From julia.shaw at ucl.ac.uk Fri Jul 1 08:57:54 2016 From: julia.shaw at ucl.ac.uk (Shaw, Julia) Date: Fri, 01 Jul 16 08:57:54 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Request for pdf of D.S. Ruegg's (1980) 'Ahimsa and Vegetarianism in the History of Buddhism' Message-ID: Dear all I wonder if anyone has a PDF of the following? Ruegg, D.S., 1980. 'Ahimsa and Vegetarianism in the History of Buddhism' in S. Balasooriya et al., (Eds.), Buddhist Studies in Honour of Walpola Rahula. London: 234-41 If so I would be most grateful if you could share it with me please. Many thanks and best wishes, Julia Shaw -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dr Julia Shaw Lecturer in South Asian Archaeology Institute of Archaeology UCL 31-34 Gordon Square London WC1H 0PY http://www.ucl.ac.uk/archaeology/people/staff/shaw -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From julia.shaw at ucl.ac.uk Fri Jul 1 09:40:57 2016 From: julia.shaw at ucl.ac.uk (Shaw, Julia) Date: Fri, 01 Jul 16 09:40:57 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Request for pdf of D.S. Ruegg's (1980) 'Ahimsa and Vegetarianism in the History of Buddhism' In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear all, I have now received copies of the requested article... many thanks to Jonathan Silk and James Stewart for such a speedy response! All best wishes, Julia Dr Julia Shaw Lecturer in South Asian Archaeology Institute of Archaeology UCL 31-34 Gordon Square London WC1H 0PY http://www.ucl.ac.uk/archaeology/people/staff/shaw ________________________________ From: Shaw, Julia Sent: 01 July 2016 09:57:54 To: indology at list.indology.info Subject: Request for pdf of D.S. Ruegg's (1980) 'Ahimsa and Vegetarianism in the History of Buddhism' Dear all I wonder if anyone has a PDF of the following? Ruegg, D.S., 1980. 'Ahimsa and Vegetarianism in the History of Buddhism' in S. Balasooriya et al., (Eds.), Buddhist Studies in Honour of Walpola Rahula. London: 234-41 If so I would be most grateful if you could share it with me please. Many thanks and best wishes, Julia Shaw -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dr Julia Shaw Lecturer in South Asian Archaeology Institute of Archaeology UCL 31-34 Gordon Square London WC1H 0PY http://www.ucl.ac.uk/archaeology/people/staff/shaw -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From julia.hegewald at uni-bonn.de Fri Jul 1 11:34:36 2016 From: julia.hegewald at uni-bonn.de (Julia Hegewald) Date: Fri, 01 Jul 16 13:34:36 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Call_for_papers:_Second_EAAA_conference_in_Z=C3=BCrich:_24.-27._August_2017?= In-Reply-To: <07604E1C-EA66-4DD8-B095-18367B29AE85@uni-bonn.de> Message-ID: <617DB062-2746-4AE9-8628-DE26EAB7376D@uni-bonn.de> Dear colleagues and friends, after my earlier email (?safe the date? from early June) with regards to the second EAAA conference in Zurich from 24th till 27th August 2017, please find attached the official call for papers with further information. with best wishes, Julia Hegewald. Prof. Dr. Julia A. B. Hegewald Professorin f?r Orientalische Kunstgeschichte Abteilungsleiterin Universit?t Bonn Institut f?r Orient- und Asienwissenschaften (IOA) Abteilung f?r Asiatische und Islamische Kunstgeschichte Adenauerallee 10 D ? 53113 Bonn Email: julia.hegewald at uni-bonn.de www.aik.uni-bonn.de Tel. 0228-73 7213 Fax. 0228-73 4042 On 03 Jun 2016, at 12:13, Julia Hegewald wrote: > Dear colleagues and friends, > > on behalf of the board of the European Association of Asian Art and Archaeology (EAAA), I am happy to announce the > > Second EAAA conference in Zurich: 24.-27. August 2017. > > The date was chosen so as not to coincide with the scheduled 15th EAJS conference, which takes place from 30. August - 2. September in Lisbon, Portugal (http://www.eajs.eu/?id=305). For anyone traveling from afar, it might even make sense to combine the two events. > > Timeline: > 30. June 2016: official call for papers > 15. November 2016: Submission of panel and paper proposals > > 28. February 2017: Notification of acceptance > 31. March 2017: early bird registration deadline > 31. May 2017: conference program published > > Abstracts: > follow the AAS standard: 250 words for both panel proposal, and paper abstracts > > Membership: > A membership of EAAA is a prerequisite for panel and paper applications ? > annual membership fees are a mere 30 ?, or 10 ? for students, and we welcome donations!: http://www.ea-aaa.eu/members > > For more information on the EAAA and its conference, visit: http://www.ea-aaa.eu > In case you have any questions, please contact: info at ea-aaa.eu > > We look forward to receiving your abstracts and panel proposals and to welcoming you to Zurich! > > On behalf of the EAAA board, I wish you all the best > and hope for your participation in the Second EAAA conference, > > Julia Hegewald. > > > > Prof. Dr. Julia A. B. Hegewald > Professor of Oriental Art History > Head of Department > University of Bonn > Institute of Oriental and Asian Studies (IOA) > Department of Asian and Islamic Art History > Adenauerallee 10 > 53113 Bonn > Germany > > Email: julia.hegewald at uni-bonn.de > www.aik.uni-bonn.de > Tel. 0049-228-73 7213 > Fax. 0049-228-73 4042 > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: EAAA_CfP_final.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 196318 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wiese at wifa.uni-leipzig.de Sat Jul 2 15:25:53 2016 From: wiese at wifa.uni-leipzig.de (Harald Wiese) Date: Sat, 02 Jul 16 17:25:53 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_N=C4=81rada:_Asah=C4=81ya,_Bh=C4=81vasv=C4=81m=C4=AB,_N=C4=81radasm=E1=B9=9Btitattvaprak=C4=81=C5=9Bik=C4=81?= Message-ID: <7e32beba-ddc7-1b72-011d-3c6c6f70e880@wifa.uni-leipzig.de> Dear list members, could anybody help me with a copy of Shastri, Heramba Chatterjee (1989). N?rada-sm?ti, The text along with English translation and the commentaries of Asah?ya, Bh?vasv?m? and the N?radasm?titattvaprak??ik?. Sanskrit College (Calcutta). Yours sincerely Harald Wiese University of Leipzig wiese at wifa.uni-leipzig.de From r.stuhrmann at t-online.de Sat Jul 2 16:36:17 2016 From: r.stuhrmann at t-online.de (rainer stuhrmann) Date: Sat, 02 Jul 16 18:36:17 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Indra Message-ID: Dear Howard, Indra`s visible appearence: according to RV 10,95,8 Indra is /h?ri-ke?a/ and /h?ri-?ma??ru/, of ?yellow-red (golden) hair? and ?yellow-red (golden) beard?. //h?ri / /is also used of the fire, the sun, of lightening and of Indras horses - and of the Soma plant. According to Falk, however, /h?ri / denotes ?yellowish-green to green? (Falk, p.85, Soma I and II, BSOAS, Vol. 52, No. 1,1989, pp. 77-90 ), because this - he thinks - makes that colourful epitheton fit to the ?bluish green? (Falk, p.85) colour of the ephedra plant. That would make Indra the first punk of history. Rainer Stuhrmann Stuttgart -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From vajpeyi at csds.in Sat Jul 2 17:10:28 2016 From: vajpeyi at csds.in (Ananya Vajpeyi) Date: Sat, 02 Jul 16 22:40:28 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Olivelle's_translation_of_Kau=E1=B9=ADilya's_Artha=C5=9B=C4=81stra?= Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, Wanted to share my review essay about Professor Patrick Olivelle's recent annotated translation of Kau?ilya's Artha??stra (King, Governance, and Law in Ancient India, OUP 2013), that appeared on Public Books yesterday: http://www.publicbooks.org/nonfiction/an-ancient-treatise-and-the-making-of-modern-india http://www.publicbooks.org All Best, Ananya Vajpeyi. -- *Ananya Vajpeyi, PhD * *Associate Fellow* *Centre for the Study of Developing Societies* *29 Rajpur Road, Civil Lines* *New Delhi 110054* *e: vajpeyi at csds.in * *ext: 229* *http://www.csds.in/faculty_ananya_vajpeyi.htm * *http://www.hup.harvard.edu/catalog.php?isbn=9780674048959&content=book * *http://www.carnegiecouncil.org/programs/gen/gefellows/current/ananya_vajpeyi.html * -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alanus1216 at yahoo.com Sat Jul 2 23:20:08 2016 From: alanus1216 at yahoo.com (Allen Thrasher) Date: Sat, 02 Jul 16 23:20:08 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Indra In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <628646927.907180.1467501608229.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Were the other RV deities hari- in their hair, or just Indra? Allen Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Sat, Jul 2, 2016 at 12:36 PM, rainer stuhrmann wrote: Dear Howard, ? Indra`s visible appearence: ? according to RV 10,95,8 Indra is h?ri-ke?a and h?ri-?ma??ru, of ??yellow-red (golden) hair? and ?yellow-red (golden) beard?. h?ri? is also used of the fire, the sun, of lightening and of Indras horses - and of the Soma plant. According to Falk, however, h?ri? denotes? ?yellowish-green to green? (Falk, p.85, Soma I and II, BSOAS, Vol. 52, No. 1,1989, pp. 77-90 ), because this - he thinks - makes that colourful epitheton fit to the ?bluish green? (Falk, p.85) colour of the ephedra plant. That would make Indra the first punk of history. Rainer Stuhrmann Stuttgart ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com Sun Jul 3 01:58:48 2016 From: hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com (Harry Spier) Date: Sat, 02 Jul 16 21:58:48 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Bibliographic data for Muktabodha digital library etexts Message-ID: Dear list members, I was requested to include some bibliographic information with the new etext announcements of Muktabodha. In the future I'll do that. Bibliographic information is included with each etext both at the top of the transliterated etext (not at the top of the devanagari pdf). It also is included on the website for each text when you click on its title. The cursory bibliographic information for the last announcement of new etexts is: (Note: KSTS stands for Kashmir Series of Texts and Studies) vij??nabhairava with commentary called Kaumadi by ?nandabha??? KSTS vol 9 ?ivas?travimar?in? KSTS vol. 1 ?ivastotr?val? Chowkambha Sanskrit Series 1902 editor Rai Pramadasa Mitra Bahadurpratyabhij??h?daya KSTS vol. 3 spandak?rik? with viv?t? by r?maka??ha KSTS vol. 6 laghuyogav?si??ha with commentary v?si??hacandrik? by v?sudeva?arma?? Editor : Vasudeva Sharma Panasikara , Bombay 1933 ?r?karabh??ya being the v?ra?aiva commentary on the ved?ntas?tras Editor : C. Hayavadana Rao, Bangalore Press 1936 aniruddhasa?hit? edited and published by by A. Srinavasa Iyengar , Mysore 1956 laghustuti with commentary by raghav?nanda , Volume 60 of ananta?ayanasa?sk?tagranth?vali 1936 par?nandas?tra a tantric text written in the format of a vedic kalpas?tra, , Editor : Swami trivikrama t?rtha , Baroda Oriental Institute 1931 para?ambhumahimnastava Publisher : N. Rajam & Co.. 1936 Madras Thank you, Harry Spier Muktabodha -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rmahoney at fastmail.com Sun Jul 3 03:24:09 2016 From: rmahoney at fastmail.com (Richard Mahoney) Date: Sun, 03 Jul 16 15:24:09 +1200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] RESOURCE> IeB Scholiast update - June 2016 Message-ID: <20160703152409.00005e6e@fastmail.com> Dear Colleagues, The most recent update can be found here: Six months free access to Scholiast - June 2016 Publication date: 30.June.2016, 08:17 ``Indica et Buddhica Scholiast is an Asian and Buddhist Studies bibliographic database, ISSN: 2463-5847. Registered users can now obtain hands-on experience with Scholiast for free. ...'' http://indica-et-buddhica.org/scholia-scholiast/updates/scholiast-six-months-free-access ? With best regards, Richard -- Richard Mahoney | Indica et Buddhica Littledene Bay Road Oxford New Zealand +64-3-312-1699 r.mahoney at indica-et-buddhica.org From r.stuhrmann at t-online.de Sun Jul 3 09:02:14 2016 From: r.stuhrmann at t-online.de (rainer stuhrmann) Date: Sun, 03 Jul 16 11:02:14 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Indra In-Reply-To: <628646927.907180.1467501608229.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: S?rya is once said to be h?ri-ke?a (10,137,7) and also, in association with the rising of the sun, h?ri-ke?a is once said from Savitar, RV 10.139,1ab: s??ryara?mir h?rike?a? pur?st?t savit?? jy?tir ?d ay?m? ?jasram / ?With rays of the sun, with yellow-red (golden) hair, from the east Savitar has just raised up the unfading light.? Also Agni is once, RV 3,2,13, said to be h?ri-ke?a and RV 1, 79,1, to be of "golden hair" (h?ra?ya-ke?a). This seems to be metaphoric in contrast to Indra?s anthropomorphic descriptions. Rainer Am 03.07.2016 um 01:20 schrieb Allen Thrasher: > Were the other RV deities hari- in their hair, or just Indra? > > Allen > > > Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android > > > On Sat, Jul 2, 2016 at 12:36 PM, rainer stuhrmann > wrote: > > Dear Howard, > > Indra`s visible appearence: > > according to RV 10,95,8 Indra is /h?ri-ke?a/ and /h?ri-?ma??ru/, > of ?yellow-red (golden) hair? and ?yellow-red (golden) beard?. > > //h?ri / /is also used of the fire, the sun, of lightening and of > Indras horses - and of the Soma plant. > > > According to Falk, however, /h?ri / denotes ?yellowish-green to > green? (Falk, p.85, Soma I and II, BSOAS, Vol. 52, No. 1,1989, pp. > 77-90 ), > > because this - he thinks - makes that colourful epitheton fit to > the ?bluish green? (Falk, p.85) colour of the ephedra plant. That > would make > > Indra the first punk of history. > > > > Rainer Stuhrmann > > Stuttgart > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From psdmccartney at gmail.com Sun Jul 3 11:27:37 2016 From: psdmccartney at gmail.com (patrick mccartney) Date: Sun, 03 Jul 16 21:27:37 +1000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] meru tantra Message-ID: Dear Friends, Does anyone have or know where I could find a copy of the meru tantra? I know nothing about this text. When was it composed? I have looked on gretil, muktabodha, archive, google,wikipedia, but no luck. The searchable archives on Indology came up with not much: http://list.indology.info/pipermail/indology_list.indology.info/2004-September/028666.html apart from a suggestion it was written in the 8th century. I would like a searchable document ideally. An organisation I am studying at the moment keeps referring to it for the definition of a 'Hindu'. >From their website: The Holy text the *Merutantra *defines the word Hindu (?????) as ?????? ?????? ?????? ??? ????? ? (*hinaani gunaani dushyati iti Hindu*)'. ??????? ?????? ??????? means that which destroys (*dushyati*) the base and inferior (*hin*)* Raja *and *Tama* components (*gun*). Thus Hinduism is an attitude. It means being a seeker. If one is a seeker enriched with the *Sattva* component which destroys the *Raja* and *Tama* components then one is certainly a Hindu. By this definition, a seeker belonging to any religion, can be considered a Hindu. Hence the Hindu religion, in a real sense, views all religions with equality. http://forumforhinduawakening.org/understanding/synonyms-dharma Thanks in advance. All the best, Patrick McCartney, PhD School of Culture, History & Language College of the Asia-Pacific The Australian National University Canberra, Australia, 0200 Skype - psdmccartney Phone + Whatsapp: +61 414 954 748 Twitter - @psdmccartney academia - Linkedin #yogabodyANU2016 symposium Ep1 - Imagining Sanskrit Land Ep 2 - Total-am Ep 3 - Jalam ? Chillum A Day in our Ashram Stop animation short film of Shakuntala Forced to Clean Human Waste One of my favourite song s -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ondracka at ff.cuni.cz Sun Jul 3 12:09:12 2016 From: ondracka at ff.cuni.cz (Lubomir Ondracka) Date: Sun, 03 Jul 16 14:09:12 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] meru tantra In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20160703140912.f2480df9802eee590468763f@ff.cuni.cz> Dear Patrick, for basic information about this text, see Goudriaan - Gupta: Hindu Tantric nad ??kta Literature, p. 98 and Kavir?j: T?ntrik s?hitya, pp. 528-9. Regarding the date, Goudriaan - Gupta are inconclusive (Although it has more than once been regarded as a late work because the town of London is said to be mentioned in it, it is possible that at least its core goes further back), as is Alexis Sanderson (the Merutantra, a work composed or at least completed in its present form after the arrival of the British in India). There is a couple of editions (the latest one is probably this one: http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/917764869), but I am afraid there is no searchable text available. Best, Lubomir On Sun, 3 Jul 2016 21:27:37 +1000 patrick mccartney wrote: > Dear Friends, > > Does anyone have or know where I could find a copy of the meru tantra? I > know nothing about this text. When was it composed? I have looked on > gretil, muktabodha, archive, google,wikipedia, but no luck. > > The searchable archives on Indology came up with not much: > http://list.indology.info/pipermail/indology_list.indology.info/2004-September/028666.html > apart from a suggestion it was written in the 8th century. > > > I would like a searchable document ideally. > An organisation I am studying at the moment keeps referring to it for the > definition of a 'Hindu'. > > > From their website: > > The Holy text the *Merutantra *defines the word Hindu (?????) as ?????? > ?????? ?????? ??? ????? ? (*hinaani gunaani dushyati iti Hindu*)'. ??????? > ?????? ??????? means that which destroys (*dushyati*) the base and > inferior (*hin*)* Raja *and *Tama* components (*gun*). Thus Hinduism is an > attitude. It means being a seeker. If one is a seeker enriched with the > *Sattva* component which destroys the *Raja* and *Tama* components then one > is certainly a Hindu. By this definition, a seeker belonging to any > religion, can be considered a Hindu. Hence the Hindu religion, in a real > sense, views all religions with equality. > > http://forumforhinduawakening.org/understanding/synonyms-dharma > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > All the best, > > Patrick McCartney, PhD > School of Culture, History & Language > College of the Asia-Pacific > The Australian National University > Canberra, Australia, 0200 > > > Skype - psdmccartney > Phone + Whatsapp: +61 414 954 748 > Twitter - @psdmccartney > > academia > > - > > Linkedin > > > #yogabodyANU2016 symposium > > > > > Ep1 - Imagining Sanskrit Land > > Ep 2 - Total-am > > Ep 3 - Jalam ? Chillum > > A Day in our Ashram > > > Stop animation short film of Shakuntala > > > Forced to Clean Human Waste > > One of my favourite song s From wujastyk at gmail.com Sun Jul 3 13:46:25 2016 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Sun, 03 Jul 16 15:46:25 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] meru tantra In-Reply-To: <20160703140912.f2480df9802eee590468763f@ff.cuni.cz> Message-ID: A transcription of the Merutantra is available at the Muktabodha online library. link: http://muktalib5.org/DL_CATALOG/DL_CATALOG_USER_INTERFACE/dl_user_interface_display_catalog_record.php?M00195 Metadata: Catalog number : M00195 _________________________________ Uniform title: merutantra Main title: merutantra with ?ippani Commentator : raghun?tha??stri _________________________________ ... _________________________________ Notes: Data-entered by the staff of Muktabodha under the supervision of Mark S.G. Dyczkowski. Revision 0: October 21, 2009 Revision 1: February 11, 2010 - chapters 21-23 added Revision 2: April 5, 2010 - chapters 24-end added. _________________________________ Publisher : ?r?venkate?vara Publication year : 1908 Publication city : Bombay Publication country : India _________________________________ ________________________________ Copyrights ?2011 Muktabodha Indological Research Institute All Rights Reserved. E-texts may be viewed only online or downloaded for private study. E-texts may not, under any circumstances, be copied, republished, reproduced, distributed or sold, either in original or altered form, without the express permission of Muktabodha Indological Research Institute in writing. -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada ?sas.ualberta.ca? On 3 July 2016 at 14:09, Lubomir Ondracka wrote: > Dear Patrick, > > for basic information about this text, see Goudriaan - Gupta: Hindu > Tantric nad ??kta Literature, p. 98 and Kavir?j: T?ntrik s?hitya, pp. 528-9. > > Regarding the date, Goudriaan - Gupta are inconclusive (Although it has > more than once been regarded as a late work because the town of London is > said to be mentioned in it, it > is possible that at least its core goes further back), as is Alexis > Sanderson (the Merutantra, a work composed or at least completed in its > present form after the arrival of the British in India). > > There is a couple of editions (the latest one is probably this one: > http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/917764869), but I am afraid there is no > searchable text available. > > Best, > Lubomir > > > On Sun, 3 Jul 2016 21:27:37 +1000 > patrick mccartney wrote: > > > Dear Friends, > > > > Does anyone have or know where I could find a copy of the meru tantra? I > > know nothing about this text. When was it composed? I have looked on > > gretil, muktabodha, archive, google,wikipedia, but no luck. > > > > The searchable archives on Indology came up with not much: > > > http://list.indology.info/pipermail/indology_list.indology.info/2004-September/028666.html > > apart from a suggestion it was written in the 8th century. > > > > > > I would like a searchable document ideally. > > An organisation I am studying at the moment keeps referring to it for the > > definition of a 'Hindu'. > > > > > > From their website: > > > > The Holy text the *Merutantra *defines the word Hindu (?????) as ?????? > > ?????? ?????? ??? ????? ? (*hinaani gunaani dushyati iti Hindu*)'. > ??????? > > ?????? ??????? means that which destroys (*dushyati*) the base and > > inferior (*hin*)* Raja *and *Tama* components (*gun*). Thus Hinduism is > an > > attitude. It means being a seeker. If one is a seeker enriched with the > > *Sattva* component which destroys the *Raja* and *Tama* components then > one > > is certainly a Hindu. By this definition, a seeker belonging to any > > religion, can be considered a Hindu. Hence the Hindu religion, in a real > > sense, views all religions with equality. > > > > http://forumforhinduawakening.org/understanding/synonyms-dharma > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > All the best, > > > > Patrick McCartney, PhD > > School of Culture, History & Language > > College of the Asia-Pacific > > The Australian National University > > Canberra, Australia, 0200 > > > > > > Skype - psdmccartney > > Phone + Whatsapp: +61 414 954 748 > > Twitter - @psdmccartney > > > > academia > > > > - > > > > Linkedin > > < > https://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=241756978&trk=nav_responsive_tab_profile > > > > > > #yogabodyANU2016 symposium > > < > http://chl.anu.edu.au/news-events/events/658/yoga-and-body-past-and-present-symposium?#tab > > > > > > < > http://chl.anu.edu.au/news-events/events/658/yoga-and-body-past-and-present-symposium?#tab > > > > > > Ep1 - Imagining Sanskrit Land > > > > Ep 2 - Total-am > > > > Ep 3 - Jalam ? Chillum > > > > A Day in our Ashram > > > > > > > Stop animation short film of Shakuntala > > > > > > Forced to Clean Human Waste > > > > One of my favourite song < > http://trinityroots.bandcamp.com/track/all-we-be>s > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Sun Jul 3 14:03:05 2016 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Sun, 03 Jul 16 16:03:05 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] meru tantra In-Reply-To: <20160703140912.f2480df9802eee590468763f@ff.cuni.cz> Message-ID: Merutantre: pa?ca kh?n?? sapta m?n?? nava ??h? mah?bal?? || hindudharmapralopt?ro j?yante cakravarttina? || 148 || p?rv?mn?ye nava?ata?a?a??tipravarttina? || phira?gabh??ay? mantr?ste??? sa?s?dhan?dbhuvi || 149 || adhip? mandar???? ca sa?gr?me?vapar?jit?? || i?grej? nava gady??ca la??ane?vapi bh?vina? || 150 || bahuvidy?nid??v?na? pravakt?ro manoratha || tadb?jap?rvv?? sarvepi manavo v?masiddhid?? || 151 || -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada ?sas.ualberta.ca? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From slaje at kabelmail.de Sun Jul 3 14:55:18 2016 From: slaje at kabelmail.de (Walter Slaje) Date: Sun, 03 Jul 16 16:55:18 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Indra Message-ID: You might wish to consider this: ?V 10.96 praises Indra?s pair of dun horses (*h?r?*). The god is described as having *h?ri-?ma??ru* and/or *h?ri-ke?a *(10.23.4b; 96.5b;8a). The colors related to Indra there are said to be *harita*. Geldner identified the god?s horses as ?*Falbenpaar*? and translated the color of Indra?s hair and beard as ?*goldgelb*? (?golden yellow?). In their introductory comment on this S?kta, Brereton & Jamison speak of ?*fallow bay horses*? and ?*an extended pun between the words **hari/harita **?gold-colored, tawny*?. Despite the color as they defined it, Brereton & Jamison decided to ?*render the former as ?golden,? even in reference to the horses* [?]?. Indra appears in their translation of that hymn accordingly as ?*golden-bearded, golden-haired*? (X.96.8). In 10.23.4b, however, where Indra?s beard is also referred to (*?ndra? ?m??r??i h?rit?bh? pru??ute*), Brereton & Jamison translate its color more acceptably as ?tawny?: ?*Indra sprinkles his tawny beard*.? It should be noted that the color name remains the same in the RV. Although it is certainly most difficult to determine the semantic coverage of color designations from words and their etymologies alone, it is perhaps possible to approach it in the present case from the angle of comparisons made of Indra?s hair and beard color with the coat of animals: *Hari* is used also as a designation for animals the fur of which is yellowish or tawny, such as monkeys, (dun or bay) horses, or lions. Their color could have hardly been perceived as ?golden? in the sense of deep red gold, but, if at all, as ?stray yellow?. The latter rather seems to match pale yellow gold. This kind of gold was widespread and has commonly been perceived in the West as gold per se, which might have inspired Western translators to introduce the gold metaphor. ?Goldhaar / with golden hair? is a well-known poetic expression for blond girls in Western literature. There is no attested primary meaning in the ?V of *hari*(*ta*) connoting ?gold(en)? in the sense of the precious metal, at least not to my knowledge. In addition to the evidence of ?gvedic Kavis depicting the phenotypic appearance of Indra as they saw it, I would like to draw attention to another one, which appears to confirm that Indra?s hair and beard color was imagined as fair also in the V?jasaney? Sa?hit? (19.91-92). The text adds some more color comparisons taken from the animal and plant kingdoms: *?ndrasya r?p??* [?] | *y?v? n? barh?r bhruv? k?sar??i* [?] || 91 || (Mah?dhara: *yav? barhi? ca bhruvi* [=] *bhruvo?*) *?tm?nn up?sthe n? v??kasya l?ma m?khe ?m??r??i n? vy?ghralom? | k??? n? ??r??n y??ase ?riy?i ??kh? si?h?sya l?ma tv??ir indriy??i* || 92 || In brief, eyebrows [of the color] of barley and sacrificial grass; body and pubic hairs [dense] like a wolf; his beard: the hair [color] of a tiger; his hair: the shine of [the color of] a lion. Heinrich Zimmer sen., who from the evidence he had collected at the time described Indra as with blond hair (?Indra wird b?rtig gedacht; wie er blondes Haupthaar *(harike?a) *tr?gt, so auch einen blonden Bart *(hari?ma??ru) *Rv.10, 96, 8? ? ?Altindisches Leben?. Berlin 1879, p. 265) translated the VS quote in the following manner (p. 266): ?Wie Gersten(?hren)und Grasb?schel sind die Haare an seinen Brauen, am K?rper, in seinem Schooss hat er Haare wie ein Wolf, im Antlitz einen Bart wie Tigerhaar (blond, *hari), *die Haare auf dem Kopf sind zur Zier, zum Schmuck der Haarbusch, wie L?wenhaar sind Glanz und gewaltige Erscheinung?. *?ndr?yendo p?ri srava*! WS ----------------------------- Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 D-99425 Weimar Deutschland Ego ex animi mei sententia spondeo ac polliceor studia humanitatis impigro labore culturum et provecturum non sordidi lucri causa nec ad vanam captandam gloriam, sed quo magis veritas propagetur et lux eius, qua salus humani generis continetur, clarius effulgeat. Vindobonae, die XXI. mensis Novembris MCMLXXXIII. 2016-07-03 11:02 GMT+02:00 rainer stuhrmann : > S?rya is once said to be h?ri-ke?a (10,137,7) and also, in association > with the rising of the sun, h?ri-ke?a is once said from Savitar, RV > 10.139,1ab: > > s??ryara?mir h?rike?a? pur?st?t savit?? jy?tir ?d ay?m? ?jasram / > > ?With rays of the sun, with yellow-red (golden) hair, from the east > Savitar has just raised up the unfading light.? > > Also Agni is once, RV 3,2,13, said to be h?ri-ke?a and RV 1, 79,1, to be > of "golden hair" (h?ra?ya-ke?a). > > This seems to be metaphoric in contrast to Indra?s anthropomorphic > descriptions. > > > Rainer > > > Am 03.07.2016 um 01:20 schrieb Allen Thrasher: > > Were the other RV deities hari- in their hair, or just Indra? > > Allen > > > Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android > > > On Sat, Jul 2, 2016 at 12:36 PM, rainer stuhrmann > wrote: > > Dear Howard, > > > > Indra`s visible appearence: > > > > according to RV 10,95,8 Indra is *h?ri-ke?a* and *h?ri-?ma??ru*, of ?yellow-red > (golden) hair? and ?yellow-red (golden) beard?. > > *h?ri *is also used of the fire, the sun, of lightening and of Indras > horses - and of the Soma plant. > > > According to Falk, however, *h?ri * denotes ?yellowish-green to green? > (Falk, p.85, Soma I and II, BSOAS, Vol. 52, No. 1,1989, pp. 77-90 ), > > because this - he thinks - makes that colourful epitheton fit to the > ?bluish green? (Falk, p.85) colour of the ephedra plant. That would make > > Indra the first punk of history. > > > > Rainer Stuhrmann > > Stuttgart > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From slaje at kabelmail.de Sun Jul 3 18:11:10 2016 From: slaje at kabelmail.de (Walter Slaje) Date: Sun, 03 Jul 16 20:11:10 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Indra (Addendum) Message-ID: ?*Addendum* The earliest translation of the ?gveda (1876) by no less a Vedic scholar than Alfred Ludwig renders *h?ri *by "gelb" (yellow). M. Mayrhofer's Etymological Dictionary of Old Indo-Aryan(2006) indirectly confirms Ludwig's early rendering. Mayrhofer determines the original meaning of *h?ri*- as "pale, yellowish; yellowish steed": 10.23.4 (= Ludwig?s translation No. 631) ?Indra beschnaubt seinen *gelben bart*? (Ludwig, Transl. Vol. 2., Prag 1876, p. 242) 10.96.8 (=Ludwig?s translation No. 645) ?der mit *gelbem barte*, mit *gelbem haare*? (Ludwig, Transl. Vol. 2., Prag 1876, p. 258) M. Mayrhofer, EWA (Vol. 2, Heidelberg 1996, p. 805 s.v. *hari*-) ?Adj. *fahl, gelblich*, gr?nlich, m. *gelbliches Ro?* (RV +).? Thus there is no linguistic or notional derivation from "gold" recognisable in ?gvedic *h?ri*. Translating it nonetheless by "golden" (or cognate adjectives) would - according to established standards of (not only Sanskrit) philology - call for a sound justification. ? ?WS? 2016-07-03 16:55 GMT+02:00 Walter Slaje : > You might wish to consider this: > > > ?V 10.96 praises Indra?s pair of dun horses (*h?r?*). The god is > described as having *h?ri-?ma??ru* and/or *h?ri-ke?a *(10.23.4b; 96.5b;8a). > The colors related to Indra there are said to be *harita*. Geldner > identified the god?s horses as ?*Falbenpaar*? and translated the color of > Indra?s hair and beard as ?*goldgelb*? (?golden yellow?). > > In their introductory comment on this S?kta, Brereton & Jamison speak of ?*fallow > bay horses*? and ?*an extended pun between the words **hari/harita **?gold-colored, > tawny*?. Despite the color as they defined it, Brereton & Jamison decided > to ?*render the former as ?golden,? even in reference to the horses* > [?]?. Indra appears in their translation of that hymn accordingly as ?*golden-bearded, > golden-haired*? (X.96.8). > > In 10.23.4b, however, where Indra?s beard is also referred to (*?ndra? > ?m??r??i h?rit?bh? pru??ute*), Brereton & Jamison translate its color > more acceptably as ?tawny?: ?*Indra sprinkles his tawny beard*.? It > should be noted that the color name remains the same in the RV. > > > > Although it is certainly most difficult to determine the semantic coverage > of color designations from words and their etymologies alone, it is perhaps > possible to approach it in the present case from the angle of comparisons > made of Indra?s hair and beard color with the coat of animals: > > *Hari* is used also as a designation for animals the fur of which is > yellowish or tawny, such as monkeys, (dun or bay) horses, or lions. Their > color could have hardly been perceived as ?golden? in the sense of deep red > gold, but, if at all, as ?stray yellow?. The latter rather seems to match > pale yellow gold. This kind of gold was widespread and has commonly been > perceived in the West as gold per se, which might have inspired Western > translators to introduce the gold metaphor. ?Goldhaar / with golden hair? > is a well-known poetic expression for blond girls in Western literature. > > There is no attested primary meaning in the ?V of *hari*(*ta*) connoting > ?gold(en)? in the sense of the precious metal, at least not to my knowledge. > > > > In addition to the evidence of ?gvedic Kavis depicting the phenotypic > appearance of Indra as they saw it, I would like to draw attention to > another one, which appears to confirm that Indra?s hair and beard color was > imagined as fair also in the V?jasaney? Sa?hit? (19.91-92). The text adds > some more color comparisons taken from the animal and plant kingdoms: > > *?ndrasya r?p??* [?] | > *y?v? n? barh?r bhruv? k?sar??i* [?] || 91 || (Mah?dhara: *yav? barhi? ca > bhruvi* [=] *bhruvo?*) > > > *?tm?nn up?sthe n? v??kasya l?ma m?khe ?m??r??i n? vy?ghralom? | k??? n? > ??r??n y??ase ?riy?i ??kh? si?h?sya l?ma tv??ir indriy??i* || 92 || > > > In brief, eyebrows [of the color] of barley and sacrificial grass; body > and pubic hairs [dense] like a wolf; his beard: the hair [color] of a > tiger; his hair: the shine of [the color of] a lion. > > > > Heinrich Zimmer sen., who from the evidence he had collected at the time > described Indra as with blond hair (?Indra wird b?rtig gedacht; wie er > blondes Haupthaar *(harike?a) *tr?gt, so auch einen blonden Bart *(hari?ma??ru) > *Rv.10, 96, 8? ? ?Altindisches Leben?. Berlin 1879, p. 265) translated > the VS quote in the following manner (p. 266): > > ?Wie Gersten(?hren)und Grasb?schel sind die Haare an seinen Brauen, am > K?rper, in seinem Schooss hat er Haare wie ein Wolf, im Antlitz einen Bart > wie Tigerhaar (blond, *hari), *die Haare auf dem Kopf sind zur Zier, zum > Schmuck der Haarbusch, wie L?wenhaar sind Glanz und gewaltige Erscheinung?. > > > > *?ndr?yendo p?ri srava*! > > > WS > > > ----------------------------- > Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje > Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 > D-99425 Weimar > Deutschland > > Ego ex animi mei sententia spondeo ac polliceor > studia humanitatis impigro labore culturum et provecturum > non sordidi lucri causa nec ad vanam captandam gloriam, > sed quo magis veritas propagetur et lux eius, qua salus > humani generis continetur, clarius effulgeat. > Vindobonae, die XXI. mensis Novembris MCMLXXXIII. > > > 2016-07-03 11:02 GMT+02:00 rainer stuhrmann : > >> S?rya is once said to be h?ri-ke?a (10,137,7) and also, in association >> with the rising of the sun, h?ri-ke?a is once said from Savitar, RV >> 10.139,1ab: >> >> s??ryara?mir h?rike?a? pur?st?t savit?? jy?tir ?d ay?m? ?jasram / >> >> ?With rays of the sun, with yellow-red (golden) hair, from the east >> Savitar has just raised up the unfading light.? >> >> Also Agni is once, RV 3,2,13, said to be h?ri-ke?a and RV 1, 79,1, to >> be of "golden hair" (h?ra?ya-ke?a). >> >> This seems to be metaphoric in contrast to Indra?s anthropomorphic >> descriptions. >> >> >> Rainer >> >> >> Am 03.07.2016 um 01:20 schrieb Allen Thrasher: >> >> Were the other RV deities hari- in their hair, or just Indra? >> >> Allen >> >> >> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android >> >> >> On Sat, Jul 2, 2016 at 12:36 PM, rainer stuhrmann >> wrote: >> >> Dear Howard, >> >> >> >> Indra`s visible appearence: >> >> >> >> according to RV 10,95,8 Indra is *h?ri-ke?a* and *h?ri-?ma??ru*, of ?yellow-red >> (golden) hair? and ?yellow-red (golden) beard?. >> >> *h?ri *is also used of the fire, the sun, of lightening and of Indras >> horses - and of the Soma plant. >> >> >> According to Falk, however, *h?ri * denotes ?yellowish-green to green? >> (Falk, p.85, Soma I and II, BSOAS, Vol. 52, No. 1,1989, pp. 77-90 ), >> >> because this - he thinks - makes that colourful epitheton fit to the >> ?bluish green? (Falk, p.85) colour of the ephedra plant. That would make >> >> Indra the first punk of history. >> >> >> >> Rainer Stuhrmann >> >> Stuttgart >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com Sun Jul 3 23:14:25 2016 From: hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com (Harry Spier) Date: Sun, 03 Jul 16 19:14:25 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Word internal doubling of consonent ch after vowels in Rg Veda Message-ID: Dear list members, As far as I can see in Aufrechts edition of the Rg Veda he doesn't do word internal doubling of the consonent ch after vowels . I did a search on gach/gacch and yach/yacch and yuch\yucch in Aufrecht. But another edition I looked at Max Muellers appears to do word internal doubling of consonent ch after vowels. What do the pratisakhyas and other authorities say about word internal doubling of ch in the Rg Veda? Is it mandatory, optional or not done? Whats the usual manuscript practice? Thanks, Harry Spier -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com Mon Jul 4 22:53:46 2016 From: hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com (Harry Spier) Date: Mon, 04 Jul 16 18:53:46 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Word internal doubling of consonent ch after vowels in Rg Veda In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thank you to Dipak Bhattacharya, Michael Witzel and George Cardona for their replies to my query. Harry Spier On Sun, Jul 3, 2016 at 7:14 PM, Harry Spier wrote: > Dear list members, > > As far as I can see in Aufrechts edition of the Rg Veda he doesn't do word > internal doubling of the consonent ch after vowels . I did a search on > gach/gacch and yach/yacch and yuch\yucch in Aufrecht. But another edition > I looked at Max Muellers appears to do word internal doubling of consonent > ch after vowels. > > What do the pratisakhyas and other authorities say about word internal > doubling of ch in the Rg Veda? Is it mandatory, optional or not done? > Whats the usual manuscript practice? > > Thanks, > Harry Spier > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From p.balcerowicz at uw.edu.pl Tue Jul 5 00:28:36 2016 From: p.balcerowicz at uw.edu.pl (Piotr Balcerowicz) Date: Tue, 05 Jul 16 02:28:36 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] online publication of "Logic and Belief in Indian Philosophy" Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, Below is a link to the following publication: http://www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz/indology/Logic_and_Belief_in_Indian_Philosophy_2016.pdf Logic and Belief in Indian Philosophy. Edited by Piotr Balcerowicz. Second Revised Edition, Warsaw 2016, which is re-edition (online publication) of the same published by Motilal Banarsidass, Delhi 2010 [ISBN 978-81-208-3446-0]. With best regards, Piotr Balcerowicz ---------------------------------------------------------- http://www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From soni at staff.uni-marburg.de Tue Jul 5 07:02:30 2016 From: soni at staff.uni-marburg.de (soni at staff.uni-marburg.de) Date: Tue, 05 Jul 16 09:02:30 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] online publication of "Logic and Belief in Indian Philosophy" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20160705090230.Horde.vuclgXf8gB09ud3qGzUy-PA@home.staff.uni-marburg.de> Dear Piotr, Thank you very much for this. It is wonderful to have it online, and especially revised. All the best, Jay Soni ----- Message from Piotr Balcerowicz --------- Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2016 02:28:36 +0200 From: Piotr Balcerowicz Subject: [INDOLOGY] online publication of "Logic and Belief in Indian Philosophy" To: indology at list.indology.info > Dear Colleagues, > > Below is a link to the following publication: > > http://www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz/indology/Logic_and_Belief_in_Indian_Philosophy_2016.pdf > > Logic and Belief in Indian Philosophy. Edited by Piotr Balcerowicz. Second > Revised Edition, Warsaw 2016, which is re-edition (online publication) of > the same published by Motilal Banarsidass, Delhi 2010 [ISBN > 978-81-208-3446-0]. > > With best regards, > Piotr Balcerowicz > ---------------------------------------------------------- > http://www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz/ ----- End message from Piotr Balcerowicz ----- -- From nmisra at gmail.com Tue Jul 5 11:12:11 2016 From: nmisra at gmail.com (Nityanand Misra) Date: Tue, 05 Jul 16 16:42:11 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Attested_use_of_var=E1=B9=A3eja/k=E1=B9=A3areja/=C5=9Bareja/vareja?= Message-ID: Dear list Are these any attested uses of the words *var?eja*, *k?areja*, *?areja*, and *vareja*? We know that these are all optional forms resulting from the rule *vibh??? var?ak?ara?aravar?t* (6.3.15). Are there any uses in standard works? Thanks, Nityananda -- Nity?nanda Mi?ra -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From krishnaprasadah.g at gmail.com Tue Jul 5 16:01:03 2016 From: krishnaprasadah.g at gmail.com (Krishnaprasad G) Date: Tue, 05 Jul 16 21:31:03 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]=09Attested_use_of_var=E1=B9=A3eja/k=E1=B9=A3areja/=C5=9Bareja/vareja?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Misra Ji ???? ???????????????????????????? ???????????? ? ????? ?????? ???? ????????? ???????????? ????? ????????? (????????????? ?? ????? ? ???? On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 4:42 PM, Nityanand Misra wrote: > Dear list > > Are these any attested uses of the words *var?eja*, *k?areja*, *?areja*, > and *vareja*? > > We know that these are all optional forms resulting from the rule *vibh??? > var?ak?ara?aravar?t* (6.3.15). Are there any uses in standard works? > > Thanks, Nityananda > > -- > Nity?nanda Mi?ra > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Palaniappa at aol.com Tue Jul 5 17:11:35 2016 From: Palaniappa at aol.com (Sudalaimuthu Palaniappan) Date: Tue, 05 Jul 16 12:11:35 -0500 Subject: High court decision on Perumal Murugan Message-ID: <54BB5671-2417-4DF9-8324-59F83F56AC3A@aol.com> The following decision may be of interest to the members http://scroll.in/article/811211/the-right-to-write-key-bits-from-the-judgment-that-brings-author-perumal-murugan-back-from-the-dead Regards, Palaniappan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From vjroebuck at btinternet.com Tue Jul 5 18:41:36 2016 From: vjroebuck at btinternet.com (Valerie Roebuck) Date: Tue, 05 Jul 16 19:41:36 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] High court decision on Perumal Murugan In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <32D98F8A-F541-40F4-8BA8-F988650A4565@btinternet.com> It?s good to read this calm, sensible judgement. Valerie J Roebuck Manchester, UK > On 5 Jul 2016, at 18:12, Sudalaimuthu Palaniappan via INDOLOGY wrote: > > > From: Sudalaimuthu Palaniappan > Subject: High court decision on Perumal Murugan > Date: 5 July 2016 at 18:11:35 BST > To: Indology > > > The following decision may be of interest to the members > > http://scroll.in/article/811211/the-right-to-write-key-bits-from-the-judgment-that-brings-author-perumal-murugan-back-from-the-dead > > Regards, > Palaniappan > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karp at uw.edu.pl Tue Jul 5 18:59:22 2016 From: karp at uw.edu.pl (Artur Karp) Date: Tue, 05 Jul 16 20:59:22 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Two etymologies Message-ID: Dear List, Two epic heroes: Utta?ka and Tak?aka. Do their names have established etymologies? In advance, Artur Karp (ret.) University of Warsaw Poland -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From krishnaprasadah.g at gmail.com Wed Jul 6 04:22:24 2016 From: krishnaprasadah.g at gmail.com (Krishnaprasad G) Date: Wed, 06 Jul 16 09:52:24 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Amarakhandana PDF request Message-ID: Dear all I am searching for AmaraKhandana I found the reference from A History of Indian Literature series Indian Lexicography Vol 5 Fasc 4 Page 318 However I have downloaded Amara Mandana from digital library of India Thanks -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dipak.d2004 at gmail.com Wed Jul 6 04:28:28 2016 From: dipak.d2004 at gmail.com (Dipak Bhattacharya) Date: Wed, 06 Jul 16 09:58:28 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Two etymologies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Utta?ka and Tak?aka. The etymological meaning is not always found in names. ta;nc ?gerinnen lassen? ?let run? is rare but Mayrhofer (EWA)cites post-RV instances like ?- *tanakti* (TS); *tak?aka* Mayrhofer - ?Zimmerman?;= ?carpenter?. This meaning is indicated in RV.1.32.2 *tatak?a*. Here the etymological meaning stands. Bset DB On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 12:29 AM, Artur Karp wrote: > Dear List, > > Two epic heroes: Utta?ka and Tak?aka. > > Do their names have established etymologies? > > In advance, > > Artur Karp (ret.) > > University of Warsaw > Poland > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dchakra at hotmail.de Wed Jul 6 06:39:48 2016 From: dchakra at hotmail.de (Dr. Debabrata Chakrabarti) Date: Wed, 06 Jul 16 06:39:48 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] How Indian sages viewed violence (and why western mythology has such different ideas about it) Message-ID: Dear List, I am giving here a link of the following topic and hope interested Indologists would like to read it. Regards DC How Indian sages viewed violence (and why western mythology has such different ideas about it) In Greek myth, violence is part of a movement from chaos to order. But Indian myth lays out that as long as violence exists, it will beget violence. http://scroll.in/article/811150/one-difference-between-indian-and-western-mythology-their-attitude-to-violence [http://d1u4oo4rb13yy8.cloudfront.net/facebook/safaisfisi-1467631665.jpg] How Indian sages viewed violence (and why western mythology has such different ideas about it) scroll.in In Greek myth, violence is part of a movement from chaos to order. But Indian myth lays out that as long as violence exists, it will beget violence. ???This body is like a musical instrument; what you hear depends upon how you play it.??? ??? Anandamayi Ma ???Inside every human being there exists a special heaven, whole and unbroken.??? - Paracelsus -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karp at uw.edu.pl Wed Jul 6 07:18:33 2016 From: karp at uw.edu.pl (Artur Karp) Date: Wed, 06 Jul 16 09:18:33 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] How Indian sages viewed violence (and why western mythology has such different ideas about it) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Debabrata, Who is the author of this nice piece? Is it you? Best, Artur Karp (ret.) University of Warsaw Poland 2016-07-06 8:39 GMT+02:00 Dr. Debabrata Chakrabarti : > > Dear List, > I am giving here a link of the following topic and hope interested > Indologists would like to read it. > Regards > DC > How Indian sages viewed violence (and why western mythology has such > different ideas about it) In Greek myth, violence is part of a movement > from chaos to order. But Indian myth lays out that as long as violence > exists, it will beget violence. > > > http://scroll.in/article/811150/one-difference-between-indian-and-western-mythology-their-attitude-to-violence > > > How Indian sages viewed violence (and why western mythology has such > different ideas about it) > > scroll.in > In Greek myth, violence is part of a movement from chaos to order. But > Indian myth lays out that as long as violence exists, it will beget > violence. > > > > > > > ???This body is like a musical instrument; what you hear depends upon how > you play it.??? ??? Anandamayi Ma > > ???Inside every human being there exists a special heaven, whole and > unbroken.??? - Paracelsus > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rajam at earthlink.net Wed Jul 6 14:49:35 2016 From: rajam at earthlink.net (rajam) Date: Wed, 06 Jul 16 07:49:35 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] How Indian sages viewed violence (and why western mythology has such different ideas about it) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: An eye-opener! Now I?m beginning to understand why some Indologists ?see? ?chaos and the need for controlling" women and certain groups of people as depicted in Old Tamil literature! Thanks and regards, V.S.Rajam > On Jul 5, 2016, at 11:39 PM, Dr. Debabrata Chakrabarti wrote: > > > Dear List, > I am giving here a link of the following topic and hope interested Indologists would like to read it. > Regards > DC > How Indian sages viewed violence (and why western mythology has such different ideas about it) > In Greek myth, violence is part of a movement from chaos to order. But Indian myth lays out that as long as violence exists, it will beget violence. > > > http://scroll.in/article/811150/one-difference-between-indian-and-western-mythology-their-attitude-to-violence > > How Indian sages viewed violence (and why western mythology has such different ideas about it) > scroll.in > In Greek myth, violence is part of a movement from chaos to order. But Indian myth lays out that as long as violence exists, it will beget violence. > > > > > > > ???This body is like a musical instrument; what you hear depends upon how you play it.??? ??? Anandamayi Ma > ???Inside every human being there exists a special heaven, whole and unbroken.??? - Paracelsus > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hr at ivs.edu Wed Jul 6 17:24:36 2016 From: hr at ivs.edu (Howard Resnick) Date: Wed, 06 Jul 16 10:24:36 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] How Indian sages viewed violence (and why western mythology has such different ideas about it) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <6365DF44-6C99-4B44-94A8-DFCC61178EF8@ivs.edu> I wondered at several statements in this article. I will discuss two of them. 1. "In dismay they watched Europeans say 'never again' after the First World War. In dismay they read posters at Holocaust museums that demanded history should be remembered, not repeated. That was like hoping humans could prevent the next thunderstorm. It revealed a failure to recognise the nature of humanity.? Granted that within an endlessly cycling and recycling cosmic history, the notion of a final, definitive end of violence is quite naive. Still, much good can be done in the world, and efforts to bring about that good should elicit our gratitude, and not merely our ?dismay.? To give an example, gardens must perpetually be weeded, but they are weeded and there are many beautiful gardens in the world. The lack of a final, once-and-for-all weeding should not elicit our dismay when we see people caring for lovely gardens. The Gita seems to teach this view in the famous verse 4.7: yadA yadA hi dharmasya glanir bhavati? The very term yadA yadA acknowledges that adharma is perpetual, but so should be our efforts to restore dharma. Gardens must ever be weeded, To use an example from the article, despite the tragic miscalculations after WW I, all post-war calculations have not been equally tragic. Indeed, despite serious mistakes, the post WW II arrangements were better. The UN survived where the League of Nations failed. The Marshall plan was an effective corrective to the harsh conditions imposed on Germany after WW I. Endless peace and virtue in the world of Maya would be hopeless utopianism. But we can and should make a difference. That?s why Holocaust Museums elicit in me much more than dismay. 2. "The only way to break free from the violent instinct is to outgrow our hungers and fears. This a sage can achieve through rigorous mental re-conditioning, but he also realises that such an enterprise cannot be forced on a population. It remains an individual endeavour, and can never be a collective enterprise.? Really? I find this incomprehensible, given the picture we find in, say, Mahabharata where good kings enact and protect peace in their realms, often with the committed encouragement and guidance of sages. Best wishes, Howard > On Jul 6, 2016, at 7:49 AM, rajam wrote: > > An eye-opener! Now I?m beginning to understand why some Indologists ?see? ?chaos and the need for controlling" women and certain groups of people as depicted in Old Tamil literature! > > Thanks and regards, > V.S.Rajam > > >> On Jul 5, 2016, at 11:39 PM, Dr. Debabrata Chakrabarti > wrote: >> >> >> Dear List, >> I am giving here a link of the following topic and hope interested Indologists would like to read it. >> Regards >> DC >> How Indian sages viewed violence (and why western mythology has such different ideas about it) >> In Greek myth, violence is part of a movement from chaos to order. But Indian myth lays out that as long as violence exists, it will beget violence. >> >> >> http://scroll.in/article/811150/one-difference-between-indian-and-western-mythology-their-attitude-to-violence >> >> How Indian sages viewed violence (and why western mythology has such different ideas about it) >> scroll.in >> In Greek myth, violence is part of a movement from chaos to order. But Indian myth lays out that as long as violence exists, it will beget violence. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ???This body is like a musical instrument; what you hear depends upon how you play it.??? ??? Anandamayi Ma >> ???Inside every human being there exists a special heaven, whole and unbroken.??? - Paracelsus >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rajam at earthlink.net Wed Jul 6 19:48:45 2016 From: rajam at earthlink.net (rajam) Date: Wed, 06 Jul 16 12:48:45 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Two etymologies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: For a layperson like me, the terms Utta?ka and Tak?aka seem to refer to two polar entities (north and south). These terms seem to find a place in Tamil literature as ?uttara? and ?takshi?a.? The term ?taccar? appears in Old Tamil referring to Greek carpenters, specifically Ionia (?yava?a-t-taccar?). > On Jul 5, 2016, at 9:28 PM, Dipak Bhattacharya wrote: > > Utta?ka and Tak?aka. > > The etymological meaning is not always found in names. ta;nc ?gerinnen lassen? ?let run? is rare but Mayrhofer (EWA)cites post-RV instances like ?-tanakti (TS); tak?aka Mayrhofer - ?Zimmerman?;= ?carpenter?. This meaning is indicated in RV.1.32.2 tatak?a. Here the etymological meaning stands. > > Bset > > DB > > > On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 12:29 AM, Artur Karp > wrote: > Dear List, > > Two epic heroes: Utta?ka and Tak?aka. > > Do their names have established etymologies? > > In advance, > > Artur Karp (ret.) > > University of Warsaw > Poland > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From d.wujastyk at gmail.com Thu Jul 7 08:02:45 2016 From: d.wujastyk at gmail.com (Dagmar Wujastyk) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 10:02:45 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India Message-ID: Dear all, Can anyone point me to publications on the making and use of glassware in ancient India? I am particularly interested in bottles (k?p?), as these appear relatively late in medical literature in the context of alchemical procedures. Many thanks! Dagmar Dr Dagmar Wujastyk University of Vienna Institute for South Asian, Tibetan and Buddhist Studies Spitalgasse 2, Hof 2.7 1090 Vienna Austria http://ayuryog.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From d.wujastyk at gmail.com Thu Jul 7 08:37:26 2016 From: d.wujastyk at gmail.com (Dagmar Wujastyk) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 10:37:26 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: <363679393C2EB44480CDA76B2F23C9F7609E3274@P2KITMBX06WC03.unicph.domain> Message-ID: Hi Ken, Well, ??rngadharasa?hit? 2.12.31 and 2, 12, 241 mention a "k?cak?p?", so I think in that case it probably is a glass bottle. That is, a glass bottle covered in cloth soaked in mud. 2,12, 241 also mentions a "k?cabh???a", which might not mean a bottle. In other cases, in which a k?p? is mentioned, it is not clear whether it might not be a clay vessel. Certainly, the way these procedures are done today involve glass bottles. See for example, here . Best, Dagmar On 7 July 2016 at 10:18, Kenneth Gregory Zysk wrote: > Hi Dagmar, > > > > Interesting query. How do you know that the word k?p? refers to a glass > bottle, as opposed to some other vessel, since much of alchemical > procedures used clay vessels? > > > > Best, > > Ken > > > > *From:* INDOLOGY [mailto:indology-bounces at list.indology.info] *On Behalf > Of *Dagmar Wujastyk > *Sent:* 7. juli 2016 10:03 > *To:* indology > *Subject:* [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India > > > > Dear all, > > Can anyone point me to publications on the making and use of glassware in > ancient India? I am particularly interested in bottles (k?p?), as these > appear relatively late in medical literature in the context of alchemical > procedures. > > Many thanks! > > Dagmar > > Dr Dagmar Wujastyk > > University of Vienna > > Institute for South Asian, Tibetan and Buddhist Studies > > Spitalgasse 2, Hof 2.7 > > 1090 Vienna > > Austria > > http://ayuryog.org > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zysk at hum.ku.dk Thu Jul 7 09:12:23 2016 From: zysk at hum.ku.dk (Kenneth Gregory Zysk) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 09:12:23 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?B?W0lORE9MT0dZXSDFmsSBcmTFq2xha2Fy4bmHxIF2YWTEgW5h?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <363679393C2EB44480CDA76B2F23C9F7609E3297@P2KITMBX06WC03.unicph.domain> I should appreciate it if someone could send me a pdf version of the ??rd?lakar??vad?na, ed by Sujitkumar Mukhopadhyaya (Santiniketan, 1954). Many thanks. Best, Ken Kenneth Zysk, PhD, DPhil Head of Indology Department of Cross-Cultural and Regional Studies University of Copenhagen Karen Blixens Vej 4, Bygn. 10, DK-2300 Copenhagen S Denmark Ph: +45 3532 8951 Email: zysk at hum.ku.dk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ondracka at ff.cuni.cz Thu Jul 7 09:23:34 2016 From: ondracka at ff.cuni.cz (Lubomir Ondracka) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 11:23:34 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_=C5=9A=C4=81rd=C5=ABlakar=E1=B9=87=C4=81vad=C4=81na?= In-Reply-To: <363679393C2EB44480CDA76B2F23C9F7609E3297@P2KITMBX06WC03.unicph.domain> Message-ID: <20160707112334.997d9caec96d4777a340d12c@ff.cuni.cz> Dear Kenneth, this title is available from DLI (4990010047994). Best, Lubomir On Thu, 7 Jul 2016 09:12:23 +0000 Kenneth Gregory Zysk wrote: > I should appreciate it if someone could send me a pdf version of the ??rd?lakar??vad?na, ed by Sujitkumar Mukhopadhyaya (Santiniketan, 1954). > Many thanks. > Best, > Ken > > > Kenneth Zysk, PhD, DPhil > Head of Indology > Department of Cross-Cultural and Regional Studies > University of Copenhagen > Karen Blixens Vej 4, Bygn. 10, > DK-2300 Copenhagen S Denmark > Ph: +45 3532 8951 Email: zysk at hum.ku.dk > > > From zysk at hum.ku.dk Thu Jul 7 09:47:07 2016 From: zysk at hum.ku.dk (Kenneth Gregory Zysk) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 09:47:07 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_=C5=9A=C4=81rd=C5=ABlakar=E1=B9=87=C4=81vad=C4=81na?= In-Reply-To: <20160707112334.997d9caec96d4777a340d12c@ff.cuni.cz> Message-ID: <363679393C2EB44480CDA76B2F23C9F7609E32FC@P2KITMBX06WC03.unicph.domain> Great. Thanks. Best, Ken -----Original Message----- From: Lubomir Ondracka [mailto:ondracka at ff.cuni.cz] Sent: 7. juli 2016 11:24 To: Kenneth Gregory Zysk Cc: indology Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] ??rd?lakar??vad?na Dear Kenneth, this title is available from DLI (4990010047994). Best, Lubomir On Thu, 7 Jul 2016 09:12:23 +0000 Kenneth Gregory Zysk wrote: > I should appreciate it if someone could send me a pdf version of the ??rd?lakar??vad?na, ed by Sujitkumar Mukhopadhyaya (Santiniketan, 1954). > Many thanks. > Best, > Ken > > > Kenneth Zysk, PhD, DPhil > Head of Indology > Department of Cross-Cultural and Regional Studies University of > Copenhagen Karen Blixens Vej 4, Bygn. 10, > DK-2300 Copenhagen S Denmark > Ph: +45 3532 8951 Email: zysk at hum.ku.dk > > > From ondracka at ff.cuni.cz Thu Jul 7 10:49:41 2016 From: ondracka at ff.cuni.cz (Lubomir Ondracka) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 12:49:41 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20160707124941.e2157888932bd5e159b11e5d@ff.cuni.cz> Dear Dagmar, quite exhaustive and up-to-date list of publications on glass in ancient India is an entry "Glass in Ancient India" in Encyclopaedia of the History of Science, Technology, and Medicine in Non-Western Cultures (ed. by Helaine Selin, 2nd ed. 2008), pp. 1023-1033. The article is written more from an archaeological perspective and thus deals mainly with glass beads, but I think that some references could be interesting for you. If you want I can send you a pdf off-list. Best, Lubomir On Thu, 7 Jul 2016 10:02:45 +0200 Dagmar Wujastyk wrote: > Dear all, > > Can anyone point me to publications on the making and use of glassware in > ancient India? I am particularly interested in bottles (k?p?), as these > appear relatively late in medical literature in the context of alchemical > procedures. > > Many thanks! > > Dagmar > > > Dr Dagmar Wujastyk > University of Vienna > Institute for South Asian, Tibetan and Buddhist Studies > Spitalgasse 2, Hof 2.7 > 1090 Vienna > Austria > > http://ayuryog.org From philipp.a.maas at gmail.com Thu Jul 7 11:04:48 2016 From: philipp.a.maas at gmail.com (philipp.a.maas) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 13:04:48 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India Message-ID: <577e370b.264ec20a.f7ade.3224@mx.google.com> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dipak.d2004 at gmail.com Thu Jul 7 12:28:09 2016 From: dipak.d2004 at gmail.com (Dipak Bhattacharya) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 17:58:09 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: 7.6.16 Dear Professor Wujastyk, Though this is in reply to your mail it does not directly address the question you raised. Hence I apologize. Still, what I may point out for you is that the existence of glass was evidenced in the second level from below at Hastin?pur? dated circa 1100 ? 800 BC by B.B.Lal (ASI Annual Bulletin, No.5 1954-55). There is a discussion on the matter. I do not know of anyone having questioned Lal?s dating and finding. Incidentally I might refer to the earlier views of Karl Hoffmann who assumed *k?ca* to be a borrowed word from OP *k?sa*. I made a long discussion on the matter in 2004, but that was in Bengali. I have not yet been able to complete an attempted English translation of the monograph. I shall be glad if this helped in any way. Best Dipak Bhattacharya On Thu, Jul 7, 2016 at 1:32 PM, Dagmar Wujastyk wrote: > Dear all, > > Can anyone point me to publications on the making and use of glassware in > ancient India? I am particularly interested in bottles (k?p?), as these > appear relatively late in medical literature in the context of alchemical > procedures. > > Many thanks! > > Dagmar > > > Dr Dagmar Wujastyk > University of Vienna > Institute for South Asian, Tibetan and Buddhist Studies > Spitalgasse 2, Hof 2.7 > 1090 Vienna > Austria > > http://ayuryog.org > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From d.wujastyk at gmail.com Thu Jul 7 12:48:02 2016 From: d.wujastyk at gmail.com (Dagmar Wujastyk) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 14:48:02 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thank you, Prof. Bhattacharya. I have just read the article proposed by Lubomir Ondracka, and it makes reference to Lal's work. Glass beads and use of glass for pottery glazes seems to have a very long history in India indeed. However, there was nothing in the article on bottles or glass vessels, except for an unreferenced claim that glass vessels are mentioned in the Amarako?a. The Su?rutasa?hit? seems to describe glass plates (S?trasth?na 46.453), but the earliest mention of a glass bottle I could find in medical literature was in the ??r?gadharasa?hit?. I am sure it also occurs in alchemical literature. With kind regards, Dagmar Wujastyk On 7 July 2016 at 14:28, Dipak Bhattacharya wrote: > 7.6.16 > > Dear Professor Wujastyk, > > Though this is in reply to your mail it does not directly address the > question you raised. Hence I apologize. Still, what I may point out for > you is that the existence of glass was evidenced in the second level from > below at Hastin?pur? dated circa 1100 ? 800 BC by B.B.Lal (ASI Annual > Bulletin, No.5 1954-55). There is a discussion on the matter. I do not > know of anyone having questioned Lal?s dating and finding. > > Incidentally I might refer to the earlier views of Karl Hoffmann who > assumed *k?ca* to be a borrowed word from OP *k?sa*. I made a long > discussion on the matter in 2004, but that was in Bengali. I have not yet > been able to complete an attempted English translation of the monograph. > > > I shall be glad if this helped in any way. > > Best > > Dipak Bhattacharya > > On Thu, Jul 7, 2016 at 1:32 PM, Dagmar Wujastyk > wrote: > >> Dear all, >> >> Can anyone point me to publications on the making and use of glassware in >> ancient India? I am particularly interested in bottles (k?p?), as these >> appear relatively late in medical literature in the context of alchemical >> procedures. >> >> Many thanks! >> >> Dagmar >> >> >> Dr Dagmar Wujastyk >> University of Vienna >> Institute for South Asian, Tibetan and Buddhist Studies >> Spitalgasse 2, Hof 2.7 >> 1090 Vienna >> Austria >> >> http://ayuryog.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Thu Jul 7 13:28:14 2016 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 13:28:14 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Two etymologies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047BB3C6A@xm-mbx-06-prod> The Tibetan translation of tak?aka is 'jog-po, used, so far as I know, only in the name of a particular N?gar?ja. The term, though, means "one who puts in place," and seems to convey the sense not quite of "carpenter," but rather something like "architect, construction foreman." Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jpo at austin.utexas.edu Thu Jul 7 13:35:49 2016 From: jpo at austin.utexas.edu (Olivelle, J P) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 13:35:49 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <73CBEFC2-A4A6-4382-B6FC-4BA98D5BCAA2@austin.utexas.edu> Hi Dagmar: Two persons to consult would be Osmond Bopeaarachchi and Sanjyot Mehendale. They were responsible for the underwater excavation of perhaps the oldest known shipwreck in the Indian ocean off Hambantota in Sri Lanka (c. 1st c. BCE, I think). And there were glassware and large glass ingot (I saw one of them in the museum in Colombo). The ship was probably going from Sri Lanka to Andhra. Patrick On Jul 7, 2016, at 3:02 AM, Dagmar Wujastyk > wrote: Dear all, Can anyone point me to publications on the making and use of glassware in ancient India? I am particularly interested in bottles (k?p?), as these appear relatively late in medical literature in the context of alchemical procedures. Many thanks! Dagmar Dr Dagmar Wujastyk University of Vienna Institute for South Asian, Tibetan and Buddhist Studies Spitalgasse 2, Hof 2.7 1090 Vienna Austria http://ayuryog.org _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Thu Jul 7 13:53:57 2016 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 13:53:57 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: <73CBEFC2-A4A6-4382-B6FC-4BA98D5BCAA2@austin.utexas.edu> Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047BB3CA1@xm-mbx-06-prod> A number of interesting glass objects are also known from the 200 BCE - 200 CE "Jetavana Treasure," on which see Hema Ratnayake, "The Jetavana Treasure," in Sri Lanka and the Silk Road of the Sea, eds. S. Bandaranayake et al. Colombo 2003 (illustrated in figs. 4 & 5 on p. 43). Some of the other articles in the same volume may mention glass as well, though, in the absence of an index, one will have to peruse. Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From d.wujastyk at gmail.com Thu Jul 7 14:08:35 2016 From: d.wujastyk at gmail.com (Dagmar Wujastyk) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 16:08:35 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: <1FDF46C9-B162-4180-8668-47C025076AC5@gmail.com> Message-ID: Many thanks for these very helpful pointers! Dagmar On 7 July 2016 at 16:07, Dan Lusthaus wrote: > See https://www.britishmuseum.org/PDF/Mairs.pdf > > From the British Museum, by Rachel Mairs, "Glassware from Roman Egypt at > Begram (Afghanistan) and the Red Sea trade?. Includes large bibliography. > > Dan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dipak.d2004 at gmail.com Thu Jul 7 14:13:09 2016 From: dipak.d2004 at gmail.com (Dipak Bhattacharya) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 19:43:09 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Two etymologies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: But cf., uttariiya 'upper outer decorative garment, a wrapper' and tasar 'silk'. Related? DB On Thu, Jul 7, 2016 at 1:18 AM, rajam wrote: > For a layperson like me, the terms Utta?ka and Tak?aka seem to refer to > two polar entities (north and south). > > These terms seem to find a place in Tamil literature as ?uttara? > and ?takshi?a.? > > The term ?taccar? appears in Old Tamil referring to Greek carpenters, > specifically Ionia (?yava?a-t-taccar?). > > > On Jul 5, 2016, at 9:28 PM, Dipak Bhattacharya > wrote: > > Utta?ka and Tak?aka. > > The etymological meaning is not always found in names. ta;nc ?gerinnen > lassen? ?let run? is rare but Mayrhofer (EWA)cites post-RV instances like ?- > *tanakti* (TS); *tak?aka* Mayrhofer - ?Zimmerman?;= ?carpenter?. This > meaning is indicated in RV.1.32.2 *tatak?a*. Here the etymological > meaning stands. > > Bset > > DB > > On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 12:29 AM, Artur Karp wrote: > >> Dear List, >> >> Two epic heroes: Utta?ka and Tak?aka. >> >> Do their names have established etymologies? >> >> In advance, >> >> Artur Karp (ret.) >> >> University of Warsaw >> Poland >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ondracka at ff.cuni.cz Thu Jul 7 14:21:12 2016 From: ondracka at ff.cuni.cz (Lubomir Ondracka) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 16:21:12 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20160707162112.b2f15efef95dc4a79e9544e1@ff.cuni.cz> I just went through this publication: S. N. Sen and Mamata Chaudhuri: Ancient Glass and India, New Delhi: Indian National Science Academy, 1985 (available from DLI). The authors discuss many archaeological findings of different glass objects (including flasks and bottles) and from my quick reading it seems that all ancient flasks and bottles found in India are of foreign origin. So it is highly probable that the technology of producing glass bottles is rather a latecomer in India. Best, Lubomir On Thu, 7 Jul 2016 14:48:02 +0200 Dagmar Wujastyk wrote: > Thank you, Prof. Bhattacharya. I have just read the article proposed by > Lubomir Ondracka, and it makes reference to Lal's work. Glass beads and use > of glass for pottery glazes seems to have a very long history in India > indeed. However, there was nothing in the article on bottles or glass > vessels, except for an unreferenced claim that glass vessels are mentioned > in the Amarako?a. > The Su?rutasa?hit? seems to describe glass plates (S?trasth?na 46.453), but > the earliest mention of a glass bottle I could find in medical literature > was in the ??r?gadharasa?hit?. I am sure it also occurs in alchemical > literature. > With kind regards, > Dagmar Wujastyk > > On 7 July 2016 at 14:28, Dipak Bhattacharya wrote: > > > 7.6.16 > > > > Dear Professor Wujastyk, > > > > Though this is in reply to your mail it does not directly address the > > question you raised. Hence I apologize. Still, what I may point out for > > you is that the existence of glass was evidenced in the second level from > > below at Hastin?pur? dated circa 1100 ? 800 BC by B.B.Lal (ASI Annual > > Bulletin, No.5 1954-55). There is a discussion on the matter. I do not > > know of anyone having questioned Lal?s dating and finding. > > > > Incidentally I might refer to the earlier views of Karl Hoffmann who > > assumed *k?ca* to be a borrowed word from OP *k?sa*. I made a long > > discussion on the matter in 2004, but that was in Bengali. I have not yet > > been able to complete an attempted English translation of the monograph. > > > > > > I shall be glad if this helped in any way. > > > > Best > > > > Dipak Bhattacharya > > > > On Thu, Jul 7, 2016 at 1:32 PM, Dagmar Wujastyk > > wrote: > > > >> Dear all, > >> > >> Can anyone point me to publications on the making and use of glassware in > >> ancient India? I am particularly interested in bottles (k?p?), as these > >> appear relatively late in medical literature in the context of alchemical > >> procedures. > >> > >> Many thanks! > >> > >> Dagmar > >> > >> > >> Dr Dagmar Wujastyk > >> University of Vienna > >> Institute for South Asian, Tibetan and Buddhist Studies > >> Spitalgasse 2, Hof 2.7 > >> 1090 Vienna > >> Austria > >> > >> http://ayuryog.org > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> INDOLOGY mailing list > >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > >> committee) > >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > >> unsubscribe) > >> > > > > From harzer at utexas.edu Thu Jul 7 15:01:31 2016 From: harzer at utexas.edu (harzer at utexas.edu) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 10:01:31 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3FC2732D-09B7-4BDE-9347-5FFE061561F2@utexas.edu> Wilhelm Rau has a short article on glass in ancient India. I do not have the reference on hand, but it might be obtainable in the appended bibliography from the Festschrift W. Rau...1987, there may be also recent updates of the bibliography. Cannot recall whether there was any mention of glass bottles and such. FYI. Edeltraud Harzer Austin, TX Sent from my iPad > On Jul 7, 2016, at 9:08 AM, Dagmar Wujastyk wrote: > > Many thanks for these very helpful pointers! > Dagmar > >> On 7 July 2016 at 16:07, Dan Lusthaus wrote: >> See https://www.britishmuseum.org/PDF/Mairs.pdf >> >> From the British Museum, by Rachel Mairs, "Glassware from Roman Egypt at Begram (Afghanistan) and the Red Sea trade?. Includes large bibliography. >> >> Dan > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From arlogriffiths at hotmail.com Thu Jul 7 15:13:17 2016 From: arlogriffiths at hotmail.com (Arlo Griffiths) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 15:13:17 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I may add one more recent publication: Perret, Daniel and Zulkifli Jaafar, eds. 2014. Ancient Glassware in Malaysia: The Pengkalan Bujang Collection. Kuala Lumpur: Department of Museums Malaysia. The collection in question (to my limited knowledge, I don't have the book at hand) consists of finds from a site at an important node in the Indian Ocean trade, and almost certainly includes many items produced in India. Best, Arlo Griffiths From: d.wujastyk at gmail.com Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2016 16:08:35 +0200 To: prajnapti at gmail.com Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India CC: INDOLOGY at list.indology.info Many thanks for these very helpful pointers! Dagmar On 7 July 2016 at 16:07, Dan Lusthaus wrote: See https://www.britishmuseum.org/PDF/Mairs.pdf >From the British Museum, by Rachel Mairs, "Glassware from Roman Egypt at Begram (Afghanistan) and the Red Sea trade?. Includes large bibliography. Dan _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From john.darumadera at gmail.com Thu Jul 7 15:43:56 2016 From: john.darumadera at gmail.com (John Huntington) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 11:43:56 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: In the northern Indic regions of what is now Pakistan and Afghanistan, there was a substantial number of glass objects found at Begram and some blue glass blocks (paving tiles?) around the stupa at Butkara I in Swat. The Begram material is probably imported but the big blocks of blue glass at Butkara I may have been produced locally. The Begram material is published in the J. Hackin: Memoires de la Delegation Archeologique Francaise en Afghanistan, *Recherches Arceologiques a Begram* Chantier No. 2 (1937), Text and Planches (2 vols) and *Nouvelles Recherches Archeologiques a Begram* (ancienne Kapici) (1939-1940) Text and Planches (2 books). I am not sure of the blue glass from Butkara I was ever published. John C. Huntington On Thu, Jul 7, 2016 at 10:08 AM, Dagmar Wujastyk wrote: > Many thanks for these very helpful pointers! > Dagmar > > On 7 July 2016 at 16:07, Dan Lusthaus wrote: > >> See https://www.britishmuseum.org/PDF/Mairs.pdf >> >> From the British Museum, by Rachel Mairs, "Glassware from Roman Egypt at >> Begram (Afghanistan) and the Red Sea trade?. Includes large bibliography. >> >> Dan > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From john.darumadera at gmail.com Thu Jul 7 15:49:25 2016 From: john.darumadera at gmail.com (John Huntington) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 11:49:25 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fwd: glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: sorry for the resend if this is one, I received a strange error message. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: John Huntington Date: Thu, Jul 7, 2016 at 11:43 AM Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India To: Dagmar Wujastyk Cc: Dan Lusthaus , indology < INDOLOGY at list.indology.info> In the northern Indic regions of what is now Pakistan and Afghanistan, there was a substantial number of glass objects found at Begram and some blue glass blocks (paving tiles?) around the stupa at Butkara I in Swat. The Begram material is probably imported but the big blocks of blue glass at Butkara I may have been produced locally. The Begram material is published in the J. Hackin: Memoires de la Delegation Archeologique Francaise en Afghanistan, *Recherches Arceologiques a Begram* Chantier No. 2 (1937), Text and Planches (2 vols) and *Nouvelles Recherches Archeologiques a Begram* (ancienne Kapici) (1939-1940) Text and Planches (2 books). I am not sure of the blue glass from Butkara I was ever published. John C. Huntington On Thu, Jul 7, 2016 at 10:08 AM, Dagmar Wujastyk wrote: > Many thanks for these very helpful pointers! > Dagmar > > On 7 July 2016 at 16:07, Dan Lusthaus wrote: > >> See https://www.britishmuseum.org/PDF/Mairs.pdf >> >> From the British Museum, by Rachel Mairs, "Glassware from Roman Egypt at >> Begram (Afghanistan) and the Red Sea trade?. Includes large bibliography. >> >> Dan > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From slaje at kabelmail.de Thu Jul 7 16:23:04 2016 From: slaje at kabelmail.de (Walter Slaje) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 18:23:04 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: For those interested in the matter and who do not have the Begram publications ready to hand, the images attached might convey an idea about the beauty of these artefacts. Regards, WS ----------------------------- Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 D-99425 Weimar Deutschland 2016-07-07 17:43 GMT+02:00 John Huntington : > In the northern Indic regions of what is now Pakistan and Afghanistan, > there was a substantial number of glass objects found at Begram and some > blue glass blocks (paving tiles?) around the stupa at Butkara I in Swat. > The Begram material is probably imported but the big blocks of blue glass > at Butkara I may have been produced locally. > > The Begram material is published in the J. Hackin: Memoires de la > Delegation Archeologique Francaise en Afghanistan, *Recherches > Arceologiques a Begram* Chantier No. 2 (1937), Text and Planches (2 > vols) and *Nouvelles Recherches Archeologiques a Begram* (ancienne > Kapici) (1939-1940) Text and Planches (2 books). > > I am not sure of the blue glass from Butkara I was ever published. > > John C. Huntington > > On Thu, Jul 7, 2016 at 10:08 AM, Dagmar Wujastyk > wrote: > >> Many thanks for these very helpful pointers! >> Dagmar >> >> On 7 July 2016 at 16:07, Dan Lusthaus wrote: >> >>> See https://www.britishmuseum.org/PDF/Mairs.pdf >>> >>> From the British Museum, by Rachel Mairs, "Glassware from Roman Egypt at >>> Begram (Afghanistan) and the Red Sea trade?. Includes large bibliography. >>> >>> Dan >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: AfghanistanNo160Begram.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 2247968 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: AfghanistanNo165Begram.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 1523586 bytes Desc: not available URL: From rajam at earthlink.net Thu Jul 7 16:31:09 2016 From: rajam at earthlink.net (rajam) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 09:31:09 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Two etymologies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <594A3280-3354-4F50-8700-9103A42FAF78@earthlink.net> I guess the terms referring to the cardinal directions have the root meaning of up/front (north), down/back (south), right (east ), and left (west). Here, I?m imagining we are facing the north. I?m also imagining the Cartesian coordinates of the y-axis for north and south; the coordinates of the x-axis for east and west. Thus, as Prof. Bhattacharya mentioned, ?uttariya? naturally refers to an upper garment. ?tasar? referring to ?silk? may be due to the silk?s ?flowing' quality. Just my wild speculation. > On Jul 7, 2016, at 7:13 AM, Dipak Bhattacharya wrote: > > > The term ?taccar? appears in Old Tamil referring to Greek carpenters, specifically Ionia (?yava?a-t-taccar?).> > But cf., uttariiya 'upper outer decorative garment, a wrapper' and tasar 'silk'. > Related? > DB > > On Thu, Jul 7, 2016 at 1:18 AM, rajam > wrote: > For a layperson like me, the terms Utta?ka and Tak?aka seem to refer to two polar entities (north and south). > > These terms seem to find a place in Tamil literature as ?uttara? and ?takshi?a.? > > The term ?taccar? appears in Old Tamil referring to Greek carpenters, specifically Ionia (?yava?a-t-taccar?). > > >> On Jul 5, 2016, at 9:28 PM, Dipak Bhattacharya > wrote: >> >> Utta?ka and Tak?aka. >> >> The etymological meaning is not always found in names. ta;nc ?gerinnen lassen? ?let run? is rare but Mayrhofer (EWA)cites post-RV instances like ?-tanakti (TS); tak?aka Mayrhofer - ?Zimmerman?;= ?carpenter?. This meaning is indicated in RV.1.32.2 tatak?a. Here the etymological meaning stands. >> >> Bset >> >> DB >> >> >> On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 12:29 AM, Artur Karp > wrote: >> Dear List, >> >> Two epic heroes: Utta?ka and Tak?aka. >> >> Do their names have established etymologies? >> >> In advance, >> >> Artur Karp (ret.) >> >> University of Warsaw >> Poland >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From klongwaters at utexas.edu Thu Jul 7 16:45:20 2016 From: klongwaters at utexas.edu (Kathleen Longwaters) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 10:45:20 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Naqvi in A Study of Buddhist Medicine and Surgery in Gandhara 2011: 46 also mentions glass tiles found at the Dharmarajika Stupa, Taxila. He presumes they are imported. Kathleen Longwaters Sent from my iPad > On Jul 7, 2016, at 9:43 AM, John Huntington wrote: > > In the northern Indic regions of what is now Pakistan and Afghanistan, there was a substantial number of glass objects found at Begram and some blue glass blocks (paving tiles?) around the stupa at Butkara I in Swat. The Begram material is probably imported but the big blocks of blue glass at Butkara I may have been produced locally. > > The Begram material is published in the J. Hackin: Memoires de la Delegation Archeologique Francaise en Afghanistan, Recherches Arceologiques a Begram Chantier No. 2 (1937), Text and Planches (2 vols) and Nouvelles Recherches Archeologiques a Begram (ancienne Kapici) (1939-1940) Text and Planches (2 books). > > I am not sure of the blue glass from Butkara I was ever published. > > John C. Huntington > >> On Thu, Jul 7, 2016 at 10:08 AM, Dagmar Wujastyk wrote: >> Many thanks for these very helpful pointers! >> Dagmar >> >>> On 7 July 2016 at 16:07, Dan Lusthaus wrote: >>> See https://www.britishmuseum.org/PDF/Mairs.pdf >>> >>> From the British Museum, by Rachel Mairs, "Glassware from Roman Egypt at Begram (Afghanistan) and the Red Sea trade?. Includes large bibliography. >>> >>> Dan >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karp at uw.edu.pl Thu Jul 7 17:33:11 2016 From: karp at uw.edu.pl (Artur Karp) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 19:33:11 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Two etymologies In-Reply-To: <594A3280-3354-4F50-8700-9103A42FAF78@earthlink.net> Message-ID: > wild speculation Yes, quite wild, if I may say so. Tak?aka as 'builder' (Polish 'budowniczy', Czech 'stavitel'), 'construction foreman' sounds reasonable, quite convincing. Now, Uttanka? One who 'ruins', 'lays waste' (Turner 5628, ta?c ? ?contract, coagulate?)? See this Mbh episode (Kumbakonam 1906 Ed.), where Uttanka, while trying to enter Taksaka's underground home, violently destroys its entrance. Artur Karp -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: uttanka.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 138735 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: uttankacut.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 138735 bytes Desc: not available URL: From karp at uw.edu.pl Thu Jul 7 17:40:06 2016 From: karp at uw.edu.pl (Artur Karp) Date: Thu, 07 Jul 16 19:40:06 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Two etymologies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Complete page: 2016-07-07 19:33 GMT+02:00 Artur Karp : > > wild speculation > > Yes, quite wild, if I may say so. > > Tak?aka as 'builder' (Polish 'budowniczy', Czech 'stavitel'), > 'construction foreman' sounds reasonable, quite convincing. > > Now, Uttanka? One who 'ruins', 'lays waste' (Turner 5628, ta?c ? > ?contract, coagulate?)? > > See this Mbh episode (Kumbakonam 1906 Ed.), where Uttanka, while trying to > enter Taksaka's underground home, violently destroys its entrance. > > Artur Karp > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Uttankapage.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 108107 bytes Desc: not available URL: From karp at uw.edu.pl Fri Jul 8 08:15:54 2016 From: karp at uw.edu.pl (Artur Karp) Date: Fri, 08 Jul 16 10:15:54 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Two etymologies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, Utta?ka one more question: to your knowledge - does Mahabharata know of any other person whose name would end in *-**a?ka*? Artur Karp 2016-07-07 19:40 GMT+02:00 Artur Karp : > > Complete page: > > 2016-07-07 19:33 GMT+02:00 Artur Karp : > >> > wild speculation >> >> Yes, quite wild, if I may say so. >> >> Tak?aka as 'builder' (Polish 'budowniczy', Czech 'stavitel'), >> 'construction foreman' sounds reasonable, quite convincing. >> >> Now, Uttanka? One who 'ruins', 'lays waste' (Turner 5628, ta?c ? >> ?contract, coagulate?)? >> >> See this Mbh episode (Kumbakonam 1906 Ed.), where Uttanka, while trying >> to enter Taksaka's underground home, violently destroys its entrance. >> >> Artur Karp >> >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From caf57 at cam.ac.uk Fri Jul 8 08:31:14 2016 From: caf57 at cam.ac.uk (C.A. Formigatti) Date: Fri, 08 Jul 16 09:31:14 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Bibliographical help for illuminated Nepalese manuscripts In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <642605cc36d3d8cee812293a57d2aaff@cam.ac.uk> Dear Colleagues, a friend and colleague of mine, Daniele Cuneo, is currently finishing up an article on an illuminated Nepalese manuscript preserved in the Cambridge collections and recently digitised by the Sanskrit manuscript project (see http://cudl.lib.cam.ac.uk/view/MS-ADD-00864/1). As he is no art historian, he is afraid he might have overlooked some relevant publication on that particular manuscript or some other related illuminated Nepalese manuscripts. He would be very grateful for any suggestion or pointer to useful materials. All the best, Camillo A. Formigatti From paolo.magnone at unicatt.it Fri Jul 8 09:42:07 2016 From: paolo.magnone at unicatt.it (Paolo Magnone) Date: Fri, 08 Jul 16 11:42:07 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Two etymologies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <494e9a63-c4c5-c860-b224-d6b1092b71f7@unicatt.it> Dear Arthur & list, I would rather connect the name Utta?ka to root TA?K ?live in distress?, whence ta?ka ?a miserable life? and ?grief produced from separation from a beloved object? (MW, Apte), which seems to suit very well his character and epic vicissitudes: he lives a miserable life as a lingering brahmac?rin, and grieves for the loss of precious objects ? the earrings (= talismans of youth?), the ambrosia in different (versions of ) myths belonging to his corpus. You may wish to have a look at my paper ?Utta?ka?s Quest?? (available here) offering a comprehensive interpretation of the Utta?ka corpus as related to the universal mythical theme of the quest for immortality. Paolo Magnone Sanskrit Language and Literature Catholic University of the Sacred Heart - Milan History of Religions - Hinduism & Buddhism Theological Faculty of Northern Italy - Milan Jambudvipa - Indology and Sanskrit Studies (www.jambudvipa.net) Academia.edu: http://unicatt.academia.edu/PaoloMagnone On 07/07/2016 19:40, Artur Karp wrote: Complete page: 2016-07-07 19:33 GMT+02:00 Artur Karp >: > wild speculation Yes, quite wild, if I may say so. Tak?aka as 'builder' (Polish 'budowniczy', Czech 'stavitel'), 'construction foreman' sounds reasonable, quite convincing. Now, Uttanka? One who 'ruins', 'lays waste' (Turner 5628, ta?c ? ?contract, coagulate?)? See this Mbh episode (Kumbakonam 1906 Ed.), where Uttanka, while trying to enter Taksaka's underground home, violently destroys its entrance. Artur Karp _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) [Logo] Universit? Cattolica investe nel talento, nella ricerca, nella solidariet?. Puoi farlo anche tu. CF 02133120150 www.unicatt.it/5permille -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Fri Jul 8 09:59:31 2016 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Fri, 08 Jul 16 15:29:31 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Two etymologies In-Reply-To: <494e9a63-c4c5-c860-b224-d6b1092b71f7@unicatt.it> Message-ID: This meaning ?live in distress? suits the character well, because it is his distress resulting from the curse of paushya ( to be childless) and his distress of his guru asking him why he took such a long time to return and the resulting frustration of him leading to the sarpayaaga. On Fri, Jul 8, 2016 at 3:12 PM, Paolo Magnone wrote: > Dear Arthur & list, > > I would rather connect the name Utta?ka to root TA?K ?live in distress?, > whence * ta?ka* ?a miserable life? and ?grief produced from separation > from a beloved object? (MW, Apte), which seems to suit very well his > character and epic vicissitudes: he lives a miserable life as a lingering *brahmac?rin, > *and grieves for the loss of precious objects ? the earrings (= talismans > of youth?), the ambrosia in different (versions of ) myths belonging to his > corpus. > > You may wish to have a look at my paper ?Utta?ka?s Quest?? (available here > ) offering a > comprehensive interpretation of the Utta?ka corpus as related to the > universal mythical theme of the quest for immortality. > > Paolo Magnone > Sanskrit Language and Literature > Catholic University of the Sacred Heart - Milan > History of Religions - Hinduism & Buddhism > Theological Faculty of Northern Italy - Milan > > Jambudvipa - Indology and Sanskrit Studies (www.jambudvipa.net) > Academia.edu: http://unicatt.academia.edu/PaoloMagnone > > > On 07/07/2016 19:40, Artur Karp wrote: > > > Complete page: > > 2016-07-07 19:33 GMT+02:00 Artur Karp : > >> > wild speculation >> >> Yes, quite wild, if I may say so. >> >> Tak?aka as 'builder' (Polish 'budowniczy', Czech 'stavitel'), >> 'construction foreman' sounds reasonable, quite convincing. >> >> Now, Uttanka? One who 'ruins', 'lays waste' (Turner 5628, ta?c ? >> ?contract, coagulate?)? >> >> See this Mbh episode (Kumbakonam 1906 Ed.), where Uttanka, while trying >> to enter Taksaka's underground home, violently destroys its entrance. >> >> Artur Karp >> >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing listINDOLOGY at list.indology.infoindology-owner@list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee)http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > > > [image: Logo] *Universit? Cattolica* *investe nel talento, nella ricerca, > nella solidariet?.* > Puoi farlo anche tu. *CF 02133120150* www.unicatt.it/5permille > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Fri Jul 8 10:00:06 2016 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Fri, 08 Jul 16 15:30:06 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Two etymologies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: http://pustak.org/index.php/dictionary/word_meaning/%E0%A4%A4%E0%A4%95%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%B7%E0%A4%95 *????? :* ???? [????????+??????-??] ?. ??????????? ????? ?? ?? ????? ??? ?? ?? ?? ????? ?? ????? ?? ?? ????? ?? ???? ?? ??????? ??? ??? ???? ???????? ?? ?????? ??? ?? ????? ?? ??? ??? ?. ????? ????? ?. ??????????? ?. ????? ?. ????????? ?. ??? ???? ???? ?? ?? ?????? ??? ?? ?? ??? ?. ?? ?????? ?? ????? ?. ??????? ??? ?? ?? ???? ???? ????? ???????? ??????? ???? ?? ???????? ???? ?? ??? ?? ??? ??? ?. ????? ????????? ?. ????? ?? *?????????*? On Fri, Jul 8, 2016 at 1:45 PM, Artur Karp wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > > Utta?ka > > one more question: to your knowledge - does Mahabharata know of any other > person whose name would end in *-**a?ka*? > > Artur Karp > > > > 2016-07-07 19:40 GMT+02:00 Artur Karp : > >> >> Complete page: >> >> 2016-07-07 19:33 GMT+02:00 Artur Karp : >> >>> > wild speculation >>> >>> Yes, quite wild, if I may say so. >>> >>> Tak?aka as 'builder' (Polish 'budowniczy', Czech 'stavitel'), >>> 'construction foreman' sounds reasonable, quite convincing. >>> >>> Now, Uttanka? One who 'ruins', 'lays waste' (Turner 5628, ta?c ? >>> ?contract, coagulate?)? >>> >>> See this Mbh episode (Kumbakonam 1906 Ed.), where Uttanka, while trying >>> to enter Taksaka's underground home, violently destroys its entrance. >>> >>> Artur Karp >>> >>> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karp at uw.edu.pl Fri Jul 8 10:07:57 2016 From: karp at uw.edu.pl (Artur Karp) Date: Fri, 08 Jul 16 12:07:57 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fwd: Two etymologies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Paolo (and List) Have you noticed the difference between the Kumbakonam and the newer Mbh eds. concerning the image of Uttanka trying - at first unsuccesfully - to enter Taksaka's realm? Any serious reason for it? Best ,and thanks once more, Ar*t*ur -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Fri Jul 8 10:17:11 2016 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Fri, 08 Jul 16 15:47:11 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Two etymologies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: FWIW, In the Telugu translation of MBh by Nannaya , he uses calls/translates Uttanka as Udanka, making it Ut +anka rather than Ut +tanka. 2016-07-08 15:30 GMT+05:30 Nagaraj Paturi : > > http://pustak.org/index.php/dictionary/word_meaning/%E0%A4%A4%E0%A4%95%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%B7%E0%A4%95 > > *????? :* ???? [????????+??????-??] ?. ??????????? ????? ?? ?? ????? ??? > ?? ?? ?? ????? ?? ????? ?? ?? ????? ?? ???? ?? ??????? ??? ??? ???? > ???????? ?? ?????? ??? ?? ????? ?? ??? ??? ?. ????? ????? ?. ??????????? ?. > ????? ?. ????????? ?. ??? ???? ???? ?? ?? ?????? ??? ?? ?? ??? ?. ?? ?????? > ?? ????? ?. ??????? ??? ?? ?? ???? ???? ????? ???????? ??????? ???? ?? > ???????? ???? ?? ??? ?? ??? ??? ?. ????? ????????? ?. ????? ?? *?????????* > ? > > On Fri, Jul 8, 2016 at 1:45 PM, Artur Karp wrote: > >> Dear Colleagues, >> >> Utta?ka >> >> one more question: to your knowledge - does Mahabharata know of any other >> person whose name would end in *-**a?ka*? >> >> Artur Karp >> >> >> >> 2016-07-07 19:40 GMT+02:00 Artur Karp : >> >>> >>> Complete page: >>> >>> 2016-07-07 19:33 GMT+02:00 Artur Karp : >>> >>>> > wild speculation >>>> >>>> Yes, quite wild, if I may say so. >>>> >>>> Tak?aka as 'builder' (Polish 'budowniczy', Czech 'stavitel'), >>>> 'construction foreman' sounds reasonable, quite convincing. >>>> >>>> Now, Uttanka? One who 'ruins', 'lays waste' (Turner 5628, ta?c ? >>>> ?contract, coagulate?)? >>>> >>>> See this Mbh episode (Kumbakonam 1906 Ed.), where Uttanka, while trying >>>> to enter Taksaka's underground home, violently destroys its entrance. >>>> >>>> Artur Karp >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > > -- > Nagaraj Paturi > > Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. > > Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies > > FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, > > (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) > > > > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From paolo.magnone at unicatt.it Fri Jul 8 12:28:12 2016 From: paolo.magnone at unicatt.it (Paolo Magnone) Date: Fri, 08 Jul 16 14:28:12 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fwd: Two etymologies In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Arthur & list, I had indeed remarked the difference in a footnote, reproduced here for convenience: --- The last sentence summarizes a passage found solely in the vulgate (Mbh 1.3.130b-132), which here exhibits a major discrepancy with respect to the critical edition, to its own advantage, it might be judged, at least going by textual considerations. Expunging the five-liner, whose gist is Indra's coming to the succour of the helpless Utta?ka, the critical edition has Utta?ka cleaving through the rift to the n?galoka unaided. However, Indra's intervention at this junction, besides being corroborated by version B, seems all the more plausible in view of the donor/helper role manifoldly played by him (albeit reluctantly on occasions) both in this same myth and elsewhere (see below). --- As for the reasons, I can only say that, for all the practical usefulness of the CE, and without entering into the merit of the soundness or otherwise of the editorial choices, in principle I share the misgivings once expressed by M. Biardeau (in the wake of S. L?vy) about the whole philological enterprise (see e.g. M. Biardeau, ?Some More Considerations about Text Criticism?, Pur??a X, 2 (1968)). Paolo Magnone On 08/07/2016 12:07, Artur Karp wrote: Dear Paolo (and List) Have you noticed the difference between the Kumbakonam and the newer Mbh eds. concerning the image of Uttanka trying - at first unsuccesfully - to enter Taksaka's realm? Any serious reason for it? Best ,and thanks once more, Artur _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) [Logo] Universit? Cattolica investe nel talento, nella ricerca, nella solidariet?. Puoi farlo anche tu. CF 02133120150 www.unicatt.it/5permille -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From asko.parpola at helsinki.fi Fri Jul 8 12:55:42 2016 From: asko.parpola at helsinki.fi (asko.parpola at helsinki.fi) Date: Fri, 08 Jul 16 15:55:42 +0300 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Book anniversary discount Message-ID: <20160708155542.Horde.eM9Qmfalb7umG0LI3b7Pdg9@webmail.helsinki.fi> Dear Colleagues and Friends, I received today the following message from OUP concerning my book "The Roots of Hinduism: The Early Aryans and the Indus Civilization". Some of you might be interested in the 30% discount offered. With best regards and wishes, Asko -------------------------- Hi Dr. Parpola, My name is Michelle, and I work with Alyssa Bender Russell on OUP?s Religion books. As of August 12, your book is one year old?congratulations! Here?s a 30% off promo code that you can send to friends, family, and colleagues to celebrate: It is the one-year anniversary of my book?s publication. If you haven?t ordered it yet, order online at https://global.oup.com/academic/product/the-roots-of-hinduism-9780190226923 with promotion code AAFLYG6 to save 30%. Warm regards, Michelle Mangione Michelle Mangione Marketing Assistant for Academic/Trade History | Oxford University Press 198 Madison Avenue | New York, NY 10016 michelle.mangione at oup.com | 212.726.6265 From rpjain1903 at gmail.com Fri Jul 8 18:12:54 2016 From: rpjain1903 at gmail.com (Rajeev P. Jain) Date: Fri, 08 Jul 16 23:42:54 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <35AA1FDC-59C3-45AF-AC47-139E366B8E47@gmail.com> The book is available with MLBD.Visit their site mlbd.com if you need to order Rajeev Rajeev Jain 10 A Rajniwas Marg Civil Lines 'ANANDA'-villa # 7 Delhi-110054 (INDIA) (011)23983983 > On 07-Jul-2016, at 10:15 PM, Kathleen Longwaters wrote: > > Naqvi in A Study of Buddhist Medicine and Surgery in Gandhara 2011: 46 also mentions glass tiles found at the Dharmarajika Stupa, Taxila. He presumes they are imported. > > Kathleen Longwaters > > Sent from my iPad > >> On Jul 7, 2016, at 9:43 AM, John Huntington wrote: >> >> In the northern Indic regions of what is now Pakistan and Afghanistan, there was a substantial number of glass objects found at Begram and some blue glass blocks (paving tiles?) around the stupa at Butkara I in Swat. The Begram material is probably imported but the big blocks of blue glass at Butkara I may have been produced locally. >> >> The Begram material is published in the J. Hackin: Memoires de la Delegation Archeologique Francaise en Afghanistan, Recherches Arceologiques a Begram Chantier No. 2 (1937), Text and Planches (2 vols) and Nouvelles Recherches Archeologiques a Begram (ancienne Kapici) (1939-1940) Text and Planches (2 books). >> >> I am not sure of the blue glass from Butkara I was ever published. >> >> John C. Huntington >> >>> On Thu, Jul 7, 2016 at 10:08 AM, Dagmar Wujastyk wrote: >>> Many thanks for these very helpful pointers! >>> Dagmar >>> >>>> On 7 July 2016 at 16:07, Dan Lusthaus wrote: >>>> See https://www.britishmuseum.org/PDF/Mairs.pdf >>>> >>>> From the British Museum, by Rachel Mairs, "Glassware from Roman Egypt at Begram (Afghanistan) and the Red Sea trade?. Includes large bibliography. >>>> >>>> Dan >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alanus1216 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 8 21:53:21 2016 From: alanus1216 at yahoo.com (Allen Thrasher) Date: Fri, 08 Jul 16 21:53:21 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] glass in ancient India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1914533166.4204318.1468014801383.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> P. K. Gode might have an article on it in one of his books of kleine schriften. I'm away from home right now and can't check. Allen Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Thu, Jul 7, 2016 at 4:04 AM, Dagmar Wujastyk wrote: Dear all, Can anyone point me to publications on the making and use of glassware in ancient India? I am particularly interested in bottles (k?p?), as these appear relatively late in medical literature in the context of alchemical procedures. Many thanks! Dagmar Dr Dagmar Wujastyk University of Vienna Institute for South Asian, Tibetan and Buddhist Studies Spitalgasse 2, Hof 2.7 1090 Vienna Austria http://ayuryog.org _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Sat Jul 9 11:12:49 2016 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Sat, 09 Jul 16 11:12:49 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] article search Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047BB42E8@xm-mbx-06-prod> Dear Indologists, Might one of you be able to help me to obtain a pdf copy of Kawasaki, Shinjo. 1977. "The Mimamsa Chapter of Bhavya's Madhyamaka-hrdaya?-karika - Text and Translation." many thanks in advance, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________________ From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Sat Jul 9 11:39:14 2016 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Sat, 09 Jul 16 11:39:14 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] article search In-Reply-To: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047BB42E8@xm-mbx-06-prod> Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047BB4305@xm-mbx-06-prod> Thanks so much, Madhav, for your near instant reply! best, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ______ From nmisra at gmail.com Sun Jul 10 03:35:25 2016 From: nmisra at gmail.com (Nityanand Misra) Date: Sun, 10 Jul 16 09:05:25 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_The_usage_=E2=80=98m=C4=81tarapitarau=E2=80=99_in_Pari=C5=9Bi=E1=B9=A3=E1=B9=ADaparva_(and_other_works)?= Message-ID: [Apologies for cross-posting] Dear list members I am looking for usages of the form ?m?tarapitarau? which was allowed for in the opinion of northern ?c?rya-s by ?m?tarapitar?vud?c?m? (A 6.3.31). A Google Book search on the Unicode ????????? led me to discover that the form is used in Hemacandra?s ?Pari?i??aparva?, but the snippet view (attached image) does not give any idea of where (which chapter or verse) the form is used. That the usage occurs in the work is further confirmed by the discussion by the editors Vijaya Dharma S?ri (and his two disciples) in the introduction to Muni Bhadra S?ri?s ??r???ntin?thamah?k?vyam?. Please see page 9 of the attached PDF (page 7 in the book) where the editors in their refutation of H Jacobi?s assessment of Hemacandra?s language discuss the form ?m?tarapitarau?. If somebody has a digital edition of ?Pari?i??aparva? or has come across the form ?m?tarapitarau? in the work, can they please help with the complete citation? In addition, citations of any other attested usages of ?m?tarapitarau? outside grammar works would be welcome. I am already aware of the examples in the ?Mah?bh??ya? (?m?tarapitarau bhojayata?? and ?m?tarapitar?v?naya?) and grammatical commentaries. I am not referred the Vaidika Pad?nukrama Ko?a (do not have a digital or print copy), perhaps the Vedic texts have an example or two. Thanks, Nity?nanda -- Nity?nanda Mi?ra -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Srisantinatha.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 363715 bytes Desc: not available URL: From nmisra at gmail.com Sun Jul 10 08:15:30 2016 From: nmisra at gmail.com (Nityanand Misra) Date: Sun, 10 Jul 16 13:45:30 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]=09The_usage_=E2=80=98m=C4=81tarapitarau=E2=80=99_in_Pari=C5=9Bi=E1=B9=A3=E1=B9=ADaparva_(and_other_works)?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Andrew Thanks for your kind help with the Pari?i??aparva citation. Could you please help with the link to the e-text edition of ???g?raprak??a that you used? I will check in other editions. Thanks, Nityananda On 10 July 2016 at 13:20, Andrew Ollett wrote: > Dear Nityanand, > > It seems that Jacobi has given the reference in the extract quoted by > Vijaya Dharma S?ri in the attachment as 3.130, which is confirmed by > checking the editions available on DLI (99999990244944, 99999990245113, > 99999990293745, 99999990321936). The full verse is: ?????????????? ? > ????????? ? ????? ? ?????? ????? ?????????????? ????????? ? > > I could not find a similar compound in any other work (an e-text of the > ???g?raprak??a, possibly based on Raghavan's edition, has m?tarapitarau in > ch. 11, but when I checked Dwivedi's edition the same passage has > m?t?pitar?bhy?m. (Of course Dwivedi silently corrects many of the > 'mistakes' in the manuscript...) > > Andrew > > >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > -- Nity?nanda Mi?ra -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Sun Jul 10 12:51:02 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sun, 10 Jul 16 08:51:02 -0400 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]=09The_usage_=E2=80=98m=C4=81tarapitarau=E2=80=99_in_Pari=C5=9Bi=E1=B9=A3=E1=B9=ADaparva_(and_other_works)?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Looking at the line ?????????????? ? ????????? ? ????? quoted from the Pari?i??aparvan, the first of this line looks metrically defective to me, and the metrically correct line would probably read ??????????????? ?. Assuming this to be the case, the usage ??????????????? is identical with what we find the the RV ??????????. The RV also has ??????????. Looking at the RV usages, it appears to me most likely that ????????? is a further development of the RV ??????????, and that it is no wonder that Patanjali says this is the usage of Ud?c?m "Northerners." Most likely, the developments of the RV usage, itself from this region, survived in that region. This is just a speculation. Madhav Deshpande On Sun, Jul 10, 2016 at 4:15 AM, Nityanand Misra wrote: > Dear Andrew > > Thanks for your kind help with the Pari?i??aparva citation. > > Could you please help with the link to the e-text edition of ???g?raprak??a > that you used? I will check in other editions. > > Thanks, Nityananda > > On 10 July 2016 at 13:20, Andrew Ollett wrote: > >> Dear Nityanand, >> >> It seems that Jacobi has given the reference in the extract quoted by >> Vijaya Dharma S?ri in the attachment as 3.130, which is confirmed by >> checking the editions available on DLI (99999990244944, 99999990245113, >> 99999990293745, 99999990321936). The full verse is: ?????????????? ? >> ????????? ? ????? ? ?????? ????? ?????????????? ????????? ? >> >> I could not find a similar compound in any other work (an e-text of the >> ???g?raprak??a, possibly based on Raghavan's edition, has m?tarapitarau in >> ch. 11, but when I checked Dwivedi's edition the same passage has >> m?t?pitar?bhy?m. (Of course Dwivedi silently corrects many of the >> 'mistakes' in the manuscript...) >> >> Andrew >> >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >> >> > > > -- > Nity?nanda Mi?ra > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From McComas.Taylor at anu.edu.au Mon Jul 11 01:09:28 2016 From: McComas.Taylor at anu.edu.au (McComas Taylor) Date: Mon, 11 Jul 16 01:09:28 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] New book: 'Seven Days of Nectar' Message-ID: Dear Colleagues I am delighted to announce that my new book, Seven Days of Nectar: Contemporary Oral Performance of the Bhagavatapura?a, is now available from OUP. This message arrived from the publisher today: 'Order online at https://global.oup.com/academic/product/seven-days-of-nectar-9780190611910 with promotion code AAFLYG6 to save 30%' Thanks to everyone who supported, encouraged, cajoled and helped me through this rather long gestation period. Yours McComas [https://global.oup.com/academic/covers/pdp/9780190611910] Seven Days of Nectar - McComas Taylor - Oxford University ... global.oup.com Seven Days of Nectar Contemporary Oral Performance of the Bhagavatapurana McComas Taylor. Applies performance theory to a Sanskrit text; First book on the oral ... ________________________________ McComas Taylor, Associate Professor Reader in Sanskrit College of Asia and the Pacific The Australian National University, Tel. + 61 2 6125 3179 Website: https://sites.google.com/site/mccomasanu/ Address: Baldessin Building 4.24, ANU, ACT 0200 Spoken Sanskrit in three minutes? Go on. Try it! ________________________________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dchakra at hotmail.de Mon Jul 11 07:17:02 2016 From: dchakra at hotmail.de (Dr. Debabrata Chakrabarti) Date: Mon, 11 Jul 16 07:17:02 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_T._Bloch,_An_Indian_Version_of_the_Iranian_Legend_of_S=C4=81m!?= Message-ID: Dear List, I translated an essay by T. Bloch on 'An Indian Version of the Iranian Legend of S?m' from German about two decades ago. I incidentally found this unpublished translation today, but was unable to get all references regarding it - I attach, therefore, a page of the translation for identification and pray if anybody is able to support me with the particulars (where it was published, date of issue, etc.). Regards DC ???This body is like a musical instrument; what you hear depends upon how you play it.??? ??? Anandamayi Ma ???Inside every human being there exists a special heaven, whole and unbroken.??? - Paracelsus -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: BlochAsample.doc Type: application/msword Size: 29696 bytes Desc: not available URL: From steiner at staff.uni-marburg.de Mon Jul 11 07:31:41 2016 From: steiner at staff.uni-marburg.de (Roland Steiner) Date: Mon, 11 Jul 16 09:31:41 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_T._Bloch,_An_Indian_Version_of_the_Iranian_Legend_of_S=C4=81m!?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20160711093141.Horde.8zo8nIYAMEfSPHngHMwt-Lf@home.staff.uni-marburg.de> Dear Dr. Chakrabarti, > T. Bloch on 'An Indian Version of the Iranian Legend of S?m' > if anybody is able to support me with the particulars (where it was > published, date of issue, etc.). Bloch, Theodor: Eine indische Version der iranischen Sage von S?m, in: Zeitschrift der Deutschen Morgenl?ndischen Gesellschaft, 64, 1910, pp. 733-738. Best wishes, Roland Steiner -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: BlochTheodor_EineindischeVersionderiranischenSagevonSam.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 1345162 bytes Desc: not available URL: From nmisra at gmail.com Tue Jul 12 00:37:44 2016 From: nmisra at gmail.com (Nityanand Misra) Date: Tue, 12 Jul 16 06:07:44 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]=09Attested_use_of_var=E1=B9=A3eja/k=E1=B9=A3areja/=C5=9Bareja/vareja?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks, Krishnaprasad for the citation. Very helpful. 2016-07-05 21:31 GMT+05:30 Krishnaprasad G : > Misra Ji > ???? ???????????????????????????? ???????????? ? > ????? ?????? ???? ????????? ???????????? ????? ????????? (????????????? ?? > ????? ? ???? > > On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 4:42 PM, Nityanand Misra wrote: > >> Dear list >> >> Are these any attested uses of the words *var?eja*, *k?areja*, *?areja*, >> and *vareja*? >> >> We know that these are all optional forms resulting from the rule *vibh??? >> var?ak?ara?aravar?t* (6.3.15). Are there any uses in standard works? >> >> Thanks, Nityananda >> >> -- >> Nity?nanda Mi?ra >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > -- Nity?nanda Mi?ra http://nmisra.googlepages.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From psdmccartney at gmail.com Tue Jul 12 05:57:18 2016 From: psdmccartney at gmail.com (patrick mccartney) Date: Tue, 12 Jul 16 15:57:18 +1000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] "ancient literature" Message-ID: Dear Friends, The Chairman of the ICHR, Prof. Y Sudershan Rao, has released a report into the activities they will faciliate in the near future. http://ichr.ac.in/Chairman_Perspective%20Plan.pdf >From this document it says that: *National Seminar on ?Antiquity, Continuity and Development of Civilisation and Culture in Bharat up to first millennium B C?: Theme:The land south of Meru (the Himalayan range) was traditionally known as Bharat, of which the land south of the Vindhya Range was known as Dakshinapath as an integral part of it.* I find my interest piqued by the following assertion that: *Ancient literature describes the country as a single well defined geographical unit from the Himalayas in north to the Indian Ocean in south. It is generally agreed that the culture and civilization of Bharat was continuous without a break.* Might anyone be able to point me towards this "ancient literature"? I would like to read it. All the best, Patrick McCartney, PhD School of Culture, History & Language College of the Asia-Pacific The Australian National University Canberra, Australia, 0200 Skype - psdmccartney Phone + Whatsapp: +61 414 954 748 Twitter - @psdmccartney academia - Linkedin #yogabodyANU2016 symposium Ep1 - Imagining Sanskrit Land Ep 2 - Total-am Ep 3 - Jalam ? Chillum A Day in our Ashram Stop animation short film of Shakuntala Forced to Clean Human Waste One of my favourite song s -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Tue Jul 12 09:52:50 2016 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Tue, 12 Jul 16 15:22:50 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] "ancient literature" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Sharing a portion of Bheeshmaparva as a pdf here. Though this may not exactly match with the passage quoted, you have the word Bhaarata in the name of a geopolitical unit discussed in the Bheeshmaparva of Mahabharata. It has: ?????????? ????? ????? ????? ????? ??????? ???????? ????? ????????????? ????????? ?????? ????????? ??? ?? Sanjaya's answer to this question is a description of the 'richness of Bharata Varsha' .He describes Bharata Varsha in that context. It is said here: ???? ?? ???????????? ????? ???? *???????* ??????????????? ?????? ??????????????? ?? ?? ???????? ? ?????? ???????????? ????????? ?????????? ????????? ?????? ???? *???????* ?? The following description from Vishnupurana may come close to the quoted passage: ?????? ???????????? ????????????? ???????? ?????? ??? ????? ??? ????? ???? ?????? ?? - Vishnu Purana (2.3.1) On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 11:27 AM, patrick mccartney wrote: > Dear Friends, > > The Chairman of the ICHR, Prof. Y Sudershan Rao, has released a report > into the activities they will faciliate in the near future. > > http://ichr.ac.in/Chairman_Perspective%20Plan.pdf > > From this document it says that: > > *National Seminar on ?Antiquity, Continuity and Development of > Civilisation and Culture in Bharat up to first millennium B C?: Theme:The > land south of Meru (the Himalayan range) was traditionally known as Bharat, > of which the land south of the Vindhya Range was known as Dakshinapath as > an integral part of it.* > > I find my interest piqued by the following assertion that: > > *Ancient literature describes the country as a single well defined > geographical unit from the Himalayas in north to the Indian Ocean in south. > It is generally agreed that the culture and civilization of Bharat was > continuous without a break.* > Might anyone be able to point me towards this "ancient literature"? I > would like to read it. > > > All the best, > > Patrick McCartney, PhD > School of Culture, History & Language > College of the Asia-Pacific > The Australian National University > Canberra, Australia, 0200 > > > Skype - psdmccartney > Phone + Whatsapp: +61 414 954 748 > Twitter - @psdmccartney > > academia > > - > > Linkedin > > > #yogabodyANU2016 symposium > > > > > Ep1 - Imagining Sanskrit Land > > Ep 2 - Total-am > > Ep 3 - Jalam ? Chillum > > A Day in our Ashram > > > Stop animation short film of Shakuntala > > > Forced to Clean Human Waste > > One of my favourite song > s > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: bheeshmaparvabharatreferencesresourcesdescription.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 100773 bytes Desc: not available URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Tue Jul 12 10:53:42 2016 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Tue, 12 Jul 16 16:23:42 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] "ancient literature" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: This is from a post by Sri V. Subrahmanian on another list: Here are two uses of the word in the Bh??ya of Shankaracharya, just informing us that the term was in use during his times: ?????????????????? ? ?????? ??????? ? ???????? ???? ? ?????????????? ? ??????? ? - ??????? ?????????????? ? ??????? ???? ? ??????? ?????? ????? ????? ????? ?????? ; ??? ??????????????????? ??????? ??????? ????? ?????????? ????????? ? ???????????????????????? ? ?????????????? ? ?????? ?????????? ? ??????? ? - ???????: ?? ??????? ? ????????? ???????????? ??????? ; ?????????? ?????? ?????????, ? ??????? ; ????????????? ?? ????????? ; ???????? ?? ??????? ??????? ???? ? On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 3:22 PM, Nagaraj Paturi wrote: > Sharing a portion of Bheeshmaparva as a pdf here. > > Though this may not exactly match with the passage quoted, you have the > word Bhaarata in the name of a geopolitical unit discussed in the > Bheeshmaparva of Mahabharata. > > It has: > > ?????????? ????? > > ????? ????? ????? ??????? ???????? ????? > > ????????????? ????????? ?????? ????????? ??? ?? > > Sanjaya's answer to this question is a description of the 'richness of > Bharata Varsha' .He describes Bharata Varsha in that context. > > It is said here: > > ???? ?? ???????????? ????? ???? *???????* > > ??????????????? ?????? ??????????????? ?? ?? > > ???????? ? ?????? ???????????? ????????? > > ?????????? ????????? ?????? ???? *???????* ?? > > > The following description from Vishnupurana may come close to the quoted > passage: > > ?????? ???????????? ????????????? ???????? ?????? ??? ????? ??? ????? > ???? ?????? ?? - Vishnu Purana (2.3.1) > > > > On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 11:27 AM, patrick mccartney < > psdmccartney at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Dear Friends, >> >> The Chairman of the ICHR, Prof. Y Sudershan Rao, has released a report >> into the activities they will faciliate in the near future. >> >> http://ichr.ac.in/Chairman_Perspective%20Plan.pdf >> >> From this document it says that: >> >> *National Seminar on ?Antiquity, Continuity and Development of >> Civilisation and Culture in Bharat up to first millennium B C?: Theme:The >> land south of Meru (the Himalayan range) was traditionally known as Bharat, >> of which the land south of the Vindhya Range was known as Dakshinapath as >> an integral part of it.* >> >> I find my interest piqued by the following assertion that: >> >> *Ancient literature describes the country as a single well defined >> geographical unit from the Himalayas in north to the Indian Ocean in south. >> It is generally agreed that the culture and civilization of Bharat was >> continuous without a break.* >> Might anyone be able to point me towards this "ancient literature"? I >> would like to read it. >> >> >> All the best, >> >> Patrick McCartney, PhD >> School of Culture, History & Language >> College of the Asia-Pacific >> The Australian National University >> Canberra, Australia, 0200 >> >> >> Skype - psdmccartney >> Phone + Whatsapp: +61 414 954 748 >> Twitter - @psdmccartney >> >> academia >> >> - >> >> Linkedin >> >> >> #yogabodyANU2016 symposium >> >> >> >> >> Ep1 - Imagining Sanskrit Land >> >> Ep 2 - Total-am >> >> Ep 3 - Jalam ? Chillum >> >> A Day in our Ashram >> >> >> Stop animation short film of Shakuntala >> >> >> Forced to Clean Human Waste >> >> One of my favourite song >> s >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > > -- > Nagaraj Paturi > > Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. > > Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies > > FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, > > (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) > > > > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From psdmccartney at gmail.com Tue Jul 12 13:03:42 2016 From: psdmccartney at gmail.com (patrick mccartney) Date: Tue, 12 Jul 16 23:03:42 +1000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] "ancient literature" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thank you Nagaraj and Dipak for taking the time to respond. I really appreciate it. All the best, Patrick McCartney, PhD School of Culture, History & Language College of the Asia-Pacific The Australian National University Canberra, Australia, 0200 Skype - psdmccartney Phone + Whatsapp: +61 414 954 748 Twitter - @psdmccartney academia - Linkedin #yogabodyANU2016 symposium Ep1 - Imagining Sanskrit Land Ep 2 - Total-am Ep 3 - Jalam ? Chillum A Day in our Ashram Stop animation short film of Shakuntala Forced to Clean Human Waste One of my favourite song s On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 7:52 PM, Nagaraj Paturi wrote: > Sharing a portion of Bheeshmaparva as a pdf here. > > Though this may not exactly match with the passage quoted, you have the > word Bhaarata in the name of a geopolitical unit discussed in the > Bheeshmaparva of Mahabharata. > > It has: > > ?????????? ????? > > ????? ????? ????? ??????? ???????? ????? > > ????????????? ????????? ?????? ????????? ??? ?? > > Sanjaya's answer to this question is a description of the 'richness of > Bharata Varsha' .He describes Bharata Varsha in that context. > > It is said here: > > ???? ?? ???????????? ????? ???? *???????* > > ??????????????? ?????? ??????????????? ?? ?? > > ???????? ? ?????? ???????????? ????????? > > ?????????? ????????? ?????? ???? *???????* ?? > > > The following description from Vishnupurana may come close to the quoted > passage: > > ?????? ???????????? ????????????? ???????? ?????? ??? ????? ??? ????? > ???? ?????? ?? - Vishnu Purana (2.3.1) > > > > On Tue, Jul 12, 2016 at 11:27 AM, patrick mccartney < > psdmccartney at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Dear Friends, >> >> The Chairman of the ICHR, Prof. Y Sudershan Rao, has released a report >> into the activities they will faciliate in the near future. >> >> http://ichr.ac.in/Chairman_Perspective%20Plan.pdf >> >> From this document it says that: >> >> *National Seminar on ?Antiquity, Continuity and Development of >> Civilisation and Culture in Bharat up to first millennium B C?: Theme:The >> land south of Meru (the Himalayan range) was traditionally known as Bharat, >> of which the land south of the Vindhya Range was known as Dakshinapath as >> an integral part of it.* >> >> I find my interest piqued by the following assertion that: >> >> *Ancient literature describes the country as a single well defined >> geographical unit from the Himalayas in north to the Indian Ocean in south. >> It is generally agreed that the culture and civilization of Bharat was >> continuous without a break.* >> Might anyone be able to point me towards this "ancient literature"? I >> would like to read it. >> >> >> All the best, >> >> Patrick McCartney, PhD >> School of Culture, History & Language >> College of the Asia-Pacific >> The Australian National University >> Canberra, Australia, 0200 >> >> >> Skype - psdmccartney >> Phone + Whatsapp: +61 414 954 748 >> Twitter - @psdmccartney >> >> academia >> >> - >> >> Linkedin >> >> >> #yogabodyANU2016 symposium >> >> >> >> >> Ep1 - Imagining Sanskrit Land >> >> Ep 2 - Total-am >> >> Ep 3 - Jalam ? Chillum >> >> A Day in our Ashram >> >> >> Stop animation short film of Shakuntala >> >> >> Forced to Clean Human Waste >> >> One of my favourite song >> s >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > > -- > Nagaraj Paturi > > Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. > > Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies > > FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, > > (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From peter.pasedach at googlemail.com Tue Jul 12 13:36:12 2016 From: peter.pasedach at googlemail.com (Peter Mukunda Pasedach) Date: Tue, 12 Jul 16 15:36:12 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Five_Bhaktis_in_S=C4=81man_Recitation?= Message-ID: Dear all, in the Haravijaya 6.33, sphu?ahi?kriy?dinidhan?vas?nat? - pratipannapa?cavidhabhaktisau??havam | druhi?ena s?ma bahuvartma g?yat? jagati tvam eva gu?agaura g?yase || 33 || a series of verses begins in which ?iva is praised in musicological terms, starting with the S?maveda recitation: "Oh Gu?agaura, by Brahman who is singing the s?man which is of many paths [and] in which excellence of a fivefold division has been obtained, which clearly has hi?kriy? at the beginning and nidhana at the end, it is you only in the world who are being sung." Utpala comments: "he gu?agaura, brahma?? bahuvartma s?ma g?yat? tvam eva g?yase, param?tmasvar?patv?t. sphu?a? k?tv? hi?kriy?ditay? hi?k?r?ditvena nidhan?ntatay? ca ?rita? pa?cavidhay? bhakty? sau??hava? yatra. tad ukta?: ??v?halak?m? hi?k?ra? prast?va? pratih?raka? | udg?tho nidhana? ceti pa?cokt?? s?mag?taya? ||? iti. kecin nidhana?abdasya madhy?rth?bhidh?yitv?d ?dimadhy?nte?u hi?kriyety ?hu? ||" Now I have not been able to locate the verse he quotes, listing the five s?ma-g?tis and would appreciate if some S?maveda expert could enlighten me about it. Also the last sentence is a riddle to me, "some [presumably other commentators on this verse] say that hi?kriy? is in the beginning, the middle and the end, because the word 'nidhana' [(technical term of one of these components of the s?man chant, lit. 'end'] means 'middle'". Can anybody make any more sense out of this? Best, Peter -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From franco at uni-leipzig.de Wed Jul 13 09:40:57 2016 From: franco at uni-leipzig.de (Eli Franco) Date: Wed, 13 Jul 16 11:40:57 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] The Nay Science In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20160713114057.Horde.807pYDMjCdKXr6mjopKeZA7@mail.uni-leipzig.de> Dear friends and colleagues, Some of you may remember a brief discussion on ?The Nay Science? in this list about a year ago. My review of this book has just been published in South Asia. If anyone is interested, it can be downloaded (50 times?) from http://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/uWN8kpU9APVwRUzBdaYc/full With best wishes, Eli Franco -- Prof. Dr. Eli Franco Institut f?r Indologie und Zentralasienwissenschaften Schillerstr. 6 04109 Leipzig Ph. +49 341 9737 121, 9737 120 (dept. office) Fax +49 341 9737 148 From andrew.nicholson at stonybrook.edu Wed Jul 13 12:36:55 2016 From: andrew.nicholson at stonybrook.edu (Andrew Nicholson) Date: Wed, 13 Jul 16 08:36:55 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Job Opening: Mattoo Chair in Classical Indic Humanities Message-ID: Dear Friends and Colleagues, I?d like to call your attention to a new job opening for an endowed position at Stony Brook University, the Mattoo Chair in Classical Indic Humanities. Click on the link below for details, and please feel free to to notify others who might be interested. Inquiries about the position can be sent via e-mail to me or to the search committee chair, S.N. Sridhar ( s.sridhar at stonybrook.edu). https://academicjobsonline.org/ajo/jobs/7396 ------- The College of Arts and Sciences at Stony Brook University invites applications and nominations for the Nirmal K. and Augustina Mattoo Endowed Chair in Classical Indic Humanities. The goal of the Mattoo Chair is to advance research in and promote a better appreciation of the contributions to human knowledge made by systems of knowledge having their origin or major development in Classical India. For the inaugural appointment to the Chair, we are looking for an outstanding scholar in the fields of art, aesthetics, literature, philosophy, theories of mind, religion, cultural anthropology, or cultural and intellectual history. The successful candidate must be eligible for appointment with tenure as a full professor at Stony Brook University. Required Qualifications: PhD in Art, Asian/Asian-American Studies, History, Philosophy, Sociology or related field. Outstanding scholarship in art, aesthetics, literature, philosophy, theories of mind, religion, cultural anthropology, or cultural and intellectual history. Must be tenurable in one of the following departments: Art, Asian/Asian-American Studies, History, Philosophy, or Sociology. Exemplary record of leadership and high standing in the international research community. Preferred Qualifications: Experience in teaching and in community outreach. The holder of the chair will provide intellectual leadership to the field; collaborate with campus academic units to design and implement initiatives that will mainstream India Studies; pursue a research program resulting in prestigious publications; teach graduate and undergraduate courses and guide research scholars; organize conferences and lecture series; conduct outreach programs; and contribute to the mission of the Mattoo Center and its robust engagement with the public and the Indian American community. The endowed professor will hold the academic rank of tenured professor in an appropriate department. Salary will be commensurate with qualifications and experience. Additionally, the successful candidate will have access to research, publication and program funding from the Mattoo Endowment. Stony Brook University is home to the Bishembarnath and Sheela Mattoo Center for India Studies, a respected academic resource and community asset with an endowment of $5 million. The Employment Application form can be found here: https://www.asa.stonybrook.edu/asa/ASAForms/Department/HRS/Document/HRSF0113 . We will begin reviewing files on October 1, 2016. Inquiries or to nominate an individual may be directed to the chair of the search committee, Professor S.N. Sridhar, Chair of the Search Committee, at s.sridhar at stonybrook.edu. Telephone: (631) 632-9742. Andrew J. Nicholson Associate Professor Graduate Studies Director Asian & Asian American Studies Stony Brook University Stony Brook, NY 11794-5343 (631) 632-4030 http://philosophicalrasika.com/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From franco at uni-leipzig.de Wed Jul 13 13:00:35 2016 From: franco at uni-leipzig.de (Eli Franco) Date: Wed, 13 Jul 16 15:00:35 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] The Nay Science In-Reply-To: <20160713114057.Horde.807pYDMjCdKXr6mjopKeZA7@mail.uni-leipzig.de> Message-ID: <20160713150035.Horde.8da8FGfcjsgjCjyoyuep_A2@mail.uni-leipzig.de> Dear All, It seems that the link is no longer active (if this is because more than 50 colleagues have downloaded the review, I am indeed honoured). Whatever the case may be, I attach the file to this mail. With best wishes, Eli Zitat von Eli Franco : > Dear friends and colleagues, > Some of you may remember a brief discussion on ?The Nay Science? in > this list about a year ago. My review of this book has just been > published in South Asia. If anyone is interested, it can be > downloaded (50 times?) from > http://www.tandfonline.com/eprint/uWN8kpU9APVwRUzBdaYc/full > With best wishes, > Eli Franco > > -- > Prof. Dr. Eli Franco > Institut f?r Indologie und Zentralasienwissenschaften > Schillerstr. 6 > 04109 Leipzig > > Ph. +49 341 9737 121, 9737 120 (dept. office) > Fax +49 341 9737 148 > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list > options or unsubscribe) -- Prof. Dr. Eli Franco Institut f?r Indologie und Zentralasienwissenschaften Schillerstr. 6 04109 Leipzig Ph. +49 341 9737 121, 9737 120 (dept. office) Fax +49 341 9737 148 -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: TheNayScienceAHistoryofGermanIndologybyVishwaAdluriandJoydeepBagchee1.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 445176 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jmdelire at ulb.ac.be Thu Jul 14 07:23:02 2016 From: jmdelire at ulb.ac.be (Jean-Michel Delire) Date: Thu, 14 Jul 16 09:23:02 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Astrolabes in Udaipur Message-ID: <851057873dd6d5a5d@wm-srv.ulb.ac.be> Dear List, I am in Udaipur and, trying to find astrolabes or other instruments (ancient or new), I only meet shop's tenants who propose me to find an astrolabe (new) but need time for that. I suppose they know people who are still able to make these instruments (as S.R.Sarma ensured me to exist in Udaipur), but of course they don't want to give me more details. Does anybody know more about this ? Regards, J.M.Delire, Lecturer on Science and Civilization of India, University of Brussels From martin.gansten at pbhome.se Thu Jul 14 16:28:59 2016 From: martin.gansten at pbhome.se (Martin Gansten) Date: Thu, 14 Jul 16 18:28:59 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Metrical question (arya) In-Reply-To: <20160713150035.Horde.8da8FGfcjsgjCjyoyuep_A2@mail.uni-leipzig.de> Message-ID: <5c0e71d2-213d-baee-d571-66bbc9def2b4@pbhome.se> Namo v?ttavidvadbhya?: Balabhadra's /H?yanaratna /contains the following quotation from an astrological work no longer extant: /sa?t?pa-sahamam aharni?am indor mand?nta? ?a??hata? p?ta? |// / 'The /sahama /of affliction by day and night is [the distance] from the moon up to Saturn; the casting out is [done] from the sixth.' Ignoring the technical content for the present, I am puzzled by the metre. All other quotations from the same work are in ?ry?, and the present half-stanza looks like it too, except for the initial word (/sa?t?pa-/). Is there a variant of ?ry? that would allow for these extra 5 morae? All the mss of the /H?yanaratna /available to me agree on the reading. Martin Gansten -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dipak.d2004 at gmail.com Fri Jul 15 04:49:56 2016 From: dipak.d2004 at gmail.com (Dipak Bhattacharya) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 10:19:56 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Astrolabes in Udaipur In-Reply-To: <851057873dd6d5a5d@wm-srv.ulb.ac.be> Message-ID: Dear friend There are observatories at Delhi and in Rajasthan. I do not know of astrolabs Best DB On Thu, Jul 14, 2016 at 12:53 PM, Jean-Michel Delire wrote: > Dear List, > > I am in Udaipur and, trying to find astrolabes or other instruments > (ancient or new), I only meet shop's tenants who propose me to find an > astrolabe (new) but need time for that. I suppose they know people who are > still able to make these instruments (as S.R.Sarma ensured me to exist in > Udaipur), but of course they don't want to give me more details. Does > anybody know more about this ? > > Regards, > > J.M.Delire, > Lecturer on Science and Civilization of India, University of Brussels > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From eastwestcultural at yahoo.com Fri Jul 15 06:17:20 2016 From: eastwestcultural at yahoo.com (Dean Michael Anderson) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 06:17:20 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Astrolabes in Udaipur In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <685696740.129918.1468563440025.