From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Sun Nov 1 02:21:45 2015 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Sun, 01 Nov 15 02:21:45 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_Question:_360_non-Buddhist_schools_in_Bh=C4=81vaviveka?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B0FAC1@xm-mbx-04-prod> Dear Anna and all, It should be noted that Bh?viveka's list was copied into numerous Tibetan works of the Grub-mtha' (siddh?nta) genre with no effort to explain much of it. More problematic is the likelihood that some Tibetan authors drew selectively on the list and then invented explanations. So Tibetan sources are not, so far as I know, likely to shed much light on the many obscure items mentioned. David has suggest that M?m?ms? works might help. My own hunch is that early Jaina doxographical writings might be of use. Given my limited knowledge of this material, I can't offer much more than this, but even relatively early Jaina works such as the Isibh?siya involve very intricate classifications of rival schools of thought, exemplifying the kind of complexity that seems to be in the background of Bh?viveka's work. A much less elaborated early Buddhist parallel would be the P?li Brahmaj?lasutta with its list of 62 views, some of which perhaps found their way into the Tarkajv?la as well. I hope this helps to some small extent -- the problem is an interesting one and I wish you all success, Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Sun Nov 1 13:19:03 2015 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Sun, 01 Nov 15 13:19:03 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_Question:_360_non-Buddhist_schools_in_Bh=C4=81vaviveka?= In-Reply-To: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B0FAC1@xm-mbx-04-prod> Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B0FB66@xm-mbx-04-prod> I note too that bcings nas 'dug pa probably means "those who sit having tied themselves up" rather than "those who remain bound" -- i.e. it likely refers to an ascetic practice and not to the state of being unliberated. Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From drdhaval2785 at gmail.com Mon Nov 2 10:37:45 2015 From: drdhaval2785 at gmail.com (dhaval patel) Date: Mon, 02 Nov 15 16:07:45 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Database of digitized manuscripts (NMM) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: gmail didn't allow attachment of >8.0 MB. So, the mail may not have the file. A dropbox link is attached - https://www.dropbox.com/s/9g703gcxqdl0vc5/Namami_Digitization.xlsx?dl=0. On Mon, Nov 2, 2015 at 3:59 PM, dhaval patel wrote: > Dear friends, > Sorry for cross posting. > > I am attaching herewith a complete database of manuscripts digitized by > http://namami.org/, which I received from them after a year long legal > issue. > I am thankful to National Manuscript for Manuscript to have provided this > valuable data. > > > Total Manuscripts digitized - 2,10,573 > > Total Manuscript repositories - 51 > > Notes - > 1. Each record has the following fields > Sr. No. ManusID Acc. No. Title Number of pages Script Repo Code Notes > > > 2. Repository codes are placed in 'Abbrv' worksheet of the same file. > > 3. Because of different transliteration conventions used in base files, > the transliteration is not uniform > > -- > Dr. Dhaval Patel, I.A.S > Collector and District Magistrate, Anand > www.sanskritworld.in > > -- Dr. Dhaval Patel, I.A.S Collector and District Magistrate, Anand www.sanskritworld.in -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hermantull at gmail.com Mon Nov 2 14:21:42 2015 From: hermantull at gmail.com (Herman Tull) Date: Mon, 02 Nov 15 09:21:42 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] stray request Message-ID: I am trying to get access to a stray quote from Anagarika Dharmapala's The Arya Dharma of Sakya Muni, Gautama, Buddha: Or, The Ethics of Self Discipline, Maha Bodhi Society, 1917. The quote occurs on p. 80 of the 1917 edition, but access to pp. 79 and 81 would be greatly appreciated. Google books provides me with a snippet view, but this is insufficient. I apologize for asking the list to be my researchers, but I do not have access to a research library at the moment, and I am working under deadline. Any help will be appreciated! -- *Herman TullPrinceton, NJ * -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hermantull at gmail.com Mon Nov 2 14:46:58 2015 From: hermantull at gmail.com (Herman Tull) Date: Mon, 02 Nov 15 09:46:58 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] stray request In-Reply-To: <5637766E.6060907@uni-bonn.de> Message-ID: Thank you! Exactly what I need. Once gain, I bow to the wisdom and to the kindness of the list! On Mon, Nov 2, 2015 at 9:42 AM, Peter Wyzlic wrote: > Am 02.11.2015 um 15:21 schrieb Herman Tull: > > I am trying to get access to a stray quote from Anagarika Dharmapala's The > Arya Dharma of Sakya Muni, Gautama, Buddha: Or, The Ethics of Self > Discipline, Maha Bodhi Society, 1917. The quote occurs on p. 80 of the > 1917 edition, but access to pp. 79 and 81 would be greatly appreciated. > > Google books provides me with a snippet view, but this is insufficient. I > apologize for asking the list to be my researchers, but I do not have > access to a research library at the moment, and I am working under > deadline. > > Dear Herman Tull, > > you may find a PDF file of a transcript under URL: > > , it is made > after an 1989 reprint of the 1917 edition. The transcript retains the > original page numbering, as it seems. > > Hope it helps > Peter Wyzlic > > -- > Institut f?r Orient- und Asienwissenschaften > Bibliothek > Universit?t Bonn > Regina-Pacis-Weg 7 > D-53113 Bonn > > -- *Herman TullPrinceton, NJ * -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From emstern at verizon.net Mon Nov 2 15:46:26 2015 From: emstern at verizon.net (Elliot Stern) Date: Mon, 02 Nov 15 10:46:26 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] stray request In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Herman, You should be able to download this book from Digital Library of India (bar code 4990010004229 ). Elliot M. Stern 552 South 48th Street Philadelphia, PA 19143-2029 United States of America telephone: 215-747-6204 mobile: 267-240-8418 emstern at verizon.net > On 02 Nov 2015, at 09:21, Herman Tull wrote: > > I am trying to get access to a stray quote from Anagarika Dharmapala's The Arya Dharma of Sakya Muni, Gautama, Buddha: Or, The Ethics of Self Discipline, Maha Bodhi Society, 1917. The quote occurs on p. 80 of the 1917 edition, but access to pp. 79 and 81 would be greatly appreciated. > > Google books provides me with a snippet view, but this is insufficient. I apologize for asking the list to be my researchers, but I do not have access to a research library at the moment, and I am working under deadline. > > Any help will be appreciated! > > -- > Herman Tull > Princeton, NJ > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rsalomon at u.washington.edu Mon Nov 2 17:49:53 2015 From: rsalomon at u.washington.edu (Richard Salomon) Date: Mon, 02 Nov 15 09:49:53 -0800 Subject: [INDOLOGY] deciphering a Tibetan mural In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5637A241.50801@u.washington.edu> Dear Mark, I don't think there's anything "pseudo-" about this inscription. It looks like script forms seen in old Sanskrit mss. from Nepal, and also resembles Pala-period scripts. A specialist in those areas (which I am not) should be able to confirm this and read it. (The last word is probably svaahaa.) Rich On 10/31/2015 12:11 PM, Mark McClish wrote: > Dear friends, > > A colleague of mine who works in Indo-Tibetan art contacted me for > help deciphering some writing on a mural he?s studying. I include here > the information and image he provided: > > I wonder if I might trouble you to take a look at a detail of mural > depicting the learned 17th century Tibetan scholar Taranatha > (attached). He is shown holding the stems of two lotuses, one lotus > bearing a sword, the other a text, the attributes of Manjushri. The > detail I send you is of the text, which I fancy aims at depicting > Sanskrit (it is not Tibetan, either cursive or otherwise). Is this > pseudo-Sanskrit (on par with pseudo-Kufic), or is it possible that it > is indeed readable Sanskrit? Much obliged if you have a moment to > glance at it. > > I am not able to make sense of the writing, and this is far afield > from my areas of expertise. Thanks in advance for any help. > > Best, > Mark > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- ---------------------- Richard Salomon Department of Asian Languages and Literature University of Washington, Box 353521 Seattle WA 98195-3521 USA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: attachment.jpe Type: image/jpeg Size: 1077359 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mango.angot at gmail.com Mon Nov 2 20:16:26 2015 From: mango.angot at gmail.com (Michel Angot) Date: Mon, 02 Nov 15 21:16:26 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Origin of a quotation Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, In the Commentary on Ha*t*haprad?pik?, Brahm?nanda quotes some *chandovid*. According to them, api m?shaM mashaM kury?c chandobhanga? tyajed gir?m'. I have seen this shloka attributed to Pata?jali the Grammarian. Bit it is not une the Mah?bh?shya.Does somedu know something about that? All best wishes Michel Angot CEIAS-EHESS Paris mango.angot at gmail.com. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ondracka at ff.cuni.cz Mon Nov 2 20:39:07 2015 From: ondracka at ff.cuni.cz (Lubomir Ondracka) Date: Mon, 02 Nov 15 21:39:07 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Origin of a quotation In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20151102213907.6c02a9f15b84e66d16e10904@ff.cuni.cz> Dear Michel, this vesrse is quoted by Mallin?tha on Raghuva??a 19.23 (Panshikar's edition with Jaglekar's notes and translation, 1925, page 270). Best, ---- Lubomir Ondracka Institute for Philosophy & Religious Studies Charles University, Namesti Jana Palacha 2 116 38 Praha 1, Czech Republic e-mail: ondracka at ff.cuni.cz On Mon, 2 Nov 2015 21:16:26 +0100 Michel Angot wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > > In the Commentary on Ha*t*haprad?pik?, Brahm?nanda quotes some *chandovid*. > According to them, api m?shaM mashaM kury?c chandobhanga? tyajed gir?m'. I > have seen this shloka attributed to Pata?jali the Grammarian. Bit it is not > une the Mah?bh?shya.Does somedu know something about that? > > All best wishes > > Michel Angot > CEIAS-EHESS Paris > mango.angot at gmail.com. From caf57 at cam.ac.uk Tue Nov 3 10:57:39 2015 From: caf57 at cam.ac.uk (C.A. Formigatti) Date: Tue, 03 Nov 15 10:57:39 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] deciphering a Tibetan mural In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <7e81d6b84d70b0fa33a872588dfdbce6@cam.ac.uk> Dear Mark, As Prof. Salomon already wrote, it is indeed a script very common in Nepalese palm-leaf manuscripts (from my experience up to the 15h-16th century; it is used also in some earlier Pala manuscripts). The picture has a relatively good resolution, but still it is difficult to read the first part of the text (it might begin with the ak?aras kama). I believe that the last part reads vakaddhitv?d. It is interesting to note that many Nepalese scripts were used as ornamental scripts in Tibet, and also that the writing material in the depiction seems to be paper (as to be expected in Tibet), since the folio bends. Best wishes, Camillo Formigatti > Dear friends, > > A colleague of mine who works in Indo-Tibetan art contacted me for > help deciphering some writing on a mural he?s studying. I include > here the information and image he provided: > > I wonder if I might trouble you to take a look at a detail of mural > depicting the learned 17th century Tibetan scholar Taranatha > (attached). He is shown holding the stems of two lotuses, one lotus > bearing a sword, the other a text, the attributes of Manjushri. The > detail I send you is of the text, which I fancy aims at depicting > Sanskrit (it is not Tibetan, either cursive or otherwise). Is this > pseudo-Sanskrit (on par with pseudo-Kufic), or is it possible that it > is indeed readable Sanskrit? Much obliged if you have a moment to > glance at it. > > I am not able to make sense of the writing, and this is far afield > from my areas of expertise. Thanks in advance for any help. > > Best, > Mark > From christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be Tue Nov 3 12:39:03 2015 From: christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be (Christophe Vielle) Date: Tue, 03 Nov 15 13:39:03 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] deciphering a Tibetan mural In-Reply-To: <7e81d6b84d70b0fa33a872588dfdbce6@cam.ac.uk> Message-ID: <8207C0BA-4DCA-47C2-B6E8-AADC96CE38E7@uclouvain.be> Dear list, I forward below Dr. Anirban Dash (University of Pune)'s short message to Dylan Esler on the topic, with his tentative transcription made on the picture. ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: Anirban Dash To: Dylan Esler Sent: Tuesday, 3 November 2015, 12:11 Subject: Re: Fw: [INDOLOGY] deciphering a Tibetan mural It is a script of Nepali family. The script name may be 'bhuji mol' bhuji means fly and mol means - head . Head stroke of each letter looks like fly. It is not so clear. Whatever i have understood, sending to you. thanks. With best regards, Anirban Dash Department of Pali and Buddhist Studies University of Pune, Ganeshkhind, Pune - 411007, Maharashtra, India Mobile : 91 + 7769 934157 (PUNE) 91 + 9839 482298 (VARANASI) Skype: brahmilipi Le 3 nov. 2015 ? 11:57, C.A. Formigatti a ?crit : > Dear Mark, > > As Prof. Salomon already wrote, it is indeed a script very common in Nepalese palm-leaf manuscripts (from my experience up to the 15h-16th century; it is used also in some earlier Pala manuscripts). The picture has a relatively good resolution, but still it is difficult to read the first part of the text (it might begin with the ak?aras kama). I believe that the last part reads vakaddhitv?d. It is interesting to note that many Nepalese scripts were used as ornamental scripts in Tibet, and also that the writing material in the depiction seems to be paper (as to be expected in Tibet), since the folio bends. > > Best wishes, > > Camillo Formigatti Dear Mark, I don't think there's anything "pseudo-" about this inscription. It looks like script forms seen in old Sanskrit mss. from Nepal, and also resembles Pala-period scripts. A specialist in those areas (which I am not) should be able to confirm this and read it. (The last word is probably svaahaa.) Rich ---------------------- Richard Salomon Department of Asian Languages and Literature University of Washington, Box 353521 Seattle WA 98195-3521 USA > >> Dear friends, >> A colleague of mine who works in Indo-Tibetan art contacted me for >> help deciphering some writing on a mural he?s studying. I include >> here the information and image he provided: >> I wonder if I might trouble you to take a look at a detail of mural >> depicting the learned 17th century Tibetan scholar Taranatha >> (attached). He is shown holding the stems of two lotuses, one lotus >> bearing a sword, the other a text, the attributes of Manjushri. The >> detail I send you is of the text, which I fancy aims at depicting >> Sanskrit (it is not Tibetan, either cursive or otherwise). Is this >> pseudo-Sanskrit (on par with pseudo-Kufic), or is it possible that it >> is indeed readable Sanskrit? Much obliged if you have a moment to >> glance at it. >> I am not able to make sense of the writing, and this is far afield >> from my areas of expertise. Thanks in advance for any help. >> Best, >> Mark > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) ??????????????????? Christophe Vielle Louvain-la-Neuve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mark.mcclish at northwestern.edu Tue Nov 3 20:18:56 2015 From: mark.mcclish at northwestern.edu (Mark McClish) Date: Tue, 03 Nov 15 20:18:56 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] deciphering a Tibetan mural In-Reply-To: <8207C0BA-4DCA-47C2-B6E8-AADC96CE38E7@uclouvain.be> Message-ID: Many thanks to everyone who has contributed to this thread. It?s gratifying to receive such generous assistance from the community. Christophe, I am not able to see the attachment to the email you?ve sent, whether using my mail client or the web interface. Could you possibly resend it? Best, Mark On Nov 3, 2015, at 6:39 AM, Christophe Vielle > wrote: Dear list, I forward below Dr. Anirban Dash (University of Pune)'s short message to Dylan Esler on the topic, with his tentative transcription made on the picture. ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: Anirban Dash > To: Dylan Esler > Sent: Tuesday, 3 November 2015, 12:11 Subject: Re: Fw: [INDOLOGY] deciphering a Tibetan mural It is a script of Nepali family. The script name may be 'bhuji mol' bhuji means fly and mol means - head . Head stroke of each letter looks like fly. It is not so clear. Whatever i have understood, sending to you. thanks. With best regards, Anirban Dash Department of Pali and Buddhist Studies University of Pune, Ganeshkhind, Pune - 411007, Maharashtra, India Mobile : 91 + 7769 934157 (PUNE) 91 + 9839 482298 (VARANASI) Skype: brahmilipi Le 3 nov. 2015 ? 11:57, C.A. Formigatti > a ?crit : Dear Mark, As Prof. Salomon already wrote, it is indeed a script very common in Nepalese palm-leaf manuscripts (from my experience up to the 15h-16th century; it is used also in some earlier Pala manuscripts). The picture has a relatively good resolution, but still it is difficult to read the first part of the text (it might begin with the ak?aras kama). I believe that the last part reads vakaddhitv?d. It is interesting to note that many Nepalese scripts were used as ornamental scripts in Tibet, and also that the writing material in the depiction seems to be paper (as to be expected in Tibet), since the folio bends. Best wishes, Camillo Formigatti Dear Mark, I don't think there's anything "pseudo-" about this inscription. It looks like script forms seen in old Sanskrit mss. from Nepal, and also resembles Pala-period scripts. A specialist in those areas (which I am not) should be able to confirm this and read it. (The last word is probably svaahaa.) Rich ---------------------- Richard Salomon Department of Asian Languages and Literature University of Washington, Box 353521 Seattle WA 98195-3521 USA Dear friends, A colleague of mine who works in Indo-Tibetan art contacted me for help deciphering some writing on a mural he?s studying. I include here the information and image he provided: I wonder if I might trouble you to take a look at a detail of mural depicting the learned 17th century Tibetan scholar Taranatha (attached). He is shown holding the stems of two lotuses, one lotus bearing a sword, the other a text, the attributes of Manjushri. The detail I send you is of the text, which I fancy aims at depicting Sanskrit (it is not Tibetan, either cursive or otherwise). Is this pseudo-Sanskrit (on par with pseudo-Kufic), or is it possible that it is indeed readable Sanskrit? Much obliged if you have a moment to glance at it. I am not able to make sense of the writing, and this is far afield from my areas of expertise. Thanks in advance for any help. Best, Mark _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) ??????????????????? Christophe Vielle Louvain-la-Neuve _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rsalomon at u.washington.edu Tue Nov 3 23:15:11 2015 From: rsalomon at u.washington.edu (Richard Salomon) Date: Tue, 03 Nov 15 15:15:11 -0800 Subject: [INDOLOGY] INDOLOGY Digest, Vol 33, Issue 28 In-Reply-To: <2115052518.31800521.1446308610068.JavaMail.javamailuser@localhost> Message-ID: <56393FFF.50409@u.washington.edu> Dear Piotr, Thanks for the clarification; and also to Jonathan Silk and his colleagues for further confirmation and information. So now it seems probable that this object did somehow make its way to Pakistan in pre-modern times. This is surprising but not impossible. I am thinking of Ingo Strauch's work (Foreign Sailors on Socotra, Bremen 2012) documenting extensive presence of Indians on the island of Socotra. Of course there are differences: (a) Socotra is an island off the coast of Yemen, while the copper plate comes from the mainland of Yemen; (b) the Socotra inscriptions are mostly from later centuries than the plate; and (c) the Socotra inscriptions are clearly and explicitly connected with the west coast of India (modern Gujarat), not with the northwestern/Gandhara area. Despite these differences, it still seems to me that the best explanation is that the copper plate somehow made its way to India via the trade routes with the west, which were at the peak around the time in question. Could it, for example, have been brought to India by a trader from Yemen? Rich Salomon On 10/31/2015 9:23 AM, Piotr Balcerowicz wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > Thank you so much for your feedback. > I should provide some additional explanation concerning the copper plate: > A few days back I happened to be a witness to a transaction when a villager from the vicinity of Peshawar contacted a local antique dealer and sold him the copper plate (for approx. 20 USD). The villager did not reveal where he found the copper plate but from what I understood the place is somewhere between Peshawar and Swat. > Being a witness and knowing that the copper plate will sooner or later circulate in the black market and may never be available to researcher, I asked them to provide me with a photograph of it. All the means that the plate couldn?t have been published anywhere before because it seems to be the new found (discovered about a month ago or so) as a result of rampant illegal excavations in the Af-Pak region. I cannot say where the copper plate is now. It is indeed quite surprising to learn that the copper plate originated from Yemen and reached the areas near Peshawar. Knowing that the villager brought the plate to the dealer, it is unlikely that it transpired in Pakistan as a result of modern illegal antique trade. > My intention to circulate the photo via Indology List was to make it available to researchers: since we cannot have the material object any more, at least there is the photograph of it. > Best regards, > Piotr Balcerowicz > -------------------------------- > www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz > From : Richard Salomon > Subject : [INDOLOGY] Fwd: Re: copper plate > To : indology at list.indology.info, Michael Macdonald , mcskin at u.washington.edu, Jason Neelis , Robin Dushman , Norbert Nebes > > Fri, 30 Oct, 2015 20:01 > > Here is some authoritative information about the copper plate (reportedly) from Peshawar, provided by Professor Dr Norbert Nebes of the University of Jena, forwarded by M. Macdonald of Oxford: > > "As far as I am aware the fragment of the bronze plaque is unknown and has not been published yet. It comes from the sanctuary QDMN of Ta'lab Riyam which is situated in Damhan, the ancient name of the present day al-Huqqa in the northern highlands of Yemen (about 20 km in the north of Sanaa). Without any doubt, it is a votive text probably dedicated by a female person. The text (Middle Sabaic, from the early centuries AD) also contains two or three interesting words." > > [Prof. Nebes wishes it to be noted that "the information is not intended for the art market resp. for persons who are involved in this metier (in any way)."] > > So my previous guess about the dating was way off -- please disregard it. The correct date proposed by Prof. Nebes, i.e. "the early centuries AD," makes a little more sense, in that this is the period when Peshawar (ancient Purusapura) was something of a metropolis. But it is still very surprising that this object from such a remote location should be found there. Of course it is possible that it was brought to Pakistan in modern times, but this seems hardly likely. If this really is what it seems, it might be somehow be a by-product of the widespread international sea and land trade between India and the west in the period concerned. > > Rich Salomon > > > > -------- Forwarded Message -------- > Subject: [INDOLOGY] copper plate > Date: Thu, 29 Oct 2015 13:48:45 +0100 (CET) > From: Piotr Balcerowicz > To: indology at list.indology.info > > > Dear Colleagues, > Attached is a photograph of a copper plate found near Peshawar. Exact location of the fund is unknown. I thought this might be of some interested to some of you. If anyone can say more about the contents of the copper plate and its possible date, it???ll be appreciated. > Regards, > Piotr Balcerowicz > -------------------------------- > www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz > -- ---------------------- Richard Salomon Department of Asian Languages and Literature University of Washington, Box 353521 Seattle WA 98195-3521 USA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From franco at uni-leipzig.de Tue Nov 3 23:41:43 2015 From: franco at uni-leipzig.de (Eli Franco) Date: Wed, 04 Nov 15 00:41:43 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Buddhist murals in the Kucha region In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20151104004143.Horde.VxYTYGqR_nyaIE_Yzqhs3Q2@mail.uni-leipzig.de> Dear friends and colleagues, It gives me great pleasure to announce the approval by the Union of the German Academies of Sciences of a long term research project on the Buddhist murals in the Kucha region (Xinjiang province). The project, which will be conducted at the Institute for Indology and Central Asian Studies of the University of Leipzig, will fund five positions, four in Buddhist art history and one in digital humanities, for a period of fifteen years. With best wishes (and apologies for cross-posting), Eli Franco -- Prof. Dr. Eli Franco Institut f?r Indologie und Zentralasienwissenschaften Schillerstr. 6 04109 Leipzig Ph. +49 341 9737 121, 9737 120 (dept. office) Fax +49 341 9737 148 From vglyssenko at yandex.ru Wed Nov 4 10:51:00 2015 From: vglyssenko at yandex.ru (Viktoria Lysenko) Date: Wed, 04 Nov 15 13:51:00 +0300 Subject: [INDOLOGY] the paper of Gunilla Gren-Eklund Message-ID: <569641446634260@web2o.yandex.ru> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From r.mahoney at indica-et-buddhica.org Wed Nov 4 19:14:43 2015 From: r.mahoney at indica-et-buddhica.org (Richard Mahoney) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 08:14:43 +1300 Subject: [INDOLOGY] the paper of Gunilla Gren-Eklund In-Reply-To: <569641446634260@web2o.yandex.ru> Message-ID: <563A5923.5070909@indica-et-buddhica.org> On 11/4/2015 23:51, Viktoria Lysenko wrote: > Dear list, > I desperately need a paper of Gunilla Gren-Eklund "The meanings of words > and the categories of things, Indian and Aristotelian". Lecture at the > 12th World Sanskrit Conference, Bangalore 1997. Orientalia Suecana 48 > (1999).Pp.43-48. Could anyone help me with its PDF, or any other > electronic form? The German holdings are extensive: Orientalia Suecana http://indica-et-buddhica.org/tabulae/o/orientalia-suecana Scholia ~ Zeitschriftendatenbank (ZDB) http://bit.ly/1l81QOi Best, R > With warm regards, > Victoria > > https://rggu.academia.edu/LysenkoVictoria > http://iph.ras.ru/lysenko.htm > -- > Victoria Lysenko, dr.hab.philos. > Head, Department for Oriental philosophy studies > Institute of Philosophy, Russian Academy of Sciences > Moscow, Volkhonka, 14 > Professor, Russian State University for Humanities > Russia -- Richard Mahoney Littledene Bay Road Oxford 7430 NZ M: +64-21-064-0216 T: +64-3-312-1699 r.mahoney at indica-et-buddhica.org -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 473 bytes Desc: not available URL: From p.balcerowicz at uw.edu.pl Wed Nov 4 23:38:01 2015 From: p.balcerowicz at uw.edu.pl (Piotr Balcerowicz) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 00:38:01 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] INDOLOGY Digest, Vol 33, Issue 28 In-Reply-To: <56393FFF.50409@u.washington.edu> Message-ID: <1438725213.33606641.1446680281236.JavaMail.javamailuser@localhost> Dear Rich, What is trully puzzling is indeed, as you?ve pointed out, how that plated reached the area of Peshawar in pre-modern times. One possibility is that it was indeed brought to the Gandhara region by a trader from Yemen, but that being the case, the plate should have been considered of some material value by both the trader and a potential buyer. As we learn, "it is a votive text probably dedicated by a female person" ... "from the early centuries AD", so it is a religious item, probably of little practical or religious value for anyone in an area where Buddhism dominated. Perhaps the contents of the plate could reveal some more details. A possibility is that, if being a votive plate, perhaps it played some protective role for a traveller / trader from Yemen venturing to India? Alternatively, it could have been transported perhaps with some household goods or dowry of a bride from Yemen moving to India? Or perhaps it was once offered by a Yemeni person to an Indian trader who spend some time in Yemen and on his way back he took all his belongings along with him back to India? These are sheer speculations on my part because I don?t have any idea what function such votive copper plates fulfilled in Yemen, how they were used and circulated etc. If such votive plates were placed in a temple somewhere in Yemen "for ever" and offered to a local deity, then it is quite difficult to expain how the plate found its way to India. However, if such plates were meant to be given to someone as a kind of protective amulet, then it makes it much easier to explain. We would require some additional help from a specialist who would explain the role of such votive plates. All the best, Piotr Balcerowicz -------------------------------- www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Salomon To: Piotr Balcerowicz , indology at list.indology.info, Michael Macdonald , mcskin at u.washington.edu, Jason Neelis , Robin Dushman , Norbert Nebes Sent: Wed, 04 Nov 2015 00:15:11 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: INDOLOGY Digest, Vol 33, Issue 28 Dear Piotr, Thanks for the clarification; and also to Jonathan Silk and his colleagues for further confirmation and information. So now it seems probable that this object did somehow make its way to Pakistan in pre-modern times. This is surprising but not impossible. I am thinking of Ingo Strauch's work (Foreign Sailors on Socotra, Bremen 2012) documenting extensive presence of Indians on the island of Socotra. Of course there are differences: (a) Socotra is an island off the coast of Yemen, while the copper plate comes from the mainland of Yemen; (b) the Socotra inscriptions are mostly from later centuries than the plate; and (c) the Socotra inscriptions are clearly and explicitly connected with the west coast of India (modern Gujarat), not with the northwestern/Gandhara area. Despite these differences, it still seems to me that the best explanation is that the copper plate somehow made its way to India via the trade routes with the west, which were at the peak around the time in question. Could it, for example, have been brought to India by a trader from Yemen? Rich Salomon On 10/31/2015 9:23 AM, Piotr Balcerowicz wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > Thank you so much for your feedback. > I should provide some additional explanation concerning the copper plate: > A few days back I happened to be a witness to a transaction when a villager from the vicinity of Peshawar contacted a local antique dealer and sold him the copper plate (for approx. 20 USD). The villager did not reveal where he found the copper plate but from what I understood the place is somewhere between Peshawar and Swat. > Being a witness and knowing that the copper plate will sooner or later circulate in the black market and may never be available to researcher, I asked them to provide me with a photograph of it. All the means that the plate couldn?t have been published anywhere before because it seems to be the new found (discovered about a month ago or so) as a result of rampant illegal excavations in the Af-Pak region. I cannot say where the copper plate is now. It is indeed quite surprising to learn that the copper plate originated from Yemen and reached the areas near Peshawar. Knowing that the villager brought the plate to the dealer, it is unlikely that it transpired in Pakistan as a result of modern illegal antique trade. > My intention to circulate the photo via Indology List was to make it available to researchers: since we cannot have the material object any more, at least there is the photograph of it. > Best regards, > Piotr Balcerowicz > -------------------------------- > www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz > From : Richard Salomon > Subject : [INDOLOGY] Fwd: Re: copper plate > To : indology at list.indology.info, Michael Macdonald , mcskin at u.washington.edu, Jason Neelis , Robin Dushman , Norbert Nebes > > Fri, 30 Oct, 2015 20:01 > > Here is some authoritative information about the copper plate (reportedly) from Peshawar, provided by Professor Dr Norbert Nebes of the University of Jena, forwarded by M. Macdonald of Oxford: > > "As far as I am aware the fragment of the bronze plaque is unknown and has not been published yet. It comes from the sanctuary QDMN of Ta'lab Riyam which is situated in Damhan, the ancient name of the present day al-Huqqa in the northern highlands of Yemen (about 20 km in the north of Sanaa). Without any doubt, it is a votive text probably dedicated by a female person. The text (Middle Sabaic, from the early centuries AD) also contains two or three interesting words." > > [Prof. Nebes wishes it to be noted that "the information is not intended for the art market resp. for persons who are involved in this metier (in any way)."] > > So my previous guess about the dating was way off -- please disregard it. The correct date proposed by Prof. Nebes, i.e. "the early centuries AD," makes a little more sense, in that this is the period when Peshawar (ancient Purusapura) was something of a metropolis. But it is still very surprising that this object from such a remote location should be found there. Of course it is possible that it was brought to Pakistan in modern times, but this seems hardly likely. If this really is what it seems, it might be somehow be a by-product of the widespread international sea and land trade between India and the west in the period concerned. > > Rich Salomon > > > > -------- Forwarded Message -------- > Subject: [INDOLOGY] copper plate > Date: Thu, 29 Oct 2015 13:48:45 +0100 (CET) > From: Piotr Balcerowicz > To: indology at list.indology.info > > > Dear Colleagues, > Attached is a photograph of a copper plate found near Peshawar. Exact location of the fund is unknown. I thought this might be of some interested to some of you. If anyone can say more about the contents of the copper plate and its possible date, it???ll be appreciated. > Regards, > Piotr Balcerowicz > -------------------------------- > www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz > -- ---------------------- Richard Salomon Department of Asian Languages and Literature University of Washington, Box 353521 Seattle WA 98195-3521 USA From hellwig7 at gmx.de Thu Nov 5 10:08:27 2015 From: hellwig7 at gmx.de (hellwig7 at gmx.de) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 11:08:27 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Texts with different topics by one author Message-ID: Dear list members, I am looking for Sanskrit authors who have written about many (>=3) different topics or in many (>=3) different genres (e.g., poetry, narrative, philosophical, scientific, ...); alternatively for voluminous texts by one author that cover such different topics in separate chapters (i.e., the thematic strata should be easily separable). Further requirements: 1) Authorship of their works should be consolidated in Indological research. 2) Texts should not be too short. 3) Texts should not be collections of former works or of citations only, but "really" be written by these authors. 4) The older, the better! 5) Texts should be edited or - even better - already digitized. The first (and actually only) author that came to my mind is Kshemendra. Do you have any other ideas? Any feedback is highly appreciated. Regards, Oliver --- Oliver Hellwig, University of D?sseldorf From franco at uni-leipzig.de Thu Nov 5 10:23:46 2015 From: franco at uni-leipzig.de (Eli Franco) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 11:23:46 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Texts with different topics by one author In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20151105112346.Horde.aMWIbCzRvJOYmmOpVaiCZg3@mail.uni-leipzig.de> VAcaspatimizra and Abhinavagupta would be obvious choices. Best wishes, EF Zitat von hellwig7 at gmx.de: > Dear list members, > > I am looking for Sanskrit authors who have written about many (>=3) > different topics or in many (>=3) different genres (e.g., poetry, > narrative, philosophical, scientific, ...); alternatively for > voluminous texts by one author that cover such different topics in > separate chapters (i.e., the thematic strata should be easily > separable). > > Further requirements: > 1) Authorship of their works should be consolidated in Indological research. > 2) Texts should not be too short. > 3) Texts should not be collections of former works or of citations > only, but "really" be written by these authors. > 4) The older, the better! > 5) Texts should be edited or - even better - already digitized. > > The first (and actually only) author that came to my mind is > Kshemendra. Do you have any other ideas? Any feedback is highly > appreciated. > > Regards, Oliver > > --- Oliver Hellwig, University of D?sseldorf > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list > options or unsubscribe) -- Prof. Dr. Eli Franco Institut f?r Indologie und Zentralasienwissenschaften Schillerstr. 6 04109 Leipzig Ph. +49 341 9737 121, 9737 120 (dept. office) Fax +49 341 9737 148 From pwyzlic at uni-bonn.de Thu Nov 5 11:18:17 2015 From: pwyzlic at uni-bonn.de (Peter Wyzlic) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 12:18:17 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Texts with different topics by one author In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Am 05.11.2015 um 11:08 schrieb : > I am looking for Sanskrit authors who have written about many (>=3) different topics or in many (>=3) different genres (e.g., poetry, narrative, philosophical, scientific, ...); alternatively for voluminous texts by one author that cover such different topics in separate chapters (i.e., the thematic strata should be easily separable). > > Further requirements: > 1) Authorship of their works should be consolidated in Indological research. > 2) Texts should not be too short. > 3) Texts should not be collections of former works or of citations only, but "really" be written by these authors. > 4) The older, the better! > 5) Texts should be edited or - even better - already digitized. > > The first (and actually only) author that came to my mind is Kshemendra. Do you have any other ideas? Any feedback is highly appreciated. > Kalik?lasarvaj?a Hemacandra might be one of those authors. All the best Peter Wyzlic -- Institut f?r Orient- und Asienwissenschaften Bibliothek Universit?t Bonn Regina-Pacis-Weg 7 53113 Bonn From christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be Thu Nov 5 11:47:40 2015 From: christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be (Christophe Vielle) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 12:47:40 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Texts with different topics by one author In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <06EC35F2-E7CA-4E73-8391-85519DAA9F4F@uclouvain.be> ? R?ja?ekhara, but his ko?a's are lost (9th-10th c.) Bhoja (11th c.), but the various works he authored were probably composed by others They are numerous real polygraphs in more recent times, e.g. Ved?nta De?ika/Ve?ka?an?tha (13th-14th c.) Appaya D?k?ita (16th c.) Melputt?r N?r?ya?a Bha??atiri (16th-17th c.) R?map??iv?da (18th c.) N?ge?a Bha??a (18th c.) Le 5 nov. 2015 ? 11:08, a ?crit : > Dear list members, > > I am looking for Sanskrit authors who have written about many (>=3) different topics or in many (>=3) different genres (e.g., poetry, narrative, philosophical, scientific, ...); alternatively for voluminous texts by one author that cover such different topics in separate chapters (i.e., the thematic strata should be easily separable). > > Further requirements: > 1) Authorship of their works should be consolidated in Indological research. > 2) Texts should not be too short. > 3) Texts should not be collections of former works or of citations only, but "really" be written by these authors. > 4) The older, the better! > 5) Texts should be edited or - even better - already digitized. > > The first (and actually only) author that came to my mind is Kshemendra. Do you have any other ideas? Any feedback is highly appreciated. > > Regards, Oliver > > --- Oliver Hellwig, University of D?sseldorf > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) ??????????????????? Christophe Vielle Louvain-la-Neuve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kauzeya at gmail.com Thu Nov 5 12:20:17 2015 From: kauzeya at gmail.com (Jonathan Silk) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 13:20:17 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Texts with different topics by one author In-Reply-To: <06EC35F2-E7CA-4E73-8391-85519DAA9F4F@uclouvain.be> Message-ID: I don't have a good list of names to suggest, but I just want to say that this request suggests that you are at the stage of testing some algorithms for determining authorship, and this is very very exciting!! Genre-wise it does not really meet your requirements, but you might think (I would hope you would think) of Vasubandhu as a future 'test case'. Jonathan On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 12:47 PM, Christophe Vielle < christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be> wrote: > ? > R?ja?ekhara, but his *ko**?a*'s are lost (9th-10th c.) > Bhoja (11th c.), but the various works he authored were probably composed > by others > They are numerous real polygraphs in more recent times, e.g. > Ved?nta De?ika/Ve?ka?an?tha (13th-14th c.) > Appaya D?k?ita (16th c.) > Melputt?r N?r?ya?a Bha??atiri (16th-17th c.) > R?map??iv?da (18th c.) > N?ge?a Bha??a (18th c.) > > Le 5 nov. 2015 ? 11:08, a ?crit : > > Dear list members, > > I am looking for Sanskrit authors who have written about many (>=3) > different topics or in many (>=3) different genres (e.g., poetry, > narrative, philosophical, scientific, ...); alternatively for voluminous > texts by one author that cover such different topics in separate chapters > (i.e., the thematic strata should be easily separable). > > Further requirements: > 1) Authorship of their works should be consolidated in Indological > research. > 2) Texts should not be too short. > 3) Texts should not be collections of former works or of citations only, > but "really" be written by these authors. > 4) The older, the better! > 5) Texts should be edited or - even better - already digitized. > > The first (and actually only) author that came to my mind is Kshemendra. > Do you have any other ideas? Any feedback is highly appreciated. > > Regards, Oliver > > --- Oliver Hellwig, University of D?sseldorf > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > ??????????????????? > Christophe Vielle > Louvain-la-Neuve > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- J. Silk Leiden University Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b 2311 BZ Leiden The Netherlands copies of my publications may be found at http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From andra.kleb at gmail.com Thu Nov 5 12:58:00 2015 From: andra.kleb at gmail.com (Andrey Klebanov) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 18:28:00 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Texts with different topics by one author In-Reply-To: <06EC35F2-E7CA-4E73-8391-85519DAA9F4F@uclouvain.be> Message-ID: Also Mallin?tha and the less known Vidy?m?dhava (both 14-15th c.). For the latter the 5th requirement isn?t fulfilled though. best, Andrey > On 11/05/2015, at 17:17, Christophe Vielle wrote: > > ? > R?ja?ekhara, but his ko?a's are lost (9th-10th c.) > Bhoja (11th c.), but the various works he authored were probably composed by others > They are numerous real polygraphs in more recent times, e.g. > Ved?nta De?ika/Ve?ka?an?tha (13th-14th c.) > Appaya D?k?ita (16th c.) > Melputt?r N?r?ya?a Bha??atiri (16th-17th c.) > R?map??iv?da (18th c.) > N?ge?a Bha??a (18th c.) > > Le 5 nov. 2015 ? 11:08, > > a ?crit : > >> Dear list members, >> >> I am looking for Sanskrit authors who have written about many (>=3) different topics or in many (>=3) different genres (e.g., poetry, narrative, philosophical, scientific, ...); alternatively for voluminous texts by one author that cover such different topics in separate chapters (i.e., the thematic strata should be easily separable). >> >> Further requirements: >> 1) Authorship of their works should be consolidated in Indological research. >> 2) Texts should not be too short. >> 3) Texts should not be collections of former works or of citations only, but "really" be written by these authors. >> 4) The older, the better! >> 5) Texts should be edited or - even better - already digitized. >> >> The first (and actually only) author that came to my mind is Kshemendra. Do you have any other ideas? Any feedback is highly appreciated. >> >> Regards, Oliver >> >> --- Oliver Hellwig, University of D?sseldorf >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > ??????????????????? > Christophe Vielle > Louvain-la-Neuve > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From emstern at verizon.net Thu Nov 5 13:33:10 2015 From: emstern at verizon.net (Elliot Stern) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 08:33:10 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Texts with different topics by one author In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <28129BED-2A0F-4640-B8DC-6ED1B43DC2A1@verizon.net> N?ge?a (N?goj?bha??a) Elliot M. Stern 552 South 48th Street Philadelphia, PA 19143-2029 United States of America telephone: 215-747-6204 mobile: 267-240-8418 emstern at verizon.net > On 05 Nov 2015, at 05:08, wrote: > > Dear list members, > > I am looking for Sanskrit authors who have written about many (>=3) different topics or in many (>=3) different genres (e.g., poetry, narrative, philosophical, scientific, ...); alternatively for voluminous texts by one author that cover such different topics in separate chapters (i.e., the thematic strata should be easily separable). > > Further requirements: > 1) Authorship of their works should be consolidated in Indological research. > 2) Texts should not be too short. > 3) Texts should not be collections of former works or of citations only, but "really" be written by these authors. > 4) The older, the better! > 5) Texts should be edited or - even better - already digitized. > > The first (and actually only) author that came to my mind is Kshemendra. Do you have any other ideas? Any feedback is highly appreciated. > > Regards, Oliver > > --- Oliver Hellwig, University of D?sseldorf > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From uskokov at uchicago.edu Thu Nov 5 14:31:22 2015 From: uskokov at uchicago.edu (Aleksandar Uskokov) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 08:31:22 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Texts with different topics by one author In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Jiva Gosvamin and Baladeva Vidyabhusana among the Gaudiyas. Vedantadesika. Perhaps Sriharsa? Kind regards Aleksandar On Nov 5, 2015 8:27 AM, wrote: > Dear list members, > > I am looking for Sanskrit authors who have written about many (>=3) > different topics or in many (>=3) different genres (e.g., poetry, > narrative, philosophical, scientific, ...); alternatively for voluminous > texts by one author that cover such different topics in separate chapters > (i.e., the thematic strata should be easily separable). > > Further requirements: > 1) Authorship of their works should be consolidated in Indological > research. > 2) Texts should not be too short. > 3) Texts should not be collections of former works or of citations only, > but "really" be written by these authors. > 4) The older, the better! > 5) Texts should be edited or - even better - already digitized. > > The first (and actually only) author that came to my mind is Kshemendra. > Do you have any other ideas? Any feedback is highly appreciated. > > Regards, Oliver > > --- Oliver Hellwig, University of D?sseldorf > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dmellins at gmail.com Thu Nov 5 16:42:34 2015 From: dmellins at gmail.com (David Mellins) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 11:42:34 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Texts with different topics by one author In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Also G?g?bha??a (Vi?ve?vara). David On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 9:31 AM, Aleksandar Uskokov wrote: > Jiva Gosvamin and Baladeva Vidyabhusana among the Gaudiyas. > > Vedantadesika. > > Perhaps Sriharsa? > > Kind regards > Aleksandar > On Nov 5, 2015 8:27 AM, wrote: > >> Dear list members, >> >> I am looking for Sanskrit authors who have written about many (>=3) >> different topics or in many (>=3) different genres (e.g., poetry, >> narrative, philosophical, scientific, ...); alternatively for voluminous >> texts by one author that cover such different topics in separate chapters >> (i.e., the thematic strata should be easily separable). >> >> Further requirements: >> 1) Authorship of their works should be consolidated in Indological >> research. >> 2) Texts should not be too short. >> 3) Texts should not be collections of former works or of citations only, >> but "really" be written by these authors. >> 4) The older, the better! >> 5) Texts should be edited or - even better - already digitized. >> >> The first (and actually only) author that came to my mind is Kshemendra. >> Do you have any other ideas? Any feedback is highly appreciated. >> >> Regards, Oliver >> >> --- Oliver Hellwig, University of D?sseldorf >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From c.ram-prasad at lancaster.ac.uk Thu Nov 5 20:53:30 2015 From: c.ram-prasad at lancaster.ac.uk (Ram-Prasad, Chakravarthi) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 20:53:30 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?B?W0lORE9MT0dZXSBHxavhuI3EgXJ0aGFkxKtwaWvEgQ==?= Message-ID: <5622B5FA1B14F3439A3ABC85C5A09EA823C03D81@EX-1-MB1.lancs.local> Could someone please point me to an electronic version of Madhus?dana?s commentary on the G?t?? Thank you. Ram Chakravarthi Ram-Prasad Professor of Comparative Religion and Philosophy Lancaster University -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hellwig7 at gmx.de Thu Nov 5 21:15:43 2015 From: hellwig7 at gmx.de (hellwig7 at gmx.de) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 22:15:43 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Texts with different topics by one author Message-ID: Thanks a lot for the list of recommendations! After a short look at GRETIL, Abhinavagupta and Kshemendra seem to be the best (easiest available) ones to begin with. @Jonathan: Yes, it?s for authorship attribution ? I need some data to ?calibrate? the statistical measures and test some basic assumptions. Best, Oliver --- Oliver Hellwig, University of D?sseldorf -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karp at uw.edu.pl Thu Nov 5 21:47:53 2015 From: karp at uw.edu.pl (Artur Karp) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 22:47:53 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Tithi & synodic month Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, Is there any evidence for the use of the fraction 63/64 ? to determine the length of the lunar day (tithi)? In ancient Babylonian-Greek astronomy? In ancient Indian astronomy? The result of the division, if multiplied by 30, would give the length of the synodic month ? as 29. 53125d. Your help in the matter would be greatly appreciated, Artur Karp University of Warsaw , South Asian Studies Dept. , Emeritus -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bill.m.mak at gmail.com Thu Nov 5 22:35:06 2015 From: bill.m.mak at gmail.com (Bill Mak) Date: Fri, 06 Nov 15 07:35:06 +0900 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Tithi & synodic month In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5F9E9263-4368-4902-9CF8-8BFECF3C0D88@gmail.com> Dear Artur, Sphujidhvaja in Yavanaj?taka 79.5 gives the definition of a tithi as 63/64 of a civil day: dina? catu??a??ilavonam ?hus tithi? dyu?abd?khyam ahas tu sarvam | tri?a??ibh?gena yuta? sahasra? yuge ?vam?n?m apasapta?a?kam ||5|| They say that a day (dinam) minus 1/64 [of a day] is a tithi; on the other hand, a day (ahar), called by the word dyu, is one whole [tithi] plus 1/63 [of a tithi]. The number of omitted tithis (avama) in a yuga is equal to 1000 minus "7 times 6" (i.e. 1000 - 42 = 958). Pingree's translation is somewhat different and but I believe his maths is incorrect since t = 1- 1/64 d, d = t + 1/63. His reading of cd was based on his own emendation and not on the ms (or even his own reading in the apparatus!): They say that a tithi equals a day minus 1/64th, but that every day equals a tithi plus 1/60th. In a yuga there are 990 seasons (?tu), (each) consisting of 62 (tithis). 63/64 is used only as an approximate value, since the algorithm for the "caturm?navidh?na" (79.6 ff.) yields the value 60272/61230 which would give a better synodic month of 29.5306222... (given also in 79.12) compared to 29.53125 (cmp. modern value: 29.53059...). Hayashi Takao pointed out to me that the expression for 64/63 can be easily derived from 61230/60272 through a popular method of approximation by reducing a series of fraction. I would be interested in other instances of 64/63, 1/64 or 1/63. If you know any, please let me know. For further explanations and notes, see my critical edition: Mak, Bill M. 2013. "The Last Chapter of Sphujidhvaja's Yavanaj?taka critically edited with notes." SCIAMVS 14: 59-148. In particular, pp.78-80, 90-91. Best regards, Bill -- Dr. Bill M. Mak Hakubi Associate Professor of History of Science Institute for Research in Humanities, Kyoto University Yoshidahonmachi, Sakyo-ku, Kyoto, Japan 606-8501 ?606-8501 ?????????? ??????????? email: mak at zinbun.kyoto-u.ac.jp Tel:+81-75-753-6961 Fax:+81-75-753-6903 copies of my publications may be found at: http://www.billmak.com On 2015/11/06, at 6:47, Artur Karp wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > > Is there any evidence for the use of the fraction 63/64 ? to determine the length of the lunar day (tithi)? In ancient Babylonian-Greek astronomy? In ancient Indian astronomy? > > > > The result of the division, if multiplied by 30, would give the length of the synodic month ? as 29. 53125d. > > > > > > Your help in the matter would be greatly appreciated, > > > > Artur Karp > > University of Warsaw, South Asian Studies Dept., Emeritus > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From p.balcerowicz at uw.edu.pl Thu Nov 5 23:45:16 2015 From: p.balcerowicz at uw.edu.pl (Piotr Balcerowicz) Date: Fri, 06 Nov 15 00:45:16 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] INDOLOGY Digest, Vol 33, Issue 28 In-Reply-To: <22510684-9DA6-4081-ACAC-3531B4A113ED@orinst.ox.ac.uk> Message-ID: <2091458538.34119476.1446767116210.JavaMail.javamailuser@localhost> Dear Michael, You are absolutely right that this could be the easiest way to explain the presence of the Yemen-origin copper plate in the area near Peshawar. The only problem with the 19th-century transfer hypothesis howeer is that the plate which I saw and photograhed was brought to a local antique dealer by a villager who explained he had found it in the fields (somewhere between Peshawar and Swat) and these are the same fields where villagers occasionally find Kushan coins etc. And he brought it to the dealer like many other antique items - for sale. It is rather unlikely (but certainly not impossible) that 19th century British citizen brought the plate from Yemen and deposited (or lost) it somewhere in the fields. Best wishes, Piotr -------------------------------- www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Macdonald To: Piotr Balcerowicz Cc: Richard Salomon , indology at list.indology.info, mcskin at u.washington.edu, Jason Neelis , Robin Dushman , Norbert Nebes Sent: Thu, 05 Nov 2015 18:02:41 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: INDOLOGY Digest, Vol 33, Issue 28 Dear All, This is a very interesting discussion, but I think it might be worth considering another possibility. As we all know, in the 19th and the first half of the 20th century Britain ruled both southern Yemen and India/Pakistan. Now, we also know that there are Ancient South Arabian inscriptions in the Bombay Museum and probably other museums in the Subcontinent (Norbert Nebes will be able to provide the details). Most British ships en route to India stopped at Aden to refuel, and it seems likely that these inscriptions were bought in Yemen by British or other travellers on their way to the Subcontinent where some of them, at least, were left. The antiquities market was already flourishing in Yemen during the 19th century and it is highly likely that finds from the north of Yemen (where there would have been very few commercial outlets) found their way to the international market in Aden. Of course, this is pure speculation but it seems to me a more likely explanation than that the plaque was taken to Pakistan in antiquity. With best wishes, Michael. > On 4 Nov 2015, at 23:38, Piotr Balcerowicz wrote: > > Dear Rich, > What is trully puzzling is indeed, as you?ve pointed out, how that plated reached the area of Peshawar in pre-modern times. One possibility is that it was indeed brought to the Gandhara region by a trader from Yemen, but that being the case, the plate should have been considered of some material value by both the trader and a potential buyer. > As we learn, "it is a votive text probably dedicated by a female person" ... "from the early centuries AD", so it is a religious item, probably of little practical or religious value for anyone in an area where Buddhism dominated. Perhaps the contents of the plate could reveal some more details. A possibility is that, if being a votive plate, perhaps it played some protective role for a traveller / trader from Yemen venturing to India? Alternatively, it could have been transported perhaps with some household goods or dowry of a bride from Yemen moving to India? Or perhaps it was once offered by a Yemeni person to an Indian trader who spend some time in Yemen and on his way back he took all his belongings along with him back to India? These are sheer speculations on my part because I don?t have any idea what function such votive copper plates fulfilled in Yemen, how they were used and circulated etc. If such votive plates were placed in a temple somewhere in Yemen "for ever" and offered to a local deity, then it is quite difficult to expain how the plate found its way to India. However, if such plates were meant to be given to someone as a kind of protective amulet, then it makes it much easier to explain. We would require some additional help from a specialist who would explain the role of such votive plates. > All the best, > Piotr Balcerowicz > -------------------------------- > www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Richard Salomon > To: Piotr Balcerowicz , indology at list.indology.info, Michael Macdonald , mcskin at u.washington.edu, Jason Neelis , Robin Dushman , Norbert Nebes > Sent: Wed, 04 Nov 2015 00:15:11 +0100 (CET) > Subject: Re: INDOLOGY Digest, Vol 33, Issue 28 > > Dear Piotr, > > Thanks for the clarification; and also to Jonathan Silk and his > colleagues for further confirmation and information. So now it seems > probable that this object did somehow make its way to Pakistan in > pre-modern times. This is surprising but not impossible. I am thinking > of Ingo Strauch's work (Foreign Sailors on Socotra, Bremen 2012) > documenting extensive presence of Indians on the island of Socotra. > > Of course there are differences: (a) Socotra is an island off the coast > of Yemen, while the copper plate comes from the mainland of Yemen; (b) > the Socotra inscriptions are mostly from later centuries than the plate; > and (c) the Socotra inscriptions are clearly and explicitly connected > with the west coast of India (modern Gujarat), not with the > northwestern/Gandhara area. > > Despite these differences, it still seems to me that the best > explanation is that the copper plate somehow made its way to India via > the trade routes with the west, which were at the peak around the time > in question. Could it, for example, have been brought to India by a > trader from Yemen? > > Rich Salomon > > On 10/31/2015 9:23 AM, Piotr Balcerowicz wrote: >> Dear Colleagues, >> Thank you so much for your feedback. >> I should provide some additional explanation concerning the copper plate: >> A few days back I happened to be a witness to a transaction when a villager from the vicinity of Peshawar contacted a local antique dealer and sold him the copper plate (for approx. 20 USD). The villager did not reveal where he found the copper plate but from what I understood the place is somewhere between Peshawar and Swat. >> Being a witness and knowing that the copper plate will sooner or later circulate in the black market and may never be available to researcher, I asked them to provide me with a photograph of it. All the means that the plate couldn?t have been published anywhere before because it seems to be the new found (discovered about a month ago or so) as a result of rampant illegal excavations in the Af-Pak region. I cannot say where the copper plate is now. It is indeed quite surprising to learn that the copper plate originated from Yemen and reached the areas near Peshawar. Knowing that the villager brought the plate to the dealer, it is unlikely that it transpired in Pakistan as a result of modern illegal antique trade. >> My intention to circulate the photo via Indology List was to make it available to researchers: since we cannot have the material object any more, at least there is the photograph of it. >> Best regards, >> Piotr Balcerowicz >> -------------------------------- >> www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz >> From : Richard Salomon >> Subject : [INDOLOGY] Fwd: Re: copper plate >> To : indology at list.indology.info, Michael Macdonald , mcskin at u.washington.edu, Jason Neelis , Robin Dushman , Norbert Nebes >> >> Fri, 30 Oct, 2015 20:01 >> >> Here is some authoritative information about the copper plate (reportedly) from Peshawar, provided by Professor Dr Norbert Nebes of the University of Jena, forwarded by M. Macdonald of Oxford: >> >> "As far as I am aware the fragment of the bronze plaque is unknown and has not been published yet. It comes from the sanctuary QDMN of Ta'lab Riyam which is situated in Damhan, the ancient name of the present day al-Huqqa in the northern highlands of Yemen (about 20 km in the north of Sanaa). Without any doubt, it is a votive text probably dedicated by a female person. The text (Middle Sabaic, from the early centuries AD) also contains two or three interesting words." >> >> [Prof. Nebes wishes it to be noted that "the information is not intended for the art market resp. for persons who are involved in this metier (in any way)."] >> >> So my previous guess about the dating was way off -- please disregard it. The correct date proposed by Prof. Nebes, i.e. "the early centuries AD," makes a little more sense, in that this is the period when Peshawar (ancient Purusapura) was something of a metropolis. But it is still very surprising that this object from such a remote location should be found there. Of course it is possible that it was brought to Pakistan in modern times, but this seems hardly likely. If this really is what it seems, it might be somehow be a by-product of the widespread international sea and land trade between India and the west in the period concerned. >> >> Rich Salomon >> >> >> >> -------- Forwarded Message -------- >> Subject: [INDOLOGY] copper plate >> Date: Thu, 29 Oct 2015 13:48:45 +0100 (CET) >> From: Piotr Balcerowicz >> To: indology at list.indology.info >> >> >> Dear Colleagues, >> Attached is a photograph of a copper plate found near Peshawar. Exact location of the fund is unknown. I thought this might be of some interested to some of you. If anyone can say more about the contents of the copper plate and its possible date, it???ll be appreciated. >> Regards, >> Piotr Balcerowicz >> -------------------------------- >> www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz >> > > -- > ---------------------- > > Richard Salomon > Department of Asian Languages and Literature > University of Washington, Box 353521 > Seattle WA 98195-3521 > USA > > From drdhaval2785 at gmail.com Fri Nov 6 01:03:55 2015 From: drdhaval2785 at gmail.com (dhaval patel) Date: Fri, 06 Nov 15 06:33:55 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Database of manuscripts digitized by National Manuscript Mission In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear friends, Sorry for cross posting. I am attaching herewith a complete database of manuscripts digitized by http://namami.org/, which I received from them after a year long legal issue. I am thankful to National Manuscript for Manuscript to have provided this valuable data. Dropbox link - https://www.dropbox.com/s/9g703gcxqdl0vc5/Namami_Digitization.xlsx?dl=0. Total Manuscripts digitized - 2,10,573 Total Manuscript repositories - 51 Notes - 1. Each record has the following fields Sr. No. ManusID Acc. No. Title Number of pages Script Repo Code Notes 2. Repository codes are placed in 'Abbrv' worksheet of the same file. 3. Because of different transliteration conventions used in base files, the transliteration is not uniform -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jpo at uts.cc.utexas.edu Fri Nov 6 02:00:59 2015 From: jpo at uts.cc.utexas.edu (Patrick Olivelle) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 20:00:59 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Database of manuscripts digitized by National Manuscript Mission In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5134D365-924D-4AD3-A53B-7B8A97B4CBCC@uts.cc.utexas.edu> Thank you so much for this very important database. You have done a great service. Now if we can only obtain actual manuscripts from NAMAMI we would be in a perfect world, like the Nepali manuscripts from the central archive. Thanks again. Patrick On Nov 5, 2015, at 7:03 PM, dhaval patel wrote: > Dear friends, > Sorry for cross posting. > > I am attaching herewith a complete database of manuscripts digitized by http://namami.org/, which I received from them after a year long legal issue. > I am thankful to National Manuscript for Manuscript to have provided this valuable data. > > Dropbox link - https://www.dropbox.com/s/9g703gcxqdl0vc5/Namami_Digitization.xlsx?dl=0. > > Total Manuscripts digitized - 2,10,573 > > Total Manuscript repositories - 51 > > Notes - > 1. Each record has the following fields > Sr. No. ManusID Acc. No. Title Number of pages Script Repo Code Notes > > 2. Repository codes are placed in 'Abbrv' worksheet of the same file. > > 3. Because of different transliteration conventions used in base files, the transliteration is not uniform > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From yogacara at gmail.com Fri Nov 6 02:42:00 2015 From: yogacara at gmail.com (Dan Lusthaus) Date: Thu, 05 Nov 15 21:42:00 -0500 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_G=C5=AB=E1=B8=8D=C4=81rthad=C4=ABpik=C4=81?= In-Reply-To: <5622B5FA1B14F3439A3ABC85C5A09EA823C03D81@EX-1-MB1.lancs.local> Message-ID: <8A479AD8E797485E8D1B134A8110C517@Dan> Dear Ram, Gretil has an e-version that includes Madhus?dana's comm. along with 3 others (though Madhus?dana is not included in the first chapter), http://gretil.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gret_utf.htm#BhG archive.org has a version that can be downloaded in various formats that includes includes several BG comms. https://archive.org/details/SrimadBhagavadGita.With.the.Commentaries Srimad-Bhagavad-Gita with 8 Sanskrit Commentaries by Advaita Teachers - Edited By Wasudev Laxman Shastri Pansikar by Sankaracharya, Anandagiri, Nilakathi, Dhanapati, Sridhara, Abhanavgupta, Madhusudana Sarasvati, Dharmadatta, Wasudev Laxman Shastri Published 1936 best, Dan Could someone please point me to an electronic version of Madhus?dana?s commentary on the G?t?? Thank you. Ram Chakravarthi Ram-Prasad Professor of Comparative Religion and Philosophy Lancaster University -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From shrivara at gmail.com Fri Nov 6 02:55:37 2015 From: shrivara at gmail.com (Shrininivasa Varakhedi) Date: Fri, 06 Nov 15 08:25:37 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Texts with different topics by one author In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear All, Many names?many authors were versatile. Annambhatta (16th CE) vachaspati Mishra Raghavendra Yati (16th CE) Vijayaeendra Tirtha (15th CE) Abhinavagupta Krishnavadhuta Pandita (19th CE) mallinatha Bellankonda Ramaraya kavi Shriharsha Many of them authored works in one or two disciplines but involving many disciplines like Nyaya, Vyakarana, Vedanta, meemamsa etc. For example - Sudarshana suri Jayatirtha (14th CE) Vyasatirtha (15th CE) Madhusudana Saraswati (15th CE) The authors participating in the series of dialectics of Nyayamrita-Advaitasiddhi are not only well-versed in many disciplines like Nyaya, Vyakarana, Meemamsa and Vedanta, but employed them in the dialectic works authored by them. Likewise, the Nyaya and Vyakarana works on Semantics like Vyutpattivada, Vaiyakarana Bhushana Sara, Manjusha etc., require a good acquaintance of many disciplines. Stalwarts like Adi Shankara, Udayana, Jayanta Bhatta, Madhva, Jagannatha Pandita were not just limited to their domain. with best regards shrinivasa varakhedi Professor and Dean - Shastra Faculty Karnataka Sanskrit University Bangalore 18 www.ksu.ac.in > On 05-Nov-2015, at 10:12 pm, David Mellins wrote: > > Also G?g?bha??a (Vi?ve?vara). > > David > > On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 9:31 AM, Aleksandar Uskokov > wrote: > Jiva Gosvamin and Baladeva Vidyabhusana among the Gaudiyas. > > Vedantadesika. > > Perhaps Sriharsa? > > Kind regards > Aleksandar > > On Nov 5, 2015 8:27 AM, > wrote: > Dear list members, > > I am looking for Sanskrit authors who have written about many (>=3) different topics or in many (>=3) different genres (e.g., poetry, narrative, philosophical, scientific, ...); alternatively for voluminous texts by one author that cover such different topics in separate chapters (i.e., the thematic strata should be easily separable). > > Further requirements: > 1) Authorship of their works should be consolidated in Indological research. > 2) Texts should not be too short. > 3) Texts should not be collections of former works or of citations only, but "really" be written by these authors. > 4) The older, the better! > 5) Texts should be edited or - even better - already digitized. > > The first (and actually only) author that came to my mind is Kshemendra. Do you have any other ideas? Any feedback is highly appreciated. > > Regards, Oliver > > --- Oliver Hellwig, University of D?sseldorf > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Fri Nov 6 07:39:10 2015 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Fri, 06 Nov 15 07:39:10 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Texts with different topics by one author In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B10788@xm-mbx-04-prod> Dear Oliver, A few other names come to mind: Jayantabhatta (who wrote the Nyaya treatise Nyayamanjari as well as the play Agamadambara); Jnanasrimisra (author of works of kavya as well as pramanasastra); Possibly Sankara, whose very diverse oeuvre may be difficult to assess owing to controversies about attribution (though this might make him an interesting test case for what you are doing). sorry about the missing diacritical marks best, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christian.haskett at centre.edu Fri Nov 6 13:27:54 2015 From: christian.haskett at centre.edu (Christian P. Haskett) Date: Fri, 06 Nov 15 13:27:54 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_G=C5=AB=E1=B8=8D=C4=81rthad=C4=ABpik=C4=81?= In-Reply-To: <5622B5FA1B14F3439A3ABC85C5A09EA823C03D81@EX-1-MB1.lancs.local> Message-ID: It looks like the G?t? Supersite, http://www.gitasupersite.iitk.ac.in/, has the commentary of Madhusudan Saraswati [sic], as well as several of those in the volume mentioned by Dan Lusthaus. The site also appears to have resolved some of the font display issues that plagued it in the past. best cpbh Christian Haskett Religion Program Centre College ________________________________________ From: INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info] on behalf of Ram-Prasad, Chakravarthi [c.ram-prasad at lancaster.ac.uk] Sent: Thursday, November 5, 2015 3:53 PM To: Indology ?[indology at list.indology.info]? Subject: [INDOLOGY] G???rthad?pik? Could someone please point me to an electronic version of Madhus?dana?s commentary on the G?t?? Thank you. Ram Chakravarthi Ram-Prasad Professor of Comparative Religion and Philosophy Lancaster University From m.gluckman at anu.edu.au Sat Nov 7 08:26:36 2015 From: m.gluckman at anu.edu.au (Martin Gluckman) Date: Sat, 07 Nov 15 13:56:36 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Contacts of Dr. N.V. Ramachandran Message-ID: Dearest Friends, I am looking for the up to date contacts for Dr. N.V. Ramachandran (he is working with the Asian Classics Input Project in Kerala). If anyone has his current contacts I would be most grateful to receive. Warmly, Martin Gluckman -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Sat Nov 7 16:49:41 2015 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Sat, 07 Nov 15 09:49:41 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] the paper of Gunilla Gren-Eklund In-Reply-To: <569641446634260@web2o.yandex.ru> Message-ID: On 4 November 2015 at 03:51, Viktoria Lysenko wrote: > d ?Prof. Gren-Eklund has now uploaded this paper to her page at Academia.edu , from where you can freely download it.? -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Sat Nov 7 17:04:26 2015 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Sat, 07 Nov 15 10:04:26 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Database of manuscripts digitized by National Manuscript Mission In-Reply-To: <5134D365-924D-4AD3-A53B-7B8A97B4CBCC@uts.cc.utexas.edu> Message-ID: When NAMAMI says "digitized" they don't mean "digitized". They mean, "for which a bibliographical record has been created in our database". I would love to be corrected, but to the best of my knowledge, NAMAMI does not have a MS digitizing program. Only IGNCA has been doing that. (And their database of the MSS they have photographed is separate.) NAMAMI's database is based on field-surveys of MS holdings in various parts of India. Their staff went out into villages and collected information on what people had. This information was recorded on paper forms and later typed into the computer at head office. These surveys have been considered as trials, not as a full-fledged program. Thus, the NAMAMI program is a bit like the old surveys of Rajendralal Mitra and Haraprasad Shastri, published in the *Notices* series. The MSS stayed in the villages, and the publications gave what we would today call metadata. Today, mostly, only the metadata survives. To get images of the MSS recorded by NAMAMI one has to communicate with the original owners of the MSS. My attempts to do this through agents and colleagues have in all cases drawn blanks. I have heard indirectly that NAMAMI field officers were paid per return, and that some officers returned more metadata sheets than appeared feasible given the hours that they worked. ? ? -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk Singhmar Chair in Ancient Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Sat Nov 7 17:19:36 2015 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Sat, 07 Nov 15 10:19:36 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Texts with different topics by one author In-Reply-To: Message-ID: V?caspati Mi?ra. ? ?Vopadeva.? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Sat Nov 7 17:56:27 2015 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Sat, 07 Nov 15 10:56:27 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fwd: [RISA-L LIST] AIIS language programs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: John Cort Date: 6 November 2015 at 09:27 Subject: [RISA-L LIST] AIIS language programs To: RISA Academic Discussion List If you have a student interested in pursuing the study of an Indian language, have them view the following: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hmh7Jv34j2w and then see the following for more information: http://www.indiastudies.org/language-programs/ -- John E. Cort Chair, Department of Religion Member, East Asian Studies, Environmental Studies, International Studies Committees Denison University Granville, OH 43023 740-587-6254 (o) cort at denison.edu _______________________________________________ RISA-L mailing list RISA-L at lists.sandiego.edu https://lists.sandiego.edu/mailman/listinfo/risa-l -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From e.demichelis at ymail.com Sun Nov 8 23:14:37 2015 From: e.demichelis at ymail.com (Elizabeth De Michelis) Date: Sun, 08 Nov 15 23:14:37 +0000 Subject: Fw: [RISA-L LIST] IAST and the Gayatri Mantra In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1631321238.2650876.1447024477574.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> Thought the reference to the utexas LRC (including RV) mentioned on RISA-L could be of interest to some on the Indology list.All the bestE De Michelis(Independent scholar, Italy) On Thursday, 5 November 2015, 18:57, Adheesh Sathaye wrote: Dear Ketan, 3.062.10a? ? t?t savit?r v?re?iyam 3.062.10b? ? bh?rgo dev?sya dh?mahi 3.062.10c? ? dh?yo y? na? pracod?y?t You can find this and other IAST version of the metrically restored RV at: http://www.utexas.edu/cola/centers/lrc/RV/ All best wishes, Adheesh ? Dr. Adheesh Sathaye Dept. of Asian Studies University of British Columbia 408-1871 West Mall Vancouver BC CANADA V6T1Z2 adheesh at mail.ubc.ca +1. 604.822.5188 > On Nov 5, 2015, at 08:04, Alder, Katan wrote: > > Dear RISA, > > Can anyone provide a IAST of the Savitri verse (popularly known as the Gayatri Mantra) in the ?g Veda 3.62.10, or a source where this can be found? > > Many thanks in advance > > Ketan > > > Dr Ketan Alder > Lecturer in Politics and Religions > Dept of Politics, Philosophy and Religion > B15. County South > Lancaster University > k.alder at lancs.ac.uk > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Sun Nov 8 23:33:19 2015 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Sun, 08 Nov 15 16:33:19 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Database of manuscripts digitized by National Manuscript Mission In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I stand corrected! Dr Patel has informed me that his list is indeed of actually digitized manuscripts. The procedure that he reports for seeing these images is, And ... the reply which I got for accessing the MSS says 1. Get consent of the concerned repository first. 2. Pay Rs 25 per page for gettig digitized images to NAMAMI 3. They supply the image. My sincere apologies to all for my misleading statement. I was last at NAMAMI in 2011, and nobody mentioned digitization, but there was a lot of discussion about the online database. Dominik -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com Mon Nov 9 00:24:31 2015 From: hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com (Harry Spier) Date: Sun, 08 Nov 15 19:24:31 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fw: [RISA-L LIST] IAST and the Gayatri Mantra In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Adeesh Sataye wrote: Dear Ketan, 3.062.10a t?t savit?r v?re?iyam 3.062.10b bh?rgo dev?sya dh?mahi 3.062.10c dh?yo y? na? pracod?y?t You can find this and other IAST version of the metrically restored RV at: http://www.utexas.edu/cola/centers/lrc/RV/ This is the form of the original Gayatri mantra from the Rg Veda but later gayatri mantras follow a different form. . . . . . . . . . . .vidmahe . . . . . . . . . .. dhimahI tan na? X pracoday?t 1) Are the Gayatri mantras from the Taittir?ya ?ra?yaka book 10 (Mah?n?r?ya?a Upani?ad) the earliest Gayatri mantras in this later form.? Given the sacredness afforded to the Gayatri mantra from the Rg Veda, does any of the Sanskrit literature say anything about why the later Gayatri mantras follow this different form? Thanks, Harry Spier -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dipak.d2004 at gmail.com Mon Nov 9 04:57:14 2015 From: dipak.d2004 at gmail.com (Dipak Bhattacharya) Date: Mon, 09 Nov 15 10:27:14 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fw: [RISA-L LIST] IAST and the Gayatri Mantra In-Reply-To: Message-ID: It will be, at least, unusual to suppose that the Rigvedic form of the verse is later. The TA is a much later text. Among others the disyllabic reading of *ya* as *iya* or *ia* was not adopted in writing tho the parctice of disyllabic reading was never forsaken. But, if we take Panini as the authority, this is metrical ie not grammatical. Sorry for long lecture. Best wishes Dipak Bhattacharya On Mon, Nov 9, 2015 at 5:54 AM, Harry Spier wrote: > Adeesh Sataye wrote: > > > Dear Ketan, > > 3.062.10a t?t savit?r v?re?iyam > 3.062.10b bh?rgo dev?sya dh?mahi > 3.062.10c dh?yo y? na? pracod?y?t > > You can find this and other IAST version of the metrically restored RV at: > http://www.utexas.edu/cola/centers/lrc/RV/ > > > > This is the form of the original Gayatri mantra from the Rg Veda but later > gayatri mantras follow a different form. > > . . . . . . . . . . .vidmahe > > . . . . . . . . . .. dhimahI > > tan na? X pracoday?t > > 1) Are the Gayatri mantras from the Taittir?ya ?ra?yaka book 10 > (Mah?n?r?ya?a Upani?ad) the earliest Gayatri mantras in this later form.? > > Given the sacredness afforded to the Gayatri mantra from the Rg Veda, does > any of the Sanskrit literature say anything about why the later Gayatri > mantras follow this different form? > > Thanks, > > Harry Spier > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From audrey.truschke at gmail.com Mon Nov 9 04:59:05 2015 From: audrey.truschke at gmail.com (Audrey Truschke) Date: Sun, 08 Nov 15 20:59:05 -0800 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Article_on_Thanjavur_Maharaja_Serfoji=E2=80=99s_Sarasvati_Mahal_Library?= Message-ID: By way of Ananya Vajpeyi: http://www.thehindu.com/features/magazine/pradeep-chakravarthy-on-the-sarasvati-mahal-library/article7854775.ece Audrey Truschke Mellon Postdoctoral Fellow Department of Religious Studies Stanford University e- mail | website -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dipak.d2004 at gmail.com Mon Nov 9 05:08:43 2015 From: dipak.d2004 at gmail.com (Dipak Bhattacharya) Date: Mon, 09 Nov 15 10:38:43 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fw: [RISA-L LIST] IAST and the Gayatri Mantra In-Reply-To: Message-ID: In continuation -- take note of the deities in the TA verses. New cults developed, the TA changed accordingly. DB On Mon, Nov 9, 2015 at 10:27 AM, Dipak Bhattacharya wrote: > It will be, at least, unusual to suppose that the Rigvedic form of the > verse is later. The TA is a much later text. Among others the disyllabic > reading of *ya* as *iya* or *ia* was not adopted in writing tho the > parctice of disyllabic reading was never forsaken. But, if we take Panini > as the authority, this is metrical ie not grammatical. > Sorry for long lecture. > Best wishes > Dipak Bhattacharya > > On Mon, Nov 9, 2015 at 5:54 AM, Harry Spier > wrote: > >> Adeesh Sataye wrote: >> >> >> Dear Ketan, >> >> 3.062.10a t?t savit?r v?re?iyam >> 3.062.10b bh?rgo dev?sya dh?mahi >> 3.062.10c dh?yo y? na? pracod?y?t >> >> You can find this and other IAST version of the metrically restored RV >> at: >> http://www.utexas.edu/cola/centers/lrc/RV/ >> >> >> >> This is the form of the original Gayatri mantra from the Rg Veda but >> later gayatri mantras follow a different form. >> >> . . . . . . . . . . .vidmahe >> >> . . . . . . . . . .. dhimahI >> >> tan na? X pracoday?t >> >> 1) Are the Gayatri mantras from the Taittir?ya ?ra?yaka book 10 >> (Mah?n?r?ya?a Upani?ad) the earliest Gayatri mantras in this later form.? >> >> Given the sacredness afforded to the Gayatri mantra from the Rg Veda, >> does any of the Sanskrit literature say anything about why the later >> Gayatri mantras follow this different form? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Harry Spier >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From davidpaolo.pierdominicileao at uniroma1.it Mon Nov 9 09:07:34 2015 From: davidpaolo.pierdominicileao at uniroma1.it (David Pierdominici) Date: Mon, 09 Nov 15 10:07:34 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] PDF scan copy Message-ID: Dear colleagues, I am looking for a PDF scan copy of ?Annual Report on Indian Epigraphy ( 1911-1914 )?. Does anyone have it? Many thanks. Warm regards, DP David Pierdominici PhD candidate Sapienza Universit? di Roma From joerg.gengnagel at urz.uni-heidelberg.de Mon Nov 9 11:15:27 2015 From: joerg.gengnagel at urz.uni-heidelberg.de (Joerg Gengnagel) Date: Mon, 09 Nov 15 12:15:27 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Axel Michaels receives Lautenschlaeger Research Prize Message-ID: <5640804F.9040708@urz.uni-heidelberg.de> Dear Colleagues, it is my great pleasure to inform you that Axel Michaels receives the Lautenschlaeger Research Prize 2015, the most highly endowed research prize from a private sponsor in Germany. The ceremony will be held on 4th December at Heidelberg University. For more information please see the following link: http://www.asia-europe.uni-heidelberg.de/en/newsevents/news/detail/m/axel-michaels-receives-lautenschlaeger-research-prize.html (Please note the link to Axel Michaels' recently published book "Homo Ritualis. Hindu Ritual and Its Significance for Ritual Theory. New York/Oxford: Oxford University Press, 2016. - 400 p. ($ 39.95)") Regards, Joerg Gengnagel -- apl. Prof. Dr. J?rg Gengnagel South Asia Institute Department of Cultural and Religious History of South Asia (Classical Indology) Im Neuenheimer Feld 330 D-69120 Heidelberg phone: +49(0)6221/54-8906 fax: +49(0)6221/54-8841 http://www.sai.uni-heidelberg.de/abt/IND/mitarbeiter/gengnagel/gengnagel.php From joerg.gengnagel at urz.uni-heidelberg.de Mon Nov 9 11:22:59 2015 From: joerg.gengnagel at urz.uni-heidelberg.de (Joerg Gengnagel) Date: Mon, 09 Nov 15 12:22:59 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Axel Michaels receives Lautenschlaeger Research Prize Message-ID: <56408213.4050108@urz.uni-heidelberg.de> Dear Colleagues, it is my great pleasure to inform you that Axel Michaels receives the Lautenschlaeger Research Prize 2015, the most highly endowed research prize from a private sponsor in Germany. The ceremony will be held on 4th December at Heidelberg University. For more information please see the following link: http://www.asia-europe.uni-heidelberg.de/en/newsevents/news/detail/m/axel-michaels-receives-lautenschlaeger-research-prize.html Please note the link to Axel Michaels' recently published book "Homo Ritualis. Hindu Ritual and Its Significance for Ritual Theory. New York/Oxford: Oxford University Press, 2016. - 400 p. ($ 39.95)" Regards, Joerg Gengnagel -- apl. Prof. Dr. J?rg Gengnagel South Asia Institute Department of Cultural and Religious History of South Asia (Classical Indology) Im Neuenheimer Feld 330 D-69120 Heidelberg phone: +49(0)6221/54-8906 fax: +49(0)6221/54-8841 http://www.sai.uni-heidelberg.de/abt/IND/mitarbeiter/gengnagel/gengnagel.php From jacob at fabularasa.dk Mon Nov 9 14:36:36 2015 From: jacob at fabularasa.dk (jacob at fabularasa.dk) Date: Mon, 09 Nov 15 15:36:36 +0100 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_S=C4=81=E1=B9=83khya_&_72?= Message-ID: <9cf053fe79c3230f9a29ccf268bcd2d8@fabularasa.dk> Dear list, I am trying to determine the possible rationale behind expressing s??khya-based philosophical tenets on 72-square (8x9) j??na caupa?a (snakes and ladders) boards. I have noticed that the S??khyak?rik? as well as the expositions on s??khya in the Bhagavadg?t? (chapter 2) and the Bh?gavatapur??a (3.26) all consist of 72 verses. I have considered the explanation that 24 tattvas times 3 gu?as equals 72, but I would be curious to know if you are aware of any other explanations linking s??khya and its exposition with the number 72. Regards, Jacob Jacob Schmidt-Madsen PhD Student (Indology) Department of Cross-Cultural and Regional Studies University of Copenhagen Denmark From hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com Tue Nov 10 00:50:29 2015 From: hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com (Harry Spier) Date: Mon, 09 Nov 15 19:50:29 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fw: [RISA-L LIST] IAST and the Gayatri Mantra In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thank you Dipak, I wasn't suggesting that the RgVeda gayatri was later than the Taittiriya Aranyaka gayatris. What I was trying to ask was 1)if the Taittiriya Aranyaka gayatris were the earliest gayatris after the RgVeda gayatri 2Since the RgVeda gayatri became such a sacred mantra, the later gayatris didn't follow its form but followed the form of the Taittiriya Aranyaka gayatris. I.e. .....vidmahe ....dhimahI tan naH pracodayAt Thanks, Harry On Sun, Nov 8, 2015 at 11:57 PM, Dipak Bhattacharya wrote: > It will be, at least, unusual to suppose that the Rigvedic form of the > verse is later. The TA is a much later text. Among others the disyllabic > reading of *ya* as *iya* or *ia* was not adopted in writing tho the > parctice of disyllabic reading was never forsaken. But, if we take Panini > as the authority, this is metrical ie not grammatical. > Sorry for long lecture. > Best wishes > Dipak Bhattacharya > > On Mon, Nov 9, 2015 at 5:54 AM, Harry Spier > wrote: > >> Adeesh Sataye wrote: >> >> >> Dear Ketan, >> >> 3.062.10a t?t savit?r v?re?iyam >> 3.062.10b bh?rgo dev?sya dh?mahi >> 3.062.10c dh?yo y? na? pracod?y?t >> >> You can find this and other IAST version of the metrically restored RV >> at: >> http://www.utexas.edu/cola/centers/lrc/RV/ >> >> >> >> This is the form of the original Gayatri mantra from the Rg Veda but >> later gayatri mantras follow a different form. >> >> . . . . . . . . . . .vidmahe >> >> . . . . . . . . . .. dhimahI >> >> tan na? X pracoday?t >> >> 1) Are the Gayatri mantras from the Taittir?ya ?ra?yaka book 10 >> (Mah?n?r?ya?a Upani?ad) the earliest Gayatri mantras in this later form.? >> >> Given the sacredness afforded to the Gayatri mantra from the Rg Veda, >> does any of the Sanskrit literature say anything about why the later >> Gayatri mantras follow this different form? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Harry Spier >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com Tue Nov 10 02:50:29 2015 From: hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com (Harry Spier) Date: Mon, 09 Nov 15 21:50:29 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fw: [RISA-L LIST] IAST and the Gayatri Mantra In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I'm having finger trouble today. I meant to ask since the Gayatri mantra from the Rg Veda, became so sacred I would have thought later gayatri mantras would have followed its form, but they didn't, they followed the form of the later gayatri mantras from the Taittiriya Aranyaka. .... vidmahe ....dhimahI ....pracodayAt Does any of the Sanskrit literature discuss this? Thanks, Harry Spier >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Tue Nov 10 02:56:33 2015 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Mon, 09 Nov 15 19:56:33 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] An Ancient Jain Tale for the Historians at ICHR [feedly] Message-ID: ---- *An Ancient Jain Tale for the Historians at ICHR* // *The Wire* *Some essential wisdom on the danger of taking scripture too literally* Jain manuscript cover, Western India, 19th century. Credit: Victoria and Albert Museum, London. *For us, the Ramayana and the Mahabharata are true accounts of the periods in which they were written ?* *Sudershan Rao, chairman of the Indian Council of Historical Research. * Once upon a time, the garden known as Jeern Udyan (the tumbledown garden) in the city of Ujaiyini , used to be a great meeting place for conmen. Their most famous leaders were four: Shash, Ailashadh, Muldev and a beautiful maiden, Khandpana. On a sultry day, they sat around telling tales and feeling more and more hungry. A question arose, who shall foot the bill for their meal? Muldev asked the crowd, do you all believe in the historical veracity of our scriptures? Every one said yes. So, said Muldev, let each of us recount a most fantastical tale or an episode to you. If we as tale tellers can prove that the tale is true, no matter how fantastical, on the basis of the Vedas or the two epics of Ramayana and Mahabharata, we get a free meal. Are we agreed? Yes, said the crowd. So the tale telling began. *The Tale of Ailashadh* ?One day, as I was going to graze my cows in the forest, I saw a band of dacoits at a distance. I took off my blanket, wrapped my cows in it and carried them bundled upon my back to my village. As I reached, I saw some young cowherds playing and villagers idling under a tree. I asked them to help me unwrap and usher the cows in. While we were busy doing that, the dacoits again arrived on the scene rattling their sabres and yelling. All of us then quickly entered a cucumber. A little later, a goat ate up the cucumber, but while she was still swallowing it, a python swallowed her. The python in turn was gobbled up by a crane. The crane then flew up and sat upon a tree with one leg dangling. A king and his army were resting under the tree and the king?s elephant got entangled in the crane?s leg. The crane flew up in the sky with the elephant. At this, the mahouts raised a din. Finally the crane was shot dead by the king?s archers and the elephant was retrieved. ?When the crane?s abdomen was opened, out came the python who regurgitated the goat, who regurgitated me, all my cows and the cowherds. I took my cows home, and so did the cowherds and fellow villagers.? Prove this to be true, said the crowd. ?Sure,? said the conmen. ?See, the scriptures say in the beginning was a golden egg swimming in primordial waters and this earth, its forests and living creatures are all said to have been contained within one egg that lay within the stomach of Lord Vishnu, who as Krishna was within his mother Devaki?s womb while Devaki was confined to her bed within a tiny cell in a jail. How can you as believers question this tale?? *The Tale of Shash* Lesyas depicted in Folio from Samghanayanarayna loose leaf manuscript (17th century) from Gujarat or Rajasthan. Credit: Wikimedia Commons ?One early winter month, I went to my father?s fields to clear the weeds. I saw that the sesame plants had grown so large that I had to chop them down with an axe. Suddenly, a wild elephant began chasing me so I climbed up a sesame tree. The angry elephant began going round the tree shaking it now and then with his trunk as sesame seeds rained all around. Finally the seeds, crushed by the elephant?s feet, produced a river of oil in which the elephant was swept away and killed. I got off the tree, skinned the elephant, stitched a skin bag and filled it with the sesame seed oil. By now I was hungry so I made a meal of dry husks and washed them down with ten large pots of oil. I brought my skin bag of oil to my village and hung it upon a tree. I later sent my son to fetch it and he could not see it so he plucked the entire tree and brought it to me. Tired after all this, I arrived here. Now tell me if you all believe my tale.? Even before the crowd could express its doubts, Shash?s companions began to explain. ?See, our epics describe many occasions when elephant herds came marching out of forests and the liquid (mud) oozing out of their foreheads created rivers that swept off whole armies, horses and chariots and all. As for the sesame trees, the epics say that in Pataliputra (Patna), large trumpets can rest on sesame shrubs. ?So if you are all believers, you must agree our friend here was not lying.? Who could say he was a non-believer? *The Tale of Muldev* ?I once wished to hold the holy river Ganges on my head. Carrying my water pot (*kamandal*) and my umbrella, I left for my master?s place. On the way, a mad elephant began chasing me. I quickly entered my water pot through its long snout, but the rogue elephant also entered it and tormented me for six months. Finally I emerged out of my *kamandal* on the banks of the vast river Ganges, followed by the elephant. But luckily for me, this time, his tail got stuck in the spout. ?Before the elephant came loose, I crossed the river in one leap and arrived at my master?s. There for six months I held the river Ganges on my head without eating or drinking. I bowed to Lord Kartikeya and left finally for Ujjayini and now I sit among you all.? Once again, the conmen proved the veracity of this tale on the basis of scriptural wisdom. ?See,? they said, ?the scriptures say that all the four castes came out of Lord Brahma?s body. If that is so, it is entirely believable that a man and an elephant should be contained within one *kamandal*. As for the elephant?s tale getting stuck, the scriptures also say how after Brahma sitting on a lotus emerged out of Lord Vishnu?s stomach, the root of the lotus remained stuck in Vishnu?s navel. No? And in the Ramayana, Hanuman said that he managed to cross a whole sea with his Lord?s blessings (*prabhu kripa*). Now we come to the point where our friend held the river Ganges in his matted locks for six months. It is hard but not impossible. The scriptures say Lord Shiva held them for thousands of years. No?? Now it was the turn of the beautiful conwoman Khandpana. Khandpana, as was her wont, deviated from the script. She said, ?If you all will bow to me with folded hands and touch your foreheads to the ground, I am personally willing to serve you all a free meal.? The con men were amused. ?Oh you little woman,? they said. ?We are worldly con men. Why should we act humble and bow to you, a mere con woman?? Khandpana smiled and began her tale. *Khandpana?s Tale* Detail from one of a pair of Jain Manuscripts (Patli), early 12th century Gujarat. Credit: Metropolitan Museum of Art, New York. ?I was born the daughter of the king?s washerman. Once my father and I, accompanied by a thousand of our servants, went to the river front with our buffalo cart to wash and dry the royal linen upon the banks of the river. After we had hung the washing to dry in the sun, a sudden gust of wind swept all the clothes away. Seeing that and fearing the royal wrath, our servants also ran off. I was desperate but father was nowhere to be seen. So I turned myself into a chameleon and ran into a forest to hide. There I became a vine and stayed against a mango tree for some time. One day, I heard the drummers announcing a royal pardon for our family, so I returned to find my father. Father and I together began looking for our cart. Finally we found that the dogs and jackals had eaten up everything including perhaps the washing lines. A little further, father found our buffalo?s tail all wrapped up in yards and yards of all the missing ropes. ?Now tell me can you still quote scriptures to prove my tale to be true? If not, I demand a free meal.? The conmen thought for a while, and then said oh yes, we can. ?See, if, as the scriptures say, even Lord Brahma and Vishnu could not find the end of Shiva?s Lingam, our sister?s tale might well be true. As for the buffalo?s tail and the yards and yards of rope, think of Hanuman?s tail. You know how the demon king of Lanka, Ravana tried to set fire to it, but the ghee, the oil and the cloth all ran out, since Hanuman?s tail had grown enormous due to the Lord?s grace (*prabhu kripa*). ?And the Mahabharata is also full of wondrous stories about princes and kings transforming themselves like Arjuna into another creature, or even coming back to life like Subhadra?s murdered foetus. So we can believe how you may have become first a chameleon, then a vine and then back to being a young girl. No?? Khandpana laughed aloud. ?You haven?t heard it all yet, sirs. I told you how those royal clothes had flown away in the wind and with that our servants too had run away. Well, I am still looking. And I have reason to believe you are the missing servants and not just that, you are all dressed in stolen royal robes. ?Now if I am right, you have to come live with me and be my servants. If not, get me a free meal!? The three conmen bowed deeply to Khandpana Devi and declared her to be their guru. After this, Khandpana treated them all to a royal repast and earned much approbation from the royal quarters. *(Sourced from *Do Hazar Saal Purani Kahaniyan*, translated from the * Apbhramsha*, and compiled by Dr Jagdish Chandra Jain, Bharatiya Gyanpeeth)* ---- Shared via *my feedly reader* -- Sent from Dominik Wujastyk's Android phone -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dipak.d2004 at gmail.com Tue Nov 10 07:40:34 2015 From: dipak.d2004 at gmail.com (Dipak Bhattacharya) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 15 13:10:34 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fw: [RISA-L LIST] IAST and the Gayatri Mantra In-Reply-To: Message-ID: 10 11 2015 Two later features may be noted In the daily prayers the G?yatr? is muttered as it is in the ?gveda. The citation betrays sectarian need. Many cults developed later. But modified use of the G?yatr? did not take place widely so that any generalization may be misleading. The ?gvedic G?yatr? is overwhelmingly more in use. Best DB On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 8:20 AM, Harry Spier wrote: > I'm having finger trouble today. I meant to ask since the Gayatri mantra > from the Rg Veda, became so sacred I would have thought later gayatri > mantras would have followed its form, but they didn't, they followed the > form of the later gayatri mantras from the Taittiriya Aranyaka. > .... vidmahe > ....dhimahI > ....pracodayAt > > Does any of the Sanskrit literature discuss this? > > Thanks, > > Harry Spier > > > > >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >>> committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options >>> or unsubscribe) >>> >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nagarajpaturi at gmail.com Tue Nov 10 17:55:45 2015 From: nagarajpaturi at gmail.com (Nagaraj Paturi) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 15 23:25:45 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fw: [RISA-L LIST] IAST and the Gayatri Mantra Message-ID: The RV one is called Gayatri Mantra. The .....vidmahe ....dhimahI tan naH pracodayAt type are called various Gayatris not Gayatri mantras. For example, if the tan nah ............ prachodayat reads as tan nah vishNuh prachodayat it is called VishNu gayatri. Gayatri Mantra and these Gayatris of the formula .....vidmahe ....dhimahI tan naH pracodayAt do not belong to the same category. Gayatri mantra is a full , unique, single mantra. Where as the Gayatris is a formula that can be used to generate several Gayatris that are never used/executed the way Gayatri Mantra is executed. -- Nagaraj Paturi Hyderabad, Telangana, INDIA. Former Senior Professor of Cultural Studies FLAME School of Communication and FLAME School of Liberal Education, (Pune, Maharashtra, INDIA ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Tue Nov 10 22:23:59 2015 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Tue, 10 Nov 15 15:23:59 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Call For Papers - Eighth Joint Meeting of the BSHS, CSHPS, and HSS, 22-25 June 2016, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada Message-ID: The eighth joint meeting of the British Society for the History of Science, the Canadian Society for the History and Philosophy of Science, and the History of Science Society will take place in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada. Previous successful meetings were in Philadelphia (2012), Oxford (2008), Halifax, Nova Scotia (2004), St Louis (2000), Edinburgh (1996), Toronto (1992), and Manchester (1988). The theme of the meeting will be ?Transitions.? Although presenters are not confined to this theme, the Program Committee is seeking papers or sessions that reflect this theme and encourages participants to consider the broader scientific, scholarly and social implications associated with moments of scientific transition. Transitions might include such ideas as moving from one scientific meme to another, one locality to another or generational change. The programme will include themed sessions, plenary lectures and panels. A typical presentation will be 20 minutes plus 10 minutes for questions, but special sessions such as round tables and panels will be accommodated. The conference will take place at the University of Alberta. Founded in 1905, U of A is located in Edmonton, Canada?s most northern major city. Edmonton is known as the ?Gateway to the North? and is the capital of the province. It is a major economic and cultural hub, situated on the banks of the North Saskatchewan River. The conference will include education and outreach activities, a reception at the Art Gallery of Alberta and a Conference Dinner. Delegates can explore the vibrant arts scene, and there are many festivals in June, including the Edmonton International Jazz Festival. Accommodation will be available on campus and near campus. The Programme Committee welcomes proposals for sessions or individual papers based around the conference theme from researchers at all stages of their careers. Participation is in no way limited to members of the three organising societies, but there will be a discount for members. Intending participants should also note that the usual HSS rules concerning presenting at successive conferences do not apply to this meeting. The deadline for submitting a session or paper proposal is 4 December 2015. Full details of how to submit your session or abstract can be found at: www.uab.ca/3societies Enquiries concerning the program should be directed to: aede at ualberta.ca Enquiries concerning the conference should be directed to: threesocieties2016 at ualberta.ca -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From diwakar.acharya at bun.kyoto-u.ac.jp Wed Nov 11 07:13:12 2015 From: diwakar.acharya at bun.kyoto-u.ac.jp (Diwakar ACHARYA) Date: Wed, 11 Nov 15 16:13:12 +0900 Subject: [INDOLOGY] fixed term (5 years) Associate Professor Position at the Department of Indological Studies, Kyoto University In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1447225992251393.1342961919@mail04.iimc.kyoto-u.ac.jp> Dear Colleagues, Please note the following job advertisement for a position at Kyoto University. Please feel free to share this announcement with any interested potential candidates for the position. You could download the pdf-file of the announcement from the following address: http://www.kyoto-u.ac.jp/en/about/employment/other/employment-faculty.html I suggest that normally the would be candidates contact Prof. Yuko Yokochi, and in case of further inquiries they can contact me and Prof. Akihiko Akamatsu, too. best regards, Diwakar Acharya ********************* Dr. Diwakar N. Acharya Associate Professor Graduate School of Letters Kyoto University Yoshida Honmachi, Sakyo-ku Kyoto 606-8501, Japan Tel.: +81 75 753 2803 (office) ??????????????????? Program-Specific Foreign Language Associate Professor Position at the Department of Indological Studies, Graduate School of Letters / Faculty of Letters, Kyoto University October 22 2015 The Department of Indological Studies, Graduate School of Letters & Faculty of Letters, at Kyoto University invites applications for a post-doctoral teaching fellow position. The main duty of this position is teaching Sanskrit Grammar. All the classes should be held in English and the Japanese ability is not required. The longest term of employment is five years, which cannot be renewed, and one who can work more than three years is desirable. An academic year here consists of two terms: the first term from the beginning of April to the beginning of August and the second term from the beginning of October and the beginning of February. Teaching at this position is preferably to start from the second term of 2016. Qualifications 1.Excellent level of Sanskrit ability. 2.Fluency in English: not only to teach classes but also to instruct academic writing inEnglish, specifically dissertations and research papers, in Indology and related fields. 3.PhD degree is required in principle. 4.Preference will be given to the candidate who has the knowledge of Indo-Europeanlinguistics and/or some languages relevant to our field (Tamil, Pali, Prakrit, Hindi etc.) and the candidate who can teach German or French reading class in the field of Indology and Buddhology. 5.Japanese ability is not required. Employment Conditions 1.Working hours are 38 hours 45 minutes per week under a flexible-hours system. 2.Main duty is to teach six classes per week (one class takes one and half hour). Two ofthe six classes are allotted to the Sanskrit Grammar and at least one class to English for academic writing in Indology and related field (including doctoral theses). In addition to the six, one more class in basic education course may sometimes be required. 3.There is no duty in the administration of the Faculty and University. On the otherhand, active involvement in the department?s education programme and management will be expected. 4.A monthly salary of \750,000 shall be paid on a specified day each month. Taxes,insurance and other applicable deductions shall be deducted from this amount. The travel cost between the home country and Japan should be paid on one?s own. 5.Holidays with pay are 20 days per year. In addition, there are several Nationalholidays, New Year holidays (about a week) and Bon holidays (three days in the middle of August). 6.Eligible for MEXT* mutual aid association membership, employment insurance, andworkers? compensation insurance. *Japan?s Ministry of Education, Culture, Sports, Science and Technology 7.All allowances (commuting allowance, housing allowance, and dependency allowance)will not be paid. Applicants should submit the following documents to the contact address mentioned below by February 5, 2016 either by email or by airmail. References should be sent separately from the referents. 1.A cover letter stating your motivation for this position 2.A CV 3.A set of copies of representative publications 4.Two references (referents? signature is not required when their references are sent tothe contact person by email). Contact Address: Prof. Yuko Yokochi Head of the selection committee Email: yyokochi at bun.kyoto-u.ac.jp Department of Indological Studies, Graduate School of Letters, Kyoto University Yoshida Honmachi, Sakyo-ku, Kyoto 606-8501 JAPAN If there is any question, do not hesitate to get contact with us, please. You can also get contact with Prof. Diwakar Acharya for the information about the working condition of our department (diwakar.acharya at bun.kyoto-u.ac.jp). From psdmccartney at gmail.com Wed Nov 11 20:34:46 2015 From: psdmccartney at gmail.com (patrick mccartney) Date: Thu, 12 Nov 15 07:04:46 +1030 Subject: [INDOLOGY] cakra sadhana Message-ID: Dear Friends, I am looking for information regarding a particular Tantric practice. It involves building up a living internal image of the dev? within the practitioner's own body through visualising the chakras, their petals and the corresponding b?ja mantras. I don't really have much more to go on than this. If someone can point me towards some textual references that would be great. All the best, Patrick McCartney PhD Candidate School of Culture, History & Language College of the Asia-Pacific The Australian National University Canberra, Australia, 0200 Skype - psdmccartney Phone + Whatsapp: +61 414 954 748 - *https://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=241756978&trk=nav_responsive_tab_profile * - *https://anu-au.academia.edu/patrickmccartney * https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cy6lVABgjmg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LVqBD_2P4Pg http://youtu.be/y3XfjbwqC_g http://trinityroots.bandcamp.com/track/all-we-be -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From arlogriffiths at hotmail.com Thu Nov 12 04:42:08 2015 From: arlogriffiths at hotmail.com (Arlo Griffiths) Date: Thu, 12 Nov 15 04:42:08 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] research visa Message-ID: Dear colleagues, Allow me to pose a very practical question. From information online, it would seem that getting a research visa for India is now no longer as difficult as it was reputed to be in the past, as least not if one is seeking to obtain such a visa from France: http://www.vfsglobal.com/india/france/Research_Visa.html The documents to be furnished are not outlandish in quantity or nature: http://www.vfsglobal.com/india/france/pdf/F_OPS_CL-RESEARCH-EN_07.pdf Does anyone have actual experience with the procedure, and does anyone have any idea on how much involvement in the research project Indian immigration services need to see in the letter from the Indian sponsor ("An original letter written in English, confirming the applicant?s admission or invitation to an Indian Institution")? Thank you. Best wishes, Arlo Griffths ?cole fran?aise d'Extr?me-Orient, Paris Universit? Jean Moulin ? Lyon 3 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dipak.d2004 at gmail.com Thu Nov 12 12:22:13 2015 From: dipak.d2004 at gmail.com (Dipak Bhattacharya) Date: Thu, 12 Nov 15 17:52:13 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] cakra sadhana In-Reply-To: Message-ID: 12 11 15 The Buddhist parallel of this act has been described in many modern works. Snellgrove is well-known. Less known is Lama Anagarika Govinda, *Foundations* *of* *Tibetan* *Mysticism* London, 1959. The ??kta Tantric ritual will be found, among others, in the ??kt?nandatarangi?? by Brahm?nanda Giri, (ed. Panchanan Shastri,Calcutta 1942-43, in Bengali character and with Bengali translation ) Ch. 4. Giri closely follows the *??rad?tilakatantra*. Gopinath Kaviraj, *Bharatiya* *Sadhanar* *Dhara* (Bengali), Sanskrit College, Calcutta,1965 96ff gives interesting details without exact reference. But Kaviraj is entirely dependable. Best DB On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 2:04 AM, patrick mccartney wrote: > Dear Friends, > > I am looking for information regarding a particular Tantric practice. It > involves building up a living internal image of the dev? within the > practitioner's own body through visualising the chakras, their petals and > the corresponding b?ja mantras. > > I don't really have much more to go on than this. If someone can point me > towards some textual references that would be great. > > All the best, > > Patrick McCartney > > PhD Candidate > School of Culture, History & Language > College of the Asia-Pacific > The Australian National University > Canberra, Australia, 0200 > > > Skype - psdmccartney > Phone + Whatsapp: +61 414 954 748 > > > > - *https://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=241756978&trk=nav_responsive_tab_profile > * > - *https://anu-au.academia.edu/patrickmccartney > * > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cy6lVABgjmg > > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LVqBD_2P4Pg > > http://youtu.be/y3XfjbwqC_g > > http://trinityroots.bandcamp.com/track/all-we-be > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From josephine.brill at gmail.com Thu Nov 12 13:29:00 2015 From: josephine.brill at gmail.com (Jo Brill) Date: Thu, 12 Nov 15 07:29:00 -0600 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_paribh=C4=81=E1=B9=A3=C4=81s_in_dharma=C5=9B=C4=81stra=3F?= Message-ID: Greetings to all, namaskaromi -- Perhaps you know of secondary literature concerning the use of so-called paribh???s, or interpretive rules by any name, in dharma??stra particularly. Of course P. V. Kane has laid the ground in Chapter XXX of History of Dharma??stra, volume 5. I am also interested in explicit mentions of the word 'paribh???' in works of dharma??stra. I've already unearthed a few by searching the texts on GRETIL. I would be honored and delighted to receive your advice and suggestions. All the best, Jo -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Thu Nov 12 19:42:56 2015 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Thu, 12 Nov 15 12:42:56 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]=09paribh=C4=81=E1=B9=A3=C4=81s_in_dharma=C5=9B=C4=81stra=3F?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: It's not quite dead-centre to your query, Jo, but Julieta Rotaru has written valuable investigations about the use of paribh???s in the Kau?ikas?tra. Part I , Part II . Dominik *--Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and PolityDepartment of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada * -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From drdj at austin.utexas.edu Thu Nov 12 22:14:16 2015 From: drdj at austin.utexas.edu (Donald R Davis) Date: Thu, 12 Nov 15 22:14:16 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_paribh=C4=81=E1=B9=A3=C4=81s_in_dharma=C5=9B=C4=81stra=3F?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Jo, There is an interesting Dharma??stra use of paribh??? in connection with the viv?dapada called sa?vidvyatikrama. Several commentaries call the conventions of various local groups p?ribh??ikadharma and speak of settling complicated legal matters by resorting to this kind of dharma. I understand these to be local rules that fix the manner in which rules of ??stra will be applied or received in particular groups, and thence paribh???s. I wrote about this some time ago in JESHO 2005 (I?ll send you the article separately). Other, more familiar uses of paribh??? also occur when an author defines terms. For example, at Mit?k?ar? (Ydh) 1.366, Vij??ne?vara says the verse is a paribh??? of the author?s own treatise, defining the meaning of highest, middle, and lowest fines. The term occurs several other times in the Mit?k?ar?. Hope that gives you some more to go on. Best, Don Don Davis Dept of Asian Studies University of Texas at Austin From: INDOLOGY > on behalf of Jo Brill > Date: Thursday, November 12, 2015 at 7:29 AM To: "indology at list.indology.info" > Subject: [INDOLOGY] paribh???s in dharma??stra? Greetings to all, namaskaromi -- Perhaps you know of secondary literature concerning the use of so-called paribh???s, or interpretive rules by any name, in dharma??stra particularly. Of course P. V. Kane has laid the ground in Chapter XXX of History of Dharma??stra, volume 5. I am also interested in explicit mentions of the word 'paribh???' in works of dharma??stra. I've already unearthed a few by searching the texts on GRETIL. I would be honored and delighted to receive your advice and suggestions. All the best, Jo -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Thu Nov 12 23:43:56 2015 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Thu, 12 Nov 15 16:43:56 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]=09paribh=C4=81=E1=B9=A3=C4=81s_in_dharma=C5=9B=C4=81stra=3F?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Another area to think about is the "Tantra-yukti" lists that occur in the Artha??stra, Carakasa?hit? and Su?rutasa?hit?. There's a good account of them in Antonella Comba's *La medicina indiana classica* and in Dasgupta's *History of Indian Philosophy* v.2 ch.13. These are like general paribh???s that appear to be very old and were applied in several ??stras, including especially ny?ya. ? ?DW? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com Fri Nov 13 05:21:36 2015 From: hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com (Harry Spier) Date: Fri, 13 Nov 15 00:21:36 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] cakra sadhana In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 7:22 AM, Dipak Bhattacharya wrote: > 12 11 15 > > . . . . . > The ??kta Tantric ritual will be found, among others, in the > ??kt?nandatarangi?? by Brahm?nanda Giri, (ed. Panchanan Shastri,Calcutta > 1942-43, in Bengali character and with Bengali translation ) Ch. 4. Giri > closely follows the *??rad?tilakatantra*. > > A searchable e-text of the ??kt?nandatarangi?? by Brahm?nanda Giri, is available for viewing or download from the Muktabodha digital library. www.muktabodha.org Harry Spier Manager, Muktabodha Digital Library Muktabodha Indological Research Institute > On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 2:04 AM, patrick mccartney > wrote: > >> Dear Friends, >> >> I am looking for information regarding a particular Tantric practice. It >> involves building up a living internal image of the dev? within the >> practitioner's own body through visualising the chakras, their petals and >> the corresponding b?ja mantras. >> >> I don't really have much more to go on than this. If someone can point me >> towards some textual references that would be great. >> >> All the best, >> >> Patrick McCartney >> >> PhD Candidate >> School of Culture, History & Language >> College of the Asia-Pacific >> The Australian National University >> Canberra, Australia, 0200 >> >> >> Skype - psdmccartney >> Phone + Whatsapp: +61 414 954 748 >> >> >> >> - *https://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=241756978&trk=nav_responsive_tab_profile >> * >> - *https://anu-au.academia.edu/patrickmccartney >> * >> >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cy6lVABgjmg >> >> >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LVqBD_2P4Pg >> >> http://youtu.be/y3XfjbwqC_g >> >> http://trinityroots.bandcamp.com/track/all-we-be >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing >> committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or >> unsubscribe) >> > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kauzeya at gmail.com Fri Nov 13 10:42:37 2015 From: kauzeya at gmail.com (Jonathan Silk) Date: Fri, 13 Nov 15 11:42:37 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] another request for a scan Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, Leiden University Library's copy of Sternbach's "Aphorisms and proverbs in the Katha?-sarit-sa?gara" is missing (i.e., lost). It does not seem possible to purchase a new copy. Is it possible that someone has a scan they would be willing to share? In addition, as far as I can tell with a quick look, the promised volume 2, which was to include the Sanskrit texts, was never published; does that also seem to be the case? Many thanks, Jonathan -- J. Silk Leiden University Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b 2311 BZ Leiden The Netherlands copies of my publications may be found at http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From LubinT at wlu.edu Fri Nov 13 16:44:47 2015 From: LubinT at wlu.edu (Lubin, Tim) Date: Fri, 13 Nov 15 16:44:47 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_paribh=C4=81=E1=B9=A3=C4=81s_in_dharma=C5=9B=C4=81stra=3F?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Jo, You have probably already considered this, but in the background of the Dharma??stra are the ritual s?tras, and there are individual paribh???s and chapters of paribh??? rules: e.g., the first chapter of K?ty?yana-?rauta-S?tra, the ?pastamba-Yaj?a-Paribh???-S?tra (translated by Oldenberg in SBE vol. 31 to fill out the second volume of g?hya-s?tras), the Baudh?yana-Karm?nta-S?tra (= B?S 24). There is also a Baudh?yana-G?hya-Paribh???-S?tra (= BGS 5 in the Mysore edition) that is worth considering. Jan Gonda gives a detailed listing of its contents (Beitr?ge zur Indienforschung: Ernst Waldschmidt zum 80. Geburstag gewidmet, ed. Herbert H?rtel [Berlin: Museum f?r Indische Kunst, 1977], 169?190.) I discuss B?S 24.1 and 4 and BGPS in a JAOS article to come out in 2016, and (esp. the BGPS) in an another article that should be appearing imminently (proofs here: http://tinyurl.com/oa9vvlr) Much of what is in these Baudh?yana sections are not paribh???s in the strict sense of the word: there are general discussions of the rites as a system, definitions and classifications, and other supplementary considerations. Notice also the first chapter of the Kau?ika-S?tra of the Atharva-Veda. Best wishes, Tim Timothy Lubin Professor of Religion and Adjunct Professor of Law Washington and Lee University Lexington, Virginia 24450 http://home.wlu.edu/~lubint http://wlu.academia.edu/TimothyLubin https://twitter.com/TimothyLubin ? From: INDOLOGY > on behalf of "Donald R. Davis" > Date: Thursday, November 12, 2015 at 5:14 PM To: "indology at list.indology.info" > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] paribh???s in dharma??stra? Dear Jo, There is an interesting Dharma??stra use of paribh??? in connection with the viv?dapada called sa?vidvyatikrama. Several commentaries call the conventions of various local groups p?ribh??ikadharma and speak of settling complicated legal matters by resorting to this kind of dharma. I understand these to be local rules that fix the manner in which rules of ??stra will be applied or received in particular groups, and thence paribh???s. I wrote about this some time ago in JESHO 2005 (I?ll send you the article separately). Other, more familiar uses of paribh??? also occur when an author defines terms. For example, at Mit?k?ar? (Ydh) 1.366, Vij??ne?vara says the verse is a paribh??? of the author?s own treatise, defining the meaning of highest, middle, and lowest fines. The term occurs several other times in the Mit?k?ar?. Hope that gives you some more to go on. Best, Don Don Davis Dept of Asian Studies University of Texas at Austin From: INDOLOGY > on behalf of Jo Brill > Date: Thursday, November 12, 2015 at 7:29 AM To: "indology at list.indology.info" > Subject: [INDOLOGY] paribh???s in dharma??stra? Greetings to all, namaskaromi -- Perhaps you know of secondary literature concerning the use of so-called paribh???s, or interpretive rules by any name, in dharma??stra particularly. Of course P. V. Kane has laid the ground in Chapter XXX of History of Dharma??stra, volume 5. I am also interested in explicit mentions of the word 'paribh???' in works of dharma??stra. I've already unearthed a few by searching the texts on GRETIL. I would be honored and delighted to receive your advice and suggestions. All the best, Jo -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Fri Nov 13 19:34:18 2015 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Fri, 13 Nov 15 12:34:18 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] 200, 000 pages of historic Indian books to be made available online Message-ID: - http://www.bl.uk/press-releases/2015/november/unlocking-indias-printed-heritage -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jpo at uts.cc.utexas.edu Fri Nov 13 21:02:12 2015 From: jpo at uts.cc.utexas.edu (Patrick Olivelle) Date: Fri, 13 Nov 15 15:02:12 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Query Message-ID: In the Y?j?avalkya Sm?ti I find what I think is an unusual phenomenon?a very large number of verses where a compound breaches the p?da boundaries, and quite a large number of verses where one compound spans an entire line (two p?das). I find 9.5% (192 total) of half-verses in YDh following this pattern. Do you know of any studies done about this phenomenon in other parallel texts in verse? I would like to know whether this is peculiar to Y?j?avalkya or a broader phenomenon. I have not found this common in other Dharma??stras. With thanks, Patrick From ashok.aklujkar at gmail.com Sat Nov 14 06:04:34 2015 From: ashok.aklujkar at gmail.com (Ashok Aklujkar) Date: Fri, 13 Nov 15 22:04:34 -0800 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Query In-Reply-To: <6F2F38CE-6CC6-472A-8BC5-A293DE1EB4A9@uts.cc.utexas.edu> Message-ID: <4BE868E2-B8B3-41FB-8E4C-EA05348457D2@gmail.com> Dear Patrick, Historically, long compounds seem to have begun with dvandvas. The relationship of the constituents is uniform and easiest to understand in a dvandva. There is no syntactic complexity. Essentially all one does is to list. In the Artha-??stra, too, almost all long compounds are dvandvas. In verse texts like the Y?j?avalkya Sm?ti the only additional constraint is to rearrange the items in such a way as to fit the expected sequence of heavy and light syllables. In the ?loka or anu??ubh metre such rearranging is not very difficult to achieve. Best. ashok > On Nov 13, 2015, at 5:36 PM, Patrick Olivelle wrote: > > Dear Ashok: > > Not all, but most of them are Dvandvas. Does it make a difference? > > Patrick > > > > On Nov 13, 2015, at 6:55 PM, Ashok Aklujkar wrote: > >> Patrick, >> >> Do most of these lines contain dvandva compounds? >> >> ashok >> >> >>> On Nov 13, 2015, at 1:02 PM, Patrick Olivelle wrote: >>> >>> In the Y?j?avalkya Sm?ti I find what I think is an unusual phenomenon?a very large number of verses where a compound breaches the p?da boundaries, and quite a large number of verses where one compound spans an entire line (two p?das). I find 9.5% (192 total) of half-verses in YDh following this pattern. >>> >>> Do you know of any studies done about this phenomenon in other parallel texts in verse? I would like to know whether this is peculiar to Y?j?avalkya or a broader phenomenon. I have not found this common in other Dharma??stras. > From dipak.d2004 at gmail.com Sat Nov 14 07:09:58 2015 From: dipak.d2004 at gmail.com (Dipak Bhattacharya) Date: Sat, 14 Nov 15 12:39:58 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]=09paribh=C4=81=E1=B9=A3=C4=81s_in_dharma=C5=9B=C4=81stra=3F?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Samiran Chandra Chakrabarti's work on the Paribhshas of the Srautasutras came out around 1988 in the form of papers published in the JRAS. Later a book was published from Calcutta. DB On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 6:59 PM, Jo Brill wrote: > Greetings to all, namaskaromi -- > > Perhaps you know of secondary literature concerning the use of so-called > paribh???s, or interpretive rules by any name, in dharma??stra > particularly. Of course P. V. Kane has laid the ground in Chapter XXX of > History of Dharma??stra, volume 5. > > I am also interested in explicit mentions of the word 'paribh???' in works > of dharma??stra. I've already unearthed a few by searching the texts on > GRETIL. > > I would be honored and delighted to receive your advice and suggestions. > > All the best, > Jo > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From heike.oberlin at uni-tuebingen.de Sat Nov 14 11:51:44 2015 From: heike.oberlin at uni-tuebingen.de (PD Dr. Heike Oberlin) Date: Sat, 14 Nov 15 12:51:44 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Heinrich v . Stietencron receives the Distinguished Indologist Award Message-ID: Dear members of the list, dear colleagues, it is my great pleasure to inform you that the Emeritus of the Dept. of Indology at T?bingen University, Heinrich von Stietencron, receives the "Distinguished Indologist Award" by the Indian government. The award ceremony of this newly created prize is connected to the three-day "World Indology Conference" and will take place on November 21, 2015 in Delhi, President Pranab Mukherjee will personally present the award. Best regards, Heike Oberlin ------------------- PD Dr. phil. habil. Heike Oberlin General Manager & Scientific Coordinator (AOI) Associate Professor (Indology) Eberhard-Karls-Universit?t Tuebingen Institute of Asian and Oriental Studies (AOI) Dept. of Indology and Comparative Religion Gartenstr. 19 ? 72074 Tuebingen ? Germany Phone +49 7071 29-74005 ? Mobile +49 176 20030066 ? Fax +49 7071 29-2675 heike.oberlin at uni-tuebingen.de http://www.uni-tuebingen.de/aoi/indologie/mitarbeiter/heike-oberlin-moser.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From LubinT at wlu.edu Sat Nov 14 15:35:46 2015 From: LubinT at wlu.edu (Lubin, Tim) Date: Sat, 14 Nov 15 15:35:46 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_paribh=C4=81=E1=B9=A3=C4=81s_in_dharma=C5=9B=C4=81stra=3F?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Further on Prof. Bhattacharya?s excellent suggestion of Chakrabarti?s articles collected in his 1980 book, The Paribh???s in the ?rautas?tras (Sanskrit Pustak Bhandar): More recently, I notice, he has published Apastamba-Samanya-Sutra or Yajnaparibhasa Sutra (Asiatic Society of Calcutta, 2006), including text, translation, and analysis, which I have not yet seen (just ordered a copy). Timothy Lubin Professor of Religion and Adjunct Professor of Law Washington and Lee University Lexington, Virginia 24450 http://home.wlu.edu/~lubint http://wlu.academia.edu/TimothyLubin https://twitter.com/TimothyLubin ? From: INDOLOGY > on behalf of Dipak Bhattacharya > Date: Saturday, November 14, 2015 at 2:09 AM To: Jo Brill > Cc: Indology > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] paribh???s in dharma??stra? Samiran Chandra Chakrabarti's work on the Paribhshas of the Srautasutras came out around 1988 in the form of papers published in the JRAS. Later a book was published from Calcutta. DB On Thu, Nov 12, 2015 at 6:59 PM, Jo Brill > wrote: Greetings to all, namaskaromi -- Perhaps you know of secondary literature concerning the use of so-called paribh???s, or interpretive rules by any name, in dharma??stra particularly. Of course P. V. Kane has laid the ground in Chapter XXX of History of Dharma??stra, volume 5. I am also interested in explicit mentions of the word 'paribh???' in works of dharma??stra. I've already unearthed a few by searching the texts on GRETIL. I would be honored and delighted to receive your advice and suggestions. All the best, Jo _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From antonia.ruppel at cornell.edu Sun Nov 15 18:10:18 2015 From: antonia.ruppel at cornell.edu (Antonia Ruppel) Date: Sun, 15 Nov 15 18:10:18 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] tunes/melodies used for chanting Sanskrit verse Message-ID: Dear all, I've been looking for a source (online or printed) on the different tunes used to chant the various Sanskrit meters. Do any of you know whether something like that exists, or whether these are only passed on orally? Many thanks, Antonia -- Dr Antonia Ruppel Townsend Senior Lecturer in the Greek, Latin and Sanskrit Languages Department of Classics 120 Goldwin Smith Hall Cornell University Ithaca, NY 14853 USA antonia.ruppel at cornell.edu -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From LubinT at wlu.edu Sun Nov 15 20:05:03 2015 From: LubinT at wlu.edu (Lubin, Tim) Date: Sun, 15 Nov 15 20:05:03 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] tunes/melodies used for chanting Sanskrit verse In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Antonia, You will find links to some recordings here: http://home.wlu.edu/~lubint/texts/ However these represent just a few samples ? there is a lot of variation by region, tradition, and individual. Best wishes, Timothy Lubin Professor of Religion and Adjunct Professor of Law Washington and Lee University Lexington, Virginia 24450 http://home.wlu.edu/~lubint http://wlu.academia.edu/TimothyLubin https://twitter.com/TimothyLubin From: INDOLOGY > on behalf of Antonia Ruppel > Date: Sunday, November 15, 2015 at 1:10 PM To: "indology at list.indology.info" > Subject: [INDOLOGY] tunes/melodies used for chanting Sanskrit verse Dear all, I've been looking for a source (online or printed) on the different tunes used to chant the various Sanskrit meters. Do any of you know whether something like that exists, or whether these are only passed on orally? Many thanks, Antonia -- Dr Antonia Ruppel Townsend Senior Lecturer in the Greek, Latin and Sanskrit Languages Department of Classics 120 Goldwin Smith Hall Cornell University Ithaca, NY 14853 USA antonia.ruppel at cornell.edu -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nmisra at gmail.com Mon Nov 16 01:54:39 2015 From: nmisra at gmail.com (Nityanand Misra) Date: Mon, 16 Nov 15 07:24:39 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] tunes/melodies used for chanting Sanskrit verse In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Sun, Nov 15, 2015 at 11:40 PM, Antonia Ruppel wrote: > Dear all, > > I've been looking for a source (online or printed) on the different tunes > used to chant the various Sanskrit meters. Do any of you know whether > something like that exists, or whether these are only passed on orally? > > You may find the following recitations in the voice of Padma Shri Dr. Ram?k?nta ?ukla useful. The metres are indravajr?, upendravajr?, upaj?ti, viyogin?, va??astha, drutavilambita, vasantatilak?, m?lin?, mand?kr?nt?, ?ikhari??, hari??, ??rd?lavikr??ita, sragdhar?, vidyunm?l?, dodhaka, ??lin?, uddhat?, sv?gat?, to?aka, pa?cac?mara, ma?jubh??i??, p?thv?, and ?ry?: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2X6GcE5Seg0 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be Mon Nov 16 07:53:45 2015 From: christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be (Christophe Vielle) Date: Mon, 16 Nov 15 08:53:45 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] tunes/melodies used for chanting Sanskrit verse In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <9A27DC7E-0F56-48EC-9A06-6EBA2F067A2E@uclouvain.be> Two more links on Sanskrit meters : http://sanskritdocuments.org/learning_tools/Sanskritmetres/ http://pantheon.yale.edu/~asd49/meters.html (there is also a useful Sanskrit meters identifying tool : http://www.cfilt.iitb.ac.in/mitweb/ ) Note for the simple zloka in the BhG, the contrast which can be found between the recitation on the nicely made Polish website http://www.bhagavadgita.eu/en/?cat=24 and the ornate version available at http://www.bhagavad-gita.org/Gita/verse-01-01.html Le 15 nov. 2015 ? 19:10, Antonia Ruppel a ?crit : > Dear all, > > I've been looking for a source (online or printed) on the different tunes used to chant the various Sanskrit meters. Do any of you know whether something like that exists, or whether these are only passed on orally? > > Many thanks, > Antonia > > > -- > Dr Antonia Ruppel > Townsend Senior Lecturer in the > Greek, Latin and Sanskrit Languages > Department of Classics > 120 Goldwin Smith Hall > Cornell University > Ithaca, NY 14853 > USA > > > antonia.ruppel at cornell.edu > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) ??????????????????? Christophe Vielle Louvain-la-Neuve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From McComas.Taylor at anu.edu.au Mon Nov 16 10:09:32 2015 From: McComas.Taylor at anu.edu.au (McComas Taylor) Date: Mon, 16 Nov 15 10:09:32 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] A wonderful creative project Message-ID: Dear colleagues Begging your indulgence: Every year, I read Meghaduta with my third-year students at the Australian National University. Part of their assessment is a creative project in which they are required to make the poem 'their own' and express it in the medium of their choice. Please take a couple of minutes to watch this wonderful performance by Lily Warrum. She has choreographed and performed this herself. I'm sure you will agree it is quite an achievement. Yours, McComas https://youtu.be/MEdTrQ4q0kE YouTube Share your videos with friends, family, and the world Read more... ________________________________ McComas Taylor, Associate Professor College of Asia and the Pacific The Australian National University, Tel. + 61 2 6125 3179 Website: https://sites.google.com/site/mccomasanu/ Address: Baldessin Building 4.24, ANU, ACT 0200 Spoken Sanskrit in three minutes? Go on. Try it! ________________________________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From shrinsaha at gmail.com Tue Nov 17 06:22:45 2015 From: shrinsaha at gmail.com (Niranjan Saha) Date: Tue, 17 Nov 15 11:52:45 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and Social-political-religious Concerns Message-ID: Dear List, Could anybody shed light on the environmental humanities and its relation to or influence on the formation of classical knowledge system and vice versa, including the contemporary or pre-modern environmental debate in relation to the socio-political-religious formations connected to the regional systems in South and East Asia and Europe? Sharing of any articles and links will be highly appreciated. With regards, Niranjan Saha -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tylerwwilliams at gmail.com Tue Nov 17 16:45:14 2015 From: tylerwwilliams at gmail.com (Tyler Williams) Date: Tue, 17 Nov 15 10:45:14 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and Social-political-religious Concerns In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Niranjan, Kalyanakrishnan Sivaramakrishnan and Mahesh Rangarajan have edited a two volume environmental history of India that, while not always dealing directly with the question of knowledge systems, often touches upon them. It might be a good starting point for finding references. 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. Best, Tyler On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 12:22 AM, Niranjan Saha wrote: > Dear List, > > Could anybody shed light on the environmental humanities and its relation to > or influence on the formation of classical knowledge system and vice versa, > including the contemporary or pre-modern environmental debate in relation to > the socio-political-religious formations connected to the regional systems > in South and East Asia and Europe? > > Sharing of any articles and links will be highly appreciated. > > > > With regards, > Niranjan Saha > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) From shrinsaha at gmail.com Tue Nov 17 20:22:20 2015 From: shrinsaha at gmail.com (Niranjan Saha) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 15 01:52:20 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and Social-political-religious Concerns In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Tyler, Thank you so much for pointing out to me these two works on environmental history of India. While I need to prepare a half page write-up on the subject in a day or two, I'll see what ready-made material I could look at (for the time being). Best, Niranjan On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 10:15 PM, Tyler Williams wrote: > Dear Niranjan, > > Kalyanakrishnan Sivaramakrishnan and Mahesh Rangarajan have edited a > two volume environmental history of India that, while not always > dealing directly with the question of knowledge systems, often touches > upon them. It might be a good starting point for finding references. > > 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the > Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. > > 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the > Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. > > Best, > Tyler > > > > On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 12:22 AM, Niranjan Saha > wrote: > > Dear List, > > > > Could anybody shed light on the environmental humanities and its > relation to > > or influence on the formation of classical knowledge system and vice > versa, > > including the contemporary or pre-modern environmental debate in > relation to > > the socio-political-religious formations connected to the regional > systems > > in South and East Asia and Europe? > > > > Sharing of any articles and links will be highly appreciated. > > > > > > > > With regards, > > Niranjan Saha > > > > _______________________________________________ > > INDOLOGY mailing list > > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > > committee) > > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From p.balcerowicz at uw.edu.pl Tue Nov 17 21:25:02 2015 From: p.balcerowicz at uw.edu.pl (Piotr Balcerowicz) Date: Tue, 17 Nov 15 22:25:02 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Garbha-upanisad & Sariraka-upanisad Message-ID: <1686007545.55543.1447795502520.JavaMail.javamailuser@localhost> Dear Colleagues, I?m looking for any scanned (e.g. PDF) reliable editions of the two texts: "Garbha-upanisad" and "Sariraka-upanisad". I would appreciate if anyone of you could help in this regard. Thank you! Best regards, Piotr Balcerowicz -------------------------------- www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz From ondracka at ff.cuni.cz Tue Nov 17 21:49:29 2015 From: ondracka at ff.cuni.cz (Lubomir Ondracka) Date: Tue, 17 Nov 15 22:49:29 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Garbha-upanisad & Sariraka-upanisad In-Reply-To: <1686007545.55543.1447795502520.JavaMail.javamailuser@localhost> Message-ID: <20151117224929.532ef73a017b79464e38f094@ff.cuni.cz> Dear Piotr, both these upanisads are included in the Chowkhamba edition by Vasudev Lakshman Panashikar (Vidy?bhavana pr?cyavidy? grantham?l? 28) which is available from DLI (no. 99999990034422 or 99999990828253). Garbha no. 17 (pp,. 134-135) ?ar?raka no. 65 (pp. 392-393). Lubomir On Tue, 17 Nov 2015 22:25:02 +0100 Piotr Balcerowicz wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > I?m looking for any scanned (e.g. PDF) reliable editions of the two texts: > "Garbha-upanisad" and "Sariraka-upanisad". > I would appreciate if anyone of you could help in this regard. Thank you! > Best regards, > Piotr Balcerowicz > -------------------------------- > www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) From LubinT at wlu.edu Tue Nov 17 22:03:30 2015 From: LubinT at wlu.edu (Lubin, Tim) Date: Tue, 17 Nov 15 22:03:30 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Garbha-upanisad & Sariraka-upanisad In-Reply-To: <20151117224929.532ef73a017b79464e38f094@ff.cuni.cz> Message-ID: Dear Piotr, Garbha is also included in R?mamaya Tarkaratna?s edition of Atharvan Upani?ads, with N?r?ya?a?s commentary and HN Apte?s Upani?atsamuccaya with two commentaries (both attached). Best, Tim Timothy Lubin Professor of Religion and Adjunct Professor of Law Washington and Lee University Lexington, Virginia 24450 http://home.wlu.edu/~lubint http://wlu.academia.edu/TimothyLubin https://twitter.com/TimothyLubin ? From: INDOLOGY > on behalf of Lubomir Ondracka > Date: Tuesday, November 17, 2015 at 4:49 PM To: Piotr Balcerowicz > Cc: "indology at list.indology.info" > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Garbha-upanisad & Sariraka-upanisad Dear Piotr, both these upanisads are included in the Chowkhamba edition by Vasudev Lakshman Panashikar (Vidy?bhavana pr?cyavidy? grantham?l? 28) which is available from DLI (no. 99999990034422 or 99999990828253). Garbha no. 17 (pp,. 134-135) ?ar?raka no. 65 (pp. 392-393). Lubomir On Tue, 17 Nov 2015 22:25:02 +0100 Piotr Balcerowicz > wrote: Dear Colleagues, I?m looking for any scanned (e.g. PDF) reliable editions of the two texts: "Garbha-upanisad" and "Sariraka-upanisad". I would appreciate if anyone of you could help in this regard. Thank you! Best regards, Piotr Balcerowicz -------------------------------- www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Garbha-Atharvanopanisadah.ed.RamamayaTarkaratna.1872.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 750896 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Garbha-Upanisadsamuccaya32.ASS029.Apte1895.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 2269259 bytes Desc: not available URL: From McComas.Taylor at anu.edu.au Wed Nov 18 00:20:05 2015 From: McComas.Taylor at anu.edu.au (McComas Taylor) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 15 00:20:05 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] "Whatever is here is found elsewhere" Message-ID: Dear Colleagues Does anyone know the origin or the Sanskrit original of the claim often made about the Mahabharata, 'Whatever is here is found elsewhere. But whatever is not here is nowhere else' ? I have not been able to find it in the Ganguli-Roy translation, and without the Sanskrit I cannot search the online versions of the text. Thanks in advance McComas ________________________________ McComas Taylor, Associate Professor College of Asia and the Pacific The Australian National University, Tel. + 61 2 6125 3179 Website: https://sites.google.com/site/mccomasanu/ Address: Baldessin Building 4.24, ANU, ACT 0200 Spoken Sanskrit in three minutes? Go on. Try it! ________________________________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Michael.Slouber at wwu.edu Wed Nov 18 00:24:01 2015 From: Michael.Slouber at wwu.edu (Michael Slouber) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 15 00:24:01 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] "Whatever is here is found elsewhere" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4473ACAE-4F80-485A-B71D-DB1F37EB11A2@wwu.edu> Mbh 1.56.33cd: yad ih?sti tad anyatra, yan neh?sti na tat kvacit. ?? Michael Slouber Assistant Professor of South Asia Department of Liberal Studies Western Washington University On ???? ???????? ??, at ?:?? ???????, McComas Taylor > wrote: Dear Colleagues Does anyone know the origin or the Sanskrit original of the claim often made about the Mah?bh?rata, 'Whatever is here is found elsewhere. But whatever is not here is nowhere else' ? I have not been able to find it in the Ganguli-Roy translation, and without the Sanskrit I cannot search the online versions of the text. Thanks in advance McComas ________________________________ McComas Taylor, Associate Professor College of Asia and the Pacific The Australian National University, Tel. + 61 2 6125 3179 Website: https://sites.google.com/site/mccomasanu/ Address: Baldessin Building 4.24, ANU, ACT 0200 Spoken Sanskrit in three minutes? Go on. Try it! ________________________________ _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From a.bowles1 at uq.edu.au Wed Nov 18 00:28:07 2015 From: a.bowles1 at uq.edu.au (Adam Bowles) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 15 00:28:07 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] "Whatever is here is found elsewhere" In-Reply-To: <4473ACAE-4F80-485A-B71D-DB1F37EB11A2@wwu.edu> Message-ID: And 18.5.38cd. Dr Adam Bowles Senior Lecturer in Asian Religions Convenor, Studies in Religion Discipline School of Historical and Philosophical Inquiry Faculty of Humanities and Social Sciences The University of Queensland Tel:+61 7 33656324 Email:a.bowles1 at uq.edu.au Web: http://hapi.uq.edu.au/dr-adam-bowles https://uq.academia.edu/AdamBowles https://twitter.com/Bowles1A [FaceBook-icon] Associate Editor, South Asia: Journal of South Asian Studies http://www.tandfonline.com/toc/csas20/current CRICOS Provider Number: 00025B This email is intended solely for the addressee. It may contain private or confidential information. If you are not the intended addressee, you must take no action based on it, nor show a copy to anyone. Kindly notify the sender by reply email. Opinions and information in this email which do not relate to the official business of The University of Queensland shall be understood as neither given nor endorsed by the University. From: INDOLOGY > on behalf of Michael Slouber > Date: Wednesday, 18 November 2015 10:24 am To: indology > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] "Whatever is here is found elsewhere" neh?sti -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jknutson at hawaii.edu Wed Nov 18 00:30:27 2015 From: jknutson at hawaii.edu (Jesse Knutson) Date: Tue, 17 Nov 15 14:30:27 -1000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] "Whatever is here is found elsewhere" In-Reply-To: <4473ACAE-4F80-485A-B71D-DB1F37EB11A2@wwu.edu> Message-ID: Dear Friends, It also occurs here: dharme c?rthe ca k?me ca mok?e ca bharatar?abha/ yad ih?sti tad anyatra yan neh?sti na tat kvacit// (18.5.38). On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 2:24 PM, Michael Slouber wrote: > Mbh 1.56.33cd: yad ih?sti tad anyatra, yan neh?sti na tat kvacit. > > ?? > Michael Slouber > Assistant Professor of South Asia > Department of Liberal Studies > Western Washington University > > > On ???? ???????? ??, at ?:?? ???????, McComas Taylor < > McComas.Taylor at anu.edu.au> wrote: > > Dear Colleagues > > Does anyone know the origin or the Sanskrit original of the claim often > made about the Mah?bh?rata, 'Whatever is here is found elsewhere. But > whatever is not here is nowhere else' ? > > I have not been able to find it in the Ganguli-Roy translation, and > without the Sanskrit I cannot search the online versions of the text. > > Thanks in advance > > McComas > > ------------------------------ > McComas Taylor, Associate Professor > College of Asia and the Pacific > The Australian National University, Tel. + 61 2 6125 3179 > Website: https://sites.google.com/site/mccomasanu/ > Address: Baldessin Building 4.24, ANU, ACT 0200 > > Spoken Sanskrit in three minutes? Go on. > Try it! > > ------------------------------ > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Jesse Ross Knutson PhD Assistant Professor of Sanskrit and Bengali, Department of Indo-Pacific Languages and Literatures University of Hawai'i at M?noa 452A Spalding -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ondracka at ff.cuni.cz Wed Nov 18 00:31:05 2015 From: ondracka at ff.cuni.cz (Lubomir Ondracka) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 15 01:31:05 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] "Whatever is here is found elsewhere" In-Reply-To: <4473ACAE-4F80-485A-B71D-DB1F37EB11A2@wwu.edu> Message-ID: <20151118013105.f5c4f65064a9027007a819ae@ff.cuni.cz> Plus: MBh 18.5.38cd (the same verse) LO On Wed, 18 Nov 2015 00:24:01 +0000 Michael Slouber wrote: > Mbh 1.56.33cd: yad ih?sti tad anyatra, yan neh?sti na tat kvacit. > > ?? > Michael Slouber > Assistant Professor of South Asia > Department of Liberal Studies > Western Washington University > > > On ???? ???????? ??, at ?:?? ???????, McComas Taylor > wrote: > > Dear Colleagues > > Does anyone know the origin or the Sanskrit original of the claim often made about the Mah?bh?rata, 'Whatever is here is found elsewhere. But whatever is not here is nowhere else' ? > > I have not been able to find it in the Ganguli-Roy translation, and without the Sanskrit I cannot search the online versions of the text. > > Thanks in advance > > McComas > > ________________________________ > McComas Taylor, Associate Professor > College of Asia and the Pacific > The Australian National University, Tel. + 61 2 6125 3179 > Website: https://sites.google.com/site/mccomasanu/ > Address: Baldessin Building 4.24, ANU, ACT 0200 > > Spoken Sanskrit in three minutes? Go on. Try it! > > ________________________________ > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > From dipak.d2004 at gmail.com Wed Nov 18 04:37:36 2015 From: dipak.d2004 at gmail.com (Dipak Bhattacharya) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 15 10:07:36 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Garbha-upanisad & Sariraka-upanisad In-Reply-To: <1686007545.55543.1447795502520.JavaMail.javamailuser@localhost> Message-ID: It is available on the Internet under 108-Upanishads-with-Sanskrit-commentary which one has to search. One gifted that to me on a DVD so that I cannot give the web-address. Hope you will find. Best DB On Wed, Nov 18, 2015 at 2:55 AM, Piotr Balcerowicz wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > I?m looking for any scanned (e.g. PDF) reliable editions of the two texts: > "Garbha-upanisad" and "Sariraka-upanisad". > I would appreciate if anyone of you could help in this regard. Thank you! > Best regards, > Piotr Balcerowicz > -------------------------------- > www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mark.mcclish at northwestern.edu Wed Nov 18 19:12:09 2015 From: mark.mcclish at northwestern.edu (Mark McClish) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 15 19:12:09 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and Social-political-religious Concerns In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <6440115E-D867-4477-8A10-B0D25B81EF9B@northwestern.edu> Niranjan, You might find Thomas Trautmann's Elephants and Kings: An Environmental History (Oxford 2015) helpful. Best, Mark On Nov 17, 2015, at 2:23 PM, Niranjan Saha > wrote: Dear Tyler, Thank you so much for pointing out to me these two works on environmental history of India. While I need to prepare a half page write-up on the subject in a day or two, I'll see what ready-made material I could look at (for the time being). Best, Niranjan On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 10:15 PM, Tyler Williams > wrote: Dear Niranjan, Kalyanakrishnan Sivaramakrishnan and Mahesh Rangarajan have edited a two volume environmental history of India that, while not always dealing directly with the question of knowledge systems, often touches upon them. It might be a good starting point for finding references. 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. Best, Tyler On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 12:22 AM, Niranjan Saha > wrote: > Dear List, > > Could anybody shed light on the environmental humanities and its relation to > or influence on the formation of classical knowledge system and vice versa, > including the contemporary or pre-modern environmental debate in relation to > the socio-political-religious formations connected to the regional systems > in South and East Asia and Europe? > > Sharing of any articles and links will be highly appreciated. > > > > With regards, > Niranjan Saha > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mark.mcclish at northwestern.edu Wed Nov 18 19:49:43 2015 From: mark.mcclish at northwestern.edu (Mark McClish) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 15 19:49:43 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and Social-political-religious Concerns In-Reply-To: <6440115E-D867-4477-8A10-B0D25B81EF9B@northwestern.edu> Message-ID: <2EC2CFF3-0CE8-4CE4-B58B-3A30CF65D77D@northwestern.edu> Sorry, Trautmann's book is published by the University of Chicago Press. On Nov 18, 2015, at 1:12 PM, Mark McClish > wrote: Niranjan, You might find Thomas Trautmann's Elephants and Kings: An Environmental History (Oxford 2015) helpful. Best, Mark On Nov 17, 2015, at 2:23 PM, Niranjan Saha > wrote: Dear Tyler, Thank you so much for pointing out to me these two works on environmental history of India. While I need to prepare a half page write-up on the subject in a day or two, I'll see what ready-made material I could look at (for the time being). Best, Niranjan On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 10:15 PM, Tyler Williams > wrote: Dear Niranjan, Kalyanakrishnan Sivaramakrishnan and Mahesh Rangarajan have edited a two volume environmental history of India that, while not always dealing directly with the question of knowledge systems, often touches upon them. It might be a good starting point for finding references. 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. Best, Tyler On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 12:22 AM, Niranjan Saha > wrote: > Dear List, > > Could anybody shed light on the environmental humanities and its relation to > or influence on the formation of classical knowledge system and vice versa, > including the contemporary or pre-modern environmental debate in relation to > the socio-political-religious formations connected to the regional systems > in South and East Asia and Europe? > > Sharing of any articles and links will be highly appreciated. > > > > With regards, > Niranjan Saha > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From vera.lazzaretti at gmail.com Wed Nov 18 20:14:45 2015 From: vera.lazzaretti at gmail.com (Vera Lazzaretti) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 15 21:14:45 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Spatial and Visual Dimensions of Pilgrimage in South Asia - CFP for 24th ECSAS Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, We are pleased to share this Call for Papers for the next Conference of the European Association of South Asian Studies which will take place in Warsaw in July 2016. Please feel free to circulate to other interested colleagues. *?Spatial and Visual Dimensions of Pilgrimage in South Asia?* *Convenors:* *Dr. J?rg Gengnagel (Heidelberg University)* *Dr. Vera Lazzaretti (University of Milan)* *Short Abstract* *The panel addresses spatial and visual dimensions of pilgrimage in South Asia by exploring its local variations and inner spaces, with a focus on the visual productions connected to it, such as maps, diagrams, illuminated manuscripts and built-substitutes for pilgrimage.* *More details about the panel, deadline and proposals at: http://nomadit.co.uk/easas/ecsas2016/panels.php5?PanelID=3753 * Vera Lazzaretti Universit? degli Studi di Milano -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From p.balcerowicz at uw.edu.pl Wed Nov 18 21:41:50 2015 From: p.balcerowicz at uw.edu.pl (Piotr Balcerowicz) Date: Wed, 18 Nov 15 22:41:50 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Garbha-upanisad & Sariraka-upanisad In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2128780653.573482.1447882910025.JavaMail.javamailuser@localhost> Dear Lubomir, Dear Tim, Dear Dipak, Thank you so much for your quick reply! Best wishes, Piotr -------------------------------- www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz ----- Original Message ----- From: Dipak Bhattacharya To: Piotr Balcerowicz Cc: Indology Sent: Wed, 18 Nov 2015 05:37:36 +0100 (CET) Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Garbha-upanisad & Sariraka-upanisad It is available on the Internet under 108-Upanishads-with-Sanskrit-commentary which one has to search. One gifted that to me on a DVD so that I cannot give the web-address. Hope you will find. Best DB On Wed, Nov 18, 2015 at 2:55 AM, Piotr Balcerowicz wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > I?m looking for any scanned (e.g. PDF) reliable editions of the two texts: > "Garbha-upanisad" and "Sariraka-upanisad". > I would appreciate if anyone of you could help in this regard. Thank you! > Best regards, > Piotr Balcerowicz > -------------------------------- > www.orient.uw.edu.pl/balcerowicz > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) From astridzotter at yahoo.de Thu Nov 19 12:25:43 2015 From: astridzotter at yahoo.de (astridzotter at yahoo.de) Date: Thu, 19 Nov 15 12:25:43 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Professorship_(W3)_in_=E2=80=9EClassical_Indology=E2=80=9C_(Succession_to_Prof._Dr._Axel_Michaels)?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <1401965204.11779366.1447935943749.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> The SouthAsia Institute of Heidelberg University (Germany) invites applications for aposition ranked as aFull Professorship (W3) in ?Classical Indology?(Succession to Prof. Dr. Axel Michaels)to be filled by October 2016.The position has an emphasis on the cultural and religious history ofSouth Asia. The candidate is expected to cover classical Indian languages,especially Sanskrit, and the cultural and religious history of South Asia,especially Hinduism, in teaching and research. Knowledge of a modern Indianlanguage and experience in field research are advantageous. The candidate isexpected to cover a broad spectrum of the discipline in undergraduate andpostgraduate teaching.The South Asia Institute of Heidelberg University (http://www.sai.uni-heidelberg.de/) with seven academicdisciplines and four additional affiliated professors has a particular focus oninterdisciplinary research and has been very successful in attracting researchgrants for joint research projects. The candidate would be expected to participatein inter-departmental research projects and to collaborate with otherdepartments at the South Asia Institute as well as with the Heidelberg Centrefor Transcultural Studies. A university degree, a Ph.D. qualification, teaching experience, and (inaccordance with Article 47, paragraph 2 of the Higher Education Law of thestate of Baden-W?rttemberg) a ?Habilitation? or academic achievements comparableto the German ?Habilitation? (in particular a successfully evaluated Junior-Professorship)are prerequisites for a successful application.The University is intent on increasing the share of women in areas wherethey have been previously underrepresented. Applications from qualified women arestrongly encouraged. Preference will be given to disabled applicants with equalqualifications and aptitude for the position.Applications containing a curriculum vitae, proof of teachingexperience, a list of publications, copies of academic certificates and teachingevaluations should be sent as a single PDF document by email to the Dean of theFaculty of Philosophy, Prof. Dr. Gerrit Kloss, Vo?str. 2, Geb. 37, 69115Heidelberg, E-Mail: philosophische.fakultaet at uni-heidelberg.de.? The application deadline is 22.12.2015.Informal inquiries regarding this position may be addressed to theDirector of the South Asia Institute, Prof. Dr. Stefan Klonner, Tel. 0049 6221548924.? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pankaj.jain at unt.edu Thu Nov 19 19:53:36 2015 From: pankaj.jain at unt.edu (Pankaj Jain) Date: Thu, 19 Nov 15 13:53:36 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fwd: UNT Dept of Phil & Religion invites applications for dept chair In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Please share in your networks: The University of North Texas Department of Philosophy and Religion invites applications for Department Chair. The department chair position is a 12-month appointment, beginning fall 2016. It is anticipated that the new chair will build upon the department's existing strengths, while working together with faculty to envision a vibrant and sustainable future. Teaching responsibilities are two courses a year. Rank and salary are commensurate with qualifications and experience. Salary and benefits are competitive. The position reports to the Dean of the College of Arts and Sciences. Details at: https://facultyjobs.unt.edu/applicants/jsp/shared/position/JobDetails_css.jsp?postingId=167136 ------------------------------------------------------------ ---------------------- Dr. Pankaj Jain (???? ???) pankaj.jain at unt.edu Assistant Professor Dept of Anthropology 940-369-6980 Dept of Philosophy and Religion 940-369-8126 Director, EcoDharma Project The University of North Texas [image: http://www.amazon.com/Pankaj-Jain/e/B004UHPYKA/] [image: h, source icon] -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From birendra176 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 20 04:48:48 2015 From: birendra176 at yahoo.com (Birendra Nath Prasad) Date: Fri, 20 Nov 15 04:48:48 +0000 Subject: INDOLOGY Digest, Vol 34, Issue 19 In-Reply-To: <362876255.6465041.1447994928782.JavaMail.yahoo.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <362876255.6465041.1447994928782.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> One may also see my paper titled ?Brahmanical Temples, Ma?has, Agrah?ras and a Buddhist Establishment in a Marshy and Forested Periphery of Two ?Frontier? States: Early Mediaeval Surma Valley (Sylhet and Cachar), c. 600 CE?1100 CE?. This paper was published in Religions of South Asia, Vol. 6, no.1 , 2012. Religions of South Asia is an international peer-reviewed journal, published by Equinox Publications, London. This paper analyses the complex pattern of interaction between religion, agrarian expansion , detribalisation and the evolution of a local state in the most forested and marshiest part of early medieval Bengal. Abstract of the paper may be seen at https://journals.equinoxpub.com/index.php/ROSA/article/view/10764 Birendra Nath Prasad Asstt. Professor, History BB Ambedkar University (A Central University) Lucknow -226025 Email : bnprasad at bbau.ac.in bp2629 at gmail.com -------------------------------------------- On Thu, 11/19/15, indology-request at list.indology.info wrote: Subject: INDOLOGY Digest, Vol 34, Issue 19 To: indology at list.indology.info Date: Thursday, November 19, 2015, 10:30 PM Send INDOLOGY mailing list submissions to ??? indology at list.indology.info To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit ??? http://list.indology.info/mailman/listinfo/indology_list.indology.info or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ??? indology-request at list.indology.info You can reach the person managing the list at ??? indology-owner at list.indology.info When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of INDOLOGY digest..." Today's Topics: ???1. Re: Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and ? ? ? Social-political-religious Concerns (Mark McClish) ???2. Re: Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and ? ? ? Social-political-religious Concerns (Mark McClish) ???3. Spatial and Visual Dimensions of Pilgrimage in South Asia - ? ? ? CFP for 24th ECSAS (Vera Lazzaretti) ???4. Re: Garbha-upanisad & Sariraka-upanisad (Piotr Balcerowicz) ???5. Professorship (W3) in ?Classical Indology? (Succession to ? ? ? Prof. Dr. Axel Michaels) (astridzotter at yahoo.de) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2015 19:12:09 +0000 From: Mark McClish To: "INDOLOGY at list.indology.info" Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and ??? Social-political-religious Concerns Message-ID: <6440115E-D867-4477-8A10-B0D25B81EF9B at northwestern.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Niranjan, You might find Thomas Trautmann's Elephants and Kings: An Environmental History (Oxford 2015) helpful. Best, Mark On Nov 17, 2015, at 2:23 PM, Niranjan Saha > wrote: Dear Tyler, Thank you so much for pointing out to me these two works on environmental history of India. While I need to prepare a half page write-up on the subject in a day or two, I'll see what ready-made material I could look at (for the time being). Best, Niranjan On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 10:15 PM, Tyler Williams > wrote: Dear Niranjan, Kalyanakrishnan Sivaramakrishnan and Mahesh Rangarajan have edited a two volume environmental history of India that, while not always dealing directly with the question of knowledge systems, often touches upon them.? It might be a good starting point for finding references. 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. Best, Tyler On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 12:22 AM, Niranjan Saha > wrote: > Dear List, > > Could anybody shed light on the environmental humanities and its relation to > or influence on the formation of classical knowledge system and vice versa, > including the contemporary or pre-modern environmental debate in relation to > the socio-political-religious formations connected to the regional systems > in South and East Asia and Europe? > > Sharing of any articles and links will be highly appreciated. > > > > With regards, > Niranjan Saha > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) From birendra176 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 20 04:48:49 2015 From: birendra176 at yahoo.com (Birendra Nath Prasad) Date: Fri, 20 Nov 15 04:48:49 +0000 Subject: INDOLOGY Digest, Vol 34, Issue 19 In-Reply-To: <1259842723.6415355.1447994929615.JavaMail.yahoo.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1259842723.6415355.1447994929615.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> One may also see my paper titled ?Brahmanical Temples, Ma?has, Agrah?ras and a Buddhist Establishment in a Marshy and Forested Periphery of Two ?Frontier? States: Early Mediaeval Surma Valley (Sylhet and Cachar), c. 600 CE?1100 CE?. This paper was published in Religions of South Asia, Vol. 6, no.1 , 2012. Religions of South Asia is an international peer-reviewed journal, published by Equinox Publications, London. This paper analyses the complex pattern of interaction between religion, agrarian expansion , detribalisation and the evolution of a local state in the most forested and marshiest part of early medieval Bengal. Abstract of the paper may be seen at https://journals.equinoxpub.com/index.php/ROSA/article/view/10764 Birendra Nath Prasad Asstt. Professor, History BB Ambedkar University (A Central University) Lucknow -226025 Email : bnprasad at bbau.ac.in bp2629 at gmail.com -------------------------------------------- On Thu, 11/19/15, indology-request at list.indology.info wrote: Subject: INDOLOGY Digest, Vol 34, Issue 19 To: indology at list.indology.info Date: Thursday, November 19, 2015, 10:30 PM Send INDOLOGY mailing list submissions to ??? indology at list.indology.info To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit ??? http://list.indology.info/mailman/listinfo/indology_list.indology.info or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ??? indology-request at list.indology.info You can reach the person managing the list at ??? indology-owner at list.indology.info When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of INDOLOGY digest..." Today's Topics: ???1. Re: Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and ? ? ? Social-political-religious Concerns (Mark McClish) ???2. Re: Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and ? ? ? Social-political-religious Concerns (Mark McClish) ???3. Spatial and Visual Dimensions of Pilgrimage in South Asia - ? ? ? CFP for 24th ECSAS (Vera Lazzaretti) ???4. Re: Garbha-upanisad & Sariraka-upanisad (Piotr Balcerowicz) ???5. Professorship (W3) in ?Classical Indology? (Succession to ? ? ? Prof. Dr. Axel Michaels) (astridzotter at yahoo.de) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2015 19:12:09 +0000 From: Mark McClish To: "INDOLOGY at list.indology.info" Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and ??? Social-political-religious Concerns Message-ID: <6440115E-D867-4477-8A10-B0D25B81EF9B at northwestern.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Niranjan, You might find Thomas Trautmann's Elephants and Kings: An Environmental History (Oxford 2015) helpful. Best, Mark On Nov 17, 2015, at 2:23 PM, Niranjan Saha > wrote: Dear Tyler, Thank you so much for pointing out to me these two works on environmental history of India. While I need to prepare a half page write-up on the subject in a day or two, I'll see what ready-made material I could look at (for the time being). Best, Niranjan On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 10:15 PM, Tyler Williams > wrote: Dear Niranjan, Kalyanakrishnan Sivaramakrishnan and Mahesh Rangarajan have edited a two volume environmental history of India that, while not always dealing directly with the question of knowledge systems, often touches upon them.? It might be a good starting point for finding references. 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. Best, Tyler On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 12:22 AM, Niranjan Saha > wrote: > Dear List, > > Could anybody shed light on the environmental humanities and its relation to > or influence on the formation of classical knowledge system and vice versa, > including the contemporary or pre-modern environmental debate in relation to > the socio-political-religious formations connected to the regional systems > in South and East Asia and Europe? > > Sharing of any articles and links will be highly appreciated. > > > > With regards, > Niranjan Saha > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) From birendra176 at yahoo.com Fri Nov 20 04:48:48 2015 From: birendra176 at yahoo.com (Birendra Nath Prasad) Date: Fri, 20 Nov 15 04:48:48 +0000 Subject: INDOLOGY Digest, Vol 34, Issue 19 In-Reply-To: <277216446.6370363.1447994929000.JavaMail.yahoo.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <277216446.6370363.1447994929000.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com> One may also see my paper titled ?Brahmanical Temples, Ma?has, Agrah?ras and a Buddhist Establishment in a Marshy and Forested Periphery of Two ?Frontier? States: Early Mediaeval Surma Valley (Sylhet and Cachar), c. 600 CE?1100 CE?. This paper was published in Religions of South Asia, Vol. 6, no.1 , 2012. Religions of South Asia is an international peer-reviewed journal, published by Equinox Publications, London. This paper analyses the complex pattern of interaction between religion, agrarian expansion , detribalisation and the evolution of a local state in the most forested and marshiest part of early medieval Bengal. Abstract of the paper may be seen at https://journals.equinoxpub.com/index.php/ROSA/article/view/10764 Birendra Nath Prasad Asstt. Professor, History BB Ambedkar University (A Central University) Lucknow -226025 Email : bnprasad at bbau.ac.in bp2629 at gmail.com -------------------------------------------- On Thu, 11/19/15, indology-request at list.indology.info wrote: Subject: INDOLOGY Digest, Vol 34, Issue 19 To: indology at list.indology.info Date: Thursday, November 19, 2015, 10:30 PM Send INDOLOGY mailing list submissions to ??? indology at list.indology.info To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit ??? http://list.indology.info/mailman/listinfo/indology_list.indology.info or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ??? indology-request at list.indology.info You can reach the person managing the list at ??? indology-owner at list.indology.info When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of INDOLOGY digest..." Today's Topics: ???1. Re: Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and ? ? ? Social-political-religious Concerns (Mark McClish) ???2. Re: Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and ? ? ? Social-political-religious Concerns (Mark McClish) ???3. Spatial and Visual Dimensions of Pilgrimage in South Asia - ? ? ? CFP for 24th ECSAS (Vera Lazzaretti) ???4. Re: Garbha-upanisad & Sariraka-upanisad (Piotr Balcerowicz) ???5. Professorship (W3) in ?Classical Indology? (Succession to ? ? ? Prof. Dr. Axel Michaels) (astridzotter at yahoo.de) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Wed, 18 Nov 2015 19:12:09 +0000 From: Mark McClish To: "INDOLOGY at list.indology.info" Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and ??? Social-political-religious Concerns Message-ID: <6440115E-D867-4477-8A10-B0D25B81EF9B at northwestern.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Niranjan, You might find Thomas Trautmann's Elephants and Kings: An Environmental History (Oxford 2015) helpful. Best, Mark On Nov 17, 2015, at 2:23 PM, Niranjan Saha > wrote: Dear Tyler, Thank you so much for pointing out to me these two works on environmental history of India. While I need to prepare a half page write-up on the subject in a day or two, I'll see what ready-made material I could look at (for the time being). Best, Niranjan On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 10:15 PM, Tyler Williams > wrote: Dear Niranjan, Kalyanakrishnan Sivaramakrishnan and Mahesh Rangarajan have edited a two volume environmental history of India that, while not always dealing directly with the question of knowledge systems, often touches upon them.? It might be a good starting point for finding references. 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. Best, Tyler On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 12:22 AM, Niranjan Saha > wrote: > Dear List, > > Could anybody shed light on the environmental humanities and its relation to > or influence on the formation of classical knowledge system and vice versa, > including the contemporary or pre-modern environmental debate in relation to > the socio-political-religious formations connected to the regional systems > in South and East Asia and Europe? > > Sharing of any articles and links will be highly appreciated. > > > > With regards, > Niranjan Saha > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) From julia.hegewald at uni-bonn.de Fri Nov 20 11:57:08 2015 From: julia.hegewald at uni-bonn.de (Julia Hegewald) Date: Fri, 20 Nov 15 12:57:08 +0100 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Ausschreibung_W1_Gegenwartsbezogene_S=C3=BCdasienforschung?= In-Reply-To: <564EE72E.7080200@uni-bonn.de> Message-ID: Dear colleagues and friends, via the link below you can access information on a new professorship in Contemporary Indian Studies at the University of Bonn in Germany. > https://www.uni-bonn.de/die-universitaet/stellenangebote/dez.-3/w1_suedasienwissenschaft > The advertisement is in German only but any translation programme should do to understand the basics if you don?t know German. It?s for a German ?W1-Professorship? which is a junior position only requiring an excellent PhD but not a Habilitation which is normally needed. Applicants should be specialised in an aspect of the culture, history, political or social science of India and have a modern South Asian language (preferably Hindi/Urdu). Further information can be obtained from Prof. Conrad Klaus, the Professor of Sanskrit at Bonn University (konrad.klaus at uni-bonn.de). The application deadline is 15th January 2016. Thank you for circulating this advertisement via other relevant lists and for passing it on to interested persons. with best wishes, Julia Hegewald. Prof. Dr. Julia A. B. Hegewald Professor of Oriental Art History Head of Department University of Bonn Institute of Oriental and Asian Studies (IOA) Department of Asian and Islamic Art History Adenauerallee 10 53113 Bonn Germany Email: julia.hegewald at uni-bonn.de www.aik.uni-bonn.de Tel. 0049-228-73 7213 Fax. 0049-228-73 4042 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bill.m.mak at gmail.com Fri Nov 20 16:38:37 2015 From: bill.m.mak at gmail.com (Bill Mak) Date: Fri, 20 Nov 15 22:23:37 +0545 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Snellgrove's_map_and_iconography_of_astral_deities_in_Kathmandu_--_Chus=CC=A3y=C4=81_Bah=C4=81l_and_Pinch=E1=BA=BD_Bah=C4=81l?= Message-ID: <4661A4A1-9B23-4B34-8D26-72A2B257CCF4@gmail.com> Dear colleagues, Would anyone be able to share a pdf copy of Snellgrove, D.L. 1961. Shrines and Temples of Nepal. 2 parts. Arts Asiatiques, VIII/1: 3-10; VIII/2: 93-120? In particular, the map on pp.117 would be immensely helpful for me to locate the two temples in Kathmandu, Chu?y? Bah?l and Pinch? Bah?l. I am now in Kathmandu and I plan to make a visit to the two temples to examine the wood carving of the astral deities, ie saptagraha and other dh?r??? deities. They were discussed in articles by Mevissen (2006) and B?hnemann (2006/2014). Pictures of the sculptures were partially published in works by Kooij and Mevissen. I will try to take photos of all the deities and look at them in greater details. Please let me know if you have any more information on them or if you would like to see the photos, if I manage to locate them! Best regards, Bill Mak -- Dr. Bill M. Mak Hakubi Associate Professor of History of Science Institute for Research in Humanities, Kyoto University Yoshidahonmachi, Sakyo-ku, Kyoto, Japan 606-8501 email: mak at zinbun.kyoto-u.ac.jp Tel:+81-75-753-6961 Fax:+81-75-753-6903 copies of my publications may be found at: http://www.billmak.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karp at uw.edu.pl Fri Nov 20 18:18:25 2015 From: karp at uw.edu.pl (Artur Karp) Date: Fri, 20 Nov 15 19:18:25 +0100 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]=09Snellgrove's_map_and_iconography_of_astral_deities_in_Kathmandu_--_Chus=CC=A3y=C4=81_Bah=C4=81l_and_Pinch=E1=BA=BD_Bah=C4=81l?= In-Reply-To: <4661A4A1-9B23-4B34-8D26-72A2B257CCF4@gmail.com> Message-ID: Dear Bill, According to www.latlong.net the geo coordinates of both the shrines are: 27.43' 2.0820'' N, 85.19'26.2560 E. Look at the map there. Best, Artur PS. Thank you very much, once more, for your comments (and translation) re the proportion 63::64 found in the Sphujidhvaja's Yavanajataka. A. 2015-11-20 17:38 GMT+01:00 Bill Mak : > Dear colleagues, > > Would anyone be able to share a pdf copy of Snellgrove, D.L. 1961. Shrines > and Temples of Nepal. 2 parts. Arts Asiatiques, VIII/1: 3-10; VIII/2: > 93-120? In particular, the map on pp.117 would be immensely helpful for me > to locate the two temples in Kathmandu, Chu?y? Bah?l and Pinch? Bah?l. > > I am now in Kathmandu and I plan to make a visit to the two temples to > examine the wood carving of the astral deities, ie saptagraha and other > dh?r??? deities. They were discussed in articles by Mevissen (2006) and > B?hnemann (2006/2014). Pictures of the sculptures were partially published > in works by Kooij and Mevissen. I will try to take photos of all the > deities and look at them in greater details. Please let me know if you have > any more information on them or if you would like to see the photos, if I > manage to locate them! > > Best regards, > > Bill Mak > > > -- > Dr. Bill M. Mak > Hakubi Associate Professor of History of Science > > Institute for Research in Humanities, Kyoto University > Yoshidahonmachi, Sakyo-ku, Kyoto, Japan 606-8501 > > email: mak at zinbun.kyoto-u.ac.jp > Tel:+81-75-753-6961 > Fax:+81-75-753-6903 > > copies of my publications may be found at: > http://www.billmak.com > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bill.m.mak at gmail.com Sat Nov 21 13:06:56 2015 From: bill.m.mak at gmail.com (Bill Mak) Date: Sat, 21 Nov 15 18:51:56 +0545 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_Snellgrove's_map_and_iconography_of_astral_deities_in_Kathmandu_--_Chus=CC=A3y=C4=81_Bah=C4=81l_and_Pinch=E1=BA=BD_Bah=C4=81l?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0D5335D4-D3C0-4BF5-AC22-4237978FB122@gmail.com> Many thanks to the prompt response and helpful tips from Will and Artur. We managed to find Chu?y? Bah?l not far from Thamel and the priest there kindly gave us many useful information about the temple and the wood-carvings, including those of the saptav?ra and 27 nak?atras. Those who are interested in some of the pictures we have taken may check out these links: https://www.facebook.com/astralscience/posts/877397065706921 http://www.billmak.com/newari-buddhist-iconography-of-seven-day-planetary-deities-and-nak?atras/ -- Bill M. Mak Institute for Research in Humanities, Kyoto University Yoshidahonmachi, Sakyo-ku, Kyoto 606-8501 ?606-8501 ?????????? ??????????? Tel:+81-75-753-6961 Fax:+81-75-753-6903 copies of my publications may be found at: http://www.billmak.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Sat Nov 21 21:32:58 2015 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Sat, 21 Nov 15 21:32:58 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B1359F@xm-mbx-04-prod> Dear colleagues, When do we first see rubrication in Indian manuscripts? And can you send me any links to images of early examples? Of course, vermilion was known and used in many contexts, but here I am particularly interested in its use in writing. with thanks in advance, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From yogacara at gmail.com Sun Nov 22 08:18:27 2015 From: yogacara at gmail.com (Dan Lusthaus) Date: Sun, 22 Nov 15 03:18:27 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B1359F@xm-mbx-04-prod> Message-ID: <4CD0526BE05345C6B654C11DF971765D@Dan> Dear Matthew, Red writing mixed in with ordinary black ink passages already is found in Chinese mss. in Dunhuang, some perhaps dating from as early as the fifth or sixth century (though not necessarily to mark headings -- its function and purpose is a bit more mysterious). The Dunhuang ms. site http://idp.bl.uk/ has online facsimiles of some, but I haven't time now to locate specific examples (and usually the urls are temporary so they are useless in emails -- one would have to identify text numbers, etc. and do a search text by text; perhaps someone who has that corpus closer to their fingertips than I do can guide you where to look). While I don't recall offhand any Indian texts there with similar features, it is likely that the practice was being transferred across cultures. Someone who had been very interested in this is Toru Funayama. I don't recall if he ever published anything on it. If you can't find any of those, let me know, and I will try to find some time to do a red-ink hunt on the Dunhuang site. Somewhere I may have notes compiled from years ago. best, Dan ----- Original Message ----- From: Matthew Kapstein Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Dear colleagues, When do we first see rubrication in Indian manuscripts? And can you send me any links to images of early examples? Of course, vermilion was known and used in many contexts, but here I am particularly interested in its use in writing. with thanks in advance, Matthew Matthew Kapstein -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Sun Nov 22 08:29:55 2015 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Sun, 22 Nov 15 08:29:55 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <4CD0526BE05345C6B654C11DF971765D@Dan> Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B13662@xm-mbx-04-prod> Thanks, Dan, I am quite aware of Chinese, Tibetan and medieval Western rubrication, as well as late Indian materials. My query, though, specifically concerns early examples in Indian manuscripts. thanks anyway, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________________ From: Dan Lusthaus [yogacara at gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2015 2:18 AM To: Matthew Kapstein Cc: Indology Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Dear Matthew, Red writing mixed in with ordinary black ink passages already is found in Chinese mss. in Dunhuang, some perhaps dating from as early as the fifth or sixth century (though not necessarily to mark headings -- its function and purpose is a bit more mysterious). The Dunhuang ms. site http://idp.bl.uk/ has online facsimiles of some, but I haven't time now to locate specific examples (and usually the urls are temporary so they are useless in emails -- one would have to identify text numbers, etc. and do a search text by text; perhaps someone who has that corpus closer to their fingertips than I do can guide you where to look). While I don't recall offhand any Indian texts there with similar features, it is likely that the practice was being transferred across cultures. Someone who had been very interested in this is Toru Funayama. I don't recall if he ever published anything on it. If you can't find any of those, let me know, and I will try to find some time to do a red-ink hunt on the Dunhuang site. Somewhere I may have notes compiled from years ago. best, Dan ----- Original Message ----- From: Matthew Kapstein Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Dear colleagues, When do we first see rubrication in Indian manuscripts? And can you send me any links to images of early examples? Of course, vermilion was known and used in many contexts, but here I am particularly interested in its use in writing. with thanks in advance, Matthew Matthew Kapstein From philipp.a.maas at gmail.com Sun Nov 22 09:07:28 2015 From: philipp.a.maas at gmail.com (philipp.a.maas) Date: Sun, 22 Nov 15 10:07:28 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Message-ID: <565185d1.2269c20a.9ee01.7e27@mx.google.com> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Michael.Slouber at wwu.edu Sun Nov 22 09:19:16 2015 From: Michael.Slouber at wwu.edu (Michael Slouber) Date: Sun, 22 Nov 15 09:19:16 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <565185d1.2269c20a.9ee01.7e27@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <15E185E4-FEED-4333-942C-0420A9863418@wwu.edu> Rubrication is used on palm leaf manuscripts in Nepal from as early as the 9th century. I confirmed this with photos of the Su?rutasa?hit? manuscript. (http://www.unesco.org/new/en/kathmandu/about-this-office/single-view/news/two_manuscripts_from_nepal_now_in_unescos_prestigious_memory_of_the_world_register) ?? Michael Slouber Assistant Professor of South Asia Department of Liberal Studies Western Washington University On ???? ???????? ??, at ?:?? ?????????, philipp.a.maas > wrote: As far as the Sanskrit mss. are concerned that I have worked with, rubrication exclusively occurs in paper mss. Could it be possible that rubrication was introduced in South Asia along with the use of paper as a writing material? Best wishes, Philipp Enviado atrav?s de Huawei Mobile -------- Originalnachricht -------- Betreff: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Von: Matthew Kapstein An: Dan Lusthaus Cc: Indology Thanks, Dan, I am quite aware of Chinese, Tibetan and medieval Western rubrication, as well as late Indian materials. My query, though, specifically concerns early examples in Indian manuscripts. thanks anyway, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________________ From: Dan Lusthaus [yogacara at gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2015 2:18 AM To: Matthew Kapstein Cc: Indology Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Dear Matthew, Red writing mixed in with ordinary black ink passages already is found in Chinese mss. in Dunhuang, some perhaps dating from as early as the fifth or sixth century (though not necessarily to mark headings -- its function and purpose is a bit more mysterious). The Dunhuang ms. site http://idp.bl.uk/ has online facsimiles of some, but I haven't time now to locate specific examples (and usually the urls are temporary so they are useless in emails -- one would have to identify text numbers, etc. and do a search text by text; perhaps someone who has that corpus closer to their fingertips than I do can guide you where to look). While I don't recall offhand any Indian texts there with similar features, it is likely that the practice was being transferred across cultures. Someone who had been very interested in this is Toru Funayama. I don't recall if he ever published anything on it. If you can't find any of those, let me know, and I will try to find some time to do a red-ink hunt on the Dunhuang site. Somewhere I may have notes compiled from years ago. best, Dan ----- Original Message ----- From: Matthew Kapstein Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Dear colleagues, When do we first see rubrication in Indian manuscripts? And can you send me any links to images of early examples? Of course, vermilion was known and used in many contexts, but here I am particularly interested in its use in writing. with thanks in advance, Matthew Matthew Kapstein _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From philipp.a.maas at gmail.com Sun Nov 22 09:28:03 2015 From: philipp.a.maas at gmail.com (Philipp Maas) Date: Sun, 22 Nov 15 10:28:03 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <15E185E4-FEED-4333-942C-0420A9863418@wwu.edu> Message-ID: Thank you, Michael, for this example for rubrication on palm leaf. Are you, or is anybody else, aware of rubrication also on palm leaf mss. from South India? Philipp Am 22.11.2015 10:20 schrieb "Michael Slouber" : > Rubrication is used on palm leaf manuscripts in Nepal from as early as the > 9th century. I confirmed this with photos of the Su?rutasa?hit? > manuscript. > > ( > http://www.unesco.org/new/en/kathmandu/about-this-office/single-view/news/two_manuscripts_from_nepal_now_in_unescos_prestigious_memory_of_the_world_register) > > > ?? > Michael Slouber > Assistant Professor of South Asia > Department of Liberal Studies > Western Washington University > > > > On ???? ???????? ??, at ?:?? ?????????, philipp.a.maas < > philipp.a.maas at gmail.com> wrote: > > As far as the Sanskrit mss. are concerned that I have worked with, > rubrication exclusively occurs in paper mss. Could it be possible that > rubrication was introduced in South Asia along with the use of paper as a > writing material? > > Best wishes, > Philipp > > Enviado atrav?s de Huawei Mobile > > > -------- Originalnachricht -------- > Betreff: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. > Von: Matthew Kapstein > An: Dan Lusthaus > Cc: Indology > > > Thanks, Dan, > > I am quite aware of Chinese, Tibetan and medieval Western rubrication, as > well as late Indian materials. > My query, though, specifically concerns early examples in Indian > manuscripts. > > thanks anyway, > Matthew > > Matthew Kapstein > Directeur d'?tudes, > Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes > > Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, > The University of Chicago > > ________________________________________ > From: Dan Lusthaus [yogacara at gmail.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2015 2:18 AM > To: Matthew Kapstein > Cc: Indology > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. > > Dear Matthew, > > Red writing mixed in with ordinary black ink passages already is found in > Chinese mss. in Dunhuang, some perhaps dating from as early as the fifth or > sixth century (though not necessarily to mark headings -- its function and > purpose is a bit more mysterious). The Dunhuang ms. site http://idp.bl.uk/ > has online facsimiles of some, but I haven't time now to locate specific > examples (and usually the urls are temporary so they are useless in emails > -- one would have to identify text numbers, etc. and do a search text by > text; perhaps someone who has that corpus closer to their fingertips than I > do can guide you where to look). While I don't recall offhand any Indian > texts there with similar features, it is likely that the practice was being > transferred across cultures. > > Someone who had been very interested in this is Toru Funayama. I don't > recall if he ever published anything on it. > > If you can't find any of those, let me know, and I will try to find some > time to do a red-ink hunt on the Dunhuang site. Somewhere I may have notes > compiled from years ago. > > best, > Dan > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Matthew Kapstein > Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. > > Dear colleagues, > > When do we first see rubrication in Indian manuscripts? And can you send > me any links to > images of early examples? Of course, vermilion was known and used in many > contexts, > but here I am particularly interested in its use in writing. > > with thanks in advance, > Matthew > > Matthew Kapstein > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dipak.d2004 at gmail.com Sun Nov 22 12:14:34 2015 From: dipak.d2004 at gmail.com (Dipak Bhattacharya) Date: Sun, 22 Nov 15 17:44:34 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B13662@xm-mbx-04-prod> Message-ID: The oldest Indian manuscripts discovered in India are, perhaps, the ones from Gilgit. I have some images which do not give indication of rubrication. But they are available for checking. The difficulty lies in the paucity of old manuscripts. I may assure that from 14th century we get Odiya palmleaf mansucripts with engravings of symbols (e.g. fish) or of deities or humans as artistic presentation. The main body sometimes has symbols with colophon statements. Some of them were xeroxed in an OCE (Venlo) machine. Xeroxing then was not as developed as today; the copies on special paper became fade. Alice Boner's mss on the Sun Temple are known. My remarks were published in 1882 not with decisive hope. Arlo Griffiths seemed to disagree with me. I have not changed my view. A twelfth century Bhagavata ms was displayed in Delhi in 1964. I have not the description with me at present. Perhaps there were some paintings in it. These also should be available for checking. Best DB On Sun, Nov 22, 2015 at 1:59 PM, Matthew Kapstein wrote: > Thanks, Dan, > > I am quite aware of Chinese, Tibetan and medieval Western rubrication, as > well as late Indian materials. > My query, though, specifically concerns early examples in Indian > manuscripts. > > thanks anyway, > Matthew > > Matthew Kapstein > Directeur d'?tudes, > Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes > > Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, > The University of Chicago > > ________________________________________ > From: Dan Lusthaus [yogacara at gmail.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2015 2:18 AM > To: Matthew Kapstein > Cc: Indology > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. > > Dear Matthew, > > Red writing mixed in with ordinary black ink passages already is found in > Chinese mss. in Dunhuang, some perhaps dating from as early as the fifth or > sixth century (though not necessarily to mark headings -- its function and > purpose is a bit more mysterious). The Dunhuang ms. site http://idp.bl.uk/ > has online facsimiles of some, but I haven't time now to locate specific > examples (and usually the urls are temporary so they are useless in emails > -- one would have to identify text numbers, etc. and do a search text by > text; perhaps someone who has that corpus closer to their fingertips than I > do can guide you where to look). While I don't recall offhand any Indian > texts there with similar features, it is likely that the practice was being > transferred across cultures. > > Someone who had been very interested in this is Toru Funayama. I don't > recall if he ever published anything on it. > > If you can't find any of those, let me know, and I will try to find some > time to do a red-ink hunt on the Dunhuang site. Somewhere I may have notes > compiled from years ago. > > best, > Dan > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Matthew Kapstein > Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. > > Dear colleagues, > > When do we first see rubrication in Indian manuscripts? And can you send > me any links to > images of early examples? Of course, vermilion was known and used in many > contexts, > but here I am particularly interested in its use in writing. > > with thanks in advance, > Matthew > > Matthew Kapstein > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jpo at uts.cc.utexas.edu Sun Nov 22 13:11:31 2015 From: jpo at uts.cc.utexas.edu (Patrick Olivelle) Date: Sun, 22 Nov 15 07:11:31 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0526D02F-7A36-4CB1-B32F-7E0BFD0F016B@uts.cc.utexas.edu> I wonder whether this may have something to do with the preparation of the palm leaves for either writing with a stylus or with pen and ink. The Southern mss were of the former type, and any pigment applied to it will erase off except in the incisions made by the stylus. The ones used in the north were often of the latter type. I have seen both types coming from Nepal. The palm leaves intended for ink would of course take any other pigment applied to it as well. Patrick On Nov 22, 2015, at 3:28 AM, Philipp Maas wrote: > Thank you, Michael, for this example for rubrication on palm leaf. Are you, or is anybody else, aware of rubrication also on palm leaf mss. from South India? > > Philipp > > Am 22.11.2015 10:20 schrieb "Michael Slouber" : > Rubrication is used on palm leaf manuscripts in Nepal from as early as the 9th century. I confirmed this with photos of the Su?rutasa?hit? manuscript. > > (http://www.unesco.org/new/en/kathmandu/about-this-office/single-view/news/two_manuscripts_from_nepal_now_in_unescos_prestigious_memory_of_the_world_register) > > ?? > Michael Slouber > Assistant Professor of South Asia > Department of Liberal Studies > Western Washington University > > > >> On ???? ???????? ??, at ?:?? ?????????, philipp.a.maas wrote: >> >> As far as the Sanskrit mss. are concerned that I have worked with, rubrication exclusively occurs in paper mss. Could it be possible that rubrication was introduced in South Asia along with the use of paper as a writing material? >> >> Best wishes, >> Philipp >> >> Enviado atrav?s de Huawei Mobile >> >> >> -------- Originalnachricht -------- >> Betreff: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. >> Von: Matthew Kapstein >> An: Dan Lusthaus >> Cc: Indology >> >> >> Thanks, Dan, >> >> I am quite aware of Chinese, Tibetan and medieval Western rubrication, as well as late Indian materials. >> My query, though, specifically concerns early examples in Indian manuscripts. >> >> thanks anyway, >> Matthew >> >> Matthew Kapstein >> Directeur d'?tudes, >> Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes >> >> Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, >> The University of Chicago >> >> ________________________________________ >> From: Dan Lusthaus [yogacara at gmail.com] >> Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2015 2:18 AM >> To: Matthew Kapstein >> Cc: Indology >> Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. >> >> Dear Matthew, >> >> Red writing mixed in with ordinary black ink passages already is found in Chinese mss. in Dunhuang, some perhaps dating from as early as the fifth or sixth century (though not necessarily to mark headings -- its function and purpose is a bit more mysterious). The Dunhuang ms. site http://idp.bl.uk/ has online facsimiles of some, but I haven't time now to locate specific examples (and usually the urls are temporary so they are useless in emails -- one would have to identify text numbers, etc. and do a search text by text; perhaps someone who has that corpus closer to their fingertips than I do can guide you where to look). While I don't recall offhand any Indian texts there with similar features, it is likely that the practice was being transferred across cultures. >> >> Someone who had been very interested in this is Toru Funayama. I don't recall if he ever published anything on it. >> >> If you can't find any of those, let me know, and I will try to find some time to do a red-ink hunt on the Dunhuang site. Somewhere I may have notes compiled from years ago. >> >> best, >> Dan >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Matthew Kapstein >> Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. >> >> Dear colleagues, >> >> When do we first see rubrication in Indian manuscripts? And can you send me any links to >> images of early examples? Of course, vermilion was known and used in many contexts, >> but here I am particularly interested in its use in writing. >> >> with thanks in advance, >> Matthew >> >> Matthew Kapstein >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Sun Nov 22 18:02:00 2015 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Sun, 22 Nov 15 18:02:00 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B1359F@xm-mbx-04-prod> Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B13811@xm-mbx-04-prod> Thanks to all for your interventions about this. I had first thought,with Philipp, that rubrication was a rather late development in India, and so it may well be in general. Michael's very helpful link, however, makes clear that relatively early examples are known, and Patrick's observation about the use of the stylus clarifies why it may not have become widespread. If there are no instances known from Gilgit or Gandh?ra, might we then reasonably posit that it began to be introduced into scribal practice during only the late first millennium? All of this uncertain of course. Ninth century Tibetan mss from Dunhuang are sometimes rubricated. Might Nepal have been influenced by practices up north? What do we know of rubrication in other central Asian languages--Tocharian, khotanese etc? Of course, my purpose in all this is to sort out the possible influences on Tibet. China remains a prime suspect, but not the only one. Best, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago __ From Michael.Slouber at wwu.edu Mon Nov 23 02:13:43 2015 From: Michael.Slouber at wwu.edu (Michael Slouber) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 02:13:43 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <15E185E4-FEED-4333-942C-0420A9863418@wwu.edu> Message-ID: <1DE4B76E-E355-42AB-A94A-AC5D9693EE91@wwu.edu> Dear List, I would like to revise my statement that Nepalese palmleaf manuscripts use rubrication from the 9th century. What they do is use red ink as a sort of highlighting for section boundary marks, and later, colophons, but they do not use it for the writing itself in examples that I have seen. Dr. Kapstein?s query is still very much open, then. ?? Michael Slouber Assistant Professor of South Asia Department of Liberal Studies Western Washington University On ???? ???????? ??, at ?:?? ?????????, Michael Slouber > wrote: Rubrication is used on palm leaf manuscripts in Nepal from as early as the 9th century. I confirmed this with photos of the Su?rutasa?hit? manuscript. (http://www.unesco.org/new/en/kathmandu/about-this-office/single-view/news/two_manuscripts_from_nepal_now_in_unescos_prestigious_memory_of_the_world_register) ?? Michael Slouber Assistant Professor of South Asia Department of Liberal Studies Western Washington University On ???? ???????? ??, at ?:?? ?????????, philipp.a.maas > wrote: As far as the Sanskrit mss. are concerned that I have worked with, rubrication exclusively occurs in paper mss. Could it be possible that rubrication was introduced in South Asia along with the use of paper as a writing material? Best wishes, Philipp Enviado atrav?s de Huawei Mobile -------- Originalnachricht -------- Betreff: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Von: Matthew Kapstein An: Dan Lusthaus Cc: Indology Thanks, Dan, I am quite aware of Chinese, Tibetan and medieval Western rubrication, as well as late Indian materials. My query, though, specifically concerns early examples in Indian manuscripts. thanks anyway, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________________ From: Dan Lusthaus [yogacara at gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2015 2:18 AM To: Matthew Kapstein Cc: Indology Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Dear Matthew, Red writing mixed in with ordinary black ink passages already is found in Chinese mss. in Dunhuang, some perhaps dating from as early as the fifth or sixth century (though not necessarily to mark headings -- its function and purpose is a bit more mysterious). The Dunhuang ms. site http://idp.bl.uk/ has online facsimiles of some, but I haven't time now to locate specific examples (and usually the urls are temporary so they are useless in emails -- one would have to identify text numbers, etc. and do a search text by text; perhaps someone who has that corpus closer to their fingertips than I do can guide you where to look). While I don't recall offhand any Indian texts there with similar features, it is likely that the practice was being transferred across cultures. Someone who had been very interested in this is Toru Funayama. I don't recall if he ever published anything on it. If you can't find any of those, let me know, and I will try to find some time to do a red-ink hunt on the Dunhuang site. Somewhere I may have notes compiled from years ago. best, Dan ----- Original Message ----- From: Matthew Kapstein Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Dear colleagues, When do we first see rubrication in Indian manuscripts? And can you send me any links to images of early examples? Of course, vermilion was known and used in many contexts, but here I am particularly interested in its use in writing. with thanks in advance, Matthew Matthew Kapstein _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dominic.goodall at gmail.com Mon Nov 23 02:52:46 2015 From: dominic.goodall at gmail.com (Dominic Goodall) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 08:22:46 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <1DE4B76E-E355-42AB-A94A-AC5D9693EE91@wwu.edu> Message-ID: <6FB3C7C2-3914-4F9F-B46C-9D8F552F7786@gmail.com> Dear List, In the 9th-century ??rama-charter inscriptions of the Khmer king Ya?odharavarman, students are to be given blank palm-leaves, ink and m?tsn?, which has consistently been translated (Bergaigne 1893:430, C?d?s 1932:103) as ?craie? (?chalk?). But might it refer to ?clay?, for example, for the kind of reddish highlighting to which Michael Slouber has referred ? Here is the passage in question, which recurs in several inscriptions: K. 279, LXXXVII ab. (11) riktapattra? ma??? m?tsn?? dady?d adhyet?s?dhave To the virtuous student, one should give blank leave[s], ink (Bergaigne & C?d?s : ? du noir animal ?) and clay (Bergaigne & C?d?s : ? de la craie ?). Why did Bergaigne assume m?tsn? to be chalk ? Bergaigne observes (1893:430, fn.8): ?Du noir animal pour noircir les feuillets, de la craie pour y ?crire.? And he refers back to a footnote of Auguste Barthe (1885:31, fn.5) reporting that an ancient Chinese account refers to the use by the Khmers of blackened deerskin for writing upon. This suggests that Bergaigne imagined that the inscription refers to blank ?leaves? of deerskin that were blackened and written upon with chalk. Today, now that we have more context, it seems more likely that the Khmers in the ninth century shared the South Indian technology of the book (writing by incision into palm-leaves), and so the interpretation of m?tsn? by ?chalk? should probably therefore be abandoned. But then what was the m?tsn? and what was it for ? Dominic Goodall EFEO, Pondicherry > On 23-Nov-2015, at 7:43 am, Michael Slouber wrote: > > Dear List, > > I would like to revise my statement that Nepalese palmleaf manuscripts use rubrication from the 9th century. What they do is use red ink as a sort of highlighting for section boundary marks, and later, colophons, but they do not use it for the writing itself in examples that I have seen. > > Dr. Kapstein?s query is still very much open, then. > > ?? > Michael Slouber > Assistant Professor of South Asia > Department of Liberal Studies > Western Washington University > > > >> On ???? ???????? ??, at ?:?? ?????????, Michael Slouber > wrote: >> >> Rubrication is used on palm leaf manuscripts in Nepal from as early as the 9th century. I confirmed this with photos of the Su?rutasa?hit? manuscript. >> >> (http://www.unesco.org/new/en/kathmandu/about-this-office/single-view/news/two_manuscripts_from_nepal_now_in_unescos_prestigious_memory_of_the_world_register ) >> >> ?? >> Michael Slouber >> Assistant Professor of South Asia >> Department of Liberal Studies >> Western Washington University >> >> >> >>> On ???? ???????? ??, at ?:?? ?????????, philipp.a.maas > wrote: >>> >>> As far as the Sanskrit mss. are concerned that I have worked with, rubrication exclusively occurs in paper mss. Could it be possible that rubrication was introduced in South Asia along with the use of paper as a writing material? >>> >>> Best wishes, >>> Philipp >>> >>> Enviado atrav?s de Huawei Mobile >>> >>> >>> -------- Originalnachricht -------- >>> Betreff: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. >>> Von: Matthew Kapstein >>> An: Dan Lusthaus >>> Cc: Indology >>> >>> >>> Thanks, Dan, >>> >>> I am quite aware of Chinese, Tibetan and medieval Western rubrication, as well as late Indian materials. >>> My query, though, specifically concerns early examples in Indian manuscripts. >>> >>> thanks anyway, >>> Matthew >>> >>> Matthew Kapstein >>> Directeur d'?tudes, >>> Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes >>> >>> Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, >>> The University of Chicago >>> >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: Dan Lusthaus [yogacara at gmail.com ] >>> Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2015 2:18 AM >>> To: Matthew Kapstein >>> Cc: Indology >>> Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. >>> >>> Dear Matthew, >>> >>> Red writing mixed in with ordinary black ink passages already is found in Chinese mss. in Dunhuang, some perhaps dating from as early as the fifth or sixth century (though not necessarily to mark headings -- its function and purpose is a bit more mysterious). The Dunhuang ms. site http://idp.bl.uk/ has online facsimiles of some, but I haven't time now to locate specific examples (and usually the urls are temporary so they are useless in emails -- one would have to identify text numbers, etc. and do a search text by text; perhaps someone who has that corpus closer to their fingertips than I do can guide you where to look). While I don't recall offhand any Indian texts there with similar features, it is likely that the practice was being transferred across cultures. >>> >>> Someone who had been very interested in this is Toru Funayama. I don't recall if he ever published anything on it. >>> >>> If you can't find any of those, let me know, and I will try to find some time to do a red-ink hunt on the Dunhuang site. Somewhere I may have notes compiled from years ago. >>> >>> best, >>> Dan >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: Matthew Kapstein >>> Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. >>> >>> Dear colleagues, >>> >>> When do we first see rubrication in Indian manuscripts? And can you send me any links to >>> images of early examples? Of course, vermilion was known and used in many contexts, >>> but here I am particularly interested in its use in writing. >>> >>> with thanks in advance, >>> Matthew >>> >>> Matthew Kapstein >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Mon Nov 23 08:47:28 2015 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 08:47:28 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <6FB3C7C2-3914-4F9F-B46C-9D8F552F7786@gmail.com> Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B13989@xm-mbx-04-prod> Dear Dominic, A little passage like this is a treasure. Is there any possibility that m?tsn? refers to an agent that may have been used to treat the leaves so as to keep them supple and/or free of insects, etc.? Or might it have been used in smoothing the leaves? A useful summary of palm-leaf writing technology - http://www.idc.iitb.ac.in/resources/dt-july-2009/Palm.pdf refers to several such agents, though none are earths (as one would expect m?tsn? to have been). (The illuminated folio labeled in the article as fig. 1.2 must be much earlier than the 18th c. date assigned to it here, by the way.) best, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christoph.emmrich at utoronto.ca Mon Nov 23 08:53:15 2015 From: christoph.emmrich at utoronto.ca (Christoph Emmrich) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 08:53:15 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <6FB3C7C2-3914-4F9F-B46C-9D8F552F7786@gmail.com> Message-ID: <67D489B2-375B-4438-A623-4857AB7CA917@utoronto.ca> Dear Dominic, Bergaigne's and C?d?s' comments remind me more of the Burmese leporello-format "black" parabaik (purapuik), manufactured out of the pulp of mulberry bark or bamboo, blackened with rice water and ground charcoal and written upon with steatite or limestone/chalk. In Burma, until the Konbaung period, black parabaiks were, -except for things prestigious, - the most popular writing materials and were used for pretty much everything that needed to (or, depending on the perspective, needn't) be written down (and as easily erased, usually by re-blackening, for reuse of the support) - from administrative texts and astrological calculations, to sketches, student notes and even doodles. For details see Lammerts, Notes on Burmese Manuscripts, Journal of Burma Studies 14, 2010, 241-244. Warm regards, Christoph ---- Christoph Emmrich Associate Professor, Buddhist Studies Chair, Numata Program UofT/McMaster University of Toronto http://www.religion.utoronto.ca/people/faculty/christoph-emmrich/ http://www.obwg-sshrc-uoft.ca Department for the Study of Religion University of Toronto, 170 St. George Street Jackman Humanities Building, Room 303 Toronto, Ontario M5R 2M8, Canada +416.978.6463 (o), +416.978.1610 (f) Private, currently: Villa Devotion, 8, rue Labourdonnais, Pondicherry 605001, India +91 80-56695992 christoph.emmrich at utoronto.ca Sent from my iPhone On 23-Nov-2015, at 8:23 AM, Dominic Goodall > wrote: Dear List, In the 9th-century ??rama-charter inscriptions of the Khmer king Ya?odharavarman, students are to be given blank palm-leaves, ink and m?tsn?, which has consistently been translated (Bergaigne 1893:430, C?d?s 1932:103) as ?craie? (?chalk?). But might it refer to ?clay?, for example, for the kind of reddish highlighting to which Michael Slouber has referred ? Here is the passage in question, which recurs in several inscriptions: K. 279, LXXXVII ab. (11) riktapattra? ma??? m?tsn?? dady?d adhyet?s?dhave To the virtuous student, one should give blank leave[s], ink (Bergaigne & C?d?s : ? du noir animal ?) and clay (Bergaigne & C?d?s : ? de la craie ?). Why did Bergaigne assume m?tsn? to be chalk ? Bergaigne observes (1893:430, fn.8): ?Du noir animal pour noircir les feuillets, de la craie pour y ?crire.? And he refers back to a footnote of Auguste Barthe (1885:31, fn.5) reporting that an ancient Chinese account refers to the use by the Khmers of blackened deerskin for writing upon. This suggests that Bergaigne imagined that the inscription refers to blank ?leaves? of deerskin that were blackened and written upon with chalk. Today, now that we have more context, it seems more likely that the Khmers in the ninth century shared the South Indian technology of the book (writing by incision into palm-leaves), and so the interpretation of m?tsn? by ?chalk? should probably therefore be abandoned. But then what was the m?tsn? and what was it for ? Dominic Goodall EFEO, Pondicherry On 23-Nov-2015, at 7:43 am, Michael Slouber > wrote: Dear List, I would like to revise my statement that Nepalese palmleaf manuscripts use rubrication from the 9th century. What they do is use red ink as a sort of highlighting for section boundary marks, and later, colophons, but they do not use it for the writing itself in examples that I have seen. Dr. Kapstein?s query is still very much open, then. ?? Michael Slouber Assistant Professor of South Asia Department of Liberal Studies Western Washington University On ???? ???????? ??, at ?:?? ?????????, Michael Slouber > wrote: Rubrication is used on palm leaf manuscripts in Nepal from as early as the 9th century. I confirmed this with photos of the Su?rutasa?hit? manuscript. (http://www.unesco.org/new/en/kathmandu/about-this-office/single-view/news/two_manuscripts_from_nepal_now_in_unescos_prestigious_memory_of_the_world_register) ?? Michael Slouber Assistant Professor of South Asia Department of Liberal Studies Western Washington University On ???? ???????? ??, at ?:?? ?????????, philipp.a.maas > wrote: As far as the Sanskrit mss. are concerned that I have worked with, rubrication exclusively occurs in paper mss. Could it be possible that rubrication was introduced in South Asia along with the use of paper as a writing material? Best wishes, Philipp Enviado atrav?s de Huawei Mobile -------- Originalnachricht -------- Betreff: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Von: Matthew Kapstein An: Dan Lusthaus Cc: Indology Thanks, Dan, I am quite aware of Chinese, Tibetan and medieval Western rubrication, as well as late Indian materials. My query, though, specifically concerns early examples in Indian manuscripts. thanks anyway, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________________ From: Dan Lusthaus [yogacara at gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, November 22, 2015 2:18 AM To: Matthew Kapstein Cc: Indology Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Dear Matthew, Red writing mixed in with ordinary black ink passages already is found in Chinese mss. in Dunhuang, some perhaps dating from as early as the fifth or sixth century (though not necessarily to mark headings -- its function and purpose is a bit more mysterious). The Dunhuang ms. site http://idp.bl.uk/ has online facsimiles of some, but I haven't time now to locate specific examples (and usually the urls are temporary so they are useless in emails -- one would have to identify text numbers, etc. and do a search text by text; perhaps someone who has that corpus closer to their fingertips than I do can guide you where to look). While I don't recall offhand any Indian texts there with similar features, it is likely that the practice was being transferred across cultures. Someone who had been very interested in this is Toru Funayama. I don't recall if he ever published anything on it. If you can't find any of those, let me know, and I will try to find some time to do a red-ink hunt on the Dunhuang site. Somewhere I may have notes compiled from years ago. best, Dan ----- Original Message ----- From: Matthew Kapstein Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Dear colleagues, When do we first see rubrication in Indian manuscripts? And can you send me any links to images of early examples? Of course, vermilion was known and used in many contexts, but here I am particularly interested in its use in writing. with thanks in advance, Matthew Matthew Kapstein _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Mon Nov 23 09:01:10 2015 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 09:01:10 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <67D489B2-375B-4438-A623-4857AB7CA917@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B139A2@xm-mbx-04-prod> Dear Christoph, Your comment is very interesting, and there does seem to be a prima facie similarity between what is described in Dominic's passage and parabaik techniques. But when does paper-making (or parabaik-making) technology begin in SE Asia? What do we know of its early history in the region? all best, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From shrinsaha at gmail.com Mon Nov 23 11:12:36 2015 From: shrinsaha at gmail.com (Niranjan Saha) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 16:42:36 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Ecology, Classical Knowledge System, and Social-political-religious Concerns In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Tyler, Mark, Elisa, Rocco, Prasadji, and the list, So much thanks to you all for your prompt answer and the help to clarify the point in question, and also for sending me the required links and material. I've noted your suggestions etc.minutely, and kept them as a boon for the future (in case I need to deal with the subject in detail, about which I do not still have much study etc.). With regards, Niranjan Saha, PhD On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 10:15 PM, Tyler Williams wrote: > Dear Niranjan, > > Kalyanakrishnan Sivaramakrishnan and Mahesh Rangarajan have edited a > two volume environmental history of India that, while not always > dealing directly with the question of knowledge systems, often touches > upon them. It might be a good starting point for finding references. > > 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the > Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. > > 2011. Environmental History of India 1: From Earliest Times to the > Colonial Period. New Delhi: Permanent Black. 464 pps. > > Best, > Tyler > > > > On Tue, Nov 17, 2015 at 12:22 AM, Niranjan Saha > wrote: > > Dear List, > > > > Could anybody shed light on the environmental humanities and its > relation to > > or influence on the formation of classical knowledge system and vice > versa, > > including the contemporary or pre-modern environmental debate in > relation to > > the socio-political-religious formations connected to the regional > systems > > in South and East Asia and Europe? > > > > Sharing of any articles and links will be highly appreciated. > > > > > > > > With regards, > > Niranjan Saha > > > > _______________________________________________ > > INDOLOGY mailing list > > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > > committee) > > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christoph.emmrich at utoronto.ca Mon Nov 23 13:18:52 2015 From: christoph.emmrich at utoronto.ca (Christoph Emmrich) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 13:18:52 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B139A2@xm-mbx-04-prod> Message-ID: Dear Matthew, Anthony Reid (A History of Southeast Asia: Critical Crossroads, 2015: 133) mentions the import of paper to SEA from China in the 15th cent., and there is the 14th cent. Niitisaararasamuccaya ms. from Kerinci. Also, there is an indication in a Bagan inscription, dated 1223, that features both the terms parabaik (i.e. other than palm leaf) and a donation of steatite in a container typical for usage on black (paper) parabaik more recently. Lammerts (2010, 232, fn. 7 and 10) points out that the terms and materials mentioned there may, but need not necessarily point to the usage of paper. Many thanks for raising this intriguing larger question, Matthew. Warmly, Christoph ---- Sent from my iPhone On 23-Nov-2015, at 2:31 PM, Matthew Kapstein > wrote: Dear Christoph, Your comment is very interesting, and there does seem to be a prima facie similarity between what is described in Dominic's passage and parabaik techniques. But when does paper-making (or parabaik-making) technology begin in SE Asia? What do we know of its early history in the region? all best, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From m.gluckman at anu.edu.au Mon Nov 23 18:18:50 2015 From: m.gluckman at anu.edu.au (Martin Gluckman) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 23:48:50 +0530 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Y=C4=81ska's_Nirukta_-_Digital_editions_and_word_lists?= Message-ID: Dear Friends, I am searching for digital editions of Y?ska's Nirukta (both the source text and any translations done till date) and any other digital material in this light (word lists with definitions as given in any translations/commentary and so forth). With much appreciation in advance, Martin Gluckman -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karp at uw.edu.pl Mon Nov 23 18:32:23 2015 From: karp at uw.edu.pl (Artur Karp) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 19:32:23 +0100 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]=09Y=C4=81ska's_Nirukta_-_Digital_editions_and_word_lists?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Martin, use this archive.org link to download the 1967 edition of the Nighantu and Nirukta: https://archive.org/details/nighantuniruktao00yaskuoft Best, Artur Karp 2015-11-23 19:18 GMT+01:00 Martin Gluckman : > Dear Friends, > > I am searching for digital editions of Y?ska's Nirukta (both the source > text and any translations done till date) and any other digital material in > this light (word lists with definitions as given in any > translations/commentary and so forth). > > With much appreciation in advance, > > Martin Gluckman > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rsalomon at u.washington.edu Mon Nov 23 19:14:56 2015 From: rsalomon at u.washington.edu (Richard Salomon) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 11:14:56 -0800 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B139A2@xm-mbx-04-prod> Message-ID: <565365B0.4030703@u.washington.edu> I don't have the material at hand, but I think there were comments on rubrication in Nepali mss. somewhere among the three technical articles at the beginning of the current volume of the Journal of the International Association of Buddhist Studies. Rich On 11/23/2015 1:01 AM, Matthew Kapstein wrote: > Dear Christoph, > > Your comment is very interesting, and there does seem to be a prima > facie similarity between > what is described in Dominic's passage and parabaik techniques. But > when does paper-making > (or parabaik-making) technology begin in SE Asia? What do we know of > its early history in the > region? > > all best, > Matthew > > Matthew Kapstein > Directeur d'?tudes, > Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes > > Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, > The University of Chicago > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -- ---------------------- Richard Salomon Department of Asian Languages and Literature University of Washington, Box 353521 Seattle WA 98195-3521 USA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mmdesh at umich.edu Mon Nov 23 19:17:59 2015 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 14:17:59 -0500 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]=09Y=C4=81ska's_Nirukta_-_Digital_editions_and_word_lists?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Siddheshwar Varma's book "Etymologies of Yaska" may be useful to you. Madhav Deshpande On Mon, Nov 23, 2015 at 1:18 PM, Martin Gluckman wrote: > Dear Friends, > > I am searching for digital editions of Y?ska's Nirukta (both the source > text and any translations done till date) and any other digital material in > this light (word lists with definitions as given in any > translations/commentary and so forth). > > With much appreciation in advance, > > Martin Gluckman > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- Madhav M. Deshpande Professor of Sanskrit and Linguistics Department of Asian Languages and Cultures 202 South Thayer Street, Suite 6111 The University of Michigan Ann Arbor, MI 48104-1608, USA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tccahill at loyno.edu Mon Nov 23 19:24:20 2015 From: tccahill at loyno.edu (Tim Cahill) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 13:24:20 -0600 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Y=C4=81ska's_Nirukta_-_Digital_editions_and_word_lists?= Message-ID: <565367E4.6050207@loyno.edu> Peter Scharf's XML edition is available here - http://sanskritlibrary.org/catalogsText/nirukta.html best, Tim Cahill Loyola University New Orleans From arlogriffiths at hotmail.com Mon Nov 23 19:29:11 2015 From: arlogriffiths at hotmail.com (Arlo Griffiths) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 19:29:11 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear colleagues, However interesting the evidence for non-palmleaf writing materials in early Southeast Asia, it must not be ignored that the epigraphical passage cited by Dominic explicitly mentions palmleaf (riktapattra). I think we have to come to terms with some use of 'earth' in the contexts of writing on palmleaf. Further evidence for such a practice is furnished in some passages cited in this interesting article on manuscript culture of early Java: Aditia Gunawan. 2015. ?Nipah or Gebang? A Philological and Codicological Study Based on Sources from West Java.? Bijdragen tot de Taal-, Land- en Volkenkunde / Journal of the Humanities and Social Sciences of Southeast Asia 171 (2-3): 249?80. doi:10.1163/22134379-17101004. I attach the article hereto. The sources are in Old Javanese and in Old Sundanese language; the context is explicitly that of writing on one or the other type of palmleaf (the local term lontar comes from rontal 'leaf of palm', where tal = t?la); the word for 'earth' is tanah, which still means 'earth' in Malay/Indonesian. Aditia Gunawan briefly discusses but does not solve the problem of what purpose 'earth' would serve in writing on palmleaf. Best wishes, Arlo Griffiths ?cole fran?aise d'Extr?me-Orient, Paris Universit? Jean Moulin ? Lyon 3 From: christoph.emmrich at utoronto.ca To: mkapstei at uchicago.edu Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2015 13:18:52 +0000 Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. CC: indology at list.indology.info Dear Matthew, Anthony Reid (A History of Southeast Asia: Critical Crossroads, 2015: 133) mentions the import of paper to SEA from China in the 15th cent., and there is the 14th cent. Niitisaararasamuccaya ms. from Kerinci. Also, there is an indication in a Bagan inscription, dated 1223, that features both the terms parabaik (i.e. other than palm leaf) and a donation of steatite in a container typical for usage on black (paper) parabaik more recently. Lammerts (2010, 232, fn. 7 and 10) points out that the terms and materials mentioned there may, but need not necessarily point to the usage of paper. Many thanks for raising this intriguing larger question, Matthew. Warmly, Christoph ---- Sent from my iPhone On 23-Nov-2015, at 2:31 PM, Matthew Kapstein wrote: Dear Christoph, Your comment is very interesting, and there does seem to be a prima facie similarity between what is described in Dominic's passage and parabaik techniques. But when does paper-making (or parabaik-making) technology begin in SE Asia? What do we know of its early history in the region? all best, Matthew Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Gunawan2015NipahorGebang.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 287344 bytes Desc: not available URL: From r.mahoney at indica-et-buddhica.org Mon Nov 23 19:42:38 2015 From: r.mahoney at indica-et-buddhica.org (Richard Mahoney) Date: Tue, 24 Nov 15 08:42:38 +1300 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Indica et Buddhica Scholiast (Publication Announcement) Message-ID: <56536C2E.6080805@indica-et-buddhica.org> Dear Colleagues, I am pleased to announce the release of Scholiast, a bibliographic resource for Buddhist Studies researchers: Indica et Buddhica Scholiast http://indica-et-buddhica.org/scholia-scholiast/scholiast With best regards, Richard Mahoney -- Richard Mahoney Littledene Bay Road Oxford NZ M: +64-21-064-0216 T: +64-3-312-1699 r.mahoney at indica-et-buddhica.org From yogacara at gmail.com Mon Nov 23 20:07:26 2015 From: yogacara at gmail.com (Dan Lusthaus) Date: Mon, 23 Nov 15 15:07:26 -0500 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_Fw:__Y=C4=81ska's_Nirukta_-_Digital_editions_and_word_lists?= Message-ID: <788191BB8B6A42AE8CDA1F944C09E1B2@Dan> Dear Martin, For some reason GRETIL no longer carries Y?ska. I saved a copy that used to be there, which I am attaching. Since it marks word boundaries with periods e-searches have to be careful. Lakshman Sarup's edition and translation is quite readable. L. Sarup. The Nigha??u and the Nirukta. Motilal Banarsidass (numerous rpts) The following discuss Yaska in detail, primarily evaluating his etymologies from the perspective of modern 'scientific' etymologies: Siddheshwar Varma. The Etymologies of Y?ska. Hoshiarpur: Vishveshvanand Institute Publications, 1953 and Hannes Skold. The Nirukta: Its place in old Indian Literature and Etymologies. Lund, London, Paris, Oxford, Leipzig, 1926 I'm unaware of e-editions of those. best, Dan Lusthaus ----- Original Message ----- From: Martin Gluckman To: Indology List Sent: Monday, November 23, 2015 1:18 PM Subject: [INDOLOGY] Y?ska's Nirukta - Digital editions and word lists Dear Friends, I am searching for digital editions of Y?ska's Nirukta (both the source text and any translations done till date) and any other digital material in this light (word lists with definitions as given in any translations/commentary and so forth). With much appreciation in advance, Martin Gluckman ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be Tue Nov 24 11:02:33 2015 From: christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be (Christophe Vielle) Date: Tue, 24 Nov 15 12:02:33 +0100 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_Fw:__Y=C4=81ska's_Nirukta_-_Digital_editions_and_word_lists?= In-Reply-To: <788191BB8B6A42AE8CDA1F944C09E1B2@Dan> Message-ID: <20B4C961-3689-465A-9CE7-84F002EF8298@uclouvain.be> - The Nirukta is still to be found on GRETIL in Veda > Vedanga > Pratisakhyas http://gretil.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gret_utf.htm#Nirukta http://gretil.sub.uni-goettingen.de/gretil/1_sanskr/1_veda/5_vedang/3_pratis/niruktau.htm - On Indologica/Digitalisierte Werke , there is a reference to the 1st ed. (1921) of Sarup + to Roth's edition of 1852: The Nighan?t?u and the Nirukta : the oldest Indian treatise on etymology, philology and semantics / critically ed. from original manuscripts and transl. for the first time into English, with introd., exegetical and critical notes, three indexes and eight appendices. English Translation and Notes by Lakshman Sarup. - London : Oxford University Press, 1921. - 259 S. URL: http://library.du.ac.in/dspace/handle/1/1765 (Digital Library, University of Delhi) Dateiformat: PDF Notiz: In der Vorlage fehlt das Titelblatt Roth, Rudolf von (1821-1895) [Hrsg.] Ja?ska's Nirukta sammt den Nighan?t?avas / hrsg. und erla?utert von Rudolph Roth. - Go?ttingen : Verlag der Dieterichschen Buchhandlung, 1852. - LXXII, 228, 230 S. Notiz: Ya?ska: Nirukta. URL: http://books.google.com/books?id=eagIAAAAQAAJ (Google Books. Digitalisiert: 13. Juni 2007, Vorlage: Oxford University) Dateiformat: G; PDF - On the DLI < http://www.new1.dli.ernet.in > s.v. "Nirukta", no less than 4 pages of references : various editions (e.g. the one by H.M. & R.G. Bhadkamkar, vols 1 & 2, 1918 & 1942, Bombay Sanskrit and Prakrit Series 73 & 85) and works (e.g. Yaskas Nirukta And The Science Of Etymology. Bhattacharya,Bishnupada. 1958). Note that for the DLI, a better viewing (and whole .pdf) is now available for some items, see this one: http://dli.serc.iisc.ernet.in/handle/2015/283544 Le 23 nov. 2015 ? 21:07, Dan Lusthaus a ?crit : > Dear Martin, > > For some reason GRETIL no longer carries Y?ska. I saved a copy that used to be there, which I am attaching. Since it marks word boundaries with periods e-searches have to be careful. > > Lakshman Sarup's edition and translation is quite readable. > > L. Sarup. The Nigha??u and the Nirukta. Motilal Banarsidass (numerous rpts) > > The following discuss Yaska in detail, primarily evaluating his etymologies from the perspective of modern 'scientific' etymologies: > > Siddheshwar Varma. The Etymologies of Y?ska. Hoshiarpur: Vishveshvanand Institute Publications, 1953 > and > Hannes Skold. The Nirukta: Its place in old Indian Literature and Etymologies. Lund, London, Paris, Oxford, Leipzig, 1926 > > I'm unaware of e-editions of those. > > best, > Dan Lusthaus > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Martin Gluckman > To: Indology List > Sent: Monday, November 23, 2015 1:18 PM > Subject: [INDOLOGY] Y?ska's Nirukta - Digital editions and word lists > > Dear Friends, > > I am searching for digital editions of Y?ska's Nirukta (both the source text and any translations done till date) and any other digital material in this light (word lists with definitions as given in any translations/commentary and so forth). > > With much appreciation in advance, > > Martin Gluckman > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) ??????????????????? Christophe Vielle Louvain-la-Neuve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From elena.mucciarelli at indo.uni-tuebingen.de Tue Nov 24 19:20:30 2015 From: elena.mucciarelli at indo.uni-tuebingen.de (Elena Mucciarelli) Date: Tue, 24 Nov 15 20:20:30 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Paper & Pixel II, 17.-21.12.2015 Message-ID: <9DD75044-E8BA-46A3-A66C-6154E3D872A4@indo.uni-tuebingen.de> Dear members of the list, we have the pleasure to announce that the workshop "Paper & Pixel II: International Winter School on Digital Humanities in Indology? will take place from the 17th until the 21st of December 2015 in the venue of the University of T?bingen. This is a follow up of the first workshop on Digital Humanities in Indology held at the University of T?bingen in July 2014. Both students and scholars are welcome.The participation is free of charge. Here below a provisional program. Best regards, PD Dr. Heike Oberlin & Dr. Elena Mucciarelli -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Programme_PaperPixelII_K.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 576098 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com Wed Nov 25 03:10:53 2015 From: hspier.muktabodha at gmail.com (Harry Spier) Date: Tue, 24 Nov 15 22:10:53 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] E-mail of Matthias Ahlborn needed Message-ID: Dear list members, Can someone supply me with the email address of Matthias Ahlborn Harry Spier Manager, Muktabodha Digital Library -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dominic.goodall at gmail.com Wed Nov 25 04:42:17 2015 From: dominic.goodall at gmail.com (Dominic Goodall) Date: Wed, 25 Nov 15 10:12:17 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear colleagues, I am grateful for all this (for me) new information about parabaik, nipah, gebang. Arlo is right that the ??rama-foundation charters mention blank ?leaves? (riktapattra). The same ninth-century charters record (verse 98) that 6 leaf-preparers (?a? pattrak?rak??) are to be employed at each ??rama, as well as two scribes (lekhakau) and two librarians (pustakarak?akau). The word pattra could, of course, be a figurative way of referring to some other writing material, but this seems unlikely. The ?earth? used in Aditia Gunawan?s passages seems rather likely to be a blackening agent, and so, on the face of it, unlikely to be parallel to the m?tsn?, for the same sentence in the charters refers also to ma??, which is presumably black. As for the possibility that m?tsn? refers to chalk, that might have been suggested not only by the Chinese allusion to blackened deerskin but also by an awareness of parabaik-use that Christoph has informed us about. These may have been invented later, but is also, I suppose, not inconceivable that palm-leaves might have been blackened and written upon with chalk or something similar. And yet it seemed to me odd to understand m?tsn? to be chalk. Does m?tsn? ever mean chalk in any other context ? Surely m?tsn? is almost invariably mud or clay (of differing colours), often used for smearing ? This was what led me to the idea that m?tsn? might have been used for the kind of ?rubrication? effect by smearing with a coloured substance to highlight letters or words or colophon-florets. (By the way, I notice a few instances of such smearing of colophon-florets also on the 9th-century Nepalese manuscript that transmits the Ni?v?satattvasa?hit?, but they might of course have been added by some later user.) But I have just now come across another intriguing passage that seems likely to throw light on the question, even if at the moment it perplexes me. Perhaps colleagues on the list will have suggestions. The passage in question is verse 134 of the immense 298-verse stela commemorating the foundation of the ?aiva temple known today as Pre Rup in 883 ?aka. It is, of course, part of a description of the king. yad?ya? ?aram?tsn?bhir yya?a? k?mena k?ntijam h?dya? h?di varastr???? lagna? likhitam ak?aram C?d?s interpretation is this: The glory that was born of his beauty, and that was pleasing to the heart, was a written character (ak?aram) that Kama had engraved indelibly (ak?aram) in the hearts of noble women with the powder of his arrows (?aram?tsn?bhi?). (La gloire n?e de sa beaut?, et plaisante au c?ur, ?tait un caract?re d??criture que l?Amour avait grav? d?une fa?on ind?l?bile dans le c?ur des nobles femmes avec la poudre de ses fl?ches.) This is fine as far as it goes. The verse recalls the convention of heroes marking their arrows with names (usually their own) before shooting them, and there is an elegant play on ak?ara. But what can the ?powder of his arrows? be ? Is there some arcanum of dhanu??stra that could explain this ? Or does the poet invite us to imagine simply that some clay or power was used to mark the name of the king upon the arrows that were then fired off by K?madeva ? But would not the compound ?aram?tsn?bhi? fit rather better here if it were a mukhacandra-type comparison-compound ? In that case m?tsn? could designate a writing instrument such as a stick of chalk or a slate pencil of the kind that Aditia Gunawan supposes might be referred to with the expression tanah (2015:263?264). In that case we might understand: K?ma fixed as indelible (the letter that was) the heart-enflaming fame of his beauty [by rendering it] engraved in the hearts of lovely women by means of the pencils that were his arrows (?aram?tsn?bhi?). This is attractive to me. But then what of the ink (ma??) in the ??rama-charters. Should one suppose that an expression whose primary meaning was slate pencil or chalk stick came to be generalised to refer to any writing instrument, a bit like the word ?pen?, which no longer suggests the notion of ?feathers? to most people who use it? In other words, could m?tsn? have come to mean ?stylus? in Cambodian Sanskrit ? In that case, we would have the leaves (riktapattr???), the blackening agent (ma??) and the writing instrument (m?tsn?) all referred to in the sentence of the ??rama-charters: riktapattra? ma??? m?tsn?? dady?d adhyet?s?dhave. Suggestions welcome ! Dominic Goodall ?cole fran?aise d'Extr?me-Orient, Pondicherry > On 24-Nov-2015, at 12:59 am, Arlo Griffiths wrote: > > Dear colleagues, > > However interesting the evidence for non-palmleaf writing materials in early Southeast Asia, it must not be ignored that the epigraphical passage cited by Dominic explicitly mentions palmleaf (riktapattra). I think we have to come to terms with some use of 'earth' in the contexts of writing on palmleaf. Further evidence for such a practice is furnished in some passages cited in this interesting article on manuscript culture of early Java: > > Aditia Gunawan. 2015. ?Nipah or Gebang? A Philological and Codicological Study Based on Sources from West Java.? Bijdragen tot de Taal-, Land- en Volkenkunde / Journal of the Humanities and Social Sciences of Southeast Asia 171 (2-3): 249?80. doi:10.1163/22134379-17101004. > > I attach the article hereto. The sources are in Old Javanese and in Old Sundanese language; the context is explicitly that of writing on one or the other type of palmleaf (the local term lontar comes from rontal 'leaf of palm', where tal = t?la); the word for 'earth' is tanah, which still means 'earth' in Malay/Indonesian. Aditia Gunawan briefly discusses but does not solve the problem of what purpose 'earth' would serve in writing on palmleaf. > > Best wishes, > > Arlo Griffiths > ?cole fran?aise d'Extr?me-Orient, Paris > Universit? Jean Moulin ? Lyon 3 > > > > From: christoph.emmrich at utoronto.ca > To: mkapstei at uchicago.edu > Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2015 13:18:52 +0000 > Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. > CC: indology at list.indology.info > > Dear Matthew, > > Anthony Reid (A History of Southeast Asia: Critical Crossroads, 2015: 133) mentions the import of paper to SEA from China in the 15th cent., and there is the 14th cent. Niitisaararasamuccaya ms. from Kerinci. Also, there is an indication in a Bagan inscription, dated 1223, that features both the terms parabaik (i.e. other than palm leaf) and a donation of steatite in a container typical for usage on black (paper) parabaik more recently. Lammerts (2010, 232, fn. 7 and 10) points out that the terms and materials mentioned there may, but need not necessarily point to the usage of paper. > > Many thanks for raising this intriguing larger question, Matthew. > > Warmly, > Christoph > > ---- > > Sent from my iPhone > > On 23-Nov-2015, at 2:31 PM, Matthew Kapstein > wrote: > > Dear Christoph, > > Your comment is very interesting, and there does seem to be a prima facie similarity between > what is described in Dominic's passage and parabaik techniques. But when does paper-making > (or parabaik-making) technology begin in SE Asia? What do we know of its early history in the > region? > > all best, > Matthew > > Matthew Kapstein > Directeur d'?tudes, > Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes > > Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, > The University of Chicago > > > _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ashok.aklujkar at gmail.com Wed Nov 25 06:30:36 2015 From: ashok.aklujkar at gmail.com (Ashok Aklujkar) Date: Tue, 24 Nov 15 22:30:36 -0800 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <6AF9517A-D107-4E5A-959E-28715E4A40CA@gmail.com> I recall being told in Kerala many years ago that palm leaves are kept in mud or muddy waters after they are taken off the trees and before they are cut to a specific rectangular shape to form the material for manuscript writing. Soft earth or clay (m?tsn?) may in some cases refer to mud in such processing. Soft clay is also applied to body in ?yurvedic treatments. a.a. From christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be Wed Nov 25 08:35:28 2015 From: christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be (Christophe Vielle) Date: Wed, 25 Nov 15 09:35:28 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Dominic, m?tsn? has also the technical meaning of an "aluminous slate" (MW : "Lit. Bhpr.") like both m?d (L.), m?ts? (L.) m?ttik? (Lit. L.) and bh?ghn? ? could it mean a tablet for writing upon ? An interesting comment (not directly relevant here) is to be found in Rhys Davids & Stede's Pali-English Dictionary s.v. cu??a (= skrt c?r?a) as powder : "often combined with mattik? (= skrt m?ttik?; s.v., plur. as "kinds of clay used in cosmetics, like Fuller's earth") clay, in distinction of which c. is for delicate use (tender skin), whereas m. for rougher purposes". Best wishes, Christophe Le 25 nov. 2015 ? 05:42, Dominic Goodall a ?crit : > Dear colleagues, > > I am grateful for all this (for me) new information about parabaik, nipah, gebang. > > Arlo is right that the ??rama-foundation charters mention blank ?leaves? (riktapattra). The same ninth-century charters record (verse 98) that 6 leaf-preparers (?a? pattrak?rak??) are to be employed at each ??rama, as well as two scribes (lekhakau) and two librarians (pustakarak?akau). The word pattra could, of course, be a figurative way of referring to some other writing material, but this seems unlikely. > > The ?earth? used in Aditia Gunawan?s passages seems rather likely to be a blackening agent, and so, on the face of it, unlikely to be parallel to the m?tsn?, for the same sentence in the charters refers also to ma??, which is presumably black. As for the possibility that m?tsn? refers to chalk, that might have been suggested not only by the Chinese allusion to blackened deerskin but also by an awareness of parabaik-use that Christoph has informed us about. These may have been invented later, but is also, I suppose, not inconceivable that palm-leaves might have been blackened and written upon with chalk or something similar. And yet it seemed to me odd to understand m?tsn? to be chalk. Does m?tsn? ever mean chalk in any other context ? Surely m?tsn? is almost invariably mud or clay (of differing colours), often used for smearing ? This was what led me to the idea that m?tsn? might have been used for the kind of ?rubrication? effect by smearing with a coloured substance to highlight letters or words or colophon-florets. (By the way, I notice a few instances of such smearing of colophon-florets also on the 9th-century Nepalese manuscript that transmits the Ni?v?satattvasa?hit?, but they might of course have been added by some later user.) > > But I have just now come across another intriguing passage that seems likely to throw light on the question, even if at the moment it perplexes me. Perhaps colleagues on the list will have suggestions. > > The passage in question is verse 134 of the immense 298-verse stela commemorating the foundation of the ?aiva temple known today as Pre Rup in 883 ?aka. It is, of course, part of a description of the king. > > yad?ya? ?aram?tsn?bhir yya?a? k?mena k?ntijam > h?dya? h?di varastr???? lagna? likhitam ak?aram > > C?d?s interpretation is this: > > The glory that was born of his beauty, and that was pleasing to the heart, was a written character (ak?aram) that Kama had engraved indelibly (ak?aram) in the hearts of noble women with the powder of his arrows (?aram?tsn?bhi?). > > (La gloire n?e de sa beaut?, et plaisante au c?ur, ?tait un caract?re d??criture que l?Amour avait grav? d?une fa?on ind?l?bile dans le c?ur des nobles femmes avec la poudre de ses fl?ches.) > > This is fine as far as it goes. The verse recalls the convention of heroes marking their arrows with names (usually their own) before shooting them, and there is an elegant play on ak?ara. But what can the ?powder of his arrows? be ? Is there some arcanum of dhanu??stra that could explain this ? Or does the poet invite us to imagine simply that some clay or power was used to mark the name of the king upon the arrows that were then fired off by K?madeva ? > > But would not the compound ?aram?tsn?bhi? fit rather better here if it were a mukhacandra-type comparison-compound ? In that case m?tsn? could designate a writing instrument such as a stick of chalk or a slate pencil of the kind that Aditia Gunawan supposes might be referred to with the expression tanah (2015:263?264). In that case we might understand: > > K?ma fixed as indelible (the letter that was) the heart-enflaming fame of his beauty [by rendering it] engraved in the hearts of lovely women by means of the pencils that were his arrows (?aram?tsn?bhi?). > > This is attractive to me. But then what of the ink (ma??) in the ??rama-charters. Should one suppose that an expression whose primary meaning was slate pencil or chalk stick came to be generalised to refer to any writing instrument, a bit like the word ?pen?, which no longer suggests the notion of ?feathers? to most people who use it? In other words, could m?tsn? have come to mean ?stylus? in Cambodian Sanskrit ? In that case, we would have the leaves (riktapattr???), the blackening agent (ma??) and the writing instrument (m?tsn?) all referred to in the sentence of the ??rama-charters: riktapattra? ma??? m?tsn?? dady?d adhyet?s?dhave. > > Suggestions welcome ! > > Dominic Goodall > ?cole fran?aise d'Extr?me-Orient, Pondicherry > > > >> On 24-Nov-2015, at 12:59 am, Arlo Griffiths wrote: >> >> Dear colleagues, >> >> However interesting the evidence for non-palmleaf writing materials in early Southeast Asia, it must not be ignored that the epigraphical passage cited by Dominic explicitly mentions palmleaf (riktapattra). I think we have to come to terms with some use of 'earth' in the contexts of writing on palmleaf. Further evidence for such a practice is furnished in some passages cited in this interesting article on manuscript culture of early Java: >> >> Aditia Gunawan. 2015. ?Nipah or Gebang? A Philological and Codicological Study Based on Sources from West Java.? Bijdragen tot de Taal-, Land- en Volkenkunde / Journal of the Humanities and Social Sciences of Southeast Asia 171 (2-3): 249?80. doi:10.1163/22134379-17101004. >> >> I attach the article hereto. The sources are in Old Javanese and in Old Sundanese language; the context is explicitly that of writing on one or the other type of palmleaf (the local term lontar comes from rontal 'leaf of palm', where tal = t?la); the word for 'earth' is tanah, which still means 'earth' in Malay/Indonesian. Aditia Gunawan briefly discusses but does not solve the problem of what purpose 'earth' would serve in writing on palmleaf. >> >> Best wishes, >> >> Arlo Griffiths >> ?cole fran?aise d'Extr?me-Orient, Paris >> Universit? Jean Moulin ? Lyon 3 >> >> >> >> From: christoph.emmrich at utoronto.ca >> To: mkapstei at uchicago.edu >> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2015 13:18:52 +0000 >> Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. >> CC: indology at list.indology.info >> >> Dear Matthew, >> >> Anthony Reid (A History of Southeast Asia: Critical Crossroads, 2015: 133) mentions the import of paper to SEA from China in the 15th cent., and there is the 14th cent. Niitisaararasamuccaya ms. from Kerinci. Also, there is an indication in a Bagan inscription, dated 1223, that features both the terms parabaik (i.e. other than palm leaf) and a donation of steatite in a container typical for usage on black (paper) parabaik more recently. Lammerts (2010, 232, fn. 7 and 10) points out that the terms and materials mentioned there may, but need not necessarily point to the usage of paper. >> >> Many thanks for raising this intriguing larger question, Matthew. >> >> Warmly, >> Christoph >> >> ---- >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On 23-Nov-2015, at 2:31 PM, Matthew Kapstein wrote: >> >> Dear Christoph, >> >> Your comment is very interesting, and there does seem to be a prima facie similarity between >> what is described in Dominic's passage and parabaik techniques. But when does paper-making >> (or parabaik-making) technology begin in SE Asia? What do we know of its early history in the >> region? >> >> all best, >> Matthew >> >> Matthew Kapstein >> Directeur d'?tudes, >> Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes >> >> Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, >> The University of Chicago >> >> >> _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.infoindology-owner@list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info(where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) ??????????????????? Christophe Vielle Louvain-la-Neuve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be Wed Nov 25 09:29:42 2015 From: christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be (Christophe Vielle) Date: Wed, 25 Nov 15 10:29:42 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fwd: rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: To remain in the palm-leaves, in reference to the "lamp-black or coal powder mixed with oil [which] is applied on the leaves" (in the Design Thoughts article) for making the script black, maybe ma??? m?tsn?? has to be understood as ma?i/?-m?tsn?? "inking/inked/black clay/powder" (in contrast with ma??jala as liquid ink) D?but du message r?exp?di? : > De: Christophe Vielle > Objet: R?p : [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. > Date: 25 novembre 2015 09:35:28 UTC+1 > ?: Dominic Goodall > Cc: INDOLOGY > > Dear Dominic, > > m?tsn? has also the technical meaning of an "aluminous slate" (MW : "Lit. Bhpr.") like both m?d (L.), m?ts? (L.) m?ttik? (Lit. L.) and bh?ghn? ? could it mean a tablet for writing upon ? > > An interesting comment (not directly relevant here) is to be found in Rhys Davids & Stede's Pali-English Dictionary s.v. cu??a (= skrt c?r?a) as powder : "often combined with mattik? (= skrt m?ttik?; s.v., plur. as "kinds of clay used in cosmetics, like Fuller's earth") clay, in distinction of which c. is for delicate use (tender skin), whereas m. for rougher purposes". > > Best wishes, > Christophe > > Le 25 nov. 2015 ? 05:42, Dominic Goodall a ?crit : > >> Dear colleagues, >> >> I am grateful for all this (for me) new information about parabaik, nipah, gebang. >> >> Arlo is right that the ??rama-foundation charters mention blank ?leaves? (riktapattra). The same ninth-century charters record (verse 98) that 6 leaf-preparers (?a? pattrak?rak??) are to be employed at each ??rama, as well as two scribes (lekhakau) and two librarians (pustakarak?akau). The word pattra could, of course, be a figurative way of referring to some other writing material, but this seems unlikely. >> >> The ?earth? used in Aditia Gunawan?s passages seems rather likely to be a blackening agent, and so, on the face of it, unlikely to be parallel to the m?tsn?, for the same sentence in the charters refers also to ma??, which is presumably black. As for the possibility that m?tsn? refers to chalk, that might have been suggested not only by the Chinese allusion to blackened deerskin but also by an awareness of parabaik-use that Christoph has informed us about. These may have been invented later, but is also, I suppose, not inconceivable that palm-leaves might have been blackened and written upon with chalk or something similar. And yet it seemed to me odd to understand m?tsn? to be chalk. Does m?tsn? ever mean chalk in any other context ? Surely m?tsn? is almost invariably mud or clay (of differing colours), often used for smearing ? This was what led me to the idea that m?tsn? might have been used for the kind of ?rubrication? effect by smearing with a coloured substance to highlight letters or words or colophon-florets. (By the way, I notice a few instances of such smearing of colophon-florets also on the 9th-century Nepalese manuscript that transmits the Ni?v?satattvasa?hit?, but they might of course have been added by some later user.) >> >> But I have just now come across another intriguing passage that seems likely to throw light on the question, even if at the moment it perplexes me. Perhaps colleagues on the list will have suggestions. >> >> The passage in question is verse 134 of the immense 298-verse stela commemorating the foundation of the ?aiva temple known today as Pre Rup in 883 ?aka. It is, of course, part of a description of the king. >> >> yad?ya? ?aram?tsn?bhir yya?a? k?mena k?ntijam >> h?dya? h?di varastr???? lagna? likhitam ak?aram >> >> C?d?s interpretation is this: >> >> The glory that was born of his beauty, and that was pleasing to the heart, was a written character (ak?aram) that Kama had engraved indelibly (ak?aram) in the hearts of noble women with the powder of his arrows (?aram?tsn?bhi?). >> >> (La gloire n?e de sa beaut?, et plaisante au c?ur, ?tait un caract?re d??criture que l?Amour avait grav? d?une fa?on ind?l?bile dans le c?ur des nobles femmes avec la poudre de ses fl?ches.) >> >> This is fine as far as it goes. The verse recalls the convention of heroes marking their arrows with names (usually their own) before shooting them, and there is an elegant play on ak?ara. But what can the ?powder of his arrows? be ? Is there some arcanum of dhanu??stra that could explain this ? Or does the poet invite us to imagine simply that some clay or power was used to mark the name of the king upon the arrows that were then fired off by K?madeva ? >> >> But would not the compound ?aram?tsn?bhi? fit rather better here if it were a mukhacandra-type comparison-compound ? In that case m?tsn? could designate a writing instrument such as a stick of chalk or a slate pencil of the kind that Aditia Gunawan supposes might be referred to with the expression tanah (2015:263?264). In that case we might understand: >> >> K?ma fixed as indelible (the letter that was) the heart-enflaming fame of his beauty [by rendering it] engraved in the hearts of lovely women by means of the pencils that were his arrows (?aram?tsn?bhi?). >> >> This is attractive to me. But then what of the ink (ma??) in the ??rama-charters. Should one suppose that an expression whose primary meaning was slate pencil or chalk stick came to be generalised to refer to any writing instrument, a bit like the word ?pen?, which no longer suggests the notion of ?feathers? to most people who use it? In other words, could m?tsn? have come to mean ?stylus? in Cambodian Sanskrit ? In that case, we would have the leaves (riktapattr???), the blackening agent (ma??) and the writing instrument (m?tsn?) all referred to in the sentence of the ??rama-charters: riktapattra? ma??? m?tsn?? dady?d adhyet?s?dhave. >> >> Suggestions welcome ! >> >> Dominic Goodall >> ?cole fran?aise d'Extr?me-Orient, Pondicherry >> >> >> >>> On 24-Nov-2015, at 12:59 am, Arlo Griffiths wrote: >>> >>> Dear colleagues, >>> >>> However interesting the evidence for non-palmleaf writing materials in early Southeast Asia, it must not be ignored that the epigraphical passage cited by Dominic explicitly mentions palmleaf (riktapattra). I think we have to come to terms with some use of 'earth' in the contexts of writing on palmleaf. Further evidence for such a practice is furnished in some passages cited in this interesting article on manuscript culture of early Java: >>> >>> Aditia Gunawan. 2015. ?Nipah or Gebang? A Philological and Codicological Study Based on Sources from West Java.? Bijdragen tot de Taal-, Land- en Volkenkunde / Journal of the Humanities and Social Sciences of Southeast Asia 171 (2-3): 249?80. doi:10.1163/22134379-17101004. >>> >>> I attach the article hereto. The sources are in Old Javanese and in Old Sundanese language; the context is explicitly that of writing on one or the other type of palmleaf (the local term lontar comes from rontal 'leaf of palm', where tal = t?la); the word for 'earth' is tanah, which still means 'earth' in Malay/Indonesian. Aditia Gunawan briefly discusses but does not solve the problem of what purpose 'earth' would serve in writing on palmleaf. >>> >>> Best wishes, >>> >>> Arlo Griffiths >>> ?cole fran?aise d'Extr?me-Orient, Paris >>> Universit? Jean Moulin ? Lyon 3 >>> >>> >>> >>> From: christoph.emmrich at utoronto.ca >>> To: mkapstei at uchicago.edu >>> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2015 13:18:52 +0000 >>> Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. >>> CC: indology at list.indology.info >>> >>> Dear Matthew, >>> >>> Anthony Reid (A History of Southeast Asia: Critical Crossroads, 2015: 133) mentions the import of paper to SEA from China in the 15th cent., and there is the 14th cent. Niitisaararasamuccaya ms. from Kerinci. Also, there is an indication in a Bagan inscription, dated 1223, that features both the terms parabaik (i.e. other than palm leaf) and a donation of steatite in a container typical for usage on black (paper) parabaik more recently. Lammerts (2010, 232, fn. 7 and 10) points out that the terms and materials mentioned there may, but need not necessarily point to the usage of paper. >>> >>> Many thanks for raising this intriguing larger question, Matthew. >>> >>> Warmly, >>> Christoph >>> >>> ---- >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>> On 23-Nov-2015, at 2:31 PM, Matthew Kapstein wrote: >>> >>> Dear Christoph, >>> >>> Your comment is very interesting, and there does seem to be a prima facie similarity between >>> what is described in Dominic's passage and parabaik techniques. But when does paper-making >>> (or parabaik-making) technology begin in SE Asia? What do we know of its early history in the >>> region? >>> >>> all best, >>> Matthew >>> >>> Matthew Kapstein >>> Directeur d'?tudes, >>> Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes >>> >>> Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, >>> The University of Chicago >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.infoindology-owner@list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info(where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > ??????????????????? > Christophe Vielle > Louvain-la-Neuve > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) ??????????????????? Christophe Vielle Louvain-la-Neuve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be Wed Nov 25 16:37:45 2015 From: christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be (Christophe Vielle) Date: Wed, 25 Nov 15 17:37:45 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fwd: Black soot with oil (maSi) & turmeric powder (mRtsnaa) used in writing on palm leaves In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4B29A295-6237-4BFC-A203-5B8AF0EA0982@uclouvain.be> >From N. Ganesan : > De: "N. Ganesan" > Objet: Black soot with oil (maSi) & turmeric powder (mRtsnaa) used in writing on palm leaves > Date: 25 novembre 2015 16:32:07 UTC+1 > > > Dear Dominic Goodall & All, > > I think the meaning of mRtsna is clear if we read the evidence > from Tamil. Th. Burrow, The Sanskrit Language, pg. 153, 2001 > gives: "mRtsna- masc. nt. 'dust, powder'". > http://www.sanskrita.org/wiki/index.php/mRtsna > m?tsna m. n. dust, powder cf. Su?r. > Let us see what powder it is, and its purpose in palm leaves preparation > and preservation. mRtsnaa - is fragrant powder: > http://www.spokensanskrit.de/index.php?tinput=mRtsna&link=m > > You wrote: > "Here is the passage in question, which recurs in several inscriptions: > K. 279, LXXXVII ab. > (11) riktapattra? ma??? m?tsn?? dady?d adhyet?s?dhave" > > It talks of 3 things (the iron stylus is not explicitly mentioned in this line, > may be elsewhere in the inscription): > (1) palm leaf - riktapattram > (2) maSI - black soot mixed with oil > (which is used after writing/incising with iron stylus, see: > http://www.idc.iitb.ac.in/resources/dt-july-2009/Palm.pdf ) > Note that this maSi is not for writing, but only to highlight what is incised. > > Compare the Tamil word, macaku: > Madras Tamil Lexicon entry: > ????? macaku , n. cf. ma?imasaka.] Mixture of oil and burnt straw, used as grease for country carts; ???????? ??????? ????????????? ?????? ?????????????? ??????????? ??. > > (3) mRtsna "dust, powder" of turmeric. This is used before & after writing. (See ref.s given at end.) > and in preparing palm leaves. As a preservative and also to give yellow/gold polish. > > This explanation is supported by Tamil evidence. > I don't know why mrtsnaa is used in Cambodia; a hybrid-Sanskrit? > To match with maSii, mrtsnaa is used?? Sanskritists can explain to us, > mRtsnaa - fragrant (powder) > http://www.spokensanskrit.de/index.php?tinput=mRtsna&link=m > > (This letter I was drafting yesterday, just reading your mail of today.The answer > is in Cilappatikaaram etc., will tell tomorrow.) > > Here are two important Tamil literary references > which I gave almost 20 years ago in Indology list, > http://list.indology.info/pipermail/indology_list.indology.info/1996-February/004149.html > > Caring of Palm-leaf Manuscripts - Tamil literature > ************************************************** > > Two old poems from Tamil literature come to my mind. > > U. V. Saminathaiyar who edited the Sangam classics for the > first time in print edited a messenger poem on Madurai Siva. > (UVS, maturaic cokkan^Atar tamizviTu tUtu, 1930, Madras, I > edition. 7 reprints were made after). > > The heroine sends "Tamil" as her messenger to her Lord. > There are few couplets describing Tamil as a girl. > One of them is, > > manjaL kuLippATTi maiyiTTu muppAlum > minjap pukaTTa mikavaLarn^tAy! > > ?????? ???????????? ???????? ?????????? > ??????? ?????? ??? ?????????? > http://www.projectmadurai.org/pm_etexts/utf8/pmuni0040.html > > 1) As for a girl, the meaning is: > When you were a baby, you enjoyed taking showers with turmeric (manjaL) > smeared all over. decorated using cosmetics (mai/anjana) and > consumed milk/juices taht are essential for healthy growth. > > 2) As for the sweet Tamil, the meaning is: > All your treasures/literatures in palmleaves are protected with > turmeric, the letters on palmleaves are coated with soot (mai/anjana) > to make the writing more visible, and in the early stages of life, > Valluvar's KuRaL nourished you! (muppAl is another name for the > famous TirukkuRaL because it is divided into three sections.) > > The second example comes from ParanjOti Munivar's tiruviLaiyATal > purANam (16th century?). The local stala purANam for Madurai. > (Dr. William Harman translated parts of this work.) > Here the imagery is grand and beautiful. > > cEya tArakai varuNamAt tITTiya vAnam > Aya ETTinai iruLenum anjanam taTavi > tUya vALn^ilA enumveN tUcinAl tuTaippAN > pAya vElaiyil muLaittanan panimatik kaTavuL. > > ??? ????? ???????? ??????? ????? > ?? ???????? ???????? ??????? ?????? > ??? ?????? ???????????? ???????? ?????????? > ??? ???????? ?????????? ???????? ??????. > http://www.tamilvu.org/slet/l41d0/l41d0pd1.jsp?bookid=68&part=III&link=305 > > Siva appears in the sea. > The crescent moon on his head sends out lunar rays to remove > the darkness of the night sky and the stars shine. > > It is like > The poet using a soft, white cloth to remove the carbon (anjanam) > from the face of palmleaf manuscript and the letters look bright! > > Here, the comparison is: > > sky ------> palmleaf > stars -----> written letters > darkness of the night ---> carbon smear > moon's rays ----> soft cloth > ---------------------------------------------------- > > Some references where the black charcoal mixed with oil (maSi) > and turmeric used both before writing and after writing are employed.That is > mRsnaa"fragrant powder". > http://cool.conservation-us.org/coolaic/sg/bpg/annual/v24/bp24-17.pdf > https://books.google.com/books?id=cjr3P1DU8zgC&pg=PA116&lpg=PA116&dq=turmeric+on+palm+leaf&source=bl&ots=BBPb0q7C-Y&sig=ikP2B-NTMzEAAiW9CPij8Y2yKcI&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwitu9vrtqjJAhUGLYgKHbBbA8w4ChDoAQgiMAE#v=onepage&q=turmeric%20on%20palm%20leaf&f=false > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turmeric > https://www.library.cornell.edu/preservation/publications/documents/ConservationandStabilizationofPalmLeafandParabaik.pdf > https://books.google.com/books?id=t35yp4G8E2gC&pg=PA45&lpg=PA45&dq=turmeric+on+palm+leaf&source=bl&ots=QkMEs4pXtg&sig=mP0cJBHuXW2CNAdJYR9Om8oHngE&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjIxPHptKjJAhVMLIgKHbKVCTQQ6AEIOjAH#v=onepage&q=turmeric%20on%20palm%20leaf&f=false > https://www.facebook.com/TurmericHands/posts/602782589776722 > http://www.jstor.org/stable/24042168?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents > > Kind regards > N. Ganesan > http://nganesan.blogspot.com > > ??????????????????? Christophe Vielle Louvain-la-Neuve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From DCL96 at rci.rutgers.edu Wed Nov 25 18:18:53 2015 From: DCL96 at rci.rutgers.edu (DC Lammerts) Date: Wed, 25 Nov 15 13:18:53 -0500 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, A brief footnote on palm-leaf blackening practices in Burma, so as to dispel any potential confusion between blackened palm-leaf and paper in that context. The vast majority of engraved (as opposed to inked, which are anyhow quite rare by the 17th?19th centuries) palm-leaf manuscripts were blackened, in order to raise the contrast between the incised text and the surface of the folio. Albert Fytche describes the blackening process for engraved palm-leaf as follows in _Burma, Past and Present_, Vol 2 (London 1878), 8?9: "Burmese books are composed of leaves of the palmyra palm, through the ends of which a string is passed*, and are bound together between a couple wooden covers, gilt, and lacquered in colored devices. The letters are engraved on the leaves with an iron stylus, held nearly perpendicular by the two forefingers and the thumb of the right hand, and steadied by the thumb-nail of the left hand, in which a nick is often cut to receive it. The writing is rendered visible by the application of charcoal ground with eng-tway [Bse. ??????, a? tvai], a fragrant gum procured from Dipterocarpus grandiflora, and which latter [sic] preserves also the leaves from the attacks of insects. Every Buddhist monastery contains a library of these books, kept in carved and lacquered cabinets." {*n.b. this is not entirely correct, and?certainly during the 19th century?binding techniques included wooden sticks in addition to string.} Other accounts mention different blackening compounds (e.g. the use of Entada pursaetha oil), but the basic procedure is the same, and as far as I am aware this is also done elsewhere in mainland SE Asia. Blackening is still used today, and I have witnessed even engine oil enlisted for this purpose. In any event, this procedure is quite different from the sort of blackening used to manufacture paper black parabaik mss, the aim of which is to render the entire surface of the folio black prior to writing on it with steatite or chalk. Best regards, Christian DC Lammerts Assistant Professor Department of Religion Rutgers University -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nakeerthi at gmail.com Thu Nov 26 10:34:18 2015 From: nakeerthi at gmail.com (naresh keerthi) Date: Thu, 26 Nov 15 16:04:18 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. Message-ID: Can the following verse from the Kum?ra-sambhava? be taken as having an oblique reference to rubrication? [Unless we take the second p?da to be a qualifier for the rikta version of the bh?rja-patra] nyast?k?ar? dh?tu-rasena yatra bh?rja-tvacah kunjara-bindu-?o??? | vrajanti vidy?dhara-sundar??am'ananga-lekha-kriyayo'payogam || 1.7 || Best, Naresh Keerthi National Institute of Advanced Studies, IISC campus Bangalore - 12 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mailmealakendudas at rediffmail.com Thu Nov 26 11:04:45 2015 From: mailmealakendudas at rediffmail.com (alakendu das) Date: Thu, 26 Nov 15 11:04:45 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BODDHI SATTWA Message-ID: <20151126110445.13921.qmail@f4mail-235-249.rediffmail.com> To All, Can anybody refer the text where the word Boddhisatta appears for the first time? ALAKENDU DAS -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dominic.goodall at gmail.com Thu Nov 26 11:28:33 2015 From: dominic.goodall at gmail.com (Dominic Goodall) Date: Thu, 26 Nov 15 16:58:33 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear List, Indeed Vallabhadeva (C10th) understands the birch-bark to be red because of being written upon with vermilion or the like: dh?turasena sind?r?didravye?a nyast?k?ar? likhitavar???/ ata? c?k?ar???? lauhity?t ku?jarabinduvac cho?? lohit??/ But it is perhaps conceivable that they are red because they have been sealed with red sealing wax, which is what is suggested by this echo in Dhoy?'s Pavanad?ta: ?tta? kar??t pra?ihitapada? s??janair a?rule?ai? baddha? t?paglapitabisin?tantun? bandhanena/ yatra str???m adhararucakanyastasind?ramudra? t?l?patra? pra?ayini jane premalekhatvam eti// 40 James Mallinson's translation reads: Where palm-leaf decorations taken from the ladies? ears, inscribed with teardrops mixed with mascara, bound with ties of lotus fibres withered by the fever of separation and sealed with vermilion lipstick, become love letters to their sweethearts. Dominic Goodall, EFEO, Pondicherry > On 26-Nov-2015, at 4:04 pm, naresh keerthi wrote: > > Can the following verse from the Kum?ra-sambhava? be taken as having an oblique reference to rubrication? [Unless we take the second p?da to be a qualifier for the rikta version of the bh?rja-patra] > > nyast?k?ar? dh?tu-rasena yatra bh?rja-tvacah kunjara-bindu-?o??? | > vrajanti vidy?dhara-sundar??am'ananga-lekha-kriyayo'payogam || 1.7 || > > > Best, > Naresh Keerthi > National Institute of Advanced Studies, > IISC campus > Bangalore - 12 > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From vjroebuck at btinternet.com Thu Nov 26 12:06:35 2015 From: vjroebuck at btinternet.com (Valerie Roebuck) Date: Thu, 26 Nov 15 12:06:35 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BODDHI SATTWA In-Reply-To: <20151126110445.13921.qmail@f4mail-235-249.rediffmail.com> Message-ID: As ?Bodhisaco', in an inscription on a Mathura (c. 2nd century) sculpture of the Buddha (rather than what we would call a Bodhisattva). https://www.jstor.org/stable/pdf/3250056.pdf?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents Valerie J Roebuck Manchester, UK > On 26 Nov 2015, at 11:04, alakendu das wrote: > > > > To All, > > Can anybody refer the text where the word Boddhisatta appears for the first time? > > > ALAKENDU DAS > > > Get your own FREE website, FREE domain & FREE mobile app with Company email. > Know More > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Joseph.Walser at tufts.edu Thu Nov 26 13:22:27 2015 From: Joseph.Walser at tufts.edu (Walser, Joseph) Date: Thu, 26 Nov 15 13:22:27 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] BODDHI SATTWA In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <0A0402D1-1952-4E43-BEDA-5A6B49E2A5FE@tufts.edu> If you are looking for the earliest text in literature, you may want to look at Bhikkhu Analayo's book, Origins of the Bodhisattva Ideal. I believe you can download it from his website. He is very thorough. J On Nov 26, 2015, at 7:07 AM, Valerie Roebuck > wrote: As ?Bodhisaco', in an inscription on a Mathura (c. 2nd century) sculpture of the Buddha (rather than what we would call a Bodhisattva). https://www.jstor.org/stable/pdf/3250056.pdf?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents Valerie J Roebuck Manchester, UK On 26 Nov 2015, at 11:04, alakendu das > wrote: To All, Can anybody refer the text where the word Boddhisatta appears for the first time? ALAKENDU DAS [https://sigads.rediff.com/RealMedia/ads/adstream_nx.ads/www.rediffmail.com/signatureline.htm at Middle] Get your own FREE website, FREE domain & FREE mobile app with Company email. Know More > _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dominic.goodall at gmail.com Thu Nov 26 14:02:37 2015 From: dominic.goodall at gmail.com (Dominic Goodall) Date: Thu, 26 Nov 15 19:32:37 +0530 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear colleagues, Thank you for the fresh crop of suggestions and remarks. I feel more uncertain than yesterday about the hypothesis I advanced, but no more convinced by any other theories. A couple of considerations that guide me here could be mentioned. 1) Since both epigraphical passages, that of Pre Rup and that of the ??rama-charters, come from exactly the same area, are just 70 years apart and talk about writing, it seems to me that the ideal would be to find an interpretation of m?tsn? that would fit them both. This makes me disinclined, for example, to favour the idea suggested by Professor Aklujkar that m?tsn? might refer here to clay used for softening palm-leaves. (A further consideration that makes this seem unlikely is that the ??rama-charters refer to the employment of 6 leaf-preparers, so it is presumably they who would be occupied with curing the leaves rather than the students.) 2) Although I am often accused of being only too ready to introduce conjectural emendations, in this case I think we have to follow the principle of sthitasya gati? cintan?y?, for these inscriptions are not only beautifully and carefully engraved, but the ??rama-charters have actually been beautifully and carefully several times over. This means that emending ma??? m?tsn?? to ma??m?tsn??, which is I think what Christophe is suggesting, seems out of the question. Bearing these guiding principles in mind I was in favour yesterday of understanding m?tsn? as ?steatite/chalk pencil? or the like, and therefore perhaps simply as ?writing implement? generically. I certainly still think that this is possible, but I now think that the ?powder? hypothesis (chalk, talk, or, as N. Ganesan has suggested, turmeric) cannot be abandoned either. There are two difficulties with it: 1) it remains uncertain exactly how the powder would be used in manuscript production (rubbing turmeric to cure the leaves or render them supple ? rubbing light-coloured clay or powder to highlight the leaf around certain letters ? rubbing light-coloured powder instead of soot or blackener into the grooves that form certain letters, to achieve a sort of ?rubrication" in white ? marking out guidelines on the leaf before beginning to incise ?); and 2) it is unclear how the powder would be used in archery. Reflecting about this second uncertainty, I noticed that Sarva Daman Singh (Ancient Indian Warfare: With Special Reference to the Vedic Period, p. 172) recounts an anecdote about an extraordinary South Indian archer in modern times who was nicknamed Kaliyug? Arjuna: "He smeared exceedingly sharp arrow-tips with chalk dust and shot them at the bare backs of students with a perfect delicacy of control, so that they left only chalk marks on their tender targets without even grazing them." This is not about ancient times, but if the trick was practised recently, then it might have been thought up long ago. Perhaps K?ma is after all imagined similarly to have dusted his arrows with chalk. Moreover, as Andrew Ollett has pointed out to me, the Pre Rup verse "provides some additional support to the chalk hypothesis, since it would have been impossible for the king's glory (and therefore also the letter drawn by k?ma's arrows) to have been anything other than white.? Please let me know if you have further ideas on this (I am trying to finish an article about what can be gleaned about text-transmission practices in ancient times in the Khmer-speaking area). Dominic Goodall, EFEO, Pondicherry > On 25-Nov-2015, at 2:59 pm, Christophe Vielle wrote: > > To remain in the palm-leaves, in reference to the > > "lamp-black or coal powder mixed with oil [which] is applied on the leaves" (in the Design Thoughts article) > > for making the script black, > maybe ma??? m?tsn?? > has to be understood as ma?i/?-m?tsn?? > "inking/inked/black clay/powder" (in contrast with ma??jala? <>as liquid ink) > > D?but du message r?exp?di? : > >> De: Christophe Vielle > >> Objet: R?p : [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. >> Date: 25 novembre 2015 09:35:28 UTC+1 >> ?: Dominic Goodall > >> Cc: INDOLOGY > >> >> Dear Dominic, >> >> m?tsn?? <>has also the technical meaning of an "aluminous slate" (MW : "Lit. Bhpr.") like both m?d? <>(L.), m?ts?? <>(L.) m?ttik?? <>(Lit. L.) and bh?ghn?? <>? could it mean a tablet for writing upon ? >> >> An interesting comment (not directly relevant here) is to be found in Rhys Davids & Stede's Pali-English Dictionary s.v. cu <>? <>?a <> (= skrt c?r?a <>) as powder : "often combined with mattik?? <>(= skrt m?ttik? <>; s.v., plur. as "kinds of clay used in cosmetics, like Fuller's earth") clay, in distinction of which c. is for delicate use (tender skin), whereas m. for rougher purposes". >> >> Best wishes, >> Christophe >> >> Le 25 nov. 2015 ? 05:42, Dominic Goodall > a ?crit : >> >>> Dear colleagues, >>> >>> I am grateful for all this (for me) new information about parabaik, nipah, gebang. >>> >>> Arlo is right that the ??rama-foundation charters mention blank ?leaves? (riktapattra). The same ninth-century charters record (verse 98) that 6 leaf-preparers (?a? pattrak?rak??) are to be employed at each ??rama, as well as two scribes (lekhakau) and two librarians (pustakarak?akau). The word pattra could, of course, be a figurative way of referring to some other writing material, but this seems unlikely. >>> >>> The ?earth? used in Aditia Gunawan?s passages seems rather likely to be a blackening agent, and so, on the face of it, unlikely to be parallel to the m?tsn?, for the same sentence in the charters refers also to ma??, which is presumably black. As for the possibility that m?tsn? refers to chalk, that might have been suggested not only by the Chinese allusion to blackened deerskin but also by an awareness of parabaik-use that Christoph has informed us about. These may have been invented later, but is also, I suppose, not inconceivable that palm-leaves might have been blackened and written upon with chalk or something similar. And yet it seemed to me odd to understand m?tsn? to be chalk. Does m?tsn? ever mean chalk in any other context ? Surely m?tsn? is almost invariably mud or clay (of differing colours), often used for smearing ? This was what led me to the idea that m?tsn? might have been used for the kind of ?rubrication? effect by smearing with a coloured substance to highlight letters or words or colophon-florets. (By the way, I notice a few instances of such smearing of colophon-florets also on the 9th-century Nepalese manuscript that transmits the Ni?v?satattvasa?hit?, but they might of course have been added by some later user.) >>> >>> But I have just now come across another intriguing passage that seems likely to throw light on the question, even if at the moment it perplexes me. Perhaps colleagues on the list will have suggestions. >>> >>> The passage in question is verse 134 of the immense 298-verse stela commemorating the foundation of the ?aiva temple known today as Pre Rup in 883 ?aka. It is, of course, part of a description of the king. >>> >>> yad?ya? ?aram?tsn?bhir yya?a? k?mena k?ntijam >>> h?dya? h?di varastr???? lagna? likhitam ak?aram >>> >>> C?d?s interpretation is this: >>> >>> The glory that was born of his beauty, and that was pleasing to the heart, was a written character (ak?aram) that Kama had engraved indelibly (ak?aram) in the hearts of noble women with the powder of his arrows (?aram?tsn?bhi?). >>> >>> (La gloire n?e de sa beaut?, et plaisante au c?ur, ?tait un caract?re d??criture que l?Amour avait grav? d?une fa?on ind?l?bile dans le c?ur des nobles femmes avec la poudre de ses fl?ches.) >>> >>> This is fine as far as it goes. The verse recalls the convention of heroes marking their arrows with names (usually their own) before shooting them, and there is an elegant play on ak?ara. But what can the ?powder of his arrows? be ? Is there some arcanum of dhanu??stra that could explain this ? Or does the poet invite us to imagine simply that some clay or power was used to mark the name of the king upon the arrows that were then fired off by K?madeva ? >>> >>> But would not the compound ?aram?tsn?bhi? fit rather better here if it were a mukhacandra-type comparison-compound ? In that case m?tsn? could designate a writing instrument such as a stick of chalk or a slate pencil of the kind that Aditia Gunawan supposes might be referred to with the expression tanah (2015:263?264). In that case we might understand: >>> >>> K?ma fixed as indelible (the letter that was) the heart-enflaming fame of his beauty [by rendering it] engraved in the hearts of lovely women by means of the pencils that were his arrows (?aram?tsn?bhi?). >>> >>> This is attractive to me. But then what of the ink (ma??) in the ??rama-charters. Should one suppose that an expression whose primary meaning was slate pencil or chalk stick came to be generalised to refer to any writing instrument, a bit like the word ?pen?, which no longer suggests the notion of ?feathers? to most people who use it? In other words, could m?tsn? have come to mean ?stylus? in Cambodian Sanskrit ? In that case, we would have the leaves (riktapattr???), the blackening agent (ma??) and the writing instrument (m?tsn?) all referred to in the sentence of the ??rama-charters: riktapattra? ma??? m?tsn?? dady?d adhyet?s?dhave. >>> >>> Suggestions welcome ! >>> >>> Dominic Goodall >>> ?cole fran?aise d'Extr?me-Orient, Pondicherry >>> >>> >>> >>>> On 24-Nov-2015, at 12:59 am, Arlo Griffiths > wrote: >>>> >>>> Dear colleagues, >>>> >>>> However interesting the evidence for non-palmleaf writing materials in early Southeast Asia, it must not be ignored that the epigraphical passage cited by Dominic explicitly mentions palmleaf (riktapattra). I think we have to come to terms with some use of 'earth' in the contexts of writing on palmleaf. Further evidence for such a practice is furnished in some passages cited in this interesting article on manuscript culture of early Java: >>>> >>>> Aditia Gunawan. 2015. ?Nipah or Gebang? A Philological and Codicological Study Based on Sources from West Java.? Bijdragen tot de Taal-, Land- en Volkenkunde / Journal of the Humanities and Social Sciences of Southeast Asia 171 (2-3): 249?80. doi:10.1163/22134379-17101004. >>>> >>>> I attach the article hereto. The sources are in Old Javanese and in Old Sundanese language; the context is explicitly that of writing on one or the other type of palmleaf (the local term lontar comes from rontal 'leaf of palm', where tal = t?la); the word for 'earth' is tanah, which still means 'earth' in Malay/Indonesian. Aditia Gunawan briefly discusses but does not solve the problem of what purpose 'earth' would serve in writing on palmleaf. >>>> >>>> Best wishes, >>>> >>>> Arlo Griffiths >>>> ?cole fran?aise d'Extr?me-Orient, Paris >>>> Universit? Jean Moulin ? Lyon 3 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> From: christoph.emmrich at utoronto.ca >>>> To: mkapstei at uchicago.edu >>>> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 2015 13:18:52 +0000 >>>> Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. >>>> CC: indology at list.indology.info >>>> >>>> Dear Matthew, >>>> >>>> Anthony Reid (A History of Southeast Asia: Critical Crossroads, 2015: 133) mentions the import of paper to SEA from China in the 15th cent., and there is the 14th cent. Niitisaararasamuccaya ms. from Kerinci. Also, there is an indication in a Bagan inscription, dated 1223, that features both the terms parabaik (i.e. other than palm leaf) and a donation of steatite in a container typical for usage on black (paper) parabaik more recently. Lammerts (2010, 232, fn. 7 and 10) points out that the terms and materials mentioned there may, but need not necessarily point to the usage of paper. >>>> >>>> Many thanks for raising this intriguing larger question, Matthew. >>>> >>>> Warmly, >>>> Christoph >>>> >>>> ---- >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>> On 23-Nov-2015, at 2:31 PM, Matthew Kapstein > wrote: >>>> >>>> Dear Christoph, >>>> >>>> Your comment is very interesting, and there does seem to be a prima facie similarity between >>>> what is described in Dominic's passage and parabaik techniques. But when does paper-making >>>> (or parabaik-making) technology begin in SE Asia? What do we know of its early history in the >>>> region? >>>> >>>> all best, >>>> Matthew >>>> >>>> Matthew Kapstein >>>> Directeur d'?tudes, >>>> Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes >>>> >>>> Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, >>>> The University of Chicago >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> INDOLOGY mailing list >>> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >>> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >>> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) >> >> ??????????????????? >> Christophe Vielle >> Louvain-la-Neuve >> >> _______________________________________________ >> INDOLOGY mailing list >> INDOLOGY at list.indology.info >> indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) >> http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) > > ??????????????????? > Christophe Vielle > Louvain-la-Neuve > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be Thu Nov 26 21:15:06 2015 From: christophe.vielle at uclouvain.be (Christophe Vielle) Date: Thu, 26 Nov 15 22:15:06 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Fwd: Black soot with oil (maSi) & turmeric powder (mRtsnaa) used in writing on palm leaves In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On behalf of N. Ganesan : > De: "N. Ganesan" > Objet: R?p : Black soot with oil (maSi) & turmeric powder (mRtsnaa) used in writing on palm leaves > Date: 26 novembre 2015 21:10:43 UTC+1 > > Dr. Dominic Goodall wrote: > <<< But I have just now come across another intriguing passage that seems likely to throw light on the question, even if at the moment it perplexes me. Perhaps colleagues on the list will have suggestions. > > The passage in question is verse 134 of the immense 298-verse stela commemorating the foundation of the ?aiva temple known today as Pre Rup in 883 ?aka. It is, of course, part of a description of the king. > > yad?ya? ?aram?tsn?bhir yya?a? k?mena k?ntijam > h?dya? h?di varastr???? lagna? likhitam ak?aram > > C?d?s interpretation is this: > > The glory that was born of his beauty, and that was pleasing to the heart, was a written character (ak?aram) that Kama had engraved indelibly (ak?aram) in the hearts of noble women with the powder of his arrows (?aram?tsn?bhi?). > > (La gloire n?e de sa beaut?, et plaisante au c?ur, ?tait un caract?re d??criture que l?Amour avait grav? d?une fa?on ind?l?bile dans le c?ur des nobles femmes avec la poudre de ses fl?ches.) > > This is fine as far as it goes. The verse recalls the convention of heroes marking their arrows with names (usually their own) before shooting them, and there is an elegant play on ak?ara. But what can the ?powder of his arrows? be ? Is there some arcanum of dhanu??stra that could explain this ? Or does the poet invite us to imagine simply that some clay or power was used to mark the name of the king upon the arrows that were then fired off by K?madeva ? >>> > > To understand the verse quoted in Khmer inscription, again parallel passages in old Tamil literature helps. In Tamil, ezutu (?????-) means "to paint", which later on also came to be employed as "characters" (=ezuttu, ???????). There is a Prabandha genre called "MaDal Urtal" in which the hero rides a palmyrah horse, holding the painting of the heroine who refuses to marry, thus making their love public. The painting on palmyrah leaf-fan is called "paTam ezutu-tal". A famous TirukkuRaL is: > ezutuGkAl kOlkANAk kaNNEpOl kONkan > pazikANEn kaNTa iTattu > ??????????? ?????????? ????????? ??????? > ????????? ???? ?????? > > Here, ezutuGkAl = while painting. & kOl = brush used to apply kohl/collyrium > Rev. Dr. G.U.Pope Translation: > The eye sees not the rod that paints it; nor can I > See any fault, when I behold my husband high. > --------------------------------------- > > Until now, three palm species are employed for writing/incising in south India (Borassus flabellifer, Corypha umbraculifera, Corypha utan). In Tamil, their names are panai, tALip panai & cItALi. cItALIp panai lives 100+ years, flowers only once and then dies; this sri-tALi palm is represented in Indus valley tablets also. Like kAz "black" becomes kAla "yama" & paza "fruit" > phala in Sanskrit, tAzai becomes tAla 'palms'. These palm leaves are treated with turmeric powder. tAzai is common name for palms and pandanus in Tamil. In Telugu and further north, tAzai is cognate with tADi "toddy" palm. > > There is another closely related species to that of palms, whose flower leaves/petals (called maDal, > Olai, ODu, tODu) are used to write secret, short messages such as love letters. It is the Pandanus flower petals, and no stylus is used. Only a brush is used to write some secretive symbols. Even the bronze age writing of symbols in Indus valley should have started like this on leaves of pandanus, palms and cotton cloth. W. A. Fairservis' book shows how the famous fish symbol comes from painting. > > "In contrast to lontar-leaf manuscripts, which make up the vast majority of all > known palm leaf manuscripts from Lombok to Sumatra, use of the nipah leaf > as writing support has been the subject of only limited codicological research, > receiving almost no attention in the literature (Van der Molen 1983:88). The > only testimony to the use of nipah leaves for writing material is De Clercq (1927, > as quoted in Van der Molen 1983:89), who states that he heard that formerly, in > the hinterlands of South Sumatra, and perhaps up to the time of his report, > nipah were used for writing ephemeral love letters. " Aditia Gunawan, 2015. > Reading this reminds of what is said about ephemeral writing/painting symbols on pandanus flower petals. The pandanus flower "leaf" is large enough for writing symbols, and 3 Jaina epics record this mode of "writing" (actually painting) on pandan flowers. > > Pandanus flowers - of pale yellow color - used as writing support base, > and the yellow makaranda powder of these large flowers is referred to > in the Khmer inscription. Panadanus leaves are called Kaama's sword, > and the flowers as arrow of Kaamadeva in 100s of poems in Tamil. > Obviously, the pollen powder (which is like turmeric powder) is mentioned in > the inscription. > http://www.allposters.com/-sp/Pandan-Pandanus-Amaryllifolius-Posters_i10044020_.htm > http://www.flickriver.com/photos/upuliishm/popular-interesting/ > http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/ai387e/ai387e08.htm > > Cilappatikaaram refers to Maadhavi, the courtesan, writing to Koavalan > on pandanus flower-leaf. The letters/symbols were painted red > using red cotton flower dye (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombax_ceiba ). > This red-cotton tree is 'cempaJcu' or 'ceG-kOGku' in Tamil. All this is in: > http://www.tamilvu.org/slet/l3100/l3100uri.jsp?slno=1000&subid=1000015 > You can see why panadus leaf is called Manmatha's sword here, > http://fairfun.net/my2/flora_my/flora_my-m/flora-mn/mp/pdpasp01c.htm > > In Ciivaka CintaamaNi, pandanus is called "arampai" and compared with > a sword. Using this book verses, G. U. Pope showed a century ago that > aNaGkan is the source for the word, anaGga (= Kaama) in Sanskrit. > The only cultivated species of pandaus is called rampai in Tamil (& also in Sinhala, Hindi). > Rampai (pandan) leaves are fragrant & is used in making biryanis, also baking along > with meat. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pandanus_amaryllifolius > arampu-tal "to torment" seems to be the source for the devaloka gaNikA, rambhaa. > https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/vallamai/MeUVJPnDL2A/gZd_6HmxCgAJ > Her thighs, compared with banana tree, gives one name for banana tree as arampai. > > In KonguvELir's PeruGkatai (a rendering of Brhatkathaa), the heroine's forehead > is treated as pandanus "flower-leaf" and used for writing to send secret messages. > Cintamani explicitly compares the heroine's forehead with panadanus "flower-leaf" > The chapter is called "muka ezuttuk kAtai": > http://www.tamilvu.org/slet/l3600/l3600son.jsp?subid=3629 > > Hope the Khmer inscription mentioning pandanus flower as arrow of Kaama, > and the poet's play of the pandan makaranda used in writing (implicitly referring > to the similar colored turmeric used on palm leaves) is clear in: > yad?ya? ?aram?tsn?bhir yya?a? k?mena k?ntijam > h?dya? h?di varastr???? lagna? likhitam ak?aram > > Hope this beautiful inscription is translated in full. > > Kind regards, > N. Ganesan > > BTW, the famous GuDimallam lingam, the most ancient in India, has pandanus flower bracts decorating the axe-bearing god's > head. Being a product of Neytal seascape, the pandanus bracts are apt. So, I presented a paper in 16th WSC, Bangkok > suggesting GuDimallam linga is really VaruNa, the god of Neytal landscape. In Sangam literature, a tree is the symbol of > a chieftain's and his capital is named after the VaruNa tree. The word, linga, occurs in Tamil for the first time associated > with VaruNa tree & provides support for Gudimallam linga as VaruNa. Siva is not mentioned in Tolkaappiyam at all. > ??????????????????? Christophe Vielle Louvain-la-Neuve -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Palaniappa at aol.com Fri Nov 27 06:35:28 2015 From: Palaniappa at aol.com (Sudalaimuthu Palaniappan) Date: Fri, 27 Nov 15 00:35:28 -0600 Subject: Prof. Noboru Karashima, Tamil scholar who inspired a generation Message-ID: <4E7AA601-9C51-4607-8FE6-4F84AFF27132@aol.com> Dear Indologists, Prof. Noboru Karashima has passed away. See http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/tamil-scholar-who-inspired-a-generation/article7920303.ece . Regards, Palaniappan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From arlogriffiths at hotmail.com Fri Nov 27 13:00:44 2015 From: arlogriffiths at hotmail.com (Arlo Griffiths) Date: Fri, 27 Nov 15 13:00:44 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Epigraphia Indica vol. 39 Message-ID: Dear colleagues, I don't find any digital copy of this volume online. Can anyone oblige with a pdf of the whole volume, or if not that with a pdf of P.R. Srinivasan's contribution on one or more Nagarjunakonda inscriptions? Thank you. Arlo Griffiths EFEO, Paris Universit? Jean Moulin ? Lyon 3 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From H.J.H.Tieken at hum.leidenuniv.nl Fri Nov 27 15:36:13 2015 From: H.J.H.Tieken at hum.leidenuniv.nl (Tieken, H.J.H.) Date: Fri, 27 Nov 15 15:36:13 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] as long as the moon and the sun shall shine Message-ID: Dear List members, In the S??c? version of A?oka's Schism Edict we come across the expression (putapapotike) ca?das?riyike, ?(as long as my sons and great-grandsons shall reign and) the moon and the sun (shall shine)?. A variant is found in the so-called Seventh Pillar Edict: putapapotike ca?damasuliyike hotu ti. I am certain I have come across the expression before, but at the moment can think only of cantir?titta-varai in a South Indian Tamil inscription. Furthermore, I remember having once seen a photograph of a hero-stone (or was it a sat?-stone) with a sun and a moon carved in the upper part. I hope someone on the list can help me with some more information. What I would in particular like to know is how wide-spread this expression is, what are the oldest instances, and if it has been described in the secondary literature. With kind regards, Herman Herman Tieken Stationsweg 58 2515 BP Den Haag The Netherlands 00 31 (0)70 2208127 website: hermantieken.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From wujastyk at gmail.com Fri Nov 27 15:40:01 2015 From: wujastyk at gmail.com (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Fri, 27 Nov 15 08:40:01 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Bibliography of TeX critical editions done with EDMAC, LEDMAC, eLEDMAC, reLEDMAC Message-ID: Dear colleagues, There is a Zotero group where one may record a bibliographical entry for any critical edition that uses the TeX or LaTeX packages for formatting critical editions. If your critical edition uses EDMAC or one of its derivatives, please consider adding an entry for your book or article to the list. The address is: - https://www.zotero.org/groups/critical_editions_typeset_with_edmac_ledmac_and_eledmac Best wishes, Dominik Wujastyk -- Professor Dominik Wujastyk* Singhmar Chair in Classical Indian Society and Polity Department of History and Classics University of Alberta, Canada -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From LubinT at wlu.edu Fri Nov 27 17:30:53 2015 From: LubinT at wlu.edu (Lubin, Tim) Date: Fri, 27 Nov 15 17:30:53 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] as long as the moon and the sun shall shine In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Herman, As it happens, I just presented a paper in Heidelberg that discussed this and other diplomatic idioms, their long duration and wide spread in South and Southeast Asia. http://www.haw.uni-heidelberg.de/md/haw/veranstaltungen/programm_nepal-tagung_07.08_ii.pdf I noted in particular that a surprising number of such idioms appear already in A?oka?s edicts, even though these have often been regarded as quite unlike later South Asian inscriptions. Here is a sampling of what I call the ?perpetuity clause? in various forms. There are many variations, but when moon and sun are mentioned (as they almost always are), it is always first and in that order, sometimes with stars inserted. Here is a tiny selection of later examples in Sanskrit, (post-A?oka) Prakrit, Tamil, and Javanese, though such examples are legion: Skt.: ?-candr?rka?[1]/ ?-candr?rka-t?ra-k?l?na[2]/ candra-t?r?rkka-sthiti-k?la-[3]/ etc. etc. up to the time of the moon and sun [and stars] Pkt.: ?-canda-t?ra-k?l?ka[4] up to the time of the moon and stars CT: cantr?tittaval[5] as long as the moon and sun OJ: kadi lavas sa? hya? candr?ditya hana ri? ?-?k??a sumuluh hi? a??abhuvana[6] so long as the moon and sun remain in the sky and illuminate the earth-egg ________________________________ [1] Very common; an example from Nepal is the Y?pagr?madra?ga grant of year 67 = 386, Gn. no. LXVII; DV no. 123; Regmi, no. 116, line 18, or the Lagan Tol stele above. -k?liya: Jamb CP, llines 30?31. [2] Many Bagh CPs from Orissa; sim. Paharpur CP, line 20, Baigram CP, line. 11, etc. etc. [3] Faridpur CP A, line 18. [4] Hirahadagalli CP, line 29. [5] Tirum?lan?tar Temple, Bahur, year 27 of Ka??aradeva = 966 (PI 9; ARE 1902.183; SII 7.810). [6] Kembang Arum A/B CP of Panggumulan I and II (? 824-825 = 27 Dec. 902), 3v7?8. K. V. Ramesh has collected numerous examples from Kannada and Telugu inscriptions in his new Dictionary of Social, Economic, and Administrative Terms in South Indian Inscriptions (Oxford India, 2012), see pp. 8?9. The ?sons and grandsons clause? that you mention is also almost as widespread, though it is not necessarily conjoined with the ?moon and sun clause.? I am revising the paper at them moment, but I would be willing to share it when it is ready, in mid-January. Best wishes, Tim Timothy Lubin Professor of Religion and Adjunct Professor of Law Washington and Lee University Lexington, Virginia 24450 http://home.wlu.edu/~lubint http://wlu.academia.edu/TimothyLubin https://twitter.com/TimothyLubin ? From: INDOLOGY > on behalf of "Tieken, H.J.H." > Date: Friday, November 27, 2015 at 10:36 AM To: "indology at list.indology.info" > Subject: [INDOLOGY] as long as the moon and the sun shall shine Dear List members, In the S??c? version of A?oka's Schism Edict we come across the expression (putapapotike) ca?das?riyike, ?(as long as my sons and great-grandsons shall reign and) the moon and the sun (shall shine)?. A variant is found in the so-called Seventh Pillar Edict: putapapotike ca?damasuliyike hotu ti. I am certain I have come across the expression before, but at the moment can think only of cantir?titta-varai in a South Indian Tamil inscription. Furthermore, I remember having once seen a photograph of a hero-stone (or was it a sat?-stone) with a sun and a moon carved in the upper part. I hope someone on the list can help me with some more information. What I would in particular like to know is how wide-spread this expression is, what are the oldest instances, and if it has been described in the secondary literature. With kind regards, Herman Herman Tieken Stationsweg 58 2515 BP Den Haag The Netherlands 00 31 (0)70 2208127 website: hermantieken.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From arlogriffiths at hotmail.com Fri Nov 27 19:35:49 2015 From: arlogriffiths at hotmail.com (Arlo Griffiths) Date: Fri, 27 Nov 15 19:35:49 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] as long as the moon and the sun shall shine In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Especially for those Indologists who read Dutch: https://openaccess.leidenuniv.nl/bitstream/handle/1887/12400/oratie_griffiths_def.pdf?sequence=1 For some reason the version they put online is not the final one... Arlo Griffiths From: LubinT at wlu.edu To: indology at list.indology.info Date: Fri, 27 Nov 2015 17:30:53 +0000 Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] as long as the moon and the sun shall shine Dear Herman, As it happens, I just presented a paper in Heidelberg that discussed this and other diplomatic idioms, their long duration and wide spread in South and Southeast Asia. http://www.haw.uni-heidelberg.de/md/haw/veranstaltungen/programm_nepal-tagung_07.08_ii.pdf I noted in particular that a surprising number of such idioms appear already in A?oka?s edicts, even though these have often been regarded as quite unlike later South Asian inscriptions. Here is a sampling of what I call the ?perpetuity clause? in various forms. There are many variations, but when moon and sun are mentioned (as they almost always are), it is always first and in that order, sometimes with stars inserted. Here is a tiny selection of later examples in Sanskrit, (post-A?oka) Prakrit, Tamil, and Javanese, though such examples are legion: Skt.: ?-candr?rka? [1] Very common; an example from Nepal is the Y?pagr?madra?ga grant of year 67 = 386, Gn. no. LXVII; DV no. 123; Regmi, no. 116, line 18, or the Lagan Tol stele above. -k?liya: Jamb CP, llines 30?31. [2] Many Bagh CPs from Orissa; sim. Paharpur CP, line 20, Baigram CP, line. 11, etc. etc. [3] Faridpur CP A, line 18. [4] Hirahadagalli CP, line 29. [5] Tirum?lan?tar Temple, Bahur, year 27 of Ka??aradeva = 966 (PI 9; ARE 1902.183; SII 7.810). [6] Kembang Arum A/B CP of Panggumulan I and II (? 824-825 = 27 Dec. 902), 3v7?8. K. V. Ramesh has collected numerous examples from Kannada and Telugu inscriptions in his new Dictionary of Social, Economic, and Administrative Terms in South Indian Inscriptions (Oxford India, 2012), see pp. 8?9. The ?sons and grandsons clause? that you mention is also almost as widespread, though it is not necessarily conjoined with the ?moon and sun clause.? I am revising the paper at them moment, but I would be willing to share it when it is ready, in mid-January. Best wishes, Tim Timothy Lubin Professor of Religion and Adjunct Professor of Law Washington and Lee University Lexington, Virginia 24450 http://home.wlu.edu/~lubint http://wlu.academia.edu/TimothyLubin https://twitter.com/TimothyLubin ? From: INDOLOGY on behalf of "Tieken, H.J.H." Date: Friday, November 27, 2015 at 10:36 AM To: "indology at list.indology.info" Subject: [INDOLOGY] as long as the moon and the sun shall shine Dear List members, In the S??c? version of A?oka's Schism Edict we come across the expression (putapapotike) ca?das?riyike, ?(as long as my sons and great-grandsons shall reign and) the moon and the sun (shall shine)?. A variant is found in the so-called Seventh Pillar Edict: putapapotike ca?damasuliyike hotu ti. I am certain I have come across the expression before, but at the moment can think only of cantir?titta-varai in a South Indian Tamil inscription. Furthermore, I remember having once seen a photograph of a hero-stone (or was it a sat?-stone) with a sun and a moon carved in the upper part. I hope someone on the list can help me with some more information. What I would in particular like to know is how wide-spread this expression is, what are the oldest instances, and if it has been described in the secondary literature. With kind regards, Herman Herman Tieken Stationsweg 58 2515 BP Den Haag The Netherlands 00 31 (0)70 2208127 website: hermantieken.com _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From H.J.H.Tieken at hum.leidenuniv.nl Sat Nov 28 14:01:49 2015 From: H.J.H.Tieken at hum.leidenuniv.nl (Tieken, H.J.H.) Date: Sat, 28 Nov 15 14:01:49 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] as long as the moon and the sun shall shine In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Tim, Manu, Arlo and Harry, Thank you very much for the information. I knew there was more but had no idea where to look and how much it was. Herman Herman Tieken Stationsweg 58 2515 BP Den Haag The Netherlands 00 31 (0)70 2208127 website: hermantieken.com ________________________________ Van: INDOLOGY [indology-bounces at list.indology.info] namens Arlo Griffiths [arlogriffiths at hotmail.com] Verzonden: vrijdag 27 november 2015 20:35 Aan: Tim Lubin; INDOLOGY Onderwerp: Re: [INDOLOGY] as long as the moon and the sun shall shine Especially for those Indologists who read Dutch: https://openaccess.leidenuniv.nl/bitstream/handle/1887/12400/oratie_griffiths_def.pdf?sequence=1 For some reason the version they put online is not the final one... Arlo Griffiths ________________________________ From: LubinT at wlu.edu To: indology at list.indology.info Date: Fri, 27 Nov 2015 17:30:53 +0000 Subject: Re: [INDOLOGY] as long as the moon and the sun shall shine Dear Herman, As it happens, I just presented a paper in Heidelberg that discussed this and other diplomatic idioms, their long duration and wide spread in South and Southeast Asia. http://www.haw.uni-heidelberg.de/md/haw/veranstaltungen/programm_nepal-tagung_07.08_ii.pdf I noted in particular that a surprising number of such idioms appear already in A?oka?s edicts, even though these have often been regarded as quite unlike later South Asian inscriptions. Here is a sampling of what I call the ?perpetuity clause? in various forms. There are many variations, but when moon and sun are mentioned (as they almost always are), it is always first and in that order, sometimes with stars inserted. Here is a tiny selection of later examples in Sanskrit, (post-A?oka) Prakrit, Tamil, and Javanese, though such examples are legion: Skt.: ?-candr?rka? ________________________________ [1] Very common; an example from Nepal is the Y?pagr?madra?ga grant of year 67 = 386, Gn. no. LXVII; DV no. 123; Regmi, no. 116, line 18, or the Lagan Tol stele above. -k?liya: Jamb CP, llines 30?31. [2] Many Bagh CPs from Orissa; sim. Paharpur CP, line 20, Baigram CP, line. 11, etc. etc. [3] Faridpur CP A, line 18. [4] Hirahadagalli CP, line 29. [5] Tirum?lan?tar Temple, Bahur, year 27 of Ka??aradeva = 966 (PI 9; ARE 1902.183; SII 7.810). [6] Kembang Arum A/B CP of Panggumulan I and II (? 824-825 = 27 Dec. 902), 3v7?8. K. V. Ramesh has collected numerous examples from Kannada and Telugu inscriptions in his new Dictionary of Social, Economic, and Administrative Terms in South Indian Inscriptions (Oxford India, 2012), see pp. 8?9. The ?sons and grandsons clause? that you mention is also almost as widespread, though it is not necessarily conjoined with the ?moon and sun clause.? I am revising the paper at them moment, but I would be willing to share it when it is ready, in mid-January. Best wishes, Tim Timothy Lubin Professor of Religion and Adjunct Professor of Law Washington and Lee University Lexington, Virginia 24450 http://home.wlu.edu/~lubint http://wlu.academia.edu/TimothyLubin https://twitter.com/TimothyLubin ? From: INDOLOGY > on behalf of "Tieken, H.J.H." > Date: Friday, November 27, 2015 at 10:36 AM To: "indology at list.indology.info" > Subject: [INDOLOGY] as long as the moon and the sun shall shine Dear List members, In the S??c? version of A?oka's Schism Edict we come across the expression (putapapotike) ca?das?riyike, ?(as long as my sons and great-grandsons shall reign and) the moon and the sun (shall shine)?. A variant is found in the so-called Seventh Pillar Edict: putapapotike ca?damasuliyike hotu ti. I am certain I have come across the expression before, but at the moment can think only of cantir?titta-varai in a South Indian Tamil inscription. Furthermore, I remember having once seen a photograph of a hero-stone (or was it a sat?-stone) with a sun and a moon carved in the upper part. I hope someone on the list can help me with some more information. What I would in particular like to know is how wide-spread this expression is, what are the oldest instances, and if it has been described in the secondary literature. With kind regards, Herman Herman Tieken Stationsweg 58 2515 BP Den Haag The Netherlands 00 31 (0)70 2208127 website: hermantieken.com _______________________________________________ INDOLOGY mailing list INDOLOGY at list.indology.info indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dnreigle at gmail.com Sat Nov 28 16:41:18 2015 From: dnreigle at gmail.com (David and Nancy Reigle) Date: Sat, 28 Nov 15 09:41:18 -0700 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]=09Y=C4=81ska's_Nirukta_-_Digital_editions_and_word_lists?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Martin, The edition and translation of the Nirukta (and Nigha??u) by Lakshman Sarup was originally published in four parts: Introduction; English translation; Sanskrit text; Indices and Appendices. The Motilal Banarsidass reprints include only the first three of these, despite their subtitle. The fourth volume, of Indices and Appendices, is the part that makes this text useful for reference purposes. Not only does it allow one to find a particular word in the Nirukta (or Nigha??u), it also serves as a glossary, since it gives English equivalents throughout. Your query has spurred me on to scan my copy of this necessary volume and post it with the Sanskrit texts here: http://prajnaquest.fr/blog/sanskrit-texts-3/sanskrit-hindu-texts/ Best regards, David Reigle Colorado, U.S.A. On Mon, Nov 23, 2015 at 11:18 AM, Martin Gluckman wrote: > Dear Friends, > > I am searching for digital editions of Y?ska's Nirukta (both the source > text and any translations done till date) and any other digital material in > this light (word lists with definitions as given in any > translations/commentary and so forth). > > With much appreciation in advance, > > Martin Gluckman > > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ashok.aklujkar at gmail.com Sun Nov 29 13:19:42 2015 From: ashok.aklujkar at gmail.com (Ashok Aklujkar) Date: Sun, 29 Nov 15 05:19:42 -0800 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <7CEE4657-CED4-4459-B10D-1F09A73BB17E@gmail.com> As in an earlier instance, I am just sharing information and am not concerned much with whether the information would fit a particular pre-modern text exactly. > On Nov 26, 2015, at 6:02 AM, Dominic Goodall wrote: > Bearing these guiding principles in mind I was in favour yesterday of understanding m?tsn? as ?steatite/chalk pencil? or the like, and therefore perhaps simply as ?writing implement? generically. I certainly still think that this is possible, but I now think that the ?powder? hypothesis (chalk, talk, or, as N. Ganesan has suggested, turmeric) cannot be abandoned either. There used to be a writing implement called dh??-p??? ??????? in Marathi (which would correpond to ????-???? or ????-?????/????? ?dust-board? in Skt and hence will be relatable to m?tsn?). I have not seen one and am not entirely sure about the extent to which it was used or the exact way in which it was used. However, it was definitely used to learn writing and was associated with texts that were not meant to be preserved. Students probably wrote numbers, alphabet letters and practice sentences on it and corrected or erased the writing after the teacher had checked it for accuracy. Perhaps the following publication, which I cannot access at present, will have more information about it: Sarma, S.R. 1985. Writing Material in Ancient India. Aligarh: Viveka Publishers. Aligarh Oriental Series, No. 5. a.a. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mkapstei at uchicago.edu Sun Nov 29 15:56:41 2015 From: mkapstei at uchicago.edu (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Sun, 29 Nov 15 15:56:41 +0000 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <7CEE4657-CED4-4459-B10D-1F09A73BB17E@gmail.com> Message-ID: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B14B70@xm-mbx-04-prod> We're now far from rubrication, but in connection with Ashok's comment about "dust-boards," it may be of interest to note that Tibetans employed a similar technique in order to economize on paper. White ash would be sprinkled on a slate or blackboard, on which students could then practice their writing using a dry bamboo pen. But there was a deluxe version of this as well, in which a lacquered black surface, fastened into an often elaborately decorated case, so that the ash would not be disturbed after writing, served as the medium for transmitting messages among the high aristocracy. The recipient, on receiving the message, would transcribe it into his journal if necessary, but then wipe the slate clean before returning it. Matthew Kapstein Directeur d'?tudes, Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, The University of Chicago ________________________________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jpo at uts.cc.utexas.edu Sun Nov 29 16:33:59 2015 From: jpo at uts.cc.utexas.edu (Patrick Olivelle) Date: Sun, 29 Nov 15 10:33:59 -0600 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <82C3E42590D939418C74DD76B97DDED047B14B70@xm-mbx-04-prod> Message-ID: <19F276F5-75F9-4E81-8AD6-4C119A31FE15@uts.cc.utexas.edu> Yes, we are far from rubrication ? but a parallel to Ashok's dust-board is the preliminary writing of a plaint in a court of law on what they say is "phalaka", or chalk board, where corrections are made and the plaint written down permanently on a patra. See N?rada Sm?ti m?t?k?, 2:18; B?haspati Sm?ti 1.2.30. Patrick On Nov 29, 2015, at 9:56 AM, Matthew Kapstein wrote: > We're now far from rubrication, but in connection with Ashok's comment about "dust-boards," it > may be of interest to note that Tibetans employed a similar technique in order to economize on > paper. White ash would be sprinkled on a slate or blackboard, on which students could then > practice their writing using a dry bamboo pen. But there was a deluxe version of this as well, > in which a lacquered black surface, fastened into an often elaborately decorated case, so that the > ash would not be disturbed after writing, served as the medium for transmitting messages among > the high aristocracy. The recipient, on receiving the message, would transcribe it into his journal > if necessary, but then wipe the slate clean before returning it. > > Matthew Kapstein > Directeur d'?tudes, > Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes > > Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, > The University of Chicago > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kauzeya at gmail.com Sun Nov 29 16:30:08 2015 From: kauzeya at gmail.com (Jonathan Silk) Date: Sun, 29 Nov 15 17:30:08 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] rubrication in Indian mss. In-Reply-To: <19F276F5-75F9-4E81-8AD6-4C119A31FE15@uts.cc.utexas.edu> Message-ID: even farther.... but it is not without relevance that Friday Richard Salomon delivered the Gonda Lecture in Amsterdam with the title "HOW THE BUDDHA LEARNED HIS ABCS: ON TEACHING WRITING IN THE ANCIENT WORLD". Writing tablets played a large part in his discussion; he has promised a full publication of his remarks (it looked to me that his actual manuscript was at least double the length of the lecture he delivered), with ample illustrations, in the near future. Since he reads this list I assume that once he recovers from his jet-lag he'll be able to say something himself :) best, Jonathan On Sun, Nov 29, 2015 at 5:33 PM, Patrick Olivelle wrote: > Yes, we are far from rubrication ? but a parallel to Ashok's dust-board is > the preliminary writing of a plaint in a court of law on what they say is > "phalaka", or chalk board, where corrections are made and the plaint > written down permanently on a patra. See N?rada Sm?ti m?t?k?, 2:18; > B?haspati Sm?ti 1.2.30. > > Patrick > > > On Nov 29, 2015, at 9:56 AM, Matthew Kapstein > wrote: > > We're now far from rubrication, but in connection with Ashok's comment > about "dust-boards," it > may be of interest to note that Tibetans employed a similar technique in > order to economize on > paper. White ash would be sprinkled on a slate or blackboard, on which > students could then > practice their writing using a dry bamboo pen. But there was a deluxe > version of this as well, > in which a lacquered black surface, fastened into an often elaborately > decorated case, so that the > ash would not be disturbed after writing, served as the medium for > transmitting messages among > the high aristocracy. The recipient, on receiving the message, would > transcribe it into his journal > if necessary, but then wipe the slate clean before returning it. > > Matthew Kapstein > Directeur d'?tudes, > Ecole Pratique des Hautes Etudes > > Numata Visiting Professor of Buddhist Studies, > The University of Chicago > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -- J. Silk Leiden University Leiden University Institute for Area Studies, LIAS Matthias de Vrieshof 3, Room 0.05b 2311 BZ Leiden The Netherlands copies of my publications may be found at http://www.buddhismandsocialjustice.com/silk_publications.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cchl2 at cam.ac.uk Sun Nov 29 18:08:40 2015 From: cchl2 at cam.ac.uk (Charles Li) Date: Sun, 29 Nov 15 18:08:40 +0000 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?[INDOLOGY]_folk_etymology_of_"ka=C5=9Bm=C4=ABra"?= In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <565B3F28.3030500@cam.ac.uk> I came across this purported nirukta of the word "ka?m?ra" on the Wikipedia page for "Kashmir" -- does anyone know where it comes from? -- : The Nilamata Purana describes the Valley's origin from the waters, Ka means "water" and Shimir means "to desiccate". Hence, Kaashmir stands for "a land desiccated from water." There is also a theory which takes Kaashmir to be a contraction of Kashyap-mira or Kashyapmir or Kashyapmeru, the "sea or mountain of Kashyapa", the sage who is credited with having drained the waters of the primordial lake Satisar, that Kaashmir was before it was reclaimed. I checked the N?lamata Pur?na, which has this: ka? praj?patir uddi??a? ka?yapa? ca praj?pati? | ten?sau nirmito de?a? ka?m?r?khyo bhavi?yati || 231 || ka? v?ri hari?? yasm?d de??d asm?d ap?k?tam | ka?m?r?khya? tato pa?ya n?ma loke bhavi??ati || 232 || source: https://archive.org/stream/nilamatapurana/nilamata_purana#page/n47/mode/2up This explains the "ka" as water (v?ri), but doesn't have anything to say about "shimir". The R?jatara?gi?? has, similarly: ka?yapena tadanta?sta? gh?tayitv? jalodbhavam | nirmame tatsarobh?mau ka?m?r? iti ma??alam || 27 || source: https://archive.org/stream/TheRajataranginiOfKalhanaVol3/The%20Rajatarangini%20of%20Kalhana%20-%20Vol%201#page/n7/mode/2up Neither source seems to have anything to say about the second half of the word "ka?m?ra" meaning something like "desiccated". Does anyone have any idea where this might come from? Thanks, Charles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From slaje at kabelmail.de Sun Nov 29 20:26:42 2015 From: slaje at kabelmail.de (Walter Slaje) Date: Sun, 29 Nov 15 21:26:42 +0100 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[INDOLOGY]_folk_etymology_of_"ka=C5=9Bm=C4=ABra"?= In-Reply-To: <565B3F28.3030500@cam.ac.uk> Message-ID: This since B?hler's detailed analysis of the N?lamata in his famous Kashm?r report of 1877 well-known desiccation myth simply provided a background for "Nirvacananists" in search for a meaning like "water-draining-away" in the syllables *ka-?m?-ra*. The N?lamata reference with *ka *(n.) as "water" may tacitly presuppose on what Govind Kaul elaborated more extensively later in the 19th century. See his *R?jatara?gi??prade?avy?khy? *(MS Stein No. 128, Clauson's Catalogue [1912] p. 598). There, he explains the nirukti in the context of Kashmir's "second name", Sat?saras, in the following manner: *ka? *[=] jala?, *?m?rati *[=] calaty asm?d iti *?m?ra sm?ra* calane iti dh?tor au??dika? r?pam. Thereafter he quotes your N?lamata passage, incidentally using the notable variant *halin? *instead of *hari??* (cp. the apparatus in De Vreese's ed.). Thus by a forced u??di derivation two nominal stems *?m?ra / sm?ra* were made up assigning to it the meaning of the verbal root *cal*. This could very well represent an older tradition. Anyway, following Kaul's etymology, *ka-?m?ra* would eventually come to mean "[land] from-where-the-water-drained-away". In this manuscript, Govind Kaul explains also the etymologies of the name Kashmir in the Ka?m?r? (*ka??ra, ka?ur, ka??r*) and Persian (*ka?yapamar, ka?mar*) languages. Regards, WS ----------------------------- Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje Hermann-L?ns-Str. 1 D-99425 Weimar Deutschland Ego ex animi mei sententia spondeo ac polliceor studia humanitatis impigro labore culturum et provecturum non sordidi lucri causa nec ad vanam captandam gloriam, sed quo magis veri ?? tas propagetur et lux eius, qua salus humani generis continetur, clarius effulgeat. Vindobonae, die XXI. mensis Novembris MCMLXXXIII. 2015-11-29 19:08 GMT+01:00 Charles Li : > I came across this purported nirukta of the word "ka?m?ra" on the > Wikipedia page for "Kashmir" -- does anyone know where it comes from? -- : > > The Nilamata Purana describes the Valley's origin from the waters, Ka > means "water" and Shimir means "to desiccate". Hence, Kaashmir stands for > "a land desiccated from water." There is also a theory which takes Kaashmir > to be a contraction of Kashyap-mira or Kashyapmir or Kashyapmeru, the "sea > or mountain of Kashyapa", the sage who is credited with having drained the > waters of the primordial lake Satisar, that Kaashmir was before it was > reclaimed. > > I checked the N?lamata Pur?na, which has this: > > ka? praj?patir uddi??a? ka?yapa? ca praj?pati? | > ten?sau nirmito de?a? ka?m?r?khyo bhavi?yati || 231 || > ka? v?ri hari?? yasm?d de??d asm?d ap?k?tam | > ka?m?r?khya? tato pa?ya n?ma loke bhavi??ati || 232 || > > > source: > https://archive.org/stream/nilamatapurana/nilamata_purana#page/n47/mode/2up > > This explains the "ka" as water (v?ri), but doesn't have anything to say > about "shimir". The R?jatara?gi?? has, similarly: > > ka?yapena tadanta?sta? gh?tayitv? jalodbhavam | > nirmame tatsarobh?mau ka?m?r? iti ma??alam || 27 || > > > source: > https://archive.org/stream/TheRajataranginiOfKalhanaVol3/The%20Rajatarangini%20of%20Kalhana%20-%20Vol%201#page/n7/mode/2up > > Neither source seems to have anything to say about the second half of the > word "ka?m?ra" meaning something like "desiccated". Does anyone have any > idea where this might come from? > > Thanks, > > Charles > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing > committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or > unsubscribe) > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mbroo at abo.fi Mon Nov 30 09:29:04 2015 From: mbroo at abo.fi (mbroo at abo.fi) Date: Mon, 30 Nov 15 11:29:04 +0200 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Gopinath Kaviraja's Tantrika sahitya? Message-ID: <20151130112904.wdlgwqewgscw8oow@webmail2.abo.fi> Dear colleagues, Does anyone have an electronic copy of Gopinath Kaviraja's Tantrika sahitya (Lucknow 1972)? I would be very grateful if someone could share one. Sincerely M?ns Broo -- Dr. M?ns Broo Senior Lecturer of Comparative Religion Editor of Temenos, Nordic Journal of Comparative Religion ?bo Akademi University Fabriksgatan 2 FI-20500 ?bo, Finland phone: +358-2-2154398 fax: +358-2-2154902 mobile: +358-50-5695754 From ondracka at ff.cuni.cz Mon Nov 30 09:32:11 2015 From: ondracka at ff.cuni.cz (Lubomir Ondracka) Date: Mon, 30 Nov 15 10:32:11 +0100 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Gopinath Kaviraja's Tantrika sahitya? In-Reply-To: <20151130112904.wdlgwqewgscw8oow@webmail2.abo.fi> Message-ID: <20151130103211.591f143afe700ee786c1606a@ff.cuni.cz> It is available from DLI (no. 99999990001055). --- Lubomir Ondracka Institute for Philosophy & Religious Studies Charles University, Namesti Jana Palacha 2 116 38 Praha 1, Czech Republic e-mail: ondracka at ff.cuni.cz On Mon, 30 Nov 2015 11:29:04 +0200 wrote: > > Dear colleagues, > > Does anyone have an electronic copy of Gopinath Kaviraja's Tantrika > sahitya (Lucknow 1972)? I would be very grateful if someone could > share one. > > Sincerely > M?ns Broo > > -- > Dr. M?ns Broo > Senior Lecturer of Comparative Religion > Editor of Temenos, Nordic Journal of Comparative Religion > ?bo Akademi University > Fabriksgatan 2 > FI-20500 ?bo, Finland > phone: +358-2-2154398 > fax: +358-2-2154902 > mobile: +358-50-5695754 > > > > _______________________________________________ > INDOLOGY mailing list > INDOLOGY at list.indology.info > indology-owner at list.indology.info (messages to the list's managing committee) > http://listinfo.indology.info (where you can change your list options or unsubscribe) From d.wujastyk at gmail.com Mon Nov 30 19:17:29 2015 From: d.wujastyk at gmail.com (Dagmar Wujastyk) Date: Mon, 30 Nov 15 12:17:29 -0700 Subject: [INDOLOGY] Launch of AyurYog project website Message-ID: Dear colleagues, I am very pleased to announce the launch of the updated AyurYog project website and blog at ayuryog.org ! The AyurYog project "Medicine, Immortality, Mok?a: Entangled Histories of Ayurveda, Yoga and Alchemy in South Asia" examines the connections between ayurveda, yoga and rasa??stra with a focus on health, rejuvenation and longevity practices. The ERC-Starting-Grant-funded research project is hosted at the Institute for South Asian, Tibetan and Buddhist Studies at the University of Vienna. I hope you enjoy the website and the blog! With best wishes, Dagmar Wujastyk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: