From witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU  Wed Jan  1 04:52:59 2003
From: witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU (Michael Witzel)
Date: Tue, 31 Dec 02 23:52:59 -0500
Subject: Important archaeological discovery in Russia
Message-ID: <161227071935.23782.13736415208665062673.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

As of now, methinks, we can put an end to many fruitless discussions:

such as about Pt. Frawley's Vedic, Stone Age kingdom in the Gangetic basin
at 10,000 BCE --mother of all civilizations on the planet--,
or about Dr. Wells', by now genetically proven immigration of speakers of
Dravidian, also at 10,000 BCE.

Russian scientists  (or more correctly, their Turkish-speaking Bashkir
compatriots) have done us this great service!  However, the important news
item has unfortunately been overlooked by all avid internet citizens, so
active on this and other Indian lists. Thanks to god(s), my attention was
drawn to it a few days ago and I can share with you here.

The discovery  has been published  in the Russian newspaper of Soviet fame,
Pravda. Its name implies  (nyet, it has always implied)  "Truth":

http://english.pravda.ru/main/2002/04/30/28149.html

In short:  natural scientists of the Bashkir State University have
discovered --in the Urals, remember: the home of the Aryans!--  a hoary
civilization that used ultra-modern technology, space  based
three-dimensional mapping,  and air transport and thus had no need for
roads --  120 million  ( 1200,00 000 ) years ago...

This scintillating discovery, supported by Chinese and American natural
scientists, should put to rest all those useless, never-ending discussions
by supremacist, Eurocentric etc. p.p. Indologists about an Aryan invasion,
or the truly patriotic Bha_rati_ya debate about a  lost and found
Sarasvati_ River, or the submersive Dravidianist seperatists'  idea of a
lost Southern Continent off  kanyakumArI (Lemuria), or even the
anthropologists'/geneticists'  new tale of recent, just 6 mill. to 150K
b.p.,  human origins in Africa...

Jiivatv  anusandhaanam!

A happy and fruitful 2003,

MW
============================================================
Michael Witzel
Department of Sanskrit & Indian Studies, Harvard University
2 Divinity Avenue, Cambridge MA 02138, USA

ph. 1- 617-496 2990 (also messages)
home page:  http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwpage.htm




From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK  Wed Jan  1 09:37:19 2003
From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk)
Date: Wed, 01 Jan 03 09:37:19 +0000
Subject: Claude Setzer -- current e-mail address?
In-Reply-To: <20030101045638.GB8006@ext.canterbury.ac.nz>
Message-ID: <161227071939.23782.5005240865952320749.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Claude Setzer <cssetzer at mum.edu>


On Wed, 1 Jan 2003, Richard Mahoney wrote:


> Would any of you know the current e-mail and/or postal address of Dr
> Claude Setzer?




From rbm49 at EXT.CANTERBURY.AC.NZ  Wed Jan  1 04:56:39 2003
From: rbm49 at EXT.CANTERBURY.AC.NZ (Richard Mahoney)
Date: Wed, 01 Jan 03 17:56:39 +1300
Subject: Claude Setzer -- current e-mail address?
Message-ID: <161227071937.23782.15022210489334261270.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear INDOLOGY Colleagues,

[I apologize to RISA-L subscribers for cross posting]

Would any of you know the current e-mail and/or postal address of Dr
Claude Setzer?


Regards,

 Richard Mahoney


--
Richard Mahoney    |  E-mail: rbm49 at ext.canterbury.ac.nz
78 Jeffreys Road   |          r.mahoney at comnet.net.nz
Fendalton          |  Telephone: 0064-3-351-5831
CHRISTCHURCH 8005  |  Cellular: 0064-25-829-986
NEW ZEALAND        |  http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney




From indologia at LATINMAIL.COM  Thu Jan  2 01:53:09 2003
From: indologia at LATINMAIL.COM (humanidades India)
Date: Wed, 01 Jan 03 20:53:09 -0500
Subject: NASA Founds!!!
Message-ID: <161227071941.23782.13581630551577018618.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

:  "harinam108" <harinam108 at y...>
Date:  Mon Oct 7, 2002  4:42 am
Subject:  NASA Images Discover Ancient Bridge between India and SriLanka


ADVERTISEMENT



NASA Images Discover Ancient Bridge between India and SriLanka
(Courtesy : NASA Digital Image Collection)

<http://images.jsc.nasa.gov/iams/images/earth/STS059/lowres/20143034.j
pg>

Space images taken by NASA reveal a mysterious ancient bridge in the
Strait between India and Sri Lanka. The recently discovered bridge
currently named as Adam?s Bridge is made of chain of shoals, c.18 mi
(30 km) long.

The bridge?s unique curvature and composition by age reveals that it
is man made. The legends as well as Archeological studies reveal that
the first signs of human inhabitants in Sri Lanka date back to the a
primitive age, about 17,50,000 years ago and the bridge?s age is also
almost equivalent.

This information is a crucial aspect for an insight into the
mysterious legend called Ramayana, which was supposed to have taken
place in treta yuga (more than 17,00,000 years ago).

In this epic, there is a mentioning about a bridge, which was built
between Rameshwaram (India) and Srilankan coast under the supervision
of a dynamic and invincible figure called Rama who is supposed to be
the incarnation of the supreme.

This information may not be of much importance to the archeologists
who are interested in exploring the origins of man, but it is sure to
open the spiritual gates of the people of the world to have come to
know an ancient history linked to the Indian mythology.




_________________________________________________________
http://www.latinmail.com.  Gratuito, latino y en espa?ol.




From jkirk at SPRO.NET  Thu Jan  2 05:51:23 2003
From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk)
Date: Wed, 01 Jan 03 22:51:23 -0700
Subject: NASA Founds!!!
Message-ID: <161227071943.23782.13110781356386714044.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

A similar notice of this alleged bridge relic appeared on the risa-l list in
November, so I looked up the various posted views of the area. One of these
views suggested to me that someeone had tampered with the photo to make it
look more like a bridge "on" the shoal. Take a good look at the second photo
on the following website, to see obvious evidence of image-tampering in the
form of regular sized little strokes that appear to imitate stones:
http://www.indolink.com/Religion/r091702-130924.php

Joanna Kirkpatrick
===============================

----- Original Message -----
From: "humanidades India" <indologia at LATINMAIL.COM>
To: <INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk>
Sent: Wednesday, January 01, 2003 6:53 PM
Subject: NASA Founds!!!


> :  "harinam108" <harinam108 at y...>
> Date:  Mon Oct 7, 2002  4:42 am
> Subject:  NASA Images Discover Ancient Bridge between India and SriLanka
>
>
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
> NASA Images Discover Ancient Bridge between India and SriLanka
> (Courtesy : NASA Digital Image Collection)
>
> <http://images.jsc.nasa.gov/iams/images/earth/STS059/lowres/20143034.j
> pg>
>
> Space images taken by NASA reveal a mysterious ancient bridge in the
> Strait between India and Sri Lanka. The recently discovered bridge
> currently named as Adam?s Bridge is made of chain of shoals, c.18 mi
> (30 km) long.
>
> The bridge?s unique curvature and composition by age reveals that it
> is man made. The legends as well as Archeological studies reveal that
> the first signs of human inhabitants in Sri Lanka date back to the a
> primitive age, about 17,50,000 years ago and the bridge?s age is also
> almost equivalent.
>
> This information is a crucial aspect for an insight into the
> mysterious legend called Ramayana, which was supposed to have taken
> place in treta yuga (more than 17,00,000 years ago).
>
> In this epic, there is a mentioning about a bridge, which was built
> between Rameshwaram (India) and Srilankan coast under the supervision
> of a dynamic and invincible figure called Rama who is supposed to be
> the incarnation of the supreme.
>
> This information may not be of much importance to the archeologists
> who are interested in exploring the origins of man, but it is sure to
> open the spiritual gates of the people of the world to have come to
> know an ancient history linked to the Indian mythology.
>
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________
> http://www.latinmail.com.  Gratuito, latino y en espa?ol.
>




From veerankp at IFPINDIA.ORG  Thu Jan  2 06:09:14 2003
From: veerankp at IFPINDIA.ORG (Veeranarayana Pandurangi)
Date: Thu, 02 Jan 03 11:39:14 +0530
Subject: muraari"sataka
Message-ID: <161227071945.23782.12609537132539951709.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Friends,
I want to know whether there is any work called muraari"sataka ascribed to "sanakaracaarya the great advaitin.
Jayateertha in his nyayasudhaa and tattvodyota.tiikaa, quotes one verse from this work. 
that verse is 
an.rtaja.davirodhiruupam antatrayamalabandhanadu.hkhataaviruddham/
atinika.tamavikriya.m muraare.h paramapada.m pra.nayaadabhi.s.tviimi//

I also want to know who is right person to disuss with my problem of some untraced buddhist verses quoted by Madhavaacaarya.

veeranarayana
FIP Pondicherry




From karp at MERCURY.CI.UW.EDU.PL  Thu Jan  2 10:45:42 2003
From: karp at MERCURY.CI.UW.EDU.PL (Artur Karp)
Date: Thu, 02 Jan 03 11:45:42 +0100
Subject: NASA Founds!!!
In-Reply-To: <20030102015301.B0AA31804C@smtp.latinmail.com>
Message-ID: <161227071947.23782.2488284256657720421.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

At 02:53 2003-01-02, you wrote:

>:  "harinam108" <harinam108 at y...>
>Date:  Mon Oct 7, 2002  4:42 am
>Subject:  NASA Images Discover Ancient Bridge between India and SriLanka
>
>
>ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
>NASA Images Discover Ancient Bridge between India and SriLanka
>(Courtesy : NASA Digital Image Collection)
>
><http://images.jsc.nasa.gov/iams/images/earth/STS059/lowres/20143034.j
>pg>
>
>
>This information is a crucial aspect for an insight into the
>mysterious legend called Ramayana, which was supposed to have taken
>place in treta yuga (more than 17,00,000 years ago).


Be it whatever, an Adverisement or a real NASA photo ---  what worries me
here is an apparent lack of precision in reckoning the time of the yugas.
Why -  if I may ask - should we be satisfied with the statement that "treta
yuga  was supposed to have taken place more than 17,00,000 years ago"?

Now, since we live in, roughly, the beginning of 6th M of the kali yuga,
the treta should have started (let me calculate: 5 M for the kali + 864 M
for the dvapara = 869 M) , yes - cca 869 000 years ago. Or do I miss
anything important?

Oh, yeah, they say that it WAS supposed -- do they mean it IS NOT suposed NOW?

Regards,

and all the best for the New Year 2003

Artur Karp

Poland

PS. On second thoughts - couldn't it be that the bridge was built by those
mysterious fellows from Bashkiria?



---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.434 / Virus Database: 243 - Release Date: 2002-12-25




From karp at MERCURY.CI.UW.EDU.PL  Thu Jan  2 11:30:58 2003
From: karp at MERCURY.CI.UW.EDU.PL (Artur Karp)
Date: Thu, 02 Jan 03 12:30:58 +0100
Subject: NASA Founds!!! erratum
In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030102110319.032cbbe8@mercury.ci.uw.edu.pl>
Message-ID: <161227071949.23782.14884825153742900557.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

At 11:45 2003-01-02, you wrote:
>At 02:53 2003-01-02, you wrote:
>
>>:  "harinam108" <harinam108 at y...>
>>Date:  Mon Oct 7, 2002  4:42 am
>>Subject:  NASA Images Discover Ancient Bridge between India and SriLanka
>>
>>
>>ADVERTISEMENT
>>
>>
>>
>>NASA Images Discover Ancient Bridge between India and SriLanka
>>(Courtesy : NASA Digital Image Collection)
>>
>><http://images.jsc.nasa.gov/iams/images/earth/STS059/lowres/20143034.j>pg>
>>
>>
>>This information is a crucial aspect for an insight into the
>>mysterious legend called Ramayana, which was supposed to have taken
>>place in treta yuga (more than 17,00,000 years ago).
>
>
>Be it whatever, an Adverisement or a real NASA photo ---  what worries me
>here is an apparent lack of precision in reckoning the time of the yugas.
>Why -  if I may ask - should we be satisfied with the statement that "treta
>yuga  was supposed to have taken place more than 17,00,000 years ago"?
>
>Now, since we live in, roughly, the beginning of 6th M of the kali yuga,
>the treta should have started (let me calculate: 5 M for the kali + 864 M
>for the dvapara = 869 M) , yes - cca 869 000 years ago. Or do I miss
>anything important?

Erratum:

In place of "should have started" read please "should have ended".




>Oh, yeah, they say that it WAS supposed -- do they mean it IS NOT suposed NOW?
>
>Regards,
>
>and all the best for the New Year 2003
>
>Artur Karp
>
>Poland
>
>PS. On second thoughts - couldn't it be that the bridge was built by those
>mysterious fellows from Bashkiria?
>
>
>
>
>---
>Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
>Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
>Version: 6.0.434 / Virus Database: 243 - Release Date: 2002-12-25


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.434 / Virus Database: 243 - Release Date: 2002-12-25




From reimann at UCLINK4.BERKELEY.EDU  Thu Jan  2 23:54:52 2003
From: reimann at UCLINK4.BERKELEY.EDU (Luis Gonzalez-Reimann)
Date: Thu, 02 Jan 03 15:54:52 -0800
Subject: NASA Founds!!! erratum
In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030102123045.032cbbe8@mercury.ci.uw.edu.pl>
Message-ID: <161227071952.23782.8811687755292012550.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Arthur,

Time since Kali Yuga started           5, 104   years
Duration of DvApara                  + 864, 000
                                                      _______
Time since end of TretA               869, 104 years
                                                  +
Duration of TretA                       1 296, 000
                                                   ________
Time since beginning of TretA   2 165, 104  years
                                                   ________
                                                   ________

So, if 1 700, 000 ago falls between the two dates for the TretA, there is
nothing wrong.
"Taken place" doesn't mean either started or finished.

Luis
____________________

At 12:30 PM 01/02/2003 +0100, you wrote:

>>Be it whatever, an Adverisement or a real NASA photo ---  what worries me
>>here is an apparent lack of precision in reckoning the time of the yugas.
>>Why -  if I may ask - should we be satisfied with the statement that "treta
>>yuga  was supposed to have taken place more than 17,00,000 years ago"?
>>
>>Now, since we live in, roughly, the beginning of 6th M of the kali yuga,
>>the treta should have started (let me calculate: 5 M for the kali + 864 M
>>for the dvapara = 869 M) , yes - cca 869 000 years ago. Or do I miss
>>anything important?
>
>Erratum:
>
>In place of "should have started" read please "should have ended".




From zydenbos at LRZ.UNI-MUENCHEN.DE  Fri Jan  3 12:17:39 2003
From: zydenbos at LRZ.UNI-MUENCHEN.DE (zydenbos)
Date: Fri, 03 Jan 03 13:17:39 +0100
Subject: Vidyaara.nya
Message-ID: <161227071958.23782.16337245959708896364.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

zydenbos <zydenbos at lrz.uni-muenchen.de> schrieb:
------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------

Kommentar:
----------
Has anyone on the list come across good studies about the 14th-cent. religious 
and political thinker Vidyaara.nya (Karnataka / Vijayanagara)? I am 
interested in studies about his writings as well as about his time and his 
historical significance.

Prof. Robert J. Zydenbos
Institut f?r Indologie und Iranistik
Univer


------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------

Diese Nachricht wurde ueber den WWW-Server des LRZ verschickt.
http://www.lrz-muenchen.de
Rechnername des Absenders: pd9ebc68d.dip0.t-ipconnect.de
IP Adresse des Absenders: 217.235.198.141




From veerankp at IFPINDIA.ORG  Fri Jan  3 08:47:31 2003
From: veerankp at IFPINDIA.ORG (Veeranarayana Pandurangi)
Date: Fri, 03 Jan 03 14:17:31 +0530
Subject: NASA Founds!!! erratum
Message-ID: <161227071954.23782.5649794958435729149.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

----- Original Message -----
From: "Luis Gonzalez-Reimann" <reimann at UCLINK4.BERKELEY.EDU>
To: <INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk>
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 5:24 AM
Subject: Re: NASA Founds!!! erratum


> Arthur,
>
> Time since Kali Yuga started           5, 104   years
> Duration of DvApara                  + 864, 000
>                                                       _______
> Time since end of TretA               869, 104 years
>                                                   +
> Duration of TretA                       1 296, 000
>                                                    ________
> Time since beginning of TretA   2 165, 104  years
>                                                    ________
>                                                    ________
>
> So, if 1 700, 000 ago falls between the two dates for the TretA, there is
> nothing wrong.
> "Taken place" doesn't mean either started or finished.
>
> Luis
> ____________________
>
> At 12:30 PM 01/02/2003 +0100, you wrote:
>
> >>Be it whatever, an Adverisement or a real NASA photo ---  what worries
me
> >>here is an apparent lack of precision in reckoning the time of the
yugas.
> >>Why -  if I may ask - should we be satisfied with the statement that
"treta
> >>yuga  was supposed to have taken place more than 17,00,000 years ago"?
> >>
> >>Now, since we live in, roughly, the beginning of 6th M of the kali yuga,
> >>the treta should have started (let me calculate: 5 M for the kali + 864
M
> >>for the dvapara = 869 M) , yes - cca 869 000 years ago. Or do I miss
> >>anything important?
> >
> >Erratum:
> >
> >In place of "should have started" read please "should have ended".
>




From veerankp at IFPINDIA.ORG  Fri Jan  3 08:54:14 2003
From: veerankp at IFPINDIA.ORG (Veeranarayana Pandurangi)
Date: Fri, 03 Jan 03 14:24:14 +0530
Subject: nasa's foto
Message-ID: <161227071956.23782.13310822485345336283.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear friends
Sorry for my previous mail which was mistake.

But I want to say that the bridge in gulf is believed to be built in the
twentyfourth tretayga and not the present twentyeighth mahayuga's tretayuga
of present manvantara.
With regards
veeranarayana




From athr at LOC.GOV  Fri Jan  3 21:00:12 2003
From: athr at LOC.GOV (Allen W Thrasher)
Date: Fri, 03 Jan 03 16:00:12 -0500
Subject: Cataloging post in Hindi or Sanskrit (etc.) at Library of Congress
Message-ID: <161227071959.23782.13159460345977880546.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

The post mentioned in the message of last week, repeated below, will be
held open for applications for an extended period, until 31 January
2003.


<<There is a cataloger's post open in the Library of Congress, in
Washington, DC, described at:

http://jsearch.usajobs.opm.gov/ftva.asp?OPMControl=TU5643


Applicants must know at least one of the following languages: Thai,
Vietnamese, Indonesian, Hindi, or Sanskrit.

Please address any questions about the positions to the places
indicated in the posting, not to me.

Allen Thrasher>>



Allen W. Thrasher, Ph.D.
Senior Reference Librarian
Southern Asia Section
Asian Division
Library of Congress
Jefferson Building 150
101 Independence Ave., S.E.
Washington, DC 20540-4810
tel. 202-707-3732
fax 202-707-1724
athr at loc.gov
The opinions expressed do not necessarily reflect those of the Library
of Congress.




From tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU  Fri Jan  3 23:43:22 2003
From: tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU (Bob Thurman)
Date: Fri, 03 Jan 03 18:43:22 -0500
Subject: Buddhism as Iranian heresy?
Message-ID: <161227071618.23782.15884825366400368607.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

An Iranian heresy? I think that is "off the wall," as they say. Not that
it was not an Indic heresy, as it long remained, making fro cdreative
ferment and debate in the subcontinent!
RAFThurman




From tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU  Fri Jan  3 23:53:12 2003
From: tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU (Bob Thurman)
Date: Fri, 03 Jan 03 18:53:12 -0500
Subject: bhagavat
Message-ID: <161227071632.23782.18277535986466816423.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Jan,
The Chinese Shih-tsun I always assumed came from the Skt. Lokajyeshtha,
not one of the main epithets, but one that does occur.
Best
Bob




From tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU  Sat Jan  4 13:40:08 2003
From: tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU (Bob Thurman)
Date: Sat, 04 Jan 03 08:40:08 -0500
Subject: Buddhism as Iranian heresy?
Message-ID: <161227071634.23782.6749296732730761199.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Dean,
Yes to your question in the last para. There have been previous
Eurocentric speculations about
influence on sculptures of Buddha from Gandhara, Zoroastrian influence
on the Amitabha cult of Mahayana, and so on, all with some basis, all
controversial. Earlier Iranian-Indic Vedic period interactions,
migrations, etc., as alluded to by Prof. Witzel, are surely probable,
but the idea that "Buddhism," i.e. the social/religious/intellectual
movement founded by Shakyamuni, would have inspiration from Iranian
sources is what is out of left field. After all, Buddhism's problem in
India was always that it was against the divinity of the Vedas, seeing
them rather as human artifacts, and therefore being a "heresy" against
the culture(s) that elevated them as apaurus.eya.
RAFT




From indologia at LATINMAIL.COM  Wed Jan  8 14:11:35 2003
From: indologia at LATINMAIL.COM (humanidades India)
Date: Wed, 08 Jan 03 09:11:35 -0500
Subject: NASA seeks India's help???
Message-ID: <161227071963.23782.7347187948333281774.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

------- Mensaje original ------
to:
cc:
date: 1/8/2003 5:31:42 AM
subject: fwd:[world-vedic] NASA seeks India's help



I had recieved a letter from Luis Gonzales of Berkley but I had lost his email.
Cuold the Dr. Gonzales send other time it.??

 Please, may be the follow post has litle  importance by hte moderns stuidies of India.




<tt>

NASA seeks Indian help in Earth sciences study<BR>

NASA seeks Indian help in Earth sciences study <BR>

IANS <BR>

<BR>

Monday, January 06, 2003 <BR>

<BR>

The U.S. National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA) is <BR>

seeking India's help to study and decipher the massive amounts of <BR>

data on earth sciences from a confluence of satellites. <BR>



BANGALORE: Numerous U.S. satellites studying changes in the Earth, R>

oceans and atmosphere have been pumping in huge quantities of data.<



&quot;The most difficult thing we find is understanding the meaning of the

data for meteorological prediction. This is one major area in which

India's experts can help NASA,&quot; says Jim Dodge, programme director of <BR>

earth sciences at the U.S. space agency.<BR>

<BR>

Delivering a &quot;vision&quot; talk at the space summit organised as a part of <BR>

the 90th Indian Science Congress here, Dodge pointedly mentioned the <BR>

expertise of Indians in meteorology, mathematics, physics and other <BR>

disciplines for the study of data from satellites.<BR>

<BR>

&quot;We are right now swimming with new data that could predict the <BR>

future. Our focus, like the Indian space programme, is also on <BR>

meeting the societal needs in the next two decades,&quot; Dodge added.<BR>

<BR>

&quot;The drivers are no more technology, but scientific. How the global <BR>

Earth system is changing and how the Earth responds to natural and <BR>

human-induced changes are some questions.&quot;<BR>

<BR>

The urgency in doing the &quot;massive job of distilling data&quot; emanates <BR>

from the fact that there is a demand for providing the information on <BR>

a personal computer. <BR>

<BR>

&quot;The challenge for the future is really analysis of data,&quot; Dodge said.<BR>

<BR>

But it is not only the U.S. that is seeking India's cooperation in <BR>

space technology and applications. China, Thailand, Malaysia and the <BR>

European Space Agency are all looking for strengthening their ties <BR>

with India.<BR>

<BR>

&quot;We have a memorandum of understanding with India. But we are still <BR>

in the exploratory stage. We don't know where it will be headed <BR>

finally,&quot; an official of the Chinese space agency told IANS.<BR>

<BR>

&quot;We have the capacity to launch big satellites, but India has <BR>

expertise in remote sensing and Earth sciences.&quot;<BR>

<BR>

Suvit Vibulshresth of Thailand's Geo-Informatics and Space Technology <BR>

Development Agency (GISTDA) told the space summit: &quot;Thailand is <BR>

already receiving images from the Indian remote sensing satellite. <BR>

And we are awaiting the launch of Cartosat to receive higher density <BR>

images. We also hope India can help us build a small satellite. <BR>

<BR>

Added Antonio Rodata, director of the European Space Agency: &quot;We have <BR>

been cooperating with India for 25 years. We are now having talks for <BR>

cooperation in disaster management.&quot;<BR>

<BR>

(This is the real Information Technology as opposed to GL and <BR>

Payroll - KMG)<BR>

 <BR>

<BR>

<BR>

<BR>

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From LubinT at WLU.EDU  Wed Jan  8 17:57:48 2003
From: LubinT at WLU.EDU (Timothy Lubin)
Date: Wed, 08 Jan 03 12:57:48 -0500
Subject: Vidyaara.nya
Message-ID: <161227071965.23782.9368273207045458926.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

A major new study is Robert Goodding's dissertation submitted to U.
Texas, Austin:

"The Treatise on Liberation in Life: Critical Edition and Annotated
Translation of the Jiivanmuktiviveka of Vidyaara.nya" (2002, 522 pp.,
including a valuable introduction).

Goodding has generously made the entire text available on-line for
download as an Acrobat PDF file at:
http://www.robgoodd.net/

Be aware that the file is 1743 KB, so unless you have a high-speed
connection, it will take a while to load.

Goodding is interested mostly in Vidyaara.nya's role in "internal
debates within medieval Vedaanta philosophy" as the context for the
work, though he assesses various arguments about V.'s identity and
career.

Timothy Lubin
Assistant Professor (Religions of South Asia)
23 Newcomb Hall
Washington and Lee University
Lexington, VA 24450  USA

office: 540.458.8146; fax: 540.458.8498
lubint at wlu.edu   |   http://home.wlu.edu/~lubint


>>> zydenbos at LRZ.UNI-MUENCHEN.DE 01/03/03 07:17AM >>>
zydenbos <zydenbos at lrz.uni-muenchen.de> schrieb:
------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------------------------------------

Kommentar:
----------
Has anyone on the list come across good studies about the 14th-cent.
religious and political thinker Vidyaara.nya (Karnataka / Vijayanagara)?
I am
interested in studies about his writings as well as about his time and
his
historical significance.




From JFStaal at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU  Wed Jan  8 21:40:41 2003
From: JFStaal at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU (Frits Staal)
Date: Wed, 08 Jan 03 13:40:41 -0800
Subject: facsimile editions
In-Reply-To: <E18WGnf-0004YS-00@mailhub2.liv.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <161227071967.23782.15538937778635819095.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Hi Leslie and Indology members,

I have (and have had for some time) something quite different and wonder
whether you or anyone on the list has any suggestions: a set of excellent
bl/wh photographs of Tantric mudras used in Kerala with explanations. About
20 I believe. Where to publish it Indological publications being so
verbally oriented?

Happy New year,

At 02:00 PM 1/8/03 +0000, you wrote:
>Dear colleagues,
>
>I have been asked to suggest items for publication in the form of
>facsimile editions, and wonder if members of the list might be in a
>position to help.
>
>There are no specific criteria except that the resulting book(s) will
>have a good market in international academic and other particular
>specialist libraries worldwide, and any additional readership that the
>particular volume(s) might have.
>
>There is particular interest in printing editions of original Sanskrit
>manuscripts or out-of-print classic Sanskrit texts, in order to issue
>these for wider readership worldwide.
>
>The format would probably be: a facsimile of the original text
>(manuscript or printed text), together with a translation on the facing
>page or as the second part of the volume.
>
>Suggestions should go directly to Sarah Lloyd, Commissioning
>Editor, Ashgate Publishing Ltd (SLloyd at Ashgatepub.co.uk).
>
>Thank you,
>Julia Leslie
>
>SOAS
>London

Frits Staal
http://philosophy.berkeley.edu/staal/




From jl6 at SOAS.AC.UK  Wed Jan  8 14:00:33 2003
From: jl6 at SOAS.AC.UK (Julia Leslie)
Date: Wed, 08 Jan 03 14:00:33 +0000
Subject: facsimile editions
Message-ID: <161227071961.23782.4051487333319476685.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear colleagues,

I have been asked to suggest items for publication in the form of
facsimile editions, and wonder if members of the list might be in a
position to help.

There are no specific criteria except that the resulting book(s) will
have a good market in international academic and other particular
specialist libraries worldwide, and any additional readership that the
particular volume(s) might have.

There is particular interest in printing editions of original Sanskrit
manuscripts or out-of-print classic Sanskrit texts, in order to issue
these for wider readership worldwide.

The format would probably be: a facsimile of the original text
(manuscript or printed text), together with a translation on the facing
page or as the second part of the volume.

Suggestions should go directly to Sarah Lloyd, Commissioning
Editor, Ashgate Publishing Ltd (SLloyd at Ashgatepub.co.uk).

Thank you,
Julia Leslie

SOAS
London




From silk at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU  Thu Jan  9 05:55:38 2003
From: silk at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU (Silk, Jonathan)
Date: Wed, 08 Jan 03 21:55:38 -0800
Subject: an injustice
Message-ID: <161227071969.23782.11062655572371199417.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Colleagues,

In the same spirit in which many of us spoke out against the injustice
visited on our colleague Yigal Bronner, I would like to draw your attention
to an equally unacceptable action taken recently in Paris. Please take a
moment, if you wish, to visit

http://217.174.203.80/contreleboycott/

or

http://contreleboycott.free.fr/

(I used the latter URL, but it appears to automatically turn into the
former).

Thank you for considering academic freedom and interchange to be a universal
good, not to be sacrificed to the political winds of the moment.

Jonathan Silk
silk at humnet.ucla.edu

PS:  If you would like to pass on the above information to others, I am sure
it would help.




From vielle at ORI.UCL.AC.BE  Thu Jan  9 08:00:53 2003
From: vielle at ORI.UCL.AC.BE (Christophe Vielle)
Date: Thu, 09 Jan 03 09:00:53 +0100
Subject: facsimile editions
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030108133730.00a431c0@socrates.berkeley.edu>
Message-ID: <161227071971.23782.12995069936433800539.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

The Journal of the SukRtIndra Oriental Research Institute, recently
established in Cochin, is very well printed and makes good reproductions of
photographs. They have also a series (and a collection of manuscripts...).
http://www.kashimath.org/oriental.htm


>Hi Leslie and Indology members,
>
>I have (and have had for some time) something quite different and wonder
>whether you or anyone on the list has any suggestions: a set of excellent
>bl/wh photographs of Tantric mudras used in Kerala with explanations. About
>20 I believe. Where to publish it Indological publications being so
>verbally oriented?
>
>Happy New year,
>

Dr. Christophe Vielle
Centre d'Etudes de l'Inde et de l'Asie du Sud
Institut orientaliste
Place Blaise Pascal 1
B - 1348 Louvain-la-Neuve
BELGIUM
Tel. +32-(0)10-47 49 54 (office)/ -(0)2-640 62 66 (home)
E-mail: vielle at ori.ucl.ac.be




From vielle at ORI.UCL.AC.BE  Thu Jan  9 08:32:35 2003
From: vielle at ORI.UCL.AC.BE (Christophe Vielle)
Date: Thu, 09 Jan 03 09:32:35 +0100
Subject: facsimile editions
In-Reply-To: <E18WGnf-0004YS-00@mailhub2.liv.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <161227071973.23782.9749663677733655102.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I would suggest:
W. Kirfel's Pur-a.na Pa?ncalak.sa.na;
and all the old editions in the Bibliotheca Indica series, the Trivandrum
Sanskrit series (only some of them have been reprinted by Nag or
Munshiram), the K-avya m-al-a series or without-series of the Nir.naya
S-agara Press in Bombay (also only a few reprinted in India) and the Bombay
Sanskrit series. The full availability of such important series is a
desideratum for individual Indologists as well as for "young" university
libraries (even the old university libraries could be interested to buy new
exemplars of them).


>Dear colleagues,
>
>I have been asked to suggest items for publication in the form of
>facsimile editions, and wonder if members of the list might be in a
>position to help.
>
>There are no specific criteria except that the resulting book(s) will
>have a good market in international academic and other particular
>specialist libraries worldwide, and any additional readership that the
>particular volume(s) might have.
>
>There is particular interest in printing editions of original Sanskrit
>manuscripts or out-of-print classic Sanskrit texts, in order to issue
>these for wider readership worldwide.
>
>The format would probably be: a facsimile of the original text
>(manuscript or printed text), together with a translation on the facing
>page or as the second part of the volume.
>
>Suggestions should go directly to Sarah Lloyd, Commissioning
>Editor, Ashgate Publishing Ltd (SLloyd at Ashgatepub.co.uk).
>
>Thank you,
>Julia Leslie
>
>SOAS
>London


Dr. Christophe Vielle
Centre d'Etudes de l'Inde et de l'Asie du Sud
Institut orientaliste
Place Blaise Pascal 1
B - 1348 Louvain-la-Neuve
BELGIUM
Tel. +32-(0)10-47 49 54 (office)/ -(0)2-640 62 66 (home)
E-mail: vielle at ori.ucl.ac.be




From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK  Thu Jan  9 09:45:52 2003
From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk)
Date: Thu, 09 Jan 03 09:45:52 +0000
Subject: facsimile editions
In-Reply-To: <l03130302ba42de83abc2@[130.104.243.146]>
Message-ID: <161227071975.23782.8602383249868677905.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

These series have all been microfilmed and are, in principle, available
to buy on film.  See
  http://www.columbia.edu/cu/lweb/indiv/southasia/cuvl/indolseries.html

I would be very interested to know the current status of this great
project, and the materials that were gathered.  Anyone know? Am I right in
thinking that through The Digital South Asia Library project
(http://dsal.uchicago.edu/), these materials will be made available under
the title "The Indological Series Database", as an NEH-funded project
located at the U. of Chicago? (Apparently providing efficient searching of
published editions of texts in a database of some 25,000 records.)

Best,
Dominik

On Thu, 9 Jan 2003, Christophe Vielle wrote:

> I would suggest:
> W. Kirfel's Pur-a.na Pa?ncalak.sa.na;
> and all the old editions in the Bibliotheca Indica series, the Trivandrum
> Sanskrit series (only some of them have been reprinted by Nag or
> Munshiram), the K-avya m-al-a series or without-series of the Nir.naya
> S-agara Press in Bombay (also only a few reprinted in India) and the Bombay
> Sanskrit series. The full availability of such important series is a
> desideratum for individual Indologists as well as for "young" university
> libraries (even the old university libraries could be interested to buy new
> exemplars of them).
>
>
> >Dear colleagues,
> >
> >I have been asked to suggest items for publication in the form of
> >facsimile editions, and wonder if members of the list might be in a
> >position to help.
> >
> >There are no specific criteria except that the resulting book(s) will
> >have a good market in international academic and other particular
> >specialist libraries worldwide, and any additional readership that the
> >particular volume(s) might have.
> >
> >There is particular interest in printing editions of original Sanskrit
> >manuscripts or out-of-print classic Sanskrit texts, in order to issue
> >these for wider readership worldwide.
> >
> >The format would probably be: a facsimile of the original text
> >(manuscript or printed text), together with a translation on the facing
> >page or as the second part of the volume.
> >
> >Suggestions should go directly to Sarah Lloyd, Commissioning
> >Editor, Ashgate Publishing Ltd (SLloyd at Ashgatepub.co.uk).
> >
> >Thank you,
> >Julia Leslie
> >
> >SOAS
> >London
>
>
> Dr. Christophe Vielle
> Centre d'Etudes de l'Inde et de l'Asie du Sud
> Institut orientaliste
> Place Blaise Pascal 1
> B - 1348 Louvain-la-Neuve
> BELGIUM
> Tel. +32-(0)10-47 49 54 (office)/ -(0)2-640 62 66 (home)
> E-mail: vielle at ori.ucl.ac.be
>




From jpo at UTS.CC.UTEXAS.EDU  Thu Jan  9 16:55:42 2003
From: jpo at UTS.CC.UTEXAS.EDU (Patrick Olivelle)
Date: Thu, 09 Jan 03 10:55:42 -0600
Subject: New publication "Images du corps dans le monde hindou"
In-Reply-To: <Pine.WNT.4.50.0301091550510.1992-100000@Anat-lws119.anat.ucl.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <161227071986.23782.1437785113028669830.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dominik:

Is there a website or an e-mail address of the publishers from which
one can purchase this?

Patrick



>A new publication (excuse the BibTeX database format):
>
>   editors =       "V?ronique Bouillier and Gilles Tarabout",
>   title =         "Images du corps dans le monde hindou",
>   year =          "2002",
>   publisher =     "CNRS ?ditions",
>   address =       "Paris",
>   series =        "Collection Monde Indien, Sciences sociales, 15-20 si?cle",
>   isbn =          "2-271-06060-5",
>   note =      "511 pages; includes numerous illustrations, and
>colour plates"
>
>
>Contains chapters by
>
>  Michel Angot,
>  France Bhattacharya,
>  V?ronique Bouillier,
>  G?rard Colas,
>  Richard A. Darmon,
>  Gilles Gr?vin,
>  Emmanuel Grimaud,
>  Sarasvati Joshi,
>  Caroline Osella,
>  Filippo Osella,
>  Andr? Padoux,
>  Josiiane Racine,
>  Marie-Carolline Saglio-Yatzimirsky,
>  Livia Sorrentino-Holden,
>  Gilles Tarabout,
>  David G. White,
>  Dominik Wujastyk,
>  Francis Zimmermann.
>
>How can you *not* have a copy?!
>
>Best,
>Dominik




From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK  Thu Jan  9 12:24:47 2003
From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk)
Date: Thu, 09 Jan 03 12:24:47 +0000
Subject: 16.405 Versioning Machine beta release (fwd)
Message-ID: <161227071977.23782.1447136436056553177.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

This announcement may be of interest to those of us interested in critical
editions.

DW

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 9 Jan 2003 10:05:48 +0000
From: "Humanist Discussion Group (by way of Willard McCarty
    <willard.mccarty at kcl.ac.uk>)" <willard at lists.village.virginia.edu>
To: humanist at Princeton.EDU
Subject: 16.405 Versioning Machine beta release

               Humanist Discussion Group, Vol. 16, No. 405.
       Centre for Computing in the Humanities, King's College London
                   www.kcl.ac.uk/humanities/cch/humanist/
                     Submit to: humanist at princeton.edu



         Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 09:39:28 +0000
         From: "Susan Schreibman" <ss423 at umail.umd.edu>
         Subject: Beta Release of the Versioning Machine

Maryland Institute for Technology in the Humanities (MITH) is pleased to
announce the beta release of The Versioning Machine (VM) 1.0.

The Versioning Machine is a software tool designed to display and compare
multiple versions of texts. The display environment seeks not only to
provide for features traditionally found in codex-based critical editions
(such as annotation and introductory material), but to take advantage of
opportunities of electronic publishing by providing a frame to compare
diplomatic versions of witnesses side by side, allowing for images of the
witness to be viewed alongside the diplomatic edition, and providing users
with an enhanced typology of notes. The VM is TEI conformant and utilizes
parallel segmentation encoding.

The Versioning Machine is now ready, and we welcome beta testers. To aid
with the encoding process, we provide several sample encoded texts as well
as documentation in the Download Zip.

To register and download the beta version please go to
http://www.mith2.umd.edu/products/ver-mach/
and follow the link to "Download".

Please send any comments and suggestions to ver-mach-users at dev.umd.edu
Susan Schreibman, Amit Kumar, eriC White, Jarom McDonald, Lara Vetter




From magier at COLUMBIA.EDU  Thu Jan  9 19:34:29 2003
From: magier at COLUMBIA.EDU (David Magier)
Date: Thu, 09 Jan 03 14:34:29 -0500
Subject: New publication "Images du corps dans le monde hindou"
In-Reply-To: <p05100312ba4359eb392d@[66.141.54.251]>
Message-ID: <161227071990.23782.12279810165704222374.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Their website is at:

http://www.cnrseditions.fr/

David Magier

At 10:55 AM -0600 1/9/03, Patrick Olivelle wrote:
>Dominik:
>
>Is there a website or an e-mail address of the publishers from which
>one can purchase this?
>
>Patrick
>
>
>>A new publication (excuse the BibTeX database format):
>>
>>   editors =       "V?ronique Bouillier and Gilles Tarabout",
>>   title =         "Images du corps dans le monde hindou",
>>   year =          "2002",
>>   publisher =     "CNRS ?ditions",
>>   address =       "Paris",
>>   series =        "Collection Monde Indien, Sciences sociales, 15-20 si?cle",
>>   isbn =          "2-271-06060-5",
>>   note =      "511 pages; includes numerous illustrations, and
>>colour plates"
>>
>>
>>Contains chapters by
>>
>>  Michel Angot,
>>  France Bhattacharya,
>>  V?ronique Bouillier,
>>  G?rard Colas,
>>  Richard A. Darmon,
>>  Gilles Gr?vin,
>>  Emmanuel Grimaud,
>>  Sarasvati Joshi,
>>  Caroline Osella,
>>  Filippo Osella,
>>  Andr? Padoux,
>>  Josiiane Racine,
>>  Marie-Carolline Saglio-Yatzimirsky,
>>  Livia Sorrentino-Holden,
>>  Gilles Tarabout,
>>  David G. White,
>>  Dominik Wujastyk,
>>  Francis Zimmermann.
>>
>>How can you *not* have a copy?!
>>
>>Best,
>>Dominik




From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK  Thu Jan  9 15:44:01 2003
From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk)
Date: Thu, 09 Jan 03 15:44:01 +0000
Subject: facsimile editions (fwd)
Message-ID: <161227071981.23782.9785606002289903209.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 09 Jan 2003 07:47:02 -0600
From: James Nye <jnye at midway.uchicago.edu>


Dear Dominik,

The information on the series at the .../southasia/cuvl/indolseries.html
URL is still correct except that the prices for the microfilm copies has
increased over the past decade.  Inquiries about purchase of the microfilm,
including current prices, may still be addressed to the relevant institutions.

All microfilmed titles in the major series and almost all of those for the
less well known series have been fully cataloged.  Complete sets of the
bibliographic information for the microfilm copies are available on the
OCLC and on the RLIN databases.  The vast majority of those cataloging
records have been available since the early 1990s.  The last of the
cataloging has continued at a slow rate, but should be completed this year.

Funds have not been available for a printing subvention, so the full
Indological Books in Series has not appeared as an ink print.  Funds for
the Digital South Asia Library (DSAL) project from the U.S. Department of
Education are to support development of resources for modern languages and
other recent resources of information the study of South Asia.  The study
of classical languages is generally not support by that funding agency.  We
have been careful to find complementary sources of funding when resources
relating to classical topics are made available under DSAL.  It still is my
intention that the Indological series database should be presented as a Web
resource.  It would be imprudent, though, to predict when that might happen
since the lack of support and the pressure of other obligations make it
difficult to speak with assurance.

Best wishes,
James Nye
Bibliographer for Southern Asia
University of Chicago




From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK  Thu Jan  9 15:56:49 2003
From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk)
Date: Thu, 09 Jan 03 15:56:49 +0000
Subject: New publication "Images du corps dans le monde hindou"
Message-ID: <161227071983.23782.14572339176495067077.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

A new publication (excuse the BibTeX database format):

  editors =       "V?ronique Bouillier and Gilles Tarabout",
  title =         "Images du corps dans le monde hindou",
  year =          "2002",
  publisher =     "CNRS ?ditions",
  address =       "Paris",
  series =        "Collection Monde Indien, Sciences sociales, 15-20 si?cle",
  isbn =          "2-271-06060-5",
  note = 	  "511 pages; includes numerous illustrations, and colour plates"


Contains chapters by

 Michel Angot,
 France Bhattacharya,
 V?ronique Bouillier,
 G?rard Colas,
 Richard A. Darmon,
 Gilles Gr?vin,
 Emmanuel Grimaud,
 Sarasvati Joshi,
 Caroline Osella,
 Filippo Osella,
 Andr? Padoux,
 Josiiane Racine,
 Marie-Carolline Saglio-Yatzimirsky,
 Livia Sorrentino-Holden,
 Gilles Tarabout,
 David G. White,
 Dominik Wujastyk,
 Francis Zimmermann.

How can you *not* have a copy?!

Best,
Dominik




From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK  Thu Jan  9 17:09:15 2003
From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk)
Date: Thu, 09 Jan 03 17:09:15 +0000
Subject: New publication "Images du corps dans le monde hindou"
In-Reply-To: <p05100312ba4359eb392d@[66.141.54.251]>
Message-ID: <161227071988.23782.8962763393028491134.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I didn't think there was, but in tiny print on the back cover it does say:

	http://www.cnrseditions.fr

Best,
Dominik

On Thu, 9 Jan 2003, Patrick Olivelle wrote:

> Dominik:
>
> Is there a website or an e-mail address of the publishers from which
> one can purchase this?
>
> Patrick
>
>
>
> >A new publication (excuse the BibTeX database format):
> >
> >   editors =       "V?ronique Bouillier and Gilles Tarabout",
> >   title =         "Images du corps dans le monde hindou",
> >   year =          "2002",
> >   publisher =     "CNRS ?ditions",
> >   address =       "Paris",
> >   series =        "Collection Monde Indien, Sciences sociales, 15-20 si?cle",
> >   isbn =          "2-271-06060-5",
> >   note =      "511 pages; includes numerous illustrations, and
> >colour plates"
> >
> >
> >Contains chapters by
> >
> >  Michel Angot,
> >  France Bhattacharya,
> >  V?ronique Bouillier,
> >  G?rard Colas,
> >  Richard A. Darmon,
> >  Gilles Gr?vin,
> >  Emmanuel Grimaud,
> >  Sarasvati Joshi,
> >  Caroline Osella,
> >  Filippo Osella,
> >  Andr? Padoux,
> >  Josiiane Racine,
> >  Marie-Carolline Saglio-Yatzimirsky,
> >  Livia Sorrentino-Holden,
> >  Gilles Tarabout,
> >  David G. White,
> >  Dominik Wujastyk,
> >  Francis Zimmermann.
> >
> >How can you *not* have a copy?!
> >
> >Best,
> >Dominik
>




From Asko.Parpola at HELSINKI.FI  Thu Jan  9 15:32:00 2003
From: Asko.Parpola at HELSINKI.FI (Asko Parpola)
Date: Thu, 09 Jan 03 17:32:00 +0200
Subject: Tamil Brahmi inscriptions from Perur
Message-ID: <161227071979.23782.11412733079015165043.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Last year I brought to the notice of the INDOLOGY list the home pages of
the Tamil Heritage Foundation, which carry digital photographs of many
previously unknown terracotta tablets, pottery etc with Tamil Brahmi
inscriptions. I noted that these finds are remarkable, if proved to be
genuine, pointing out to the Tamil Heritage Foundation that their first
priority should be to establish beyound doubt that these objects are not
fakes. I also wondered that they had not consulted Iravatham Mahadevan,
to whom I immediately forwarded the material. I got Mahadevan's reply
only today, after a reminder. It follows below.
        With best regards, Asko Parpola



-------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject:
        Inscribed Pottery from Perur
   Date:
        Thu, 9 Jan 2003 20:06:11 +0530
   From:
        "iravatham" <iravatham at eth.net>
     To:
        "Asko" <Asko.Parpola at Helsinki.Fi>




Date 09-01-03

Dear Asko

Sub: Inscribed Pottery from Perur.

I refer to your query on the inscribed pottery from Perur near
Coimbatore. I have examined some of the originals and most of the
photographs
very carefully. I am of the opinion that they are not genuine. There are
several reasons for my suspicion:

1. Passages from the cave inscriptions at Mangulam and Sittannavasal
(published in my Corpus in 1966) recur in these pottery insriptions out
of context.

2. Some of the characters look like the Brahmi script around 1st century
A.D., but others in the same inscriptions are from a much later period.
Some of the characters occur nowhere else and seem to be clumsy
inventions.

3. The site is kept a closely guarded secret by some persons. It is
curious that even though these Terracotta pieces are floating round for
the
last few years, neither the Central nor the State departments of
Archaeology nor the Universities have shown any interest in digging even
a trial
trench upto date.

4. Last year, one of my students, Mr. Sankaran Raman, a numismatist from
Chennai , went to Coimbatore and Perur to investigate. He caught
red-handed a person (said to be a gold-smith) faking a copper tablet
with a Tamil-Brahmi Inscription. When confronted, he said he was doing
it
for practice! I brought the incident to the notice of Mr. I. Ramaswamy
who is the main source for most of the Terracotta pieces and other
antiquities from Perur. He said that he knew nothing about the matter.

I have voiced my suspicions to archaeologists and epigraphists who have
consulted me in the matter. I have not included the material from Perur
in my book for the above reasons. My views in the matter are well-known
and you can quote me.

With best wishes

Jani




From swantam at ASIANETINDIA.COM  Thu Jan  9 16:14:10 2003
From: swantam at ASIANETINDIA.COM (Maheswaran Nair)
Date: Thu, 09 Jan 03 21:14:10 +0500
Subject: facsimile editions
Message-ID: <161227071984.23782.5713346552172638978.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I agree with Vielle.It may be noted that this is the centenary year of the starting of publication of the Trivandrum Sanskrit series.Any help in this regard including making available rare copies can be extended.
K.Maheswaran Nair,
Professor of Sanskrit & Director
Centre for Vedanta Studies
University of Kerala
Thiruvananthapuram
Kerala,India.
----- Original Message -----
From: Christophe Vielle <vielle at ORI.UCL.AC.BE>
Date: Thursday, January 9, 2003 2:02 pm
Subject: Re: facsimile editions

> I would suggest:
> W. Kirfel's Pur-a.na Pa?ncalak.sa.na;
> and all the old editions in the Bibliotheca Indica series, the
> TrivandrumSanskrit series (only some of them have been reprinted
> by Nag or
> Munshiram), the K-avya m-al-a series or without-series of the Nir.naya
> S-agara Press in Bombay (also only a few reprinted in India) and
> the Bombay
> Sanskrit series. The full availability of such important series is a
> desideratum for individual Indologists as well as for "young"
> universitylibraries (even the old university libraries could be
> interested to buy new
> exemplars of them).
>
>
> >Dear colleagues,
> >
> >I have been asked to suggest items for publication in the form of
> >facsimile editions, and wonder if members of the list might be in a
> >position to help.
> >
> >There are no specific criteria except that the resulting book(s) will
> >have a good market in international academic and other particular
> >specialist libraries worldwide, and any additional readership
> that the
> >particular volume(s) might have.
> >
> >There is particular interest in printing editions of original
> Sanskrit>manuscripts or out-of-print classic Sanskrit texts, in
> order to issue
> >these for wider readership worldwide.
> >
> >The format would probably be: a facsimile of the original text
> >(manuscript or printed text), together with a translation on the
> facing>page or as the second part of the volume.
> >
> >Suggestions should go directly to Sarah Lloyd, Commissioning
> >Editor, Ashgate Publishing Ltd (SLloyd at Ashgatepub.co.uk).
> >
> >Thank you,
> >Julia Leslie
> >
> >SOAS
> >London
>
>
> Dr. Christophe Vielle
> Centre d'Etudes de l'Inde et de l'Asie du Sud
> Institut orientaliste
> Place Blaise Pascal 1
> B - 1348 Louvain-la-Neuve
> BELGIUM
> Tel. +32-(0)10-47 49 54 (office)/ -(0)2-640 62 66 (home)
> E-mail: vielle at ori.ucl.ac.be
>




From mmdesh at UMICH.EDU  Fri Jan 10 14:13:10 2003
From: mmdesh at UMICH.EDU (Madhav Deshpande)
Date: Fri, 10 Jan 03 09:13:10 -0500
Subject: lion - "five-faced"
Message-ID: <161227071997.23782.8446216445118364078.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

V.S.Apte's dictionary explains paJcaanana referring to a lion as paJcam aananam yasya, "so called because its mouth is generally wide-open."  It also lists paJca in the sense of "spread, extended," though the only cited instances of this word are in compounds like paJcaanana.  

                                                Madhav Deshpande

> ----------
> From:         Eva De Clercq
> Reply To:     Indology
> Sent:         Friday, January 10, 2003 8:28 AM
> To:   INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk
> Subject:           lion - "five-faced"
> 
> Hello,
> 
> Do any of you have any references to why a lion is often called "five-
> faced", paJc?nana?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Eva De Clercq
> 
> 




From pf at CIX.CO.UK  Fri Jan 10 10:45:00 2003
From: pf at CIX.CO.UK (Peter Flugel)
Date: Fri, 10 Jan 03 10:45:00 +0000
Subject: New publication "Images du corps dans le monde hindou"
In-Reply-To: <p05100300ba437f262a0c@[128.59.167.81]>
Message-ID: <161227071993.23782.1852417993555876952.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Just try: amazon.fr

Peter




From Ev.DeClercq at RUG.AC.BE  Fri Jan 10 13:28:30 2003
From: Ev.DeClercq at RUG.AC.BE (Eva De Clercq)
Date: Fri, 10 Jan 03 13:28:30 +0000
Subject: lion - "five-faced"
Message-ID: <161227071995.23782.795094648574602985.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Hello,

Do any of you have any references to why a lion is often called "five-
faced", paJc?nana?

Thanks,

Eva De Clercq




From JFStaal at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU  Sat Jan 11 00:31:43 2003
From: JFStaal at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU (Frits Staal)
Date: Fri, 10 Jan 03 16:31:43 -0800
Subject: None
Message-ID: <161227072007.23782.74880924216288211.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Does anyone have an E-mail address for Minoru Hara or for the Tokyo
Buddhist Institute of which he is the President?

Thanks

Frits Staal
http://philosophy.berkeley.edu/staal/




From aklujkar at INTERCHANGE.UBC.CA  Sat Jan 11 00:38:39 2003
From: aklujkar at INTERCHANGE.UBC.CA (Ashok Aklujkar)
Date: Fri, 10 Jan 03 16:38:39 -0800
Subject: Minoru Hara address
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030110163056.00a5fab0@socrates.berkeley.edu>
Message-ID: <161227072008.23782.1187675515821166212.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Prof. Minoru Hara, President, International College for Advanced Buddhist
Studies, 5-3-23 Toranomon, Minato-ku Tokyo 105, Japan.

<icabs at icabs.ac.jp>

ashok aklujkar


On 2003-01-10 16:31, "Frits Staal" <JFStaal at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU> wrote:

> Does anyone have an E-mail address for Minoru Hara or for the Tokyo
> Buddhist Institute of which he is the President?
>
> Thanks
>
> Frits Staal
> http://philosophy.berkeley.edu/staal/




From jlc at CCR.JUSSIEU.FR  Fri Jan 10 17:06:42 2003
From: jlc at CCR.JUSSIEU.FR (Jean-Luc Chevillard)
Date: Fri, 10 Jan 03 18:06:42 +0100
Subject: 1 2  1 2 3 2 1 2 3 4 ... (Re: lion - "five-faced")
In-Reply-To: <60D386B60521234BB917967801F3A30F6200D2@lsa-m4.lsa.adsroot.              itcs.umich.edu>
Message-ID: <161227071999.23782.15770711450222789377.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

At 09:13 10/01/03 -0500, you wrote:
>V.S.Apte's dictionary explains paJcaanana referring to a lion as paJcam 
>aananam yasya, "so called because its mouth is generally wide-open."  It 
>also lists paJca in the sense of "spread, extended," though the only cited 
>instances of this word are in compounds like paJcaanana.
>
>                                                 Madhav Deshpande

It is curious to note that there is some parallel phenomenon
with "nAlvAy" in Tamil,
as was pointed to me once by Dominic Goodall,
when it appears in the tiruveZukURRirukkai
(tEvAram 1-128),
seemingly in a progression
that goes up and down several times
1 2 1 2 3 2 1 2 3 4 3 2 1 2 3 4 5 ... etc. upto 7
and containing:
  Or uru "one form"
  Ir iyalpu "two natures"
  oru "one"
  iru cuTar "two luminaries"
  mummUrttikaL "three embodiments"
  ....
  nAlvAy
  etc.
[it goes by steps upto eZu "seven"]

One would expect nAlvAy to mean "four"
but it is in fact translated by "hanging jaw"
(for an elephant)

[for the record, that same meaning of nAlvAy
is also seen in tEvAram 1-102 (2)

Happy new year 2003 to all Indology list members

-- Jean-Luc Chevillard (Paris)



> > ----------
> > From:         Eva De Clercq
> > Reply To:     Indology
> > Sent:         Friday, January 10, 2003 8:28 AM
> > To:   INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk
> > Subject:           lion - "five-faced"
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > Do any of you have any references to why a lion is often called "five-
> > faced", paJc?nana?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Eva De Clercq
> >
> >




From jlc at CCR.JUSSIEU.FR  Fri Jan 10 17:21:19 2003
From: jlc at CCR.JUSSIEU.FR (Jean-Luc Chevillard)
Date: Fri, 10 Jan 03 18:21:19 +0100
Subject: ERRATUM to (1 2  1 2 3 2 1 2 3 4 ... (Re: lion - "five-faced"))
In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030110173936.02768b50@moka.ccr.jussieu.fr>
Message-ID: <161227072001.23782.6540726465108619409.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

At 18:06 10/01/03 +0100, I wrote:

>One would expect nAlvAy to mean "four"

I should, of course, have written:

One would expect the "nAl" in "nAlvAy" to mean "four"
(vAy is "mouth")

>but it is in fact translated by "hanging jaw"
>(for an elephant)
>
>[for the record, that same meaning of nAlvAy
>is also seen in tEvAram 1-102 (2)

Sorry for the typo

-- Jean-Luc Chevillard (Paris)




From neelisja at U.WASHINGTON.EDU  Sat Jan 11 02:43:27 2003
From: neelisja at U.WASHINGTON.EDU (Jason Neelis)
Date: Fri, 10 Jan 03 18:43:27 -0800
Subject: Buddhist Relics from Bhilsa Topes
In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030111005658.02cefab8@mercury.ci.uw.edu.pl>
Message-ID: <161227072010.23782.3396169210294807225.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

The relics from Sanci are in the British Museum. In Michael Willis, Buddhist Reliquaries from Ancient India (London: British Museum Press, 2000), Cunningham's finds are cataloged and illustrated.

On Sat, 11 Jan 2003, Artur Karp wrote:

> Dear List-members,
>
> Does anyone know what is the fate of relics excavated by Cunningham from
> the stupas he opened in the early fifties of the 19th century?
>
> Regards,
>
> Artur Karp
>
> University of Warsaw
> Poland
>
Jason Neelis
University of Washington
Seattle, WA 98195   USA
neelisja at u.washington.edu




From swantam at ASIANETINDIA.COM  Fri Jan 10 17:47:56 2003
From: swantam at ASIANETINDIA.COM (Maheswaran Nair)
Date: Fri, 10 Jan 03 22:47:56 +0500
Subject: lion - "five-faced"
Message-ID: <161227072003.23782.12352633427423182845.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Hello,
Sabdakalpadruma says-pancam vistrtam ?nanam yasya simhah.In the figure of a lion what is comparatively the most prominent and broad is its face.And the least in size is its kati or loin.That is why the loin of beautiful woman is compared with that of lion-mrgaraajakatii.   
K.Maheswaran Nair
Professor of Sanskrit & Director
Centre for Vedanta Studies
University of Kerala
Thiruvananthapuram 
Kerala,India
----- Original Message -----
From: Eva De Clercq <Ev.DeClercq at RUG.AC.BE>
Date: Friday, January 10, 2003 6:58 pm
Subject: lion - "five-faced"

> Hello,
> 
> Do any of you have any references to why a lion is often called 
> "five-
> faced", paJc?nana?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Eva De Clercq
>




From karp at MERCURY.CI.UW.EDU.PL  Fri Jan 10 23:58:05 2003
From: karp at MERCURY.CI.UW.EDU.PL (Artur Karp)
Date: Sat, 11 Jan 03 00:58:05 +0100
Subject: Buddhist Relics from Bhilsa Topes
In-Reply-To: <60D386B60521234BB917967801F3A30F6200D2@lsa-m4.lsa.adsroot.              itcs.umich.edu>
Message-ID: <161227072005.23782.3998283185347365957.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear List-members,

Does anyone know what is the fate of relics excavated by Cunningham from
the stupas he opened in the early fifties of the 19th century?

Regards,

Artur Karp

University of Warsaw
Poland


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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From vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET  Sat Jan 11 07:40:55 2003
From: vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET (Valerie J Roebuck)
Date: Sat, 11 Jan 03 07:40:55 +0000
Subject: Buddhist Relics from Bhilsa Topes
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.43.0301101843270.1784@hymn17.u.washington.edu>
Message-ID: <161227072012.23782.13052887076699458156.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

The reliquaries, artefacts etc are indeed in the British Museum.  But
the bodily relics (of the two chief Arahats, SAriputta and
MoggallAna) were given into the keeping of the Bhikkhu-saGgha in Sri
Lanka.

This is from memory, so I can't at present provide a reference.

Dr Valerie J Roebuck
Manchester, UK

>The relics from Sanci are in the British Museum. In Michael Willis,
>Buddhist Reliquaries from Ancient India (London: British Museum
>Press, 2000), Cunningham's finds are cataloged and illustrated.
>
>On Sat, 11 Jan 2003, Artur Karp wrote:
>
>>  Dear List-members,
>>
>>  Does anyone know what is the fate of relics excavated by Cunningham from
>>  the stupas he opened in the early fifties of the 19th century?
>>
>>  Regards,
>>
>>  Artur Karp
>>
>>  University of Warsaw
>>  Poland
>>
>Jason Neelis
>University of Washington
>Seattle, WA 98195   USA
>neelisja at u.washington.edu




From vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET  Sat Jan 11 14:21:24 2003
From: vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET (Valerie J Roebuck)
Date: Sat, 11 Jan 03 14:21:24 +0000
Subject: Buddhist Relics from Bhilsa Topes
In-Reply-To: <a05100300ba45798d3ce4@[80.40.42.53]>
Message-ID: <161227072014.23782.16376389802408713795.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Nyanaponika Thera, The Life of SAriputta, Wheel Publication 90-92,
Buddhist Publication Society, Kandy, 1966, pp. 103-7, has a "Note on
the Relics of Sariputta and Maha-Moggallana" from the stUpas at Sanci
and SatadhAra.  The following is an extract from pp. 105-7:

"The Sacred Relics [of the bodies of the two great Arahats] were
preserved in the Victoria and Albert Museum until 1939, when the MahA
Bodhi Society approached the British government with a request that
they be returned to India.  The request was at once granted, but
owing to the outbreak of the Second World War in that year, the
actual transfer was delayed for reasons of safety until Feb. 24th
1947.  On that date they were handed over to the representatives of
the MahA Bodhi Society at the Victoria and Albert Museum, and so
began their journey back to the land of their origin.

"Before being restored to India, however, the relics were taken to
Ceylon, where they were received with great honour amid general
rejoicing.  For two and a half months in 1947, they were displayed
for public worship at the Colombo Museum, where it has been estimated
that well over two million people paid homage to them.  It is said
that not only Buddhists but Hindus, Christians and Muslims joined in
paying reverence to them.

"The next stage of their journey to the new VihAra that was being
erected for their re-enshrinement at SAnchi, was Calcutta [where
their were similar scenes of devotion, mainly by Hindus, but also by
Muslims]... Many had come from distant parts to pay their respects to
the remains of these great sons of India...  [The relics were then
taken, at the request of their respective governments, to Burma,
Nepal and Ladakh, again drawing vast crowds.]

"After they were returned to India the Burmese government asked that
a portion of the Sacred Relics should be given to Burma... They were
ceremonially transferred... on the 20th October, 1950.  The portion
allotted to Burma was afterwards enshrined in the Kaba Aye Zedi
(World Peace Pagoda), built on the site of the Sixth Great Buddhist
Council, close to Rangoon...

"Another portion was given to Ceylon, to be enshrined in a new stupa
built by the Maha Bodhi Society of Ceylon...

"On the 30th November 1952 the remaining Relics were duly enshrined
at Sanchi on completion of the new Chetiyagiri Vihara built to
receive them.  There they remain, objects of the deepest veneration
to pilgrims from every Buddhist country, and a lasting reminder of
the lives of those in whom the Buddha's Teaching bore its finest
fruit."

Valerie J Roebuck
Manchester, UK

At 7:40 am +0000 11/1/03, Valerie J Roebuck wrote:
>The reliquaries, artefacts etc are indeed in the British Museum.  But
>the bodily relics (of the two chief Arahats, SAriputta and
>MoggallAna) were given into the keeping of the Bhikkhu-saGgha in Sri
>Lanka.
>
>This is from memory, so I can't at present provide a reference.
>
>Dr Valerie J Roebuck
>Manchester, UK
>
>>The relics from Sanci are in the British Museum. In Michael Willis,
>>Buddhist Reliquaries from Ancient India (London: British Museum
>>Press, 2000), Cunningham's finds are cataloged and illustrated.
>>
>>On Sat, 11 Jan 2003, Artur Karp wrote:
>>
>>>  Dear List-members,
>>>
>>>  Does anyone know what is the fate of relics excavated by Cunningham from
>>>  the stupas he opened in the early fifties of the 19th century?
>>>
>>>  Regards,
>>>
>>>  Artur Karp
>>>
>>>  University of Warsaw
>>>  Poland
>>>
>>Jason Neelis
>>University of Washington
>>Seattle, WA 98195   USA
>>neelisja at u.washington.edu




From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK  Sun Jan 12 15:35:51 2003
From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk)
Date: Sun, 12 Jan 03 15:35:51 +0000
Subject: Write to the Committee, not Dominik
Message-ID: <161227072016.23782.15847079319707808221.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear friends,

Since reopening, the INDOLOGY list has been managed by a committee, and
the email address is

        indologycommittee at liverpool.ac.uk

Those of us on the committee take turns on a weekly rota to do whatever
needs to be done for the list, like subscribe new applicants, change
addresses which have altered, or whatever else.

A number of queries and requests regarding the list are still sent to me
personally, for obvious - but now firmly historical - reasons.  I just
forward these messages to the address above.  You'll get better service if
you just go to the commitee directly.  And my inbox will be a little
smaller :-)


All the best,

Dominik




From athr at LOC.GOV  Mon Jan 13 19:57:29 2003
From: athr at LOC.GOV (Allen W Thrasher)
Date: Mon, 13 Jan 03 14:57:29 -0500
Subject: death of Prof. Dr. M.D. Vasanth Raj
Message-ID: <161227072018.23782.12482273305888686295.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Forwarded from the Jain list:

 ----- Original Message -----
From: Eva De Clercq
To: jainlist at yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, January 11, 2003 9:16 PM
Subject: Obituary: Prof. Dr. M.D. Vasanth Raj


On 27th december 2002, M.D. Vasanth Raj, former professor of Jainology
and
 Prakrits of Mysore University, passed away. He not only was one of the
great
 scholars of Jainism, he also was a devout Jain himself, whose
character was
 exemplary to all. Those who had the fortune of meeting him, will
remember
 him as a kind, gentle and modest man, who never refused anyone who
came to
 him for help or advice. Our thoughts go out to his family.

-------------------------------------------------------

--
`````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````
Manish Modi

HINDI GRANTH KARYALAY
http://www.hindibooks.8m.com
Booksellers and Publishers
Hirabaug, C. P. Tank,
Mumbai 400004 INDIA
Phone: +91-22-23826739
Email: manish.modi at bol.net.in




From aklujkar at INTERCHANGE.UBC.CA  Mon Jan 13 23:48:50 2003
From: aklujkar at INTERCHANGE.UBC.CA (Ashok Aklujkar)
Date: Mon, 13 Jan 03 15:48:50 -0800
Subject: lion - "five-faced"
In-Reply-To: <60D386B60521234BB917967801F3A30F6200D2@lsa-m4.lsa.adsroot.itcs.umich.edu>
Message-ID: <161227072019.23782.10964420656152960614.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

There has been some interesting discussion on pa;ncaanana in Marathi between
Professors M.A. Mehendale and M.G. Dhadphale. I cannot locate it at present,
nor remember its precise content. The inquirer could contact both scholars
at the Bhandarkar Oriental Research Institute, Pune 411 004.

In the meanwhile, I will simply observe that pa;nca could be connected to
the root pa;nc that is found in words such as prapa;nca and must have some
such sense as 'expand, proliferate.'

ashok aklujkar


On 2003-01-10 06:13, "Madhav Deshpande" <mmdesh at UMICH.EDU> wrote:

> V.S.Apte's dictionary explains paJcaanana referring to a lion as paJcam
> aananam yasya, "so called because its mouth is generally wide-open."  It also
> lists paJca in the sense of "spread, extended," though the only cited
> instances of this word are in compounds like paJcaanana.
> 
>                                               Madhav Deshpande
> 
>> ----------
>> From:         Eva De Clercq
>> Reply To:     Indology
>> Sent:         Friday, January 10, 2003 8:28 AM
>> To:   INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk
>> Subject:           lion - "five-faced"
>> 
>> Hello,
>> 
>> Do any of you have any references to why a lion is often called "five-
>> faced", paJc?nana?
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> 
>> Eva De Clercq
>> 
>> 




From athr at LOC.GOV  Tue Jan 14 15:32:06 2003
From: athr at LOC.GOV (Allen W Thrasher)
Date: Tue, 14 Jan 03 10:32:06 -0500
Subject: lion - "five-faced"
Message-ID: <161227072021.23782.1304060315559042714.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Ashok said, "In the meanwhile, I will simply observe that pa;nca could
be connected to
the root pa;nc that is found in words such as prapa;nca and must have
some
such sense as 'expand, proliferate.'

ashok aklujkar"

I thought prapanca had something to do with the splitting into the five
elements.

Allen




Allen W. Thrasher, Ph.D.
Senior Reference Librarian
Southern Asia Section
Asian Division
Library of Congress
Jefferson Building 150
101 Independence Ave., S.E.
Washington, DC 20540-4810
tel. 202-707-3732
fax 202-707-1724
athr at loc.gov
The opinions expressed do not necessarily reflect those of the Library
of Congress.




From aklujkar at INTERCHANGE.UBC.CA  Tue Jan 14 18:58:06 2003
From: aklujkar at INTERCHANGE.UBC.CA (Ashok Aklujkar)
Date: Tue, 14 Jan 03 10:58:06 -0800
Subject: lion - "five-faced"
In-Reply-To: <se23e713.067@loc.gov>
Message-ID: <161227072023.23782.1823884229325802132.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On 2003-01-14 07:32, "Allen W Thrasher" <athr at LOC.GOV> wrote:

> I thought prapanca had something to do with the splitting into the five
> elements.

In that case the stem would have been a consonantal one, that is,
prapa;ncan, and we would have come across a grammarian writing a deletion
rule for the final n. Besides, prapa;nca does not at least commonly occur in
the company of five elements, and compounds of pra with a numeral as the
second member do not seem to exist (e.g., I have not come across words like
pra-dvi or prada;sa).

a.a.




From isabo at BLUEYONDER.CO.UK  Tue Jan 14 18:45:37 2003
From: isabo at BLUEYONDER.CO.UK (isabelle onians)
Date: Tue, 14 Jan 03 18:45:37 +0000
Subject: PRASADA Professorship
Message-ID: <161227072025.23782.12781840531490346060.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

De Montfort University
Faculty of Art and Design
PRASADA

Professorship in South Asian Studies

A senior appointment, up to Professorial level, is to be made at PRASADA
(Practice, Research and Advancement in South Asian Design and Architecture),
the University's centre for the art, architecture and material culture of
the Indian subcontinent and its diaspora. Established in 1996 with the aim
of integrating research and creative practice, the centre has already become
the largest concentration of expertise in its field in a British university,
and scored a 4 in the 2001 RAE. PRASADA's research projects and postgraduate
programmes (MPhil/PhD and MA) are complemented by its design consultancy
work.

The successful applicant will have an international reputation for research
in an aspect of the arts and culture of South Asia. A record of related
creative practice would be an advantage. He or she will contribute to the
range of activities of the centre, and will initiate, lead and find funding
for major research projects, working closely with Professor Adam Hardy,
Director of PRASADA, in managing the centre and developing its vision and
strategy. Salary: to be negotiated.

Informal enquiries can be made to Professor Adam Hardy, e-mail:
ahardy at dmu.ac.uk, tel: +44 (0)116 250 6025.




From GthomGt at CS.COM  Wed Jan 15 03:14:15 2003
From: GthomGt at CS.COM (George Thompson)
Date: Tue, 14 Jan 03 22:14:15 -0500
Subject: lion - "five-faced"
Message-ID: <161227072027.23782.11901130578174197677.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

In a message dated 1/14/2003 1:51:41 PM Eastern Standard Time,
aklujkar at INTERCHANGE.UBC.CA writes:


> In that case the stem would have been a consonantal one, that is,
> prapa;ncan, and we would have come across a grammarian writing a deletion
> rule for the final n. Besides, prapa;nca does not at least commonly occur in
> the company of five elements, and compounds of pra with a numeral as the
> second member do not seem to exist (e.g., I have not come across words like
> pra-dvi or prada;sa).
>



Hello Ashok and Allen and List,

The old Indo-Europeanist view is that prapaJcayati is a denominative stem
derived from prapaJca.  paJcan [parallel with saptan] is in fact attested in
bahuvrIhis [see Wackernagel-Debrunner, Altindische Grammatik 3.354].  I have
no explanation for pra + paJca [nor for the absence of pra + dvi or pra +
daza, etc.], but paJca as 'five' thus to ''expansiveness, manifoldness" is
easy.  We have in IE languages many instances of 'five' going to 'fist, hand,
etc.'  -- not only in English but also in German, Slavic, Greek, etc. [see
Mayrhofer KEWA, under paJca].  Compare paJcazAkha = hand.

I don't see anything wrong with the old IE view.  Does anyone else?

Best wishes,

George Thompson




From ghart at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU  Wed Jan 15 17:43:41 2003
From: ghart at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU (George Hart)
Date: Wed, 15 Jan 03 09:43:41 -0800
Subject: lion - "five-faced"
In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.20030115123005.006bf1a8@imap.satyam.net.in>
Message-ID: <161227072030.23782.3247359233431277261.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

To add to Jean-Luc Chevillard's note, the Tamil Lexicon gives
aivaaymaan (5-mouth-animal) as lion and suggests it is a "wrong
translation of panca into five, in the word pancaanana, or
broad-faced, a term for lion."  It also says aivaaymirukam means
"Indian black bear, melursus ursinus, so called from the prehensile
power of his four feet and mouth."  Apte does not give "bear" as one
of the meanings of pancaanana (or, to exactly parallel the Tamil
word, pancaananamrga).  Unfortunately, the Lexicon does not give a
source for the meaning "bear."




From ddsg at SATYAM.NET.IN  Wed Jan 15 07:31:09 2003
From: ddsg at SATYAM.NET.IN (Dominic Goodall)
Date: Wed, 15 Jan 03 12:31:09 +0500
Subject: lion - "five-faced"
Message-ID: <161227072028.23782.6833540078299275974.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

A word that might be relevant to this discussion and that seems not to have
been mentioned in it yet is pa~ncikaa.  Although it is not uncommonly
regarded as a variant form of pa~njikaa, might it not actually be another
derivate (like, perhaps, prapa~nca) of a root pac or pa~nc `To diffuse,
elaborate' (Apte s.v. pac II and pa~nc)?  Are those roots too to be
connected with the numeral?

Dominic Goodall

>The old Indo-Europeanist view is that prapaJcayati is a denominative stem
>derived from prapaJca.  paJcan [parallel with saptan] is in fact attested in
>bahuvrIhis [see Wackernagel-Debrunner, Altindische Grammatik 3.354].  I have
>no explanation for pra + paJca [nor for the absence of pra + dvi or pra +
>daza, etc.], but paJca as 'five' thus to ''expansiveness, manifoldness" is
>easy.  We have in IE languages many instances of 'five' going to 'fist, hand,
>etc.'  -- not only in English but also in German, Slavic, Greek, etc. [see
>Mayrhofer KEWA, under paJca].  Compare paJcazAkha = hand.
>
>I don't see anything wrong with the old IE view.  Does anyone else?
>
>Best wishes,
>
>George Thompson
>




From sseas at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU  Wed Jan 15 22:05:21 2003
From: sseas at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU (Robert Goldman)
Date: Wed, 15 Jan 03 14:05:21 -0800
Subject: lion - "five-faced"
In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.20030115123005.006bf1a8@imap.satyam.net.in>
Message-ID: <161227072034.23782.2525081975819770899.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

At VAlmIki RAmAyaNa (crit. ed.) 5.36.22 , RAma is quoted as comparing
himself to a "paJcavaktra" serpent (paJcavaktreNa bhoginA). This is
repeated at 5.65.8.  We translate the adjective as "with jaws agape."
following the interpretation of the commentator GovindarAja, who,
taking the word paJca from the root pac in the sense of "spread" or
"extend," glosses vyAttamukhena, "with mouth wide open."  As an
alternative explanation, he understands the reference as being to a
serpent with five jaws, i.e., heads. It is this second interpretation
that has been uniformly adopted by the translations consulted.  See
5.65.8; cf. 5.49.21.

At  5.49.21 SItA is described as  paJcAsyAm iva pannagIm, which we
rendered, "like a five-headed cobra" (Literally, "like a five-mouthed
she-cobra.")  Several of the commentators note that the simile serves
to inform RAvaNa that SItA will destroy him and his city with the
fire of her grief, just as a cobra would with its fiery venom. The
commentator SatyatIrtha sees the five heads as a reference to the
five principal characters who will ultimately bring about RAvaNa's
downfall, viz., RAma, LakSmaNa, the king [SugrIva], HanumAn, and
SItA. However, as an alternative,  he reads paJca,  as an adjective,
meaning "spread or extended" and thus takes the compound to mean
"with mouth agape." See 5.36.22 and 5.65.8 and notes; cf. 5.47.2-14
(verse 8).


[adapted from the notes to our translation of the SundarakANDa.
Princeton University Press, 1996]

--
Dr. R. P.  Goldman
Professor of Sanskrit
Department of  South and Southeast Asian Studies
7303 Dwinelle Hall MC #2540
University of California at Berkeley
Berkeley, CA 94720-2540
email: sseas at socrates.berkeley.edu
Phone: (510) 642-4089
Fax:     (510) 642.2409




From bimahony at DAVIDSON.EDU  Wed Jan 15 20:03:24 2003
From: bimahony at DAVIDSON.EDU (Mahony, Bill)
Date: Wed, 15 Jan 03 15:03:24 -0500
Subject: Announcement of Graduate Fellowships
Message-ID: <161227072032.23782.1666797534665448794.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

> Dear INDOLOGY Colleagues,
> 
> Please feel free to share this information regarding graduate research fellowships with any students you feel would be qualified and interested in applying.
> 
> Thank you,
> 
> William K. Mahony
> Professor of Religion, Davidson College
> President, Muktabodha Indological Research Institute.
> 
> ***********
> 
> NAME OF FELLOWSHIP: 
> 
> Muktabodha Indological Research Institute 
> Graduate Student Research Fellowships in Hindu Studies
> 
> 
> AMOUNT OF AWARD	
> 
> $10,000 per student, to be used between June 2003 and December 2004.
> 
> 
> QUALIFICATIONS: 
> 	
> Applicants must have completed their doctoral coursework in a Religion, South Asian Studies, or related program and are now undertaking their dissertation research. Fellows will normally use their grants to support them while undertaking research in India.
> 
> 
> FIELDS OF STUDY:	
> 
> Preference will be given to the study of textual sources of the Hindu Tantric tradition. However, applications from other fields of Hindu studies are also welcome.
> 
> 
> APPLICATION DEADLINE: 
> 
> March 1, 2003.
> 
> 
> ANNOUNCEMENT OF AWARDS:
> 
> March 15, 2003.
> 
> 
> FOR APPLICATION MATERIALS, PLEASE CONTACT:
> 
> Muktabodha Indological Research Institute
> Graduate Student Fellowships
> 371 Brickman Road
> Hurleyville, NY  12747-5313
> www.muktabodha.org
> info at muktabodha.org
> 
> 




From cln at SAS.UPENN.EDU  Thu Jan 16 15:22:06 2003
From: cln at SAS.UPENN.EDU (Christian Lee Novetzke)
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 03 10:22:06 -0500
Subject: Fwd: 31st January deadline reminder
Message-ID: <161227072042.23782.9371625877940337538.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Hello,

I'm forwarding this on behalf of Madhu Kishwar.  Please respond directly to
her.

Thanks,

Christian



>
>
>Dear Friends,
>
>
>
>Just in case it has slipped your mind, the deadline for submitting paper
>and panel proposals for the IAHR-CSDS Conference on Indic Religions is
>31st January, 2003, only 15 days away.
>
>
>
>The conference aims to encourage rigorous secular studies of religious
>traditions in India: Hinduism, Zoroastrianism, Jainism, Buddhism,
>Christianity, Islam and Sikhism, including their various sects and
>branches.  Furthermore, in order to promote the study of religions in
>India as a careful secular discipline, the conference hopes to establish a
>process for bringing together, on a regular basis, scholars in India who
>are working in the field of religion.
>
>
>
>Topics might include, but are not limited to: studies of traditional
>religious texts with a special focus on notions of the common or public
>good; ideal forms of gender and familiar relations; theories of justice
>and political authority; and relations between deities and mortals, rulers
>and ruled, or nature and humans; the interrelationships among religions
>theologies, canons, philosophies, practices, and folk beliefs; historical
>and contemporary studies of growth or decay of syncretic traditions in
>religious texts and practices; the role and function of pilgrimage
>centres, as well as the management of religious institutions; and the
>rise, decline, and renewal of shramanic traditions within Indic
>civilisation; the politics of conversion in history or in contemporary
>India; and the limits of religions authority and the role of dissenters
>and outsiders; the impact of nationalism on beliefs and practices; Gandhi
>s religion; and Hindu-Muslim relations; special methodological concerns in
>the study of Indic religions; and the contributions of Indic religions to
>cosmological speculation in 20th century science.
>
>
>
>Last date for submission of proposals:            January 31, 2003
>
>Dates of the conference:                               December 18 to 21, 2003
>
>Venue:                                                              Indian
>International Centre.
>
>
>
>Please see our website for proposal submission, registration, programme,
>accommodation, and contact information:
><http://www.indicreligions.com/>www.indicreligions.com
>
>
>
>Please pass this information on to other interested people.
>
>
>
>Email: <mailto:madhuk at csdsdelhi.org>madhuk at csdsdelhi.org
>
>
>
>
>
>Sincerely,
>
>Madhu Kishwar
>
>
>
>Convenor
>
>
>

Christian Lee Novetzke
Assistant Professor of South Asia Studies
University of Pennsylvania, 820 Williams Hall
36th and Spruce Streets
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6305, USA

Email: cln at sas.upenn.edu      Website: http://www.sas.upenn.edu/~cln
Tel: (215) 898-7475                  Fax: (215) 573-2138




From Axel.Michaels at URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE  Thu Jan 16 09:50:01 2003
From: Axel.Michaels at URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (Axel Michaels)
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 03 10:50:01 +0100
Subject: penance
Message-ID: <161227072038.23782.6167082621287326520.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Arlo,

sub www.sai.uni-heidelberg.de/abt/IND ("Materialien und
Publikationen") you can find a bibliography on asceticsm in Hinduism which
includes a number of publications on practices of penance in modern South
Asia.

Best
Axel

----- Original Message -----
From: "Arlo Griffiths" <A.Griffiths at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL>
To: <INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk>
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 10:10 AM
Subject: penance


> In yesterday's issue of the Dutch newspaper "Trouw", there was a short
> report on disputes in the Hindu community of Malaysia on the acceptability
> of what some at least might consider extreme forms of penance: walking on
> knives, pulling carts by hooks pierced through the flesh on their backs,
> etc., all this on the occasion of the "Thaipusam" festival. Apparently,
some
> are advocating fasting, singing, and recitation of sacred texts as
> alternatives, arguing that "Our body is the house of God, we have no right
> to harm it". I subjoin the Dutch article, for those who can read it.
>     My students have been asking me about penance in modern Hinduism, a
> subject I am quite ignorant of. Can anybody help me with references to
> literature on these and other practices of penance in modern Hinduism? I
> would be much obliged.
>
> Arlo Griffiths
>
>
> ---
>
> ?Hindoes moeten niet aan extreme boeterituelen doen?
>
> KUALA LUMPUR ? Hindoes moeten zichzelf niet geselen, niet op messen lopen
en
> geen karren voorttrekken aan haken die ze in hun rug hebben bevestigd. Die
> waarschuwing heeft de Maleisische Hindoeraad laten horen met het oog op
het
> grote Thaipusam-festival, dat zondag wordt gevierd.
>
> Gelovige hindoes gaan zich tijdens dat festival traditiegetrouw te buiten
> aan extreme vormen van boetedoening. ?Ons lichaam is de woning van God, we
> hebben niet het recht om het schade toe te brengen?, zei dr. K.
Thilagavathi
> van de Hindoeraad. De raad vertegenwoordigt de hindoe?stische minderheid
in
> het overwegend islamitische Maleisi?. Van de ongeveer 23 miljoen
Maleisi?rs
> zijn er twee miljoen hindoe.
> De raad beveelt in plaats van zelfkastijding vasten, zingen en het
reciteren
> van heilige teksten aan. De aanbeveling valt niet bij iedereen in goede
> aarde. ?Het is mijn boetedoening en ik maak uit hoe ik die volbreng?, zei
S.
> Murasoli, terwijl hij bezig was de punten van tientallen haken te scherpen
> die hij zondag in zijn huid zal steken.
> Het festival ter ere van de god Subramaniam, de tweede zoon van Shiva,
trekt
> jaarlijks honderdduizenden gelovigen. Het is ook populair bij de
> hindoegemeenschappen in Zuid-India, Singapore en Bali.
>
>
> Uit: Trouw, woensdag 15-01-2003
>
>




From jkirk at SPRO.NET  Thu Jan 16 18:00:00 2003
From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk)
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 03 11:00:00 -0700
Subject: penance
Message-ID: <161227072051.23782.4459765435498508379.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

>???From Joanna Kirkpatrick. Not clear if there's much on the psychology of hook
swinging in Oddie's work, but then I've not read it.

See the film, "Kataragama." Gananath Obeyesekere was the consultant on this
film. In it a Muslim man who dedicates himself every year at the annual
festival tells his personal reasons why he does it yearly.

Geoffrey A. Oddie, Popular Religion, Elites and Reform: Hook-Swinging and
Its Prohibition in Colonial  India, 1880-1894 (Delhi: Manohar, 1995), pp.
1-41.


And:

This anthology has a possibly insightful article by G. A. Oddie:
Re-Visioning India's Religious Traditions: Essays in Honour of Eric Lott
by Scott, David C. (ed. and contributor) and Selvanayagam, Israel (ed. and
contributor)
Contributors include Sathianathan Clarke and Geoffrey A. Oddie and Subhash
Anand and Nirmal Minz and Julius J. Lipner and Ninian Smart and Jyoti Sahi
and Andreas Nehring and I. Henry Victor and Gabriele Dietrich and M. Thomas
Thangaraj. Published in 1996 by ISPCK.
Abstract:
Fourteen essays by an outstanding group of scholars divided into four
sections: "Studying India's Sacred Past" including David C. Scott on
pre-colonial Orientalism; "Primal and Popular Religious Experience"
including Oddie on hook swinging rituals in popular Hinduism and how the
realities of this practice shatter simplistic divisions between popular and
philosophical Hinduism; "Theological Reflection in the Indian Context"
including Lipner on avatara and incarnation, Ninian Smart on learning from
Ramanuja on the inner controller; and "The Dynamics of Religious Pluralism"
including Dietrich giving a socio-economic-religious perspective on the rise
of communalism and fundamentalism in India and Victor on insights from
Montgomery Watt on Islam and Christianity. With an appendix giving a listing
of Lott's writings arranged by subject. An invaluable collection of papers
that deserves a place in every library of religious studies.
==============================================================
 What I am curious
about, is this: are there any studies of persons who do this sort of
thing? Is this a thing "anybody" can do provided s/he has the willpower,
or do such persons have a reduced sense of pain which allows them to
perform such acts? In a religious context, is there any kind of abnormal
mental state involved? If anybody on the net knows anything about this,
I would be curious to hear the answer!

Best regards,

Lars Martin Fosse

>
> ?Hindoes moeten niet aan extreme boeterituelen doen?
>
> KUALA LUMPUR ? Hindoes moeten zichzelf niet geselen, niet op
> messen lopen en geen karren voorttrekken aan haken die ze in
> hun rug hebben bevestigd. Die waarschuwing heeft de
> Maleisische Hindoeraad laten horen met het oog op het grote
> Thaipusam-festival, dat zondag wordt gevierd.
>
> Gelovige hindoes gaan zich tijdens dat festival
> traditiegetrouw te buiten aan extreme vormen van
> boetedoening. ?Ons lichaam is de woning van God, we hebben
> niet het recht om het schade toe te brengen?, zei dr. K.
> Thilagavathi van de Hindoeraad. De raad vertegenwoordigt de
> hindoe?stische minderheid in het overwegend islamitische
> Maleisi?. Van de ongeveer 23 miljoen Maleisi?rs zijn er twee
> miljoen hindoe. De raad beveelt in plaats van zelfkastijding
> vasten, zingen en het reciteren van heilige teksten aan. De
> aanbeveling valt niet bij iedereen in goede aarde. ?Het is
> mijn boetedoening en ik maak uit hoe ik die volbreng?, zei S.
> Murasoli, terwijl hij bezig was de punten van tientallen
> haken te scherpen die hij zondag in zijn huid zal steken. Het
> festival ter ere van de god Subramaniam, de tweede zoon van
> Shiva, trekt jaarlijks honderdduizenden gelovigen. Het is ook
> populair bij de hindoegemeenschappen in Zuid-India, Singapore en Bali.
>
>
> Uit: Trouw, woensdag 15-01-2003
>
>




From A.Griffiths at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL  Thu Jan 16 09:10:10 2003
From: A.Griffiths at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL (Arlo Griffiths)
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 03 11:10:10 +0200
Subject: penance
Message-ID: <161227072036.23782.11684467787760210669.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

In yesterday's issue of the Dutch newspaper "Trouw", there was a short
report on disputes in the Hindu community of Malaysia on the acceptability
of what some at least might consider extreme forms of penance: walking on
knives, pulling carts by hooks pierced through the flesh on their backs,
etc., all this on the occasion of the "Thaipusam" festival. Apparently, some
are advocating fasting, singing, and recitation of sacred texts as
alternatives, arguing that "Our body is the house of God, we have no right
to harm it". I subjoin the Dutch article, for those who can read it.
    My students have been asking me about penance in modern Hinduism, a
subject I am quite ignorant of. Can anybody help me with references to
literature on these and other practices of penance in modern Hinduism? I
would be much obliged.

Arlo Griffiths


---

?Hindoes moeten niet aan extreme boeterituelen doen?

KUALA LUMPUR ? Hindoes moeten zichzelf niet geselen, niet op messen lopen en
geen karren voorttrekken aan haken die ze in hun rug hebben bevestigd. Die
waarschuwing heeft de Maleisische Hindoeraad laten horen met het oog op het
grote Thaipusam-festival, dat zondag wordt gevierd.

Gelovige hindoes gaan zich tijdens dat festival traditiegetrouw te buiten
aan extreme vormen van boetedoening. ?Ons lichaam is de woning van God, we
hebben niet het recht om het schade toe te brengen?, zei dr. K. Thilagavathi
van de Hindoeraad. De raad vertegenwoordigt de hindoe?stische minderheid in
het overwegend islamitische Maleisi?. Van de ongeveer 23 miljoen Maleisi?rs
zijn er twee miljoen hindoe.
De raad beveelt in plaats van zelfkastijding vasten, zingen en het reciteren
van heilige teksten aan. De aanbeveling valt niet bij iedereen in goede
aarde. ?Het is mijn boetedoening en ik maak uit hoe ik die volbreng?, zei S.
Murasoli, terwijl hij bezig was de punten van tientallen haken te scherpen
die hij zondag in zijn huid zal steken.
Het festival ter ere van de god Subramaniam, de tweede zoon van Shiva, trekt
jaarlijks honderdduizenden gelovigen. Het is ook populair bij de
hindoegemeenschappen in Zuid-India, Singapore en Bali.


Uit: Trouw, woensdag 15-01-2003




From JFStaal at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU  Thu Jan 16 19:17:41 2003
From: JFStaal at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU (Frits Staal)
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 03 11:17:41 -0800
Subject: penance
In-Reply-To: <000901c2bd44$a3b52a20$fe78a8c0@db12g50j>
Message-ID: <161227072054.23782.12213604514642293037.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Earlier bibliography by Maureen Patterson, South Asian Civilizations, 
Chicago  1981 (853 pages) , s.v. "asceticism" has at least 20 references. 
For contemporary Buddhist monks in Cambodia see a recent (2001?) article by 
Olivier de Bernon in BEFEO I cannot lay my hands on.

At 10:50 AM 1/16/03 +0100, you wrote:
>Dear Arlo,
>
>sub www.sai.uni-heidelberg.de/abt/IND ("Materialien und
>Publikationen") you can find a bibliography on asceticsm in Hinduism which
>includes a number of publications on practices of penance in modern South
>Asia.
>
>Best
>Axel
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Arlo Griffiths" <A.Griffiths at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL>
>To: <INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk>
>Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 10:10 AM
>Subject: penance
>
>
> > In yesterday's issue of the Dutch newspaper "Trouw", there was a short
> > report on disputes in the Hindu community of Malaysia on the acceptability
> > of what some at least might consider extreme forms of penance: walking on
> > knives, pulling carts by hooks pierced through the flesh on their backs,
> > etc., all this on the occasion of the "Thaipusam" festival. Apparently,
>some
> > are advocating fasting, singing, and recitation of sacred texts as
> > alternatives, arguing that "Our body is the house of God, we have no right
> > to harm it". I subjoin the Dutch article, for those who can read it.
> >     My students have been asking me about penance in modern Hinduism, a
> > subject I am quite ignorant of. Can anybody help me with references to
> > literature on these and other practices of penance in modern Hinduism? I
> > would be much obliged.
> >
> > Arlo Griffiths
> >
> >
> > ---
> >
> > ?Hindoes moeten niet aan extreme boeterituelen doen?
> >
> > KUALA LUMPUR ? Hindoes moeten zichzelf niet geselen, niet op messen lopen
>en
> > geen karren voorttrekken aan haken die ze in hun rug hebben bevestigd. Die
> > waarschuwing heeft de Maleisische Hindoeraad laten horen met het oog op
>het
> > grote Thaipusam-festival, dat zondag wordt gevierd.
> >
> > Gelovige hindoes gaan zich tijdens dat festival traditiegetrouw te buiten
> > aan extreme vormen van boetedoening. ?Ons lichaam is de woning van God, we
> > hebben niet het recht om het schade toe te brengen?, zei dr. K.
>Thilagavathi
> > van de Hindoeraad. De raad vertegenwoordigt de hindoe?stische minderheid
>in
> > het overwegend islamitische Maleisi?. Van de ongeveer 23 miljoen
>Maleisi?rs
> > zijn er twee miljoen hindoe.
> > De raad beveelt in plaats van zelfkastijding vasten, zingen en het
>reciteren
> > van heilige teksten aan. De aanbeveling valt niet bij iedereen in goede
> > aarde. ?Het is mijn boetedoening en ik maak uit hoe ik die volbreng?, zei
>S.
> > Murasoli, terwijl hij bezig was de punten van tientallen haken te scherpen
> > die hij zondag in zijn huid zal steken.
> > Het festival ter ere van de god Subramaniam, de tweede zoon van Shiva,
>trekt
> > jaarlijks honderdduizenden gelovigen. Het is ook populair bij de
> > hindoegemeenschappen in Zuid-India, Singapore en Bali.
> >
> >
> > Uit: Trouw, woensdag 15-01-2003
> >
> >

Frits Staal
http://philosophy.berkeley.edu/staal/




From lmfosse at ONLINE.NO  Thu Jan 16 10:18:18 2003
From: lmfosse at ONLINE.NO (Lars Martin Fosse)
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 03 11:18:18 +0100
Subject: SV: penance
In-Reply-To: <BA4C4392.43E3%A.Griffiths@let.leidenuniv.nl>
Message-ID: <161227072040.23782.16852598027889647876.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I would like to thank Aarlo Griffiths for this interesting piece. I
recently saw a young Norwegian faqir on TV doing these things (sticking
hooks through his back skin and then hoist himself up in the air to hang
there for the rest of the program. In other words, what is religious
penance in some places is entertainment in others. What I am curious
about, is this: are there any studies of persons who do this sort of
thing? Is this a thing "anybody" can do provided s/he has the willpower,
or do such persons have a reduced sense of pain which allows them to
perform such acts? In a religious context, is there any kind of abnormal
mental state involved? If anybody on the net knows anything about this,
I would be curious to hear the answer!

Best regards,

Lars Martin Fosse

> 
> ?Hindoes moeten niet aan extreme boeterituelen doen?
> 
> KUALA LUMPUR ? Hindoes moeten zichzelf niet geselen, niet op 
> messen lopen en geen karren voorttrekken aan haken die ze in 
> hun rug hebben bevestigd. Die waarschuwing heeft de 
> Maleisische Hindoeraad laten horen met het oog op het grote 
> Thaipusam-festival, dat zondag wordt gevierd.
> 
> Gelovige hindoes gaan zich tijdens dat festival 
> traditiegetrouw te buiten aan extreme vormen van 
> boetedoening. ?Ons lichaam is de woning van God, we hebben 
> niet het recht om het schade toe te brengen?, zei dr. K. 
> Thilagavathi van de Hindoeraad. De raad vertegenwoordigt de 
> hindoe?stische minderheid in het overwegend islamitische 
> Maleisi?. Van de ongeveer 23 miljoen Maleisi?rs zijn er twee 
> miljoen hindoe. De raad beveelt in plaats van zelfkastijding 
> vasten, zingen en het reciteren van heilige teksten aan. De 
> aanbeveling valt niet bij iedereen in goede aarde. ?Het is 
> mijn boetedoening en ik maak uit hoe ik die volbreng?, zei S. 
> Murasoli, terwijl hij bezig was de punten van tientallen 
> haken te scherpen die hij zondag in zijn huid zal steken. Het 
> festival ter ere van de god Subramaniam, de tweede zoon van 
> Shiva, trekt jaarlijks honderdduizenden gelovigen. Het is ook 
> populair bij de hindoegemeenschappen in Zuid-India, Singapore en Bali.
> 
> 
> Uit: Trouw, woensdag 15-01-2003
> 
> 




From mkapstei at MIDWAY.UCHICAGO.EDU  Thu Jan 16 17:34:58 2003
From: mkapstei at MIDWAY.UCHICAGO.EDU (Matthew Kapstein)
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 03 11:34:58 -0600
Subject: OUP India
Message-ID: <161227072049.23782.16915053872414468340.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Friends,

Do any of you have the current, correct URL or e-mail
address for the OUP office in New Delhi? The
one listed in the OUP on-line directory appears to be
defunct.

with thanks,
Matthew Kapstein




From LubinT at WLU.EDU  Thu Jan 16 17:06:29 2003
From: LubinT at WLU.EDU (Timothy Lubin)
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 03 12:06:29 -0500
Subject: penance
Message-ID: <161227072044.23782.771883264639770830.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

The penances that Arlo mentions differ from those usually associated with "professional ascetics."  What is more at issue here are votive performances by bhaktas during festivals (Thaipusam, wearing of kavadi).  Ascetic restrictions on sexual activity, eating, and sleeping arrangements come into play in preparation for the performance, but performers are usually lay men and women who expect to enter into trancelike states in which they become receptacles for the divinity.  So this really comes under the heading of "charismatic" or "ecstatic" ritual, on which there is a large literature, most anthropological.  Consequently, it barely appears in the standard literature on asceticism.  To my mind, it is essential to keep in mind the basic distinction between ascetic and ecstatic practices, despite the fact that they can coincide in some cases.

Most relevant here:

Elizabeth Fuller Collins, _Pierced by Murugan's Lance: Ritual Power, and Moral Redemption among Malaysian Hindus_ (Dekalb, Ill.: Northern Illinois Univ. Press, 1997).  -- discusses political implications and contemporary trends, as well as offering an interpretation in ritual terms.  Many references to earlier literature.

Geoffrey A. Oddie, _Popular Religion, Elites and Reform: Hook-Swinging and Its Prohibition in Colonial India, 1880-1894_ (Delhi: Manohar, 1995), pp. 1-41. 

On dancing with a nail-studded board during the Bengali gaajan festival, see:A

?kos ?st?r, _The Play of the Gods: Locality, Ideology, Structure and Time in the Festivals of a Bengali Town_ (U. Chicago Press, 1980).

"Sons of Shiva": from the film project Pleasing God (a film by Robert Gardner and ?kos ?st?r for The Film Study Center, Harvard University.  [Boulder, Colo.] : Centre Communications ; Oak Park, Ill. : Distributed by American Multimedia Enterprises, 1985).  (Film of the gaajan festival.)

There is also the lurid:
"Hindu ascetics" (a film by Eberhard Thiem, Helga Lippert, Arno Peik; produced by Gottfried Kirchner.  Princeton, NJ : Films for the Humanities & Sciences, c1994).
[WARNING: This is the most embarrassingly garbled and misinformed video one could imagine; unless you are looking for humor, I suggest turning off the sound.  (For example: While dwelling on the fruits of Hindu religous culture there is a long shot of the Taj Mahal, which is then explained as a tomb built by Akbar for his wife; while explaining the four stages of life -- you know them, studenthood, marriage, asceticism, and rebirth (sic!) -- the discussion of the duties of the celibate student is illustrated with a shot of a sculpture showing a young male fondling the breasts of an apsaras; Shiva's trident is repeatedly called a "tripod"; and on and on.)  BUT, there is some rare and remarkable footage of hook-swinging, and piercing of the tongue, cheeks, and jaw by charismatics in devotion to Shiva, et al.]

Also relevant here is fire-walking:

Alf Hiltebeitel, "Timiti, the Firewalk," ch. 14 in _The Cult of Draupadi, vol. 2: On Hindu Ritual and the Goddess_ (Chicago: Univ. of Chicago Press, 1991), pp. 439-475. 

Hiltebeitel also made a film:
"Lady of Gingee: South Indian Draupadi Festivals" (producer, director Alf Hiltebeitel ; a production of GW television . Madison, Wisc. : University of Wisconsin-Madison, c1988).  This has a scene of fire-walking (tiimiti).

Hiltebeitel discusses the earlier literature on this subject, mentioning also: 

Gananath Obeyesekere, "The Firewalkers of Kataragama: The Rise of Bhakti Religiosity in Buddhist Sri Lanka," Journal of Asian Studies 36: 457-476.  (on fire-walking festivals for the Sri Lanka persona of Murugan)

and, for comparative purposes:

Loring M. Danforth, _Firewalking and Religious Healing_  (Princeton U. P., 1989). (one firewalking for Saints Constantine and Helen in Greece.)

For a good collection of recent studies on possession in South Asia:

Jackie Assayag et Gilles Tarabout, eds., _La possession en Asie du Sud: parole, corps, territoire_ (Editions de l'Ecole des Hautes Etudes en Sciences Sociales (Editions de l'EHESS; Purusartha, 1999).

As to Lars' question about whether anyone can perform such feats, I shall be interested to hear the results of any experiments he might have in mind.

Tim

Timothy Lubin
Assistant Professor (Religions of South Asia)
23 Newcomb Hall
Washington and Lee University
Lexington, VA 24450  USA

office: 540.458.8146; fax: 540.458.8498
lubint at wlu.edu   |   http://home.wlu.edu/~lubint




From yogacara_assoc at HOTMAIL.COM  Thu Jan 16 19:12:03 2003
From: yogacara_assoc at HOTMAIL.COM (Dan Lusthaus)
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 03 13:12:03 -0600
Subject: OUP India
Message-ID: <161227072057.23782.7487469178473847939.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Matthew,

Try http://www.oup.com/in/

I tried it, and it worked. Other links just offer an email link for the
Delhi office, which is:

Delhi
YMCA Library Building,
1st Floor, Jai Singh Road,
P.O. Box 43, New Delhi 110001, India
Tel: +91 11 373 2990, 374 7124/5, 373 4769
Fax: +91 11 373 2312
Email: ibho at oup.wiprobt.ems.vsnl.net.in


best,
Dan Lusthaus




From A.Griffiths at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL  Thu Jan 16 17:04:35 2003
From: A.Griffiths at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL (Arlo Griffiths)
Date: Thu, 16 Jan 03 19:04:35 +0200
Subject: penance
In-Reply-To: <se26a055.081@WISDOM.uc.wlu.edu>
Message-ID: <161227072046.23782.11657784244365120019.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Many thanks to Axel, Lars, Steve, and especially Tim!

Arlo Griffiths




From indologia at LATINMAIL.COM  Fri Jan 17 15:36:30 2003
From: indologia at LATINMAIL.COM (humanidades India)
Date: Fri, 17 Jan 03 10:36:30 -0500
Subject: Mahabharata as sheet-anchor of bharatiya itihaas
Message-ID: <161227072060.23782.13803821863082378898.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

------- Mensaje original ------
to:
cc:
date: 1/14/2003 9:16:58 PM
subject: fwd:[world-vedic] Mahabharata as sheet-anchor of bharatiya itihaas


Subject:Mahabharata as sheet-anchor of bharatiya itihaas: Colloquium <

deliberations, 2

Mahabharata as the sheet-anchor of bharatiya itihasa<BR>

"http://www.hindunet.org/saraswati/colloquium/mahabharata01.htm">http://www.hindunet.org/saraswati/colloquium/mahabharata01.htm</a><BR>


This URL provides links to the deliberations of the International Colloquium

held in Bangalore on 5 and 6 Jan. 2003 on Date of Kurukshetra War <BR>

based on astronomical data. More links on the presentations made during the colloquium will be included to present all contributions, as soon as the digital versions of the papers become available from the scholars and scientists-In my view, the seminal paper was that of Dr. BN Narahari Achar who has established the internal consistency of almost all the astronomical references contained in the Critical Edition of the Mahabharata. Of course, more work has to be done to iron out the text variants and commentaries of Vadiraja and Nilakantha and relate the chronologies to the chronologies of, for example, Aryabhat.iya and Bra_hman.as (Kaus'i_taki_ and S'atapatha astronomical
references). The date of start of the war is Nov. 22, 3067 BCE. Sky inscriptions or celestial epigraphs are observed by Veda Vyasa and recorded in the epic with extraordinary fidelity. This document thus becomes the sheet-anchor of Bharatiya Itihaas and with a
historiography unparalleled in any historical texts in any
civilization anywhere in the world, recording the chronology of events to the accuracy of a
tithi, nakshatra and solstice, apart from the observations of
celestial events such as comets and meteor-showers and of course, planetary

constellations and lunar-solar-eclipse sequence within a month, as they constitute the most

accurate clock of the times.

The next steps: 1. Resolving some observations made by scholars in future colloquia; 2. Mahabharata planetarium project and 3. resolving astronomical  references in other ancient texts of Bharat using modern-day technologies which have planetarium software to desk-tops.

Indeed, we have two technologies: 1. satellite imagery analysis <BR>

which help

validate the geographical and geo-physical data of the epics; 2. <BR>

Planetarium

software which help validate the astronomical data contained in the <BR>

epics and Brahman.a-s.




_________________________________________________________
http://www.latinmail.com.  Gratuito, latino y en espa?ol.




From ghezziem at TIN.IT  Sun Jan 19 17:12:02 2003
From: ghezziem at TIN.IT (Daniela Rossella)
Date: Sun, 19 Jan 03 18:12:02 +0100
Subject: Calcutta, 2004
Message-ID: <161227072062.23782.9539807019151535409.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dearest Friends and Colleagues, professor Chandana Chakrabarti has asked me
to announce to all the scholars, who can be interested in, the news
concerning this Symposium:

Conference on Language, Culture and Consciousness,  Calcutta, January 2004

Please, contact:

Prof. Chandana Chakrabarti,  chakraba at elon.edu

Your sincerely, Daniela Rossella


******************************************************************
Ph.D. Dr. Daniela Rossella
Department Assistant -
University of Perugia (Italy)
University of Milano (Italy)
home address: piazza Buzzati, 5
43100 PARMA (Italy)
fax: +39.0521.773854
e-mail: ghezziem at tin.it
http://www.columbia.edu/cu/lweb/data/indiv/area/idsas/ROSSELLA,Daniela.htm
******************************************************************




From ssandahl at EAGLE.CA  Mon Jan 20 09:56:40 2003
From: ssandahl at EAGLE.CA (Stella Sandahl)
Date: Mon, 20 Jan 03 04:56:40 -0500
Subject: OUP India
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0301161133000.11554-100000@harper.uchicago.edu>
Message-ID: <161227072067.23782.14388817835266818448.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Try this address:
OUP India
2/11 Ansari Road
Daryaganj
New Delhi 110 002

Customer Service Incharge is Ms. Smitha Menon. Her e-mail address is:
csdel at oupin.com

I was there ordering books ten days ago, so this address works.
Best
Stella Sandahl

on 16/1/03 12:34, Matthew Kapstein at mkapstei at MIDWAY.UCHICAGO.EDU wrote:

> Friends,
>
> Do any of you have the current, correct URL or e-mail
> address for the OUP office in New Delhi? The
> one listed in the OUP on-line directory appears to be
> defunct.
>
> with thanks,
> Matthew Kapstein
>




From Axel.Michaels at URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE  Mon Jan 20 07:45:40 2003
From: Axel.Michaels at URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (Axel Michaels)
Date: Mon, 20 Jan 03 08:45:40 +0100
Subject: Calcutta, 2004
Message-ID: <161227072065.23782.1311679382763090686.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

okay. Di um 11
Gruss
AM
----- Original Message -----
From: "Daniela Rossella" <ghezziem at TIN.IT>
To: <INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk>
Sent: Sunday, January 19, 2003 6:12 PM
Subject: Calcutta, 2004


> Dearest Friends and Colleagues, professor Chandana Chakrabarti has asked
me
> to announce to all the scholars, who can be interested in, the news
> concerning this Symposium:
>
> Conference on Language, Culture and Consciousness,  Calcutta, January 2004
>
> Please, contact:
>
> Prof. Chandana Chakrabarti,  chakraba at elon.edu
>
> Your sincerely, Daniela Rossella
>
>
> ******************************************************************
> Ph.D. Dr. Daniela Rossella
> Department Assistant -
> University of Perugia (Italy)
> University of Milano (Italy)
> home address: piazza Buzzati, 5
> 43100 PARMA (Italy)
> fax: +39.0521.773854
> e-mail: ghezziem at tin.it
> http://www.columbia.edu/cu/lweb/data/indiv/area/idsas/ROSSELLA,Daniela.htm
> ******************************************************************
>
>




From jl6 at SOAS.AC.UK  Mon Jan 20 15:33:55 2003
From: jl6 at SOAS.AC.UK (Julia Leslie)
Date: Mon, 20 Jan 03 15:33:55 +0000
Subject: self-harm ( was 'penance')
Message-ID: <161227072070.23782.14975051054457821689.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

My thanks to Arlo et al for this fascinating thread, which I am only
now catching up with.

I have selfishly re-titled the thread 'self-harm' because that is my
own angle. I am currently engaged (in collaboration with Mitchell
Weiss) in writing a book on 'Suicide and Self-Harm in India: A
Study in Cultural Understanding'. This study is based on the premise
that an academic understanding of the ideology surrounding fatal
and non-fatal deliberate self-harm in classical Indian culture
provides a historical basis for (some of?) the meanings attached to
these acts in India today. The starting-point is that the current
medical model (imported to India from the West) of self-harm as an
outcome of mental illness (self-harm as psychopathology) fails to
appreciate the complexity of Indian cultural discourse. The study will
consider in turn: the medical approaches of both Indian and
Western traditions; the ritual arena (e.g. Yavakriita); ascetic
practice, including Jain and Buddhist examples; self-harm in pursuit
of dharma; the bhakti context; and the implications of caste and
gender.

Each of these sub-topics has its own extensive bibliography, of
course. While I can't (= won't?) list everything I have collected here,
I must mention Ariel Glucklich's insightful analysis of what he calls
'self-hurting': "Sacred Pain: Hurting the Body for the Sake of the
Soul" (NY: OUP, 2001).' Taking the point of view of the practitioner,
Glucklich's material is broadly crosscultural, both historical and
contemporary, and ranges from spiritual goals to current research
in neurology and neuropsychology.

I would be delighted to continue this discussion with interested
colleagues, either on or off the list.

Julia

Dr I J Leslie
SOAS




From huntington.2 at OSU.EDU  Tue Jan 21 16:46:42 2003
From: huntington.2 at OSU.EDU (John Huntington)
Date: Tue, 21 Jan 03 11:46:42 -0500
Subject: NASA Founds!!!
In-Reply-To: <004d01c2b222$fc49ea90$2930cece@JKIRK>
Message-ID: <161227072072.23782.16144407164522608118.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Indology Colleagues,
Please forgive me for weighing in late on this one, I have been in
nepal for six weeks and am just catching up on the e-mail scene.  I
am very critical of the interpretation of the Photograph. It does not
show a bridge.  It shows what may suggest a causeway or  bridge
foundation to some. the nature of the structure is undetermined and
the photograph, assuming it is un-tampered with, suggests that a
little time in the water with a scuba rig by an experienced
underwater archaeologist. or other form of undersea exploration may
be in order.

There are many factors that have not been taken into account
including the unbridled hopefulness of those of us who actually wish
that a connection will be found some day.

John


>A similar notice of this alleged bridge relic appeared on the risa-l list in
>November, so I looked up the various posted views of the area. One of these
>views suggested to me that someeone had tampered with the photo to make it
>look more like a bridge "on" the shoal. Take a good look at the second photo
>on the following website, to see obvious evidence of image-tampering in the
>form of regular sized little strokes that appear to imitate stones:
>http://www.indolink.com/Religion/r091702-130924.php
>
>Joanna Kirkpatrick
>===============================
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "humanidades India" <indologia at LATINMAIL.COM>
>To: <INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk>
>Sent: Wednesday, January 01, 2003 6:53 PM
>Subject: NASA Founds!!!
>
>
>>  :  "harinam108" <harinam108 at y...>
>>  Date:  Mon Oct 7, 2002  4:42 am
>>  Subject:  NASA Images Discover Ancient Bridge between India and SriLanka
>>
>>
>>  ADVERTISEMENT
>>
>>
>>
>>  NASA Images Discover Ancient Bridge between India and SriLanka
>>  (Courtesy : NASA Digital Image Collection)
>>
>>  <http://images.jsc.nasa.gov/iams/images/earth/STS059/lowres/20143034.j
>>  pg>
>>
>>  Space images taken by NASA reveal a mysterious ancient bridge in the
>>  Strait between India and Sri Lanka. The recently discovered bridge
>>  currently named as Adam?s Bridge is made of chain of shoals, c.18 mi
>>  (30 km) long.
>>
>>  The bridge?s unique curvature and composition by age reveals that it
>>  is man made. The legends as well as Archeological studies reveal that
>>  the first signs of human inhabitants in Sri Lanka date back to the a
>>  primitive age, about 17,50,000 years ago and the bridge?s age is also
>>  almost equivalent.
>>
>>  This information is a crucial aspect for an insight into the
>>  mysterious legend called Ramayana, which was supposed to have taken
>>  place in treta yuga (more than 17,00,000 years ago).
>>
>>  In this epic, there is a mentioning about a bridge, which was built
>>  between Rameshwaram (India) and Srilankan coast under the supervision
>>  of a dynamic and invincible figure called Rama who is supposed to be
>>  the incarnation of the supreme.
>>
>>  This information may not be of much importance to the archeologists
>>  who are interested in exploring the origins of man, but it is sure to
>>  open the spiritual gates of the people of the world to have come to
>>  know an ancient history linked to the Indian mythology.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>  _________________________________________________________
>>  http://www.latinmail.com.  Gratuito, latino y en espa?ol.
>>




From witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU  Tue Jan 21 17:26:56 2003
From: witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU (Michael Witzel)
Date: Tue, 21 Jan 03 12:26:56 -0500
Subject: Brahmi MSS discovery in Kathmandu?
Message-ID: <161227072075.23782.771252218910312907.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Yesterday this was reported in the Nepalese press, about the Chabhel Stupa,
east of KTM proper just before reaching Bauddha (Bodhnath).

The Chabel/Carumati stupa is supposed to have been built by Asoka's
daughter Carumati:

see pict. today at :  http://www.nepalnews.com.np/  and check for text,
under "OTHER HEADLINES"

----------------------------------
"          Charumati stupa renovation

                                Chabahil locals have formed a committee to
restore the crumbling Charumati Stupa, which had developed cracks because of
                                heavy vehicular traffic on the nearby road.

                                The fourth-century stupa has relics dating
from the Lichhavi period .....
....
                                Priceless ancient artefacts, coins, and
manuscripts have been found during the renovation work, and archaeologists
say more
                                could be found if the whole stupa could
have been rebuilt. It has also been discovered that Charumati, like the
rest of
                                Kathmandu Valley shrines, have been revered
by both Hindus and Buddhists. Hindu deities like Bishnu and Narayan have
been
                                found among the Buddhist relics.

                                "We are looking at the coins and the
manuscripts, but it will need more study before we can date them with
accuracy," says
                                Prakash Darnal from the Department of
Archaeology who is involved in the renovation work. The manuscripts are
said to be in
                                the ancient Brahmi script. nepalnews.com rh
Jan.20  "
--------------------

However, my friends in Kathmandu tell me:

*archaeologists say that NO manuscripts were found, and only an inscribed
brick was found : "clearly a fake".
Further, a small copper plate inscription that still is under
investigation. No pics yet.

Another false alarm, unfortuately,  just as the one about early Tamil
inscriptions, recently.
Not to speak of other "discoveries"  :-)

Cheers! MW
============================================================
Michael Witzel
Department of Sanskrit & Indian Studies, Harvard University
2 Divinity Avenue, Cambridge MA 02138, USA

ph. 1- 617-496 2990 (also messages)
home page:  http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwpage.htm




From jkirk at SPRO.NET  Tue Jan 21 21:40:11 2003
From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk)
Date: Tue, 21 Jan 03 14:40:11 -0700
Subject: NASA Founds!!!
Message-ID: <161227072077.23782.8294281956350342631.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

photograph, assuming it is un-tampered with, suggests that a
little time in the water with a scuba rig by an experienced
underwater archaeologist. or other form of undersea exploration may
be in order.
==========
Hello John,

Yes i too wondered why in heck scuba divers have not explored this spot as
yet; possibly the currents through there are too strong? It's such an
obvious move.
 Joanna




From a.passi at ALMA.UNIBO.IT  Wed Jan 22 07:27:31 2003
From: a.passi at ALMA.UNIBO.IT (Alex Passi)
Date: Wed, 22 Jan 03 08:27:31 +0100
Subject: NASA Founds!!!
In-Reply-To: <p05111a03ba5326def040@[128.146.41.35]>
Message-ID: <161227072080.23782.14253833913844788511.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

>Dear Indology Colleagues,

Query "Sri Lanka" at
http://images.jsc.nasa.gov/iams/html/pao/searchpao.htm  for Nasa's
interpretation of Adam's Bridge; the photograph refers to another
site, but the explanation is relevant:
"STS-56 Earth observation taken aboard Discovery, Orbiter Vehicle
(OV) 103, is of a sun-glinted ocean along the northeastern coast of
Somalia. The small island of Xaafuun is connected to the mainland by
a well-developed double tombolo-two sand bars. Between the two
tombolos a lagoon is formed which gradually fills with sediment and
becomes a flat sand bar. Better known double tombolos include those
of Gibraltar, the now-partially submerged giant tombolos forming
Adam's Bridge (Palk Strait) connecting Sri Lanka to India, Monte
Argentario in Italy, and Long Island, New York. Such tombolos usually
indicate a constant sediment source and a strong unidirectional or
bi-directional (monsoonal) long shore current. In this case, sediment
is provided by the plumes of the major African rivers debauching into
the Mozambique Channel.
The sediment is carried predominately to the northeast along the
coast by the swiftly moving monsoonal Agulhas Current. Visible in
this scene are internal waves, shear lines and gyres of a variety of
scales. Sunglint photography from the NASA Space Shuttles
particularly allows scientists to study ocean circulation features in
greater detail than is possible from any other data source since
Seasat is no longer operational. "

Nope, no monkey-business there...

Alex Passi
--




--


---------------------------------------------------
Alex (Alessandro) Passi,
Dept. of Linguistic and Oriental Studies, Via Zamboni 16, 40126 Bologna, Italy.
ph. +39-051-233133 - fax +39-051-235298
cell +39-338-269.4933.
----------------------------------------------------




From huntington.2 at OSU.EDU  Thu Jan 23 16:46:42 2003
From: huntington.2 at OSU.EDU (John Huntington)
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 03 11:46:42 -0500
Subject: The Brahmi inscription at Dhando Chaitya.
In-Reply-To: <v04011704ba532ddc8fe1@[10.0.1.50]>
Message-ID: <161227072087.23782.16749998414514349586.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Indology Members:

Having just returned from Kathmandu where I was able to visit the
Dhando chaitya and Chabahi restorations several times, I can perhaps
shed some more light on the matter. First of all the brick is an
approximately 12th century brick with a Bhujimo lipi inscription also
on the the same surface as the as the Brahmi inscription. It was
excavated under controlled conditions under the direct oversight a
well established excavator from the Department of Archaeology, Prasad
xx (I am writing this without my notes).  My friend and colleague,
the epigraphist, Kashinath Tamot, was called immediately and both he
and I have examined the brick under all kinds of light and had a
magnification of the inscription electronically up to about 10x.  The
inscriptions are eactly what they should be for the period, carved
(some may prefer "heavily scratched") into the surface of the fired
brick with a great deal of attention to the drawing of the Brahmi
characters and much less to the Bhujimo. The Bhujimo inscription
provides a confirmation of the date suggested by the measurements.
The care with which the Brahmi inscription was carved, leads one to
think that whoever did it was making sure to get it right.

There are two important points, here.

One, it is from a controlled excavation with virtually no chance of faking.

  Two, the brick is not a Mauryan brick with a Brahmi inscription, but
a twelfth century copy of a Brahmi inscription.

I hasten to add that I know of no other example of such a "copied
ancient inscription," However, Newar Buddhist archaeology is in its
infancy and, since most of the ancient sites are still in active
worship, it is probable that the state of knowledge about Newar
conventions of re-structuring monuments will be a very long time
being developed.

There has been a plethora of material come out of the stupa, sacchas,
coins and the like.

After the publication of the excavation, we will be putting it on our
website. and Kashinath may be putting it up on his soon.
http://www.nepalmandal.com/

If you would like a photograph of the inscription, please request
permission to receive it from Kashinath,  at his son's address,
Yalamber Tamot <ytamot at nepalmandal.com>, and Kashinath or Yalambar
will inform me directly that you have received permission to receive
it.

Cheers

John




From Martin.Gansten at TEOL.LU.SE  Thu Jan 23 12:52:37 2003
From: Martin.Gansten at TEOL.LU.SE (Martin Gansten)
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 03 13:52:37 +0100
Subject: Iconographical help requested
Message-ID: <161227072082.23782.17593412225738023160.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

A friend just asked me to identify the subject of a small sculpture which
he recently came across at an antique dealer's, and estimated to be about
200 years old. Being unable to help, I refer the question to this list.

The sculpture in question (painted marble) depicts a male figure, sporting
a thin moustache, with four arms and Vaishnava markings, seated sideways in
lotus position on a horse-drawn cart. His four hands hold various objects,
one being an akshara-mala and another (probably) a flaming cakra. The two
remaining objects are more difficult to identify, though one may possibly
be a book -- always assuming it is not the piece of cheese which, to my
friend's eyes, it most resembled...

Any suggestions welcome.

Thanks,
Martin Gansten




From vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET  Thu Jan 23 14:34:35 2003
From: vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET (Valerie J Roebuck)
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 03 14:34:35 +0000
Subject: Iconographical help requested
In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20030123135237.008f6330@pop.lu.se>
Message-ID: <161227072084.23782.5718609630639529322.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

At a wild guess, without seeing an illustration, this sounds like a
form of Suurya--especially if there are 7 horses, or one horse with 7
heads.

Valerie J Roebuck
Manchester, UK

>A friend just asked me to identify the subject of a small sculpture which
>he recently came across at an antique dealer's, and estimated to be about
>200 years old. Being unable to help, I refer the question to this list.
>
>The sculpture in question (painted marble) depicts a male figure, sporting
>a thin moustache, with four arms and Vaishnava markings, seated sideways in
>lotus position on a horse-drawn cart. His four hands hold various objects,
>one being an akshara-mala and another (probably) a flaming cakra. The two
>remaining objects are more difficult to identify, though one may possibly
>be a book -- always assuming it is not the piece of cheese which, to my
>friend's eyes, it most resembled...
>
>Any suggestions welcome.
>
>Thanks,
>Martin Gansten




From dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG  Thu Jan 23 20:25:39 2003
From: dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG (dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG)
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 03 15:25:39 -0500
Subject: Rgveda from Magadha?
Message-ID: <161227072089.23782.24177128916681063.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Deshpande says:

-".ZAkalya was only one of the editors of the Rgveda, and that his recension
represents only one of several. We know that ZAkalya based his recension in
part on the earlier recension of MANDUkeya which was prevalent in the
northeastern region of Magadha, while the original Rgvedic hymns were
composed in the northwestern region."

Deshpande, Madhav M. 1995Vedic Aryans, non-Vedic Aryans, and non-Aryans:
Judging the linguistic evidence of the Veda. In George Erdosy (Ed.), The
Indo-Aryans of Ancient South Asia: Language, Material Culture and Ethnicity
(pp. 67-84). New Delhi: Munshiram Manoharlal Publishers Pvt. Ltd.

Why is it thought that there is a Magadha source for ZAkalya?

Dean Anderson




From mmdesh at UMICH.EDU  Thu Jan 23 22:06:22 2003
From: mmdesh at UMICH.EDU (Madhav Deshpande)
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 03 17:06:22 -0500
Subject: Rgveda from Magadha?
Message-ID: <161227072092.23782.7274195308867592711.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I have discussed in some detail the connection of the ZAkalya RV to the MANDUkeya tradition in my article "Genesis of the RV Retroflexion" which appeared in the volume Aryan and Non-Aryan in India edited by myself and Peter E. Hook.  This article is also included in my book Sanskrit and Prakrit: Sociolinguistic Issues.  The connection to Magadha is based on a reference in the SAMkhAyana AraNyaka VII.13 (Keith's edn of the Aitareya AraNyaka, p. 309) which says that Madhyama MANDUkeya, the son of PrAtibodhI, was a MagadhavAsI "resident of Magadha.

                                                                                        Madhav Deshpande

> ----------
> From:         dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG
> Reply To:     Indology
> Sent:         Thursday, January 23, 2003 3:25 PM
> To:   INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk
> Subject:           Rgveda from Magadha?
> 
> Deshpande says:
> 
> -".ZAkalya was only one of the editors of the Rgveda, and that his recension
> represents only one of several. We know that ZAkalya based his recension in
> part on the earlier recension of MANDUkeya which was prevalent in the
> northeastern region of Magadha, while the original Rgvedic hymns were
> composed in the northwestern region."
> 
> Deshpande, Madhav M. 1995Vedic Aryans, non-Vedic Aryans, and non-Aryans:
> Judging the linguistic evidence of the Veda. In George Erdosy (Ed.), The
> Indo-Aryans of Ancient South Asia: Language, Material Culture and Ethnicity
> (pp. 67-84). New Delhi: Munshiram Manoharlal Publishers Pvt. Ltd.
> 
> Why is it thought that there is a Magadha source for ZAkalya?
> 
> Dean Anderson
> 
> 




From dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG  Fri Jan 24 00:58:40 2003
From: dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG (dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG)
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 03 19:58:40 -0500
Subject: Rgveda from Magadha?
Message-ID: <161227072094.23782.15555312643015423561.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Thank you. I have the book on my shelf, but haven't read it yet. I'll pull
it down now.

Dean Anderson

----- Original Message -----
From: "Madhav Deshpande" <mmdesh at UMICH.EDU>
To: <INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk>
Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 5:06 PM
Subject: Re: Rgveda from Magadha?


I have discussed in some detail the connection of the ZAkalya RV to the
MANDUkeya tradition in my article "Genesis of the RV Retroflexion" which
appeared in the volume Aryan and Non-Aryan in India edited by myself and
Peter E. Hook.  This article is also included in my book Sanskrit and
Prakrit: Sociolinguistic Issues.  The connection to Magadha is based on a
reference in the SAMkhAyana AraNyaka VII.13 (Keith's edn of the Aitareya
AraNyaka, p. 309) which says that Madhyama MANDUkeya, the son of PrAtibodhI,
was a MagadhavAsI "resident of Magadha.


Madhav Deshpande

> ----------
> From:         dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG
> Reply To:     Indology
> Sent:         Thursday, January 23, 2003 3:25 PM
> To:   INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk
> Subject:           Rgveda from Magadha?
>
> Deshpande says:
>
> -".ZAkalya was only one of the editors of the Rgveda, and that his
recension
> represents only one of several. We know that ZAkalya based his recension
in
> part on the earlier recension of MANDUkeya which was prevalent in the
> northeastern region of Magadha, while the original Rgvedic hymns were
> composed in the northwestern region."
>
> Deshpande, Madhav M. 1995Vedic Aryans, non-Vedic Aryans, and non-Aryans:
> Judging the linguistic evidence of the Veda. In George Erdosy (Ed.), The
> Indo-Aryans of Ancient South Asia: Language, Material Culture and
Ethnicity
> (pp. 67-84). New Delhi: Munshiram Manoharlal Publishers Pvt. Ltd.
>
> Why is it thought that there is a Magadha source for ZAkalya?
>
> Dean Anderson
>
>




From witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU  Fri Jan 24 04:38:20 2003
From: witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU (Michael Witzel)
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 03 23:38:20 -0500
Subject: Rgveda from Magadha, Canon and bandhu-s
Message-ID: <161227072097.23782.15248198248860411557.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

It may be obvious, but just to underline:

the RV is of course from Greater Panjab (as Madhav also said earlier),
but the "final" redaction was made only in the late Vedic period, by
S'aakalya, in N. Bihar.

Dean Anderson:
>> Why is it thought that there is a Magadha source for ZAkalya?

More arguments for the whole process of canon formation in the east (N.
Bihar) in my paper:

66. ---, The Development of the Vedic Canon and its Schools: The Social and
Political Milieu. (Materials on Vedic ??kh?s 8).
In: Inside the Texts, Beyond the Texts. New Approaches to the Study of the
Vedas. Harvard Oriental Series. Opera Minora, vol. 2. Cambridge 1997,
257-345
see:

see http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwbib.htm
no. 66,    with pdf.
details in chapter 6.2 p. 322 ff.

And cf. same website,  no.  41 (1989) on some gramm. features in S'aakalya,
i.e. where he differs from his forebears in  E. Panjab, the S'akala, (found
in the *early* part of Aitareya Br.)

For the late Vedic move of (some) Aitareyins (and AitBr in general)
eastwards into Bihar,
see same website no.  37. (1987)and no. 66.


NB: Steve Farmer and I have been kicking back and forth (between the two of
us)  some ideas about canon formation, the role of Gandhara , Panini,
Bihar  etc., and we hope to get out a major article on this topic later
this year - as always, time permitting.

----
----

Incidentally, since we indulging here in  giving references, -- eh, placing
plugs, here another one: which both of us (and others) regard as
fundamental for an understanding of the bandhu, homologies,
"identifications", better: "correlations" of the middle and late Vedic
period in India (but also in similar texts of early  China, medieval
Europe, Meso-America etc.;)  see:

http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/BMFEAfinal.pdf

88. S. Farmer, J.B. Henderson, M.Witzel. Neurobiology, Layered Texts, and
Correlative Cosmologies: A Cross-Cultural Framework for Premodern History.
Bulletin of the Museum of Far Eastern Antiquities (BMFEA) 72, 2002, 48-90
*pdf

88a. S.Farmer, J.B. Henderson, M.Witzel , P.Robinson. Computer Models of
the Evolution of Premodern Religious, Philosophical and Cosmological
Systems.-- Companion piece to No. 88, ON THE NET ONLY:
http://www.safarmer.com/simulations.pdf


cheers,  mw

==============



>Thank you. I have the book on my shelf, but haven't read it yet. I'll pull
>it down now.
>
>Dean Anderson
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Madhav Deshpande" <mmdesh at UMICH.EDU>
>To: <INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk>
>Sent: Thursday, January 23, 2003 5:06 PM
>Subject: Re: Rgveda from Magadha?
>
>
>I have discussed in some detail the connection of the ZAkalya RV to the
>MANDUkeya tradition in my article "Genesis of the RV Retroflexion" which
>appeared in the volume Aryan and Non-Aryan in India edited by myself and
>Peter E. Hook.  This article is also included in my book Sanskrit and
>Prakrit: Sociolinguistic Issues.  The connection to Magadha is based on a
>reference in the SAMkhAyana AraNyaka VII.13 (Keith's edn of the Aitareya
>AraNyaka, p. 309) which says that Madhyama MANDUkeya, the son of PrAtibodhI,
>was a MagadhavAsI "resident of Magadha.
>
>
>Madhav Deshpande
>
>> ----------
>> From:         dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG
>> Reply To:     Indology
>> Sent:         Thursday, January 23, 2003 3:25 PM
>> To:   INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk
>> Subject:           Rgveda from Magadha?
>>
>> Deshpande says:
>>
>> -".ZAkalya was only one of the editors of the Rgveda, and that his
>recension
>> represents only one of several. We know that ZAkalya based his recension
>in
>> part on the earlier recension of MANDUkeya which was prevalent in the
>> northeastern region of Magadha, while the original Rgvedic hymns were
>> composed in the northwestern region."
>>
>> Deshpande, Madhav M. 1995Vedic Aryans, non-Vedic Aryans, and non-Aryans:
>> Judging the linguistic evidence of the Veda. In George Erdosy (Ed.), The
>> Indo-Aryans of Ancient South Asia: Language, Material Culture and
>Ethnicity
>> (pp. 67-84). New Delhi: Munshiram Manoharlal Publishers Pvt. Ltd.
>>
>> Why is it thought that there is a Magadha source for ZAkalya?
>>
>> Dean Anderson
>>
>>

============================================================
Michael Witzel
Department of Sanskrit & Indian Studies, Harvard University
2 Divinity Avenue, Cambridge MA 02138, USA

ph. 1- 617-496 2990 (also messages)
home page:  http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwpage.htm




From Scharf at BROWN.EDU  Fri Jan 24 21:10:38 2003
From: Scharf at BROWN.EDU (Peter M. Scharf)
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 03 16:10:38 -0500
Subject: OUP India
In-Reply-To: <Pine.GSO.4.21.0301161133000.11554-100000@harper.uchicago.edu>
Message-ID: <161227072102.23782.10491052061844659364.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Ulrich Stiehl requested that the following message be posted to the
Indology list:
------------------------------------------------------
Indologists interested in Unicode and OpenType fonts
are informed that an innovative Hybrid Open Type font
is available by Ulrich Stiehl as of 19th January 2003.

All technical details of this new font are described
in the comprehensive 36-page manual downloadable as

http://home.t-online.de/home/ulrich.stiehl/pahotman.pdf
-------------------------------------------------------




From rbm49 at EXT.CANTERBURY.AC.NZ  Fri Jan 24 18:43:05 2003
From: rbm49 at EXT.CANTERBURY.AC.NZ (Richard Mahoney)
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 03 07:43:05 +1300
Subject: HTML version of Monier-Williams Lexicon Available
Message-ID: <161227072099.23782.12732594853980530714.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear INDOLOGY colleagues,

[I apologise to H-Buddhism colleagues for cross posting]

An HTML version of the Monier-Williams Sanskrit-English Lexicon has
been released.

The lexicon can be accessed at:

 http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney/mw_dict/mw_dict.html

A compressed archive of the whole lexicon is available at:

 http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney/mw_dict/mw_dict_all_current.tar.gz

A README with installation instructions is available at:

 http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney/mw_dict/README


I would like to thank those who have made this possible.


Regards,

 Richard Mahoney


N.B. The files provided are strictly for scholarly reference. Any
commercial use is explicitly excluded. The copyright remains with the
University of Cologne.


--
Richard Mahoney    |  E-mail: rbm49 at ext.canterbury.ac.nz
78 Jeffreys Road   |          r.mahoney at comnet.net.nz
Fendalton          |  Telephone: 0064-3-351-5831
CHRISTCHURCH 8005  |  Cellular: 0064-25-829-986
NEW ZEALAND        |  http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney




From witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU  Sat Jan 25 16:11:37 2003
From: witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU (Michael Witzel)
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 03 11:11:37 -0500
Subject: www.newbeads.com
In-Reply-To: <BA5874C0.4579%A.Griffiths@let.leidenuniv.nl>
Message-ID: <161227072110.23782.12416914955302574327.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Thanks, Arlo,

by way of Pratidaanam, some may also find several items here very useful:

http://www.yorku.ca/inpar/

i.e the Inca report (for my mythology class), if you forget all the 'pious'
Christian trappings at the beginning, or those from other reagions;
--      not to speak of Bhasa, Harsha, Kalidasa.
and all sorts of flashcards for beginners.
==================================

>Some may find something of interest on www.newbeads.com, where i.a.
>electronic texts of "Vijayanagar: A Forgotten Empire" and "Alberuni's India"
>are available.
>
>-- Arlo Griffiths
>
>CNWS / Instituut Kern
>Universiteit Leiden
>Postbus 9515
>2300 RA  Leiden
>the Netherlands
>
>tel.: +31-71-5274128

============================================================
Michael Witzel
Department of Sanskrit & Indian Studies, Harvard University
2 Divinity Avenue, Cambridge MA 02138, USA

ph. 1- 617-496 2990 (also messages)
home page:  http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwpage.htm




From lmfosse at ONLINE.NO  Sat Jan 25 15:34:43 2003
From: lmfosse at ONLINE.NO (Lars Martin Fosse)
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 03 16:34:43 +0100
Subject: SV: HTML version of Monier-Williams Lexicon Available
In-Reply-To: <20030124184305.GB218@ext.canterbury.ac.nz>
Message-ID: <161227072107.23782.16312176551016705671.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Richard,

Thank you for this nice initiative. I have tried to download your files,
but I have a problem: when I try to save them on my harddisk (I have a
Windows XP system), capital and small letters are treated in the same
way, which means that I only get e.g. a.html (small a) but not the file
named with a capital A. In this way, a few files disappear for me. Any
suggestions?

Lars Martin Fosse

> -----Opprinnelig melding-----
> Fra: Indology [mailto:INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk] P? vegne av 
> Richard Mahoney
> Sendt: 24. januar 2003 19:43
> Til: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk
> Emne: HTML version of Monier-Williams Lexicon Available
> 
> 
> Dear INDOLOGY colleagues,
> 
> [I apologise to H-Buddhism colleagues for cross posting]
> 
> An HTML version of the Monier-Williams Sanskrit-English 
> Lexicon has been released.
> 
> The lexicon can be accessed at:
> 
 http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney/mw_dict/mw_dict.html

A compressed archive of the whole lexicon is available at:

 
http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney/mw_dict/mw_dict_all_current.tar
.gz

A README with installation instructions is available at:

 http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney/mw_dict/README


I would like to thank those who have made this possible.


Regards,

 Richard Mahoney


N.B. The files provided are strictly for scholarly reference. Any
commercial use is explicitly excluded. The copyright remains with the
University of Cologne.


--
Richard Mahoney    |  E-mail: rbm49 at ext.canterbury.ac.nz
78 Jeffreys Road   |          r.mahoney at comnet.net.nz
Fendalton          |  Telephone: 0064-3-351-5831
CHRISTCHURCH 8005  |  Cellular: 0064-25-829-986
NEW ZEALAND        |  http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney




From A.Griffiths at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL  Sat Jan 25 15:07:12 2003
From: A.Griffiths at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL (Arlo Griffiths)
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 03 17:07:12 +0200
Subject: www.newbeads.com
Message-ID: <161227072105.23782.968147824805186744.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Some may find something of interest on www.newbeads.com, where i.a.
electronic texts of "Vijayanagar: A Forgotten Empire" and "Alberuni's India"
are available.

-- Arlo Griffiths

CNWS / Instituut Kern
Universiteit Leiden
Postbus 9515
2300 RA  Leiden
the Netherlands

tel.: +31-71-5274128




From rbm49 at EXT.CANTERBURY.AC.NZ  Sat Jan 25 17:20:44 2003
From: rbm49 at EXT.CANTERBURY.AC.NZ (Richard Mahoney)
Date: Sun, 26 Jan 03 06:20:44 +1300
Subject: HTML version of Monier-Williams Lexicon Available
In-Reply-To: <000001c2c487$4b8b61d0$ec814382@Winston>
Message-ID: <161227072112.23782.1353318808282023821.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Lars

On Sat, Jan 25, 2003 at 04:34:43PM +0100, Lars Martin Fosse wrote:

> Thank you for this nice initiative. I have tried to download your
> files, but I have a problem: when I try to save them on my harddisk
> (I have a Windows XP system), capital and small letters are treated
> in the same way, which means that I only get e.g. a.html (small a)
> but not the file named with a capital A. In this way, a few files
> disappear for me. Any suggestions?

I apologise to other MS Windows users who have had this
problem. Windows file names -- unlike UNIX file names -- must be case
insensitive.

I will alter the file names to something approximating the Velthuis
scheme: that is, `A' to `aa', `I' to `ii' and so on. When this is done
I will notify the list.

Regards,

 Richard Mahoney


--
Richard Mahoney    |  E-mail: rbm49 at ext.canterbury.ac.nz
78 Jeffreys Road   |          r.mahoney at comnet.net.nz
Fendalton          |  Telephone: 0064-3-351-5831
CHRISTCHURCH 8005  |  Cellular: 0064-25-829-986
NEW ZEALAND        |  http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney




From rbm49 at EXT.CANTERBURY.AC.NZ  Sat Jan 25 23:49:10 2003
From: rbm49 at EXT.CANTERBURY.AC.NZ (Richard Mahoney)
Date: Sun, 26 Jan 03 12:49:10 +1300
Subject: HTML version of Monier-Williams Lexicon Available
In-Reply-To: <20030125172044.GA88210@ext.canterbury.ac.nz>
Message-ID: <161227072115.23782.3200660143175518486.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On Sun, Jan 26, 2003 at 06:20:44AM +1300, Richard Mahoney wrote:

> On Sat, Jan 25, 2003 at 04:34:43PM +0100, Lars Martin Fosse wrote:

> > Thank you for this nice initiative. I have tried to download your
> > files, but I have a problem: when I try to save them on my harddisk
> > (I have a Windows XP system), capital and small letters are treated
> > in the same way, which means that I only get e.g. a.html (small a)
> > but not the file named with a capital A. In this way, a few files
> > disappear for me. Any suggestions?
>
> I apologise to other MS Windows users who have had this
> problem. Windows file names -- unlike UNIX file names -- must be case
> insensitive.
>
> I will alter the file names to something approximating the Velthuis
> scheme: that is, `A' to `aa', `I' to `ii' and so on. When this is done
> I will notify the list.

Done.

The links and filenames at:

 http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney/mw_dict/mw_dict.html

and in the archive at:

 http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney/mw_dict/mw_dict_all_current.tar.gz

have been updated.

I've tested the site and archive under MS W2K and everything seems in
order. I don't have access to a Mac so can't comment on that count. If
anyone has any other issues please mail me (off list?) and I'll make
the necessary changes.


Regards,

 Richard Mahoney


--
Richard Mahoney    |  E-mail: rbm49 at ext.canterbury.ac.nz
78 Jeffreys Road   |          r.mahoney at comnet.net.nz
Fendalton          |  Telephone: 0064-3-351-5831
CHRISTCHURCH 8005  |  Cellular: 0064-25-829-986
NEW ZEALAND        |  http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney




From karp at MERCURY.CI.UW.EDU.PL  Sun Jan 26 12:35:31 2003
From: karp at MERCURY.CI.UW.EDU.PL (Artur Karp)
Date: Sun, 26 Jan 03 13:35:31 +0100
Subject: HTML version of Monier-Williams Lexicon Available
In-Reply-To: <20030125234910.GA262@ext.canterbury.ac.nz>
Message-ID: <161227072118.23782.14988616161138880260.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Richard,

Great thanks to you and the rest of the team involved in this project.

I now have the MW on my hard disk. It works very fast with Examine32.

Examine32 is a fast and versatile text search utility for Microsoft Windows
95/98/ME/NT/2000/XP with the following features:

It can search both text and binary files. File formats supported are text
files with Windows, Macintosh or UNIX line endings, Microsoft Word files,
Rich Text Format (RTF), HTML (web pages), WordPerfect and Write files. All
other formats are treated as binary files.

Examine32 can also search for text in files stored in ZIP archives. Any
type of stored file can be searched with the file formats above being
supported.

And a lot of other useful features.

The program needed 20 secs to find all the occurences of the word
"obstacle" in MW (58 matches in 12 files).

Examine32 can be had from:

http://www.examine32.com


With highest regards,

Artur Karp

University of Warsaw

Poland








>On Sun, Jan 26, 2003 at 06:20:44AM +1300, Richard Mahoney wrote:
>
> > On Sat, Jan 25, 2003 at 04:34:43PM +0100, Lars Martin Fosse wrote:
>
> > > Thank you for this nice initiative. I have tried to download your
> > > files, but I have a problem: when I try to save them on my harddisk
> > > (I have a Windows XP system), capital and small letters are treated
> > > in the same way, which means that I only get e.g. a.html (small a)
> > > but not the file named with a capital A. In this way, a few files
> > > disappear for me. Any suggestions?
> >
> > I apologise to other MS Windows users who have had this
> > problem. Windows file names -- unlike UNIX file names -- must be case
> > insensitive.
> >
> > I will alter the file names to something approximating the Velthuis
> > scheme: that is, `A' to `aa', `I' to `ii' and so on. When this is done
> > I will notify the list.
>
>Done.
>
>The links and filenames at:
>
>  http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney/mw_dict/mw_dict.html
>
>and in the archive at:
>
>  http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney/mw_dict/mw_dict_all_current.tar.gz
>
>have been updated.
>
>I've tested the site and archive under MS W2K and everything seems in
>order. I don't have access to a Mac so can't comment on that count. If
>anyone has any other issues please mail me (off list?) and I'll make
>the necessary changes.
>
>
>Regards,
>
>  Richard Mahoney
>
>
>--
>Richard Mahoney    |  E-mail: rbm49 at ext.canterbury.ac.nz
>78 Jeffreys Road   |          r.mahoney at comnet.net.nz
>Fendalton          |  Telephone: 0064-3-351-5831
>CHRISTCHURCH 8005  |  Cellular: 0064-25-829-986
>NEW ZEALAND        |  http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney
>
>
>---
>Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
>Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
>Version: 6.0.435 / Virus Database: 244 - Release Date: 2002-12-30


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.435 / Virus Database: 244 - Release Date: 2002-12-30




From Martin.Gansten at TEOL.LU.SE  Mon Jan 27 15:38:12 2003
From: Martin.Gansten at TEOL.LU.SE (Martin Gansten)
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 03 16:38:12 +0100
Subject: Iconographical help requested
In-Reply-To: <a05100301ba55ad7b392a@[80.40.36.57]>
Message-ID: <161227072123.23782.15421931585170421867.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Thanks, Valerie. I hear no dissenting voices, so I'll settle for the Surya
hypothesis -- at least until I've seen it myself.

Martin




From ttak at L.U-TOKYO.AC.JP  Mon Jan 27 08:34:51 2003
From: ttak at L.U-TOKYO.AC.JP (Takanobu Takahashi)
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 03 17:34:51 +0900
Subject: Fw: Obituary
Message-ID: <161227072120.23782.3695717107994602296.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Forwarded by Takanobu Takahashi <ttak at l.u-tokyo.ac.jp>
---------------- Original message follows ----------------
 From: Takanobu Takahashi <ttak at l.u-tokyo.ac.jp>
 To: ttak at l.u-tokyo.ac.jp
 Date: Mon, 27 Jan 2003 17:33:37 +0900
 Subject: Obituary
--

Herewith I send sad news.

My colleague, Professor Katsuhiko Kamimura died on 24 January at the age
of fifty-eight.
He had developed a cancer of the prostate. The operation was successful.
But his mental state became worse and worse and he was determined to die.
In these fifteen years he has been translating the Mahabharata into
Japanese. The translation of the first Adi Parvan was published in January
2002 and in October 2002 the sixth Bhisma Parvan was published.
Thus the activity of the translation of the Mahabharata was again
interrupted by a sudden death of the translator.
The funeral service will take place at Denbouin in Sensouji temple on 30
January from 12:00 to 14:00.

 Prof. Shingo Einoo
 Institute of Oriental Culture
 University of Tokyo
 Phone +3 5841 5867
 e-mail: seino at ioc.u-tokyo.ac.jp




From huntington.2 at OSU.EDU  Tue Jan 28 00:10:39 2003
From: huntington.2 at OSU.EDU (John Huntington)
Date: Mon, 27 Jan 03 19:10:39 -0500
Subject: Fwd: indology list
Message-ID: <161227072125.23782.2040544006959890596.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

>Delivered-To: orb-huntington.2 at osu.edu
>Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 08:24:55 +1100
>From: mccomas <mccomas at cres.anu.edu.au>
>Subject: indology list
>X-Sender: mccomas at cres.anu.edu.au
>To: huntington.2 at osu.edu
>X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-milter (http://amavis.org/)
>
>
>>
>>
>>Dear John
>>
>>Are you handling the indology list these days? If not could you
>>please forward this to the relevant person?
>>
>>Please change my email address from
>>
>>mccomas at cres.anu.edu.au  (or possibly mccomas at cres20.anu.edu.au)
>>
>>to
>>
>>mccomas.taylor at anu.edu.au
>>
>>Many thanks - I really find the list very stimulating. It's nice to
>>know one is not alone!
>>
>>Yours
>>
>>McComas




From s.hodge at PADMACHOLING.FREESERVE.CO.UK  Tue Jan 28 01:10:35 2003
From: s.hodge at PADMACHOLING.FREESERVE.CO.UK (Stephen Hodge)
Date: Tue, 28 Jan 03 01:10:35 +0000
Subject: HTML version of Monier-Williams Lexicon Available
Message-ID: <161227072127.23782.6127146374279000586.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Richard,

Thanks for making the Monier-Williams Lexicon as well as other texts
available to us. I look forward to any further texts you may generously
choose to share with others.  However, just one small point -- you have a
Read Me file giving instructions about unpacking the archive.  However since
it is included in the archive itself, it seems rather superfluous because,
by the time you get access to it, you have already unzipped the files.  It
would have helped me if I had been able to read it first.




From wedemeyer at HUM.KU.DK  Wed Jan 29 12:30:18 2003
From: wedemeyer at HUM.KU.DK (Christian K. Wedemeyer)
Date: Wed, 29 Jan 03 13:30:18 +0100
Subject: Job available: Hindi/Urdu Lecturer
Message-ID: <161227072130.23782.1361598939422815966.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

The Department of Asian Studies, Cornell University, is looking for
someone to fill the position described below.  (All inquiries
concerning this position should be sent to the address below, and not
to me.  Thanks!)

>
>  > Hindi/Urdu Lecturer
>>
>>  The Department of Asian Studies at Cornell University  invites
>>  applications for a full-time lecturer or senior lecturer to teach
>>  beginning, intermediate and advance language courses in Hindi/Urdu.
>>  Level of appointment based on education and experience. Renewable
>>  non-tenure-track appointment. Initial contract for a one-year
>  > probationary period, after which the successful candidate will be
>>  reviewed for a non-probationary 3- or 5-year renewable contract.
>>
>>  Minimum qualifications: Masters degree or equivalent in Hindi-Urdu
>>  language/literature/culture, a very high level of proficiency in
>>  Hindi/Urdu and English, significant language teaching experience,
>>  familiarity with the latest teaching methodologies, including
>>  technology related pedagogy.
>>
>>  Salary competitive. Position begins July 1, 2003. The committee will
>>  begin reviewing applications by February 28, 2003. Send letter of
>>  application, curriculum vita, and three letters of recommendation to:
>>
>>        Christopher Minkowski
>>        Chair, Hindi/Urdu Search Committee
>>        Department of Asian Studies
>>        Cornell University
>>        350 Rockefeller Hall
>>        Ithaca, NY 14853
>>        e-mail: asian at cornell.edu
>>
>  > Cornell is an Equal Opportunity Employer.




From utkragh at HUM.KU.DK  Wed Jan 29 18:23:51 2003
From: utkragh at HUM.KU.DK (Ulrich T. Kragh)
Date: Wed, 29 Jan 03 19:23:51 +0100
Subject: Internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel
Message-ID: <161227072133.23782.16622676982777689630.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Query regarding internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel:
In my text-critical work on chapter 17 of CandrakIrti's PrasannapadA, I need
to make a decision on whether to adopt the spelling visabhAgAnAM or
viSabhAgAnAM in the phrase "visabhAgAnAM sabhAgAnAM ca karmaNAM" ("...of
dissimilar and similar actions").

My five manuscripts (which all are from Nepal) consistently use the form
visabhAgAnAM (here and in the following passage of the text), that is
without the retroflex sibilant after the i-vowel. In the edition of the text
published by La Vall?e Poussin, the form viSabhAgAnAm has been
adopted/emended, which also seems to be in accordance with the internal
sandhi-rules for the dental sibilant after the i-vowel (cf. e.g. Whitney's
grammar ?180 and ?185a). Nevertheless, in his text-critical notes to the
text, de Jong adopts the spelling visabhAgAnAm, i.e. retains the dental
sibilant after the i-vowel, with a reference to the Japanese translation of
the text by Wogihara, which is a source I unfortunately do not have access
to at the present.

Would someone please care to clarify which sibilant ought to be used in this
case according to the rules?

Sincerely,
Ulrich T. Kragh
University of Copenhagen




From chlodwig.h.werba at UNIVIE.AC.AT  Wed Jan 29 19:18:48 2003
From: chlodwig.h.werba at UNIVIE.AC.AT (srutavega)
Date: Wed, 29 Jan 03 20:18:48 +0100
Subject: AW: Internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel
In-Reply-To: <001001c2c7c3$9577c600$3315a150@opasia.dk>
Message-ID: <161227072135.23782.15360198649627518052.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

> -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Indology [mailto:INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk]Im Auftrag von Ulrich T.
> Kragh
> Gesendet am: Mittwoch, 29. Januar 2003 19.24
> An: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk
> Betreff: Internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel
>
> Query regarding internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel:
> In my text-critical work on chapter 17 of CandrakIrti's
> PrasannapadA, I need
> to make a decision on whether to adopt the spelling visabhAgAnAM or
> viSabhAgAnAM in the phrase "visabhAgAnAM sabhAgAnAM ca karmaNAM" ("...of
> dissimilar and similar actions").
>
> My five manuscripts (which all are from Nepal) consistently use the form
> visabhAgAnAM (here and in the following passage of the text), that is
> without the retroflex sibilant after the i-vowel. In the edition
> of the text
> published by La Vall?e Poussin, the form viSabhAgAnAm has been
> adopted/emended, which also seems to be in accordance with the internal
> sandhi-rules for the dental sibilant after the i-vowel (cf. e.g. Whitney's
> grammar ?180 and ?185a). Nevertheless, in his text-critical notes to the
> text, de Jong adopts the spelling visabhAgAnAm, i.e. retains the dental
> sibilant after the i-vowel, with a reference to the Japanese
> translation of
> the text by Wogihara, which is a source I unfortunately do not have access
> to at the present.
>
> Would someone please care to clarify which sibilant ought to be
> used in this
> case according to the rules?
>
> Sincerely,
> Ulrich T. Kragh
> University of Copenhagen


Dear colleague,
Your MSS are right, please, follow their reading!
Wishing You all the best for Your work on PP XVII
Yours sincerely
Chlodwig H. Werba
University of Vienna, ISTB


>




From mkapstei at MIDWAY.UCHICAGO.EDU  Thu Jan 30 09:34:36 2003
From: mkapstei at MIDWAY.UCHICAGO.EDU (Matthew Kapstein)
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 03 03:34:36 -0600
Subject: Internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel
In-Reply-To: <001001c2c7c3$9577c600$3315a150@opasia.dk>
Message-ID: <161227072140.23782.1837458272636001099.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

So far as I can make out, the operative rules, PA.nini VIII.3.55, 57, 59,
specify that the change takes place when the s occurs in an Ades'a or
pratyaya, which is not the case with respect to the initial s of
sabhAga. Hence, the dental should remain. But this with the
caveat that a second opinion from one more specialized in 
vyAkara.na would be useful.
Matthew Kapstein 

On Wed, 29 Jan 2003, Ulrich T. Kragh wrote:

> Query regarding internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel:
> In my text-critical work on chapter 17 of CandrakIrti's PrasannapadA, I need
> to make a decision on whether to adopt the spelling visabhAgAnAM or
> viSabhAgAnAM in the phrase "visabhAgAnAM sabhAgAnAM ca karmaNAM" ("...of
> dissimilar and similar actions").
> 
> My five manuscripts (which all are from Nepal) consistently use the form
> visabhAgAnAM (here and in the following passage of the text), that is
> without the retroflex sibilant after the i-vowel. In the edition of the text
> published by La Vall?e Poussin, the form viSabhAgAnAm has been
> adopted/emended, which also seems to be in accordance with the internal
> sandhi-rules for the dental sibilant after the i-vowel (cf. e.g. Whitney's
> grammar ?180 and ?185a). Nevertheless, in his text-critical notes to the
> text, de Jong adopts the spelling visabhAgAnAm, i.e. retains the dental
> sibilant after the i-vowel, with a reference to the Japanese translation of
> the text by Wogihara, which is a source I unfortunately do not have access
> to at the present.
> 
> Would someone please care to clarify which sibilant ought to be used in this
> case according to the rules?
> 
> Sincerely,
> Ulrich T. Kragh
> University of Copenhagen
> 




From mmdesh at UMICH.EDU  Thu Jan 30 11:28:55 2003
From: mmdesh at UMICH.EDU (Madhav Deshpande)
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 03 06:28:55 -0500
Subject: Internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel
Message-ID: <161227072143.23782.6987162531725708533.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

By Panini's rules, one cannot have viSabhAga.  After upasargas like vi, s can change to S only if it is the initial of certain verb roots, for exampe vi+sIdati>viSIdati.  The element 'sa' in sabhAga does not occur in the same category.  
                                                                                   Madhav Deshpande

	-----Original Message----- 
	From: Matthew Kapstein [mailto:mkapstei at MIDWAY.UCHICAGO.EDU] 
	Sent: Thu 1/30/2003 4:34 AM 
	To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk 
	Cc: 
	Subject: Re: Internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel
	
	

	So far as I can make out, the operative rules, PA.nini VIII.3.55, 57, 59,
	specify that the change takes place when the s occurs in an Ades'a or
	pratyaya, which is not the case with respect to the initial s of
	sabhAga. Hence, the dental should remain. But this with the
	caveat that a second opinion from one more specialized in
	vyAkara.na would be useful.
	Matthew Kapstein
	
	On Wed, 29 Jan 2003, Ulrich T. Kragh wrote:
	
	> Query regarding internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel:
	> In my text-critical work on chapter 17 of CandrakIrti's PrasannapadA, I need
	> to make a decision on whether to adopt the spelling visabhAgAnAM or
	> viSabhAgAnAM in the phrase "visabhAgAnAM sabhAgAnAM ca karmaNAM" ("...of
	> dissimilar and similar actions").
	>
	> My five manuscripts (which all are from Nepal) consistently use the form
	> visabhAgAnAM (here and in the following passage of the text), that is
	> without the retroflex sibilant after the i-vowel. In the edition of the text
	> published by La Vall?e Poussin, the form viSabhAgAnAm has been
	> adopted/emended, which also seems to be in accordance with the internal
	> sandhi-rules for the dental sibilant after the i-vowel (cf. e.g. Whitney's
	> grammar ?180 and ?185a). Nevertheless, in his text-critical notes to the
	> text, de Jong adopts the spelling visabhAgAnAm, i.e. retains the dental
	> sibilant after the i-vowel, with a reference to the Japanese translation of
	> the text by Wogihara, which is a source I unfortunately do not have access
	> to at the present.
	>
	> Would someone please care to clarify which sibilant ought to be used in this
	> case according to the rules?
	>
	> Sincerely,
	> Ulrich T. Kragh
	> University of Copenhagen
	>
	





From tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU  Thu Jan 30 13:12:56 2003
From: tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU (Tenzin Bob Thurman)
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 03 08:12:56 -0500
Subject: Job available: Hindi/Urdu Lecturer
Message-ID: <161227072146.23782.13966351508791721685.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear C,
We're planning to come to Copenhagen to listen to HH in June. Do you
know where it is to be held? What is a good hotel near that place? Etc.
Love to all three.
Bob

Christian K. Wedemeyer wrote:

> The Department of Asian Studies, Cornell University, is looking for
> someone to fill the position described below.  (All inquiries
> concerning this position should be sent to the address below, and not
> to me.  Thanks!)
>
>>
>>  > Hindi/Urdu Lecturer
>>
>>>
>>>  The Department of Asian Studies at Cornell University  invites
>>>  applications for a full-time lecturer or senior lecturer to teach
>>>  beginning, intermediate and advance language courses in Hindi/Urdu.
>>>  Level of appointment based on education and experience. Renewable
>>>  non-tenure-track appointment. Initial contract for a one-year
>>
>>  > probationary period, after which the successful candidate will be
>>
>>>  reviewed for a non-probationary 3- or 5-year renewable contract.
>>>
>>>  Minimum qualifications: Masters degree or equivalent in Hindi-Urdu
>>>  language/literature/culture, a very high level of proficiency in
>>>  Hindi/Urdu and English, significant language teaching experience,
>>>  familiarity with the latest teaching methodologies, including
>>>  technology related pedagogy.
>>>
>>>  Salary competitive. Position begins July 1, 2003. The committee will
>>>  begin reviewing applications by February 28, 2003. Send letter of
>>>  application, curriculum vita, and three letters of recommendation to:
>>>
>>>        Christopher Minkowski
>>>        Chair, Hindi/Urdu Search Committee
>>>        Department of Asian Studies
>>>        Cornell University
>>>        350 Rockefeller Hall
>>>        Ithaca, NY 14853
>>>        e-mail: asian at cornell.edu
>>>
>>  > Cornell is an Equal Opportunity Employer.
>
>




From vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET  Thu Jan 30 08:35:56 2003
From: vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET (Valerie J Roebuck)
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 03 08:35:56 +0000
Subject: AW: Internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel
In-Reply-To: <000501c2c7cb$403e7a00$82b68283@indo.univie.ac.at>
Message-ID: <161227072138.23782.8515563479019899130.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

But such prefixes are not subject to the normal rules of internal
sandhi: they have their own, slightly irregular version.  "Vi-" as a
prefix does not normally cause a following s to become retroflex.
However, I imagine that it is not exactly incorrect to use the
retroflex.  (The grammar books I have to hand are not helpful on this
point.)

Cp. compounds.  Strictly, external sandhi rules should apply, but in
fact we have YudhiSThira, not *Yudhisthira.  Presumably the former
sounded more natural to speakers of the language.

Valerie J Roebuck
Manchester, UK


At 8:18 pm +0100 29/1/03, srutavega wrote:
>  > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
>>  Von: Indology [mailto:INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk]Im Auftrag von Ulrich T.
>>  Kragh
>>  Gesendet am: Mittwoch, 29. Januar 2003 19.24
>>  An: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk
>>  Betreff: Internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel
>>
>>  Query regarding internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel:
>>  In my text-critical work on chapter 17 of CandrakIrti's
>>  PrasannapadA, I need
>>  to make a decision on whether to adopt the spelling visabhAgAnAM or
>>  viSabhAgAnAM in the phrase "visabhAgAnAM sabhAgAnAM ca karmaNAM" ("...of
>>  dissimilar and similar actions").
>>
>>  My five manuscripts (which all are from Nepal) consistently use the form
>>  visabhAgAnAM (here and in the following passage of the text), that is
>>  without the retroflex sibilant after the i-vowel. In the edition
>>  of the text
>>  published by La Vall?e Poussin, the form viSabhAgAnAm has been
>>  adopted/emended, which also seems to be in accordance with the internal
>>  sandhi-rules for the dental sibilant after the i-vowel (cf. e.g. Whitney's
>>  grammar ?180 and ?185a). Nevertheless, in his text-critical notes to the
>>  text, de Jong adopts the spelling visabhAgAnAm, i.e. retains the dental
>>  sibilant after the i-vowel, with a reference to the Japanese
>>  translation of
>>  the text by Wogihara, which is a source I unfortunately do not have access
>>  to at the present.
>>
>>  Would someone please care to clarify which sibilant ought to be
>>  used in this
>>  case according to the rules?
>>
>>  Sincerely,
>>  Ulrich T. Kragh
>>  University of Copenhagen
>
>
>Dear colleague,
>Your MSS are right, please, follow their reading!
>Wishing You all the best for Your work on PP XVII
>Yours sincerely
>Chlodwig H. Werba
>University of Vienna, ISTB
>
>
>>




From rsalomon at U.WASHINGTON.EDU  Thu Jan 30 21:22:54 2003
From: rsalomon at U.WASHINGTON.EDU (Richard Salomon)
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 03 13:22:54 -0800
Subject: New publication
Message-ID: <161227072149.23782.5759799018916387413.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Just published by University of Washington Press: Timothy Lenz, "A New Version of the Gandhari Dharmapada and a Collection of Previous-Birth Stories." This is volume 3 of "Gandharan Buddhist Texts", the publication series of the British Library/University of Washington Early Buddhist Manuscripts Project.

The book can be ordered directly from the order department of the University of Washington Press at uwpord at u.washington.edu.

R. Salomon




From mmdesh at UMICH.EDU  Thu Jan 30 21:50:12 2003
From: mmdesh at UMICH.EDU (Madhav Deshpande)
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 03 16:50:12 -0500
Subject: Accents of Sanskrit, signs of change?
Message-ID: <161227072151.23782.4901551977700083908.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear colleagues,
 
         I am wondering if there are signs of change in the nature of Sanskrit accent in the following way.  Alternations like asti versus santi, and naumi versus nuva.h are linked to shifts of accent from the root to the suffix.  If these sorts of shifts indicate that an unstressed vowel gets contracted, or at worst deleted, can one infer that the accent of Sanskrit in its formative stages was stress accent, rather than pitch accent as it get represented in Vedic traditions?  Would pitch accent cause the same sort of contractions of vowels?  My second question is this.  While the correlation of vowel contractions with accent shifts is visible in verb forms and certain nominal paradigms, why is it that there is no similar effect left in the formation of Sanskrit compounds?  Consider the accent difference between a Tatpuru.sa versus a Bahuvriihi.  There are no vowel alternations similar to naumi versus nuva.h between Tatpuru.sa and Bahuvriihi.  Is it likely that the nature of accent changed from the stage when forms like naumi/nuva.h originated to the stage when compounds emerged?  Some food for thought.
 
                                                                                           Madhav Deshpande

	 





From tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU  Fri Jan 31 04:41:39 2003
From: tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU (Tenzin Bob Thurman)
Date: Thu, 30 Jan 03 23:41:39 -0500
Subject: Job available: Hindi/Urdu Lecturer
Message-ID: <161227072153.23782.7962337269736016551.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear list members,
My apologies for sending a personal communication to C Wedemeyer to the
list by accident.
Best
Bob T




From chlodwig.h.werba at UNIVIE.AC.AT  Fri Jan 31 13:36:29 2003
From: chlodwig.h.werba at UNIVIE.AC.AT (srutavega)
Date: Fri, 31 Jan 03 14:36:29 +0100
Subject: svare
In-Reply-To: <60D386B60521234BB917967801F3A30F29AE3B@lsa-m4.lsa.adsroot.itcs.umich.edu>
Message-ID: <161227072155.23782.15031078425715361263.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

priya vidyaaratna,
tatrabhavadiiyavapra?snadvaye 'nna.m naasti, yata.h:
(1) the regular form of 'Ablaut' You refer to, did neither originate in the
Panjab with the Old IndoAryan speakers, nor with the still older *Harias in
the mountains of Afghanestaan or the steps of the Aral area. It's simply
Indoeuropean heritage, as the same morphonological changes do occur in Old
Greek etc., known since F. Bopps 'Ueber das Conjugationssystem ... in the
early 18oos.
(2) Old IndoAryan or Vedic accent was definitely not a stress accent, but as
we all know it described in the Praati?saakhyas, a tonal one (comparable to
the Chinese tones). That's also the reason why it left absolutely no traces
in the MIA languages.
bhadraa?si.sa aa?saasaana.h saadhayati ?srutavega.h.
(Prof. Chlodwig H. Werba, IndoIranian Studies
Dptm. of South Asian, Tibetan, and Buddhist Studies
University of Vienna).

> -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Indology [mailto:INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk]Im Auftrag von Madhav
> Deshpande
> Gesendet am: Donnerstag, 30. Januar 2003 22.50
> An: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk
> Betreff: Accents of Sanskrit, signs of change?
>
> Dear colleagues,
>
>          I am wondering if there are signs of change in the
> nature of Sanskrit accent in the following way.  Alternations
> like asti versus santi, and naumi versus nuva.h are linked to
> shifts of accent from the root to the suffix.  If these sorts of
> shifts indicate that an unstressed vowel gets contracted, or at
> worst deleted, can one infer that the accent of Sanskrit in its
> formative stages was stress accent, rather than pitch accent as
> it get represented in Vedic traditions?  Would pitch accent cause
> the same sort of contractions of vowels?  My second question is
> this.  While the correlation of vowel contractions with accent
> shifts is visible in verb forms and certain nominal paradigms,
> why is it that there is no similar effect left in the formation
> of Sanskrit compounds?  Consider the accent difference between a
> Tatpuru.sa versus a Bahuvriihi.  There are no vowel alternations
> similar to naumi versus nuva.h between Tatpuru.sa and Bahuvriihi.
>  Is it likely that the nature of accent changed from the stage
> when forms like naumi/nuva.h originated to the stage when
> compounds emerged?  Some food for thought.
>
>
>                          Madhav Deshpande
>
>
>
>




From utkragh at HUM.KU.DK  Fri Jan 31 22:18:14 2003
From: utkragh at HUM.KU.DK (Ulrich T. Kragh)
Date: Fri, 31 Jan 03 23:18:14 +0100
Subject: Internal sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel
Message-ID: <161227072158.23782.5770684904298682033.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Thank you very much to Harunaga Isaacson (off-list), Chlodwig H. Werba,
Valerie J Roebuck, Matthew Kapstein and Madhav Deshpande, who all answered
to my enquiry about sibilant-sandhi after the i-vowel. It was very helpful
for me.

Sincerely,
Ulrich T. Kragh