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> The Jantar Mantar Observatory at the royal palace in Jaipur has huge astronomical instruments. Someone at the museum ?might know someone who still makes astrolabes. Just a guess. Best, Dean From: Dipak Bhattacharya To: Jean-Michel Delire Cc: Indology Sent: Friday, July 15, 2016 10:19 AM Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Astrolabes in Udaipur Dear friend There are observatories at Delhi and in Rajasthan. I do not know of astrolabs Best DB On Thu, Jul 14, 2016 at 12:53 PM, Jean-Michel Delire wrote: Dear List, I am in Udaipur and, trying to find astrolabes or other instruments (ancient or new), I only meet? shop's tenants who propose me to find an astrolabe (new) but need time for that. I suppose they know people who are still able to make these instruments (as S.R.Sarma ensured me to exist in Udaipur), but of course they don't want to give me more details. Does anybody know more about this ? Regards, J.M.Delire, Lecturer on Science and Civilization of India, University of Brussels _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Fri Jul 15 10:58:01 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 06:58:01 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac Message-ID: Dear Indologists, To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of you. Best, Madhav Deshpande -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mehner at sub.uni-goettingen.de Fri Jul 15 11:11:40 2016 From: mehner at sub.uni-goettingen.de (Mehner, Maximilian | GRETIL) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 11:11:40 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] GRETIL update #474 Message-ID: GRETIL is pleased to be able to report the following changes: Additions: Puggalapannatti: PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text Yamaka, I-II: PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text Sanskrit works restored: Bhagavata-Purana, Skandha 3 (numbering corrected) Pali works restored: Dhammasangani: PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text Patthana: BJT edition Samantapasadika, V & VII: PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text Khuddakapatha: PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text Works refiled: Sukasaptati from Kavya to Narrative Literature As a new feature you can now download GRETIL's whole archive for each language/language family in UTF-8 at: http://gretil.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gret_utfneu.html#Index These packages will be updated with every announcement, in case you have been missing updates, or are rebuilding your personal collection. __________________________________________________________________________ GRETIL - Goettingen Register of Electronic Texts in Indian Languages: http://gretil.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gretil.htm -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Fri Jul 15 12:37:36 2016 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 14:37:36 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux). I had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's okay now, at least. Dominik -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada ?sas.ualberta.ca? On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > Dear Indologists, > > To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the latest > version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating System > OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode Devanagari in > a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard layout. Previously, > I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like TextEdit and then copy > and paste into a Word document, but was not able to edit it in the Word > document. The new development of software has happily changed that > situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of you. Best, > > Madhav Deshpande > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Fri Jul 15 12:39:46 2016 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 14:39:46 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] GRETIL update #474 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Dr Mehner, This "download all" is a marvellous development at GRETIL. Many thanks! Dominik Wujastyk -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada ?sas.ualberta.ca? On 15 July 2016 at 13:11, Mehner, Maximilian | GRETIL < mehner at sub.uni-goettingen.de> wrote: > GRETIL is pleased to be able to report the following changes: > > Additions: > Puggalapannatti : > PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text > Yamaka, I-II : > PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text > Sanskrit works restored: > Bhagavata-Purana , Skandha 3 > (numbering corrected) > Pali works restored: > Dhammasangani : > PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text > Patthana : BJT edition > Samantapasadika, V & VII : > PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text > Khuddakapatha : > PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text > Works refiled: > Sukasaptati from Kavya > to Narrative Literature > > > As a new feature you can now download GRETIL's whole archive > for each language/language family in UTF-8 at: > http://gretil.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gret_utfneu.html#Index > These packages will be updated with every announcement, in case you have > been > missing updates, or are rebuilding your personal collection. > > __________________________________________________________________________ > GRETIL - Goettingen Register of Electronic Texts in Indian Languages: > http://gretil.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gretil.htm > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dmellins at gmail.com Fri Jul 15 12:44:42 2016 From: dmellins at gmail.com (David Mellins) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 08:44:42 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0B094B38-4B99-4F33-9FD7-13E7164A3179@gmail.com> Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the full range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort to Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. David Sent from my iPhone > On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk wrote: > > I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux). I had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's okay now, at least. > > Dominik > > -- > Professor Dominik Wujastyk* > Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity > Department of History and Classics > University of Alberta, Canada > > ?sas.ualberta.ca? > > >> On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >> Dear Indologists, >> >> To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of you. Best, >> >> Madhav Deshpande >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mehner at sub.uni-goettingen.de Fri Jul 15 12:46:23 2016 From: mehner at sub.uni-goettingen.de (Mehner, Maximilian | GRETIL) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 12:46:23 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] GRETIL update #474, correction Message-ID: The correct link for the "Download All" function is: http://gretil.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gret_utf.htm#Index Thanks to Rolf Heinrich Koch and Petra Kieffer-P?lz for pointing out! On 15 July 2016 at 13:11, Mehner, Maximilian | GRETIL > wrote: GRETIL is pleased to be able to report the following changes: Additions: Puggalapannatti: PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text Yamaka, I-II: PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text Sanskrit works restored: Bhagavata-Purana, Skandha 3 (numbering corrected) Pali works restored: Dhammasangani: PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text Patthana: BJT edition Samantapasadika, V & VII: PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text Khuddakapatha: PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text Works refiled: Sukasaptati from Kavya to Narrative Literature As a new feature you can now download GRETIL's whole archive for each language/language family in UTF-8 at: http://gretil.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gret_utfneu.html#Index These packages will be updated with every announcement, in case you have been missing updates, or are rebuilding your personal collection. __________________________________________________________________________ GRETIL - Goettingen Register of Electronic Texts in Indian Languages: http://gretil.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gretil.htm -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Fri Jul 15 12:47:03 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 08:47:03 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: <0B094B38-4B99-4F33-9FD7-13E7164A3179@gmail.com> Message-ID: David, The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try reinstalling the keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to you. Best, Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins wrote: > Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the full > range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort to > Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? > > This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy > Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. > > David > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk wrote: > > I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been > typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux). I > had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac > used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's okay now, at > least. > > Dominik > > -- > Professor Dominik Wujastyk* > Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity > Department of History and Classics > > University of Alberta, Canada > > > ?sas.ualberta.ca? > > > On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > >> Dear Indologists, >> >> To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the >> latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating >> System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode >> Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard >> layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like >> TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to >> edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily >> changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of >> you. Best, >> >> Madhav Deshpande >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Fri Jul 15 12:52:54 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 08:52:54 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] GRETIL update #474, correction In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks for this corrected download link. It worked. Madhav Deshpande On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:46 AM, Mehner, Maximilian | GRETIL < mehner at sub.uni-goettingen.de> wrote: > The correct link for the "Download All" function is: > > http://gretil.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gret_utf.htm#Index > > Thanks to Rolf Heinrich Koch and Petra Kieffer-P?lz for pointing out! > > On 15 July 2016 at 13:11, Mehner, Maximilian | GRETIL < > mehner at sub.uni-goettingen.de> wrote: > >> GRETIL is pleased to be able to report the following changes: >> >> Additions: >> Puggalapannatti : >> PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text >> Yamaka, I-II : >> PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text >> Sanskrit works restored: >> Bhagavata-Purana , Skandha 3 >> (numbering corrected) >> Pali works restored: >> Dhammasangani : >> PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text >> Patthana : BJT edition >> Samantapasadika, V & VII : >> PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text >> Khuddakapatha : >> PTS/Dhammakaya edition, annotated and plain text >> Works refiled: >> Sukasaptati from Kavya >> to Narrative Literature >> >> >> As a new feature you can now download GRETIL's whole archive >> for each language/language family in UTF-8 at: >> http://gretil.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gret_utfneu.html#Index >> These packages will be updated with every announcement, in case you have >> been >> missing updates, or are rebuilding your personal collection. >> >> __________________________________________________________________________ >> GRETIL - Goettingen Register of Electronic Texts in Indian Languages: >> http://gretil.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gretil.htm >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kauzeya at gmail.com Fri Jul 15 13:16:14 2016 From: kauzeya at gmail.com (Jonathan Silk) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 15:16:14 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard (made, if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for diacritics, no mess, no fuss. Jonathan On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > David, > > The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has the > latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try reinstalling the > keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to you. Best, > > Madhav > > On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins wrote: > >> Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the full >> range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort to >> Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? >> >> This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy >> Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. >> >> David >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk wrote: >> >> I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been >> typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux). I >> had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac >> used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's okay now, at >> least. >> >> Dominik >> >> -- >> Professor Dominik Wujastyk* >> >> Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity >> Department of History and Classics >> >> University of Alberta, Canada >> >> >> ?sas.ualberta.ca? >> >> >> On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >> >>> Dear Indologists, >>> >>> To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the >>> latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating >>> System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode >>> Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard >>> layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like >>> TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to >>> edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily >>> changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of >>> you. Best, >>> >>> Madhav Deshpande >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- J. Silk Leiden University Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b 2311 BZ Leiden The Netherlands copies of my publications may be found at http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dharmaprof108 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 15 15:48:39 2016 From: dharmaprof108 at yahoo.com (Jeffery Long) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 15:48:39 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1752931590.3816319.1468597719883.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical marks. ?Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. ?Option + x =?underdot: ?, ?, etc. ?Option + w = overdot: ?. ?Option + e = accent mark: ?. ?Tilde is of course option + n: ?. All the best,Jeff?Dr. Jeffery D. Long Professor of Religion and Asian Studies Elizabethtown CollegeElizabethtown, PA https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong Series Editor,?Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, Ethical, and PhilosophicalLexington Books Consulting Editor,?Sutra Journalhttp://www.sutrajournal.com "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials of life." ?(Holy Mother Sarada Devi) On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk wrote: Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard (made, if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for diacritics, no mess, no fuss. Jonathan On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande wrote: David, ? ? ?The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360.? Try reinstalling the keyboard file, if you have it.? If not, I can send it to you.? Best, Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins wrote: Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the full range ?of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort to Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts?? This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. David Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk wrote: I'm shocked.? I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux).? I had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac.? Wow.? And the Mac used to be the byword for multilingual support.? I'm glad it's okay now, at least. Dominik -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada ?sas.ualberta.ca? On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande wrote: Dear Indologists, ? ? ?To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard layout.? Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to edit it in the Word document.? The new development of software has happily changed that situation.? Hope this information will be of use to some of you.? Best, Madhav Deshpande _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- J. Silk Leiden University Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIASMatthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b2311 BZ Leiden The Netherlands copies of my publications may be found at http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alanus1216 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 15 15:50:18 2016 From: alanus1216 at yahoo.com (Allen Thrasher) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 15:50:18 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Astrolabes in Udaipur In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1138772780.3792546.1468597818128.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> I once saw a brass celestial globe and, though my memory may mislead me, brass astrolabes with Nagari inscriptions that appeared old in one of the shops in the Sundar Nagar Market in New Delhi, but this was years ago. Allen Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 12:49 AM, Dipak Bhattacharya wrote: Dear friend There are observatories at Delhi and in Rajasthan. I do not know of astrolabs Best DB On Thu, Jul 14, 2016 at 12:53 PM, Jean-Michel Delire wrote: Dear List, I am in Udaipur and, trying to find astrolabes or other instruments (ancient or new), I only meet? shop's tenants who propose me to find an astrolabe (new) but need time for that. I suppose they know people who are still able to make these instruments (as S.R.Sarma ensured me to exist in Udaipur), but of course they don't want to give me more details. Does anybody know more about this ? Regards, J.M.Delire, Lecturer on Science and Civilization of India, University of Brussels _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jmdelire at ulb.ac.be Fri Jul 15 16:00:55 2016 From: jmdelire at ulb.ac.be (Jean-Michel Delire) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 18:00:55 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Astrolabes in Udaipur Message-ID: <5196578908b702ae9@wm-srv.ulb.ac.be> Thank you to Hartmut, Dean Michael and Dipak for their answers. Of course, I know very well all the Savai Jai Singh's observatories (Jantar Mantar) of India, having visited them several times and read everything I could about them. I also know about the ancient astrolabes made in India, thanks to S.R.Sarma, who just edited a famous catalogue of all Sanskrit instruments extant in the world. And, again, I have seen many of them in different museums. My question concerns more specifically the fabrication (nowadays or in a recent past) of such Sanskrit astrolabes in India. Once, I saw a not too ancient astrolabe in an antiquary shop in Mumbai. It was not so expansive but I didn't buy it, due to its weight and my lack of money. Now, I regret my decision and that is why I try to find another such astrolabe. It seems that some artisans, in Udaipur, Jodhpur or Jaipur, are still able to fabricate them but nobody here want to give me any clue as how to find such an artisan. That is why I ask the question again to the list and will try to see, when in Jaipur very soon, if something can be done. Many thanks again, Jean Michel From mmdesh at umich.edu Fri Jul 15 18:13:05 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 14:13:05 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: <1752931590.3816319.1468597719883.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: This is a question as to how to get multiple markings on the same vowel sign. In my pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I had included, for instance, the sign for vowel "a" with three markings, length, nasality and accent. This is necessary to represent P??inian procedures accurately. P??ini deals with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. differing in length, accent and nasality. Is there a way to do this with unicode fonts and keyboards? Madhav Deshpande On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long wrote: > The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical marks. > Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. Option + x = underdot: > ?, ?, etc. Option + w = overdot: ?. Option + e = accent mark: ?. Tilde > is of course option + n: ?. > > All the best, > Jeff > > Dr. Jeffery D. Long > Professor of Religion and Asian Studies > Elizabethtown College > Elizabethtown, PA > > https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong > > Series Editor, *Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, Ethical, > and Philosophical* > Lexington Books > > Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal > http://www.sutrajournal.com > > "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome all > difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials of > life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) > > > > On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk wrote: > > > Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard (made, > if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for diacritics, no > mess, no fuss. > > Jonathan > > On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: > > David, > > The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has the > latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try reinstalling the > keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to you. Best, > > Madhav > > On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins wrote: > > Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the full > range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort to > Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? > > This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy > Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. > > David > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk wrote: > > I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been > typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux). I > had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac > used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's okay now, at > least. > > Dominik > > -- > Professor Dominik Wujastyk* > Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity > Department of History and Classics > > University of Alberta, Canada > > > ?sas.ualberta.ca? > > > On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > > Dear Indologists, > > To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the latest > version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating System > OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode Devanagari in > a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard layout. Previously, > I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like TextEdit and then copy > and paste into a Word document, but was not able to edit it in the Word > document. The new development of software has happily changed that > situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of you. Best, > > Madhav Deshpande > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > > > -- > J. Silk > Leiden University > Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS > Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b > 2311 BZ Leiden > The Netherlands > > copies of my publications may be found at > http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Fri Jul 15 19:16:00 2016 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 21:16:00 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The Unicode standard includes non-spacing accents, so you can stack 'em as much as you like. Working out how to type them conveniently will depend on your keyboard handler. Linux comes with many options in this area. Ibus and m17n include ready-made Roman IAST and Devanagari Sanskrit keyboards, but it's very easy to make one's own combinations ad libitum for anything not in the standard keystroke repertoire. In the control file, you put what you want to type in the left column, and what's meant to show on your screen in the right column. Finally, what stacked accents will look like depends on the font you select. Some fonts handle this more elegantly than others. Best, Dominik ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hhhock at illinois.edu Fri Jul 15 21:05:05 2016 From: hhhock at illinois.edu (Hock, Hans Henrich) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 21:05:05 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Madhav, Though there may be some limitations on stacking, it is possible to produce the following symbol on the Mac (still system 10.9.5): ???. The first diacritic (the macron) is accessed by typing option a + a; the other two diacritics by entering shift-option n and shift-option e AFTER having typed assembled the basic ? character. This post-character shift-option input procedure doesn?t seem to be well advertised; I more or less stumbled upon it in some university?s instructions for its faculty. There is one concern, however: While ? and the like is treated as a single glyph in unicode and thus transfers well between unicode-compatible platforms, more complex character, such as ??, ??, or ???, are not single glyphs and may therefore not transfer across platforms. We ran into this problem in producing the documents from which the new South Asia volume in the series World of Linguistics have been printed, and the only thing that we could do was submit a pdf-version indicating the desired character shape. I hope this helps. Cheers, Hans On 15 Jul 2016, at 13:13, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: This is a question as to how to get multiple markings on the same vowel sign. In my pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I had included, for instance, the sign for vowel "a" with three markings, length, nasality and accent. This is necessary to represent P??inian procedures accurately. P??ini deals with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. differing in length, accent and nasality. Is there a way to do this with unicode fonts and keyboards? Madhav Deshpande On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long > wrote: The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical marks. Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. Option + x = underdot: ?, ?, etc. Option + w = overdot: ?. Option + e = accent mark: ?. Tilde is of course option + n: ?. All the best, Jeff Dr. Jeffery D. Long Professor of Religion and Asian Studies Elizabethtown College Elizabethtown, PA https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong Series Editor, Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, Ethical, and Philosophical Lexington Books Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal http://www.sutrajournal.com "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials of life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk > wrote: Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard (made, if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for diacritics, no mess, no fuss. Jonathan On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: David, The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try reinstalling the keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to you. Best, Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins > wrote: Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the full range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort to Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. David Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk > wrote: I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux). I had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's okay now, at least. Dominik -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada ?sas.ualberta.ca? On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: Dear Indologists, To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of you. Best, Madhav Deshpande _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- J. Silk Leiden University Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b 2311 BZ Leiden The Netherlands copies of my publications may be found at http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Fri Jul 15 21:15:33 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 17:15:33 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hello Hans, Which keyboard-layout are you using to produce these characters? Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:05 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich wrote: > Dear Madhav, > > Though there may be some limitations on stacking, it is possible to > produce the following symbol on the Mac (still system 10.9.5): ???. The > first diacritic (the macron) is accessed by typing option a + a; the other > two diacritics by entering shift-option n and shift-option e AFTER having > typed assembled the basic ? character. This post-character shift-option > input procedure doesn?t seem to be well advertised; I more or less stumbled > upon it in some university?s instructions for its faculty. > > There is one concern, however: While ? and the like is treated as a single > glyph in unicode and thus transfers well between unicode-compatible > platforms, more complex character, such as ??, ??, or ???, are not single > glyphs and may therefore not transfer across platforms. We ran into this > problem in producing the documents from which the new South Asia volume in > the series World of Linguistics have been printed, and the only thing that > we could do was submit a pdf-version indicating the desired character shape. > > I hope this helps. > > Cheers, > > Hans > > > On 15 Jul 2016, at 13:13, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > > This is a question as to how to get multiple markings on the same vowel > sign. In my pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I had included, > for instance, the sign for vowel "a" with three markings, length, nasality > and accent. This is necessary to represent P??inian procedures accurately. > P??ini deals with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. differing in > length, accent and nasality. Is there a way to do this with unicode fonts > and keyboards? > > Madhav Deshpande > > On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long > wrote: > >> The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical marks. >> Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. Option + x = underdot: >> ?, ?, etc. Option + w = overdot: ?. Option + e = accent mark: ?. Tilde >> is of course option + n: ?. >> >> All the best, >> Jeff >> >> Dr. Jeffery D. Long >> Professor of Religion and Asian Studies >> Elizabethtown College >> Elizabethtown, PA >> >> https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong >> >> >> Series Editor, *Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, Ethical, >> and Philosophical* >> Lexington Books >> >> Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal >> http://www.sutrajournal.com >> >> >> "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome all >> difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials of >> life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) >> >> >> >> On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk >> wrote: >> >> >> Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard (made, >> if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for diacritics, no >> mess, no fuss. >> >> Jonathan >> >> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande >> wrote: >> >> David, >> >> The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has >> the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try reinstalling >> the keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to you. Best, >> >> Madhav >> >> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins >> wrote: >> >> Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the full >> range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort to >> Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? >> >> This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy >> Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. >> >> David >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk wrote: >> >> I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been >> typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux). I >> had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac >> used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's okay now, at >> least. >> >> Dominik >> >> -- >> Professor Dominik Wujastyk* >> >> Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity >> Department of History and Classics >> >> University of Alberta, Canada >> >> >> >> ?sas.ualberta.ca? >> >> >> >> On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >> >> Dear Indologists, >> >> To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the >> latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating >> System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode >> Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard >> layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like >> TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to >> edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily >> changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of >> you. Best, >> >> Madhav Deshpande >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info >> >> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info >> >> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info >> >> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> >> >> >> >> -- >> J. Silk >> Leiden University >> Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS >> Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b >> 2311 BZ Leiden >> The Netherlands >> >> copies of my publications may be found at >> http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info >> (where >> you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> >> >> > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Fri Jul 15 21:24:57 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 17:24:57 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hans, Just tested your suggestions with ABC Extended keyboard layout, and this does work in TextEdit and in Gmail, but not in MS Word. I tried to copy and paste from EextEdit into Word, and the Word was not able to show the stacking of three diacritics like ???. Glad to know that such combinations are possible at least on some platforms. Thanks, Hans, for solving one of my long-standing problems. With best wishes, Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:15 PM, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > Hello Hans, > > Which keyboard-layout are you using to produce these characters? > > Madhav > > On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:05 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich > wrote: > >> Dear Madhav, >> >> Though there may be some limitations on stacking, it is possible to >> produce the following symbol on the Mac (still system 10.9.5): ???. The >> first diacritic (the macron) is accessed by typing option a + a; the other >> two diacritics by entering shift-option n and shift-option e AFTER having >> typed assembled the basic ? character. This post-character shift-option >> input procedure doesn?t seem to be well advertised; I more or less stumbled >> upon it in some university?s instructions for its faculty. >> >> There is one concern, however: While ? and the like is treated as a >> single glyph in unicode and thus transfers well between unicode-compatible >> platforms, more complex character, such as ??, ??, or ???, are not single >> glyphs and may therefore not transfer across platforms. We ran into this >> problem in producing the documents from which the new South Asia volume in >> the series World of Linguistics have been printed, and the only thing that >> we could do was submit a pdf-version indicating the desired character shape. >> >> I hope this helps. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Hans >> >> >> On 15 Jul 2016, at 13:13, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >> >> This is a question as to how to get multiple markings on the same vowel >> sign. In my pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I had included, >> for instance, the sign for vowel "a" with three markings, length, nasality >> and accent. This is necessary to represent P??inian procedures accurately. >> P??ini deals with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. differing in >> length, accent and nasality. Is there a way to do this with unicode fonts >> and keyboards? >> >> Madhav Deshpande >> >> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long >> wrote: >> >>> The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical marks. >>> Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. Option + x = underdot: >>> ?, ?, etc. Option + w = overdot: ?. Option + e = accent mark: ?. Tilde >>> is of course option + n: ?. >>> >>> All the best, >>> Jeff >>> >>> Dr. Jeffery D. Long >>> Professor of Religion and Asian Studies >>> Elizabethtown College >>> Elizabethtown, PA >>> >>> https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong >>> >>> >>> Series Editor, *Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, Ethical, >>> and Philosophical* >>> Lexington Books >>> >>> Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal >>> http://www.sutrajournal.com >>> >>> >>> "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome all >>> difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials of >>> life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) >>> >>> >>> >>> On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard >>> (made, if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for >>> diacritics, no mess, no fuss. >>> >>> Jonathan >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande >>> wrote: >>> >>> David, >>> >>> The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has >>> the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try reinstalling >>> the keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to you. Best, >>> >>> Madhav >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins >>> wrote: >>> >>> Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the full >>> range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort to >>> Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? >>> >>> This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy >>> Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. >>> >>> David >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk >>> wrote: >>> >>> I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been >>> typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux). I >>> had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac >>> used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's okay now, at >>> least. >>> >>> Dominik >>> >>> -- >>> Professor Dominik Wujastyk* >>> >>> Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity >>> Department of History and Classics >>> >>> University of Alberta, Canada >>> >>> >>> >>> ?sas.ualberta.ca? >>> >>> >>> >>> On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >>> >>> Dear Indologists, >>> >>> To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the >>> latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating >>> System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode >>> Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard >>> layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like >>> TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to >>> edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily >>> changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of >>> you. Best, >>> >>> Madhav Deshpande >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>> >>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>> >>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>> >>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> J. Silk >>> Leiden University >>> Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS >>> Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b >>> 2311 BZ Leiden >>> The Netherlands >>> >>> copies of my publications may be found at >>> http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>> (where >>> you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hhhock at illinois.edu Sat Jul 16 00:49:04 2016 From: hhhock at illinois.edu (Hock, Hans Henrich) Date: Sat, 16 Jul 16 00:49:04 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <999D4B95-5AB5-4A6A-94A5-DF47DD979F4E@illinois.edu> Have you tried the US Extended keyboard, Madhav? I use Times New Roman, which works very well with unicode All the best Hans Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2016, at 16:25, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: Hans, Just tested your suggestions with ABC Extended keyboard layout, and this does work in TextEdit and in Gmail, but not in MS Word. I tried to copy and paste from EextEdit into Word, and the Word was not able to show the stacking of three diacritics like ???. Glad to know that such combinations are possible at least on some platforms. Thanks, Hans, for solving one of my long-standing problems. With best wishes, Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:15 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: Hello Hans, Which keyboard-layout are you using to produce these characters? Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:05 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich > wrote: Dear Madhav, Though there may be some limitations on stacking, it is possible to produce the following symbol on the Mac (still system 10.9.5): ???. The first diacritic (the macron) is accessed by typing option a + a; the other two diacritics by entering shift-option n and shift-option e AFTER having typed assembled the basic ? character. This post-character shift-option input procedure doesn?t seem to be well advertised; I more or less stumbled upon it in some university?s instructions for its faculty. There is one concern, however: While ? and the like is treated as a single glyph in unicode and thus transfers well between unicode-compatible platforms, more complex character, such as ??, ??, or ???, are not single glyphs and may therefore not transfer across platforms. We ran into this problem in producing the documents from which the new South Asia volume in the series World of Linguistics have been printed, and the only thing that we could do was submit a pdf-version indicating the desired character shape. I hope this helps. Cheers, Hans On 15 Jul 2016, at 13:13, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: This is a question as to how to get multiple markings on the same vowel sign. In my pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I had included, for instance, the sign for vowel "a" with three markings, length, nasality and accent. This is necessary to represent P??inian procedures accurately. P??ini deals with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. differing in length, accent and nasality. Is there a way to do this with unicode fonts and keyboards? Madhav Deshpande On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long > wrote: The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical marks. Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. Option + x = underdot: ?, ?, etc. Option + w = overdot: ?. Option + e = accent mark: ?. Tilde is of course option + n: ?. All the best, Jeff Dr. Jeffery D. Long Professor of Religion and Asian Studies Elizabethtown College Elizabethtown, PA https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong Series Editor, Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, Ethical, and Philosophical Lexington Books Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal http://www.sutrajournal.com "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials of life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk > wrote: Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard (made, if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for diacritics, no mess, no fuss. Jonathan On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: David, The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try reinstalling the keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to you. Best, Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins > wrote: Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the full range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort to Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. David Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk > wrote: I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux). I had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's okay now, at least. Dominik -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada ?sas.ualberta.ca? On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: Dear Indologists, To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of you. Best, Madhav Deshpande _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- J. Silk Leiden University Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b 2311 BZ Leiden The Netherlands copies of my publications may be found at http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Sat Jul 16 02:38:21 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Fri, 15 Jul 16 22:38:21 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: <999D4B95-5AB5-4A6A-94A5-DF47DD979F4E@illinois.edu> Message-ID: Hello Hans, Evidently the ABC Extended Keyboard on El Kapitan operating system is the same as the US Extended Keyboard on Maverick and older operating systems, with just a different name. Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:49 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich wrote: > Have you tried the US Extended keyboard, Madhav? > > I use Times New Roman, which works very well with unicode > > All the best > > Hans > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jul 15, 2016, at 16:25, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > > Hans, > > Just tested your suggestions with ABC Extended keyboard layout, and > this does work in TextEdit and in Gmail, but not in MS Word. I tried to > copy and paste from EextEdit into Word, and the Word was not able to show > the stacking of three diacritics like ???. Glad to know that such > combinations are possible at least on some platforms. Thanks, Hans, for > solving one of my long-standing problems. With best wishes, > > Madhav > > On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:15 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: > >> Hello Hans, >> >> Which keyboard-layout are you using to produce these characters? >> >> Madhav >> >> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:05 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich >> wrote: >> >>> Dear Madhav, >>> >>> Though there may be some limitations on stacking, it is possible to >>> produce the following symbol on the Mac (still system 10.9.5): ???. The >>> first diacritic (the macron) is accessed by typing option a + a; the other >>> two diacritics by entering shift-option n and shift-option e AFTER having >>> typed assembled the basic ? character. This post-character shift-option >>> input procedure doesn?t seem to be well advertised; I more or less stumbled >>> upon it in some university?s instructions for its faculty. >>> >>> There is one concern, however: While ? and the like is treated as a >>> single glyph in unicode and thus transfers well between unicode-compatible >>> platforms, more complex character, such as ??, ??, or ???, are not single >>> glyphs and may therefore not transfer across platforms. We ran into this >>> problem in producing the documents from which the new South Asia volume in >>> the series World of Linguistics have been printed, and the only thing that >>> we could do was submit a pdf-version indicating the desired character shape. >>> >>> I hope this helps. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Hans >>> >>> >>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 13:13, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >>> >>> This is a question as to how to get multiple markings on the same vowel >>> sign. In my pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I had included, >>> for instance, the sign for vowel "a" with three markings, length, nasality >>> and accent. This is necessary to represent P??inian procedures accurately. >>> P??ini deals with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. differing in >>> length, accent and nasality. Is there a way to do this with unicode fonts >>> and keyboards? >>> >>> Madhav Deshpande >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long >>> wrote: >>> >>>> The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical >>>> marks. Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. >>>> Option + x = underdot: ?, ?, etc. Option + w = overdot: ?. Option + >>>> e = accent mark: ?. Tilde is of course option + n: ?. >>>> >>>> All the best, >>>> Jeff >>>> >>>> Dr. Jeffery D. Long >>>> Professor of Religion and Asian Studies >>>> Elizabethtown College >>>> Elizabethtown, PA >>>> >>>> https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong >>>> >>>> >>>> Series Editor, *Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, >>>> Ethical, and Philosophical* >>>> Lexington Books >>>> >>>> Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal >>>> http://www.sutrajournal.com >>>> >>>> >>>> "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome >>>> all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials >>>> of life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard >>>> (made, if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for >>>> diacritics, no mess, no fuss. >>>> >>>> Jonathan >>>> >>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> David, >>>> >>>> The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has >>>> the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try reinstalling >>>> the keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to you. Best, >>>> >>>> Madhav >>>> >>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the >>>> full range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort >>>> to Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? >>>> >>>> This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy >>>> Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. >>>> >>>> David >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've >>>> been typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years >>>> (Linux). I had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. >>>> And the Mac used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's >>>> okay now, at least. >>>> >>>> Dominik >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Professor Dominik Wujastyk* >>>> >>>> Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity >>>> Department of History and Classics >>>> >>>> University of Alberta, Canada >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ?sas.ualberta.ca? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >>>> >>>> Dear Indologists, >>>> >>>> To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the >>>> latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating >>>> System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode >>>> Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard >>>> layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like >>>> TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to >>>> edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily >>>> changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of >>>> you. Best, >>>> >>>> Madhav Deshpande >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>> committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>> >>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>> committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>> >>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>> committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>> >>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> J. Silk >>>> Leiden University >>>> Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS >>>> Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b >>>> 2311 BZ Leiden >>>> The Netherlands >>>> >>>> copies of my publications may be found at >>>> http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>> committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>> (where >>>> you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>> >>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From vjroebuck at btinternet.com Sat Jul 16 05:41:06 2016 From: vjroebuck at btinternet.com (Valerie Roebuck) Date: Sat, 16 Jul 16 06:41:06 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <30EFE0DF-B861-4A5B-BEC1-5F467281FC8E@btinternet.com> Yes, It took me a while to work that out. I was on the phone to a baffled person at Apple trying to explain about my Sanskrit diacritics no longer working when the penny suddenly dropped. Valerie J Roebuck Manchester, UK > On 16 Jul 2016, at 03:38, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > > Hello Hans, > > Evidently the ABC Extended Keyboard on El Kapitan operating system is the same as the US Extended Keyboard on Maverick and older operating systems, with just a different name. > > Madhav > > On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:49 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich > wrote: > Have you tried the US Extended keyboard, Madhav? > > I use Times New Roman, which works very well with unicode > > All the best > > Hans > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Jul 15, 2016, at 16:25, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: > >> Hans, >> >> Just tested your suggestions with ABC Extended keyboard layout, and this does work in TextEdit and in Gmail, but not in MS Word. I tried to copy and paste from EextEdit into Word, and the Word was not able to show the stacking of three diacritics like ???. Glad to know that such combinations are possible at least on some platforms. Thanks, Hans, for solving one of my long-standing problems. With best wishes, >> >> Madhav >> >> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:15 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: >> Hello Hans, >> >> Which keyboard-layout are you using to produce these characters? >> >> Madhav >> >> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:05 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich > wrote: >> Dear Madhav, >> >> Though there may be some limitations on stacking, it is possible to produce the following symbol on the Mac (still system 10.9.5): ???. The first diacritic (the macron) is accessed by typing option a + a; the other two diacritics by entering shift-option n and shift-option e AFTER having typed assembled the basic ? character. This post-character shift-option input procedure doesn?t seem to be well advertised; I more or less stumbled upon it in some university?s instructions for its faculty. >> >> There is one concern, however: While ? and the like is treated as a single glyph in unicode and thus transfers well between unicode-compatible platforms, more complex character, such as ??, ??, or ???, are not single glyphs and may therefore not transfer across platforms. We ran into this problem in producing the documents from which the new South Asia volume in the series World of Linguistics have been printed, and the only thing that we could do was submit a pdf-version indicating the desired character shape. >> >> I hope this helps. >> >> Cheers, >> >> Hans >> >> >> On 15 Jul 2016, at 13:13, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: >> >>> This is a question as to how to get multiple markings on the same vowel sign. In my pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I had included, for instance, the sign for vowel "a" with three markings, length, nasality and accent. This is necessary to represent P??inian procedures accurately. P??ini deals with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. differing in length, accent and nasality. Is there a way to do this with unicode fonts and keyboards? >>> >>> Madhav Deshpande >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long > wrote: >>> The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical marks. Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. Option + x = underdot: ?, ?, etc. Option + w = overdot: ?. Option + e = accent mark: ?. Tilde is of course option + n: ?. >>> >>> All the best, >>> Jeff >>> >>> Dr. Jeffery D. Long >>> Professor of Religion and Asian Studies >>> Elizabethtown College >>> Elizabethtown, PA >>> >>> https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong >>> >>> Series Editor, Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, Ethical, and Philosophical >>> Lexington Books >>> >>> Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal >>> http://www.sutrajournal.com >>> >>> "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials of life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) >>> >>> >>> >>> On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk > wrote: >>> >>> >>> Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard (made, if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for diacritics, no mess, no fuss. >>> >>> Jonathan >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: >>> David, >>> >>> The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try reinstalling the keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to you. Best, >>> >>> Madhav >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins > wrote: >>> Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the full range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort to Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? >>> >>> This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. >>> >>> David >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk > wrote: >>> >>>> I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux). I had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's okay now, at least. >>>> >>>> Dominik >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Professor Dominik Wujastyk* >>>> Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity >>>> Department of History and Classics >>>> University of Alberta, Canada >>>> >>>> >>>> ?sas.ualberta.ca? >>>> >>>> >>>> On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: >>>> Dear Indologists, >>>> >>>> To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of you. Best, >>>> >>>> Madhav Deshpande >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> J. Silk >>> Leiden University >>> Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS >>> Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b >>> 2311 BZ Leiden >>> The Netherlands >>> >>> copies of my publications may be found at >>> http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dipak.d2004 at gmail.com Sat Jul 16 06:15:18 2016 From: dipak.d2004 at gmail.com (Dipak Bhattacharya) Date: Sat, 16 Jul 16 11:45:18 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Astrolabes in Udaipur In-Reply-To: <5196578908b702ae9@wm-srv.ulb.ac.be> Message-ID: 16 7 16 Dear Dr. Michel, I cannot give you information about the artisans. There are tales of horribly cruel treatment of artisans in India, both traditional and modern, the thumbs of Muslin makers being cut-off so that Manchester textile industry came to no harm, of the masons of the Taj being buried so that a second Taj was not built. Stories are current about some other monuments too ? no one could verify the veracity of the popular beliefs. All of these could not be true. Not long ago I saw masons coloring marbles for renovating the Taj. Perhaps they still do, but I have not visited the Taj for a long time; coloring may be observed in Jaipur too. I tried to talk with the artisans without much success. But temples all over India are renovated; gathering information will not be difficult. Best D.Bhattacharya On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 9:30 PM, Jean-Michel Delire wrote: > Thank you to Hartmut, Dean Michael and Dipak for their answers. Of course, > I know very well all the Savai Jai Singh's observatories (Jantar Mantar) of > India, having visited them several times and read everything I could about > them. I also know about the ancient astrolabes made in India, thanks to > S.R.Sarma, who just edited a famous catalogue of all Sanskrit instruments > extant in the world. And, again, I have seen many of them in different > museums. My question concerns more specifically the fabrication (nowadays > or in a recent past) of such Sanskrit astrolabes in India. Once, I saw a > not too ancient astrolabe in an antiquary shop in Mumbai. It was not so > expansive but I didn't buy it, due to its weight and my lack of money. Now, > I regret my decision and that is why I try to find another such astrolabe. > It seems that some artisans, in Udaipur, Jodhpur or Jaipur, are still able > to fabricate them but nobody here want to give me any clue as how to find > such an artisan. That is why I ask the question again to the list and will > try to see, when in Jaipur very soon, if something can be done. > > Many thanks again, > > Jean Michel > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Sat Jul 16 11:14:25 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sat, 16 Jul 16 07:14:25 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: <30EFE0DF-B861-4A5B-BEC1-5F467281FC8E@btinternet.com> Message-ID: Another happy discovery yesterday was that OpenOffice for Mac is able to display characters with multiple markings like ???, ???, ???, r???? etc. So, if one is writing something that needs characters with such multiple markings on Mac, it is possible to do a document in OpenOffice and save it as a pdf to preserve these character-markings. I hope someday MS Word for Mac will be able to do that. At least, for now, we can happily do Unicode Devanagari on MS Word for Mac. Madhav Deshpande On Sat, Jul 16, 2016 at 1:41 AM, Valerie Roebuck wrote: > Yes, It took me a while to work that out. I was on the phone to a baffled > person at Apple trying to explain about my Sanskrit diacritics no longer > working when the penny suddenly dropped. > > Valerie J Roebuck > Manchester, UK > > On 16 Jul 2016, at 03:38, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > > Hello Hans, > > Evidently the ABC Extended Keyboard on El Kapitan operating system is > the same as the US Extended Keyboard on Maverick and older operating > systems, with just a different name. > > Madhav > > On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:49 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich > wrote: > >> Have you tried the US Extended keyboard, Madhav? >> >> I use Times New Roman, which works very well with unicode >> >> All the best >> >> Hans >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Jul 15, 2016, at 16:25, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >> >> Hans, >> >> Just tested your suggestions with ABC Extended keyboard layout, and >> this does work in TextEdit and in Gmail, but not in MS Word. I tried to >> copy and paste from EextEdit into Word, and the Word was not able to show >> the stacking of three diacritics like ???. Glad to know that such >> combinations are possible at least on some platforms. Thanks, Hans, for >> solving one of my long-standing problems. With best wishes, >> >> Madhav >> >> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:15 PM, Madhav Deshpande >> wrote: >> >>> Hello Hans, >>> >>> Which keyboard-layout are you using to produce these characters? >>> >>> Madhav >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:05 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich >> > wrote: >>> >>>> Dear Madhav, >>>> >>>> Though there may be some limitations on stacking, it is possible to >>>> produce the following symbol on the Mac (still system 10.9.5): ???. The >>>> first diacritic (the macron) is accessed by typing option a + a; the other >>>> two diacritics by entering shift-option n and shift-option e AFTER having >>>> typed assembled the basic ? character. This post-character shift-option >>>> input procedure doesn?t seem to be well advertised; I more or less stumbled >>>> upon it in some university?s instructions for its faculty. >>>> >>>> There is one concern, however: While ? and the like is treated as a >>>> single glyph in unicode and thus transfers well between unicode-compatible >>>> platforms, more complex character, such as ??, ??, or ???, are not single >>>> glyphs and may therefore not transfer across platforms. We ran into this >>>> problem in producing the documents from which the new South Asia volume in >>>> the series World of Linguistics have been printed, and the only thing that >>>> we could do was submit a pdf-version indicating the desired character shape. >>>> >>>> I hope this helps. >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> >>>> Hans >>>> >>>> >>>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 13:13, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >>>> >>>> This is a question as to how to get multiple markings on the same vowel >>>> sign. In my pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I had included, >>>> for instance, the sign for vowel "a" with three markings, length, nasality >>>> and accent. This is necessary to represent P??inian procedures accurately. >>>> P??ini deals with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. differing in >>>> length, accent and nasality. Is there a way to do this with unicode fonts >>>> and keyboards? >>>> >>>> Madhav Deshpande >>>> >>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long >>> > wrote: >>>> >>>>> The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical >>>>> marks. Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. >>>>> Option + x = underdot: ?, ?, etc. Option + w = overdot: ?. Option + >>>>> e = accent mark: ?. Tilde is of course option + n: ?. >>>>> >>>>> All the best, >>>>> Jeff >>>>> >>>>> Dr. Jeffery D. Long >>>>> Professor of Religion and Asian Studies >>>>> Elizabethtown College >>>>> Elizabethtown, PA >>>>> >>>>> https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Series Editor, *Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, >>>>> Ethical, and Philosophical* >>>>> Lexington Books >>>>> >>>>> Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal >>>>> http://www.sutrajournal.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome >>>>> all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials >>>>> of life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard >>>>> (made, if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for >>>>> diacritics, no mess, no fuss. >>>>> >>>>> Jonathan >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> David, >>>>> >>>>> The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has >>>>> the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try reinstalling >>>>> the keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to you. Best, >>>>> >>>>> Madhav >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the >>>>> full range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort >>>>> to Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? >>>>> >>>>> This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy >>>>> Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. >>>>> >>>>> David >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've >>>>> been typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years >>>>> (Linux). I had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. >>>>> And the Mac used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's >>>>> okay now, at least. >>>>> >>>>> Dominik >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Professor Dominik Wujastyk* >>>>> >>>>> Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity >>>>> Department of History and Classics >>>>> >>>>> University of Alberta, Canada >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ?sas.ualberta.ca? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Dear Indologists, >>>>> >>>>> To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the >>>>> latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating >>>>> System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode >>>>> Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard >>>>> layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like >>>>> TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to >>>>> edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily >>>>> changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of >>>>> you. Best, >>>>> >>>>> Madhav Deshpande >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>> committee) >>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>> >>>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>> committee) >>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>> >>>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>> committee) >>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>> >>>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> J. Silk >>>>> Leiden University >>>>> Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS >>>>> Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b >>>>> 2311 BZ Leiden >>>>> The Netherlands >>>>> >>>>> copies of my publications may be found at >>>>> http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>> committee) >>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>> (where >>>>> you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>> committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>> >>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dmellins at gmail.com Sat Jul 16 15:50:23 2016 From: dmellins at gmail.com (David Mellins) Date: Sat, 16 Jul 16 11:50:23 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I'd also like to thank everyone who has clarified Sanskrit diacritical inputs in El Capitan. Big relief! David On Sat, Jul 16, 2016 at 7:14 AM, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > Another happy discovery yesterday was that OpenOffice for Mac is able to > display characters with multiple markings like ???, ???, ???, r???? etc. > So, if one is writing something that needs characters with such multiple > markings on Mac, it is possible to do a document in OpenOffice and save it > as a pdf to preserve these character-markings. I hope someday MS Word for > Mac will be able to do that. At least, for now, we can happily do Unicode > Devanagari on MS Word for Mac. > > Madhav Deshpande > > On Sat, Jul 16, 2016 at 1:41 AM, Valerie Roebuck > wrote: > >> Yes, It took me a while to work that out. I was on the phone to a baffled >> person at Apple trying to explain about my Sanskrit diacritics no longer >> working when the penny suddenly dropped. >> >> Valerie J Roebuck >> Manchester, UK >> >> On 16 Jul 2016, at 03:38, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >> >> Hello Hans, >> >> Evidently the ABC Extended Keyboard on El Kapitan operating system >> is the same as the US Extended Keyboard on Maverick and older operating >> systems, with just a different name. >> >> Madhav >> >> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:49 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich >> wrote: >> >>> Have you tried the US Extended keyboard, Madhav? >>> >>> I use Times New Roman, which works very well with unicode >>> >>> All the best >>> >>> Hans >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 16:25, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >>> >>> Hans, >>> >>> Just tested your suggestions with ABC Extended keyboard layout, and >>> this does work in TextEdit and in Gmail, but not in MS Word. I tried to >>> copy and paste from EextEdit into Word, and the Word was not able to show >>> the stacking of three diacritics like ???. Glad to know that such >>> combinations are possible at least on some platforms. Thanks, Hans, for >>> solving one of my long-standing problems. With best wishes, >>> >>> Madhav >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:15 PM, Madhav Deshpande >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hello Hans, >>>> >>>> Which keyboard-layout are you using to produce these characters? >>>> >>>> Madhav >>>> >>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:05 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich < >>>> hhhock at illinois.edu> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Dear Madhav, >>>>> >>>>> Though there may be some limitations on stacking, it is possible to >>>>> produce the following symbol on the Mac (still system 10.9.5): ???. The >>>>> first diacritic (the macron) is accessed by typing option a + a; the other >>>>> two diacritics by entering shift-option n and shift-option e AFTER having >>>>> typed assembled the basic ? character. This post-character shift-option >>>>> input procedure doesn?t seem to be well advertised; I more or less stumbled >>>>> upon it in some university?s instructions for its faculty. >>>>> >>>>> There is one concern, however: While ? and the like is treated as a >>>>> single glyph in unicode and thus transfers well between unicode-compatible >>>>> platforms, more complex character, such as ??, ??, or ???, are not single >>>>> glyphs and may therefore not transfer across platforms. We ran into this >>>>> problem in producing the documents from which the new South Asia volume in >>>>> the series World of Linguistics have been printed, and the only thing that >>>>> we could do was submit a pdf-version indicating the desired character shape. >>>>> >>>>> I hope this helps. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> >>>>> Hans >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 13:13, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >>>>> >>>>> This is a question as to how to get multiple markings on the same >>>>> vowel sign. In my pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I had >>>>> included, for instance, the sign for vowel "a" with three markings, length, >>>>> nasality and accent. This is necessary to represent P??inian procedures >>>>> accurately. P??ini deals with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. >>>>> differing in length, accent and nasality. Is there a way to do this with >>>>> unicode fonts and keyboards? >>>>> >>>>> Madhav Deshpande >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long < >>>>> dharmaprof108 at yahoo.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical >>>>>> marks. Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. >>>>>> Option + x = underdot: ?, ?, etc. Option + w = overdot: ?. Option >>>>>> + e = accent mark: ?. Tilde is of course option + n: ?. >>>>>> >>>>>> All the best, >>>>>> Jeff >>>>>> >>>>>> Dr. Jeffery D. Long >>>>>> Professor of Religion and Asian Studies >>>>>> Elizabethtown College >>>>>> Elizabethtown, PA >>>>>> >>>>>> https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Series Editor, *Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, >>>>>> Ethical, and Philosophical* >>>>>> Lexington Books >>>>>> >>>>>> Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal >>>>>> http://www.sutrajournal.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome >>>>>> all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials >>>>>> of life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard >>>>>> (made, if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for >>>>>> diacritics, no mess, no fuss. >>>>>> >>>>>> Jonathan >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> David, >>>>>> >>>>>> The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that >>>>>> has the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try >>>>>> reinstalling the keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to >>>>>> you. Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Madhav >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the >>>>>> full range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort >>>>>> to Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? >>>>>> >>>>>> This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old >>>>>> Easy Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. >>>>>> >>>>>> David >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've >>>>>> been typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years >>>>>> (Linux). I had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. >>>>>> And the Mac used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's >>>>>> okay now, at least. >>>>>> >>>>>> Dominik >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Professor Dominik Wujastyk* >>>>>> >>>>>> Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity >>>>>> Department of History and Classics >>>>>> >>>>>> University of Alberta, Canada >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ?sas.ualberta.ca? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Dear Indologists, >>>>>> >>>>>> To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the >>>>>> latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating >>>>>> System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode >>>>>> Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard >>>>>> layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like >>>>>> TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to >>>>>> edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily >>>>>> changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of >>>>>> you. Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Madhav Deshpande >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>>> committee) >>>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>>> >>>>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>>> committee) >>>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>>> >>>>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>>> committee) >>>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>>> >>>>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> J. Silk >>>>>> Leiden University >>>>>> Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS >>>>>> Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b >>>>>> 2311 BZ Leiden >>>>>> The Netherlands >>>>>> >>>>>> copies of my publications may be found at >>>>>> http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>>> committee) >>>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>>> (where >>>>>> you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>> committee) >>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>> >>>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From glhart at berkeley.edu Sat Jul 16 16:31:33 2016 From: glhart at berkeley.edu (George Hart) Date: Sat, 16 Jul 16 10:31:33 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <61BC1EAB-6D4C-40F6-BD3A-4B0070A1781A@berkeley.edu> As someone who has worked on Indic fonts (Tamil and Devanagari as well as roman transliteration) from the early 80?s and the time of the Lisa, I?d like to add my thoughts. It is wonderful to be able to use unicode for all the diacritical marks we need for all devices and operating systems (though as noted sometimes when you have several on the same letter they do not transfer well), but I don?t see that using them is particularly easy when you have to press many keys at once. Perhaps one can get up to speed this way, but option-(x) is pretty unsatisfactory, and option-shift-(x) even more so. I don?t know all the keyboard layouts that are available for roman transliteration of various South Asia languages (and, for this forum, Sanskrit especially). I would hope some are easier to use than option-shift-(x). The best solution, I think, is to use a dead key. That way, you don?t have to keep one key pressed down while you press another. I have a very simple keyboard layout for the Mac (which still works in Sierra) that uses forward slash as a dead key. /a gives ?, // gives /, /r gives ?, /h gives ?, etc. Any keyboard like this is easily constructed using Ukulele, a free Mac app, as many on this forum know. If anyone wants to try it out, here it is ? https://www.dropbox.com/s/twsgq6xayubqbxa/IndianRomanUnicode.keylayout.zip?dl=0. It can easily be modified with Ukulele to add, for example, Vedic accents. I hope it may prove useful to some scholars. (Unzip the file, put it in Library/Keyboard Layouts and activate it in Language and Region in System Preferences). Unfortunately, there is no way to get it to work in iOS that I have found, and, of course, it doesn?t work on Windows, though it should not be too hard to make a similar layout for that OS. I find myself somewhat allergic to Word, whether on Windows or the Mac (even the newest version). I use Nisus Writer Pro, which is written entirely using the MacOS development system rather than cobbling together things that have various other provenances (making Indic fonts unworkable on most Mac versions of Word). I find NWP absolutely indispensable and recently produced a camera-ready pdf of my translation of the Akan????u it. I recommend it highly. George > On Jul 16, 2016, at 9:50 AM, David Mellins wrote: > > I'd also like to thank everyone who has clarified Sanskrit diacritical inputs in El Capitan. Big relief! > > David > ) > On Sat, Jul 16, 2016 at 7:14 AM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: > Another happy discovery yesterday was that OpenOffice for Mac is able to display characters with multiple markings like ???, ???, ???, r???? etc. So, if one is writing something that needs characters with such multiple markings on Mac, it is possible to do a document in OpenOffice and save it as a pdf to preserve these character-markings. I hope someday MS Word for Mac will be able to do that. At least, for now, we can happily do Unicode Devanagari on MS Word for Mac. > > Madhav Deshpande > > On Sat, Jul 16, 2016 at 1:41 AM, Valerie Roebuck > wrote: > Yes, It took me a while to work that out. I was on the phone to a baffled person at Apple trying to explain about my Sanskrit diacritics no longer working when the penny suddenly dropped. > > Valerie J Roebuck > Manchester, UK > >> On 16 Jul 2016, at 03:38, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: >> >> Hello Hans, >> >> Evidently the ABC Extended Keyboard on El Kapitan operating system is the same as the US Extended Keyboard on Maverick and older operating systems, with just a different name. >> >> Madhav >> >> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:49 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich > wrote: >> Have you tried the US Extended keyboard, Madhav? >> >> I use Times New Roman, which works very well with unicode >> >> All the best >> >> Hans >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Jul 15, 2016, at 16:25, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: >> >>> Hans, >>> >>> Just tested your suggestions with ABC Extended keyboard layout, and this does work in TextEdit and in Gmail, but not in MS Word. I tried to copy and paste from EextEdit into Word, and the Word was not able to show the stacking of three diacritics like ???. Glad to know that such combinations are possible at least on some platforms. Thanks, Hans, for solving one of my long-standing problems. With best wishes, >>> >>> Madhav >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:15 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: >>> Hello Hans, >>> >>> Which keyboard-layout are you using to produce these characters? >>> >>> Madhav >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:05 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich > wrote: >>> Dear Madhav, >>> >>> Though there may be some limitations on stacking, it is possible to produce the following symbol on the Mac (still system 10.9.5): ???. The first diacritic (the macron) is accessed by typing option a + a; the other two diacritics by entering shift-option n and shift-option e AFTER having typed assembled the basic ? character. This post-character shift-option input procedure doesn?t seem to be well advertised; I more or less stumbled upon it in some university?s instructions for its faculty. >>> >>> There is one concern, however: While ? and the like is treated as a single glyph in unicode and thus transfers well between unicode-compatible platforms, more complex character, such as ??, ??, or ???, are not single glyphs and may therefore not transfer across platforms. We ran into this problem in producing the documents from which the new South Asia volume in the series World of Linguistics have been printed, and the only thing that we could do was submit a pdf-version indicating the desired character shape. >>> >>> I hope this helps. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Hans >>> >>> >>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 13:13, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: >>> >>>> This is a question as to how to get multiple markings on the same vowel sign. In my pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I had included, for instance, the sign for vowel "a" with three markings, length, nasality and accent. This is necessary to represent P??inian procedures accurately. P??ini deals with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. differing in length, accent and nasality. Is there a way to do this with unicode fonts and keyboards? >>>> >>>> Madhav Deshpande >>>> >>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long > wrote: >>>> The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical marks. Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. Option + x = underdot: ?, ?, etc. Option + w = overdot: ?. Option + e = accent mark: ?. Tilde is of course option + n: ?. >>>> >>>> All the best, >>>> Jeff >>>> >>>> Dr. Jeffery D. Long >>>> Professor of Religion and Asian Studies >>>> Elizabethtown College >>>> Elizabethtown, PA >>>> >>>> https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong >>>> >>>> Series Editor, Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, Ethical, and Philosophical >>>> Lexington Books >>>> >>>> Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal >>>> http://www.sutrajournal.com >>>> >>>> "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials of life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk > wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard (made, if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for diacritics, no mess, no fuss. >>>> >>>> Jonathan >>>> >>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: >>>> David, >>>> >>>> The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try reinstalling the keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to you. Best, >>>> >>>> Madhav >>>> >>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins > wrote: >>>> Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the full range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort to Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? >>>> >>>> This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. >>>> >>>> David >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk > wrote: >>>> >>>>> I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux). I had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's okay now, at least. >>>>> >>>>> Dominik >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Professor Dominik Wujastyk* >>>>> Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity >>>>> Department of History and Classics >>>>> University of Alberta, Canada >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ?sas.ualberta.ca? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: >>>>> Dear Indologists, >>>>> >>>>> To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of you. Best, >>>>> >>>>> Madhav Deshpande >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> J. Silk >>>> Leiden University >>>> Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS >>>> Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b >>>> 2311 BZ Leiden >>>> The Netherlands >>>> >>>> copies of my publications may be found at >>>> http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From aksobhya.buddha at gmail.com Sat Jul 16 17:24:19 2016 From: aksobhya.buddha at gmail.com (Justin Fifield) Date: Sat, 16 Jul 16 13:24:19 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: <61BC1EAB-6D4C-40F6-BD3A-4B0070A1781A@berkeley.edu> Message-ID: One can easily make a keyboard with a 'dead key' on Windows using the Microsoft Keyboard Layout Creator (https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=22339). It is completely customizable and you can use any keyboard as the basis for the build. I also use the forward slash for my dead key and find typing is quite fast. I haven't tried to incorporate multiple diacritics (before this thread I didn't think it was possible without specialized fonts). I'm not sure how that would work. - Justin Fifield On 7/16/2016 12:31 PM, George Hart wrote: > As someone who has worked on Indic fonts (Tamil and Devanagari as well > as roman transliteration) from the early 80?s and the time of the > Lisa, I?d like to add my thoughts. It is wonderful to be able to use > unicode for all the diacritical marks we need for all devices and > operating systems (though as noted sometimes when you have several on > the same letter they do not transfer well), but I don?t see that using > them is particularly easy when you have to press many keys at once. > Perhaps one can get up to speed this way, but option-(x) is pretty > unsatisfactory, and option-shift-(x) even more so. > > I don?t know all the keyboard layouts that are available for roman > transliteration of various South Asia languages (and, for this forum, > Sanskrit especially). I would hope some are easier to use than > option-shift-(x). The best solution, I think, is to use a dead key. > That way, you don?t have to keep one key pressed down while you press > another. I have a very simple keyboard layout for the Mac (which still > works in Sierra) that uses forward slash as a dead key. /a gives ?, // > gives /, /r gives ?, /h gives ?, etc. Any keyboard like this is easily > constructed using Ukulele, a free Mac app, as many on this forum know. > If anyone wants to try it out, here it is ? > https://www.dropbox.com/s/twsgq6xayubqbxa/IndianRomanUnicode.keylayout.zip?dl=0. > It can easily be modified with Ukulele to add, for example, Vedic > accents. I hope it may prove useful to some scholars. (Unzip the file, > put it in Library/Keyboard Layouts and activate it in Language and > Region in System Preferences). Unfortunately, there is no way to get > it to work in iOS that I have found, and, of course, it doesn?t work > on Windows, though it should not be too hard to make a similar layout > for that OS. > > I find myself somewhat allergic to Word, whether on Windows or the Mac > (even the newest version). I use Nisus Writer Pro, which is written > entirely using the MacOS development system rather than cobbling > together things that have various other provenances (making Indic > fonts unworkable on most Mac versions of Word). I find NWP absolutely > indispensable and recently produced a camera-ready pdf of my > translation of the Akan????u it. I recommend it highly. George > > >> On Jul 16, 2016, at 9:50 AM, David Mellins > > wrote: >> >> I'd also like to thank everyone who has clarified Sanskrit >> diacritical inputs in El Capitan. Big relief! >> >> David >> ) >> On Sat, Jul 16, 2016 at 7:14 AM, Madhav Deshpande > > wrote: >> >> Another happy discovery yesterday was that OpenOffice for Mac is >> able to display characters with multiple markings like ???, ???, >> ???, r???? etc. So, if one is writing something that needs >> characters with such multiple markings on Mac, it is possible to >> do a document in OpenOffice and save it as a pdf to preserve >> these character-markings. I hope someday MS Word for Mac will be >> able to do that. At least, for now, we can happily do Unicode >> Devanagari on MS Word for Mac. >> >> Madhav Deshpande >> >> On Sat, Jul 16, 2016 at 1:41 AM, Valerie Roebuck >> > wrote: >> >> Yes, It took me a while to work that out. I was on the phone >> to a baffled person at Apple trying to explain about my >> Sanskrit diacritics no longer working when the penny suddenly >> dropped. >> >> Valerie J Roebuck >> Manchester, UK >> >>> On 16 Jul 2016, at 03:38, Madhav Deshpande >> > wrote: >>> >>> Hello Hans, >>> >>> Evidently the ABC Extended Keyboard on El Kapitan operating >>> system is the same as the US Extended Keyboard on Maverick >>> and older operating systems, with just a different name. >>> >>> Madhav >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:49 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich >>> > wrote: >>> >>> Have you tried the US Extended keyboard, Madhav? >>> >>> I use Times New Roman, which works very well with unicode >>> >>> All the best >>> >>> Hans >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 16:25, Madhav Deshpande >>> > wrote: >>> >>>> Hans, >>>> >>>> Just tested your suggestions with ABC Extended >>>> keyboard layout, and this does work in TextEdit and in >>>> Gmail, but not in MS Word. I tried to copy and paste >>>> from EextEdit into Word, and the Word was not able to >>>> show the stacking of three diacritics like ???. Glad to >>>> know that such combinations are possible at least on >>>> some platforms. Thanks, Hans, for solving one of my >>>> long-standing problems. With best wishes, >>>> >>>> Madhav >>>> >>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:15 PM, Madhav Deshpande >>>> > wrote: >>>> >>>> Hello Hans, >>>> >>>> Which keyboard-layout are you using to produce >>>> these characters? >>>> >>>> Madhav >>>> >>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:05 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich >>>> > >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Dear Madhav, >>>> >>>> Though there may be some limitations on >>>> stacking, it is possible to produce the >>>> following symbol on the Mac (still system >>>> 10.9.5): ???. The first diacritic (the macron) >>>> is accessed by typing option a + a; the other >>>> two diacritics by entering shift-option n and >>>> shift-option e AFTER having typed assembled the >>>> basic ? character. This post-character >>>> shift-option input procedure doesn?t seem to be >>>> well advertised; I more or less stumbled upon >>>> it in some university?s instructions for its >>>> faculty. >>>> >>>> There is one concern, however: While ? and the >>>> like is treated as a single glyph in unicode >>>> and thus transfers well between >>>> unicode-compatible platforms, more complex >>>> character, such as ??, ??, or ???, are not >>>> single glyphs and may therefore not transfer >>>> across platforms. We ran into this problem in >>>> producing the documents from which the new >>>> South Asia volume in the series World of >>>> Linguistics have been printed, and the only >>>> thing that we could do was submit a pdf-version >>>> indicating the desired character shape. >>>> >>>> I hope this helps. >>>> >>>> Cheers, >>>> >>>> Hans >>>> >>>> >>>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 13:13, Madhav Deshpande >>>> > wrote: >>>> >>>>> This is a question as to how to get multiple >>>>> markings on the same vowel sign. In my >>>>> pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I >>>>> had included, for instance, the sign for vowel >>>>> "a" with three markings, length, nasality and >>>>> accent. This is necessary to represent >>>>> P??inian procedures accurately. P??ini deals >>>>> with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. >>>>> differing in length, accent and nasality. Is >>>>> there a way to do this with unicode fonts and >>>>> keyboards? >>>>> >>>>> Madhav Deshpande >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long >>>>> >>>> > wrote: >>>>> >>>>> The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is >>>>> good for all diacritical marks. Combining >>>>> the option key with a gives the macron: ?, >>>>> ?, etc. Option + x = underdot: ?, ?, etc. >>>>> Option + w = overdot: ?. Option + e = >>>>> accent mark: ?. Tilde is of course option >>>>> + n: ?. >>>>> >>>>> All the best, >>>>> Jeff >>>>> Dr. Jeffery D. Long >>>>> Professor of Religion and Asian Studies >>>>> Elizabethtown College >>>>> Elizabethtown, PA >>>>> >>>>> https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Series Editor, /Explorations in Indic >>>>> Traditions: Theological, Ethical, and >>>>> Philosophical/ >>>>> Lexington Books >>>>> >>>>> Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal >>>>> http://www.sutrajournal.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> "One who makes a habit of prayer and >>>>> meditation will easily overcome all >>>>> difficulties and remain calm and unruffled >>>>> in the midst of the trials of life." >>>>> (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan >>>>> Silk >>>> > wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the >>>>> Asian Extended keyboard (made, if I am not >>>>> wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly >>>>> for diacritics, no mess, no fuss. >>>>> >>>>> Jonathan >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav >>>>> Deshpande >>>> > wrote: >>>>> >>>>> David, >>>>> >>>>> The old Easy Unicode >>>>> keyboard-layout does work on my Mac >>>>> that has the latest operating system >>>>> and the latest MS Office 360. Try >>>>> reinstalling the keyboard file, if you >>>>> have it. If not, I can send it to >>>>> you. Best, >>>>> >>>>> Madhav >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David >>>>> Mellins >>>> > wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Yes, This is true, but have you >>>>> found a convenient way to enter >>>>> the full range of diacritica for >>>>> Romanized Sanskrit without having >>>>> to resort to Emoji/Latin/favorites >>>>> inserts? >>>>> >>>>> This is not the worst thing in the >>>>> world, but slower than the old >>>>> Easy Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. >>>>> >>>>> David >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, >>>>> Dominik Wujastyk >>>>> >>>> > wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I'm shocked. I don't pay much >>>>>> attention to the Mac world, but >>>>>> I've been typing Devanagari into >>>>>> everything on my computer for >>>>>> many years (Linux). I had no >>>>>> idea that this wasn't possible or >>>>>> easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac >>>>>> used to be the byword for >>>>>> multilingual support. I'm glad >>>>>> it's okay now, at least. >>>>>> >>>>>> Dominik >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Professor Dominik Wujastyk* >>>>>> >>>>>> Singhmar Chair in Classical >>>>>> Indian Society and Polity >>>>>> Department of History and >>>>>> Classics >>>>>> >>>>>> University of Alberta, Canada >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ?sas.ualberta.ca? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav >>>>>> Deshpande >>>>> > wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Dear Indologists, >>>>>> >>>>>> To my happy surprise, I >>>>>> found that with the >>>>>> combination of the latest >>>>>> version of Microsoft Office >>>>>> 360 for Mac and the latest >>>>>> Mac Operating System OS X El >>>>>> Capitan, it is now possible >>>>>> to directly enter Unicode >>>>>> Devanagari in a Word document >>>>>> with the Devanagari - QWERTY >>>>>> keyboard layout. Previously, >>>>>> I had to enter Unicode >>>>>> Devanagari in something like >>>>>> TextEdit and then copy and >>>>>> paste into a Word document, >>>>>> but was not able to edit it >>>>>> in the Word document. The >>>>>> new development of software >>>>>> has happily changed that >>>>>> situation. Hope this >>>>>> information will be of use to >>>>>> some of you. Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Madhav Deshpande >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>>> >>>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info >>>>>> >>>>>> (messages to the list's >>>>>> managing committee) >>>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>>> >>>>>> (where you can change your >>>>>> list options or unsubscribe) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>>> >>>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info >>>>>> >>>>>> (messages to the list's managing >>>>>> committee) >>>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>>> >>>>>> (where you can change your list >>>>>> options or unsubscribe) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>> >>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info >>>>> >>>>> (messages to the list's managing >>>>> committee) >>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>> >>>>> (where you can change your list >>>>> options or unsubscribe) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> J. Silk >>>>> Leiden University >>>>> Leiden University Institute for Area >>>>> Studies, LIAS >>>>> Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b >>>>> 2311 BZ Leiden >>>>> The Netherlands >>>>> >>>>> copies of my publications may be found at >>>>> http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>> >>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info >>>>> >>>>> (messages to the list's managing committee) >>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>> (where >>>>> you can change your list options or >>>>> unsubscribe) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>> >>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info >>>>> >>>>> (messages to the list's managing committee) >>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>> >>>>> (where you can change your list options or >>>>> unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info >>> (messages to the >>> list's managing committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>> (where you can change your >>> list options or unsubscribe) >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info >> (messages to the >> list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info >> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >> or unsubscribe) > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From slindqui at mail.smu.edu Sun Jul 17 02:14:58 2016 From: slindqui at mail.smu.edu (Lindquist, Steven) Date: Sun, 17 Jul 16 02:14:58 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Madhav, Can you downgrade? This sounds like a problem with Office 360. Complex characters work fine in Word 2011 w/ El Capitan. Generally speaking, unicode, Word, and Apple always have had a very rocky relationship (my understanding is that it's mainly the fault of Microsoft and, with just about every major update, there is some new problem). I always delay upgrading Word and, when I do, I always retain the older working version for quite some time afterward just in case (I never updated to 360 because nightmare stories about garbled documents appeared rather quickly after the release). Best, Steven From: INDOLOGY > on behalf of Madhav Deshpande > Date: Saturday, July 16, 2016 at 6:14 AM To: Valerie Roebuck > Cc: Indology > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac Another happy discovery yesterday was that OpenOffice for Mac is able to display characters with multiple markings like ???, ???, ???, r???? etc. So, if one is writing something that needs characters with such multiple markings on Mac, it is possible to do a document in OpenOffice and save it as a pdf to preserve these character-markings. I hope someday MS Word for Mac will be able to do that. At least, for now, we can happily do Unicode Devanagari on MS Word for Mac. Madhav Deshpande On Sat, Jul 16, 2016 at 1:41 AM, Valerie Roebuck > wrote: Yes, It took me a while to work that out. I was on the phone to a baffled person at Apple trying to explain about my Sanskrit diacritics no longer working when the penny suddenly dropped. Valerie J Roebuck Manchester, UK On 16 Jul 2016, at 03:38, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: Hello Hans, Evidently the ABC Extended Keyboard on El Kapitan operating system is the same as the US Extended Keyboard on Maverick and older operating systems, with just a different name. Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:49 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich > wrote: Have you tried the US Extended keyboard, Madhav? I use Times New Roman, which works very well with unicode All the best Hans Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2016, at 16:25, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: Hans, Just tested your suggestions with ABC Extended keyboard layout, and this does work in TextEdit and in Gmail, but not in MS Word. I tried to copy and paste from EextEdit into Word, and the Word was not able to show the stacking of three diacritics like ???. Glad to know that such combinations are possible at least on some platforms. Thanks, Hans, for solving one of my long-standing problems. With best wishes, Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:15 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: Hello Hans, Which keyboard-layout are you using to produce these characters? Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:05 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich > wrote: Dear Madhav, Though there may be some limitations on stacking, it is possible to produce the following symbol on the Mac (still system 10.9.5): ???. The first diacritic (the macron) is accessed by typing option a + a; the other two diacritics by entering shift-option n and shift-option e AFTER having typed assembled the basic ? character. This post-character shift-option input procedure doesn?t seem to be well advertised; I more or less stumbled upon it in some university?s instructions for its faculty. There is one concern, however: While ? and the like is treated as a single glyph in unicode and thus transfers well between unicode-compatible platforms, more complex character, such as ??, ??, or ???, are not single glyphs and may therefore not transfer across platforms. We ran into this problem in producing the documents from which the new South Asia volume in the series World of Linguistics have been printed, and the only thing that we could do was submit a pdf-version indicating the desired character shape. I hope this helps. Cheers, Hans On 15 Jul 2016, at 13:13, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: This is a question as to how to get multiple markings on the same vowel sign. In my pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I had included, for instance, the sign for vowel "a" with three markings, length, nasality and accent. This is necessary to represent P??inian procedures accurately. P??ini deals with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. differing in length, accent and nasality. Is there a way to do this with unicode fonts and keyboards? Madhav Deshpande On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long > wrote: The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical marks. Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. Option + x = underdot: ?, ?, etc. Option + w = overdot: ?. Option + e = accent mark: ?. Tilde is of course option + n: ?. All the best, Jeff Dr. Jeffery D. Long Professor of Religion and Asian Studies Elizabethtown College Elizabethtown, PA https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong Series Editor, Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, Ethical, and Philosophical Lexington Books Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal http://secure-web.cisco.com/1RX8fLCEnEOXJoXmHLPtsA2NBvpvncjne47kL11hVc8iZmSdFT6Hr4QgEVbi1Mdws35IZpnYzdt8TlnHqTDC-QZfCkiUIx5JMLEtcixhzDtRFqZ4Rg5yPGZYp5bhC6uHO47UqSzoV4_PCI2BQtJ3L8iCitPbeMVSY4fHnhnnzh4wJ2F57XxkA5pDJD6jrq9m2Ks2WiZesjXB8AqVp9NMpbQ/http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sutrajournal.com "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials of life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk > wrote: Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard (made, if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for diacritics, no mess, no fuss. Jonathan On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: David, The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try reinstalling the keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to you. Best, Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins > wrote: Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the full range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort to Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. David Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk > wrote: I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux). I had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's okay now, at least. Dominik -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada ?sas.ualberta.ca? On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: Dear Indologists, To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of you. Best, Madhav Deshpande _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- J. Silk Leiden University Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b 2311 BZ Leiden The Netherlands copies of my publications may be found at http://secure-web.cisco.com/1CS7rRoxE1KSDyDZCaFQCYgEncchWOA46xGBkfViV13Y3zO7S4A1ewIsI4d_mKAtHR6BhM0w-2eNU_nt1XJb2uZiHYGbGaQ4cXNSCU4siXfpGICXXm07X0-TFwHYXuIaKFngiw1Dq3v8Bk6UAQOsm3KYXYphdi2hqBQKkJbIDQspIdq9WeV-oLfQXIpZ8O6mVNpRctDkCidUIrqINNFFEpg/http%3A%2F%2Fwww.buddhismandsocialjustice.com%2Fsilk_publications.html _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Sun Jul 17 02:37:29 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sat, 16 Jul 16 22:37:29 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks, Steven, for this suggestion. Fortunately, I still have Office 2011 version on my laptop and I can create a document in it. I created a test document in Word 2011, with stacked diacritics like ???, and it worked fine. Then, when I opened that test document in Office 360, the stacked diacritics survived on the previously entered text, but Office 360 would not allow me to enter new characters with stacked diacritics. So, obviously something did change in Office 360. On the positive side, Office 360 now allows entering Unicode Devanagari with Devanagari QWERTY keyboard, something that was not possible on Office 2011. You lose some and you gain some. Madhav On Sat, Jul 16, 2016 at 10:14 PM, Lindquist, Steven wrote: > Dear Madhav, > > Can you downgrade? This sounds like a problem with Office 360. Complex > characters work fine in Word 2011 w/ El Capitan. > > Generally speaking, unicode, Word, and Apple always have had a very rocky > relationship (my understanding is that it's mainly the fault of Microsoft > and, with just about every major update, there is some new problem). I > always delay upgrading Word and, when I do, I always retain the older > working version for quite some time afterward just in case (I never updated > to 360 because nightmare stories about garbled documents appeared rather > quickly after the release). > > Best, > > Steven > > > From: INDOLOGY on behalf of Madhav > Deshpande > Date: Saturday, July 16, 2016 at 6:14 AM > To: Valerie Roebuck > Cc: Indology > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac > > Another happy discovery yesterday was that OpenOffice for Mac is able to > display characters with multiple markings like ???, ???, ???, r???? etc. > So, if one is writing something that needs characters with such multiple > markings on Mac, it is possible to do a document in OpenOffice and save it > as a pdf to preserve these character-markings. I hope someday MS Word for > Mac will be able to do that. At least, for now, we can happily do Unicode > Devanagari on MS Word for Mac. > > Madhav Deshpande > > On Sat, Jul 16, 2016 at 1:41 AM, Valerie Roebuck > wrote: > >> Yes, It took me a while to work that out. I was on the phone to a baffled >> person at Apple trying to explain about my Sanskrit diacritics no longer >> working when the penny suddenly dropped. >> >> Valerie J Roebuck >> Manchester, UK >> >> On 16 Jul 2016, at 03:38, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >> >> Hello Hans, >> >> Evidently the ABC Extended Keyboard on El Kapitan operating system >> is the same as the US Extended Keyboard on Maverick and older operating >> systems, with just a different name. >> >> Madhav >> >> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:49 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich >> wrote: >> >>> Have you tried the US Extended keyboard, Madhav? >>> >>> I use Times New Roman, which works very well with unicode >>> >>> All the best >>> >>> Hans >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 16:25, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >>> >>> Hans, >>> >>> Just tested your suggestions with ABC Extended keyboard layout, and >>> this does work in TextEdit and in Gmail, but not in MS Word. I tried to >>> copy and paste from EextEdit into Word, and the Word was not able to show >>> the stacking of three diacritics like ???. Glad to know that such >>> combinations are possible at least on some platforms. Thanks, Hans, for >>> solving one of my long-standing problems. With best wishes, >>> >>> Madhav >>> >>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:15 PM, Madhav Deshpande >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hello Hans, >>>> >>>> Which keyboard-layout are you using to produce these characters? >>>> >>>> Madhav >>>> >>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:05 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich < >>>> hhhock at illinois.edu> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Dear Madhav, >>>>> >>>>> Though there may be some limitations on stacking, it is possible to >>>>> produce the following symbol on the Mac (still system 10.9.5): ???. The >>>>> first diacritic (the macron) is accessed by typing option a + a; the other >>>>> two diacritics by entering shift-option n and shift-option e AFTER having >>>>> typed assembled the basic ? character. This post-character shift-option >>>>> input procedure doesn?t seem to be well advertised; I more or less stumbled >>>>> upon it in some university?s instructions for its faculty. >>>>> >>>>> There is one concern, however: While ? and the like is treated as a >>>>> single glyph in unicode and thus transfers well between unicode-compatible >>>>> platforms, more complex character, such as ??, ??, or ???, are not single >>>>> glyphs and may therefore not transfer across platforms. We ran into this >>>>> problem in producing the documents from which the new South Asia volume in >>>>> the series World of Linguistics have been printed, and the only thing that >>>>> we could do was submit a pdf-version indicating the desired character shape. >>>>> >>>>> I hope this helps. >>>>> >>>>> Cheers, >>>>> >>>>> Hans >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 13:13, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >>>>> >>>>> This is a question as to how to get multiple markings on the same >>>>> vowel sign. In my pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I had >>>>> included, for instance, the sign for vowel "a" with three markings, length, >>>>> nasality and accent. This is necessary to represent P??inian procedures >>>>> accurately. P??ini deals with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. >>>>> differing in length, accent and nasality. Is there a way to do this with >>>>> unicode fonts and keyboards? >>>>> >>>>> Madhav Deshpande >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long < >>>>> dharmaprof108 at yahoo.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical >>>>>> marks. Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. >>>>>> Option + x = underdot: ?, ?, etc. Option + w = overdot: ?. Option >>>>>> + e = accent mark: ?. Tilde is of course option + n: ?. >>>>>> >>>>>> All the best, >>>>>> Jeff >>>>>> >>>>>> Dr. Jeffery D. Long >>>>>> Professor of Religion and Asian Studies >>>>>> Elizabethtown College >>>>>> Elizabethtown, PA >>>>>> >>>>>> https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Series Editor, *Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, >>>>>> Ethical, and Philosophical* >>>>>> Lexington Books >>>>>> >>>>>> Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal >>>>>> >>>>>> http://secure-web.cisco.com/1RX8fLCEnEOXJoXmHLPtsA2NBvpvncjne47kL11hVc8iZmSdFT6Hr4QgEVbi1Mdws35IZpnYzdt8TlnHqTDC-QZfCkiUIx5JMLEtcixhzDtRFqZ4Rg5yPGZYp5bhC6uHO47UqSzoV4_PCI2BQtJ3L8iCitPbeMVSY4fHnhnnzh4wJ2F57XxkA5pDJD6jrq9m2Ks2WiZesjXB8AqVp9NMpbQ/http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sutrajournal.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome >>>>>> all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials >>>>>> of life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard >>>>>> (made, if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for >>>>>> diacritics, no mess, no fuss. >>>>>> >>>>>> Jonathan >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> David, >>>>>> >>>>>> The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that >>>>>> has the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try >>>>>> reinstalling the keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to >>>>>> you. Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Madhav >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the >>>>>> full range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort >>>>>> to Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? >>>>>> >>>>>> This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old >>>>>> Easy Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. >>>>>> >>>>>> David >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>> On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've >>>>>> been typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years >>>>>> (Linux). I had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. >>>>>> And the Mac used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's >>>>>> okay now, at least. >>>>>> >>>>>> Dominik >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Professor Dominik Wujastyk* >>>>>> >>>>>> Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity >>>>>> Department of History and Classics >>>>>> >>>>>> University of Alberta, Canada >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ?sas.ualberta.ca? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Dear Indologists, >>>>>> >>>>>> To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the >>>>>> latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating >>>>>> System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode >>>>>> Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard >>>>>> layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like >>>>>> TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to >>>>>> edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily >>>>>> changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of >>>>>> you. Best, >>>>>> >>>>>> Madhav Deshpande >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>>> committee) >>>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>>> >>>>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>>> committee) >>>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>>> >>>>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>>> committee) >>>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>>> >>>>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> J. Silk >>>>>> Leiden University >>>>>> Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS >>>>>> Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b >>>>>> 2311 BZ Leiden >>>>>> The Netherlands >>>>>> >>>>>> copies of my publications may be found at >>>>>> >>>>>> http://secure-web.cisco.com/1CS7rRoxE1KSDyDZCaFQCYgEncchWOA46xGBkfViV13Y3zO7S4A1ewIsI4d_mKAtHR6BhM0w-2eNU_nt1XJb2uZiHYGbGaQ4cXNSCU4siXfpGICXXm07X0-TFwHYXuIaKFngiw1Dq3v8Bk6UAQOsm3KYXYphdi2hqBQKkJbIDQspIdq9WeV-oLfQXIpZ8O6mVNpRctDkCidUIrqINNFFEpg/http%3A%2F%2Fwww.buddhismandsocialjustice.com%2Fsilk_publications.html >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>>> committee) >>>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>>> (where >>>>>> you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>>> committee) >>>>> http://listinfo.indology.info >>>>> >>>>> (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hhhock at illinois.edu Sun Jul 17 02:47:55 2016 From: hhhock at illinois.edu (Hock, Hans Henrich) Date: Sun, 17 Jul 16 02:47:55 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4B567F6E-8C5E-49F7-833A-9850270F59B7@illinois.edu> Thanks to everybody involved in this thread. I had delayed upgrading my operating system from Mavericks as long as I had to take care of the huge job of putting together and editing the South Asia volume; evidently, that was a good decision. Now that I?m thinking of upgrading, I will profit from the discussion by making sure to keep my current version of Word active. At the same time, the prospect of being able to use Office 360 for working with Nagari is attractive. Using Text Editor makes document layout just about impossible, and the options in Open Office or Apple?s own word processor are much more limited than those in Word. All the best, Hans On 16 Jul 2016, at 21:37, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: Thanks, Steven, for this suggestion. Fortunately, I still have Office 2011 version on my laptop and I can create a document in it. I created a test document in Word 2011, with stacked diacritics like ???, and it worked fine. Then, when I opened that test document in Office 360, the stacked diacritics survived on the previously entered text, but Office 360 would not allow me to enter new characters with stacked diacritics. So, obviously something did change in Office 360. On the positive side, Office 360 now allows entering Unicode Devanagari with Devanagari QWERTY keyboard, something that was not possible on Office 2011. You lose some and you gain some. Madhav On Sat, Jul 16, 2016 at 10:14 PM, Lindquist, Steven > wrote: Dear Madhav, Can you downgrade? This sounds like a problem with Office 360. Complex characters work fine in Word 2011 w/ El Capitan. Generally speaking, unicode, Word, and Apple always have had a very rocky relationship (my understanding is that it's mainly the fault of Microsoft and, with just about every major update, there is some new problem). I always delay upgrading Word and, when I do, I always retain the older working version for quite some time afterward just in case (I never updated to 360 because nightmare stories about garbled documents appeared rather quickly after the release). Best, Steven From: INDOLOGY > on behalf of Madhav Deshpande > Date: Saturday, July 16, 2016 at 6:14 AM To: Valerie Roebuck > Cc: Indology > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac Another happy discovery yesterday was that OpenOffice for Mac is able to display characters with multiple markings like ???, ???, ???, r???? etc. So, if one is writing something that needs characters with such multiple markings on Mac, it is possible to do a document in OpenOffice and save it as a pdf to preserve these character-markings. I hope someday MS Word for Mac will be able to do that. At least, for now, we can happily do Unicode Devanagari on MS Word for Mac. Madhav Deshpande On Sat, Jul 16, 2016 at 1:41 AM, Valerie Roebuck > wrote: Yes, It took me a while to work that out. I was on the phone to a baffled person at Apple trying to explain about my Sanskrit diacritics no longer working when the penny suddenly dropped. Valerie J Roebuck Manchester, UK On 16 Jul 2016, at 03:38, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: Hello Hans, Evidently the ABC Extended Keyboard on El Kapitan operating system is the same as the US Extended Keyboard on Maverick and older operating systems, with just a different name. Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:49 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich > wrote: Have you tried the US Extended keyboard, Madhav? I use Times New Roman, which works very well with unicode All the best Hans Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2016, at 16:25, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: Hans, Just tested your suggestions with ABC Extended keyboard layout, and this does work in TextEdit and in Gmail, but not in MS Word. I tried to copy and paste from EextEdit into Word, and the Word was not able to show the stacking of three diacritics like ???. Glad to know that such combinations are possible at least on some platforms. Thanks, Hans, for solving one of my long-standing problems. With best wishes, Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:15 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: Hello Hans, Which keyboard-layout are you using to produce these characters? Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 5:05 PM, Hock, Hans Henrich > wrote: Dear Madhav, Though there may be some limitations on stacking, it is possible to produce the following symbol on the Mac (still system 10.9.5): ???. The first diacritic (the macron) is accessed by typing option a + a; the other two diacritics by entering shift-option n and shift-option e AFTER having typed assembled the basic ? character. This post-character shift-option input procedure doesn?t seem to be well advertised; I more or less stumbled upon it in some university?s instructions for its faculty. There is one concern, however: While ? and the like is treated as a single glyph in unicode and thus transfers well between unicode-compatible platforms, more complex character, such as ??, ??, or ???, are not single glyphs and may therefore not transfer across platforms. We ran into this problem in producing the documents from which the new South Asia volume in the series World of Linguistics have been printed, and the only thing that we could do was submit a pdf-version indicating the desired character shape. I hope this helps. Cheers, Hans On 15 Jul 2016, at 13:13, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: This is a question as to how to get multiple markings on the same vowel sign. In my pre-Unicode diacritics font Manjushree-CSX, I had included, for instance, the sign for vowel "a" with three markings, length, nasality and accent. This is necessary to represent P??inian procedures accurately. P??ini deals with eighteen varieties of "a, i, u, ?" etc. differing in length, accent and nasality. Is there a way to do this with unicode fonts and keyboards? Madhav Deshpande On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 11:48 AM, Jeffery Long > wrote: The ABC Extended keyboard on the Mac is good for all diacritical marks. Combining the option key with a gives the macron: ?, ?, etc. Option + x = underdot: ?, ?, etc. Option + w = overdot: ?. Option + e = accent mark: ?. Tilde is of course option + n: ?. All the best, Jeff Dr. Jeffery D. Long Professor of Religion and Asian Studies Elizabethtown College Elizabethtown, PA https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong Series Editor, Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, Ethical, and Philosophical Lexington Books Consulting Editor, Sutra Journal http://secure-web.cisco.com/1RX8fLCEnEOXJoXmHLPtsA2NBvpvncjne47kL11hVc8iZmSdFT6Hr4QgEVbi1Mdws35IZpnYzdt8TlnHqTDC-QZfCkiUIx5JMLEtcixhzDtRFqZ4Rg5yPGZYp5bhC6uHO47UqSzoV4_PCI2BQtJ3L8iCitPbeMVSY4fHnhnnzh4wJ2F57XxkA5pDJD6jrq9m2Ks2WiZesjXB8AqVp9NMpbQ/http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sutrajournal.com "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials of life." (Holy Mother Sarada Devi) On Friday, July 15, 2016 9:17 AM, Jonathan Silk > wrote: Maybe indeed I'm missing something but the Asian Extended keyboard (made, if I am not wrong, by Nobumi Iyanaga) works perfectly for diacritics, no mess, no fuss. Jonathan On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 2:47 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: David, The old Easy Unicode keyboard-layout does work on my Mac that has the latest operating system and the latest MS Office 360. Try reinstalling the keyboard file, if you have it. If not, I can send it to you. Best, Madhav On Fri, Jul 15, 2016 at 8:44 AM, David Mellins > wrote: Yes, This is true, but have you found a convenient way to enter the full range of diacritica for Romanized Sanskrit without having to resort to Emoji/Latin/favorites inserts? This is not the worst thing in the world, but slower than the old Easy Unicode or Dev Unicode keyboards. David Sent from my iPhone On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:37 AM, Dominik Wujastyk > wrote: I'm shocked. I don't pay much attention to the Mac world, but I've been typing Devanagari into everything on my computer for many years (Linux). I had no idea that this wasn't possible or easy on a Mac. Wow. And the Mac used to be the byword for multilingual support. I'm glad it's okay now, at least. Dominik -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada ?sas.ualberta.ca? On 15 July 2016 at 12:58, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: Dear Indologists, To my happy surprise, I found that with the combination of the latest version of Microsoft Office 360 for Mac and the latest Mac Operating System OS X El Capitan, it is now possible to directly enter Unicode Devanagari in a Word document with the Devanagari - QWERTY keyboard layout. Previously, I had to enter Unicode Devanagari in something like TextEdit and then copy and paste into a Word document, but was not able to edit it in the Word document. The new development of software has happily changed that situation. Hope this information will be of use to some of you. Best, Madhav Deshpande _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- J. Silk Leiden University Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b 2311 BZ Leiden The Netherlands copies of my publications may be found at http://secure-web.cisco.com/1CS7rRoxE1KSDyDZCaFQCYgEncchWOA46xGBkfViV13Y3zO7S4A1ewIsI4d_mKAtHR6BhM0w-2eNU_nt1XJb2uZiHYGbGaQ4cXNSCU4siXfpGICXXm07X0-TFwHYXuIaKFngiw1Dq3v8Bk6UAQOsm3KYXYphdi2hqBQKkJbIDQspIdq9WeV-oLfQXIpZ8O6mVNpRctDkCidUIrqINNFFEpg/http%3A%2F%2Fwww.buddhismandsocialjustice.com%2Fsilk_publications.html _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hellwig7 at gmx.de Sun Jul 17 14:36:10 2016 From: hellwig7 at gmx.de (hellwig7 at gmx.de) Date: Sun, 17 Jul 16 16:36:10 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] New version of the Digital Corpus of Sanskrit In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear list, after several years, a new version of the Digital Corpus of Sanskrit has come out. It contains, among other texts, the complete morphological and lexical annotation of the Mahabharata except for three prose chapters. Although you are still redirected from the old URL, you may note the new web address: http://kjc-sv013.kjc.uni-heidelberg.de/dcs/index.php A few notes on the new release: (1) I find the multi-word search rather useful: You can now search for text lines that must contain two or more lemmata (click on the "Add to multi-word q." links after a search result on the query page). To start with, try something popular such as r?ma and s?t?; will display all text lines that contain any inflected form of r?ma and s?t?. (2) Global and text dictionaries have been merged into one. Contrary to former versions, the lexicographic database now contains all lemmata given in my digital dictionary, even if they don't occur in a text. (3) You should, in principle, be able to type IAST Unicode directly in the search interface. (4) The information contained under "Similar and related words" is only a gimmick at the moment, at least for less popular words. It displays the cosine similarity between neural embeddings built with word2vec (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Word_embedding for more information). They seem to capture some semantic similarites; check, for instance, 'r?ma' or 'gam'. (5) This release relies heavily on JavaScript. The website will look quite unresponsive when JS is deactivated in your browser. (6) Not sure why I chose the former design. The readability of the site should now be better, esp. on small screens. (7) Access to parts of the semantic annotation layer will be added in the next weeks. I'm considering quite seriously to make this version of the DCS open source. If you are interested in collaborating, please send me your github user name, so that I can invite you to the project. Finally, my special thanks go to the patient and helpful team of the KJC at the University of Heidelberg! Oliver --- Oliver Hellwig, University of D?sseldorf, Germany From m.gluckman at anu.edu.au Sun Jul 17 19:48:18 2016 From: m.gluckman at anu.edu.au (Martin Gluckman) Date: Mon, 18 Jul 16 01:18:18 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Unicode Devanagari on Mac Message-ID: Dear Friends, I have developed a software to type IAST/Devan?gar? on a Mac. The software happens to also support Unicode Br?hm? output (currently well supported in Pages) and also limited support for typing Vedic accents (to be expanded in a future version). I am happy to share the beta with Indology and would appreciate feedbacks in case you try it out. You can download the latest beta here: https://docs.google.com/a/vedicsociety.org/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSfFVVnkzDpLv0i1gqQzLfI0PzuUiHbtvIlQwjKL5zXmZXnEcA/viewform The final version will be ready in <4 weeks. Kindest Wishes, Martin Gluckman -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dimitrov at staff.uni-marburg.de Mon Jul 18 17:03:33 2016 From: dimitrov at staff.uni-marburg.de (Dragomir Dimitrov) Date: Mon, 18 Jul 16 22:33:33 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] NEW BOOK: The Legacy of the Jewel Mind Message-ID: <578D0BE5.14215.7A5FEC0@dimitrov.staff.uni-marburg.de> NEW BOOK ANNOUNCEMENT The Legacy of the Jewel Mind On the Sanskrit, Pali, and Sinhalese Works by Ratnamati A Philological Chronicle (Phullalocanava?sa) By Dragomir Dimitrov Napoli 2016 Universit? degli studi di Napoli ?L?Orientale?, Dipartimento Asia Africa e Mediterraneo Series Minor, LXXXII Hardcover, xxii, 866 pp. 15 colour illustrations, 1 halftone, 3 maps 24 x 17 cm ISBN: 978-88-6719-118-5 Price: EUR 98,00 The book can be ordered at: http://www.arborsapientiae.com For more details, please see here: http://www.dragomir-dimitrov.net/bookstall.html ________________________________________ Dr. habil. Dragomir Dimitrov Indologie und Tibetologie Philipps-Universit?t Marburg Deutschhausstr. 12 D-35032 Marburg Germany Tel.: +49 178 9190340, +91 8407961952 E-mail: dimitrov at staff.uni-marburg.de http://www.uni-marburg.de/indologie ________________________________________ From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Thu Jul 21 11:04:40 2016 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Thu, 21 Jul 16 11:04:40 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] QUERY: mouse-venom Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047BB5DD8@xm-mbx-06-prod> Dear friends, A bit of amusement during the summer recess: ??ntideva, in his Bodhicary?vat?ra IX, in the course of his critique of Yog?c?ra, argues that self-awareness (svasaMvid-) is not, pace the Yog?c?rin, a necessary condition for the formation of memory. As a counter-example, he adduces "mouse-venom": any?nubh?te saMbandh?t smRtir ?khuviSaM yath?// His commentator Praj??karamati unpacks this by explaining that one who is struck with mouse-venom does not recall the incident until the memory is aroused by a thunderstorm (meghastanitam adhigamya). Now, as we all know, philosophical examples, according to Indian rules of debate, were supposed to have been such as to be accepted by all parties. We might therefore expect the tale about mouse-venom to have been fairly widely known. My question is whether any of you might have noted it elsewhere, and if so, where? With thanks in advance for your replies, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________________ From disimone at alumni.stanford.edu Thu Jul 21 11:25:39 2016 From: disimone at alumni.stanford.edu (Charles DiSimone) Date: Thu, 21 Jul 16 13:25:39 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] QUERY: mouse-venom In-Reply-To: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047BB5DD8@xm-mbx-06-prod> Message-ID: Dear Matthew, If you haven't already spotted it, I remember in Monier Williams under ?khu one finds: ?khuvi?ah? and ?khuvi??pah?: 'destroying a rat's venom', the grass Lipeocercis Serrata and the grass Andropogon Serratum (both considered as remedies for a rat's bite). I wonder if maybe the idea of venom had to do with a bite getting infected? Best wishes, Charles On Thu, Jul 21, 2016 at 1:04 PM, Matthew Kapstein wrote: > Dear friends, > > A bit of amusement during the summer recess: > > ??ntideva, in his Bodhicary?vat?ra IX, in the course of his critique of > Yog?c?ra, > argues that self-awareness (svasaMvid-) is not, pace the Yog?c?rin, a > necessary condition > for the formation of memory. As a counter-example, he adduces > "mouse-venom": > any?nubh?te saMbandh?t smRtir ?khuviSaM yath?// > > His commentator Praj??karamati unpacks this by explaining that one who is > struck with mouse-venom > does not recall the incident until the memory is aroused by a thunderstorm > (meghastanitam adhigamya). > > Now, as we all know, philosophical examples, according to Indian rules of > debate, were supposed to > have been such as to be accepted by all parties. We might therefore expect > the tale about mouse-venom > to have been fairly widely known. My question is whether any of you might > have noted it elsewhere, > and if so, where? > > With thanks in advance for your replies, > > Matthew > > > Matthew Kapstein > Directeur d'?tudes, > Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes > > Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, > The University of Chicago > > ________________________________________ > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) -- Charles DiSimone Promotionsprogramm Buddhismus-Studien Institut f?r Indologie und Tibetologie Ludwig-Maximilians-Universit?t M?nchen -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kocchop at outlook.com Thu Jul 21 16:24:57 2016 From: kocchop at outlook.com (Fabrizio Ferrari) Date: Thu, 21 Jul 16 17:24:57 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] QUERY: mouse-venom In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Mathew, In Su?rutasa?hit? (Kalpasth?na vii.1-42) there is a discussion on rat poisoning. A list of eighteen kinds of rats is given, along with the symptoms caused by their poisonous bite and instruction on remedies. I hope this may help. With best wishes, Fabrizio Professor Fabrizio Ferrari Indology and South Asian Religions Department of Theology and Religious Studies University of Chester Parkgate Road Chester CH1 4BJ Tel 01244 511039 f.ferrari at chester.ac.uk From: Charles DiSimone [mailto:disimone at alumni.stanford.edu] Sent: 21 July 2016 12:26 To: Matthew Kapstein Cc: indology at list.indology.info Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] QUERY: mouse-venom Dear Matthew, If you haven't already spotted it, I remember in Monier Williams under ?khu one finds: ?khuvi?ah? and ?khuvi??pah?: 'destroying a rat's venom', the grass Lipeocercis Serrata and the grass Andropogon Serratum (both considered as remedies for a rat's bite). I wonder if maybe the idea of venom had to do with a bite getting infected? Best wishes, Charles On Thu, Jul 21, 2016 at 1:04 PM, Matthew Kapstein > wrote: Dear friends, A bit of amusement during the summer recess: ??ntideva, in his Bodhicary?vat?ra IX, in the course of his critique of Yog?c?ra, argues that self-awareness (svasaMvid-) is not, pace the Yog?c?rin, a necessary condition for the formation of memory. As a counter-example, he adduces "mouse-venom": any?nubh?te saMbandh?t smRtir ?khuviSaM yath?// His commentator Praj??karamati unpacks this by explaining that one who is struck with mouse-venom does not recall the incident until the memory is aroused by a thunderstorm (meghastanitam adhigamya). Now, as we all know, philosophical examples, according to Indian rules of debate, were supposed to have been such as to be accepted by all parties. We might therefore expect the tale about mouse-venom to have been fairly widely known. My question is whether any of you might have noted it elsewhere, and if so, where? With thanks in advance for your replies, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________________ _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- Charles DiSimone Promotionsprogramm Buddhismus-Studien Institut f?r Indologie und Tibetologie Ludwig-Maximilians-Universit?t M?nchen -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lavanyavemsani at gmail.com Thu Jul 21 18:48:06 2016 From: lavanyavemsani at gmail.com (Lavanya Vemsani) Date: Thu, 21 Jul 16 14:48:06 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Call for papers: Edited volume on Indian Religions Message-ID: Hello All, We are invited by a well known publisher to develop a volume of scholarly articles on religions of India. Articles may address any subject related to religions of India, either through text analysis or popular religious practice utilizing social sciences or humanities approaches. The book is scheduled for publication by August 2017. If you are interested in contributing a paper please send your abstract to the following email: lavanyavemsani at gmail.com Please also contact me off the list at this email address for further details. Thank you Lavanya -- *Dr. Lavanya Vemsani* Ph.D. History (Univ. of Hyderabad) & Ph.D. Religious Studies (McMaster Univ.) Distinguished University Professor of History, Department of Social Sciences *Shawnee State University* Portsmouth OH 45662 V:7403513233 F:7403513153 E:lvemsani at shawnee.edu Editor, *International Journal of Dharma and Hindu Studies* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From skarashima at gmail.com Fri Jul 22 00:08:21 2016 From: skarashima at gmail.com (Seishi Karashima) Date: Fri, 22 Jul 16 09:08:21 +0900 Subject: [INDOLOGY] QUERY: mouse-venom In-Reply-To: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047BB5DD8@xm-mbx-06-prod> Message-ID: Dear Matthew, Cf. **Satyasiddhi??stra* ???. T1646_.32.0322a01ff. ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????... 322a26f. ????????????????????????????????(It resembles the rat poison, which, if not eliminated, will still [?] cause an attack [even] by [hearing] sounds of thunder.) *Sphu??rth? Abhidharmako?avy?khy?: the Work of Ya?omitra*, ed. U. Wogihara, Tokyo 1936: The Publishing Association of Abhidharmako?avy?khy?; Tokyo 31989: Sankib? Busshorin, p. 488, l. 5f. *anubadna?t?ti. anukr?nte? c?turthakajvaravan m??ik?vi?avac cety anye*. = The Chinese translation of Sa?ghabhadra?s *Abhidharmany?y?nus?ra??stra*, T. 29, no. 1559, *Apidamo Shunzhenglilun *????????, translated by Xuanzang, T1562_.29.0641c22f. ??????????????????= The Chinese translation of Sa?ghabhadra?s **Abhidharmapi?akaprakara?a??sana??stra *???????? T1563_.29.0905b09f. Cf. also *L?Abhidharmako?a de Vasubandhu: traduction et annotations*, Louis de Vall?e Poussin, IV, p. 78, n. 1, 49 "poison du rat"; p. 79, n. 1 = *Abhidharmako?a-Bh??ya of Vasubandhu: The Treasury of the Abhidharma and its (Auto) Commentary*, translated into French by Louis de La Valle?e Poussin; annotated English translation by Gelong Lodr? Sangpo, II, p. 1830f. A similar phrase is found in the *Abhidharmah?daya*, ?????? T1551_.28.0847a1f. ?????????????????However, this phrase is not found another Chinese translation of the same text, see: *Le coeur de la loi supre?me: Traite?* de Fa-Cheng: Abhidharmahr?dayas?a?stra de Dharmas?ri?, traduit et annote? par Indumati Armelin, Paris Geuther 1978, p. 107; Charles Willemen, 2006 *The Essence of Scholasticism, Abhidharmah?daya. T 1550*, Revised edition with a completely new introduction, Delhi 2006: Motilal Banarsidass, p. 102. *La?k?vat?ras?tra* (??????), ed. Bunyiu Nanjio, Kyoto 1923: Otani University (Bibliotheca Otaniensis, vol. 1), reprint: Kyoto 1956: Otani University, p. 138, l. 15f. *tatr?nu?ay?n?m ariprakhy?n?? **m??ik?vi?avat** prakopadharmi??m atyantasamudgh?t?darhadvadho bhavati* /(= Vaidya 57.1). With best regards, Seishi Karashima P.S. I have placed PDF files of my articles on the following websites: https://sokauniversity.academia.edu/SeishiKarashima http://iriab.soka.ac.jp/orc/staff/karashima/index_karashima.html 2016-07-21 20:04 GMT+09:00 Matthew Kapstein : > Dear friends, > > A bit of amusement during the summer recess: > > ??ntideva, in his Bodhicary?vat?ra IX, in the course of his critique of > Yog?c?ra, > argues that self-awareness (svasaMvid-) is not, pace the Yog?c?rin, a > necessary condition > for the formation of memory. As a counter-example, he adduces > "mouse-venom": > any?nubh?te saMbandh?t smRtir ?khuviSaM yath?// > > His commentator Praj??karamati unpacks this by explaining that one who is > struck with mouse-venom > does not recall the incident until the memory is aroused by a thunderstorm > (meghastanitam adhigamya). > > Now, as we all know, philosophical examples, according to Indian rules of > debate, were supposed to > have been such as to be accepted by all parties. We might therefore expect > the tale about mouse-venom > to have been fairly widely known. My question is whether any of you might > have noted it elsewhere, > and if so, where? > > With thanks in advance for your replies, > > Matthew > > > Matthew Kapstein > Directeur d'?tudes, > Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes > > Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, > The University of Chicago > > ________________________________________ > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From skarashima at gmail.com Fri Jul 22 00:19:02 2016 From: skarashima at gmail.com (Seishi Karashima) Date: Fri, 22 Jul 16 09:19:02 +0900 Subject: [INDOLOGY] QUERY: mouse-venom Message-ID: Dear Matthew, Cf. also: Lambert Schmithausen, *Maitr? and Magic: Aspects of the Buddhist Attitude toward the Dangerous in Nature*, Wien: Verlag der Osterreichischen Akademie der Wissenschaften, 1997, (Sb?AW, Bd. 652 . Veroffentlichungen zu den Sprachen und Kulturen S?dasiens ; Heft 30), p. 38, n. 78 (with further references to Japanese articles on the *Bodhisattvacary?vat?ra*). Abhidhamm?vat?ra-abhinava??k?, Kilesappah?nakath?va??an?: appah?nabh?vena sattasant?ne anusenti m?sikavisa? viya anur?pak?ra?a? labhitv? uppajjant?ti With best regards, Seishi 2016-07-22 9:08 GMT+09:00 Seishi Karashima : > Dear Matthew, > > Cf. **Satyasiddhi??stra* ???. T1646_.32.0322a01ff. > ???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????... > 322a26f. ????????????????????????????????(It resembles the rat poison, > which, if not eliminated, will still [?] cause an attack [even] by > [hearing] sounds of thunder.) > > > *Sphu??rth? Abhidharmako?avy?khy?: the Work of Ya?omitra*, ed. U. > Wogihara, Tokyo 1936: The Publishing Association of Abhidharmako?avy?khy?; > Tokyo 31989: Sankib? Busshorin, p. 488, l. 5f. *anubadna?t?ti. anukr?nte? > c?turthakajvaravan m??ik?vi?avac cety anye*. = The Chinese translation of > Sa?ghabhadra?s *Abhidharmany?y?nus?ra??stra*, T. 29, no. 1559, *Apidamo > Shunzhenglilun *????????, translated by Xuanzang, T1562_.29.0641c22f. > ??????????????????= The Chinese translation of Sa?ghabhadra?s **Abhidharmapi?akaprakara?a??sana??stra > *???????? T1563_.29.0905b09f. > > Cf. also *L?Abhidharmako?a de Vasubandhu: traduction et annotations*, > Louis de Vall?e Poussin, IV, p. 78, n. 1, 49 "poison du rat"; p. 79, n. 1 = *Abhidharmako?a-Bh??ya > of Vasubandhu: The Treasury of the Abhidharma and its (Auto) Commentary*, > translated into French by Louis de La Valle?e Poussin; annotated English > translation by Gelong Lodr? Sangpo, II, p. 1830f. > > > A similar phrase is found in the *Abhidharmah?daya*, ?????? > T1551_.28.0847a1f. ?????????????????However, this phrase is not found > another Chinese translation of the same text, see: *Le coeur de la loi > supre?me: Traite?* de Fa-Cheng: Abhidharmahr?dayas?a?stra de Dharmas?ri?, > traduit et annote? par Indumati Armelin, Paris Geuther 1978, p. 107; > Charles Willemen, 2006 *The Essence of Scholasticism, > Abhidharmah?daya. T 1550*, Revised edition with a completely new > introduction, Delhi 2006: Motilal Banarsidass, p. 102. > > > *La?k?vat?ras?tra* (??????), ed. Bunyiu Nanjio, Kyoto 1923: Otani > University (Bibliotheca Otaniensis, vol. 1), reprint: Kyoto 1956: Otani > University, p. 138, l. 15f. *tatr?nu?ay?n?m ariprakhy?n?? **m??ik?vi?avat** > prakopadharmi??m atyantasamudgh?t?darhadvadho bhavati* /(= Vaidya 57.1). > > > With best regards, > > Seishi Karashima > > P.S. > > I have placed PDF files of my articles on the following websites: > > https://sokauniversity.academia.edu/SeishiKarashima > > http://iriab.soka.ac.jp/orc/staff/karashima/index_karashima.html > > > 2016-07-21 20:04 GMT+09:00 Matthew Kapstein : > >> Dear friends, >> >> A bit of amusement during the summer recess: >> >> ??ntideva, in his Bodhicary?vat?ra IX, in the course of his critique of >> Yog?c?ra, >> argues that self-awareness (svasaMvid-) is not, pace the Yog?c?rin, a >> necessary condition >> for the formation of memory. As a counter-example, he adduces >> "mouse-venom": >> any?nubh?te saMbandh?t smRtir ?khuviSaM yath?// >> >> His commentator Praj??karamati unpacks this by explaining that one who is >> struck with mouse-venom >> does not recall the incident until the memory is aroused by a >> thunderstorm (meghastanitam adhigamya). >> >> Now, as we all know, philosophical examples, according to Indian rules of >> debate, were supposed to >> have been such as to be accepted by all parties. We might therefore >> expect the tale about mouse-venom >> to have been fairly widely known. My question is whether any of you might >> have noted it elsewhere, >> and if so, where? >> >> With thanks in advance for your replies, >> >> Matthew >> >> >> Matthew Kapstein >> Directeur d'?tudes, >> Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes >> >> Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, >> The University of Chicago >> >> ________________________________________ >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Fri Jul 22 09:00:32 2016 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Fri, 22 Jul 16 09:00:32 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] QUERY: mouse-venom In-Reply-To: <18151254-80EF-4853-BFD9-3D1E5A29EA21@gmail.com> Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047BB5F50@xm-mbx-06-prod> Thanks to all who have responded. The force of the argument is now quite clear, as are the facts that the example was more broadly current in Indian Buddhist materials and that it draws on broader concerns about rat-poisoning in India. Neither ??ntideva nor his commentator assert rat-venom to be a CAUSE of memory loss. Their point is that it acts as a latent condition for a memory that emerges when other conditions - the thunderstorm - obtain. The sense of a latent condition seems perfectly to accord with the several examples so usefully provided by Seishi Karashima. The force of the argument derives from its demonstration of memory that does not have a prior act of self-awareness as a condition, thereby showing that self-awareness is not a necessary condition for memory, thereby showing that Dign?ga's memory argument does not hold. I leave to one side the question of how strong or weak one judges this argument to be. At least it is not so clearly sophistical as it might have first appeared. thanks again, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________________ From andrew.ollett at gmail.com Sat Jul 23 13:06:28 2016 From: andrew.ollett at gmail.com (Andrew Ollett) Date: Sat, 23 Jul 16 15:06:28 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Sri Venkateswara Oriental Research Institute Message-ID: Dear list members, I'd be very grateful if anyone could provide me off-list with the contact information of the staff of the Sri Venkateswara Oriental Research Institute in Tirupati. (The address listed on the University's website, orientalresearchinstitute at yahoo.co.in, does not work.) I'm specifically looking to get in contact with Dr. C. M. Premalata. Andrew -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pathompongb at yahoo.com Sun Jul 24 04:59:05 2016 From: pathompongb at yahoo.com (Pathompong Bodhiprasiddhinand) Date: Sun, 24 Jul 16 04:59:05 +0000 Subject: An Annoucement: A Buddhist Conference in Thailand In-Reply-To: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B6A975@xm-mbx-04-prod> Message-ID: <1089402019.3530781.1469336345364.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> The Foundation of His Holiness Somdet Phra ???asa?avara Centennial Commemoration will organise an international conference on 'Buddhist Manuscripts in Thailand: Its Importance in Buddhist Studies' on 18 August 2016 at the auditorium of Buddhamandala Hall, within the compound of the Buddhamandala precinct of Nakhonpathom Province.It will be presided over by Princess Maha Chakri Sirindhorn of Thailand. After the opening ceremony, Dr Peter Skilling of ?cole fran?aise d'Extr?me-Orient in France will give an inaugural lecture on 'The Importance of Buddhist Palm-leaf Manuscripts in Thailand: With Special References to Those kept at Wat Bovornivesviharn'. In the afternoon, there will be three paper presentations by three scholars: Dr Alexander Wynne of Liverpool University will be presenting his paper on 'The Historical Value of Khom and Tham Tipitaka Manuscripts from Thailand', Prof Dr Justin McDaniel of Pensylvania University will speak on 'The Siamese Manuscripts in United States' Collections' and Asst Prof Dr Pathompong Bodhiprasiddhinand of Mahidol University will speak on 'King Mongkut's Collections of Buddhist Palmleaf Manuscripts and the Mission of the ???asa?avara Centre for Buddhist Studies'. The presentations will be chaired by Assoc Prof Dr Pagorn Singsuriya of Mahidol University. If you are interested in joining, please contact us via Buddha.fspn at gmail.com. The registration, including lunch, is all free.Facebook | | | Facebook | | | Bodhi?Pathompong Bodhiprasiddhinand Assistant Professor, DPhil PhD Programme in Buddhist Studies Mahidol University, Thailand http://www.sh.mahidol.ac.th/bodhi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From andrew.ollett at gmail.com Sun Jul 24 08:15:41 2016 From: andrew.ollett at gmail.com (Andrew Ollett) Date: Sun, 24 Jul 16 10:15:41 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Sri Venkateswara Oriental Research Institute In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks to Charles Li, I now have the information I needed. On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 3:06 PM, Andrew Ollett wrote: > Dear list members, > > I'd be very grateful if anyone could provide me off-list with the contact > information of the staff of the Sri Venkateswara Oriental Research > Institute in Tirupati. (The address listed on the University's website, > orientalresearchinstitute at yahoo.co.in, does not work.) I'm specifically > looking to get in contact with Dr. C. M. Premalata. > > Andrew > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Palaniappa at aol.com Mon Jul 25 14:49:45 2016 From: Palaniappa at aol.com (Sudalaimuthu Palaniappan) Date: Mon, 25 Jul 16 09:49:45 -0500 Subject: A Question of Rites Message-ID: <54762312-2AA0-42E3-B175-AC8D5E6F2ADA@aol.com> The following news story may be of interest to the members. http://www.outlookindia.com/magazine/story/a-question-of-rites/203463 Regards, Palaniappan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Mon Jul 25 15:14:56 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Mon, 25 Jul 16 11:14:56 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] A Question of Rites In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks, Palaniappan, for this nice article. Pune is indeed a leader in this movement. Every year, during the Ganesh festival, thousands of women gather on the streets to chant the Ganesha Atharvashirsha collectively. It was my sister who performed the wedding of one of my daughters, and she did a terrific job of it. Madhav Deshpande On Mon, Jul 25, 2016 at 10:50 AM, Sudalaimuthu Palaniappan via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Sudalaimuthu Palaniappan > To: Indology > Cc: > Date: Mon, 25 Jul 2016 09:49:45 -0500 > Subject: A Question of Rites > The following news story may be of interest to the members. > > http://www.outlookindia.com/magazine/story/a-question-of-rites/203463 > > Regards, > Palaniappan > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Mon Jul 25 20:54:28 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Mon, 25 Jul 16 16:54:28 -0400 Subject: =?utf-8?B?W0lORE9MT0dZXSBGd2Q6IHvgpK3gpL7gpLDgpKTgpYDgpK/gpLXgpL/gpKbgpY3gpLXgpKTgpY3gpKrgpLDgpL/gpLfgpKTgpY19IFF1ZXN0aW9uIHJlZ2FyZGluZyB0aGUgbGluZWFnZSBvZiBBcHBheXlhIETEq2vhuaNpdGE=?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Indology Colleages, As you can see from the attached extract of the Sanskrit Introduction to the 1864 pothi print edition of Ve?ka??dhvarin's Lak?m?sahasra, evidently, while the great Appayya D?k?ita was mainly a ?aiva Advaitin vehemently attacking especially the M?dhva Vai??avas in his Madhvatantramukhamardana, his son Raghun?tha D?k?ita and grandson Ve?ka??dhvarin were Vai??avas. Among his later descendants we have ?aiva scholars like N?laka??ha D?k?ita. How did these ?aiva and Vai??ava affiliations develop within this one and the same family? If anyone knows sources for the family history of Appayya D?k?ita and his lineage, I would very much appreciate to know those sources. Thanks for your assistance. Madhav M. Deshpande Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Extract.tiff Type: image/tiff Size: 489150 bytes Desc: not available URL: From rajam at earthlink.net Tue Jul 26 01:18:18 2016 From: rajam at earthlink.net (rajam) Date: Mon, 25 Jul 16 18:18:18 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?B?UmU6IFtJTkRPTE9HWV0gRndkOiB74KSt4KS+4KSw4KSk4KWA4KSv4KS14KS/4KSm4KWN4KS14KSk4KWN4KSq4KSw4KS/4KS34KSk4KWNfSBRdWVzdGlvbiByZWdhcmRpbmcgdGhlIGxpbmVhZ2Ugb2YgQXBwYXl5YSBExKtr4bmjaXRh?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <69665F92-E959-4FB5-A02A-1804C049903D@earthlink.net> My cousin maintains our family tree and Appaya, Neelakanta Dikshita?s family tree. The following sites may give you some information: https://www.myheritage.com/site-32611321/appaya-dikshita https://www.myheritage.com/site-family-tree-32611321/appaya-dikshita Best, rajam > On Jul 25, 2016, at 1:54 PM, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > > Dear Indology Colleages, > > As you can see from the attached extract of the Sanskrit Introduction to the 1864 pothi print edition of Ve?ka??dhvarin's Lak?m?sahasra, evidently, while the great Appayya D?k?ita was mainly a ?aiva Advaitin vehemently attacking especially the M?dhva Vai??avas in his Madhvatantramukhamardana, his son Raghun?tha D?k?ita and grandson Ve?ka??dhvarin were Vai??avas. Among his later descendants we have ?aiva scholars like N?laka??ha D?k?ita. How did these ?aiva and Vai??ava affiliations develop within this one and the same family? If anyone knows sources for the family history of Appayya D?k?ita and his lineage, I would very much appreciate to know those sources. Thanks for your assistance. > > Madhav M. Deshpande > Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Tue Jul 26 01:25:26 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Mon, 25 Jul 16 21:25:26 -0400 Subject: =?utf-8?B?UmU6IFtJTkRPTE9HWV0JRndkOiB74KSt4KS+4KSw4KSk4KWA4KSv4KS14KS/4KSm4KWN4KS14KSk4KWN4KSq4KSw4KS/4KS34KSk4KWNfSBRdWVzdGlvbiByZWdhcmRpbmcgdGhlIGxpbmVhZ2Ugb2YgQXBwYXl5YSBExKtr4bmjaXRh?= In-Reply-To: <69665F92-E959-4FB5-A02A-1804C049903D@earthlink.net> Message-ID: Thanks, Rajam. Madhav On Mon, Jul 25, 2016 at 9:18 PM, rajam wrote: > My cousin maintains our family tree and Appaya, Neelakanta Dikshita?s > family tree. > > The following sites may give you some information: > > https://www.myheritage.com/site-32611321/appaya-dikshita > > https://www.myheritage.com/site-family-tree-32611321/appaya-dikshita > > Best, > rajam > > > On Jul 25, 2016, at 1:54 PM, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > > Dear Indology Colleages, > > As you can see from the attached extract of the Sanskrit Introduction > to the 1864 pothi print edition of Ve?ka??dhvarin's Lak?m?sahasra, > evidently, while the great Appayya D?k?ita was mainly a ?aiva Advaitin > vehemently attacking especially the M?dhva Vai??avas in his > Madhvatantramukhamardana, his son Raghun?tha D?k?ita and grandson > Ve?ka??dhvarin were Vai??avas. Among his later descendants we have ?aiva > scholars like N?laka??ha D?k?ita. How did these ?aiva and Vai??ava > affiliations develop within this one and the same family? If anyone knows > sources for the family history of Appayya D?k?ita and his lineage, I would > very much appreciate to know those sources. Thanks for your assistance. > > Madhav M. Deshpande > Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From disimone at alumni.stanford.edu Tue Jul 26 16:48:02 2016 From: disimone at alumni.stanford.edu (Charles DiSimone) Date: Tue, 26 Jul 16 18:48:02 +0200 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_PHD_Scholarship_for_Doctoral_Program_in_Buddhist_Studies_at_the_Ludwig-Maximilians-Universit=C3=A4t_in_Munich?= Message-ID: Posting for Simone Heidegger who is not a list member: The Doctoral Program in Buddhist Studies at the Ludwig-Maximilians-Universit?t in Munich, Germany invites applications for two PhD scholarships for dissertation projects related to Buddhism. Deadline for applications: 16 October 2016 Start of scholarship: summer or autumn 2017 Duration of scholarship: 3 or 4 years Scholarship amount: 1000 ? per month + insurance + support for rent + travel lump sums + 460 ? per year Scholarship donor: German Academic Exchange Service (DAAD) The selection process comprises two stages: Applications are sent to the Doctoral Program in Buddhist Studies in Munich. The program will select promising candidates, who then have to submit their materials to the DAAD. It is expected that the successful candidates will be chosen and informed by February 2017. The prerequisites for application are non-German citizenship, a Master of Arts or Magister Artium degree or equivalent, excellent knowledge of at least one Buddhist source language, outstanding qualifications in the subject, and fluency in English. A basic knowledge of German is also desirable, though not a prerequisite, but willingness to learn German/improve German language skills will be expected. Applicants should not have lived in Germany for more than fifteen months at the time of the submission of their materials to the DAAD (in December or January) and the last final examination should have taken place no more than six years before this date. For details concerning the application, please visit our homepage: http://www.en.buddhismus-studien.uni-muenchen.de/currentissues/phd_scholarships2017/index.html -- Charles DiSimone Promotionsprogramm Buddhismus-Studien Institut f?r Indologie und Tibetologie Ludwig-Maximilians-Universit?t M?nchen -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk Wed Jul 27 09:47:45 2016 From: dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk (dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk) Date: Wed, 27 Jul 16 10:47:45 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon Message-ID: <57988341.1727.8FD05B@dermot.grevatt.force9.co.uk> Can anyone explain why the mind is the microcosmic counterpart of the moon? The correspondence appears in Rgveda 10.90.13 and in countless passages of the Brahmanas and Upanisads, but it's not obvious like breath and wind. Renou ?tudes V?diques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. I find that hard to accept, because the words (candra-mas and manas) are not very similar (they are in Latin, but the sages didn't have access to an Indo-European comparative dictionary). Could the connection be through soma (often linked or identified with the moon), since the mind is called a pavitra through which poetic insight (dhI) flows and becomes offerings (Gonda Vision of the Vedic Poets pp. 278-9)? Or is it that the mind, like the moon, is constant though its content continually changes? -- Dermot Killingley 9, Rectory Drive, Gosforth, Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT Phone (0191) 285 8053 From karp at uw.edu.pl Wed Jul 27 10:16:58 2016 From: karp at uw.edu.pl (Artur Karp) Date: Wed, 27 Jul 16 12:16:58 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon In-Reply-To: <57988341.1727.8FD05B@dermot.grevatt.force9.co.uk> Message-ID: > Or is it that the mind, like the moon, is constant though its content continually changes? I'd go - intuitively - for it. And, that the Moon, like mind, doesn't possess its own light. It *reflects light*, and passes it on. Mind? It *reflects ideas* (comparable to light, enlightening), and passes them on. Best, Artur Karp (ret.) Chair of South Asian Studies, University of Warsaw Poland -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From caf57 at cam.ac.uk Wed Jul 27 11:00:33 2016 From: caf57 at cam.ac.uk (C.A. Formigatti) Date: Wed, 27 Jul 16 12:00:33 +0100 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_7th_Coffee_Break_Conference,_Leiden,_08=E2=80=9310_September_2016?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3abbead910c167d57e297a81dc4abab3@cam.ac.uk> Dear Colleagues, It is our great pleasure to announce that the seventh edition of the Coffee Break Conference will take place in Leiden, 08?10 September 2016. The topic of this year's conference is ''Comparisons Across Time and Space'' (https://asiaticacoffeebreak.wordpress.com/2016-coffee-break-conference/). The online program can be found on the Leiden University website (https://www.universiteitleiden.nl/en/events/2016/09/7th-coffee-break-conference) and downloaded on the Asiatica--CBC website (https://asiaticacoffeebreak.files.wordpress.com/2016/07/programme_cbc_20161.pdf). More information about the CBC project can be found here: https://asiaticacoffeebreak.wordpress.com/ Best wishes, Daniele Cuneo Lucas Den Boer Cristina Bignami Camillo Formigatti Elena Mucciarelli From dipak.d2004 at gmail.com Wed Jul 27 14:57:42 2016 From: dipak.d2004 at gmail.com (Dipak Bhattacharya) Date: Wed, 27 Jul 16 20:27:42 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon In-Reply-To: <57988341.1727.8FD05B@dermot.grevatt.force9.co.uk> Message-ID: Likening the sun to eye, occurring in the next quarter, is not implausible. Chandramaa manaso jaata.h might be a play with word - chandramas and manas are alliterative. The Braahmanas sometimes aggrandize old sayings with eye to ritual. I add that the Braahmana often state authentic Vedic beliefs and tradition too. Best DB On Wed, Jul 27, 2016 at 3:17 PM, wrote: > Can anyone explain why the mind is the microcosmic counterpart of the > moon? The > correspondence appears in Rgveda 10.90.13 and in countless passages of the > Brahmanas > and Upanisads, but it's not obvious like breath and wind. > > Renou ?tudes V?diques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. I find > that hard to accept, > because the words (candra-mas and manas) are not very similar (they are in > Latin, but the > sages didn't have access to an Indo-European comparative dictionary). > > Could the connection be through soma (often linked or identified with the > moon), since the > mind is called a pavitra through which poetic insight (dhI) flows and > becomes offerings > (Gonda Vision of the Vedic Poets pp. 278-9)? > > Or is it that the mind, like the moon, is constant though its content > continually changes? > > -- > Dermot Killingley > 9, Rectory Drive, > Gosforth, > Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT > Phone (0191) 285 8053 > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dimitrov at staff.uni-marburg.de Wed Jul 27 16:58:01 2016 From: dimitrov at staff.uni-marburg.de (Dragomir Dimitrov) Date: Wed, 27 Jul 16 22:28:01 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_NEW_BOOK:_Der_Mah=C4=81y=C4=81na-Buddhismus_in_den_Augen_eines_Dichters?= Message-ID: <5798E819.12835.F530D4@dimitrov.staff.uni-marburg.de> NEW BOOK ANNOUNCEMENT Der Mah?y?na-Buddhismus in den Augen eines Dichters Candragomins Schauspiel ?Freude f?r die Menschen?, sein ?Brief an einen Sch?ler? und sein ?Hymnus in Form eines S?ndenbekenntnisses? ?bersetzt von Michael Hahn unter Mitarbeit von Astrid Loh?fer M?nchen 2016 Indologica Marpurgensia, Band VIII P. Kirchheim Verlag Paperback, 225 pp. ISBN: 978-3-87410-147-9 Price: EUR 32,00 SUMMARY (in German): Der im 5. Jh. im Osten Indiens wirkende buddhistische Laienanh?nger Candragomin war nicht nur ein bedeutender Gelehrter, der ma?gebliche Abhandlungen zur Grammatik des Sanskrit verfasst hat, sondern auch ein erstrangiger Dichter, der in seinen Werken Lesern, Zuh?rern und Zuschauern die Gedankenwelt des Mah?y?na-Buddhismus in nachdr?cklicher und zugleich eing?ngiger Weise zu vermitteln suchte. Bei vielen der ihm zugeschriebenen Werken ist seine Verfasserschaft unsicher. Das gilt jedoch nicht f?r das in diesem Band dargebotene Schauspiel ?Freude f?r die Menschen?, den ?Brief an einen Sch?ler? und den ?Hymnus in Form eines S?ndenbekenntnisses?. Jedes dieser drei Werke zeichnet sich durch eine formvollendete Sprache und die Einf?hrung neuer Elemente in bereits bestehende Formen aus. Nahezu 1000 Jahre erfreuten sich Candragomins Dichtungen in ihrem Heimatland einer ungebrochenen Popularit?t, bis sie mit der Vernichtung des Buddhismus vom indischen Boden verschwanden. Lediglich der ?Brief an einen Sch?ler? hat in Nepal in einem einzigen Palmblattmanuskript von 1084 n. Chr. ?berlebt, w?hrend die anderen beiden Werke nur noch in ihren tibetischen ?bersetzungen aus dem 9. und 13. Jh. erhalten geblieben sind. In den deutschen ?bersetzungen wurde versucht, wenigstens einen Teil ihrer sprachlichen Qualit?t zu bewahren. Als dichterische Werke von hohem Rang und Beitr?ge zu einer weitgehend ideologiefreien Ethik verdienen sie es, auch heute noch gelesen zu werden. For more details, please see here: http://www.uni-marburg.de/fb10/iksl/indologie/fachgebiet/im ________________________________________ Dr. habil. Dragomir Dimitrov Indologie und Tibetologie Philipps-Universit?t Marburg Deutschhausstr. 12 D-35032 Marburg Germany Tel.: +49 6421 28 24640, +49 178 9190340 E-mail: dimitrov at staff.uni-marburg.de http://www.uni-marburg.de/indologie ________________________________________ From nakeerthi at gmail.com Thu Jul 28 05:32:04 2016 From: nakeerthi at gmail.com (naresh keerthi) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 11:02:04 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon Message-ID: > > Renou Etudes Vediques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. I don't have access to this source, but is it possible that this conjecture is based on the similarity of *mati* = mind [Sanskrit, but also used in Tamil] and *mati* = moon in Tamil? Best, Naresh Keerthi National Institute of Advanced Studies, Bangalore > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2016 10:47:45 +0100 > From: dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk > To: indology at list.indology.info > Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon > Message-ID: <57988341.1727.8FD05B at dermot.grevatt.force9.co.uk> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Can anyone explain why the mind is the microcosmic counterpart of the > moon? The > correspondence appears in Rgveda 10.90.13 and in countless passages of the > Brahmanas > and Upanisads, but it's not obvious like breath and wind. > > Renou ?tudes V?diques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. I find > that hard to accept, > because the words (candra-mas and manas) are not very similar (they are in > Latin, but the > sages didn't have access to an Indo-European comparative dictionary). > > Could the connection be through soma (often linked or identified with the > moon), since the > mind is called a pavitra through which poetic insight (dhI) flows and > becomes offerings > (Gonda Vision of the Vedic Poets pp. 278-9)? > > Or is it that the mind, like the moon, is constant though its content > continually changes? > > -- > Dermot Killingley > 9, Rectory Drive, > Gosforth, > Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT > Phone (0191) 285 8053 > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From vjroebuck at btinternet.com Thu Jul 28 06:45:03 2016 From: vjroebuck at btinternet.com (Valerie Roebuck) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 07:45:03 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I think it?s meant to be a bit more profound than a verbal similarity - though of course these were widely thought not to be merely coincidental. We find the same correspondence in astrological texts, too, e.g. in Var?hamihira?s B?hajj?taka, Chapter 2 v. 1a, where the seven planets of the ancient world are placed on the macrocosmic man of Time. k?l?tm? <> dina-kr?n <> manas <> tuhinagu? <> satva? <> kujo <> j?o <> vaco <> j?vo <> j??na-sukhe <> sita? <> ca <> madano <> du?kha? <> dine??tmaja? <> / The Sun [?Day-maker'] is the self (?tman) of Time, the Moon [?Cool-rayed?] his mind (manas), Mars [?Earth-born?] his courage, Mercury [?Knower?] his speech, Jupiter [?Life?] his knowledge and happiness, Venus [?White One?] his desire, and Saturn [?Son of the Lord of Day?] his suffering. The Moon has a very important place in Indian astrology, but here perhaps it is regarded as representing a less profound (because more changeable?) level of being than the Sun. Valerie J Roebuck Manchester, UK > On 28 Jul 2016, at 06:32, naresh keerthi wrote: > > Renou Etudes Vediques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. > > I don't have access to this source, but is it possible that this conjecture is based on the similarity of mati = mind [Sanskrit, but also used in Tamil] and mati = moon in Tamil? > > > > Best, > Naresh Keerthi > National Institute of Advanced Studies, > Bangalore > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2016 10:47:45 +0100 > From: dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk > To: indology at list.indology.info > Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon > Message-ID: <57988341.1727.8FD05B at dermot.grevatt.force9.co.uk > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Can anyone explain why the mind is the microcosmic counterpart of the moon? The > correspondence appears in Rgveda 10.90.13 and in countless passages of the Brahmanas > and Upanisads, but it's not obvious like breath and wind. > > Renou ?tudes V?diques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. I find that hard to accept, > because the words (candra-mas and manas) are not very similar (they are in Latin, but the > sages didn't have access to an Indo-European comparative dictionary). > > Could the connection be through soma (often linked or identified with the moon), since the > mind is called a pavitra through which poetic insight (dhI) flows and becomes offerings > (Gonda Vision of the Vedic Poets pp. 278-9)? > > Or is it that the mind, like the moon, is constant though its content continually changes? > > -- > Dermot Killingley > 9, Rectory Drive, > Gosforth, > Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT > Phone (0191) 285 8053 > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Thu Jul 28 07:37:38 2016 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 13:07:38 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon In-Reply-To: Message-ID: >Could the connection be through soma (often linked or identified with the moon), since the mind is called a pavitra through which poetic insight (dhI) flows and becomes offerings (Gonda Vision of the Vedic Poets pp. 278-9)? ------- I think this is a good way of going about it. ; similarly, moon is pitr loka; pitr loka is mano loka; (ancestors live in the memries of the S'raadha kartaa , S'raadha yajammana); Once they are 'promoted' from 'pitr' stage, they get elevated to Aaditya (Sun) loka. pitr, pitaamaha, prapitaamaha are at the 'moon' (pitr) level. prapitaamaha's father and his father onwards all the older ancestors are promoted to aaditya loka. (go beyond the mind/memory level) On Wed, Jul 27, 2016 at 8:27 PM, Dipak Bhattacharya wrote: > Likening the sun to eye, occurring in the next quarter, is not > implausible. Chandramaa manaso jaata.h might be a play with word - > chandramas and manas are alliterative. The Braahmanas sometimes aggrandize > old sayings with eye to ritual. I add that the Braahmana often state > authentic Vedic beliefs and tradition too. > Best > DB > > On Wed, Jul 27, 2016 at 3:17 PM, wrote: > >> Can anyone explain why the mind is the microcosmic counterpart of the >> moon? The >> correspondence appears in Rgveda 10.90.13 and in countless passages of >> the Brahmanas >> and Upanisads, but it's not obvious like breath and wind. >> >> Renou ?tudes V?diques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. I find >> that hard to accept, >> because the words (candra-mas and manas) are not very similar (they are >> in Latin, but the >> sages didn't have access to an Indo-European comparative dictionary). >> >> Could the connection be through soma (often linked or identified with the >> moon), since the >> mind is called a pavitra through which poetic insight (dhI) flows and >> becomes offerings >> (Gonda Vision of the Vedic Poets pp. 278-9)? >> >> Or is it that the mind, like the moon, is constant though its content >> continually changes? >> >> -- >> Dermot Killingley >> 9, Rectory Drive, >> Gosforth, >> Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT >> Phone (0191) 285 8053 >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From martin.gansten at pbhome.se Thu Jul 28 08:07:47 2016 From: martin.gansten at pbhome.se (Martin Gansten) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 10:07:47 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <67f12e7c7ff7d6690a30f9d5af507050@pbhome.se> Valerie Roebuck wrote: > I think it's meant to be a bit more profound than a verbal similarity - though of course these were widely thought not to be merely coincidental. We find the same correspondence in astrological texts, too, [...] That was my first thought, too. We should remember, though, that the astrological correspondence between the moon and mind does not originate in India but is present already in the early Greek astrological corpus. IF this should turn out to be a Greek contribution to the astral lore taken over from Mesopotamia and Egypt, we could be looking at a very ancient Indo-European idea (reflected in, or possibly springing from, the verbal similarity in PIE) -- but I am no expert in Mesopotamian astrology, and it might well be that the moon-mind connection was already present in that culture, in which case we are either dealing with a coincident or with something profoundly archetypal, in a Jungian sense. Perhaps the moon really is the mind of Cosmic Man? :-) Martin Gansten -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk Thu Jul 28 08:35:39 2016 From: dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk (dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 09:35:39 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5799C3DB.19923.485C15@dermot.grevatt.force9.co.uk> Dear Artur, Thank you for helping my reflections by enlightening my moonlike mind. I'm not sure the ancient rishis thought the moon only reflected light. But thank you for endorsing my suggestion of changeful constancy. With best wishes, Dermot On 27 Jul 2016 at 12:16, Artur Karp wrote: > Or is it that the mind, like the moon, is constant though its content continually changes? I'd go - intuitively - for it. And, that the Moon, like mind, doesn't possess its own light. It reflects light, and passes it on. Mind? It reflects ideas (comparable to light, enlightening), and passes them on. Best, Artur Karp (ret.) Chair of South Asian Studies, University of Warsaw Poland -- Dermot Killingley 9, Rectory Drive, Gosforth, Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT Phone (0191) 285 8053 From dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk Thu Jul 28 08:35:39 2016 From: dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk (dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 09:35:39 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5799C3DB.4228.485BB7@dermot.grevatt.force9.co.uk> Thanks, Valerie, for the Varahamihira quote. It shows an extension of the microcosm idea to the planets, keeping the mind-moon pair (but not the eye-sun one). The mind-moon pair is one of the most stable of these pairings, as well as the least explicable. Verbal similarities can be very profound, especially in the Brahmanas. But in this case I'm not sure there is much verbal similarity: in RV 10.90.13 the words are manas and candramas (in Brhadaranyaka Up. 3.2.13 it's manas and candra, which is even less similar). It's not a similarity of the same order as indra-indha (Satapatha Br 6.1.1.2; Brh Up 4.2.2). That made me wonder whether Renou, in invoking word-play as an explanation, was misled by his knowledge of the Indo-European cognates of Skt mas and manas. With best wishes, Dermot On 28 Jul 2016 at 7:45, Valerie Roebuck wrote: I think it's meant to be a bit more profound than a verbal similarity - though of course these were widely thought not to be merely coincidental. We find the same correspondence in astrological texts, too, e.g. in Varahamihira's Bhajjataka, Chapter 2 v. 1a, where the seven planets of the ancient world are placed on the macrocosmic man of Time. kalatma dina-krn manas tuhinagu satva kujo j?o vaco jivo j?ana-sukhe sita?s ca madano dukha dine?satmaja / The Sun ['Day-maker'] is the self (atman) of Time, the Moon ['Cool-rayed'] his mind (manas), Mars ['Earth-born'] his courage, Mercury ['Knower'] his speech, Jupiter ['Life'] his knowledge and happiness, Venus ['White One'] his desire, and Saturn ['Son of the Lord of Day'] his suffering. The Moon has a very important place in Indian astrology, but here perhaps it is regarded as representing a less profound (because more changeable?) level of being than the Sun. Valerie J Roebuck Manchester, UK On 28 Jul 2016, at 06:32, naresh keerthi wrote: Renou Etudes Vediques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. I don't have access to this source, but is it possible that this conjecture is based on the similarity of mati = mind [Sanskrit, but also used in Tamil] and mati = moon in Tamil? Best, Naresh Keerthi National Institute of Advanced Studies, Bangalore ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2016 10:47:45 +0100 From: dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk To: indology at list.indology.info Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon Message-ID: <57988341.1727.8FD05B at dermot.grevatt.force9.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Can anyone explain why the mind is the microcosmic counterpart of the moon? The correspondence appears in Rgveda 10.90.13 and in countless passages of the Brahmanas and Upanisads, but it's not obvious like breath and wind. Renou ?tudes V?diques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. I find that hard to accept, because the words (candra-mas and manas) are not very similar (they are in Latin, but the sages didn't have access to an Indo-European comparative dictionary). Could the connection be through soma (often linked or identified with the moon), since the mind is called a pavitra through which poetic insight (dhI) flows and becomes offerings (Gonda Vision of the Vedic Poets pp. 278-9)? Or is it that the mind, like the moon, is constant though its content continually changes? -- Dermot Killingley 9, Rectory Drive, Gosforth, Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT Phone (0191) 285 8053 _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- Dermot Killingley 9, Rectory Drive, Gosforth, Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT Phone (0191) 285 8053 From hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com Thu Jul 28 14:07:53 2016 From: hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com (Harry Spier) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 10:07:53 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Sandhi breaks in longer meters Message-ID: Dear list members, In the longer sanskrit meters (Vasantatilaka for examplbe 14 syllables to a line) is Sandhi broken after each line or only after the half verse and end of verse. Thank you, Vasishtha -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From vjroebuck at btinternet.com Thu Jul 28 14:24:42 2016 From: vjroebuck at btinternet.com (Valerie Roebuck) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 15:24:42 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Sandhi breaks in longer meters In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I?ve just had a quick look at an edition of the Saundaryalahar?, in ?ikhari?? (17 syllables to a line), and sandhi is broken only between half verses and whole verses. For example, there's a ? at the end of one half-line followed by a c at the beginning of the next. Valerie J Roebuck Manchester, UK > On 28 Jul 2016, at 15:07, Harry Spier wrote: > > Dear list members, > > In the longer sanskrit meters (Vasantatilaka for examplbe 14 syllables to a line) is Sandhi broken after each line or only after the half verse and end of verse. > > Thank you, > Vasishtha > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) From vjroebuck at btinternet.com Thu Jul 28 14:26:11 2016 From: vjroebuck at btinternet.com (Valerie Roebuck) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 15:26:11 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Sandhi breaks in longer meters In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <6A4C08FD-F7B9-44F6-9963-19EE57171528@btinternet.com> Correction: I meant ?at the end of one line?. > I?ve just had a quick look at an edition of the Saundaryalahar?, in ?ikhari?? (17 syllables to a line), and sandhi is broken only between half verses and whole verses. For example, there's a ? at the end of one half-line followed by a c at the beginning of the next. Valerie J Roebuck Manchester, UK > On 28 Jul 2016, at 15:07, Harry Spier wrote: > > Dear list members, > > In the longer sanskrit meters (Vasantatilaka for examplbe 14 syllables to a line) is Sandhi broken after each line or only after the half verse and end of verse. > > Thank you, > Vasishtha > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) From kauzeya at gmail.com Thu Jul 28 14:30:54 2016 From: kauzeya at gmail.com (Jonathan Silk) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 16:30:54 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Sandhi breaks in longer meters In-Reply-To: <6A4C08FD-F7B9-44F6-9963-19EE57171528@btinternet.com> Message-ID: I hardly dare to comment when my teacher, Madhav Deshpande, is on this list as well, and what little I know I know from him, but.... I recall very well learning that external sandhi is, according to the grammarians, always optional. Because One Can Always Speak Like This If One Wants To. In other words, the use of sandhi is a convention, so the question might be slightly rephrased as: what are the conventions of the poets, and of the scribes. No? (Perhaps, as is quite likely, of course, this was implied in the question, and I should have kept my ideas to myself. In Which Case, Sorry ;) Jonathan On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 4:26 PM, Valerie Roebuck wrote: > Correction: I meant ?at the end of one line?. > > > I?ve just had a quick look at an edition of the Saundaryalahar?, in > ?ikhari?? (17 syllables to a line), and sandhi is broken only between half > verses and whole verses. For example, there's a ? at the end of one > half-line followed by a c at the beginning of the next. > > Valerie J Roebuck > Manchester, UK > > > On 28 Jul 2016, at 15:07, Harry Spier > wrote: > > > > Dear list members, > > > > In the longer sanskrit meters (Vasantatilaka for examplbe 14 syllables > to a line) is Sandhi broken after each line or only after the half verse > and end of verse. > > > > Thank you, > > Vasishtha > > _______________________________________________ > > INDOLOGY mailing list > > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options > or unsubscribe) > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) -- J. Silk Leiden University Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b 2311 BZ Leiden The Netherlands copies of my publications may be found at http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From drdhaval2785 at gmail.com Thu Jul 28 14:44:13 2016 From: drdhaval2785 at gmail.com (dhaval patel) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 20:14:13 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fwd: Re: Sandhi breaks in longer meters In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Metrical rule for preventing ?????????? is - No side of the split should have a single syllable. As long as there are more than one syllable on either side of a yati (metrical pause) or half verse, it is fine. Will cite exact rule from vRttaratnAkara as I can lay my hands on it. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Thu Jul 28 14:46:33 2016 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 10:46:33 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Sandhi breaks in longer meters In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Yes, Jonathan, the external sandhi is optional according to grammarians, and yet the convention of metrical Sanskrit is that the sandhis are pretty much obligatory. The break in Sandhi comes after the half-verse or ardha-?c in Vedic verses. Only rarely is there a sandhi break within a metrical line. On the other hand, there are hyper or double sandhis occasionally in older metrical texts, e.g. sa? + e?a? > sa e?a?, but metrically occasionally one notices sai?a, and P??ini allows such double sandhis for filling the metrical space (so'ci lope cet p?dap?ra?am). Breaking the sandhis in metrical lines is done as part of interpretation, but not as part of recitation, since with broken sandhis, the metrical lines are no longer complaint with rules of a specific meter. Madhav Deshpande On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 10:30 AM, Jonathan Silk wrote: > I hardly dare to comment when my teacher, Madhav Deshpande, is on this > list as well, and what little I know I know from him, but.... I recall very > well learning that external sandhi is, according to the grammarians, always > optional. > Because > One > Can > Always > Speak > Like > This > If > One > Wants > To. > In other words, the use of sandhi is a convention, so the question might > be slightly rephrased as: what are the conventions of the poets, and of the > scribes. No? > (Perhaps, as is quite likely, of course, this was implied in the question, > and I should have kept my ideas to myself. > In > Which > Case, > Sorry ;) > > Jonathan > > On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 4:26 PM, Valerie Roebuck > wrote: > >> Correction: I meant ?at the end of one line?. >> >> > I?ve just had a quick look at an edition of the Saundaryalahar?, in >> ?ikhari?? (17 syllables to a line), and sandhi is broken only between half >> verses and whole verses. For example, there's a ? at the end of one >> half-line followed by a c at the beginning of the next. >> >> Valerie J Roebuck >> Manchester, UK >> >> > On 28 Jul 2016, at 15:07, Harry Spier >> wrote: >> > >> > Dear list members, >> > >> > In the longer sanskrit meters (Vasantatilaka for examplbe 14 syllables >> to a line) is Sandhi broken after each line or only after the half verse >> and end of verse. >> > >> > Thank you, >> > Vasishtha >> > _______________________________________________ >> > INDOLOGY mailing list >> > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >> or unsubscribe) >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) > > > > > -- > J. Silk > Leiden University > Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS > Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b > 2311 BZ Leiden > The Netherlands > > copies of my publications may be found at > http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From vbd203 at googlemail.com Thu Jul 28 15:30:25 2016 From: vbd203 at googlemail.com (victor davella) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 17:30:25 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Sandhi breaks in longer meters In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear All, The verse (with some minor variations) usually cited in grammatical works is: pade tu sa?hit? nity? nity? dh?t?pasargayo? | sam?se ca tath? v?kye s? vivak??m apek?ate || The text given is the earliest attestation I have found, the R?p?vat?ra (p. 6, beginning of the Sa?hit?vat?ra). The optional sandhis are those at word boundaries, including between members of a compound, but not within a word or between a root and its upasarga. This maxim is at times invoked to explain irregular sandhis in Epic/pur??ic texts. Avivak??, however, is not a valid justification for failing to apply sandhi in verse according the authorities on poetry. Cf. K?vy?dar?a 3.159 (Dimitrov's edition). A look at the various discussions of visandhi, a poetic blemish, will also reveal a number of interesting discussions about the application of sandhi in verse. For example, in commenting on K? 3.161, Ratna?r?j??na explains that the lack of sandhi between the 2nd and 3rd p?das in KA 3.161 (api / ?su) should not be viewed as fault. He further bolsters his/Da??in's view by citing a verse from the Abhij????kuntala 1.19 (tanoti / iyam). Similar statements are found in other works. There is also a rather lengthy back and forth between ?la?k?rikas over the ages concerning the correctness of using perfectly valid prag?hya sandhis (duel endings in ?, ?, and e follwed by a vowel) ,but it is perhaps not of immediate interest. All the Best, Victor D'Avella On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 4:46 PM, Madhav Deshpande wrote: > Yes, Jonathan, the external sandhi is optional according to grammarians, > and yet the convention of metrical Sanskrit is that the sandhis are pretty > much obligatory. The break in Sandhi comes after the half-verse or > ardha-?c in Vedic verses. Only rarely is there a sandhi break within a > metrical line. On the other hand, there are hyper or double sandhis > occasionally in older metrical texts, e.g. sa? + e?a? > sa e?a?, but > metrically occasionally one notices sai?a, and P??ini allows such double > sandhis for filling the metrical space (so'ci lope cet p?dap?ra?am). > Breaking the sandhis in metrical lines is done as part of interpretation, > but not as part of recitation, since with broken sandhis, the metrical > lines are no longer complaint with rules of a specific meter. > > Madhav Deshpande > > On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 10:30 AM, Jonathan Silk wrote: > >> I hardly dare to comment when my teacher, Madhav Deshpande, is on this >> list as well, and what little I know I know from him, but.... I recall very >> well learning that external sandhi is, according to the grammarians, always >> optional. >> Because >> One >> Can >> Always >> Speak >> Like >> This >> If >> One >> Wants >> To. >> In other words, the use of sandhi is a convention, so the question might >> be slightly rephrased as: what are the conventions of the poets, and of the >> scribes. No? >> (Perhaps, as is quite likely, of course, this was implied in the >> question, and I should have kept my ideas to myself. >> In >> Which >> Case, >> Sorry ;) >> >> Jonathan >> >> On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 4:26 PM, Valerie Roebuck < >> vjroebuck at btinternet.com> wrote: >> >>> Correction: I meant ?at the end of one line?. >>> >>> > I?ve just had a quick look at an edition of the Saundaryalahar?, in >>> ?ikhari?? (17 syllables to a line), and sandhi is broken only between half >>> verses and whole verses. For example, there's a ? at the end of one >>> half-line followed by a c at the beginning of the next. >>> >>> Valerie J Roebuck >>> Manchester, UK >>> >>> > On 28 Jul 2016, at 15:07, Harry Spier >>> wrote: >>> > >>> > Dear list members, >>> > >>> > In the longer sanskrit meters (Vasantatilaka for examplbe 14 syllables >>> to a line) is Sandhi broken after each line or only after the half verse >>> and end of verse. >>> > >>> > Thank you, >>> > Vasishtha >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > INDOLOGY mailing list >>> > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >> >> >> >> >> -- >> J. Silk >> Leiden University >> Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS >> Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b >> 2311 BZ Leiden >> The Netherlands >> >> copies of my publications may be found at >> http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Thu Jul 28 22:46:11 2016 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Fri, 29 Jul 16 00:46:11 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books Message-ID: Is someone collecting a bibliography of serious reviews of Rajiv Malhotra's books? Are there considered writings that could be relayed to someone interested in reasoned, academic responses to Malhotra's views? Best, Dominik -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com Fri Jul 29 01:02:55 2016 From: hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com (Harry Spier) Date: Thu, 28 Jul 16 21:02:55 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Sandhi breaks in longer meters In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thank you everyone for your replies. Harry Spier On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 11:31 AM, victor davella via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: victor davella > To: Madhav Deshpande > Cc: Jonathan Silk , indology List List < > indology at list.indology.info> > Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2016 17:30:25 +0200 > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Sandhi breaks in longer meters > Dear All, > > The verse (with some minor variations) usually cited in grammatical works > is: > > pade tu sa?hit? nity? nity? dh?t?pasargayo? | > sam?se ca tath? v?kye s? vivak??m apek?ate || > > The text given is the earliest attestation I have found, the R?p?vat?ra > (p. 6, beginning of the Sa?hit?vat?ra). > > The optional sandhis are those at word boundaries, including between > members of a compound, but not within a word or between a root and its > upasarga. This maxim is at times invoked to explain irregular sandhis in > Epic/pur??ic texts. Avivak??, however, is not a valid justification for > failing to apply sandhi in verse according the authorities on poetry. Cf. > K?vy?dar?a 3.159 (Dimitrov's edition). > > A look at the various discussions of visandhi, a poetic blemish, will also > reveal a number of interesting discussions about the application of sandhi > in verse. For example, in commenting on K? 3.161, Ratna?r?j??na explains > that the lack of sandhi between the 2nd and 3rd p?das in KA 3.161 (api / > ?su) should not be viewed as fault. He further bolsters his/Da??in's view > by citing a verse from the Abhij????kuntala 1.19 (tanoti / iyam). Similar > statements are found in other works. There is also a rather lengthy back > and forth between ?la?k?rikas over the ages concerning the correctness of > using perfectly valid prag?hya sandhis (duel endings in ?, ?, and e follwed > by a vowel) ,but it is perhaps not of immediate interest. > > All the Best, > Victor D'Avella > > > On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 4:46 PM, Madhav Deshpande > wrote: > >> Yes, Jonathan, the external sandhi is optional according to grammarians, >> and yet the convention of metrical Sanskrit is that the sandhis are pretty >> much obligatory. The break in Sandhi comes after the half-verse or >> ardha-?c in Vedic verses. Only rarely is there a sandhi break within a >> metrical line. On the other hand, there are hyper or double sandhis >> occasionally in older metrical texts, e.g. sa? + e?a? > sa e?a?, but >> metrically occasionally one notices sai?a, and P??ini allows such double >> sandhis for filling the metrical space (so'ci lope cet p?dap?ra?am). >> Breaking the sandhis in metrical lines is done as part of interpretation, >> but not as part of recitation, since with broken sandhis, the metrical >> lines are no longer complaint with rules of a specific meter. >> >> Madhav Deshpande >> >> On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 10:30 AM, Jonathan Silk >> wrote: >> >>> I hardly dare to comment when my teacher, Madhav Deshpande, is on this >>> list as well, and what little I know I know from him, but.... I recall very >>> well learning that external sandhi is, according to the grammarians, always >>> optional. >>> Because >>> One >>> Can >>> Always >>> Speak >>> Like >>> This >>> If >>> One >>> Wants >>> To. >>> In other words, the use of sandhi is a convention, so the question might >>> be slightly rephrased as: what are the conventions of the poets, and of the >>> scribes. No? >>> (Perhaps, as is quite likely, of course, this was implied in the >>> question, and I should have kept my ideas to myself. >>> In >>> Which >>> Case, >>> Sorry ;) >>> >>> Jonathan >>> >>> On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 4:26 PM, Valerie Roebuck < >>> vjroebuck at btinternet.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Correction: I meant ?at the end of one line?. >>>> >>>> > I?ve just had a quick look at an edition of the Saundaryalahar?, in >>>> ?ikhari?? (17 syllables to a line), and sandhi is broken only between half >>>> verses and whole verses. For example, there's a ? at the end of one >>>> half-line followed by a c at the beginning of the next. >>>> >>>> Valerie J Roebuck >>>> Manchester, UK >>>> >>>> > On 28 Jul 2016, at 15:07, Harry Spier >>>> wrote: >>>> > >>>> > Dear list members, >>>> > >>>> > In the longer sanskrit meters (Vasantatilaka for examplbe 14 >>>> syllables to a line) is Sandhi broken after each line or only after the >>>> half verse and end of verse. >>>> > >>>> > Thank you, >>>> > Vasishtha >>>> > _______________________________________________ >>>> > INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>> committee) >>>> > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list >>>> options or unsubscribe) >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>>> committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>>> or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> J. Silk >>> Leiden University >>> Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS >>> Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b >>> 2311 BZ Leiden >>> The Netherlands >>> >>> copies of my publications may be found at >>> http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From psdmccartney at gmail.com Fri Jul 29 04:48:25 2016 From: psdmccartney at gmail.com (patrick mccartney) Date: Fri, 29 Jul 16 14:48:25 +1000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Dominik, The only review I have collected is this one: https://www.academia.edu/22413957/Book_Review_not_by_me_The_Battle_for_Sanskrit_by_Rajiv_Malhotra You can decide for yourself whether you think it 'serious' or not... All the best, Patrick McCartney, PhD School of Culture, History & Language College of the Asia-Pacific The Australian National University Canberra, Australia, 0200 Skype - psdmccartney Phone + Whatsapp: +61 414 954 748 Twitter - @psdmccartney academia - Linkedin #yogabodyANU2016 symposium Ep1 - Imagining Sanskrit Land Ep 2 - Total-am Ep 3 - Jalam ? Chillum A Day in our Ashram Stop animation short film of Shakuntala Forced to Clean Human Waste One of my favourite song s On Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 8:46 AM, Dominik Wujastyk wrote: > Is someone collecting a bibliography of serious reviews of Rajiv > Malhotra's books? Are there considered writings that could be relayed to > someone interested in reasoned, academic responses to Malhotra's views? > > Best, > Dominik > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Fri Jul 29 09:49:42 2016 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Fri, 29 Jul 16 11:49:42 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Sandhi breaks in longer meters In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The adhik?ra s?tra governing sandhi rules is "sa?hit?y?m", "when there is conjunction". So when there is not conjunction, no sandhi rule is triggered. In the Mah?bh??ya, Pata?jali does have a discussion about how slowly you can speak and still be considered to be producing a v?kya. This problem can be related to the issue of what counts as conjunction. Best, Dominik -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada ?sas.ualberta.ca? ?? On 28 July 2016 at 16:30, Jonathan Silk wrote: > I hardly dare to comment when my teacher, Madhav Deshpande, is on this > list as well, and what little I know I know from him, but.... I recall very > well learning that external sandhi is, according to the grammarians, always > optional. > Because > One > Can > Always > Speak > Like > This > If > One > Wants > To. > In other words, the use of sandhi is a convention, so the question might > be slightly rephrased as: what are the conventions of the poets, and of the > scribes. No? > (Perhaps, as is quite likely, of course, this was implied in the question, > and I should have kept my ideas to myself. > In > Which > Case, > Sorry ;) > > Jonathan > > On Thu, Jul 28, 2016 at 4:26 PM, Valerie Roebuck > wrote: > >> Correction: I meant ?at the end of one line?. >> >> > I?ve just had a quick look at an edition of the Saundaryalahar?, in >> ?ikhari?? (17 syllables to a line), and sandhi is broken only between half >> verses and whole verses. For example, there's a ? at the end of one >> half-line followed by a c at the beginning of the next. >> >> Valerie J Roebuck >> Manchester, UK >> >> > On 28 Jul 2016, at 15:07, Harry Spier >> wrote: >> > >> > Dear list members, >> > >> > In the longer sanskrit meters (Vasantatilaka for examplbe 14 syllables >> to a line) is Sandhi broken after each line or only after the half verse >> and end of verse. >> > >> > Thank you, >> > Vasishtha >> > _______________________________________________ >> > INDOLOGY mailing list >> > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >> or unsubscribe) >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) > > > > > -- > J. Silk > Leiden University > Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS > Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b > 2311 BZ Leiden > The Netherlands > > copies of my publications may be found at > http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nmisra at gmail.com Fri Jul 29 11:58:52 2016 From: nmisra at gmail.com (Nityanand Misra) Date: Fri, 29 Jul 16 17:28:52 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 29 July 2016 at 04:16, Dominik Wujastyk wrote: > Is someone collecting a bibliography of serious reviews of Rajiv > Malhotra's books? Are there considered writings that could be relayed to > someone interested in reasoned, academic responses to Malhotra's views? > > Best, > Dominik > > Serious or not is for the reader to decide, but I wrote a detailed review of TBFS which can be read under https://www.academia.edu/25071774/The_Battle_for_Sanskrit_Review I have heard that the Hindi journal Pratim?na, published by CSDS, plans to publish four reviews of TBFS in Hindi. Past editions of Pratim?na can be seen under https://csds.academia.edu/PratimanCSDS -- Nity?nanda Mi?ra -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zysk at hum.ku.dk Fri Jul 29 12:12:03 2016 From: zysk at hum.ku.dk (Kenneth Gregory Zysk) Date: Fri, 29 Jul 16 12:12:03 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Help with article In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <363679393C2EB44480CDA76B2F23C9F7609E841A@P2KITMBX06WC03.unicph.domain> I should appreciate a pdf copy of the following article if it is available: ?On the Paleography of the Palmleaf Mss. of the Kuvalayamala? by Dr. A.N. Upadhyaye found in P.M. Joshi, et al., ed. Satabdakaumdi: Centenary Vol. Central Museum (Nagpur, India). Nagpur: Centenary Celebrations Committee, Central Museum, 1964. Best, Ken Kenneth Zysk, PhD, DPhil Head of Indology Department of Cross-Cultural and Regional Studies University of Copenhagen Karen Blixens Vej 4, Bygn. 10, DK-2300 Copenhagen S Denmark Ph: +45 3532 8951 Email: zysk at hum.ku.dk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From eastwestcultural at yahoo.com Fri Jul 29 12:31:38 2016 From: eastwestcultural at yahoo.com (Dean Michael Anderson) Date: Fri, 29 Jul 16 12:31:38 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <294773831.8166625.1469795498434.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Thank you for posting this Dominik. Given his popularity I think there is a great need for the Indological community to review his books. Best, Dean From: Dominik Wujastyk To: Indology Sent: Friday, July 29, 2016 4:16 AM Subject: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books Is someone collecting a bibliography of serious reviews of Rajiv Malhotra's books?? Are there considered writings that could be relayed to someone interested in reasoned, academic responses to Malhotra's views? Best,Dominik _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From audrey.truschke at gmail.com Fri Jul 29 13:14:22 2016 From: audrey.truschke at gmail.com (Audrey Truschke) Date: Fri, 29 Jul 16 09:14:22 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, I would point out that Rajiv Malhotra is a known, unapologetic plagiarist. He regularly makes ad hominem attacks. He has endorsed stories written in The Onion, a satirical newspaper. I'm not sure that I see much here with which to engage on an academic level. Audrey Truschke Assistant Professor Department of History Rutgers University-Newark On Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 8:32 AM, Dean Michael Anderson via INDOLOGY < indology at list.indology.info> wrote: > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Dean Michael Anderson > To: Dominik Wujastyk , Indology List < > indology at list.indology.info> > Cc: > Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2016 12:31:38 +0000 (UTC) > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books > Thank you for posting this Dominik. > > Given his popularity I think there is a great need for the Indological > community to review his books. > > Best, > > Dean > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Dominik Wujastyk > *To:* Indology > *Sent:* Friday, July 29, 2016 4:16 AM > *Subject:* [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books > > Is someone collecting a bibliography of serious reviews of Rajiv > Malhotra's books? Are there considered writings that could be relayed to > someone interested in reasoned, academic responses to Malhotra's views? > > Best, > Dominik > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hr at ivs.edu Fri Jul 29 13:23:48 2016 From: hr at ivs.edu (Howard Resnick) Date: Fri, 29 Jul 16 06:23:48 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <364C5AC2-A85F-4F70-BD0E-8CEB9E30466C@ivs.edu> I would be surprised if any of us want to enage him as a fellow scholar. He is simply a piece of contemporary Hindu history, however bizarre and disreputable one may find him. Scholars not inclined to contemporary Hindu affairs may well find little in Malhotra to interest them. Best, Howard > On Jul 29, 2016, at 6:14 AM, Audrey Truschke wrote: > > Dear Colleagues, > > I would point out that Rajiv Malhotra is a known, unapologetic plagiarist. He regularly makes ad hominem attacks. He has endorsed stories written in The Onion, a satirical newspaper. I'm not sure that I see much here with which to engage on an academic level. > > Audrey Truschke > Assistant Professor > Department of History > Rutgers University-Newark > > On Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 8:32 AM, Dean Michael Anderson via INDOLOGY > wrote: > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Dean Michael Anderson > > To: Dominik Wujastyk >, Indology List > > Cc: > Date: Fri, 29 Jul 2016 12:31:38 +0000 (UTC) > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books > Thank you for posting this Dominik. > > Given his popularity I think there is a great need for the Indological community to review his books. > > Best, > > Dean > > > From: Dominik Wujastyk > > To: Indology > > Sent: Friday, July 29, 2016 4:16 AM > Subject: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books > > Is someone collecting a bibliography of serious reviews of Rajiv Malhotra's books? Are there considered writings that could be relayed to someone interested in reasoned, academic responses to Malhotra's views? > > Best, > Dominik > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dharmaprof108 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 29 14:17:03 2016 From: dharmaprof108 at yahoo.com (Jeffery Long) Date: Fri, 29 Jul 16 14:17:03 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books In-Reply-To: <364C5AC2-A85F-4F70-BD0E-8CEB9E30466C@ivs.edu> Message-ID: <359728708.7750656.1469801823557.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Jonathan?Edelmann?wrote a very thoughtful critique of Malhotra's book Being Different?for the Journal of Hindu-Christian Studies. ?It can be found here: Becoming Different: Why Education is Required for Responding to Globalism Dharmically, Journal of Hindu-Christian Studies | | | | | | | | | | | Becoming Different: Why Education is Required for Responding to Globalism D... Becoming Different: Why Education is Required for Responding to Globalism Dharmically, Journal of Hindu-Christia... | | | | I believe some of the other essays from the panel to which Jonathan contributed this piece can be found in the same issue. Anantanand Rambachan has also written a response to Malhotra's work, as well as to the personal attacks launched against him by Malhotra and his followers.? Untangling The False Knots In Rajiv Malhotra?s Indra?s Net | | | | | | | | | | | Untangling The False Knots In Rajiv Malhotra?s Indra?s Net Professor Rambachan contends that Rajiv Malhotra distorts and misrepresents his work. He identifies and respo | | | | ?All the best,Jeff?Dr. Jeffery D. Long Professor of Religion and Asian Studies Elizabethtown CollegeElizabethtown, PA https://etown.academia.edu/JefferyLong Series Editor,?Explorations in Indic Traditions: Theological, Ethical, and PhilosophicalLexington Books Consulting Editor,?Sutra Journalhttp://www.sutrajournal.com "One who makes a habit of prayer and meditation will easily overcome all difficulties and remain calm and unruffled in the midst of the trials of life." ?(Holy Mother Sarada Devi) On Friday, July 29, 2016 9:24 AM, Howard Resnick
wrote: I would be surprised if any of us want to enage him as a fellow scholar. He is simply a piece of contemporary Hindu history, however bizarre and disreputable one may find him. Scholars not inclined to contemporary Hindu affairs may well find little in Malhotra to interest them.? Best,Howard On Jul 29, 2016, at 6:14 AM, Audrey Truschke wrote: Dear Colleagues, I would point out that Rajiv Malhotra is a known, unapologetic plagiarist. He regularly makes ad hominem attacks. He has endorsed stories written in The Onion, a satirical newspaper. I'm not sure that I see much here with which to engage on an academic level. Audrey TruschkeAssistant ProfessorDepartment of History Rutgers University-Newark On Fri, Jul 29, 2016 at 8:32 AM, Dean Michael Anderson via INDOLOGY wrote: _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From:?Dean Michael Anderson To:?Dominik Wujastyk , Indology List Cc:? Date:?Fri, 29 Jul 2016 12:31:38 +0000 (UTC) Subject:?Re: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books Thank you for posting this Dominik. Given his popularity I think there is a great need for the Indological community to review his books. Best, Dean From: Dominik Wujastyk To: Indology Sent: Friday, July 29, 2016 4:16 AM Subject: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books Is someone collecting a bibliography of serious reviews of Rajiv Malhotra's books?? Are there considered writings that could be relayed to someone interested in reasoned, academic responses to Malhotra's views? Best,Dominik _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Fri Jul 29 14:28:10 2016 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Fri, 29 Jul 16 16:28:10 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books In-Reply-To: <364C5AC2-A85F-4F70-BD0E-8CEB9E30466C@ivs.edu> Message-ID: On 29 July 2016 at 15:23, Howard Resnick
wrote: > I would be surprised if any of us want to enage him as a fellow scholar. > He is simply a piece of contemporary Hindu history, however bizarre and > disreputable one may find him. Scholars not inclined to contemporary Hindu > affairs may well find little in Malhotra to interest them. > ? > ?I'd also be interested in thoughtful analyses of Malhotra as part of contemporary Hindu history, as an object of study rather than a contributor to current academic discourse. ?Best, Dominik? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Fri Jul 29 15:38:59 2016 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Fri, 29 Jul 16 17:38:59 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Some reviews of Malhotra's work Message-ID: Battle for Sanskrit - http://asaa.asn.au/tigers-vs-goats-rajiv-malhotras-battle-for/ by McComas Taylor - Several reviews, only positive, on the book's website, under "reviews ." Being Different - https://www.academia.edu/5416706/Becoming_Different_Why_Education_is_Required_for_Responding_to_Globalism_Dharmically_Journal_of_Hindu-Christian_Studies by Jonathan Edelmann Many thanks to those who have given me this information. Dominik Wujastyk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Fri Jul 29 16:05:19 2016 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Fri, 29 Jul 16 18:05:19 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fwd: Some reviews of Malhotra's work In-Reply-To: Message-ID: update1: Battle for Sanskrit - http://asaa.asn.au/tigers-vs-goats-rajiv-malhotras-battle-for/ by McComas Taylor - Several reviews, only positive, on the book's website, under "reviews ." ?Indra's Net? - ?Untangling The False Knots In Rajiv Malhotra?s Indra?s Net ? by Anantand Rambachan Being Different - https://www.academia.edu/5416706/Becoming_Different_Why_Education_is_Required_for_Responding_to_Globalism_Dharmically_Journal_of_Hindu-Christian_Studies by Jonathan Edelmann - ?Seven articles in IJHS , December 2012?, by Nocholas Gier, Shrinivas Tilak, Gerald Larson, Rita Gross, Robert Yelle and Cleo McNelly Kearns. With a response by Rajiv Malhotra. Behind a paywall. ?More ? thanks to those who have given me this information. Dominik Wujastyk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Sat Jul 30 07:11:43 2016 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Sat, 30 Jul 16 09:11:43 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fwd: Some reviews of Malhotra's work In-Reply-To: Message-ID: update ?2? : Battle for Sanskrit - http://asaa.asn.au/tigers-vs-goats-rajiv-malhotras-battle-for/ by McComas Taylor - Several reviews, only positive, on the book's website, under "reviews ." ?Indra's Net? - ?Untangling The False Knots In Rajiv Malhotra?s Indra?s Net ? by Anantand Rambachan Being Different - https://www.academia.edu/5416706/Becoming_Different_Why_Education_is_Required_for_Responding_to_Globalism_Dharmically_Journal_of_Hindu-Christian_Studies by Jonathan Edelmann - ?Seven articles in IJHS , December 2012?, by Nocholas Gier, Shrinivas Tilak, Gerald Larson, Rita Gross, Robert Yelle and Cleo McNelly Kearns. With a response by Rajiv Malhotra. Behind a paywall. ?Indra's Net - ?http://scroll.in/article/742022/upset-about-rajiv-malhotras-plagiarism-even-more-upset-about-distortions-of-my-work by Andrew Nicholson? ? More ? thanks to those who have given me this information. Dominik Wujastyk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karp at uw.edu.pl Sat Jul 30 08:52:25 2016 From: karp at uw.edu.pl (Artur Karp) Date: Sat, 30 Jul 16 10:52:25 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] reviews of Malhotra's books In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear All, Any idea why would Mr. Rajiv Malhotra call his main opus "Indra's Net"? I do not know the book - is there any explanation there for giving it this name? Artur Karp 2016-07-29 16:28 GMT+02:00 Dominik Wujastyk : > On 29 July 2016 at 15:23, Howard Resnick
wrote: > >> I would be surprised if any of us want to enage him as a fellow scholar. >> He is simply a piece of contemporary Hindu history, however bizarre and >> disreputable one may find him. Scholars not inclined to contemporary Hindu >> affairs may well find little in Malhotra to interest them. >> ? >> > > ?I'd also be interested in thoughtful analyses of Malhotra as part of > contemporary Hindu history, as an object of study rather than a contributor > to current academic discourse. > > ?Best, > Dominik? > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From skarashima at gmail.com Sun Jul 31 09:52:30 2016 From: skarashima at gmail.com (Seishi Karashima) Date: Sun, 31 Jul 16 18:52:30 +0900 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon Message-ID: Dear colleagues, I assume that, when Renou associated etymologically *candramas* with *manas*, he may have had Senart?s explanation in his mind. Senart had explained this association as being based on a play on the roots ?*m?* in *candram?s* ?moon? and ?*man* in *manas*: ?mile Senart, *Essai sur la l?gende du Buddha: Son caract?re et ses origines*, 2e ?d., revue et suivie d?un index, Paris 1882: E. Leroux, p. 94, n. 3 "Jeu de mots sur *mans *et *candrama*, radical *man *et radical *ma* (sic)". Cf. also Paul Deussen, *Allgemeine Geschichte der Philosophie: Mit besonderer Ber?cksichtigung der Religionen*, Leipzig 1920: F.A. Brockhaus, (4. Auflage), I, 1, p. 156, ?dass endlich sein *Manas* zum Monde wird, hat vielleicht seinen Grund darin, dass die ruhige Klarheit des Mondlichts (welches ja auch nach Goethe ?die Seele l?st?) als Symbol des Intellektuellen erschien.? The best article on this topic is probably: Jan Gonda, ?Mind and Moon?, in: *Deyadharma, Studies in Memory of Dr. D.C. Sircar*, edited by Gouriswar Bhattacharya, Delhi: Sri Satguru Publications, distributed by Indian Book Center, 1986 (Sri Garib Dass Oriental Series ; no. 33), pp. 147-160 = *Selected Studies*, Leiden *et* *al.* 1991: Brill, vol. VI, pt. 2, pp. 423-436. With best regards, Seishi Karashima 2016-07-28 17:35 GMT+09:00 : > Thanks, Valerie, for the Varahamihira quote. It shows an extension of the > microcosm idea to > the planets, keeping the mind-moon pair (but not the eye-sun one). The > mind-moon pair is > one of the most stable of these pairings, as well as the least explicable. > > Verbal similarities can be very profound, especially in the Brahmanas. But > in this case I'm not > sure there is much verbal similarity: in RV 10.90.13 the words are manas > and candramas (in > Brhadaranyaka Up. 3.2.13 it's manas and candra, which is even less > similar). It's not a > similarity of the same order as indra-indha (Satapatha Br 6.1.1.2; Brh Up > 4.2.2). That made > me wonder whether Renou, in invoking word-play as an explanation, was > misled by his > knowledge of the Indo-European cognates of Skt mas and manas. > > With best wishes, > > Dermot > > On 28 Jul 2016 at 7:45, Valerie Roebuck wrote: > > I think it's meant to be a bit more profound than a verbal similarity - > though of course these > were widely thought not to be merely coincidental. We find the same > correspondence in > astrological texts, too, e.g. in Varahamihira's Bhajjataka, Chapter 2 v. > 1a, where the seven > planets of the ancient world are placed on the macrocosmic man of Time. > > kalatma dina-krn manas tuhinagu satva kujo j?o vaco jivo j?ana-sukhe > sita?s ca madano > dukha dine?satmaja / > > > The Sun ['Day-maker'] is the self (atman) of Time, the Moon ['Cool-rayed'] > his mind (manas), > Mars ['Earth-born'] his courage, Mercury ['Knower'] his speech, Jupiter > ['Life'] his knowledge > and happiness, Venus ['White One'] his desire, and Saturn ['Son of the > Lord of Day'] his > suffering. > > The Moon has a very important place in Indian astrology, but here perhaps > it is regarded as > representing a less profound (because more changeable?) level of being > than the Sun. > > Valerie J Roebuck > Manchester, UK > > On 28 Jul 2016, at 06:32, naresh keerthi wrote: > > Renou Etudes Vediques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. > > I don't have access to this source, but is it possible that this > conjecture is based on the > similarity of mati = mind [Sanskrit, but also used in Tamil] and mati > = moon in Tamil? > > > > Best, > Naresh Keerthi > National Institute of Advanced Studies, > Bangalore > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2016 10:47:45 +0100 > From: dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk > To: indology at list.indology.info > Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon > Message-ID: <57988341.1727.8FD05B at dermot.grevatt.force9.co.uk> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Can anyone explain why the mind is the microcosmic counterpart of the > moon? > The > correspondence appears in Rgveda 10.90.13 and in countless passages of > the > Brahmanas > and Upanisads, but it's not obvious like breath and wind. > > Renou ?tudes V?diques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. I find > that hard > to accept, > because the words (candra-mas and manas) are not very similar (they > are in > Latin, but the > sages didn't have access to an Indo-European comparative dictionary). > > Could the connection be through soma (often linked or identified with > the moon), > since the > mind is called a pavitra through which poetic insight (dhI) flows and > becomes > offerings > (Gonda Vision of the Vedic Poets pp. 278-9)? > > Or is it that the mind, like the moon, is constant though its content > continually > changes? > > -- > Dermot Killingley > 9, Rectory Drive, > Gosforth, > Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT > Phone (0191) 285 8053 > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options > or unsubscribe) > > > -- > Dermot Killingley > 9, Rectory Drive, > Gosforth, > Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT > Phone (0191) 285 8053 > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From skarashima at gmail.com Sun Jul 31 10:01:42 2016 From: skarashima at gmail.com (Seishi Karashima) Date: Sun, 31 Jul 16 19:01:42 +0900 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear colleagues, "Jeu de mots sur *mans *et *candrama*, radical *man *et radical *ma* (sic)" should be corrected to: "Jeu de mots sur *manas *et *candrama*, radical *man *et radical *ma* (sic)" Seishi Karashima 2016-07-31 18:52 GMT+09:00 Seishi Karashima : > Dear colleagues, > > I assume that, when Renou associated etymologically *candramas* with > *manas*, he may have had Senart?s explanation in his mind. Senart had > explained this association as being based on a play on the roots ?*m?* in > *candram?s* ?moon? and ?*man* in *manas*: ?mile Senart, *Essai sur la > l?gende du Buddha: Son caract?re et ses origines*, 2e ?d., revue et > suivie d?un index, Paris 1882: E. Leroux, p. 94, n. 3 "Jeu de mots sur *mans > *et *candrama*, radical *man *et radical *ma* (sic)". > > Cf. also Paul Deussen, *Allgemeine Geschichte der Philosophie: Mit > besonderer Ber?cksichtigung der Religionen*, Leipzig 1920: F.A. > Brockhaus, (4. Auflage), I, 1, p. 156, ?dass endlich sein *Manas* zum > Monde wird, hat vielleicht seinen Grund darin, dass die ruhige Klarheit des > Mondlichts (welches ja auch nach Goethe ?die Seele l?st?) als Symbol des > Intellektuellen erschien.? > > The best article on this topic is probably: Jan Gonda, ?Mind and Moon?, > in: *Deyadharma, Studies in Memory of Dr. D.C. Sircar*, edited by > Gouriswar Bhattacharya, Delhi: Sri Satguru Publications, distributed by > Indian Book Center, 1986 (Sri Garib Dass Oriental Series ; no. 33), pp. > 147-160 = *Selected Studies*, Leiden *et* *al.* 1991: Brill, vol. VI, pt. > 2, pp. 423-436. > > With best regards, > > Seishi Karashima > 2016-07-28 17:35 GMT+09:00 : > >> Thanks, Valerie, for the Varahamihira quote. It shows an extension of the >> microcosm idea to >> the planets, keeping the mind-moon pair (but not the eye-sun one). The >> mind-moon pair is >> one of the most stable of these pairings, as well as the least explicable. >> >> Verbal similarities can be very profound, especially in the Brahmanas. >> But in this case I'm not >> sure there is much verbal similarity: in RV 10.90.13 the words are manas >> and candramas (in >> Brhadaranyaka Up. 3.2.13 it's manas and candra, which is even less >> similar). It's not a >> similarity of the same order as indra-indha (Satapatha Br 6.1.1.2; Brh Up >> 4.2.2). That made >> me wonder whether Renou, in invoking word-play as an explanation, was >> misled by his >> knowledge of the Indo-European cognates of Skt mas and manas. >> >> With best wishes, >> >> Dermot >> >> On 28 Jul 2016 at 7:45, Valerie Roebuck wrote: >> >> I think it's meant to be a bit more profound than a verbal similarity - >> though of course these >> were widely thought not to be merely coincidental. We find the same >> correspondence in >> astrological texts, too, e.g. in Varahamihira's Bhajjataka, Chapter 2 v. >> 1a, where the seven >> planets of the ancient world are placed on the macrocosmic man of Time. >> >> kalatma dina-krn manas tuhinagu satva kujo j?o vaco jivo j?ana-sukhe >> sita?s ca madano >> dukha dine?satmaja / >> >> >> The Sun ['Day-maker'] is the self (atman) of Time, the Moon >> ['Cool-rayed'] his mind (manas), >> Mars ['Earth-born'] his courage, Mercury ['Knower'] his speech, Jupiter >> ['Life'] his knowledge >> and happiness, Venus ['White One'] his desire, and Saturn ['Son of the >> Lord of Day'] his >> suffering. >> >> The Moon has a very important place in Indian astrology, but here perhaps >> it is regarded as >> representing a less profound (because more changeable?) level of being >> than the Sun. >> >> Valerie J Roebuck >> Manchester, UK >> >> On 28 Jul 2016, at 06:32, naresh keerthi wrote: >> >> Renou Etudes Vediques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. >> >> I don't have access to this source, but is it possible that this >> conjecture is based on the >> similarity of mati = mind [Sanskrit, but also used in Tamil] and mati >> = moon in Tamil? >> >> >> >> Best, >> Naresh Keerthi >> National Institute of Advanced Studies, >> Bangalore >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 2 >> Date: Wed, 27 Jul 2016 10:47:45 +0100 >> From: dermot at grevatt.force9.co.uk >> To: indology at list.indology.info >> Subject: [INDOLOGY] Mind and moon >> Message-ID: <57988341.1727.8FD05B at dermot.grevatt.force9.co.uk> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 >> >> Can anyone explain why the mind is the microcosmic counterpart of the >> moon? >> The >> correspondence appears in Rgveda 10.90.13 and in countless passages >> of the >> Brahmanas >> and Upanisads, but it's not obvious like breath and wind. >> >> Renou ?tudes V?diques vol XVI p. 150 says it's a play on words. I >> find that hard >> to accept, >> because the words (candra-mas and manas) are not very similar (they >> are in >> Latin, but the >> sages didn't have access to an Indo-European comparative dictionary). >> >> Could the connection be through soma (often linked or identified with >> the moon), >> since the >> mind is called a pavitra through which poetic insight (dhI) flows and >> becomes >> offerings >> (Gonda Vision of the Vedic Poets pp. 278-9)? >> >> Or is it that the mind, like the moon, is constant though its content >> continually >> changes? >> >> -- >> Dermot Killingley >> 9, Rectory Drive, >> Gosforth, >> Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT >> Phone (0191) 285 8053 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list >> options or unsubscribe) >> >> >> -- >> Dermot Killingley >> 9, Rectory Drive, >> Gosforth, >> Newcastle upon Tyne NE3 1XT >> Phone (0191) 285 8053 >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Marcus.Schmuecker at oeaw.ac.at Sun Jul 31 14:23:20 2016 From: Marcus.Schmuecker at oeaw.ac.at (=?utf-8?Q?Schm=C3=BCcker=2C_Marcus?=) Date: Sun, 31 Jul 16 14:23:20 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Publications of the De Nobili Research Library - Most Recent Release Message-ID: <32DFF8C9C7C5A54696929A6A74F560DAC5C9B009@w07exdb1.oeaw.ads> PUBLICATIONS OF THE DE NOBILI RESEARCH LIBRARY OCCASIONAL PAPERS MOST RECENT RELEASE: Gerhard Oberhammer, Monistische Gotteslehre und Spiritualit?t V?manadattas. Ein religionshermeneutischer Versuch. Vienna 2016. 76p. (? 10) *** FOR ORDERS www.istb.univie.ac.at/sdn -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: most_recent_release_2016_.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 109288 bytes Desc: not available URL: From hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com Sun Jul 31 23:16:57 2016 From: hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com (Harry Spier) Date: Sun, 31 Jul 16 19:16:57 -0400 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Lanmans personal copy of his Sanskrit Reader Message-ID: Dear list members, In case its of interest to anyone. Lanmans own copy of his reader is downloadable from Google books. It has what appears to be some handwritten corrections by him. THe link. https://books.google.ca/books?id=qh8UAAAAYAAJ&printsec=frontcover&dq=a+sanskrit+reader+%22lanman%22&hl=en&sa=X&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q=a%20sanskrit%20reader%20%22lanman%22&f=false Harry Spier -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: