke's link. Teaching at a small liberal arts college, I have many students ask about study and travel in India. Articles such as this are far more useful than the reflections I can offer on my own student experiences, as a male, 40 years ago in South India. Audrey's note suggested this was not sent for discussion, but simply as a point of reference. Herman Tull On Fri, Apr 27, 2018, 12:50 PM Camillo Formigatti via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Dear colleagues, > > > > If I may put my two cents in, although I am personally very interested in > politics and latest news, I thought that this is a scholarly forum, not > political or of social critique, so I do not see the point in discussing > this terrible event here. I do understand that issues of power and gender > influence the entirety of our lives, we experience them every day at home, > at work, basically everywhere. I have my own personal opinion about gender > inequality as well as many other political and social topics (including the > case discussed in this thread), as I?m sure all of us have. > > > > Please forgive me if I sound a bit na?ve or maybe not engaged enough. I am > well aware that academia too is political, yet I really think that this is > not the right forum to discuss this kind of topic. > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Camillo > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Dr Camillo A. Formigatti > > John Clay Sanskrit Librarian > > > > Bodleian Libraries > > The Weston Library > > Broad Street, Oxford > > OX1 3BG > > > > Email: camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk > > Tel. (office): 01865 (2)77208 > www.bodleian.ox.ac.uk > > > > *GROW YOUR MIND* > > in Oxford University?s > > Gardens, Libraries and Museums > > www.mindgrowing.org > > > > *From:* Walter Slaje [mailto:slaje at kabelmail.de] > *Sent:* 27 April 2018 08:33 > *To:* indology at list.indology.info > *Subject:* Re: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research > > > > There is also this: > > > https://www.ndtv.com/opinion/mahmood-farooqui-and-his-acquittal-in-rape-case-1803070 > > And this: > > > https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/mahmood-farooqui-rape-acquittal-extremely-well-decided-says-supreme-court-dismissing-appeal-against-earlier-verdict/articleshow/62566322.cms > > The Mah?tm? moreover stated: > > ?I have always held that it is physically impossible to violate a woman > against her will. [ . . . ] If she cannot meet the assailant's physical > might, her purity will give her the strength to die before he succeeds in > violating her. [ . . . ] I know that women are capable of throwing away > their lives for a much lesser purpose. Only a few days ago a young girl of > twenty burnt herself to death as she felt she was being persecuted for > refusing to go in for ordinary studies. And she perished with such cool > courage and determination. She ignited her sari with an ordinary oil-light > and did not so much as raise a cry, so that the people in the neighbouring > room were unaware of the happening until all was over.? *Harijan*, > 25-8-1940 and 1-9-1940. > > (Quoted from M. K. GANDHI, The Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi > (Electronic Book). 98 volumes. New Delhi: Publications Division Government > of India 1999. [http://www.gandhiserve.org/ cwmg/ > cwmg.html] 79, Nr. 130: 126 f). > > > > Modern American and traditional Indian notions of rape, honour, consent > and ?sexual interaction? (e.g., the exchange of kisses can count as such) > seem to differ widely. > > > > It is well known that ?secret intercourse with a woman who is asleep, > drunk, or mentally deranged? is categorized as a form of ?marriage? in > ancient Indian law books. > > Manu (3.34) uses ?*upa-gam*? ? *inire feminam* (pw) / to approach a woman > sexually (MW) ? for the consummation of ?marriage?. *upa-gam* is a common > verb for ?having sex? in a general sense. > > > > In the given context, recent English translations use however ?to rape? as > an equivalent (see Olivelle 2005, p. 110). Interpretations follow suit: > ?Tantamount to rape? (Jamison in Olivelle & Davis (ed.), Hindu Law 2017, p. > 130). > > > > Unless supported by unambiguous evidence, such readings should be treated > as notionally anachronistic interpretations reflexively projected onto > ancient India. What appears to be ?rape?, or to be ?tantamount to rape?, in > the eyes of 21st century Western Indologists, does not necessarily > represent the viewpoint of a (pre)modern Indian society. > > > > With regard to its connotation, Doniger (1991: 46) and Michaels (2010: 49) > offer neutral and therefore more faithful translations of *upa-gam*: ?to > have sex with? and ?Beischlaf?. > > > > Actually, we are in dire need of a substantial investigation into the > history of the notions of ?rape? as they prevailed in premodern India. This > will help to understand and assess their (dis)continuation also in the > thinking of today. > > > > Best, > > WS > > > > ----------------------------- > Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje > Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 > D-99425 Weimar > Deutschland > > > > 2018-04-26 15:27 GMT+02:00 Audrey Truschke via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info>: > > Dear Colleagues, > > > > I would like to share this insightful, brave piece written by a PhD > student at Columbia University about her experience pursuing a rape charge > against Mahmood Farooqui in the Indian judicial system. I think it is > relevant for Indologists, especially for sending students to conduct > research abroad, dealing with our own instances of sexual misconduct in the > field, and thinking about gender and power dynamics. > > > > > https://scroll.in/article/876788/healing-myself-a-woman-recounts-her-struggles-after-a-court-acquitted-the-man-she-accused-of-rape > > > > Audrey > > > Audrey Truschke > > Assistant Professor > > Department of History > Rutgers University-Newark > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From suresh.kolichala at gmail.com Fri Apr 27 19:55:15 2018 From: suresh.kolichala at gmail.com (Suresh Kolichala) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 18 15:55:15 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] My Sanskrit verse today In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Madhavji, There is nothing wrong with your *dyuti?*. It is the problem with the font. The default font on Microsoft windows was changed from Mangal font to Nirmala font, in Windows 10 (actually from Windows 8). The rendering of *dyu *is not correctly implemented in Nirmala font. So, unfortunately, everyone using Microsoft windows 10 would find your *mukt?dyuti? *as *mukt?duyati?* . You can see how your text appears in various fonts as shown below: I hope someone at Microsoft is working to rid their default font of all these bugs. Regards, Suresh. On Fri, Apr 27, 2018 at 10:49 AM, Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > I am told by a few friends that they see in the second line of my verse > the word "mukt?duyati?". The Devanagari on my MacBook clearly reads > "mukt?dyuti?." So there is some issue in how Devanagari Unicode typed on a > MacBook gets displayed elsewhere. I don't have a way of solving this > dilemma. I would appreciate if anyone has suggestions. Best, > > Madhav Deshpande > Campbell, California > > 2018-04-27 6:51 GMT-07:00 Madhav Deshpande : > >> My Sanskrit verse today: >> >> ???????????????? ????????? ?????????? ??? >> ???????: ??????????????????? ????????????? ?????? ? >> ?????????????????????????? ????????? ?????? >> ????? ??????????? ??????? ???????? ??????? ?? >> >> Playing on the banks of K?lind?, the drops of sweat on his forehead >> produced by his exertion shine like pearls. The world itself shines by the >> scattering light of his infinite virtues. May this love of Gokula >> constantly shine in my mind. >> >> Madhav Deshpande >> Campbell, California >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Sat Apr 28 03:17:16 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Fri, 27 Apr 18 20:17:16 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] My Sanskrit verses this morning Message-ID: Here are my Sanskrit verses this morning. Enjoy. ??????????? ???? ???? ??????????? ????????: ???????????????????????????????? ???: ????: ? ??????: ????????? ???????? ????? ????? ??????? ?? ?????????? ??????????? ?????????? ?????? ?? Though he has no birth, the refuge of the world was born for uplifting the world. Though unborn, he became a child in a family in Gokula on the banks of K?lind?. Though he is formless, he assumed a sweet beautiful form for the pleasure of the people. I constantly offer my salutation to that M?dhava Govinda who resides in my heart. ????? ?????? ???????????????????????? ??????? ???????????????????????? ????????????? ? ??????????????????????????????????????? ???????????????? ????? ??????? ?????? ??: ?? Salutations to you, O Lord Krishna, who plays his flute and creates joy with torrents of the nectar of sweet notes, plays his games in the water of Yamun? stealing the hearts of the milkmaids, accomplishes the removal of delusion in the mind of Arjuna by reciting the Bhagavad Gita, and resides in my heart. ??????????????????????????? ???????????????????????????????? ? ???????????????????????????? ???????? ??? ????? ???????? ? ???? ?? O Krishna, you are the greatest thief of the clothes of the bathing milkmaids, your mind is attached to drinking the honey from the lotus face of Radh?, and the beauty of your hair is enhanced by peacock-feathers. I do not know any poetry other than you. ??????? ????? ??? ???????? ?????? ? ???????? ????????? ?????????? ??????? ?? Salutations to Vishnu in the form of Krishna who delights the world with his beautiful form, deeds and words. ???? ???? ??????? ????? ???? ????????? ? ?????? ?? ????????? ???????????? ????? ?? O M?dhava, you are a great thief. You enter wherever you wish. How did you open up my mind, which was closed? ????? ???????? ???? ???????? ????? ? ???? ???? ?????? ??????????? ????? ??????? ?? O Lord, you created a house in the form of this world, where, assuming various forms, you constantly play games. ????????? ?????? ?????????????????? ? ???????????????? ??????? ???? ? ??? ????? ?? Whatever exists in this world, those are all your own forms. How would I know who is you and what is a form of yours? ????????? ??????? ????? ?? ??????? ??? ? ????? ??????? ??????????????????????? ???? ?? O M?dhava, unable to pick you from among your form, I think that whatever I see is you. ??? ????? ????????? ???????: ?????????? ? ????? ????? ???????: ???????? ?????? ???? ?????? ?? If the understanding that you are everything is true, then I have a worry as to who could I be other than you. ??? ????????? ????????? ?????????? ??????: ? ?????? ???? ????? ?? ??:????? ?????? ?? ?? If you are Kr???a among Vr???is and you are also Arjuna among the P???avas, then tell me, O M?dhava, undoubtedly who am I to you? ??? ????? ???????? ?????????? ??? ??? ? ? ????????????? ????????? ??? ????????? ?? Whenever I ask this question, then, O Kr???a, you do not say anything. Is your silence an answer? Madhav Deshpande -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Sat Apr 28 04:48:06 2018 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Sat, 28 Apr 18 10:18:06 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?B?UmU6IFtJTkRPTE9HWV0ge+CkreCkvuCksOCkpOClgOCkr+CkteCkv+CkpuCljeCkteCkpOCljeCkquCksOCkv+Ckt+CkpOCljX0gTXkgU2Fuc2tyaXQgdmVyc2VzIHRoaXMgbW9ybmluZw==?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: What an enormous amount of the creativity of this mahaakavi has been suppressed by the pressures of the university career. Lion in its natural dwelling! Cuckoo in the madhumaasa (vasantaritu)! (????? ???? )! 2018-04-28 8:47 GMT+05:30 Madhav Deshpande : > Here are my Sanskrit verses this morning. Enjoy. > > ??????????? ???? ???? ??????????? ????????: > > ???????????????????????????????? ???: ????: ? > > ??????: ????????? ???????? ????? ????? ??????? > > ?? ?????????? ??????????? ?????????? ?????? ?? > > Though he has no birth, the refuge of the world was born for uplifting the > world. Though unborn, he became a child in a family in Gokula on the banks > of K?lind?. Though he is formless, he assumed a sweet beautiful form for > the pleasure of the people. I constantly offer my salutation to that > M?dhava Govinda who resides in my heart. > > > ????? ?????? ???????????????????????? ??????? > > ???????????????????????? ????????????? ? > > ??????????????????????????????????????? > > ???????????????? ????? ??????? ?????? ??: ?? > > Salutations to you, O Lord Krishna, who plays his flute and creates joy > with torrents of the nectar of sweet notes, plays his games in the water of > Yamun? stealing the hearts of the milkmaids, accomplishes the removal of > delusion in the mind of Arjuna by reciting the Bhagavad Gita, and resides > in my heart. > > > ??????????????????????????? > > ???????????????????????????????? ? > > ???????????????????????????? > > ???????? ??? ????? ???????? ? ???? ?? > > O Krishna, you are the greatest thief of the clothes of the bathing > milkmaids, your mind is attached to drinking the honey from the lotus face > of Radh?, and the beauty of your hair is enhanced by peacock-feathers. I do > not know any poetry other than you. > > > ??????? ????? ??? ???????? ?????? ? > > ???????? ????????? ?????????? ??????? ?? > > Salutations to Vishnu in the form of Krishna who delights the world with > his beautiful form, deeds and words. > > > ???? ???? ??????? ????? ???? ????????? ? > > ?????? ?? ????????? ???????????? ????? ?? > > O M?dhava, you are a great thief. You enter wherever you wish. How did you > open up my mind, which was closed? > > > ????? ???????? ???? ???????? ????? ? > > ???? ???? ?????? ??????????? ????? ??????? ?? > > O Lord, you created a house in the form of this world, where, assuming > various forms, you constantly play games. > > > ????????? ?????? ?????????????????? ? > > ???????????????? ??????? ???? ? ??? ????? ?? > > Whatever exists in this world, those are all your own forms. How would I > know who is you and what is a form of yours? > > > ????????? ??????? ????? ?? ??????? ??? ? > > ????? ??????? ??????????????????????? ???? ?? > > O M?dhava, unable to pick you from among your form, I think that whatever > I see is you. > > > ??? ????? ????????? ???????: ?????????? ? > > ????? ????? ???????: ???????? ?????? ???? ?????? ?? > > If the understanding that you are everything is true, then I have a worry > as to who could I be other than you. > > > ??? ????????? ????????? ?????????? ??????: ? > > ?????? ???? ????? ?? ??:????? ?????? ?? ?? > > If you are Kr???a among Vr???is and you are also Arjuna among the P???avas, > then tell me, O M?dhava, undoubtedly who am I to you? > > > ??? ????? ???????? ?????????? ??? ??? ? > > ? ????????????? ????????? ??? ????????? ?? > > Whenever I ask this question, then, O Kr???a, you do not say anything. Is > your silence an answer? > > Madhav Deshpande > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "???????????????????" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to bvparishat+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to bvparishat at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rpg at berkeley.edu Sat Apr 28 18:33:12 2018 From: rpg at berkeley.edu (Robert Goldman) Date: Sat, 28 Apr 18 11:33:12 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, Regarding Professor Slaje?s comments concerning conceptions of what constitutes rape in premodern India and in the legal codes of most modern countries, it is of course true that different cultures have different notions of what constitutes consent and what the consequences of forcible and other forms of non-consensual sex should be. Nonetheless, Manusm?ti and other such texts aside there is, indeed, unambiguous evidence that ancient India was fully aware of the concept of forcible rape as a crime deserving of punishment. In substantiation of this I would refer you to three quite unambiguous cases of rape narrated in the Uttarak???a of the V?lm?ki R?m?ya?a (critical edition). These are found in sargas 26, 30, and 71?72 respectively. In the first, the r?k?asa king R?va?a, after being rebuffed in his effort to seduce the apsaras Rambh?, seizes her violently and rapes her (pratig?hya bal?t . . . maithun?yopacakrame). In her disheveled and terrified state she reports the rape to her lover, Nalak?vara, telling him explicitly that she had been violently sexually assaulted (bal?t . . . dhar?it?). After confirming the truth of her allegation through meditation (!) Nalak?vara curses R?va?a in a rage, so that he would die should he ever again have sex with a woman against her will. It is this curse that robs the r?k?asa of his desire for non consensual sex and, more importantly, serves to spare S?t? from being raped by him when he has her in captivity. The second case is particularly interesting as it purports to provide an origin myth for the phenomenon of rape itself. This is the poem?s second account of the sexual encounter between Indra and Ahaly?, the wife of the sage Gautama. Unlike the first account in the B?lak???a, where Indra impersonates Gautama to seduce the apparently not unwilling Ahaly?, the Uttarak???a?s version involves an unambiguous rape. Angered that Ahaly?, the first truly beautiful woman created by Praj?pati, has been given by the Creator to the sage, the god goes to Gautama?s ashram and rapes Ahaly?. She is twice described in the chapter as dhar?it?, raped. As punishment for this grievous crime (adharma? subalav?n) the sage curses Indra to suffer three consequences. The first is that he will be captured by his enemies (Indrajit). The second is that he will lose, in effect, tenure as permanent king of the gods. The third is that, as Indra has, according to this account, actually established the phenomenon of rape among men and unleashed it upon the world, he will, from that time forward, suffer one half of the guilt of ever rape committed, the other half going to the perpetrator. This version, like the one in the B?lak???a also includes an example ofthe familiar practice of blaming the victim as the innocent Ahaly?, regarded as unfaithful by her husband, is cursed to remain invisible in her husband?s ashram (as in B?la) and also to lose her status as the world?s only beautiful person. The third and final case of rape reported in the Uttara, is that of the virgin Araj?, daughter of the sage U?anas K?vya. She is raped by the idiot king Da??a, a disciple of her father. When he attempts to seduce he, she urges him to duly request her hand from U?anas. Despite the girl?s warnings of the dire consequences, he seizes her and violently rapes her (maithun?yopacakrame) despite her efforts to resist (visphurant?m). When the sage returns and learns what has happened, he curses the king for committing such a heinous crime (p?pam ?d??a? ghoradar?anam). Da??a's punishment is far more severe than that suffered by R?va?a and Indra, U?anas? retribution is a form of collective punishment, destroying not only the perpetrator of the crime but his entire kingdom, which is reduced by a mighty dust storm to a desolate wasteland. It becomes, in fact, the eponymous Da??ak?ra?ya and the small, habitable area of the Janasth?na which figure so prominently in the R?m?yana?s narrative. In this story, as in that of Ahaly?, the rape victim, too, is punished. She is similarly confined to the ashram to engage in meditation. None of these episodes is written off as a normal seduction or sexual encounter and, particularly in the case of the rape of the unmarried Araj?, show no tendency to subject the victim to a marriage with their rapist. All three of these epilogic narratives serve to explain features of the earlier epic narrative, but they also demonstrate quite clearly, that the author or authors of the Uttarak???a, were fully aware of the phenomenon of forcible rape as a severe violation in much the way that we, in modernity, understand it. The Indra-Ahaly? episode, in fact, addresses rape as a continuing social problem and as a crime that incurs guilt both for the rapist and the originator of the phenomenon. I must agree with Professor Slaje that the phenomenon of rape in early India deserves further investigation. For those interested in this I would suggest reading the recent introduction, translation and annotation of the Uttarak???a by my colleague, Dr. Sally Sutherland Goldman and myself (Princeton University Press 2017) and Dr. Sutherland Goldman?s article now in press: "Against Their Will : Sexual Assault in the Uttarak???a? Studies in History 34(2) 1?18 ? 2018 Jawaharlal Nehru University. Delhi: SAGE Publications sagepub.in/home.nav DOI: 10.1177/0257643018772405 http://journals.sagepub.com/home/sih Best wishes to you all. Dr. R. P. Goldman Catherine and William L. Magistretti Distinguished Professor in South and Southeast Asian Studies Department of South and Southeast Asian Studies MC # 2540 The University of California at Berkeley Berkeley, CA 94720-2540 Tel: 510-642-4089 Fax: 510-642-2409 > On Apr 27, 2018, at 10:23 AM, Herman Tull via INDOLOGY wrote: > > Speaking for myself, I was grateful for Audrey Truschke's link. Teaching at a small liberal arts college, I have many students ask about study and travel in India. Articles such as this are far more useful than the reflections I can offer on my own student experiences, as a male, 40 years ago in South India. > > Audrey's note suggested this was not sent for discussion, but simply as a point of reference. > > Herman Tull > > On Fri, Apr 27, 2018, 12:50 PM Camillo Formigatti via INDOLOGY > wrote: > Dear colleagues, > > > > If I may put my two cents in, although I am personally very interested in politics and latest news, I thought that this is a scholarly forum, not political or of social critique, so I do not see the point in discussing this terrible event here. I do understand that issues of power and gender influence the entirety of our lives, we experience them every day at home, at work, basically everywhere. I have my own personal opinion about gender inequality as well as many other political and social topics (including the case discussed in this thread), as I?m sure all of us have. > > > > Please forgive me if I sound a bit na?ve or maybe not engaged enough. I am well aware that academia too is political, yet I really think that this is not the right forum to discuss this kind of topic. > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Camillo > > > > > > Dr Camillo A. Formigatti > > John Clay Sanskrit Librarian > > > > Bodleian Libraries > > The Weston Library > > Broad Street, Oxford > > OX1 3BG > > > > Email: camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk > Tel. (office): 01865 (2)77208 > www.bodleian.ox.ac.uk > > > GROW YOUR MIND > > in Oxford University?s > > Gardens, Libraries and Museums > > www.mindgrowing.org > > > From: Walter Slaje [mailto:slaje at kabelmail.de ] > Sent: 27 April 2018 08:33 > To: indology at list.indology.info > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research > > > > There is also this: > > https://www.ndtv.com/opinion/mahmood-farooqui-and-his-acquittal-in-rape-case-1803070 > And this: > > https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/mahmood-farooqui-rape-acquittal-extremely-well-decided-says-supreme-court-dismissing-appeal-against-earlier-verdict/articleshow/62566322.cms > The Mah?tm? moreover stated: > > ?I have always held that it is physically impossible to violate a woman against her will. [ . . . ] If she cannot meet the assailant's physical might, her purity will give her the strength to die before he succeeds in violating her. [ . . . ] I know that women are capable of throwing away their lives for a much lesser purpose. Only a few days ago a young girl of twenty burnt herself to death as she felt she was being persecuted for refusing to go in for ordinary studies. And she perished with such cool courage and determination. She ignited her sari with an ordinary oil-light and did not so much as raise a cry, so that the people in the neighbouring room were unaware of the happening until all was over.? Harijan, 25-8-1940 and 1-9-1940. > > (Quoted from M. K. GANDHI, The Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi (Electronic Book). 98 volumes. New Delhi: Publications Division Government of India 1999. [http://www .gandhiserve.org/ cwmg/ cwmg.html] 79, Nr. 130: 126 f). > > > > Modern American and traditional Indian notions of rape, honour, consent and ?sexual interaction? (e.g., the exchange of kisses can count as such) seem to differ widely. > > > > It is well known that ?secret intercourse with a woman who is asleep, drunk, or mentally deranged? is categorized as a form of ?marriage? in ancient Indian law books. > > Manu (3.34) uses ?upa-gam? ? inire feminam (pw) / to approach a woman sexually (MW) ? for the consummation of ?marriage?. upa-gam is a common verb for ?having sex? in a general sense. > > > > In the given context, recent English translations use however ?to rape? as an equivalent (see Olivelle 2005, p. 110). Interpretations follow suit: ?Tantamount to rape? (Jamison in Olivelle & Davis (ed.), Hindu Law 2017, p. 130). > > > > Unless supported by unambiguous evidence, such readings should be treated as notionally anachronistic interpretations reflexively projected onto ancient India. What appears to be ?rape?, or to be ?tantamount to rape?, in the eyes of 21st century Western Indologists, does not necessarily represent the viewpoint of a (pre)modern Indian society. > > > > With regard to its connotation, Doniger (1991: 46) and Michaels (2010: 49) offer neutral and therefore more faithful translations of upa-gam: ?to have sex with? and ?Beischlaf?. > > > > Actually, we are in dire need of a substantial investigation into the history of the notions of ?rape? as they prevailed in premodern India. This will help to understand and assess their (dis)continuation also in the thinking of today. > > > > Best, > > WS > > > > ----------------------------- > Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje > Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 > D-99425 Weimar > Deutschland > > > > > 2018-04-26 15:27 GMT+02:00 Audrey Truschke via INDOLOGY >: > > Dear Colleagues, > > > > I would like to share this insightful, brave piece written by a PhD student at Columbia University about her experience pursuing a rape charge against Mahmood Farooqui in the Indian judicial system. I think it is relevant for Indologists, especially for sending students to conduct research abroad, dealing with our own instances of sexual misconduct in the field, and thinking about gender and power dynamics. > > > > https://scroll.in/article/876788/healing-myself-a-woman-recounts-her-struggles-after-a-court-acquitted-the-man-she-accused-of-rape > > > Audrey > > > > Audrey Truschke > > Assistant Professor > > Department of History > Rutgers University-Newark > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From H.J.H.Tieken at hum.leidenuniv.nl Sat Apr 28 19:21:07 2018 From: H.J.H.Tieken at hum.leidenuniv.nl (Tieken, H.J.H.) Date: Sat, 28 Apr 18 19:21:07 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] [Spam:******] Re: Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear List Members I have somehow missed the previous messages on the topic of rape. There are several references to rape in the K?mas?tra (3, 5, 25 ff). For instance to plying a young girl with liquor and rob her of her virginity (d??ayitv?) when she is unconscious (25). The verb d??ayitv? is also used in the following s?tra, (26). In 27 he "merely" abducts the girl (apaharet). Mind you, the KS says that the fact that a certain course of action is mentioned in a text should not be a reason to bring it into practice. Herman Herman Tieken Stationsweg 58 2515 BP Den Haag The Netherlands 00 31 (0)70 2208127 website: hermantieken.com ________________________________ Van: INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info] namens Robert Goldman via INDOLOGY [indology at list.indology.info] Verzonden: zaterdag 28 april 2018 20:33 Aan: Herman Tull; slaje at kabelmail.de CC: Indology; sal Onderwerp: [Spam:******] Re: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research Dear Colleagues, Regarding Professor Slaje?s comments concerning conceptions of what constitutes rape in premodern India and in the legal codes of most modern countries, it is of course true that different cultures have different notions of what constitutes consent and what the consequences of forcible and other forms of non-consensual sex should be. Nonetheless, Manusm?ti and other such texts aside there is, indeed, unambiguous evidence that ancient India was fully aware of the concept of forcible rape as a crime deserving of punishment. In substantiation of this I would refer you to three quite unambiguous cases of rape narrated in the Uttarak???a of the V?lm?ki R?m?ya?a (critical edition). These are found in sargas 26, 30, and 71?72 respectively. In the first, the r?k?asa king R?va?a, after being rebuffed in his effort to seduce the apsaras Rambh?, seizes her violently and rapes her (pratig?hya bal?t . . . maithun?yopacakrame). In her disheveled and terrified state she reports the rape to her lover, Nalak?vara, telling him explicitly that she had been violently sexually assaulted (bal?t . . . dhar?it?). After confirming the truth of her allegation through meditation (!) Nalak?vara curses R?va?a in a rage, so that he would die should he ever again have sex with a woman against her will. It is this curse that robs the r?k?asa of his desire for non consensual sex and, more importantly, serves to spare S?t? from being raped by him when he has her in captivity. The second case is particularly interesting as it purports to provide an origin myth for the phenomenon of rape itself. This is the poem?s second account of the sexual encounter between Indra and Ahaly?, the wife of the sage Gautama. Unlike the first account in the B?lak???a, where Indra impersonates Gautama to seduce the apparently not unwilling Ahaly?, the Uttarak???a?s version involves an unambiguous rape. Angered that Ahaly?, the first truly beautiful woman created by Praj?pati, has been given by the Creator to the sage, the god goes to Gautama?s ashram and rapes Ahaly?. She is twice described in the chapter as dhar?it?, raped. As punishment for this grievous crime (adharma? subalav?n) the sage curses Indra to suffer three consequences. The first is that he will be captured by his enemies (Indrajit). The second is that he will lose, in effect, tenure as permanent king of the gods. The third is that, as Indra has, according to this account, actually established the phenomenon of rape among men and unleashed it upon the world, he will, from that time forward, suffer one half of the guilt of ever rape committed, the other half going to the perpetrator. This version, like the one in the B?lak???a also includes an example ofthe familiar practice of blaming the victim as the innocent Ahaly?, regarded as unfaithful by her husband, is cursed to remain invisible in her husband?s ashram (as in B?la) and also to lose her status as the world?s only beautiful person. The third and final case of rape reported in the Uttara, is that of the virgin Araj?, daughter of the sage U?anas K?vya. She is raped by the idiot king Da??a, a disciple of her father. When he attempts to seduce he, she urges him to duly request her hand from U?anas. Despite the girl?s warnings of the dire consequences, he seizes her and violently rapes her (maithun?yopacakrame) despite her efforts to resist (visphurant?m). When the sage returns and learns what has happened, he curses the king for committing such a heinous crime (p?pam ?d??a? ghoradar?anam). Da??a's punishment is far more severe than that suffered by R?va?a and Indra, U?anas? retribution is a form of collective punishment, destroying not only the perpetrator of the crime but his entire kingdom, which is reduced by a mighty dust storm to a desolate wasteland. It becomes, in fact, the eponymous Da??ak?ra?ya and the small, habitable area of the Janasth?na which figure so prominently in the R?m?yana?s narrative. In this story, as in that of Ahaly?, the rape victim, too, is punished. She is similarly confined to the ashram to engage in meditation. None of these episodes is written off as a normal seduction or sexual encounter and, particularly in the case of the rape of the unmarried Araj?, show no tendency to subject the victim to a marriage with their rapist. All three of these epilogic narratives serve to explain features of the earlier epic narrative, but they also demonstrate quite clearly, that the author or authors of the Uttarak???a, were fully aware of the phenomenon of forcible rape as a severe violation in much the way that we, in modernity, understand it. The Indra-Ahaly? episode, in fact, addresses rape as a continuing social problem and as a crime that incurs guilt both for the rapist and the originator of the phenomenon. I must agree with Professor Slaje that the phenomenon of rape in early India deserves further investigation. For those interested in this I would suggest reading the recent introduction, translation and annotation of the Uttarak???a by my colleague, Dr. Sally Sutherland Goldman and myself (Princeton University Press 2017) and Dr. Sutherland Goldman?s article now in press: "Against Their Will : Sexual Assault in the Uttarak???a? Studies in History 34(2) 1?18 ? 2018 Jawaharlal Nehru University. Delhi: SAGE Publications sagepub.in/home.nav DOI: 10.1177/0257643018772405 http://journals.sagepub.com/home/sih Best wishes to you all. Dr. R. P. Goldman Catherine and William L. Magistretti Distinguished Professor in South and Southeast Asian Studies Department of South and Southeast Asian Studies MC # 2540 The University of California at Berkeley Berkeley, CA 94720-2540 Tel: 510-642-4089 Fax: 510-642-2409 On Apr 27, 2018, at 10:23 AM, Herman Tull via INDOLOGY > wrote: Speaking for myself, I was grateful for Audrey Truschke's link. Teaching at a small liberal arts college, I have many students ask about study and travel in India. Articles such as this are far more useful than the reflections I can offer on my own student experiences, as a male, 40 years ago in South India. Audrey's note suggested this was not sent for discussion, but simply as a point of reference. Herman Tull On Fri, Apr 27, 2018, 12:50 PM Camillo Formigatti via INDOLOGY > wrote: Dear colleagues, If I may put my two cents in, although I am personally very interested in politics and latest news, I thought that this is a scholarly forum, not political or of social critique, so I do not see the point in discussing this terrible event here. I do understand that issues of power and gender influence the entirety of our lives, we experience them every day at home, at work, basically everywhere. I have my own personal opinion about gender inequality as well as many other political and social topics (including the case discussed in this thread), as I?m sure all of us have. Please forgive me if I sound a bit na?ve or maybe not engaged enough. I am well aware that academia too is political, yet I really think that this is not the right forum to discuss this kind of topic. Best wishes, Camillo ________________________________ Dr Camillo A. Formigatti John Clay Sanskrit Librarian Bodleian Libraries The Weston Library Broad Street, Oxford OX1 3BG Email: camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk Tel. (office): 01865 (2)77208 www.bodleian.ox.ac.uk GROW YOUR MIND in Oxford University?s Gardens, Libraries and Museums www.mindgrowing.org From: Walter Slaje [mailto:slaje at kabelmail.de] Sent: 27 April 2018 08:33 To: indology at list.indology.info Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research There is also this: https://www.ndtv.com/opinion/mahmood-farooqui-and-his-acquittal-in-rape-case-1803070 And this: https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/mahmood-farooqui-rape-acquittal-extremely-well-decided-says-supreme-court-dismissing-appeal-against-earlier-verdict/articleshow/62566322.cms The Mah?tm? moreover stated: ?I have always held that it is physically impossible to violate a woman against her will. [ . . . ] If she cannot meet the assailant's physical might, her purity will give her the strength to die before he succeeds in violating her. [ . . . ] I know that women are capable of throwing away their lives for a much lesser purpose. Only a few days ago a young girl of twenty burnt herself to death as she felt she was being persecuted for refusing to go in for ordinary studies. And she perished with such cool courage and determination. She ignited her sari with an ordinary oil-light and did not so much as raise a cry, so that the people in the neighbouring room were unaware of the happening until all was over.? Harijan, 25-8-1940 and 1-9-1940. (Quoted from M. K. GANDHI, The Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi (Electronic Book). 98 volumes. New Delhi: Publications Division Government of India 1999. [http://www.gandhiserve.org/ cwmg/ cwmg.html] 79, Nr. 130: 126 f). Modern American and traditional Indian notions of rape, honour, consent and ?sexual interaction? (e.g., the exchange of kisses can count as such) seem to differ widely. It is well known that ?secret intercourse with a woman who is asleep, drunk, or mentally deranged? is categorized as a form of ?marriage? in ancient Indian law books. Manu (3.34) uses ?upa-gam? ? inire feminam (pw) / to approach a woman sexually (MW) ? for the consummation of ?marriage?. upa-gam is a common verb for ?having sex? in a general sense. In the given context, recent English translations use however ?to rape? as an equivalent (see Olivelle 2005, p. 110). Interpretations follow suit: ?Tantamount to rape? (Jamison in Olivelle & Davis (ed.), Hindu Law 2017, p. 130). Unless supported by unambiguous evidence, such readings should be treated as notionally anachronistic interpretations reflexively projected onto ancient India. What appears to be ?rape?, or to be ?tantamount to rape?, in the eyes of 21st century Western Indologists, does not necessarily represent the viewpoint of a (pre)modern Indian society. With regard to its connotation, Doniger (1991: 46) and Michaels (2010: 49) offer neutral and therefore more faithful translations of upa-gam: ?to have sex with? and ?Beischlaf?. Actually, we are in dire need of a substantial investigation into the history of the notions of ?rape? as they prevailed in premodern India. This will help to understand and assess their (dis)continuation also in the thinking of today. Best, WS ----------------------------- Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 D-99425 Weimar Deutschland 2018-04-26 15:27 GMT+02:00 Audrey Truschke via INDOLOGY >: Dear Colleagues, I would like to share this insightful, brave piece written by a PhD student at Columbia University about her experience pursuing a rape charge against Mahmood Farooqui in the Indian judicial system. I think it is relevant for Indologists, especially for sending students to conduct research abroad, dealing with our own instances of sexual misconduct in the field, and thinking about gender and power dynamics. https://scroll.in/article/876788/healing-myself-a-woman-recounts-her-struggles-after-a-court-acquitted-the-man-she-accused-of-rape Audrey Audrey Truschke Assistant Professor Department of History Rutgers University-Newark _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Sat Apr 28 19:44:50 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sat, 28 Apr 18 12:44:50 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks, Bob, for bringing up these stories from R?m?ya?a. The expression "bal?t" (forcibly) used in these narratives continues into old and modern Marathi. The dictionary of Old Marathi by Tulpule and Feldhaus lists the word ???????? in the sense of rape and cites passages from old Marathi literature. The word ???????? continues to be used in modern Marathi in this sense. From the period of Maratha history going back to the time of Shivaji, there are instances of someone accused of rape being sentenced to death by being thrown down from a cliff etc. So one can find references to this issue going back into pre-modern India. Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California On Sat, Apr 28, 2018 at 11:33 AM, Robert Goldman via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > > Regarding Professor Slaje?s comments concerning conceptions of what > constitutes rape in premodern India and in the legal codes of most modern > countries, it is of course true that different cultures have different > notions of what constitutes consent and what the consequences of forcible > and other forms of non-consensual sex should be. > > Nonetheless, *Manusm?ti* and other such texts aside there is, indeed, > unambiguous evidence that ancient India was fully aware of the concept of > forcible rape as a crime deserving of punishment. In substantiation of > this I would refer you to three quite unambiguous cases of rape narrated in > the *Uttarak???a *of the* V?lm?ki R?m?ya?a *(critical edition). These are > found in *sargas* 26, 30, and 71?72 respectively. > > In the first, the *r?k?asa* king R?va?a, after being rebuffed in his > effort to seduce the apsaras Rambh?, seizes her violently and rapes her (*pratig?hya > bal?t . . . maithun?yopacakrame*). In her disheveled and terrified state > she reports the rape to her lover, Nalak?vara, telling him explicitly that > she had been violently sexually assaulted (*bal?t . . . dhar?it?*). After > confirming the truth of her allegation through meditation (!) Nalak?vara > curses R?va?a in a rage, so that he would die should he ever again have sex > with a woman against her will. It is this curse that robs the *r?k?asa* > of his desire for non consensual sex and, more importantly, serves to spare > S?t? from being raped by him when he has her in captivity. > > The second case is particularly interesting as it purports to provide an > origin myth for the phenomenon of rape itself. This is the poem?s second > account of the sexual encounter between Indra and Ahaly?, the wife of the > sage Gautama. Unlike the first account in the *B?lak???a*, where Indra > impersonates Gautama to seduce the apparently not unwilling Ahaly?, the > *Uttarak???a?s* version involves an unambiguous rape. Angered that > Ahaly?, the first truly beautiful woman created by Praj?pati, has been > given by the Creator to the sage, the god goes to Gautama?s ashram and > rapes Ahaly?. She is twice described in the chapter as *dhar?it?*, > raped. As punishment for this grievous crime (*adharma? subalav?n*) the > sage curses Indra to suffer three consequences. The first is that he will > be captured by his enemies (Indrajit). The second is that he will lose, in > effect, tenure as permanent king of the gods. The third is that, as Indra > has, according to this account, actually established the phenomenon of rape > among men and unleashed it upon the world, he will, from that time forward, > suffer one half of the guilt of ever rape committed, the other half going > to the perpetrator. This version, like the one in the *B?lak???a* also > includes an example ofthe familiar practice of blaming the victim as the > innocent Ahaly?, regarded as unfaithful by her husband, is cursed to > remain invisible in her husband?s ashram (as in *B?la*) and also to lose > her status as the world?s only beautiful person. > > The third and final case of rape reported in the *Uttara*, is that of the > virgin Araj?, daughter of the sage U?anas K?vya. She is raped by the idiot > king Da??a, a disciple of her father. When he attempts to seduce he, she > urges him to duly request her hand from U?anas. Despite the girl?s warnings > of the dire consequences, he seizes her and violently rapes her (*maithun?yopacakrame) > *despite her efforts to resist (*visphurant?m*)*. *When the sage returns > and learns what has happened, he curses the king for committing such a > heinous crime (*p?pam ?d??a? ghoradar?anam*). Da??a's punishment is far > more severe than that suffered by R?va?a and Indra, U?anas? retribution is > a form of collective punishment, destroying not only the perpetrator of the > crime but his entire kingdom, which is reduced by a mighty dust storm to a > desolate wasteland. It becomes, in fact, the eponymous Da??ak?ra?ya and > the small, habitable area of the Janasth?na which figure so prominently in > the R?m?yana?s narrative. In this story, as in that of Ahaly?, the rape > victim, too, is punished. She is similarly confined to the ashram to > engage in meditation. > > None of these episodes is written off as a normal seduction or sexual > encounter and, particularly in the case of the rape of the unmarried > Araj?, show no tendency to subject the victim to a marriage with their > rapist. > > All three of these epilogic narratives serve to explain features of the > earlier epic narrative, but they also demonstrate quite clearly, that the > author or authors of the *Uttarak???a*, were fully aware of the > phenomenon of forcible rape as a severe violation in much the way that we, > in modernity, understand it. The Indra-Ahaly? episode, in fact, addresses > rape as a continuing social problem and as a crime that incurs guilt both > for the rapist and the originator of the phenomenon. > > I must agree with Professor Slaje that the phenomenon of rape in early > India deserves further investigation. For those interested in this I would > suggest reading the recent introduction, translation and annotation of the > *Uttarak???a* by my colleague, Dr. Sally Sutherland Goldman and myself > (Princeton University Press 2017) and Dr. Sutherland Goldman?s article now > in press: > > "Against Their Will : Sexual Assault in the *Uttarak???a*? Studies in > History 34(2) 1?18 ? 2018 Jawaharlal Nehru University. Delhi: SAGE > Publications > sagepub.in/home.nav > DOI: 10.1177/0257643018772405 > http://journals.sagepub.com/home/sih > > Best wishes to you all. > > > Dr. R. P. Goldman > Catherine and William L. Magistretti Distinguished Professor in South > and Southeast Asian Studies > Department of South and Southeast Asian Studies MC # 2540 > The University of California at Berkeley > Berkeley, CA 94720-2540 > Tel: 510-642-4089 > Fax: 510-642-2409 > > On Apr 27, 2018, at 10:23 AM, Herman Tull via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > > Speaking for myself, I was grateful for Audrey Truschke's link. Teaching > at a small liberal arts college, I have many students ask about study and > travel in India. Articles such as this are far more useful than the > reflections I can offer on my own student experiences, as a male, 40 years > ago in South India. > > Audrey's note suggested this was not sent for discussion, but simply as a > point of reference. > > Herman Tull > > On Fri, Apr 27, 2018, 12:50 PM Camillo Formigatti via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > >> Dear colleagues, >> >> >> >> If I may put my two cents in, although I am personally very interested in >> politics and latest news, I thought that this is a scholarly forum, not >> political or of social critique, so I do not see the point in discussing >> this terrible event here. I do understand that issues of power and gender >> influence the entirety of our lives, we experience them every day at home, >> at work, basically everywhere. I have my own personal opinion about gender >> inequality as well as many other political and social topics (including the >> case discussed in this thread), as I?m sure all of us have. >> >> >> >> Please forgive me if I sound a bit na?ve or maybe not engaged enough. I >> am well aware that academia too is political, yet I really think that this >> is not the right forum to discuss this kind of topic. >> >> >> >> Best wishes, >> >> >> >> Camillo >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> >> >> Dr Camillo A. Formigatti >> >> John Clay Sanskrit Librarian >> >> >> >> Bodleian Libraries >> >> The Weston Library >> >> Broad Street, Oxford >> >> OX1 3BG >> >> >> >> Email: camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk >> >> Tel. (office): 01865 (2)77208 >> www.bodleian.ox.ac.uk >> >> >> >> *GROW YOUR MIND* >> >> in Oxford University?s >> >> Gardens, Libraries and Museums >> >> www.mindgrowing.org >> >> >> >> *From:* Walter Slaje [mailto:slaje at kabelmail.de] >> *Sent:* 27 April 2018 08:33 >> *To:* indology at list.indology.info >> *Subject:* Re: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting >> Research >> >> >> >> There is also this: >> >> https://www.ndtv.com/opinion/mahmood-farooqui-and-his- >> acquittal-in-rape-case-1803070 >> >> And this: >> >> https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/mahmood- >> farooqui-rape-acquittal-extremely-well-decided-says- >> supreme-court-dismissing-appeal-against-earlier- >> verdict/articleshow/62566322.cms >> >> The Mah?tm? moreover stated: >> >> ?I have always held that it is physically impossible to violate a woman >> against her will. [ . . . ] If she cannot meet the assailant's physical >> might, her purity will give her the strength to die before he succeeds in >> violating her. [ . . . ] I know that women are capable of throwing away >> their lives for a much lesser purpose. Only a few days ago a young girl of >> twenty burnt herself to death as she felt she was being persecuted for >> refusing to go in for ordinary studies. And she perished with such cool >> courage and determination. She ignited her sari with an ordinary oil-light >> and did not so much as raise a cry, so that the people in the neighbouring >> room were unaware of the happening until all was over.? *Harijan*, >> 25-8-1940 and 1-9-1940. >> >> (Quoted from M. K. GANDHI, The Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi >> (Electronic Book). 98 volumes. New Delhi: Publications Division Government >> of India 1999. [http://www.gandhiserve.org/ cwmg/ >> cwmg.html] 79, Nr. 130: 126 f). >> >> >> >> Modern American and traditional Indian notions of rape, honour, consent >> and ?sexual interaction? (e.g., the exchange of kisses can count as such) >> seem to differ widely. >> >> >> >> It is well known that ?secret intercourse with a woman who is asleep, >> drunk, or mentally deranged? is categorized as a form of ?marriage? in >> ancient Indian law books. >> >> Manu (3.34) uses ?*upa-gam*? ? *inire feminam* (pw) / to approach a >> woman sexually (MW) ? for the consummation of ?marriage?. *upa-gam* is a >> common verb for ?having sex? in a general sense. >> >> >> >> In the given context, recent English translations use however ?to rape? >> as an equivalent (see Olivelle 2005, p. 110). Interpretations follow suit: >> ?Tantamount to rape? (Jamison in Olivelle & Davis (ed.), Hindu Law 2017, p. >> 130). >> >> >> >> Unless supported by unambiguous evidence, such readings should be treated >> as notionally anachronistic interpretations reflexively projected onto >> ancient India. What appears to be ?rape?, or to be ?tantamount to rape?, in >> the eyes of 21st century Western Indologists, does not necessarily >> represent the viewpoint of a (pre)modern Indian society. >> >> >> >> With regard to its connotation, Doniger (1991: 46) and Michaels (2010: >> 49) offer neutral and therefore more faithful translations of *upa-gam*: >> ?to have sex with? and ?Beischlaf?. >> >> >> >> Actually, we are in dire need of a substantial investigation into the >> history of the notions of ?rape? as they prevailed in premodern India. This >> will help to understand and assess their (dis)continuation also in the >> thinking of today. >> >> >> >> Best, >> >> WS >> >> >> >> ----------------------------- >> Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje >> Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 >> D-99425 Weimar >> Deutschland >> >> >> >> 2018-04-26 15:27 GMT+02:00 Audrey Truschke via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info>: >> >> Dear Colleagues, >> >> >> >> I would like to share this insightful, brave piece written by a PhD >> student at Columbia University about her experience pursuing a rape charge >> against Mahmood Farooqui in the Indian judicial system. I think it is >> relevant for Indologists, especially for sending students to conduct >> research abroad, dealing with our own instances of sexual misconduct in the >> field, and thinking about gender and power dynamics. >> >> >> >> https://scroll.in/article/876788/healing-myself-a-woman- >> recounts-her-struggles-after-a-court-acquitted-the-man-she- >> accused-of-rape >> >> >> >> Audrey >> >> >> Audrey Truschke >> >> Assistant Professor >> >> Department of History >> Rutgers University-Newark >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rpg at berkeley.edu Sat Apr 28 20:54:55 2018 From: rpg at berkeley.edu (Robert Goldman) Date: Sat, 28 Apr 18 13:54:55 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <85C8832A-0875-499E-828A-012B893B0161@berkeley.edu> And thanks to you, Madhav for this information. Of course the term bal?tk?ra is well known and widely used for various forms of violence, outrage, oppression etc. in the standard Sanskrit lexicon. But I had not seen it used specifically for sexual violence. Bob Dr. R. P. Goldman Catherine and William L. Magistretti Distinguished Professor in South and Southeast Asian Studies Department of South and Southeast Asian Studies MC # 2540 The University of California at Berkeley Berkeley, CA 94720-2540 Tel: 510-642-4089 Fax: 510-642-2409 > On Apr 28, 2018, at 12:44 PM, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > > Thanks, Bob, for bringing up these stories from R?m?ya?a. The expression "bal?t" (forcibly) used in these narratives continues into old and modern Marathi. The dictionary of Old Marathi by Tulpule and Feldhaus lists the word ???????? in the sense of rape and cites passages from old Marathi literature. The word ???????? continues to be used in modern Marathi in this sense. From the period of Maratha history going back to the time of Shivaji, there are instances of someone accused of rape being sentenced to death by being thrown down from a cliff etc. So one can find references to this issue going back into pre-modern India. > > Madhav Deshpande > Campbell, California > > On Sat, Apr 28, 2018 at 11:33 AM, Robert Goldman via INDOLOGY > wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > > Regarding Professor Slaje?s comments concerning conceptions of what constitutes rape in premodern India and in the legal codes of most modern countries, it is of course true that different cultures have different notions of what constitutes consent and what the consequences of forcible and other forms of non-consensual sex should be. > > Nonetheless, Manusm?ti and other such texts aside there is, indeed, unambiguous evidence that ancient India was fully aware of the concept of forcible rape as a crime deserving of punishment. In substantiation of this I would refer you to three quite unambiguous cases of rape narrated in the Uttarak???a of the V?lm?ki R?m?ya?a (critical edition). These are found in sargas 26, 30, and 71?72 respectively. > > In the first, the r?k?asa king R?va?a, after being rebuffed in his effort to seduce the apsaras Rambh?, seizes her violently and rapes her (pratig?hya bal?t . . . maithun?yopacakrame). In her disheveled and terrified state she reports the rape to her lover, Nalak?vara, telling him explicitly that she had been violently sexually assaulted (bal?t . . . dhar?it?). After confirming the truth of her allegation through meditation (!) Nalak?vara curses R?va?a in a rage, so that he would die should he ever again have sex with a woman against her will. It is this curse that robs the r?k?asa of his desire for non consensual sex and, more importantly, serves to spare S?t? from being raped by him when he has her in captivity. > > The second case is particularly interesting as it purports to provide an origin myth for the phenomenon of rape itself. This is the poem?s second account of the sexual encounter between Indra and Ahaly?, the wife of the sage Gautama. Unlike the first account in the B?lak???a, where Indra impersonates Gautama to seduce the apparently not unwilling Ahaly?, the Uttarak???a?s version involves an unambiguous rape. Angered that Ahaly?, the first truly beautiful woman created by Praj?pati, has been given by the Creator to the sage, the god goes to Gautama?s ashram and rapes Ahaly?. She is twice described in the chapter as dhar?it?, raped. As punishment for this grievous crime (adharma? subalav?n) the sage curses Indra to suffer three consequences. The first is that he will be captured by his enemies (Indrajit). The second is that he will lose, in effect, tenure as permanent king of the gods. The third is that, as Indra has, according to this account, actually established the phenomenon of rape among men and unleashed it upon the world, he will, from that time forward, suffer one half of the guilt of ever rape committed, the other half going to the perpetrator. This version, like the one in the B?lak???a also includes an example ofthe familiar practice of blaming the victim as the innocent Ahaly?, regarded as unfaithful by her husband, is cursed to remain invisible in her husband?s ashram (as in B?la) and also to lose her status as the world?s only beautiful person. > > The third and final case of rape reported in the Uttara, is that of the virgin Araj?, daughter of the sage U?anas K?vya. She is raped by the idiot king Da??a, a disciple of her father. When he attempts to seduce he, she urges him to duly request her hand from U?anas. Despite the girl?s warnings of the dire consequences, he seizes her and violently rapes her (maithun?yopacakrame) despite her efforts to resist (visphurant?m). When the sage returns and learns what has happened, he curses the king for committing such a heinous crime (p?pam ?d??a? ghoradar?anam). Da??a's punishment is far more severe than that suffered by R?va?a and Indra, U?anas? retribution is a form of collective punishment, destroying not only the perpetrator of the crime but his entire kingdom, which is reduced by a mighty dust storm to a desolate wasteland. It becomes, in fact, the eponymous Da??ak?ra?ya and the small, habitable area of the Janasth?na which figure so prominently in the R?m?yana?s narrative. In this story, as in that of Ahaly?, the rape victim, too, is punished. She is similarly confined to the ashram to engage in meditation. > > None of these episodes is written off as a normal seduction or sexual encounter and, particularly in the case of the rape of the unmarried Araj?, show no tendency to subject the victim to a marriage with their rapist. > > All three of these epilogic narratives serve to explain features of the earlier epic narrative, but they also demonstrate quite clearly, that the author or authors of the Uttarak???a, were fully aware of the phenomenon of forcible rape as a severe violation in much the way that we, in modernity, understand it. The Indra-Ahaly? episode, in fact, addresses rape as a continuing social problem and as a crime that incurs guilt both for the rapist and the originator of the phenomenon. > > I must agree with Professor Slaje that the phenomenon of rape in early India deserves further investigation. For those interested in this I would suggest reading the recent introduction, translation and annotation of the Uttarak???a by my colleague, Dr. Sally Sutherland Goldman and myself (Princeton University Press 2017) and Dr. Sutherland Goldman?s article now in press: > > "Against Their Will : Sexual Assault in the Uttarak???a? Studies in History 34(2) 1?18 ? 2018 Jawaharlal Nehru University. Delhi: SAGE Publications > sagepub.in/home.nav > DOI: 10.1177/0257643018772405 > http://journals.sagepub.com/home/sih > > Best wishes to you all. > > > Dr. R. P. Goldman > Catherine and William L. Magistretti Distinguished Professor in South and Southeast Asian Studies > Department of South and Southeast Asian Studies MC # 2540 > The University of California at Berkeley > Berkeley, CA 94720-2540 > Tel: 510-642-4089 > Fax: 510-642-2409 > >> On Apr 27, 2018, at 10:23 AM, Herman Tull via INDOLOGY > wrote: >> >> Speaking for myself, I was grateful for Audrey Truschke's link. Teaching at a small liberal arts college, I have many students ask about study and travel in India. Articles such as this are far more useful than the reflections I can offer on my own student experiences, as a male, 40 years ago in South India. >> >> Audrey's note suggested this was not sent for discussion, but simply as a point of reference. >> >> Herman Tull >> >> On Fri, Apr 27, 2018, 12:50 PM Camillo Formigatti via INDOLOGY > wrote: >> Dear colleagues, >> >> >> >> If I may put my two cents in, although I am personally very interested in politics and latest news, I thought that this is a scholarly forum, not political or of social critique, so I do not see the point in discussing this terrible event here. I do understand that issues of power and gender influence the entirety of our lives, we experience them every day at home, at work, basically everywhere. I have my own personal opinion about gender inequality as well as many other political and social topics (including the case discussed in this thread), as I?m sure all of us have. >> >> >> >> Please forgive me if I sound a bit na?ve or maybe not engaged enough. I am well aware that academia too is political, yet I really think that this is not the right forum to discuss this kind of topic. >> >> >> >> Best wishes, >> >> >> >> Camillo >> >> >> >> >> >> Dr Camillo A. Formigatti >> >> John Clay Sanskrit Librarian >> >> >> >> Bodleian Libraries >> >> The Weston Library >> >> Broad Street, Oxford >> >> OX1 3BG >> >> >> >> Email: camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk >> Tel. (office): 01865 (2)77208 >> www.bodleian.ox.ac.uk >> >> >> GROW YOUR MIND >> >> in Oxford University?s >> >> Gardens, Libraries and Museums >> >> www.mindgrowing.org >> >> >> From: Walter Slaje [mailto:slaje at kabelmail.de ] >> Sent: 27 April 2018 08:33 >> To: indology at list.indology.info >> Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research >> >> >> >> There is also this: >> >> https://www.ndtv.com/opinion/mahmood-farooqui-and-his-acquittal-in-rape-case-1803070 >> And this: >> >> https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/mahmood-farooqui-rape-acquittal-extremely-well-decided-says-supreme-court-dismissing-appeal-against-earlier-verdict/articleshow/62566322.cms >> The Mah?tm? moreover stated: >> >> ?I have always held that it is physically impossible to violate a woman against her will. [ . . . ] If she cannot meet the assailant's physical might, her purity will give her the strength to die before he succeeds in violating her. [ . . . ] I know that women are capable of throwing away their lives for a much lesser purpose. Only a few days ago a young girl of twenty burnt herself to death as she felt she was being persecuted for refusing to go in for ordinary studies. And she perished with such cool courage and determination. She ignited her sari with an ordinary oil-light and did not so much as raise a cry, so that the people in the neighbouring room were unaware of the happening until all was over.? Harijan, 25-8-1940 and 1-9-1940. >> >> (Quoted from M. K. GANDHI, The Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi (Electronic Book). 98 volumes. New Delhi: Publications Division Government of India 1999. [http://www .gandhiserve.org/ cwmg/ cwmg.html] 79, Nr. 130: 126 f). >> >> >> >> Modern American and traditional Indian notions of rape, honour, consent and ?sexual interaction? (e.g., the exchange of kisses can count as such) seem to differ widely. >> >> >> >> It is well known that ?secret intercourse with a woman who is asleep, drunk, or mentally deranged? is categorized as a form of ?marriage? in ancient Indian law books. >> >> Manu (3.34) uses ?upa-gam? ? inire feminam (pw) / to approach a woman sexually (MW) ? for the consummation of ?marriage?. upa-gam is a common verb for ?having sex? in a general sense. >> >> >> >> In the given context, recent English translations use however ?to rape? as an equivalent (see Olivelle 2005, p. 110). Interpretations follow suit: ?Tantamount to rape? (Jamison in Olivelle & Davis (ed.), Hindu Law 2017, p. 130). >> >> >> >> Unless supported by unambiguous evidence, such readings should be treated as notionally anachronistic interpretations reflexively projected onto ancient India. What appears to be ?rape?, or to be ?tantamount to rape?, in the eyes of 21st century Western Indologists, does not necessarily represent the viewpoint of a (pre)modern Indian society. >> >> >> >> With regard to its connotation, Doniger (1991: 46) and Michaels (2010: 49) offer neutral and therefore more faithful translations of upa-gam: ?to have sex with? and ?Beischlaf?. >> >> >> >> Actually, we are in dire need of a substantial investigation into the history of the notions of ?rape? as they prevailed in premodern India. This will help to understand and assess their (dis)continuation also in the thinking of today. >> >> >> >> Best, >> >> WS >> >> >> >> ----------------------------- >> Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje >> Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 >> D-99425 Weimar >> Deutschland >> >> >> >> >> 2018-04-26 15:27 GMT+02:00 Audrey Truschke via INDOLOGY >: >> >> Dear Colleagues, >> >> >> >> I would like to share this insightful, brave piece written by a PhD student at Columbia University about her experience pursuing a rape charge against Mahmood Farooqui in the Indian judicial system. I think it is relevant for Indologists, especially for sending students to conduct research abroad, dealing with our own instances of sexual misconduct in the field, and thinking about gender and power dynamics. >> >> >> >> https://scroll.in/article/876788/healing-myself-a-woman-recounts-her-struggles-after-a-court-acquitted-the-man-she-accused-of-rape >> >> >> Audrey >> >> >> >> Audrey Truschke >> >> Assistant Professor >> >> Department of History >> Rutgers University-Newark >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Sat Apr 28 22:26:09 2018 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Sat, 28 Apr 18 22:26:09 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research In-Reply-To: <85C8832A-0875-499E-828A-012B893B0161@berkeley.edu> Message-ID: It is used as a Sanskrit borrowing word /tatsama in many contemporary Indian languages. dUshaNa too is equivalent of words like cherupu /cheDupu (Telugu) pADu chEyu (Telugu). On Sun, Apr 29, 2018, 2:25 AM Robert Goldman via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > And thanks to you, Madhav for this information. Of course the term > *bal?tk?ra* is well known and widely used for various forms of violence, > outrage, oppression etc. in the standard Sanskrit lexicon. But I had not > seen it used specifically for sexual violence. > > Bob > Dr. R. P. Goldman > Catherine and William L. Magistretti Distinguished Professor in South > and Southeast Asian Studies > Department of South and Southeast Asian Studies MC # 2540 > The University of California at Berkeley > Berkeley, CA 94720-2540 > Tel: 510-642-4089 > Fax: 510-642-2409 > > On Apr 28, 2018, at 12:44 PM, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > > Thanks, Bob, for bringing up these stories from R?m?ya?a. The expression > "bal?t" (forcibly) used in these narratives continues into old and modern > Marathi. The dictionary of Old Marathi by Tulpule and Feldhaus lists the > word ???????? in the sense of rape and cites passages from old Marathi > literature. The word ???????? continues to be used in modern Marathi in > this sense. From the period of Maratha history going back to the time of > Shivaji, there are instances of someone accused of rape being sentenced to > death by being thrown down from a cliff etc. So one can find references to > this issue going back into pre-modern India. > > Madhav Deshpande > Campbell, California > > On Sat, Apr 28, 2018 at 11:33 AM, Robert Goldman via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > >> Dear Colleagues, >> >> Regarding Professor Slaje?s comments concerning conceptions of what >> constitutes rape in premodern India and in the legal codes of most modern >> countries, it is of course true that different cultures have different >> notions of what constitutes consent and what the consequences of forcible >> and other forms of non-consensual sex should be. >> >> Nonetheless, *Manusm?ti* and other such texts aside there is, indeed, >> unambiguous evidence that ancient India was fully aware of the concept of >> forcible rape as a crime deserving of punishment. In substantiation of >> this I would refer you to three quite unambiguous cases of rape narrated in >> the *Uttarak???a *of the* V?lm?ki R?m?ya?a *(critical edition). These >> are found in *sargas* 26, 30, and 71?72 respectively. >> >> In the first, the *r?k?asa* king R?va?a, after being rebuffed in his >> effort to seduce the apsaras Rambh?, seizes her violently and rapes her (*pratig?hya >> bal?t . . . maithun?yopacakrame*). In her disheveled and terrified >> state she reports the rape to her lover, Nalak?vara, telling him explicitly >> that she had been violently sexually assaulted (*bal?t . . . dhar?it?*). >> After confirming the truth of her allegation through meditation (!) >> Nalak?vara curses R?va?a in a rage, so that he would die should he ever >> again have sex with a woman against her will. It is this curse that robs >> the *r?k?asa* of his desire for non consensual sex and, more >> importantly, serves to spare S?t? from being raped by him when he has her >> in captivity. >> >> The second case is particularly interesting as it purports to provide an >> origin myth for the phenomenon of rape itself. This is the poem?s second >> account of the sexual encounter between Indra and Ahaly?, the wife of the >> sage Gautama. Unlike the first account in the *B?lak???a*, where Indra >> impersonates Gautama to seduce the apparently not unwilling Ahaly?, the >> *Uttarak???a?s* version involves an unambiguous rape. Angered that >> Ahaly?, the first truly beautiful woman created by Praj?pati, has been >> given by the Creator to the sage, the god goes to Gautama?s ashram and >> rapes Ahaly?. She is twice described in the chapter as *dhar?it?*, >> raped. As punishment for this grievous crime (*adharma? subalav?n*) the >> sage curses Indra to suffer three consequences. The first is that he will >> be captured by his enemies (Indrajit). The second is that he will lose, in >> effect, tenure as permanent king of the gods. The third is that, as Indra >> has, according to this account, actually established the phenomenon of rape >> among men and unleashed it upon the world, he will, from that time forward, >> suffer one half of the guilt of ever rape committed, the other half going >> to the perpetrator. This version, like the one in the *B?lak???a* also >> includes an example ofthe familiar practice of blaming the victim as the >> innocent Ahaly?, regarded as unfaithful by her husband, is cursed to >> remain invisible in her husband?s ashram (as in *B?la*) and also to lose >> her status as the world?s only beautiful person. >> >> The third and final case of rape reported in the *Uttara*, is that of >> the virgin Araj?, daughter of the sage U?anas K?vya. She is raped by the >> idiot king Da??a, a disciple of her father. When he attempts to seduce he, >> she urges him to duly request her hand from U?anas. Despite the girl?s >> warnings of the dire consequences, he seizes her and violently rapes her (*maithun?yopacakrame) >> *despite her efforts to resist (*visphurant?m*)*. *When the sage returns >> and learns what has happened, he curses the king for committing such a >> heinous crime (*p?pam ?d??a? ghoradar?anam*). Da??a's punishment is far >> more severe than that suffered by R?va?a and Indra, U?anas? retribution is >> a form of collective punishment, destroying not only the perpetrator of the >> crime but his entire kingdom, which is reduced by a mighty dust storm to a >> desolate wasteland. It becomes, in fact, the eponymous Da??ak?ra?ya and >> the small, habitable area of the Janasth?na which figure so prominently in >> the R?m?yana?s narrative. In this story, as in that of Ahaly?, the rape >> victim, too, is punished. She is similarly confined to the ashram to >> engage in meditation. >> >> None of these episodes is written off as a normal seduction or sexual >> encounter and, particularly in the case of the rape of the unmarried >> Araj?, show no tendency to subject the victim to a marriage with their >> rapist. >> >> All three of these epilogic narratives serve to explain features of the >> earlier epic narrative, but they also demonstrate quite clearly, that the >> author or authors of the *Uttarak???a*, were fully aware of the >> phenomenon of forcible rape as a severe violation in much the way that we, >> in modernity, understand it. The Indra-Ahaly? episode, in fact, addresses >> rape as a continuing social problem and as a crime that incurs guilt both >> for the rapist and the originator of the phenomenon. >> >> I must agree with Professor Slaje that the phenomenon of rape in early >> India deserves further investigation. For those interested in this I would >> suggest reading the recent introduction, translation and annotation of the >> *Uttarak???a* by my colleague, Dr. Sally Sutherland Goldman and myself >> (Princeton University Press 2017) and Dr. Sutherland Goldman?s article now >> in press: >> >> "Against Their Will : Sexual Assault in the *Uttarak???a*? Studies in >> History 34(2) 1?18 ? 2018 Jawaharlal Nehru University. Delhi: SAGE >> Publications >> sagepub.in/home.nav >> DOI: 10.1177/0257643018772405 >> http://journals.sagepub.com/home/sih >> >> Best wishes to you all. >> >> >> Dr. R. P. Goldman >> Catherine and William L. Magistretti Distinguished Professor in South >> and Southeast Asian Studies >> Department of South and Southeast Asian Studies MC # 2540 >> The University of California at Berkeley >> Berkeley, CA 94720-2540 >> Tel: 510-642-4089 >> Fax: 510-642-2409 >> >> On Apr 27, 2018, at 10:23 AM, Herman Tull via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >> >> Speaking for myself, I was grateful for Audrey Truschke's link. Teaching >> at a small liberal arts college, I have many students ask about study and >> travel in India. Articles such as this are far more useful than the >> reflections I can offer on my own student experiences, as a male, 40 years >> ago in South India. >> >> Audrey's note suggested this was not sent for discussion, but simply as a >> point of reference. >> >> Herman Tull >> >> On Fri, Apr 27, 2018, 12:50 PM Camillo Formigatti via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >> >>> Dear colleagues, >>> >>> >>> >>> If I may put my two cents in, although I am personally very interested >>> in politics and latest news, I thought that this is a scholarly forum, not >>> political or of social critique, so I do not see the point in discussing >>> this terrible event here. I do understand that issues of power and gender >>> influence the entirety of our lives, we experience them every day at home, >>> at work, basically everywhere. I have my own personal opinion about gender >>> inequality as well as many other political and social topics (including the >>> case discussed in this thread), as I?m sure all of us have. >>> >>> >>> >>> Please forgive me if I sound a bit na?ve or maybe not engaged enough. I >>> am well aware that academia too is political, yet I really think that this >>> is not the right forum to discuss this kind of topic. >>> >>> >>> >>> Best wishes, >>> >>> >>> >>> Camillo >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> >>> >>> Dr Camillo A. Formigatti >>> >>> John Clay Sanskrit Librarian >>> >>> >>> >>> Bodleian Libraries >>> >>> The Weston Library >>> >>> Broad Street, Oxford >>> >>> OX1 3BG >>> >>> >>> >>> Email: camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk >>> >>> Tel. (office): 01865 (2)77208 >>> www.bodleian.ox.ac.uk >>> >>> >>> >>> *GROW YOUR MIND* >>> >>> in Oxford University?s >>> >>> Gardens, Libraries and Museums >>> >>> www.mindgrowing.org >>> >>> >>> >>> *From:* Walter Slaje [mailto:slaje at kabelmail.de] >>> *Sent:* 27 April 2018 08:33 >>> *To:* indology at list.indology.info >>> *Subject:* Re: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting >>> Research >>> >>> >>> >>> There is also this: >>> >>> >>> https://www.ndtv.com/opinion/mahmood-farooqui-and-his-acquittal-in-rape-case-1803070 >>> >>> And this: >>> >>> >>> https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/mahmood-farooqui-rape-acquittal-extremely-well-decided-says-supreme-court-dismissing-appeal-against-earlier-verdict/articleshow/62566322.cms >>> >>> The Mah?tm? moreover stated: >>> >>> ?I have always held that it is physically impossible to violate a woman >>> against her will. [ . . . ] If she cannot meet the assailant's physical >>> might, her purity will give her the strength to die before he succeeds in >>> violating her. [ . . . ] I know that women are capable of throwing away >>> their lives for a much lesser purpose. Only a few days ago a young girl of >>> twenty burnt herself to death as she felt she was being persecuted for >>> refusing to go in for ordinary studies. And she perished with such cool >>> courage and determination. She ignited her sari with an ordinary oil-light >>> and did not so much as raise a cry, so that the people in the neighbouring >>> room were unaware of the happening until all was over.? *Harijan*, >>> 25-8-1940 and 1-9-1940. >>> >>> (Quoted from M. K. GANDHI, The Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi >>> (Electronic Book). 98 volumes. New Delhi: Publications Division Government >>> of India 1999. [http://www.gandhiserve.org/ cwmg/ >>> cwmg.html] 79, Nr. 130: 126 f). >>> >>> >>> >>> Modern American and traditional Indian notions of rape, honour, consent >>> and ?sexual interaction? (e.g., the exchange of kisses can count as such) >>> seem to differ widely. >>> >>> >>> >>> It is well known that ?secret intercourse with a woman who is asleep, >>> drunk, or mentally deranged? is categorized as a form of ?marriage? in >>> ancient Indian law books. >>> >>> Manu (3.34) uses ?*upa-gam*? ? *inire feminam* (pw) / to approach a >>> woman sexually (MW) ? for the consummation of ?marriage?. *upa-gam* is >>> a common verb for ?having sex? in a general sense. >>> >>> >>> >>> In the given context, recent English translations use however ?to rape? >>> as an equivalent (see Olivelle 2005, p. 110). Interpretations follow suit: >>> ?Tantamount to rape? (Jamison in Olivelle & Davis (ed.), Hindu Law 2017, p. >>> 130). >>> >>> >>> >>> Unless supported by unambiguous evidence, such readings should be >>> treated as notionally anachronistic interpretations reflexively projected >>> onto ancient India. What appears to be ?rape?, or to be ?tantamount to >>> rape?, in the eyes of 21st century Western Indologists, does not >>> necessarily represent the viewpoint of a (pre)modern Indian society. >>> >>> >>> >>> With regard to its connotation, Doniger (1991: 46) and Michaels (2010: >>> 49) offer neutral and therefore more faithful translations of *upa-gam*: >>> ?to have sex with? and ?Beischlaf?. >>> >>> >>> >>> Actually, we are in dire need of a substantial investigation into the >>> history of the notions of ?rape? as they prevailed in premodern India. This >>> will help to understand and assess their (dis)continuation also in the >>> thinking of today. >>> >>> >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> WS >>> >>> >>> >>> ----------------------------- >>> Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje >>> Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 >>> D-99425 Weimar >>> Deutschland >>> >>> >>> >>> 2018-04-26 15:27 GMT+02:00 Audrey Truschke via INDOLOGY < >>> indology at list.indology.info>: >>> >>> Dear Colleagues, >>> >>> >>> >>> I would like to share this insightful, brave piece written by a PhD >>> student at Columbia University about her experience pursuing a rape charge >>> against Mahmood Farooqui in the Indian judicial system. I think it is >>> relevant for Indologists, especially for sending students to conduct >>> research abroad, dealing with our own instances of sexual misconduct in the >>> field, and thinking about gender and power dynamics. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> https://scroll.in/article/876788/healing-myself-a-woman-recounts-her-struggles-after-a-court-acquitted-the-man-she-accused-of-rape >>> >>> >>> >>> Audrey >>> >>> >>> Audrey Truschke >>> >>> Assistant Professor >>> >>> Department of History >>> Rutgers University-Newark >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Sat Apr 28 23:11:44 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sat, 28 Apr 18 16:11:44 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research In-Reply-To: <85C8832A-0875-499E-828A-012B893B0161@berkeley.edu> Message-ID: Especially in modern Marathi, the term bal?tk?ra exclusively refers to rape. Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California On Sat, Apr 28, 2018 at 1:54 PM, Robert Goldman wrote: > And thanks to you, Madhav for this information. Of course the term > *bal?tk?ra* is well known and widely used for various forms of violence, > outrage, oppression etc. in the standard Sanskrit lexicon. But I had not > seen it used specifically for sexual violence. > > Bob > Dr. R. P. Goldman > Catherine and William L. Magistretti Distinguished Professor in South > and Southeast Asian Studies > Department of South and Southeast Asian Studies MC # 2540 > The University of California at Berkeley > Berkeley, CA 94720-2540 > Tel: 510-642-4089 > Fax: 510-642-2409 > > On Apr 28, 2018, at 12:44 PM, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > > Thanks, Bob, for bringing up these stories from R?m?ya?a. The expression > "bal?t" (forcibly) used in these narratives continues into old and modern > Marathi. The dictionary of Old Marathi by Tulpule and Feldhaus lists the > word ???????? in the sense of rape and cites passages from old Marathi > literature. The word ???????? continues to be used in modern Marathi in > this sense. From the period of Maratha history going back to the time of > Shivaji, there are instances of someone accused of rape being sentenced to > death by being thrown down from a cliff etc. So one can find references to > this issue going back into pre-modern India. > > Madhav Deshpande > Campbell, California > > On Sat, Apr 28, 2018 at 11:33 AM, Robert Goldman via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > >> Dear Colleagues, >> >> Regarding Professor Slaje?s comments concerning conceptions of what >> constitutes rape in premodern India and in the legal codes of most modern >> countries, it is of course true that different cultures have different >> notions of what constitutes consent and what the consequences of forcible >> and other forms of non-consensual sex should be. >> >> Nonetheless, *Manusm?ti* and other such texts aside there is, indeed, >> unambiguous evidence that ancient India was fully aware of the concept of >> forcible rape as a crime deserving of punishment. In substantiation of >> this I would refer you to three quite unambiguous cases of rape narrated in >> the *Uttarak???a *of the* V?lm?ki R?m?ya?a *(critical edition). These >> are found in *sargas* 26, 30, and 71?72 respectively. >> >> In the first, the *r?k?asa* king R?va?a, after being rebuffed in his >> effort to seduce the apsaras Rambh?, seizes her violently and rapes her (*pratig?hya >> bal?t . . . maithun?yopacakrame*). In her disheveled and terrified >> state she reports the rape to her lover, Nalak?vara, telling him explicitly >> that she had been violently sexually assaulted (*bal?t . . . dhar?it?*). >> After confirming the truth of her allegation through meditation (!) >> Nalak?vara curses R?va?a in a rage, so that he would die should he ever >> again have sex with a woman against her will. It is this curse that robs >> the *r?k?asa* of his desire for non consensual sex and, more >> importantly, serves to spare S?t? from being raped by him when he has her >> in captivity. >> >> The second case is particularly interesting as it purports to provide an >> origin myth for the phenomenon of rape itself. This is the poem?s second >> account of the sexual encounter between Indra and Ahaly?, the wife of the >> sage Gautama. Unlike the first account in the *B?lak???a*, where Indra >> impersonates Gautama to seduce the apparently not unwilling Ahaly?, the >> *Uttarak???a?s* version involves an unambiguous rape. Angered that >> Ahaly?, the first truly beautiful woman created by Praj?pati, has been >> given by the Creator to the sage, the god goes to Gautama?s ashram and >> rapes Ahaly?. She is twice described in the chapter as *dhar?it?*, >> raped. As punishment for this grievous crime (*adharma? subalav?n*) the >> sage curses Indra to suffer three consequences. The first is that he will >> be captured by his enemies (Indrajit). The second is that he will lose, in >> effect, tenure as permanent king of the gods. The third is that, as Indra >> has, according to this account, actually established the phenomenon of rape >> among men and unleashed it upon the world, he will, from that time forward, >> suffer one half of the guilt of ever rape committed, the other half going >> to the perpetrator. This version, like the one in the *B?lak???a* also >> includes an example ofthe familiar practice of blaming the victim as the >> innocent Ahaly?, regarded as unfaithful by her husband, is cursed to >> remain invisible in her husband?s ashram (as in *B?la*) and also to lose >> her status as the world?s only beautiful person. >> >> The third and final case of rape reported in the *Uttara*, is that of >> the virgin Araj?, daughter of the sage U?anas K?vya. She is raped by the >> idiot king Da??a, a disciple of her father. When he attempts to seduce he, >> she urges him to duly request her hand from U?anas. Despite the girl?s >> warnings of the dire consequences, he seizes her and violently rapes her (*maithun?yopacakrame) >> *despite her efforts to resist (*visphurant?m*)*. *When the sage returns >> and learns what has happened, he curses the king for committing such a >> heinous crime (*p?pam ?d??a? ghoradar?anam*). Da??a's punishment is far >> more severe than that suffered by R?va?a and Indra, U?anas? retribution is >> a form of collective punishment, destroying not only the perpetrator of the >> crime but his entire kingdom, which is reduced by a mighty dust storm to a >> desolate wasteland. It becomes, in fact, the eponymous Da??ak?ra?ya and >> the small, habitable area of the Janasth?na which figure so prominently in >> the R?m?yana?s narrative. In this story, as in that of Ahaly?, the rape >> victim, too, is punished. She is similarly confined to the ashram to >> engage in meditation. >> >> None of these episodes is written off as a normal seduction or sexual >> encounter and, particularly in the case of the rape of the unmarried >> Araj?, show no tendency to subject the victim to a marriage with their >> rapist. >> >> All three of these epilogic narratives serve to explain features of the >> earlier epic narrative, but they also demonstrate quite clearly, that the >> author or authors of the *Uttarak???a*, were fully aware of the >> phenomenon of forcible rape as a severe violation in much the way that we, >> in modernity, understand it. The Indra-Ahaly? episode, in fact, addresses >> rape as a continuing social problem and as a crime that incurs guilt both >> for the rapist and the originator of the phenomenon. >> >> I must agree with Professor Slaje that the phenomenon of rape in early >> India deserves further investigation. For those interested in this I would >> suggest reading the recent introduction, translation and annotation of the >> *Uttarak???a* by my colleague, Dr. Sally Sutherland Goldman and myself >> (Princeton University Press 2017) and Dr. Sutherland Goldman?s article now >> in press: >> >> "Against Their Will : Sexual Assault in the *Uttarak???a*? Studies in >> History 34(2) 1?18 ? 2018 Jawaharlal Nehru University. Delhi: SAGE >> Publications >> sagepub.in/home.nav >> DOI: 10.1177/0257643018772405 >> http://journals.sagepub.com/home/sih >> >> Best wishes to you all. >> >> >> Dr. R. P. Goldman >> Catherine and William L. Magistretti Distinguished Professor in South >> and Southeast Asian Studies >> Department of South and Southeast Asian Studies MC # 2540 >> The University of California at Berkeley >> Berkeley, CA 94720-2540 >> Tel: 510-642-4089 >> Fax: 510-642-2409 >> >> On Apr 27, 2018, at 10:23 AM, Herman Tull via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >> >> Speaking for myself, I was grateful for Audrey Truschke's link. Teaching >> at a small liberal arts college, I have many students ask about study and >> travel in India. Articles such as this are far more useful than the >> reflections I can offer on my own student experiences, as a male, 40 years >> ago in South India. >> >> Audrey's note suggested this was not sent for discussion, but simply as a >> point of reference. >> >> Herman Tull >> >> On Fri, Apr 27, 2018, 12:50 PM Camillo Formigatti via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info> wrote: >> >>> Dear colleagues, >>> >>> >>> >>> If I may put my two cents in, although I am personally very interested >>> in politics and latest news, I thought that this is a scholarly forum, not >>> political or of social critique, so I do not see the point in discussing >>> this terrible event here. I do understand that issues of power and gender >>> influence the entirety of our lives, we experience them every day at home, >>> at work, basically everywhere. I have my own personal opinion about gender >>> inequality as well as many other political and social topics (including the >>> case discussed in this thread), as I?m sure all of us have. >>> >>> >>> >>> Please forgive me if I sound a bit na?ve or maybe not engaged enough. I >>> am well aware that academia too is political, yet I really think that this >>> is not the right forum to discuss this kind of topic. >>> >>> >>> >>> Best wishes, >>> >>> >>> >>> Camillo >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> >>> >>> Dr Camillo A. Formigatti >>> >>> John Clay Sanskrit Librarian >>> >>> >>> >>> Bodleian Libraries >>> >>> The Weston Library >>> >>> Broad Street, Oxford >>> >>> OX1 3BG >>> >>> >>> >>> Email: camillo.formigatti at bodleian.ox.ac.uk >>> >>> Tel. (office): 01865 (2)77208 >>> www.bodleian.ox.ac.uk >>> >>> >>> >>> *GROW YOUR MIND* >>> >>> in Oxford University?s >>> >>> Gardens, Libraries and Museums >>> >>> www.mindgrowing.org >>> >>> >>> >>> *From:* Walter Slaje [mailto:slaje at kabelmail.de] >>> *Sent:* 27 April 2018 08:33 >>> *To:* indology at list.indology.info >>> *Subject:* Re: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting >>> Research >>> >>> >>> >>> There is also this: >>> >>> https://www.ndtv.com/opinion/mahmood-farooqui-and-his-acquit >>> tal-in-rape-case-1803070 >>> >>> And this: >>> >>> https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/mahmood-farooqui- >>> rape-acquittal-extremely-well-decided-says-supreme-court- >>> dismissing-appeal-against-earlier-verdict/articleshow/62566322.cms >>> >>> The Mah?tm? moreover stated: >>> >>> ?I have always held that it is physically impossible to violate a woman >>> against her will. [ . . . ] If she cannot meet the assailant's physical >>> might, her purity will give her the strength to die before he succeeds in >>> violating her. [ . . . ] I know that women are capable of throwing away >>> their lives for a much lesser purpose. Only a few days ago a young girl of >>> twenty burnt herself to death as she felt she was being persecuted for >>> refusing to go in for ordinary studies. And she perished with such cool >>> courage and determination. She ignited her sari with an ordinary oil-light >>> and did not so much as raise a cry, so that the people in the neighbouring >>> room were unaware of the happening until all was over.? *Harijan*, >>> 25-8-1940 and 1-9-1940. >>> >>> (Quoted from M. K. GANDHI, The Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi >>> (Electronic Book). 98 volumes. New Delhi: Publications Division Government >>> of India 1999. [http://www.gandhiserve.org/ cwmg/ >>> cwmg.html] 79, Nr. 130: 126 f). >>> >>> >>> >>> Modern American and traditional Indian notions of rape, honour, consent >>> and ?sexual interaction? (e.g., the exchange of kisses can count as such) >>> seem to differ widely. >>> >>> >>> >>> It is well known that ?secret intercourse with a woman who is asleep, >>> drunk, or mentally deranged? is categorized as a form of ?marriage? in >>> ancient Indian law books. >>> >>> Manu (3.34) uses ?*upa-gam*? ? *inire feminam* (pw) / to approach a >>> woman sexually (MW) ? for the consummation of ?marriage?. *upa-gam* is >>> a common verb for ?having sex? in a general sense. >>> >>> >>> >>> In the given context, recent English translations use however ?to rape? >>> as an equivalent (see Olivelle 2005, p. 110). Interpretations follow suit: >>> ?Tantamount to rape? (Jamison in Olivelle & Davis (ed.), Hindu Law 2017, p. >>> 130). >>> >>> >>> >>> Unless supported by unambiguous evidence, such readings should be >>> treated as notionally anachronistic interpretations reflexively projected >>> onto ancient India. What appears to be ?rape?, or to be ?tantamount to >>> rape?, in the eyes of 21st century Western Indologists, does not >>> necessarily represent the viewpoint of a (pre)modern Indian society. >>> >>> >>> >>> With regard to its connotation, Doniger (1991: 46) and Michaels (2010: >>> 49) offer neutral and therefore more faithful translations of *upa-gam*: >>> ?to have sex with? and ?Beischlaf?. >>> >>> >>> >>> Actually, we are in dire need of a substantial investigation into the >>> history of the notions of ?rape? as they prevailed in premodern India. This >>> will help to understand and assess their (dis)continuation also in the >>> thinking of today. >>> >>> >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> WS >>> >>> >>> >>> ----------------------------- >>> Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje >>> Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 >>> D-99425 Weimar >>> Deutschland >>> >>> >>> >>> 2018-04-26 15:27 GMT+02:00 Audrey Truschke via INDOLOGY < >>> indology at list.indology.info>: >>> >>> Dear Colleagues, >>> >>> >>> >>> I would like to share this insightful, brave piece written by a PhD >>> student at Columbia University about her experience pursuing a rape charge >>> against Mahmood Farooqui in the Indian judicial system. I think it is >>> relevant for Indologists, especially for sending students to conduct >>> research abroad, dealing with our own instances of sexual misconduct in the >>> field, and thinking about gender and power dynamics. >>> >>> >>> >>> https://scroll.in/article/876788/healing-myself-a-woman-reco >>> unts-her-struggles-after-a-court-acquitted-the-man-she-accused-of-rape >>> >>> >>> >>> Audrey >>> >>> >>> Audrey Truschke >>> >>> Assistant Professor >>> >>> Department of History >>> Rutgers University-Newark >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Sun Apr 29 03:10:19 2018 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Sun, 29 Apr 18 08:40:19 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I think Prof. Slaje's It is well known that ?secret intercourse with a woman who is asleep, drunk, or mentally deranged? is categorized as a form of ?marriage? in ancient Indian law books. Manu (3.34) uses ?*upa-gam*? ? *inire feminam* (pw) / to approach a woman sexually (MW) ? for the consummation of ?marriage?. *upa-gam* is a common verb for ?having sex? in a general sense. is a reference to pai??cha as a viv?ha. Attention may be paid to the name of the viv?ha . pi??cha --> pai??cha Each of the viv?has is described as found among a certain community. Does anyone have info on which community is described as following pai??cha as a viv?ha? On Fri, Apr 27, 2018 at 1:02 PM, Walter Slaje via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > There is also this: > > https://www.ndtv.com/opinion/mahmood-farooqui-and-his- > acquittal-in-rape-case-1803070 > > And this: > > https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/mahmood-farooqui-rape-acquittal- > extremely-well-decided-says-supreme-court-dismissing- > appeal-against-earlier-verdict/articleshow/62566322.cms > > The Mah?tm? moreover stated: > > ?I have always held that it is physically impossible to violate a woman > against her will. [ . . . ] If she cannot meet the assailant's physical > might, her purity will give her the strength to die before he succeeds in > violating her. [ . . . ] I know that women are capable of throwing away > their lives for a much lesser purpose. Only a few days ago a young girl > of twenty burnt herself to death as she felt she was being persecuted for > refusing to go in for ordinary studies. And she perished with such cool > courage and determination. She ignited her sari with an ordinary oil-light > and did not so much as raise a cry, so that the people in the neighbouring > room were unaware of the happening until all was over.? *Harijan*, 25-8-1940 > and 1-9-1940. > > (Quoted from M. K. GANDHI, The Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi > (Electronic Book). 98 volumes. New Delhi: Publications Division Government > of India 1999. [http://www.gandhiserve.org/ cwmg/ > cwmg.html] 79, Nr. 130: 126 f). > > > > Modern American and traditional Indian notions of rape, honour, consent > and ?sexual interaction? (e.g., the exchange of kisses can count as such) > seem to differ widely. > > > > It is well known that ?secret intercourse with a woman who is asleep, > drunk, or mentally deranged? is categorized as a form of ?marriage? in > ancient Indian law books. > > Manu (3.34) uses ?*upa-gam*? ? *inire feminam* (pw) / to approach a woman > sexually (MW) ? for the consummation of ?marriage?. *upa-gam* is a common > verb for ?having sex? in a general sense. > > > > In the given context, recent English translations use however ?to rape? as > an equivalent (see Olivelle 2005, p. 110). Interpretations follow suit: > ?Tantamount to rape? (Jamison in Olivelle & Davis (ed.), Hindu Law 2017, p. > 130). > > > > Unless supported by unambiguous evidence, such readings should be treated > as notionally anachronistic interpretations reflexively projected onto > ancient India. What appears to be ?rape?, or to be ?tantamount to rape?, in > the eyes of 21st century Western Indologists, does not necessarily > represent the viewpoint of a (pre)modern Indian society. > > > > With regard to its connotation, Doniger (1991: 46) and Michaels (2010: 49) > offer neutral and therefore more faithful translations of *upa-gam*: ?to > have sex with? and ?Beischlaf?. > > > > Actually, we are in dire need of a substantial investigation into the > history of the notions of ?rape? as they prevailed in premodern India. This > will help to understand and assess their (dis)continuation also in the > thinking of today. > > > > Best, > > WS > > ----------------------------- > Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje > Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 > D-99425 Weimar > Deutschland > > > > 2018-04-26 15:27 GMT+02:00 Audrey Truschke via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info>: > >> Dear Colleagues, >> >> I would like to share this insightful, brave piece written by a PhD >> student at Columbia University about her experience pursuing a rape charge >> against Mahmood Farooqui in the Indian judicial system. I think it is >> relevant for Indologists, especially for sending students to conduct >> research abroad, dealing with our own instances of sexual misconduct in the >> field, and thinking about gender and power dynamics. >> >> https://scroll.in/article/876788/healing-myself-a-woman-reco >> unts-her-struggles-after-a-court-acquitted-the-man-she-accused-of-rape >> >> Audrey >> >> Audrey Truschke >> Assistant Professor >> Department of History >> Rutgers University-Newark >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Sun Apr 29 04:20:24 2018 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Sun, 29 Apr 18 09:50:24 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Gender, Power, and Rape when Conducting Research In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I found the following English translation: >From Manusmrti (Laws of Manu) Chapter III 20. Now listen to the brief description of the following eight marriage-rites used by the four castes (varna) which partly secure benefits and partly produce evil both in this life and after death. 21. They are the rite of Brahmana (Brahma), that of the gods (Daiva), that of the Rishis (Arsha), that of Prajapati (Prajapatya), that of the Asuras (Asura), that of the Gandharvas (Gandharva), that of the Rakshasas (Rakshasa), and that of the Pisakas (Paisaka). 22. Which is lawful for each caste (varna) and which are the virtues or faults of each (rite), all this I will declare to you, as well as their good and evil results with respect to the offspring. 23.One may know that the first six according to the order (followed above) are lawful for a Brahmana, the four last for a Kshatriya, and the same four, excepting the Rakshasa rite, for a Vaisya and a Sudra. 24. The sages state that the first four are approved (in the case) of a Brahmana, one, the Rakshasa rite in the case of a Kshatriya, and the Asura (marriage in that) of a Vaisya and of a Sudra. 25. But in these institutes of the sacred law, three of the five (last) are declared to be lawful and two unlawful; *the Paisaka and the Asura rites must never be used.* 26. For Kshatriyas those before mentioned two rites, the Gandharva and the Rakshasa, whether separate or mixed, are permitted by the sacred tradition. On Sun, Apr 29, 2018 at 8:40 AM, Nagaraj Paturi wrote: > I think Prof. Slaje's > > It is well known that ?secret intercourse with a woman who is asleep, > drunk, or mentally deranged? is categorized as a form of ?marriage? in > ancient Indian law books. > > Manu (3.34) uses ?*upa-gam*? ? *inire feminam* (pw) / to approach a woman > sexually (MW) ? for the consummation of ?marriage?. *upa-gam* is a common > verb for ?having sex? in a general sense. > > > is a reference to pai??cha as a viv?ha. > > Attention may be paid to the name of the viv?ha . pi??cha --> pai??cha > > Each of the viv?has is described as found among a certain community. > > Does anyone have info on which community is described as following pai??cha > as a viv?ha? > > > > > On Fri, Apr 27, 2018 at 1:02 PM, Walter Slaje via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > >> There is also this: >> >> https://www.ndtv.com/opinion/mahmood-farooqui-and-his-acquit >> tal-in-rape-case-1803070 >> >> And this: >> >> https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/mahmood-farooqui- >> rape-acquittal-extremely-well-decided-says-supreme-court- >> dismissing-appeal-against-earlier-verdict/articleshow/62566322.cms >> >> The Mah?tm? moreover stated: >> >> ?I have always held that it is physically impossible to violate a woman >> against her will. [ . . . ] If she cannot meet the assailant's physical >> might, her purity will give her the strength to die before he succeeds >> in violating her. [ . . . ] I know that women are capable of throwing >> away their lives for a much lesser purpose. Only a few days ago a young >> girl of twenty burnt herself to death as she felt she was being persecuted >> for refusing to go in for ordinary studies. And she perished with such cool >> courage and determination. She ignited her sari with an ordinary oil-light >> and did not so much as raise a cry, so that the people in the neighbouring >> room were unaware of the happening until all was over.? *Harijan*, 25-8-1940 >> and 1-9-1940. >> >> (Quoted from M. K. GANDHI, The Collected Works of Mahatma Gandhi >> (Electronic Book). 98 volumes. New Delhi: Publications Division Government >> of India 1999. [http://www.gandhiserve.org/ cwmg/ >> cwmg.html] 79, Nr. 130: 126 f). >> >> >> >> Modern American and traditional Indian notions of rape, honour, consent >> and ?sexual interaction? (e.g., the exchange of kisses can count as such) >> seem to differ widely. >> >> >> >> It is well known that ?secret intercourse with a woman who is asleep, >> drunk, or mentally deranged? is categorized as a form of ?marriage? in >> ancient Indian law books. >> >> Manu (3.34) uses ?*upa-gam*? ? *inire feminam* (pw) / to approach a >> woman sexually (MW) ? for the consummation of ?marriage?. *upa-gam* is a >> common verb for ?having sex? in a general sense. >> >> >> >> In the given context, recent English translations use however ?to rape? >> as an equivalent (see Olivelle 2005, p. 110). Interpretations follow suit: >> ?Tantamount to rape? (Jamison in Olivelle & Davis (ed.), Hindu Law 2017, p. >> 130). >> >> >> >> Unless supported by unambiguous evidence, such readings should be treated >> as notionally anachronistic interpretations reflexively projected onto >> ancient India. What appears to be ?rape?, or to be ?tantamount to rape?, in >> the eyes of 21st century Western Indologists, does not necessarily >> represent the viewpoint of a (pre)modern Indian society. >> >> >> >> With regard to its connotation, Doniger (1991: 46) and Michaels (2010: >> 49) offer neutral and therefore more faithful translations of *upa-gam*: >> ?to have sex with? and ?Beischlaf?. >> >> >> >> Actually, we are in dire need of a substantial investigation into the >> history of the notions of ?rape? as they prevailed in premodern India. This >> will help to understand and assess their (dis)continuation also in the >> thinking of today. >> >> >> >> Best, >> >> WS >> >> ----------------------------- >> Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje >> Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 >> D-99425 Weimar >> Deutschland >> >> >> >> 2018-04-26 15:27 GMT+02:00 Audrey Truschke via INDOLOGY < >> indology at list.indology.info>: >> >>> Dear Colleagues, >>> >>> I would like to share this insightful, brave piece written by a PhD >>> student at Columbia University about her experience pursuing a rape charge >>> against Mahmood Farooqui in the Indian judicial system. I think it is >>> relevant for Indologists, especially for sending students to conduct >>> research abroad, dealing with our own instances of sexual misconduct in the >>> field, and thinking about gender and power dynamics. >>> >>> https://scroll.in/article/876788/healing-myself-a-woman-reco >>> unts-her-struggles-after-a-court-acquitted-the-man-she-accused-of-rape >>> >>> Audrey >>> >>> Audrey Truschke >>> Assistant Professor >>> Department of History >>> Rutgers University-Newark >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > > -- > Nagaraj Paturi > > Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. > > > BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra > > BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala > > Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies > > FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, > > (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) > > > > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. BoS, MIT School of Vedic Sciences, Pune, Maharashtra BoS, Chinmaya Vishwavidyapeeth, Veliyanad, Kerala Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aparpola at gmail.com Sun Apr 29 06:46:57 2018 From: aparpola at gmail.com (Asko Parpola) Date: Sun, 29 Apr 18 09:46:57 +0300 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Etymology of mukura / makura In-Reply-To: <9D070C0D-77B0-43FF-A8DB-E1DC4F4B81F9@hum.ku.dk> Message-ID: Dear Toke, It seems possible that Sanskrit makura- 'mirror' is a Dravidian loanword, derived from the root *maku*l*- 'to turn round, be turned upside down, return, turn back' (DEDR 4617), cf. Tulu magu?u, maga?u, mag?u 'next, following; again, once more'; magu?-uttaro 'reply', and magu?udani 'echo'; maguru mu??uni 'to crop up again, to oppose, counteract; Telugu magu?a, magi?i 'again, anew, back, in return'. Of course one would like to get a better confirmation than Tamil makuram 'mirror', which can come from Sanskrit. On Thu, Apr 26, 2018 at 11:05 AM, Toke Lindegaard Knudsen via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Hi all, > > The two Sanskrit words mukura and makura both mean ?mirror.? I?m trying to > understand their etymology. > > Other meanings given in MW are ?the stick or handle of a potter's wheel? > and ?a bud, blossom.? Turner?s _A Comparative Dictionary of the Indo-Aryan > Languages_ connects the words to mukula and bakula, meaning ?bud? and ?the > tree Mimusops elengi,? respectively. Burrow and Emeneau?s _Dravidian > Etymological Dictionary_ (entry 4619), also connects the two words with > Mimusops elengi. > > How did mukura and makura come to mean ?mirror? in Sanskrit? > > Many thanks in advance. > > All best wishes, > Toke > > ----- > Toke Lindegaard Knudsen, Ph.D. > > Associate Professor and Marie Sk?odowska-Curie Fellow > Department of Cross-Cultural and Regional Studies > University of Copenhagen > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) -- Asko Parpola, aparpola at gmail.com http://www.helsinki.academia.edu/AskoParpola -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Sun Apr 29 14:21:19 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sun, 29 Apr 18 07:21:19 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Krishna verses this morning Message-ID: Dear friends, here are my Krishna verses this morning: ??????????????? ??????? ?? ???????? ? ????????????????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ?? Mandara tree for the people offering obeisance to you, O Mukunda, by offering my obeisance to you, I attain a wonderful abode of infinite joy. ?????????? ??????? ?????? ??????????? ? ???????? ?? ????????? ???????? ????? ???? ?? Though uninvited, O Govinda, you are a great thief who every moment opens the door to my mind and enters without fear. ?????????? ????? ????? ???????? ??? ?? ? ???????????? ????????? ????????? ????? ???? ?? No one allows you not stops you. Unseen while arriving, how did you enter my heart? ?????? ????? ????????????? ?? ????? ???? ? ????????????? ??????????? ???????? ????????? ?? O M?dhava, the thief is hidden in my heart. Where shall I find him? Even though expelled from the heart, he refuses to leave. ???? ????? ??????? ?? ?? ??????? ????????? ? ???????? ???? ???? ??, ????????? ????? ???? ?? Or, just stay where you are, and don't go anywhere else. You have robbed me of everything, now don't rob anyone else. ?????? ???????? ???? ???????? ????? ??? ? ???????????????? ???: ?????? ? ?? ?????? ?? Whatever you robbed of me, I just give it to you. Yet you want more. There is nothing left with me. ????? ?? ??????? ?????? ?? ????? ? ????? ?? ????????? ????????????????? ?? This great thief, Kr???a, is hidden in my mind, and the same Kr???a stands guarding at the gate of my mind. ????? ????? ???????????? ????? ?????? ?????? ? ??? ???????? ???????????????? ????? ???? ?? Whatever was given by you, you took away, and nothing belongs to me. Knowing this, I feel free and take refuge at your feet. ???? ???? ??????? ?? ?????????? ????????: ? ??????????? ??????? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ?? O M?dhava, you are such a great thief, that even the robbed praise you. Those who are not [yet] robbed beg you: ?Rob me, rob me.? ???????????? ??????? ???????? ?????? ???? ? ??? ????? ??????? ?????? ?? ??? ????????? ?? What a strange thief you are that you steal your own belongings. If all that exists is yours, what is the point of stealing? Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Sun Apr 29 14:28:53 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sun, 29 Apr 18 07:28:53 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] My Krishna verses this morning Message-ID: Here are my Krishna verses this morning: ??????????????? ??????? ?? ???????? ? ????????????????? ?????? ??????? ??????? ?? Mandara tree for the people offering obeisance to you, O Mukunda, by offering my obeisance to you, I attain a wonderful abode of infinite joy. ?????????? ??????? ?????? ??????????? ? ???????? ?? ????????? ???????? ????? ???? ?? Though uninvited, O Govinda, you are a great thief who every moment opens the door to my mind and enters without fear. ?????????? ????? ????? ???????? ??? ?? ? ???????????? ????????? ????????? ????? ???? ?? No one allows you not stops you. Unseen while arriving, how did you enter my heart? ?????? ????? ????????????? ?? ????? ???? ? ????????????? ??????????? ???????? ????????? ?? O M?dhava, the thief is hidden in my heart. Where shall I find him? Even though expelled from the heart, he refuses to leave. ???? ????? ??????? ?? ?? ??????? ????????? ? ???????? ???? ???? ??, ????????? ????? ???? ?? Or, just stay where you are, and don't go anywhere else. You have robbed me of everything, now don't rob anyone else. ?????? ???????? ???? ???????? ????? ??? ? ???????????????? ???: ?????? ? ?? ?????? ?? Whatever you robbed of me, I just give it to you. Yet you want more. There is nothing left with me. ????? ?? ??????? ?????? ?? ????? ? ????? ?? ????????? ????????????????? ?? This great thief, Kr???a, is hidden in my mind, and the same Kr???a stands guarding at the gate of my mind. ????? ????? ???????????? ????? ?????? ?????? ? ??? ???????? ???????????????? ????? ???? ?? Whatever was given by you, you took away, and nothing belongs to me. Knowing this, I feel free and take refuge at your feet. ???? ???? ??????? ?? ?????????? ????????: ? ???????????? ??????? ????? ??? ????? ?????? ?? O M?dhava, you are such a great thief, that even the robbed praise you. Those who are not [yet] robbed beg you: ?Rob me, rob me.? ???????????? ??????? ???????? ?????? ???? ? ??? ????? ??????? ?????? ?? ??? ????????? ?? What a strange thief you are that you steal your own belongings. If all that exists is yours, what is the point of stealing? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Sun Apr 29 18:23:43 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sun, 29 Apr 18 11:23:43 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Question on Sarasvati as a masculine title Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, This morning I came across this book, where the author's name is given as ?????????????????????, where the word "sarasvati" occurs with a short "i". This "sarasvat?", as well as "Bh?rat?" is added in the title of many Sannyasins. Sometimes I see the titles with a long "?", and here is an instance of a short "i". I am wondering as to what is the common practice and the grammar of that practice, especially since normally feminine expressions are being used in male titles. Any suggestions? Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hellwig7 at gmx.de Sun Apr 29 18:40:45 2018 From: hellwig7 at gmx.de (hellwig7 at gmx.de) Date: Sun, 29 Apr 18 20:40:45 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Rigveda annotation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear all, I would like to announce the release of a full annotation of the Rigveda with morphological, lexical and verb-argument information. Data are stored in a publicly accessible repository at https://git.adwmainz.net/open/rigveda Details of the annotation process are described in the LREC paper, which is stored at the upper level of the repository. Quality requirements are traditionally high in Vedic studies. So be warned: The morpho-lexical annotations **DO** contain errors. The Rigveda was the first Vedic text I processed with my tagger, which may not have been the wisest idea, given its complexity. It was analyzed book-wise in the following order: 10, 1, 2-7, 9, 8 Hopefully, error level becomes lower in the same order as well. In addition, I am constantly revising the text hymn by hymn, and future releases of the data will become better. Moreover, I did not follow Grassmann's (or PW's) analysis of the text. Therefore, lemmata such as tuvijAta, which are typically entered as one lexeme in these dictionaries, are split into tuvi+jAta (<- PPP of jan-) in my analysis, when I had the impression that they have a purely compositional reading. Nevertheless, I hope the resource can be useful for corpus-based research on this text, where large numbers may smooth away some details. Best, Oliver --- Oliver Hellwig, IVS Zurich/SFB 991, D?sseldorf From hhhock at illinois.edu Sun Apr 29 19:33:49 2018 From: hhhock at illinois.edu (Hock, Hans Henrich) Date: Sun, 29 Apr 18 19:33:49 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Question on Sarasvati as a masculine title In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Could it be analogical: yog? : yogi- = sarasvat? : X- ? > On Apr 29, 2018, at 13:25, Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY wrote: > > Dear Colleagues, > > This morning I came across this book, where the author's name is given as ?????????????????????, where the word "sarasvati" occurs with a short "i". This "sarasvat?", as well as "Bh?rat?" is added in the title of many Sannyasins. Sometimes I see the titles with a long "?", and here is an instance of a short "i". I am wondering as to what is the common practice and the grammar of that practice, especially since normally feminine expressions are being used in male titles. Any suggestions? > > > > > Madhav Deshpande > Campbell, California > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) From uskokov at uchicago.edu Sun Apr 29 19:39:05 2018 From: uskokov at uchicago.edu (Aleksandar Uskokov) Date: Sun, 29 Apr 18 19:39:05 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Question on Sarasvati as a masculine title In-Reply-To: Message-ID: It is possible that the short i is a typo, no? On Sun, Apr 29, 2018, 14:34 Hock, Hans Henrich via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > Could it be analogical: yog? : yogi- = sarasvat? : X- ? > > > > > On Apr 29, 2018, at 13:25, Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > > > > Dear Colleagues, > > > > This morning I came across this book, where the author's name is > given as ?????????????????????, where the word "sarasvati" occurs with a > short "i". This "sarasvat?", as well as "Bh?rat?" is added in the title of > many Sannyasins. Sometimes I see the titles with a long "?", and here is > an instance of a short "i". I am wondering as to what is the common > practice and the grammar of that practice, especially since normally > feminine expressions are being used in male titles. Any suggestions? > > > > > > > > > > Madhav Deshpande > > Campbell, California > > > > _______________________________________________ > > INDOLOGY mailing list > > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options > or unsubscribe) > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tubb at uchicago.edu Sun Apr 29 19:56:37 2018 From: tubb at uchicago.edu (Gary A. Tubb) Date: Sun, 29 Apr 18 19:56:37 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Question on Sarasvati as a masculine title In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <588C7EEA-6D67-4F24-BF4E-4BB982623AF9@uchicago.edu> It also might be useful to know whether Southerners are involved, since in languages such as Telugu the final vowel would be shortened even in feminine names, and perhaps this might be inadvertently carried over into a name presented in Sanskrit. > On Apr 29, 2018, at 1:23 PM, Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY wrote: > > Dear Colleagues, > > This morning I came across this book, where the author's name is given as ?????????????????????, where the word "sarasvati" occurs with a short "i". This "sarasvat?", as well as "Bh?rat?" is added in the title of many Sannyasins. Sometimes I see the titles with a long "?", and here is an instance of a short "i". I am wondering as to what is the common practice and the grammar of that practice, especially since normally feminine expressions are being used in male titles. Any suggestions? > > > > > Madhav Deshpande > Campbell, California > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) From mmdesh at umich.edu Mon Apr 30 03:00:51 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sun, 29 Apr 18 20:00:51 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] More Krishna verses Message-ID: Here are more Krishna verses of mine: ??? ????? ??????? ??? ?? ???? ????? ? ????? ?? ?? ????????? ???? ?? ???? ???????? ?????? How can I offer salutations to you, O Govinda, if you hide in my heart? My hands are outside and your feet are in my heart. ??? ????? ???? ???? ???????? ??????? ? ???????????? ??????? ???????????? ?? ??: ?????? How can I take refuge in you, O Cosmic Lord Kr???a? O Govinda, I am just a speck of dust, while your head touches the sky. ??????? ?? ??? ????? ?? ????????????? ? ????? ?? ?? ?????? ?? ??????????? ?????? I have only two hands, while you have a thousand heads. I have only one head, while you have a thousand feet. ???????? ?? ??????? ???????? ?????? ?? ? ??? ?????? ?????? ????? ??????????????? ?????? Greatness is yours, O Govinda, and I feel shamed by my smallness. We are so different. How could we become friends? ????? ?????? ????? ??????? ?? ???????? ? ??????:?? ??????? ??? ???????? ?????? Even then, O Krishna, they describe your friendship with Arjuna, the milkmen and the milkmaids. Consider me in a similar way. ????????? ???????? ???: ?????: ???????? ? ????? ????? ?? ???? ?????? ?????????? ?????? Having seen your cosmic form, Arjuna was terrified and he said with tears: ? O Lord, please show me again your four-armed form.? ??? ? ?????? ??????: ??? ???? ???????? ??: ? ??? ??????????????? ?? ???? ?????????: ?????? Where the great warrior Arjuna, and where am I, a common man? Therefore, graspable to my mind, please become the child, the delight of Nanda. ????????? ???? ??????? ??????? ?????????? ? ??????? ?????? ??? ????????????? ????????? ?????? O M?dhava, the Peacock of Gokula, dancing yourself you make all beings dance . O Stealer of Hearts, you yourself shower honey over those who are in love [with you]. Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From suresh.kolichala at gmail.com Mon Apr 30 15:27:26 2018 From: suresh.kolichala at gmail.com (Suresh Kolichala) Date: Mon, 30 Apr 18 11:27:26 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] My Sanskrit verse today In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Wow! Thanks Andrew for your response. Frankly, I didn't expect anyone to respond, let alone someone from Microsoft. So, I am extremely surprised. Thanks for your support. Yes, it is only on the browsers where *dyu *appears as *duya*. I hope the Harfbuzz developers can issue a fix soon. Furthermore, I am not sure if it is a good decision to display dyu with explicit virama, but that's a different discussion. I have many other questions on the implementation of Nirmala UI for other Indian languages. I will reach out to you offline. Thanks again, Suresh. On Sat, Apr 28, 2018 at 3:34 AM, Andrew Glass wrote: > Dear Madhav and Suresh, > > > I do work at Microsoft, and we take font bugs seriously! ? > > > It turns out the problem in this case is with Firefox and Chrome on > Windows 10. These browsers use a font rendering technology called Harfbuzz. > In this case the Nirmala UI font renders this conjunct dyu with explicit > halant. Nirmala UI renders most conjucts horizontally, often with explicit > virama, as is commonplace when typesetting Hindi. Nirmala UI has been > optimized for Hindi because most text in devanagari that renders on Windows > is in Hindi. Now the problem comes in when Harbuzz tries to position the > u-matra on the conjunct dy-. It seems to get this wrong and try to position > the u-matra on the d component. If you paste this cluster into Notepad on > Windows, you get the correct and expected rendering with the u positioned > below the ya. This rendering is also correct ("dyu") in Microsoft's Edge > browser - which is how I determined that the problem is with Harfbuzz - as > I do see the problem you mentioned, "duya" on Chrome and Firefox. I will > share this observation with the developer of Harfbuzz. > > > Here is the rendering of this pada in Word on Windows 10 using the > Devanagari fonts that ship with Windows 10. > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > Andrew Glass > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* INDOLOGY on behalf of > Suresh Kolichala via INDOLOGY > *Sent:* Friday, April 27, 2018 12:55 PM > *To:* Madhav Deshpande > *Cc:* Indology; Jayaram Sethuraman; e-shabda-charcha-peeth; Bharatiya > Vidvat parishad; Manik Thakar; Ranjana Date > *Subject:* Re: [INDOLOGY] My Sanskrit verse today > > Dear Madhavji, > > > There is nothing wrong with your *dyuti?*. It is the problem with the > font. The default font on Microsoft windows was changed from Mangal font to > Nirmala font, in Windows 10 (actually from Windows 8). The rendering of *dyu > *is not correctly implemented in Nirmala font. So, unfortunately, > everyone using Microsoft windows 10 would find your *mukt?dyuti? *as > *mukt?duyati?*. > > You can see how your text appears in various fonts as shown below: > > > > > I hope someone at Microsoft is working to rid their default font of all > these bugs. > > Regards, > Suresh. > > > On Fri, Apr 27, 2018 at 10:49 AM, Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY < > indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > > I am told by a few friends that they see in the second line of my verse > the word "mukt?duyati?". The Devanagari on my MacBook clearly reads > "mukt?dyuti?." So there is some issue in how Devanagari Unicode typed on a > MacBook gets displayed elsewhere. I don't have a way of solving this > dilemma. I would appreciate if anyone has suggestions. Best, > > Madhav Deshpande > Campbell, California > > 2018-04-27 6:51 GMT-07:00 Madhav Deshpande : > > My Sanskrit verse today: > > ???????????????? ????????? ?????????? ??? > ???????: ??????????????????? ????????????? ?????? ? > ?????????????????????????? ????????? ?????? > ????? ??????????? ??????? ???????? ??????? ?? > > Playing on the banks of K?lind?, the drops of sweat on his forehead > produced by his exertion shine like pearls. The world itself shines by the > scattering light of his infinite virtues. May this love of Gokula > constantly shine in my mind. > > Madhav Deshpande > Campbell, California > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info > > (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mailmealakendudas at rediffmail.com Mon Apr 30 18:48:02 2018 From: mailmealakendudas at rediffmail.com (alakendu das) Date: Mon, 30 Apr 18 18:48:02 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Question on Sarasvati as a masculine title In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1525026310.S.8838.8699.f5-147-236.1525114082.6477@webmail.rediffmail.com> Dr Deshpande, While going thru a book on Gita interpretation in Bengali, I came across the name of Madhusudan Saraswati with a long " I ".In Bengali , Sara's water is always spelt with a long " i", either while referring to the Goddess, or Religious order or the mythical river.However, I am not aware of any other regional variants. Alakendu Das. h a long From: "Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY"indology at list.indology.info Sent:Sun, 29 Apr 2018 23:55:10 +0530 To: Indology indology at list.indology.info, Bharatiya Vidvat parishad bvparishat at googlegroups.com, e-shabda-charcha-peeth e-shabda-charcha-peeth at googlegroups.com Subject: [INDOLOGY] Question on Sarasvati as a masculine title Dear Colleagues, >? ? ?This morning I came across this book, where the author's name is given as ?????????????????????, where the word "sarasvati" occurs with a short "i".? This "sarasvat?", as well as "Bh?rat?" is added in the title of many Sannyasins.? Sometimes I see the titles with a long "?", and here is an instance of a short "i".? I am wondering as to what is the common practice and the grammar of that practice, especially since normally feminine expressions are being used in male titles.? Any suggestions? > > >Madhav DeshpandeCampbell, California > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From H.J.H.Tieken at hum.leidenuniv.nl Mon Apr 30 19:28:21 2018 From: H.J.H.Tieken at hum.leidenuniv.nl (Tieken, H.J.H.) Date: Mon, 30 Apr 18 19:28:21 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Question on Sarasvati as a masculine title In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Madhav, I have lost track of the reactions to your question. Maybe someone has already drawn your attention to compounds like K?lid?sa, Lak?mivardhana, etc. discussed in Wackernagel and Debrunner, Altindische Grammatik, Band II, 2, pp. 304-6. If not, I do hereby. Herman Herman Tieken Stationsweg 58 2515 BP Den Haag The Netherlands 00 31 (0)70 2208127 website: hermantieken.com ________________________________ Van: INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info] namens Madhav Deshpande via INDOLOGY [indology at list.indology.info] Verzonden: zondag 29 april 2018 20:23 Aan: Indology; Bharatiya Vidvat parishad; e-shabda-charcha-peeth Onderwerp: [INDOLOGY] Question on Sarasvati as a masculine title Dear Colleagues, This morning I came across this book, where the author's name is given as ?????????????????????, where the word "sarasvati" occurs with a short "i". This "sarasvat?", as well as "Bh?rat?" is added in the title of many Sannyasins. Sometimes I see the titles with a long "?", and here is an instance of a short "i". I am wondering as to what is the common practice and the grammar of that practice, especially since normally feminine expressions are being used in male titles. Any suggestions? Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lw24 at soas.ac.uk Mon Apr 30 19:30:34 2018 From: lw24 at soas.ac.uk (Lidia Wojtczak) Date: Mon, 30 Apr 18 20:30:34 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Prof. Madhav Deshpande at SOAS, the University of Cambridge and the Oxford Centre for Hindu Studies Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, we're delighted to be releasing the programme for Professor Madhav Deshpande's visit to SOAS, the University of Cambridge and the Oxford Centre for Hindu Studies. Prof. Deshpande will be giving talks between Tuesday, May 29th and Thursday, May 31st. Please see the attached poster for details. Kind regards, Lidia Wojtczak -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: VisitingscholarProfessorDeshpandeposter.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 4273123 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Mon Apr 30 19:38:40 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Mon, 30 Apr 18 12:38:40 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Question on Sarasvati as a masculine title In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks, Herman. Will look up the discussion in Wackernagel. Best, Madhav On Mon, Apr 30, 2018 at 12:28 PM, Tieken, H.J.H. < H.J.H.Tieken at hum.leidenuniv.nl> wrote: > Dear Madhav, > I have lost track of the reactions to your question. Maybe someone has > already drawn your attention to compounds like K?lid?sa, Lak?mivardhana, > etc. discussed in Wackernagel and Debrunner, Altindische Grammatik, Band > II, 2, pp. 304-6. If not, I do hereby. > Herman > > > Herman Tieken > Stationsweg 58 > > 2515 BP Den Haag > The Netherlands > 00 31 (0)70 2208127 > website: hermantieken.com > ------------------------------ > *Van:* INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info] namens Madhav > Deshpande via INDOLOGY [indology at list.indology.info] > *Verzonden:* zondag 29 april 2018 20:23 > *Aan:* Indology; Bharatiya Vidvat parishad; e-shabda-charcha-peeth > *Onderwerp:* [INDOLOGY] Question on Sarasvati as a masculine title > > Dear Colleagues, > > This morning I came across this book, where the author's name is > given as ?????????????????????, where the word "sarasvati" occurs with a > short "i". This "sarasvat?", as well as "Bh?rat?" is added in the title of > many Sannyasins. Sometimes I see the titles with a long "?", and here is > an instance of a short "i". I am wondering as to what is the common > practice and the grammar of that practice, especially since normally > feminine expressions are being used in male titles. Any suggestions? > > > > Madhav Deshpande > Campbell, California > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Mon Apr 30 20:04:16 2018 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Mon, 30 Apr 18 20:04:16 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?B?UmU6IFtJTkRPTE9HWV0ge+CkreCkvuCksOCkpOClgOCkr+CkteCkv+CkpuCljeCkteCkpOCljeCkquCksOCkv+Ckt+CkpOCljX0gUmU6ICBRdWVzdGlvbiBvbiBTYXJhc3ZhdGkgYXMgYSBtYXNjdWxpbmUgdGl0bGU=?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: There are Deekshaa naamas ending in Giri, Puree etc. too for Advaita sanyaasis. Maadhva sannyaasis have Teertha etc. Sarasvatee , Bhaaratee could be just codes not titles, nor parts of the name. On Tue, May 1, 2018, 1:09 AM Madhav Deshpande wrote: > Thanks, Herman. Will look up the discussion in Wackernagel. Best, > > Madhav > > On Mon, Apr 30, 2018 at 12:28 PM, Tieken, H.J.H. < > H.J.H.Tieken at hum.leidenuniv.nl> wrote: > >> Dear Madhav, >> I have lost track of the reactions to your question. Maybe someone has >> already drawn your attention to compounds like K?lid?sa, Lak?mivardhana, >> etc. discussed in Wackernagel and Debrunner, Altindische Grammatik, Band >> II, 2, pp. 304-6. If not, I do hereby. >> Herman >> >> >> Herman Tieken >> Stationsweg 58 >> >> 2515 BP Den Haag >> The Netherlands >> 00 31 (0)70 2208127 >> website: hermantieken.com >> ------------------------------ >> *Van:* INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info] namens Madhav >> Deshpande via INDOLOGY [indology at list.indology.info] >> *Verzonden:* zondag 29 april 2018 20:23 >> *Aan:* Indology; Bharatiya Vidvat parishad; e-shabda-charcha-peeth >> *Onderwerp:* [INDOLOGY] Question on Sarasvati as a masculine title >> >> Dear Colleagues, >> >> This morning I came across this book, where the author's name is >> given as ?????????????????????, where the word "sarasvati" occurs with a >> short "i". This "sarasvat?", as well as "Bh?rat?" is added in the title of >> many Sannyasins. Sometimes I see the titles with a long "?", and here is >> an instance of a short "i". I am wondering as to what is the common >> practice and the grammar of that practice, especially since normally >> feminine expressions are being used in male titles. Any suggestions? >> >> >> >> Madhav Deshpande >> Campbell, California >> >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "???????????????????" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to bvparishat+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to bvparishat at googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From palaniappa at aol.com Mon Apr 30 20:46:16 2018 From: palaniappa at aol.com (Sudalaimuthu Palaniappan) Date: Mon, 30 Apr 18 15:46:16 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Akananuru Critical Edition and Akam 24 Message-ID: <9E7AF8DE-FB0E-47A2-BC66-5AFB54A02C45@aol.com> In Indology posts long ago, I had suggested that the Tamil word p?rpp?? originally could mean ?priest? in general and not ?brahmin? per se and some of the references to p?rpp?? in Classical Tamil poems could refer to non-brahmin potter priests as in Akam 337 (http://list.indology.info/pipermail/indology_list.indology.info/2013-June/132646.html ). Similarly I had questioned the reading ?ve??p p?rpp??? in Akam 24.1 which is usually interpreted/translated as a non-sacrificing brahmin. I had suggested that the original words probably referred to a potter priest. In connection with this, Eva Wilden?s recently published critical edition of the Ka?i??iy??ainirai (poems 1-120) part of the Akan????u provides important evidence for the case of potter priest in Akam 24.1. According to Eva Wilden, the present available manuscripts are not more than about 300 years old. There have been two strands of transmission, a ?aiva one and a Vai??ava one. Wilden has given primary variants from both strands as part of the critical text. See attachment for Akam 24. On Akam 24.1, the Vai??ava strand has the reading v???r. The ?aiva strand has v???. But both strands are derived from one original. The difference in readings happened about 300 years ago. But irrespective of the manuscripts of the strand used, all the editors, Raghava Iyengar (RK), Vaiyapuri Pillai (VP), and Murray Rajam (ER), chose to go with the reading v???. This can be seen highlighted on p. 158. Although Eva Wilden finally gives only 'non-sacrificing brahmin? in the translation on page 160, personally, I believe that since the dominant belief at the time the strands diverged most likely was that p?rpp?? referred to a brahmin, v??a should have been the emended version similar to the choice made by the editors of published versions in the 20th century. The variant v???r should have been the retained original version since there could be no reason for one to insert the ?r? in v???r. The V???rs are potter priests today in Tamil Nadu. Here is a description of the community http://tinyurl.com/ycdvsbkg . Tamil Lexicon entry for v???? (the singular form of v???r) shows the following: ?????? v????, n. < id. 1. A caste title; ??? ?????????????????. ????????? ??????? ?????? (S. I. I. ii, 10). 2. A title of persons belonging to the Kuyavar caste; ??????? ?????? ???????????. Mod. Kuyavar are potters. Actually, as I have shown in earlier posts related to potters, the title v???? has been associated with chieftains, high officials, as well as potters in medieval inscriptions. The honorific/plural form of v???? is v???r. (The -?? or -?r is a PNG suffix and there is no negation involved here.) So while in modern times, the title could be a caste title, it would be simply a professional/lineage title in Classical Tamil times. In other instances in Classical Tamil, potters are mentioned as v??k? (v??+k?), where the first component again is the same as in v???r. So in the interlinear English version on p. 159, Wilden?s meaning of ?v??ar? as ?sacrifice-not-they (h.)? is not appropriate since there has been no known case of ?v???r? as a brahmin group. Even in the Cilappatik?ram, which talks about a brahmin group that has given up Vedic chanting and taken up music (Cil. 13.38-39), they are not called v???r. We already know of potter priests in Classical Tamil as in Na??i?ai 293. So I would suggest 'potter priest' as the meaning for v???rp p?rpp??. (Incidentally, according to Tamil Lexicon, one of the meanings of Ta. verb p?r is 'to worship'.) Interestingly, ?v?r M?la?ki??r, the author of Akam 24, has authored a Pu?an????u poem (no. 166) about a brahmin who performs Vedic rites. So he must have known a brahmin priest as well as a potter priest. In Akam 24, by the use of v???rp p?rpp??, the poet makes it clear that the priest in question is a potter. We should also note that a female priestess in Pu?an????u 372 is called v??m?? (v??+maka?). This suggests that the potters officiated as priest (p?rpp??) in the Tamil society before that role came to be dominated by brahmins. Thanks to the Vai??ava copyist who copied the manuscript about 300 years ago and Eva Wilden, who has produced the critical edition, we can reconstruct one important aspect of Tamil socio-religious history. Regards, Palaniappan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Palaniappa at aol.com Mon Apr 30 20:48:27 2018 From: Palaniappa at aol.com (Sudalaimuthu Palaniappan) Date: Mon, 30 Apr 18 15:48:27 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Akananuru Critical Edition and Akam 24 In-Reply-To: <9E7AF8DE-FB0E-47A2-BC66-5AFB54A02C45@aol.com> Message-ID: <65A25C9D-6147-41D3-A942-EEE29EC89C1B@aol.com> Sorry, here is the attachment. Regards, Palaniappan > On Apr 30, 2018, at 3:46 PM, Sudalaimuthu Palaniappan wrote: > > In Indology posts long ago, I had suggested that the Tamil word p?rpp?? originally could mean ?priest? in general and not ?brahmin? per se and some of the references to p?rpp?? in Classical Tamil poems could refer to non-brahmin potter priests as in Akam 337 (http://list.indology.info/pipermail/indology_list.indology.info/2013-June/132646.html ). Similarly I had questioned the reading ?ve??p p?rpp??? in Akam 24.1 which is usually interpreted/translated as a non-sacrificing brahmin. I had suggested that the original words probably referred to a potter priest. In connection with this, Eva Wilden?s recently published critical edition of the Ka?i??iy??ainirai (poems 1-120) part of the Akan????u provides important evidence for the case of potter priest in Akam 24.1. > > According to Eva Wilden, the present available manuscripts are not more than about 300 years old. There have been two strands of transmission, a ?aiva one and a Vai??ava one. Wilden has given primary variants from both strands as part of the critical text. See attachment for Akam 24. On Akam 24.1, the Vai??ava strand has the reading v???r. The ?aiva strand has v???. But both strands are derived from one original. The difference in readings happened about 300 years ago. But irrespective of the manuscripts of the strand used, all the editors, Raghava Iyengar (RK), Vaiyapuri Pillai (VP), and Murray Rajam (ER), chose to go with the reading v???. This can be seen highlighted on p. 158. Although Eva Wilden finally gives only 'non-sacrificing brahmin? in the translation on page 160, personally, I believe that since the dominant belief at the time the strands diverged most likely was that p?rpp?? referred to a brahmin, v??a should have been the emended version similar to the choice made by the editors of published versions in the 20th century. The variant v???r should have been the retained original version since there could be no reason for one to insert the ?r? in v???r. > > The V???rs are potter priests today in Tamil Nadu. Here is a description of the community http://tinyurl.com/ycdvsbkg . Tamil Lexicon entry for v???? (the singular form of v???r) shows the following: > ?????? v????, n. < id. 1. A caste title; ??? ?????????????????. ????????? ??????? ?????? (S. I. I. ii, 10). 2. A title of persons belonging to the Kuyavar caste; ??????? ?????? ???????????. Mod. > > Kuyavar are potters. Actually, as I have shown in earlier posts related to potters, the title v???? has been associated with chieftains, high officials, as well as potters in medieval inscriptions. The honorific/plural form of v???? is v???r. (The -?? or -?r is a PNG suffix and there is no negation involved here.) So while in modern times, the title could be a caste title, it would be simply a professional/lineage title in Classical Tamil times. In other instances in Classical Tamil, potters are mentioned as v??k? (v??+k?), where the first component again is the same as in v???r. So in the interlinear English version on p. 159, Wilden?s meaning of ?v??ar? as ?sacrifice-not-they (h.)? is not appropriate since there has been no known case of ?v???r? as a brahmin group. Even in the Cilappatik?ram, which talks about a brahmin group that has given up Vedic chanting and taken up music (Cil. 13.38-39), they are not called v???r. We already know of potter priests in Classical Tamil as in Na??i?ai 293. So I would suggest 'potter priest' as the meaning for v???rp p?rpp??. (Incidentally, according to Tamil Lexicon, one of the meanings of Ta. verb p?r is 'to worship'.) > > Interestingly, ?v?r M?la?ki??r, the author of Akam 24, has authored a Pu?an????u poem (no. 166) about a brahmin who performs Vedic rites. So he must have known a brahmin priest as well as a potter priest. In Akam 24, by the use of v???rp p?rpp??, the poet makes it clear that the priest in question is a potter. We should also note that a female priestess in Pu?an????u 372 is called v??m?? (v??+maka?). This suggests that the potters officiated as priest (p?rpp??) in the Tamil society before that role came to be dominated by brahmins. > > Thanks to the Vai??ava copyist who copied the manuscript about 300 years ago and Eva Wilden, who has produced the critical edition, we can reconstruct one important aspect of Tamil socio-religious history. > > Regards, > Palaniappan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Akananuru24Velarpparppan.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 1229327 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Mon Apr 30 22:09:10 2018 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Mon, 30 Apr 18 15:09:10 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?B?UmU6IFtJTkRPTE9HWV0gW+CkiC3gpLbgpKzgpY3gpKbgpJrgpLDgpY3gpJrgpL7gpKrgpYDgpKBdIFJlOiAgUXVlc3Rpb24gb24gU2FyYXN2YXRpIGFzIGEgbWFzY3VsaW5lIHRpdGxl?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Dhananjay, That is an excellent reference, indicating that such variations are old, some of them going back to the days of P??ini. Thanks. Madhav Deshpande Campbell, California On Mon, Apr 30, 2018 at 1:10 PM, Jay Vaidya wrote: > ??????? ?????????????? ?????? ??????( ?? ) > ????????? ???????? ? ????????????? ????? ??????? ????? ????????? > ?????????? ???????????? ????????????? ??????????? ? ? ????? ?????????? > ??????????? ????????????? > (from Kashika) > > Hope this points to further examples of the optional short or long vowel > when ?????? or ????? is the non-final component of a compound, and is > followed by an ??????? . I forget whether ?????? means more frequently or > equally likely to be ??????. > > This sUtra is relevant for ?????????? but not for "???????-???????" I > take it that is always written ending with the long vowel. > > Regards, > Dhananjay Vaidya > > On Mon, Apr 30, 2018 at 3:38 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: > >> Thanks, Herman. Will look up the discussion in Wackernagel. Best, >> >> Madhav >> >> On Mon, Apr 30, 2018 at 12:28 PM, Tieken, H.J.H. < >> H.J.H.Tieken at hum.leidenuniv.nl> wrote: >> >>> Dear Madhav, >>> I have lost track of the reactions to your question. Maybe someone has >>> already drawn your attention to compounds like K?lid?sa, Lak?mivardhana, >>> etc. discussed in Wackernagel and Debrunner, Altindische Grammatik, Band >>> II, 2, pp. 304-6. If not, I do hereby. >>> Herman >>> >>> >>> Herman Tieken >>> Stationsweg 58 >>> >>> 2515 BP Den Haag >>> The Netherlands >>> 00 31 (0)70 2208127 >>> website: hermantieken.com >>> ------------------------------ >>> *Van:* INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info] namens Madhav >>> Deshpande via INDOLOGY [indology at list.indology.info] >>> *Verzonden:* zondag 29 april 2018 20:23 >>> *Aan:* Indology; Bharatiya Vidvat parishad; e-shabda-charcha-peeth >>> *Onderwerp:* [INDOLOGY] Question on Sarasvati as a masculine title >>> >>> Dear Colleagues, >>> >>> This morning I came across this book, where the author's name is >>> given as ?????????????????????, where the word "sarasvati" occurs with a >>> short "i". This "sarasvat?", as well as "Bh?rat?" is added in the title of >>> many Sannyasins. Sometimes I see the titles with a long "?", and here is >>> an instance of a short "i". I am wondering as to what is the common >>> practice and the grammar of that practice, especially since normally >>> feminine expressions are being used in male titles. Any suggestions? >>> >>> >>> >>> Madhav Deshpande >>> Campbell, California >>> >>> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "E-Shabda-Charcha-Peeth" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to e-shabda-charcha-peeth+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. >> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/grou >> p/e-shabda-charcha-peeth. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "E-Shabda-Charcha-Peeth" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to e-shabda-charcha-peeth+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/e-shabda-charcha-peeth > . > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: