From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK Sun Feb 2 12:21:25 2003 From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Sun, 02 Feb 03 12:21:25 +0000 Subject: Ramesvaram Setu Message-ID: <161227072160.23782.8438566635245207984.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I thought that the following 1987 article throws the recent setu/satellite photo/history/myth ar discussion into an interesting perspective. Here's the abstract: "The construction of a setu by Rama during his expedition against Ravana in Lanka is a myth. But in all periods of history its narrators have tried to visualize it. Poets have built a picture of it in their mind and they have described it with more or less precise, more or less imaginary details. Each narrator, of course, is influenced by his surroundings and the culture of his time. A popular visualisation of the XXth century treats the setu as a modern bridge, whereas Valmiki's setu is clearly a causeway. The purpose of this article is to present a remarkable interpretation of Valmiki's description by the XVIth century philosopher and poet, Appayya Diksita, against the background of his culture and his religious convictions." Jean Deloche and Pierre-Sylvain Filliozat, "Ramayana's Setu as Seen by Appayya Diksita" ABORI 68 (1987): 457-69. -- Dominik Wujastyk From christoph.emmrich at URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE Mon Feb 3 14:08:34 2003 From: christoph.emmrich at URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (Christoph Emmrich) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 03 15:08:34 +0100 Subject: Summer School in Spoken Sanskrit 2003 Message-ID: <161227072162.23782.723904209522199208.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> SUMMER SCHOOL IN SPOKEN SANSKRIT 2003 The Summer School in Spoken Sanskrit organized by the Department of Classical Indology at the South Asia Institute, Heidelberg, entering its fourth consecutive year, once again offers the opportunity, particularly to those pursuing Indological Studies, to expand the range of their use of this extraordinarily rich language: Under the tutelage of a Sanskrit native speaker, Shri Sadanada Das, students with a basic training in Sanskrit grammar and translation shall learn to carefully listen, to accurately pronounce and to slowly speak and recite it. The four-week, all-day course in simple conversation will help strengthen language skills and make the study of Sanskrit a playful and creative experience. Prerequisites: elementary knowledge of Sanskrit and English Organizer: Prof. Dr. Axel Michaels Teacher: Dr. Sadananda Das Participants: max. 15; min. 10 Venue: South Asia Institute Date: August 4 - 29, 2003; Deadlines: application until May 15, 2003; payment by June 30, 2003 Fee: Euro 250,- (including teaching material) Accomodation: can be arranged at the University Student Hostel on request; rent for the entire period approx. Euro 200,- Application: including filled out questionnaire at http://www.sai.uni-heidelberg.de/abt/IND/index.html link 'Sanskrit Summer School' by email to christoph.emmrich at urz.uni-heidelberg.de or letter to: 'Sanskrit Summer School' The Secretariat, Dept. of Classical Indology, South Asia Institute, Im Neuenheimer Feld 330, 69120 Heidelberg, Germany Payment: on confirmation by cheque to the above address or by bank transfer to following account: Universit?t Heidelberg 21911 Sparkasse Heidelberg BLZ 672 500 20 Reference: Sanskrit Summer School Sachkonto 54034 Kostenstelle 97028000 For further information please contact: Christoph Emmrich, Tel. 06221/54-6303; Fax: 06221/54-6338 christoph.emmrich at urz.uni-heidelberg.de ------------------------------------------ Application Sanskrit Summer School 2003: Questionnaire Name: Sex: Age: Nationality: University: Department: Supervisor(s): Semesters: Subjects, courses: Title(s): Occupation, position: Current project: Modern languages: Classical languages: Years of Sanskrit training, where?: Variety of texts read: Previous courses or practice in spoken Sanskrit: none/some, which? Accomodation required: yes/no -- Christoph Emmrich Classical Indology South Asia Institute Heidelberg University Im Neuenheimer Feld 330 69120 Heidelberg - Germany Tel.: +49-54-6303 Fax: +49-54-6338 From athr at LOC.GOV Tue Feb 4 00:27:30 2003 From: athr at LOC.GOV (Allen W Thrasher) Date: Mon, 03 Feb 03 19:27:30 -0500 Subject: "Pahari" Bhagavatapurana Message-ID: <161227072164.23782.535476298577309293.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Does anyone know about a version of the Bhagavatapurana in "Pahari" in Perso-Arabic script written by a Sheikh Abdullah Dehlvi and dedicated to one Rai Anand Singh, with a date of V.S. 1744? Allen Allen W. Thrasher, Ph.D. Senior Reference Librarian Southern Asia Section Asian Division Library of Congress Jefferson Building 150 101 Independence Ave., S.E. Washington, DC 20540-4810 tel. 202-707-3732 fax 202-707-1724 athr at loc.gov The opinions expressed do not necessarily reflect those of the Library of Congress. From athr at LOC.GOV Tue Feb 4 19:12:35 2003 From: athr at LOC.GOV (Allen W Thrasher) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 03 14:12:35 -0500 Subject: insects in bamboo and palm leaf Message-ID: <161227072169.23782.11714334766121689888.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I am cross posting this to CONSALD, CORMOSEA, INDOLOGY, and various individuals. We have recently detected larva cases and frass from some small insects in our collection of poetry on sections of bamboo from Mindoro, Philippines, acquired in the early 20th century. The Conservation section is taking steps to treat the items and to monitor for further infestations. It is possible the insect is the powder post beetle. We have a few more bamboo items but very many palm leaf manuscripts. Does anyone have experience whether insects that attack bamboo items may move over to palm leaf materials, and how to deal with them? Any bibliography? Conservation is consulting their bibliographical sources and also the Freer and other parts of the Smithsonian. Thanks, Allen Allen W. Thrasher, Ph.D. Senior Reference Librarian Southern Asia Section Asian Division Library of Congress Jefferson Building 150 101 Independence Ave., S.E. Washington, DC 20540-4810 tel. 202-707-3732 fax 202-707-1724 athr at loc.gov The opinions expressed do not necessarily reflect those of the Library of Congress. From athr at LOC.GOV Tue Feb 4 20:44:51 2003 From: athr at LOC.GOV (Allen W Thrasher) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 03 15:44:51 -0500 Subject: uttarakuru: Skt and Pali references Message-ID: <161227072171.23782.13651856322901706840.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Could I add to this request one for any infromation on Uttarapandavas? I have a yantra that has Uttarapandava in one direction, plus some odd goddess names such as Raktakambala. Allen Allen W. Thrasher, Ph.D. Senior Reference Librarian Southern Asia Section Asian Division Library of Congress Jefferson Building 150 101 Independence Ave., S.E. Washington, DC 20540-4810 tel. 202-707-3732 fax 202-707-1724 athr at loc.gov The opinions expressed do not necessarily reflect those of the Library of Congress. From veerankp at IFPINDIA.ORG Tue Feb 4 11:23:57 2003 From: veerankp at IFPINDIA.ORG (Veeranarayana Pandurangi) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 03 16:53:57 +0530 Subject: more about bhasmagulika Message-ID: <161227072166.23782.3595509902961959044.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Friends Can anybody help me to know more about the bhasmagulika which is referred to in nyayasudha of jayateertha. It is said to be bhasmagulika.m ced udake nik.sipyate tarhy udakam upar upasrpatiiti pratyak.sasiddham. with thanks veeranarayana From jkirk at SPRO.NET Wed Feb 5 00:54:53 2003 From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 03 17:54:53 -0700 Subject: insects in bamboo and palm leaf Message-ID: <161227072176.23782.10623085385031344936.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Is there any reason why the bamboo items could not be irradiated? The US Dept of Health could advise on irradiation. JK ==================================================== ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ulrich T. Kragh" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 4:45 PM Subject: Re: insects in bamboo and palm leaf > > Does anyone have experience whether insects that attack bamboo items may > move > > over to palm leaf materials, and how to deal with them? Any bibliography? > > A somewhat general description of various insects and what they do to mss > (pp. 79-82) along with a number of remedies (pp. 83-86) as practised in > various Indian libraries is given by Murthy. However, the book contains > nothing specific about bamboo-materials and does not specifically mention > the powder post beetle. It might not be very helpful for your case. For > general information, the book also contains an interesting section on the > production of mss in India as well as a introduction to the standard > principles of critical editing. The bibliographical reference is: > > R. S. Shivaganesha Murthy (1996): "Introduction to Manuscriptology", Sharada > Publishing House, Delhi. > > The publisher's address is: Sharada Publishing House, 40, Anand Nagar, > Inderlok, Delhi 110035, India, tel. 5117390 and 5116763 (one probably has to > to predial +91-11- for New Delhi). > > Sincerely, > Ulrich T. Kragh > University of Copenhagen > From witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU Wed Feb 5 03:32:40 2003 From: witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU (Michael Witzel) Date: Tue, 04 Feb 03 22:32:40 -0500 Subject: Intro to Veda: texts, myth, ritual, religion (on web) Message-ID: <161227072178.23782.11889888297716228739.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> As there is so much misinformation out on the web about earliest / Vedic India (do a Google search!), I have now decided to put out a 100 pp. long paper with BASIC introductory information on Vedic texts, religion, mythology and ritual. http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/VedicHinduism.htm as pdf: http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/vedica.pdf This was composed jointly by S. Jamison and me, way back in 1992, and --awaiting promised publication for many years-- has been circulated only privately among students and colleagues. It will be updated, eventually, to cover the past 10 years or so of scholarship. A much shorter (almost equally dated) version will finally come out in a vol. ed. by A. Sharma: The Study of Hinduism. U. of SC Press 2003 (?) Enjoy, MW ============================================================ Michael Witzel Department of Sanskrit & Indian Studies, Harvard University 2 Divinity Avenue, Cambridge MA 02138, USA ph. 1- 617-496 2990 (also messages) home page: http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwpage.htm From utkragh at HUM.KU.DK Tue Feb 4 23:45:16 2003 From: utkragh at HUM.KU.DK (Ulrich T. Kragh) Date: Wed, 05 Feb 03 00:45:16 +0100 Subject: insects in bamboo and palm leaf Message-ID: <161227072173.23782.3610508275291179347.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> > Does anyone have experience whether insects that attack bamboo items may move > over to palm leaf materials, and how to deal with them? Any bibliography? A somewhat general description of various insects and what they do to mss (pp. 79-82) along with a number of remedies (pp. 83-86) as practised in various Indian libraries is given by Murthy. However, the book contains nothing specific about bamboo-materials and does not specifically mention the powder post beetle. It might not be very helpful for your case. For general information, the book also contains an interesting section on the production of mss in India as well as a introduction to the standard principles of critical editing. The bibliographical reference is: R. S. Shivaganesha Murthy (1996): "Introduction to Manuscriptology", Sharada Publishing House, Delhi. The publisher's address is: Sharada Publishing House, 40, Anand Nagar, Inderlok, Delhi 110035, India, tel. 5117390 and 5116763 (one probably has to to predial +91-11- for New Delhi). Sincerely, Ulrich T. Kragh University of Copenhagen From witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU Thu Feb 6 06:12:26 2003 From: witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU (Michael Witzel) Date: Thu, 06 Feb 03 01:12:26 -0500 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?New_IPSAS_4:_Laghukath=C3=A2_,_a_Hindi_Genre,______________by__I.V._Sarma?= Message-ID: <161227072181.23782.3326499272838814405.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> It is with great pleasure that we announce another volume of the series Indian Philology and South Asian Studies (IPSAS) ed. by A. Wezler and M. Witzel, vol. 4 : Ira Valeria Sarma The Laghukath? A historical and Literary Analysis of a modern Hindi Prose Genre Berlin/New York: de Gruyter 2003 pp. XII , 344 ISBN 3-11-017593-2 This books deals with a modern prose genre, including its early history and development since c. 1900. It concentrates on the recent flourishing of the Laghukath? since c. 1970 and discusses its development as an independent genre, the authors, their intentions, the means of publication. The main focus is on literary analysis: content, themes, protagonists, space and form; an extensive chapter deals with style. for more on IPSAS see: http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/ipsas.htm ============================================================ Michael Witzel Department of Sanskrit & Indian Studies, Harvard University 2 Divinity Avenue, Cambridge MA 02138, USA ph. 1- 617-496 2990 (also messages) home page: http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwpage.htm From tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU Thu Feb 6 15:40:01 2003 From: tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU (Tenzin Bob Thurman) Date: Thu, 06 Feb 03 10:40:01 -0500 Subject: Text information Message-ID: <161227072196.23782.9799120630359095401.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Hi Ken, Garbhavakranti sutra is part of the Ratnakuta collection, one of the 2 out of 51 sutras therein that we did not translate in the 70's IASWR translation project that was only partially completed, with the C. C. Chang publication from Penn State U Press representing a selection. Bob T From asg at U.WASHINGTON.EDU Thu Feb 6 18:57:30 2003 From: asg at U.WASHINGTON.EDU (Andrew Glass) Date: Thu, 06 Feb 03 10:57:30 -0800 Subject: Toddler learns 4,000 verses of ancient language by heart Message-ID: <161227072189.23782.643488698726704483.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> A three-year old girl in India has become famous for her ability to recite thousands of verses in a dead language. Shraddha Vajapeyee can recite up to 4,000 verses called sutras from the Ashta adhyayi even though she cannot read the ancient language Sanskrit. The text is a monumental Sanskrit treatise on grammar and linguistics, authored by Acharya Panini, a scholar who lived in the sixth century BC. Her father, Ravi Shankar, an insurance agent at Janakipur near Lucknow, says his daughter learnt the entire tome by heart when she was two-and-a-half years old. Since then she has been displaying her talent in various public functions across the country. At a recent conference on the ancient text the child surprised Sanskrit scholars with a "flawless" rendering of the text. Professor Ramakrishnacharya of the Sanskrit University in Tirupati told the Newindpress website: "It is a great thing to happen. I have never seen such an exhibition of talent.'' Her mother Aparna said: ''I would like to see my daughter as a Sanskrit pundit.'' Story filed: 17:03 Wednesday 5th February 2003 Source: http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_747672.html?menu=news.quirkies From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK Thu Feb 6 14:29:03 2003 From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Thu, 06 Feb 03 14:29:03 +0000 Subject: Text information In-Reply-To: <3E42679A.92CBAFD2@hum.ku.dk> Message-ID: <161227072187.23782.12118846382189924741.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> There's a study and translation of the 2nd work (or is the garbhopanisad a different work?) in one of the Zone volumes, "fragments for a history of the human body". Let me see...yes, here it is: author = "Lakshmi Kapani", title = "Upanisad of the embryo", booktitle = "Fragments for a history of the human body, part one", publisher = "Zone", year = "1989", editor = "Michel Feher, Ramona Naddaff, Nadia Tazi", volume = "Zone 5", pages = "176--196", address = "New York", isbn = "0-942299-27-2" I have an idea that I've seen another tr. of the work elsewhere too, perhaps in a journal, but no further details come to mind. Dominik On Thu, 6 Feb 2003, Kenneth Zysk wrote: > I would greatly appreciate publication and other information about the > following texts: > > Garbhas?tra > > Garbh?vakr?nti-S?tra > > > Many thanks, > > Ken > > -- > Kenneth Zysk > Department of Asian Studies > University of Copenhagen Ph: +45 3532 8832 > Leifsgade 33,5 Fax: +45 3532 8835 > DK-2300 Copenhagen S Denmark Email: zysk at hum.ku.dk > > If mail address fails use: zysk at spam.hum.ku.dk > From zysk at HUM.KU.DK Thu Feb 6 13:48:10 2003 From: zysk at HUM.KU.DK (Kenneth Zysk) Date: Thu, 06 Feb 03 14:48:10 +0100 Subject: Text information Message-ID: <161227072184.23782.9196260576746258171.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I would greatly appreciate publication and other information about the following texts: Garbhas?tra Garbh?vakr?nti-S?tra Many thanks, Ken -- Kenneth Zysk Department of Asian Studies University of Copenhagen Ph: +45 3532 8832 Leifsgade 33,5 Fax: +45 3532 8835 DK-2300 Copenhagen S Denmark Email: zysk at hum.ku.dk If mail address fails use: zysk at spam.hum.ku.dk From mmdesh at UMICH.EDU Thu Feb 6 20:37:22 2003 From: mmdesh at UMICH.EDU (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Thu, 06 Feb 03 15:37:22 -0500 Subject: Toddler learns 4,000 verses of ancient language by heart Message-ID: <161227072192.23782.11620574710255659077.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Though I have not seen a 3yr old do this personally, I have seen Pt. S.L. Athalekar's eight year old daughter recite the Ashtadhyayi and the Bhagavadgita in this fashion. This was in early sixties in Pune. She could recite the texts in a linear way, retrieve a sutra if given a number and vice versa, and recite all sutras containing a given word. She of course did not understand the meaning of the rules. Later Pt. Athalekar was my classmate at the University of Pune and he could do these feats himself. His daughter eventually graduated with Sanskrit for her BA and MA, and I was her professor for a short period. Best, Madhav Deshpande > ---------- > From: Andrew Glass > Reply To: Indology > Sent: Thursday, February 6, 2003 1:57 PM > To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk > Subject: Toddler learns 4,000 verses of ancient language by heart > > A three-year old girl in India has become famous for her ability to recite thousands of verses in a dead language. > Shraddha Vajapeyee can recite up to 4,000 verses called sutras from the Ashta adhyayi even though she cannot read the ancient language Sanskrit. > > The text is a monumental Sanskrit treatise on grammar and linguistics, authored by Acharya Panini, a scholar who lived in the sixth century BC. > > Her father, Ravi Shankar, an insurance agent at Janakipur near Lucknow, says his daughter learnt the entire tome by heart when she was two-and-a-half years old. > > Since then she has been displaying her talent in various public functions across the country. > > At a recent conference on the ancient text the child surprised Sanskrit scholars with a "flawless" rendering of the text. > > Professor Ramakrishnacharya of the Sanskrit University in Tirupati told the Newindpress website: "It is a great thing to happen. I have never seen such an exhibition of talent.'' > > Her mother Aparna said: ''I would like to see my daughter as a Sanskrit pundit.'' > > > Story filed: 17:03 Wednesday 5th February 2003 > > Source: > > http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_747672.html?menu=news.quirkies > > From silk at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU Fri Feb 7 05:50:57 2003 From: silk at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU (Jonathan Silk) Date: Thu, 06 Feb 03 21:50:57 -0800 Subject: Garbhavakranti In-Reply-To: <000701c2ce3e$f7a9a6a0$b719893e@zen> Message-ID: <161227072198.23782.2546096554604327566.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Well, since a bit of info in need of modification has been put forth here, I would like to clarify things a bit. First, Bob Thurman has mistyped: there are 49 texts in the Ratnakuta, not 51 (but if he did not translate 2, that brings it down to 49, so from the point of gematria... well, anyway...) There are two Garbhavakrantis in the collection: as Stephen said an Ananda-, but also a nanda-. They are partially the same, partially different. What is most interesting, from one point of view, about this text is that it is in fact an excerpt from the Mulasarvastivada Vinaya, a fact which has been long known. (The Tibetan versions are renderings from Chinese). The texts have been mentioned in scholarship from time to time, as Ken Zysk must know, for instance in Demieville's Byo article in Hobogirin, and there is a German translation of one, but not very good. Some important observations were also given long ago by Lalou in her examination of the Ratnakuta collection (in Journal Asiatique). I have long had a vague idea to edit and translate these texts, but I wonder if I will ever get around to it. Robert Kritzer has lately worked on some of this material. It is worth mentioning M. Hahn's recent edition and translation of the Garbhavakranti section of the Bodhisattvavadanakalpalata, also I am sure known to Zysk, since it was published in the European Ayurveda Journal. I might also remark here that I believe that this text is very important in one most interesting respect: it counts pregnancy in weeks. This idea could only have come through the Greeks, and I believe that it is through this text that the idea was transmitted to Tibet and to the Rgyud bzhi, and also probably to China. I confess I have not found the leisure to follow up this hunch of mine. best regards, jonathan silk silk at humnet.ucla.edu From s.hodge at PADMACHOLING.FREESERVE.CO.UK Fri Feb 7 00:16:09 2003 From: s.hodge at PADMACHOLING.FREESERVE.CO.UK (Stephen Hodge) Date: Fri, 07 Feb 03 00:16:09 +0000 Subject: Text information Message-ID: <161227072194.23782.15016928210269536188.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Kenneth Zysk wrote: I would greatly appreciate publication and other information about the following texts: Garbhas?tra / Garbh?vakr?nti-S?tra ******** Curious serendipity -- I was just looking for some info in one of your books so let me help you in return. I am not sure about the first text -- it seems like an abbreviated title, possibly for the second work which is the Aananda-garbha-avakraanti-nirde'sa, included in the Ratnakuu.ta collection of suutras. I don't think there is any Skt surviving but it can be found both in Tibetan (D 57) and Chinese (T310/14). Also I am not aware of any translations in Western languages but who knows ... You should also note that here is similar materal included as the latter part of the Pitaa-putra-samaagama, also included in the Ratnakuu.ta and quoted in part in the 'Sik.saa-samuccaya for which, of course we have the Skt. Hope this helps, Stephen Hodge From zysk at HUM.KU.DK Fri Feb 7 10:42:23 2003 From: zysk at HUM.KU.DK (Kenneth Zysk) Date: Fri, 07 Feb 03 11:42:23 +0100 Subject: Text information Message-ID: <161227072203.23782.10406809749118584056.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Many thanks to Bob Thurman, Stephen Hodge, and Jonathan Silk for their time in providing me with useful information. With best wishes, Ken From deviprasad at IFPINDIA.ORG Fri Feb 7 09:09:05 2003 From: deviprasad at IFPINDIA.ORG (DEVI IFP) Date: Fri, 07 Feb 03 14:39:05 +0530 Subject: For some information. Message-ID: <161227072201.23782.2321712361019192831.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Respected Sir, For my thesis I need some information about "Mayurabhatta" and Madhusudana. There is a line like "pa~ncanadaanvaya Madhavabha.t.taatmaja Madhusuudana viv.rnute ". I need some articles about them and their birthdate, place and their other works. With Thanks regards Deviprasad Research Assistant French Institute Pondicherry - 1 deviprasad at ifpindia.org. From s.hodge at PADMACHOLING.FREESERVE.CO.UK Fri Feb 7 19:47:25 2003 From: s.hodge at PADMACHOLING.FREESERVE.CO.UK (Stephen Hodge) Date: Fri, 07 Feb 03 19:47:25 +0000 Subject: Garbhavakranti Message-ID: <161227072205.23782.17720647359426755797.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Jonathan Silk wrote: > There are two Garbhavakrantis in the collection [snip] (The Tibetan versions are > renderings from Chinese). There are, as you know, two in the Chinese RK and two in the Tibetan RK but though the colophon to one of the Tibetan versions indicates that it was translated by Chos-grub from the Chinese, the other version gives no such indication -- so is your suggestion based on a comparison with the other Chinese version or just an assumption ? Apart from the MS Vinaya connections, has anybody commented on the list of "worms" listed in these texts ? The list has a great resemblance to that given in the Vimutti-magga, suggesting perhaps some influence from there. Yijing who translated one of the versions in the Chinese RK seems to have acquired some of his mss in Sri Lanka so could the Garbhavakranti have some S Indian origin or connection ? > I might also remark here that I believe that this text is very > important in one most interesting respect: it counts pregnancy in > weeks. Note that the Vimutti-magga also counts the development of the embryo in weeks. Years ago I did some work on the anatomical descriptions found in these and other works and I think there is clear evidence that they are presenting a distinct tradition that is unconnected with the Susruta / Caraka lineages -- e.g. the way of enumerating the bones is different -- so your suggestion of a Hellenistic influence looks plausible. Best wishes, Stephen Hodge From zysk at HUM.KU.DK Sat Feb 8 06:57:47 2003 From: zysk at HUM.KU.DK (Kenneth Zysk) Date: Sat, 08 Feb 03 07:57:47 +0100 Subject: Garbhavakranti Message-ID: <161227072207.23782.447537581203644696.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Although there is still a long way to go in order to establish a connection between Indian and Hellenistic medicine, I am pleased that the topic is again being considered, with new material from Buddhist sources. We here are beginning to take a closer look at the medical material preserved through Tocharian documents, so I would greatly appreciate any and all information and/or assumptions that you may have. Please feel free to contact me off the list. Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: Stephen Hodge To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 8:47 PM Subject: Re: Garbhavakranti Jonathan Silk wrote: > There are two Garbhavakrantis in the collection [snip] (The Tibetan versions are > renderings from Chinese). There are, as you know, two in the Chinese RK and two in the Tibetan RK but though the colophon to one of the Tibetan versions indicates that it was translated by Chos-grub from the Chinese, the other version gives no such indication -- so is your suggestion based on a comparison with the other Chinese version or just an assumption ? Apart from the MS Vinaya connections, has anybody commented on the list of "worms" listed in these texts ? The list has a great resemblance to that given in the Vimutti-magga, suggesting perhaps some influence from there. Yijing who translated one of the versions in the Chinese RK seems to have acquired some of his mss in Sri Lanka so could the Garbhavakranti have some S Indian origin or connection ? > I might also remark here that I believe that this text is very > important in one most interesting respect: it counts pregnancy in > weeks. Note that the Vimutti-magga also counts the development of the embryo in weeks. Years ago I did some work on the anatomical descriptions found in these and other works and I think there is clear evidence that they are presenting a distinct tradition that is unconnected with the Susruta / Caraka lineages -- e.g. the way of enumerating the bones is different -- so your suggestion of a Hellenistic influence looks plausible. Best wishes, Stephen Hodge From witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU Sat Feb 8 14:27:43 2003 From: witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU (Michael Witzel) Date: Sat, 08 Feb 03 09:27:43 -0500 Subject: =?utf-8?Q?New_book_on_Paippal=C3=A2da_Atharvaveda?= Message-ID: <161227072209.23782.12458304641513066445.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> This new book on the very much neglected Paippal?da version of the Atharvaveda has just reached me : ------------- Abhijit Ghosh (ed.) ?tharvan? A collection of essays on the AtharvaVeda with special reference to its Paippal?da tradition Kolkata: Sanskrit Book Depot (June?) 2002 Rs. 375, $ 25 ; pp. 198 [Publ.: Abhoy Barman, 28/1 Bidhan Sarani, Kolkata 700 006] Contains papers by T.N. Adhikari, S.S. Bahulkar, D. Bhattacharya, V.A. van Bijlert, S.C. Chakrabarti, A. Ghosh, A. Griffiths, C.G. Kashikar, N. R. Kulkarni, J.A. Moleanu, K. Mylius, S.P. Narang, H.C. Patyal, G.U. Thite, K.B. Upadhyaya, M. Witzel. Several of them deal with editing the PS and the multifarious problems encountered with understanding this difficult, second oldest Indian text. Recommended as an introduction to current (Paipp.) Athavaveda studies. Cheers, MW. ============================================================ Michael Witzel Department of Sanskrit & Indian Studies, Harvard University 2 Divinity Avenue, Cambridge MA 02138, USA ph. 1- 617-496 2990 (also messages) home page: http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwpage.htm From reusch at UCLINK.BERKELEY.EDU Sat Feb 8 23:38:23 2003 From: reusch at UCLINK.BERKELEY.EDU (B. Reusch) Date: Sat, 08 Feb 03 15:38:23 -0800 Subject: Fwd: Diacritical Fonts and Unicode Page [Mac] Message-ID: <161227072213.23782.17350520757219770906.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> From: Nobumi Iyanaga Date: Sat Feb 8, 2003 7:51:53 AM US/Pacific Subject: Update of Asian Diacritical Fonts and Unicode Page [Mac] Hello, I would like to annouce that I updated my web page entitled "East Asian Diacritical Fonts and Unicode". Here are some excerpts from that page: ========= Now that Unicode begins to be used very largely in personal computing environment and Internet, it becomes important to be able to convert to Unicode files that have been created using "legacy codes". In general, this is not very difficult -- for the Mac environment, we can use utilities like Cyclone or TEC OSAX to do such tasks. It is even possible to convert to Unicode files of multilingual text (written using Apple's different language kits), if we use TEC OSAX (on these issues, please see my other web page "Unicode and MacOS, and Code converters"). But this becomes very hard when the texts to be converted use non standard fonts for transliteration of Asian languages, such as Times_Norman or Hobogirin, which have vowels with macron, etc. Tables of correspondences This is why I created tables of correspondences for some of the most used fonts among scholars... ========= Now, you can download from my page conversion tables for the following fonts: Appeal (you can download the font itself) BharatiTimes Hobogirin ITimesSkRom (you can download the font itself) Minion-Indologist MyTimes Normyn Times_Norman TimesCSXPlus TTF You will find also MacPerl converters for files written in these fonts into Unicode; and some other conversion tools and tips. I hope this will be useful for some of you. The URL is: Best regards, Nobumi Iyanaga Tokyo, Japan P.S. I will post this message to H-Buddhism, PMJS and Nisus mailing list. Please excuse me if you receive it more than once. From ghezziem at TIN.IT Sat Feb 8 15:23:57 2003 From: ghezziem at TIN.IT (Daniela Rossella) Date: Sat, 08 Feb 03 16:23:57 +0100 Subject: Message-ID: <161227072211.23782.7796751429393431081.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dearest Friends and Colleagues, please visit the web page of Calcutta Conference organised by professor C. Chakrabarti: http://www.columbia.edu/cu/lweb/data/indiv/southasia/cuvl/conf/1-04Calcutta. html A lot of possible themes are enumerated; I'm attempting to organise a panel in this one: Mysticism and Romanticism If someone of Us suppose to be glad to participate in, please let me know. I write this e-mail in accord with Prof. Chakrabarti's kind request. Best wishes, Daniela Rossella ****************************************************************** Ph.D. Dr. Daniela Rossella Department Assistant - University of Perugia (Italy) University of Milano (Italy) home address: piazza Buzzati, 5 43100 PARMA (Italy) fax: +39.0521.773854 e-mail: ghezziem at tin.it http://www.columbia.edu/cu/lweb/data/indiv/area/idsas/ROSSELLA,Daniela.htm ****************************************************************** From jkirk at SPRO.NET Sun Feb 9 00:37:59 2003 From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk) Date: Sat, 08 Feb 03 17:37:59 -0700 Subject: Books on offer Message-ID: <161227072215.23782.8142092926360063227.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear List members, I'm probably barking up the wrong slaughtering-post putting my list on Indology, but in case one of your graduate students might need one or more of the following books, I have to dispose of them -- contact me at jkirk at spro.net If further ID is needed for anything just ask. Reasonable......Joanna Kirkpatrick ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------- Baden-Powell. INDIAN VILLAGE COMMUNITY, 1896. hard cover, x-libris. Baden-Powell. VILLAGE COMMUNITIES OF INDIA, 1899; hard cover, small Whitehead. VILLAGE GODS OF INDIA. 1921; hard cover, small. Briggs. THE CHAMARS. 1920, HARD COVER, small. Steeven, G.N. IN INDIA. [memoir] n.d. hard cover----(colonial-free) Gomme. THE VILLAGE COMMUNITY. hard cover, small Thakur. CORRUPTION IN ANCIENT INDIA. 1979. hard cover W.W. Hunter. THE INDIAN EMPIRE. 1893. hard cover Sachau. ALBERUNI'S INDIA. 2 vols in one. popular edition. 1914. hard cover. x-libris Thurston, Edgar. OMENS AND SUPERSTITIONS OF SOUTHERN INDIA. 1912 hard cover. illus. Leonard. SOCIAL HISTORY OF AN INDIAN CASTE. [Kayasthas of Hyderabad] 1978.hard cover. Abbe Dubois. HINDU MANNERS, CUSTOMS AND CEREMONIES. 3d ed. 1959 hard cover, small From jkirk at SPRO.NET Mon Feb 10 03:07:58 2003 From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk) Date: Sun, 09 Feb 03 20:07:58 -0700 Subject: at risk again Message-ID: <161227072217.23782.16542811653657065122.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Not being an expert, I still try. Can anyone point me to a Sanskrit source that gives translations into English of animal names in Skt to their common or biological or both names in English? Not much of Indian birds or flowers in Monier-Williams it seems, nor on the Capeller online or Cologne online lookup machines. Thanks Joanna Kirkpatrick From j_e_m_houben at YAHOO.COM Mon Feb 10 10:10:56 2003 From: j_e_m_houben at YAHOO.COM (Jan E.M. Houben) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 02:10:56 -0800 Subject: at risk again In-Reply-To: <008101c2d0b1$9dbad090$2930cece@JKIRK> Message-ID: <161227072219.23782.8361491673050680567.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> On translations and esp. the (non)translatability/(non)identifiability of Skt. animal names (cf. the eight-legged zarabha!) see Francis Zimmermann's "Junglebook" I think the title was The jungle and the aroma of meats, english version appeared ca. 1987, Berkeley, Univ. of California. J.H. --- jkirk wrote: > Not being an expert, I still try. Can anyone > point me to a Sanskrit source > that gives translations into English of animal > names in Skt to their common > or biological or both names in English? > > Not much of Indian birds or flowers in > Monier-Williams it seems, nor on the > Capeller online or Cologne online lookup > machines. > > Thanks > Joanna Kirkpatrick __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From j_e_m_houben at YAHOO.COM Mon Feb 10 12:53:24 2003 From: j_e_m_houben at YAHOO.COM (Jan E.M. Houben) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 04:53:24 -0800 Subject: Dave on birds In-Reply-To: <3E4795BD.9E4DD8DE@Helsinki.Fi> Message-ID: <161227072234.23782.15534745349898550282.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> For the "exactness fallacy" see precisely Zimmermann's book which I mentioned. In Sanskrit terminology no "European" exactness can be expected simply because there was no phase of collective empirical and methodological rigour which in Europe became only possible when scholars could quickly and widely communicate with printed publications (cf. Elisabeth Eisenstein). Only when printing was used scholars could co-ordinate their observations and find out, in the course of the sixteenth-seventeenth century, that there is no such thing as the unicorn, whereas the zarabha continues to be happily taken serious in Ayurvedic texts and their later commentaries. It is not worthwhile to learn Dutch especially for this purpose but for those who know it I point to W.P. Gerritsen, De Eenhoorn en de Geleerden: Het debat over het bestaan van de eenhoorn van de zestiende tot de negentiende eeuw, Leiden: Universiteitsbibliotheek, 2002. Best, Jan --- Klaus Karttunen wrote: > When you read the cover and preface of Dave, it > turns out that the man > was 99 years old when he finished it and had > worked on it many many > years. The book is thus sort of life's work. He > was both a Sanskrit > scholar and an enthuasiastic ornithologist. A > major problem was that he > wanted ancient Indians to be ornithologists, > too, and tried to find > exact names for as many species as possible. > Thus there are cases where > he takes two Sanskrit names which I suppose to > be synonymous and > explains them as the names of two related > species. Here we must be > careful, but the book is very useful, indeed. > By the way, zoological > information about Indian birds can be find in > the books of Salim Ali > Regards > Klaus > -- > Klaus Karttunen, Ph.D. > Docent of Indology and Classical Ethnography > Institute of Asian and African Studies > PL 59 (Unioninkatu 38 B), 00014 University of > Helsinki, FINLAND > phone 358-0-19122188, fax 358-0-19122094 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com From jkirk at SPRO.NET Mon Feb 10 16:04:24 2003 From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 09:04:24 -0700 Subject: Dave on birds Message-ID: <161227072239.23782.14550506779605486259.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Thansk to all who have sent such fascinating replies ot my query. I must get Dave's book. Anyone who can do that at age 99 has to be admired. I am aware of the differecnes between folk naming and ornithological classification, an ddo not expect everything to be one to one in any source. After all, in Indian art and probably literature, e.g., tigers and lions are often named the same--sher. In a Panchatantra painting of the first frame story from that work, 18th c miniature, of the confrontation or meeting between the white bull and the lion, the lion in this picture is clearly a striped tiger. I do have a bird book by Salim Ali. JK =================================== > When you read the cover and preface of Dave, it turns out that the man > was 99 years old when he finished it and had worked on it many many > years. ...........By the way, zoological > information about Indian birds can be find in the books of Salim Ali > Regards > Klaus > -- > Klaus Karttunen, Ph.D. > Docent of Indology and Classical Ethnography > Institute of Asian and African Studies > PL 59 (Unioninkatu 38 B), 00014 University of Helsinki, FINLAND > phone 358-0-19122188, fax 358-0-19122094 > > From jkirk at SPRO.NET Mon Feb 10 16:05:52 2003 From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 09:05:52 -0700 Subject: at risk again Message-ID: <161227072243.23782.6107227269645827663.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Intriguing! what got me started on this were the many terms in Kalidasa's Meghaduta for birds and flowers. Probably nobody has gone through it to see if they could write a "nature concordance' for that work? ============= > Dear Colleagues, > be always very careful with Monier Williams' identifications of animals > and plants and especially with the names he used. These were often badly > antiquated even when he compiled his dictionary in the 19th century and > sometimes quite much taxonomic knowledge is needed to understand his meaning. > > There is no easy available reliable source, the information is scattered > in many places and often unavailable. Dave's books on birds in Sanskrit > is nice as a material collection, but his way of equating Sanskrit words > with zoological taxons is often erroneous. > > For Vedas Macdonell's and Keith's index contains sometimes useful > information and textual references. Mayrhofer's dictionaries are also > useful. But the whole thing is often difficult and needs special study. > > Regards > Klaus > > -- > Klaus Karttunen, Ph.D. > Docent of Indology and Classical Ethnography > Institute of Asian and African Studies > PL 59 (Unioninkatu 38 B), 00014 University of Helsinki, FINLAND > phone 358-0-19122188, fax 358-0-19122094 > > From jkirk at SPRO.NET Mon Feb 10 16:14:07 2003 From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 09:14:07 -0700 Subject: animals Message-ID: <161227072245.23782.12662597109227982526.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I should have begun this by saying i was focused on bird an dplant/flower names in Meghaduta--to save learned listmembers the trouble of sending me so many referecnes, but still grateful for all tiose too and they are being added to my list. I should be able to get a copy of Dave on ILL. The medical treatises, I'd suspect, treat of birds plants etc in reference to dieases and treatments, and so they might not be that helpful for elucidating literary references? Joanna ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dominik Wujastyk" To: Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 4:47 AM Subject: Re: animals > On Mon, 10 Feb 2003, Arlo Griffiths wrote: > > > All these works make clear that identifications commonly used by Indologists > > can in many cases already be rejected for the simple reason that the > > supposed animal does not exist in India. Regarding Dave's book on birds, we > > should indeed, as Karttunen just hinted, not forget R.P. Das' words > > ("Studies in Indian Medical History", ed. by Meulenbeld and Wujastyk, > > Groningen 1987, p. 27 n. 36): "... Dave seems on the whole far too sure of > > his identifications and has moreover more or less neglected other studies on > > the subject." > > The more I've used Dave, the less I would agree with Das's caveat. Dave > really had an excellent personal knowledge of Indian ornithology, which > makes his book uniquely useful, and his opinions far more valuable than if > they were merely based on secondary academic sources alone. (Of course, > he is very widely and usefully read in Sanskrit sources.) If Dave appears > sure, it is often because he does actually know what he's talking about. > :-) > > Obviously, there is never any excuse for not thinking for oneself. I'm > not saying Dave is perfect, just very, very good, and perhaps unfairly > criticised by Das. Also, unfortunately, out of print. > > Dominik > > From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK Mon Feb 10 10:43:09 2003 From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 10:43:09 +0000 Subject: at risk again In-Reply-To: <008101c2d0b1$9dbad090$2930cece@JKIRK> Message-ID: <161227072221.23782.13048695591554948353.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> In the Introduction of my Roots of Ayurveda book, p.23, I discuss plant names, and I list a whole lot of good reference sources on the history of plants in India, including texts that help with Sanskrit and vernacular names and Linnean identifications. Animal names: KN Dave, Birds in Sanskrit Literature (Motilal) is *the* bible for birds. SH Prater, The Book of Indian Animals, is a goldmine of info., and really helpful in identifying animals, though it doesn't do the Sanskrit itself. It does give vernacular names, though, which can be very important and helpful. It is published by the Bombay Natural History Society, all of whose publications are very useful indeed (including Daniel's Reptiles). Similarly, Samuel Israel and Toby Sinclair, Indian Wildlife: Sri Lanka, Nepal (ARA Publications, ISBN 0-245-54523-9) is excellent; same caveats as for Prater. Klaus Karttunen is interested in realia too, and his volumes on India and Greece are full of useful identifications and remarks. You might not think to look there at first. Best, Dominik On Sun, 9 Feb 2003, jkirk wrote: > Not being an expert, I still try. Can anyone point me to a Sanskrit source > that gives translations into English of animal names in Skt to their common > or biological or both names in English? > > Not much of Indian birds or flowers in Monier-Williams it seems, nor on the > Capeller online or Cologne online lookup machines. > > Thanks > Joanna Kirkpatrick > From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK Mon Feb 10 11:47:18 2003 From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 11:47:18 +0000 Subject: animals In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227072227.23782.12772563762183912854.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> On Mon, 10 Feb 2003, Arlo Griffiths wrote: > All these works make clear that identifications commonly used by Indologists > can in many cases already be rejected for the simple reason that the > supposed animal does not exist in India. Regarding Dave's book on birds, we > should indeed, as Karttunen just hinted, not forget R.P. Das' words > ("Studies in Indian Medical History", ed. by Meulenbeld and Wujastyk, > Groningen 1987, p. 27 n. 36): "... Dave seems on the whole far too sure of > his identifications and has moreover more or less neglected other studies on > the subject." The more I've used Dave, the less I would agree with Das's caveat. Dave really had an excellent personal knowledge of Indian ornithology, which makes his book uniquely useful, and his opinions far more valuable than if they were merely based on secondary academic sources alone. (Of course, he is very widely and usefully read in Sanskrit sources.) If Dave appears sure, it is often because he does actually know what he's talking about. :-) Obviously, there is never any excuse for not thinking for oneself. I'm not saying Dave is perfect, just very, very good, and perhaps unfairly criticised by Das. Also, unfortunately, out of print. Dominik From Klaus.Karttunen at HELSINKI.FI Mon Feb 10 10:53:00 2003 From: Klaus.Karttunen at HELSINKI.FI (Klaus Karttunen) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 12:53:00 +0200 Subject: at risk again Message-ID: <161227072223.23782.8810941191236180430.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Colleagues, be always very careful with Monier Williams' identifications of animals and plants and especially with the names he used. These were often badly antiquated even when he compiled his dictionary in the 19th century and sometimes quite much taxonomic knowledge is needed to understand his meaning. There is no easy available reliable source, the information is scattered in many places and often unavailable. Dave's books on birds in Sanskrit is nice as a material collection, but his way of equating Sanskrit words with zoological taxons is often erroneous. For Vedas Macdonell's and Keith's index contains sometimes useful information and textual references. Mayrhofer's dictionaries are also useful. But the whole thing is often difficult and needs special study. Regards Klaus -- Klaus Karttunen, Ph.D. Docent of Indology and Classical Ethnography Institute of Asian and African Studies PL 59 (Unioninkatu 38 B), 00014 University of Helsinki, FINLAND phone 358-0-19122188, fax 358-0-19122094 From A.Griffiths at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL Mon Feb 10 11:06:59 2003 From: A.Griffiths at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL (Arlo Griffiths) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 13:06:59 +0200 Subject: animals In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227072225.23782.14540846124148888789.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> One might also mention that Stephanie Jamison, in various publications, has dealt with the precise identification of Sanskrit animal-names: the first thing that comes to my mind is her book on the Ravenous Hyenas and the Wounded Sun, esp. pp. 68ff. (on hyenas). Then, I think of Claudius Nenninger's paper in StII 18 [1993] (on the nakula-). There is also a very interesting recent paper by Joshua Katz in the Insler Festschrift, JAOS 122.2 [2002] (on badgers, moles [not in India!] etc.). All these works make clear that identifications commonly used by Indologists can in many cases already be rejected for the simple reason that the supposed animal does not exist in India. Regarding Dave's book on birds, we should indeed, as Karttunen just hinted, not forget R.P. Das' words ("Studies in Indian Medical History", ed. by Meulenbeld and Wujastyk, Groningen 1987, p. 27 n. 36): "... Dave seems on the whole far too sure of his identifications and has moreover more or less neglected other studies on the subject." Arlo Griffiths > From: Dominik Wujastyk > Reply-To: Indology > Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2003 10:43:09 +0000 > To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk > Subject: Re: at risk again > > In the Introduction of my Roots of Ayurveda book, p.23, I discuss plant > names, and I list a whole lot of good reference sources on the history of > plants in India, including texts that help with Sanskrit and vernacular > names and Linnean identifications. > > Animal names: KN Dave, Birds in Sanskrit Literature (Motilal) is *the* > bible for birds. SH Prater, The Book of Indian Animals, is a goldmine of > info., and really helpful in identifying animals, though it doesn't do the > Sanskrit itself. It does give vernacular names, though, which can be very > important and helpful. It is published by the Bombay Natural History > Society, all of whose publications are very useful indeed (including > Daniel's Reptiles). Similarly, Samuel Israel and Toby Sinclair, Indian > Wildlife: Sri Lanka, Nepal (ARA Publications, ISBN 0-245-54523-9) is > excellent; same caveats as for Prater. > > Klaus Karttunen is interested in realia too, and his volumes on India and > Greece are full of useful identifications and remarks. You might not > think to look there at first. > > Best, > > Dominik > > On Sun, 9 Feb 2003, jkirk wrote: > >> Not being an expert, I still try. Can anyone point me to a Sanskrit source >> that gives translations into English of animal names in Skt to their common >> or biological or both names in English? >> >> Not much of Indian birds or flowers in Monier-Williams it seems, nor on the >> Capeller online or Cologne online lookup machines. >> >> Thanks >> Joanna Kirkpatrick >> From karp at MERCURY.CI.UW.EDU.PL Mon Feb 10 12:42:34 2003 From: karp at MERCURY.CI.UW.EDU.PL (Artur Karp) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 13:42:34 +0100 Subject: at risk again In-Reply-To: <008101c2d0b1$9dbad090$2930cece@JKIRK> Message-ID: <161227072232.23782.9888410469351273489.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> At 04:07 2003-02-10, you wrote: >Not being an expert, I still try. Can anyone point me to a Sanskrit source >that gives translations into English of animal names in Skt to their common >or biological or both names in English? > >Not much of Indian birds or flowers in Monier-Williams it seems, nor on the >Capeller online or Cologne online lookup machines. > >Thanks >Joanna Kirkpatrick Dear Joanna, Not much additional advice re: animals & birds Sanskrit and biological names. As far as botany is concerned, my constant companion is: Chopra R.N., Nayar S.L., Chopra I.C., Glossary of Indian Medicinal Plants, Council of Scientific & Industrial Research, New Delhi 1956, 330 pages. (On pp. 263-318 Index of Common Vernacular Names [including Sanskrit]) and Chopra R.N., Chopra I.C., Varma B.S., Supplement to Glossary of Indian Medicinal Plants, Publications & Information Directorate, New Delhi 1969, 120 pages. No photographs or drawings of the plants, though. Which is annoying. But otherwise a mine of dependable information. Regards, Artur Karp Senior Lecturer in Sanskrit and Pali University of Warsaw --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release Date: 2003-01-27 From Klaus.Karttunen at HELSINKI.FI Mon Feb 10 12:06:42 2003 From: Klaus.Karttunen at HELSINKI.FI (Klaus Karttunen) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 14:06:42 +0200 Subject: Dave on birds Message-ID: <161227072229.23782.2431520957975176657.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> When you read the cover and preface of Dave, it turns out that the man was 99 years old when he finished it and had worked on it many many years. The book is thus sort of life's work. He was both a Sanskrit scholar and an enthuasiastic ornithologist. A major problem was that he wanted ancient Indians to be ornithologists, too, and tried to find exact names for as many species as possible. Thus there are cases where he takes two Sanskrit names which I suppose to be synonymous and explains them as the names of two related species. Here we must be careful, but the book is very useful, indeed. By the way, zoological information about Indian birds can be find in the books of Salim Ali Regards Klaus -- Klaus Karttunen, Ph.D. Docent of Indology and Classical Ethnography Institute of Asian and African Studies PL 59 (Unioninkatu 38 B), 00014 University of Helsinki, FINLAND phone 358-0-19122188, fax 358-0-19122094 From beitel at GWU.EDU Mon Feb 10 21:14:39 2003 From: beitel at GWU.EDU (beitel) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 16:14:39 -0500 Subject: Pancakanya Message-ID: <161227072252.23782.18274583085671298096.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Colleagues, I have been asked to forward the following note from Pradip Bhattacharya, and would, indeed, be grateful for more on the matter myself, and for any further references (I do not have a copy of the BP) or information. With thanks, Alf Hiltebeitel ===== I wonder if you could possibly help me out to track down a reference. This is the sloka celebrating the panchakanya, viz. Ahalya Draupadi Kunti Tara Mandodari tatha panchakanya svaranityam mahapataka nashaka The problem is to find out where it occurs. One reference cites the Brahma Purana, 3.7.219. Can anyone check up this reference? If found, can you let me know the context in which it occurs, who utters the sloka and why? From athr at LOC.GOV Mon Feb 10 21:37:53 2003 From: athr at LOC.GOV (Allen W Thrasher) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 16:37:53 -0500 Subject: Pancakanya Message-ID: <161227072254.23782.17246079336226181021.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> OFF THE LIST Dear Alf, Is Bhattacharya in DC? If so he could examine our eds. of the Purana. I really don't have time to do so. LC has 15 eds. inc. translations. Allen Allen W. Thrasher, Ph.D. Senior Reference Librarian Southern Asia Section Asian Division Library of Congress Jefferson Building 150 101 Independence Ave., S.E. Washington, DC 20540-4810 tel. 202-707-3732 fax 202-707-1724 athr at loc.gov The opinions expressed do not necessarily reflect those of the Library of Congress. >>> beitel at GWU.EDU 02/10/03 04:14PM >>> Dear Colleagues, I have been asked to forward the following note from Pradip Bhattacharya, and would, indeed, be grateful for more on the matter myself, and for any further references (I do not have a copy of the BP) or information. With thanks, Alf Hiltebeitel ===== I wonder if you could possibly help me out to track down a reference. This is the sloka celebrating the panchakanya, viz. Ahalya Draupadi Kunti Tara Mandodari tatha panchakanya svaranityam mahapataka nashaka The problem is to find out where it occurs. One reference cites the Brahma Purana, 3.7.219. Can anyone check up this reference? If found, can you let me know the context in which it occurs, who utters the sloka and why? From a.passi at ALMA.UNIBO.IT Mon Feb 10 16:01:39 2003 From: a.passi at ALMA.UNIBO.IT (Alex Passi) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 17:01:39 +0100 Subject: at risk again In-Reply-To: <5.1.1.6.2.20030210133017.02d13f58@mercury.ci.uw.edu.pl> Message-ID: <161227072236.23782.8155803498145166294.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> On Indian plants, two more titles, one old, one new: - William Dymock, C.J.H. Warden, D. Hooper, Pharmacographia Indica. A history of the principal drugs of vegetable origin, met with in British India, 3 Vols., London, Bombay, Calcutta, 1890-1893; reprints: as Special Issue in ?Hamdard?, vol. XV, Karachi, 1972, and Delhi, Low Price Publications 1995. - John A. Parrotta, Healing Plants of Peninsular India, Wallingford, 2001. Though the second book has what all the other publications in this sector seem to lack, ie. color photographs, I find the older work more instructive, especially when it deals with the economics of plant derivatives and drugs. Alex Passi -- --------------------------------------------------- Alex (Alessandro) Passi, Dept. of Linguistic and Oriental Studies, Via Zamboni 16, 40126 Bologna, Italy. ph. +39-051-233133 - fax +39-051-235298 cell +39-338-269.4933. ---------------------------------------------------- From christoph.emmrich at URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE Mon Feb 10 16:13:51 2003 From: christoph.emmrich at URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (Christoph Emmrich) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 17:13:51 +0100 Subject: Advanced Summer School in Spoken Sanskrit 2003 Message-ID: <161227072241.23782.16863132544919928822.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> ADVANCED SUMMER SCHOOL IN SPOKEN SANSKRIT 2003 This year for the first time the South Asia Institute at Heidelberg University in cooperation with the Universit? degli Studi di Firenze offers a Summer School dedicated to advanced learners of spoken Sanskrit. Shri Sadananda Das has prepared a course which especially addresses the needs of the alumni of the previous Heidelberger Sanskrit Summer Schools, but is equally open to those who already speak Sanskrit fluently. What has been learnt in the previous courses will not only be reactivated but shall offer the grounds for enlarging the vocabulary and for practicing the usage of idiomatic expressions as well as developing free speech and having topically oriented discussions. By introducing new material from gnomic and kaavya literature one of the foci once again will be memorizing, recitation and theatrical performance. This time the three-week, all-day course organized by the South Asia Institute will be hosted by our partner university in Florence and will show to the old and new participants of the Summer School that also in Italy ?si parla sanscrito'. Prerequisites: participation in one of the previous Sanskrit Summer Schools or oral fluency in Sanskrit, English Organizer: Prof. Dr. Axel Michaels Teacher: Dr. Sadananda Das Participants: max. 15; min. 10 Venue: Universit? degli Studi, Florence, Italy Date: September 8 - 27, 2003 Deadlines: application until 15.05.2002; payment by 30.06.2003 Fee: Euro 250,- (including teaching material) Accomodation: can be arranged at Hostel in Florence on request for a total of approx. Euro 340,- Application: including filled out questionnaire also at http://www.sai.uni-heidelberg.de/abt/IND/index.html link 'Sanskrit Summer School' by email to christoph.emmrich at urz.uni-heidelberg.de or letter to: ?Advanced Sanskrit Summer School' The Secretariat, Classical Indology, South Asia Institute, Heidelberg University, Im Neuenheimer Feld 330, 69120 Heidelberg, Germany Payment: on confirmation by cheque to the above address or by bank transfer to following account: Universit?t Heidelberg 21911 Sparkasse Heidelberg BLZ 672 500 20 Reference: ?Advanced Sanskrit Summer School' Sachkonto 54034 Kostenstelle 97028000 For further information please contact: Christoph Emmrich Tel. 06221/54-6303; Fax: 06221/54-6338 christoph.emmrich at urz.uni-heidelberg.de ------------------------------------------ Application Advanced Sanskrit Summer School 2003: Questionnaire Name: Sex: Age: Nationality: University: Department: Supervisor(s): Semesters: Subjects, courses: Title(s): Occupation, position: Current project: Modern languages: Classical languages: Years of Sanskrit training, where?: Variety of texts read: Previous courses or practice in spoken Sanskrit: Accomodation required: yes/no -- Christoph Emmrich Classical Indology South Asia Institute Heidelberg University Im Neuenheimer Feld 330 69120 Heidelberg - Germany Tel.: +49-54-6303 Fax: +49-54-6338 From mmdesh at UMICH.EDU Mon Feb 10 22:25:34 2003 From: mmdesh at UMICH.EDU (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 17:25:34 -0500 Subject: Pancakanya Message-ID: <161227072256.23782.1456899461504576091.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Evidently the verse occurs with many variants. The one I have heard goes like this: ahalyaa draupadii siitaa taaraa mandodarii tathaa / pancakam naa smaren nityam mahaapaatakanaazanam // It is likely that a more archaic pancakam naa got transformed into pancakanyaa in oral transmission. Madhav > ---------- > From: beitel > Reply To: Indology > Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 4:14 PM > To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk > Subject: Pancakanya > > Dear Colleagues, > I have been asked to forward the following note from Pradip Bhattacharya, and > would, indeed, be grateful for more on the matter myself, and for any further > references (I do not have a copy of the BP) or information. With thanks, > Alf Hiltebeitel > > ===== > > I wonder if you could possibly help me out to track down a reference. This is > the sloka celebrating the panchakanya, viz. > > Ahalya Draupadi Kunti Tara Mandodari tatha > panchakanya svaranityam mahapataka nashaka > > The problem is to find out where it occurs. One reference cites the Brahma > Purana, 3.7.219. Can anyone check up this reference? If found, can you let me > know the context in which it occurs, who utters the sloka and why? > > From Axel.Michaels at URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE Mon Feb 10 17:27:51 2003 From: Axel.Michaels at URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (Axel Michaels) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 18:27:51 +0100 Subject: Advanced Summer School in Spoken Sanskrit 2003 Message-ID: <161227072248.23782.16951666502290078302.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Lieber Herr Emmrich, wir sollten bei diesem Kurs wohl Fabrizia Baldissera als Co-organisatorin auff?hren. Best AM ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christoph Emmrich" To: Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 5:13 PM Subject: Advanced Summer School in Spoken Sanskrit 2003 > ADVANCED SUMMER SCHOOL IN SPOKEN SANSKRIT 2003 > > This year for the first time the South Asia Institute at Heidelberg > University in cooperation with the Universit? degli Studi di Firenze > offers a Summer School dedicated to advanced learners of spoken > Sanskrit. Shri Sadananda Das has prepared a course which especially > addresses the needs of the alumni of the previous Heidelberger Sanskrit > Summer Schools, but is equally open to those who already speak Sanskrit > fluently. What has been learnt in the previous courses will not only be > reactivated but shall offer the grounds for enlarging the vocabulary and > > for practicing the usage of idiomatic expressions as well as developing > free speech and having topically oriented discussions. By introducing > new material from gnomic and kaavya literature one of the foci once > again will be memorizing, recitation and theatrical performance. This > time the three-week, all-day course organized by the South Asia > Institute will be hosted by our partner university in Florence and will > show to the old and new participants of the Summer School that also in > Italy 'si parla sanscrito'. > > Prerequisites: participation in one of the previous Sanskrit Summer > Schools or oral fluency in Sanskrit, English > Organizer: Prof. Dr. Axel Michaels > Teacher: Dr. Sadananda Das > Participants: max. 15; min. 10 > Venue: Universit? degli Studi, Florence, Italy > Date: September 8 - 27, 2003 > Deadlines: application until 15.05.2002; payment by 30.06.2003 > Fee: Euro 250,- (including teaching material) > Accomodation: can be arranged at Hostel in Florence on request for a > total of approx. Euro 340,- > > Application: > including filled out questionnaire also at > http://www.sai.uni-heidelberg.de/abt/IND/index.html link 'Sanskrit > Summer School' > by email to christoph.emmrich at urz.uni-heidelberg.de or letter to: > 'Advanced Sanskrit Summer School' The Secretariat, Classical Indology, > South Asia Institute, Heidelberg University, Im Neuenheimer Feld 330, > 69120 Heidelberg, Germany > > Payment: > on confirmation by cheque to the above address > or by bank transfer to following account: > Universit?t Heidelberg > 21911 Sparkasse Heidelberg BLZ 672 500 20 > Reference: 'Advanced Sanskrit Summer School' Sachkonto 54034 > Kostenstelle 97028000 > > For further information please contact: > Christoph Emmrich > Tel. 06221/54-6303; Fax: 06221/54-6338 > christoph.emmrich at urz.uni-heidelberg.de > > ------------------------------------------ > > Application Advanced Sanskrit Summer School 2003: Questionnaire > > Name: > Sex: > Age: > Nationality: > University: > Department: > Supervisor(s): > Semesters: > Subjects, courses: > Title(s): > Occupation, position: > Current project: > Modern languages: > Classical languages: > Years of Sanskrit training, where?: > Variety of texts read: > Previous courses or practice in spoken Sanskrit: > Accomodation required: yes/no > > -- > > Christoph Emmrich > Classical Indology > South Asia Institute > Heidelberg University > Im Neuenheimer Feld 330 > 69120 Heidelberg - Germany > Tel.: +49-54-6303 > Fax: +49-54-6338 > From a.passi at ALMA.UNIBO.IT Mon Feb 10 18:09:56 2003 From: a.passi at ALMA.UNIBO.IT (Alex Passi) Date: Mon, 10 Feb 03 19:09:56 +0100 Subject: K.N. Dave's book In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227072250.23782.3822779535308691391.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dave's book seems to be available in BPagency's on-line catalog, http://www.bpagency.com/ at No. 9248. Alex From j_e_m_houben at YAHOO.COM Tue Feb 11 21:24:18 2003 From: j_e_m_houben at YAHOO.COM (Jan E.M. Houben) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 03 13:24:18 -0800 Subject: Pancakanyaa In-Reply-To: <60D386B60521234BB917967801F3A30F62016C@lsa-m4.lsa.adsroot.itcs.umich.edu> Message-ID: <161227072262.23782.14909550280765604874.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> but what would that mean? one should not (na metrically lengthened? or should one read vaa?) regularly remember the capital-sin-destroying quintet Ahalyaa etc. ? To me, the following version makes more sense: ahalyaa draupadii siitaa taaraa mandodarii tathaa / pa?cakanyaa.h smaren nityam mahaapaatakanaazinii.h // Curiously, Madhav Deshpande's version occurs in V.S. Apte's Practical Sanskrit-English Dictionary s.v. ahalyaa (with preface by V.S. Apte dated December 1890, revised edition 1958), whereas the above, to me more intelligible version occurs in V.S. Apte's Student's Sanskrit-English Dictionary, likewise s.v. ahalyaa (preface by V.S. Apte dated February 1890). J.H. --- Madhav Deshpande wrote: > Evidently the verse occurs with many variants. > The one I have heard goes like this: > > ahalyaa draupadii siitaa taaraa mandodarii > tathaa / > pancakam naa smaren nityam mahaapaatakanaazanam > // > > It is likely that a more archaic pancakam naa > got transformed into pancakanyaa in oral > transmission. > > > Madhav > > > ---------- > > From: beitel > > Reply To: Indology > > Sent: Monday, February 10, 2003 4:14 > PM > > To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk > > Subject: Pancakanya > > > > Dear Colleagues, > > I have been asked to forward the following > note from Pradip Bhattacharya, and > > would, indeed, be grateful for more on the > matter myself, and for any further > > references (I do not have a copy of the BP) > or information. With thanks, > > Alf Hiltebeitel > > > > ===== > > > > I wonder if you could possibly help me out to > track down a reference. This is > > the sloka celebrating the panchakanya, viz. > > > > Ahalya Draupadi Kunti Tara Mandodari tatha > > panchakanya svaranityam mahapataka nashaka > > > > The problem is to find out where it occurs. > One reference cites the Brahma > > Purana, 3.7.219. Can anyone check up this > reference? If found, can you let me > > know the context in which it occurs, who > utters the sloka and why? > > > > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From harunaga at SAS.UPENN.EDU Tue Feb 11 21:37:08 2003 From: harunaga at SAS.UPENN.EDU (Harunaga Isaacson) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 03 16:37:08 -0500 Subject: Pancakanyaa In-Reply-To: <20030211212418.45495.qmail@web40803.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <161227072264.23782.7517778363350836227.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Quoting "Jan E.M. Houben" : > but what would that mean? one should not (na > metrically lengthened? or should one read vaa?) > regularly remember the capital-sin-destroying > quintet Ahalyaa etc. ? naa is nom. sg. of n.r 'a man', 'a person'. In other words 'one should always remember/be mindful of this set of five: Ahalyaa etc.' Like Madhav I'm inclined to think pa~ncaka.m naa may well be more 'original'. > Curiously, Madhav Deshpande's version occurs in > V.S. Apte's Practical Sanskrit-English Dictionary > s.v. ahalyaa (with preface by V.S. Apte dated > December 1890, revised edition 1958), whereas the > above, to me more intelligible version occurs in > V.S. Apte's Student's Sanskrit-English > Dictionary, likewise s.v. ahalyaa (preface by > V.S. Apte dated February 1890). > > J.H. > > --- Madhav Deshpande wrote: > > Evidently the verse occurs with many variants. > > The one I have heard goes like this: > > > > ahalyaa draupadii siitaa taaraa mandodarii > > tathaa / > > pancakam naa smaren nityam mahaapaatakanaazanam > > // > > > > It is likely that a more archaic pancakam naa > > got transformed into pancakanyaa in oral > > transmission. Harunaga Isaacson -- Harunaga Isaacson South Asia Studies University of Pennsylvania 820 Williams Hall 36th and Spruce Streets Philadelphia, PA 19104-6305 USA tel. +1 215 898 6047 > > From j_e_m_houben at YAHOO.COM Wed Feb 12 01:52:42 2003 From: j_e_m_houben at YAHOO.COM (Jan E.M. Houben) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 03 17:52:42 -0800 Subject: colour of biestings of Indian cow??? In-Reply-To: <60D386B60521234BB917967801F3A30F62016C@lsa-m4.lsa.adsroot.itcs.umich.edu> Message-ID: <161227072266.23782.9967613877742738487.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The freshly pressed Soma is in the .RV occasionally referred to with the term piiy/uu.sa 'biestings' (i.e. the milk of a cow the first few days after calving; it contains special nutrients and protective/purifying substances needed by the calf only in its first few days). The term is sometimes cited as a reason to believe that the Soma must have had a milky nature of its own, i.e. even before being mixed with cow's milk. (Even though even dh/ii thoughts are "milked" in the Veda so that the insistence on literalness is not compelling.) Hence this would point in the direction of a plant with milky juice, and constitute an argument against ephedra, one of the current main candidates. HOWEVER, according to a thoroughly acquainted relative, the biestings of a cow may have all kinds of colours, green, reddish, etc. but is normally not milky white. This does not apply to e.g. the first milk of a goat after getting a kid. My question: does anyone know whether the Indian cow's biestings is milky white or colourful? Thanks, Jan __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From Martin.Gansten at TEOL.LU.SE Tue Feb 11 20:10:47 2003 From: Martin.Gansten at TEOL.LU.SE (Martin Gansten) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 03 21:10:47 +0100 Subject: Sinological question (divination) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227072259.23782.1407910199560272461.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> This may seem an odd subject for an indological discussion list; but in connection with my work on South Indian naa.dii divination, I have come across a reference to a typologically similar form of Chinese divination called t'ieh pan shen shu, and am looking for additional information. Apparently the divinatory method is to identify (by means of the client's birth data) certain numbered sentences in special divination books -- sentences of a rather specific nature, such as 'Your mother is 34 years older than you', or 'Your father is an army officer'; etc. Any information on this phenomenon would be greatly appreciated; and if someone knows of a more appropriate forum for this question, please feel free to forward it. Thanks in advance, Martin Gansten From mmdesh at UMICH.EDU Wed Feb 12 02:43:32 2003 From: mmdesh at UMICH.EDU (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Tue, 11 Feb 03 21:43:32 -0500 Subject: colour of biestings of Indian cow??? Message-ID: <161227072269.23782.10509648891661149598.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I have not seen the biestings of Indian cows directly, but I have eaten numerous times in Pune a sweet thinkened milk dish made out of it that is called kharvas in Marathi. It always looked a little yellowish, never greenish or redish. Madhav > ---------- > From: Jan E.M. Houben > Reply To: Indology > Sent: Tuesday, February 11, 2003 8:52 PM > To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk > Subject: colour of biestings of Indian cow??? > > The freshly pressed Soma is in the .RV > occasionally referred to with the term piiy/uu.sa > 'biestings' (i.e. the milk of a cow the first few > days after calving; it contains special nutrients > and protective/purifying substances needed by the > calf only in its first few days). The term is > sometimes cited as a reason to believe that the > Soma must have had a milky nature of its own, > i.e. even before being mixed with cow's milk. > (Even though even dh/ii thoughts are "milked" in > the Veda so that the insistence on literalness is > not compelling.) Hence this would point in the > direction of a plant with milky juice, and > constitute an argument against ephedra, one of > the current main candidates. > HOWEVER, according to a thoroughly acquainted > relative, the biestings of a cow may have all > kinds of colours, green, reddish, etc. but is > normally not milky white. This does not apply to > e.g. the first milk of a goat after getting a > kid. My question: does anyone know whether the > Indian cow's biestings is milky white or > colourful? > Thanks, Jan > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day > http://shopping.yahoo.com > > From j_e_m_houben at YAHOO.COM Wed Feb 12 09:10:37 2003 From: j_e_m_houben at YAHOO.COM (Jan E.M. Houben) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 03 01:10:37 -0800 Subject: Pancakanyaa In-Reply-To: <1044999428.3e496d04e1efa@webmail.sas.upenn.edu> Message-ID: <161227072271.23782.5746374704257515142.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Yes, you're right, naa is of course N.Sg. of n.r, a form which the .RV in any case carefully avoids (for obvious reasons of functional ambiguity); the employment which is found, though rarely, in later Sanskrit (Renou notes Kir. 15.14 and jaina texts studied by Bloomfield) must be explained out of artificiality and/or analogy with -t.r stems (moreover, the functional ambiguity reduces when .Rgvedic metrical lengthening is restricted). The contrast between the male n.r and the five ladies is striking, as is the label kanyaa for epic heroines who knew more than one man/male god (in some versions kuntii instead of siitaa). According to Apte "one is recommended to repeat it in the morning"; searching for some context in acc. with Hiltebeitel's question: I could not find it in Shri Chandra Vasu's the Daily practice of the Hindus which gives some Vedic and Tantric material. J.H. --- Harunaga Isaacson wrote: > naa is nom. sg. of n.r 'a man', 'a person'. In > other words 'one should always > remember/be mindful of this set of five: > Ahalyaa etc.' __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day http://shopping.yahoo.com From GthomGt at CS.COM Wed Feb 12 14:12:30 2003 From: GthomGt at CS.COM (George Thompson) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 03 09:12:30 -0500 Subject: colour of biestings of Indian cow??? Message-ID: <161227072274.23782.9957361848422703047.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Hello Jan and List, Unfortunately, there is no evidence at least in the RV for the color of these beestings. Also, the word is heavily overlaid with celestial mythology, providing little information with regard to matters here on earth. In Book 9, for example, this piiy/uu.sa is always celestial [div/a.h]. This is one more reason why I think that that book is more or less useless to us with regard to identifying a real soma-plant [needless to say, of course, that the book is useful for other things!]. Elsewhere in the RV mythological associations are also present, but there is also the key formula, a.m;s/o.h piiy/uu.sa. This formula is several times accompanied by pratham/a or puurvy/a and it is for this reason that we know that the term actually refers to beestings in particular, and not to generic milk. Other non-Bk 9 passages tell us that these beestings may be pressed, filtered, portioned out, poured into the fire, etc. There are far more glimmers of a material reality in these passages, it seems to me, than in Bk 9. My general conclusion is that our best evidence for the identification of the ur-soma-plant comes from the other books of the RV. Of course, as I have pointed out at the Vedic Workshop, this formula can be derived from some Central Asian substrate language, and I would suggest that it provides some support to the claim that a.m;s/u is the original name of the original soma-plant. So, in sum, I don't think that we can count on very much help from Vedic realism with regard to the color of piiy/uu.sa. Perhaps it is not the color of the beestings of Indian cows that we should be considering, but rather the color of the beestings of Central Asian cows, of a few thousand years ago? Best wishes, George Thompson From athr at LOC.GOV Wed Feb 12 16:28:45 2003 From: athr at LOC.GOV (Allen W Thrasher) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 03 11:28:45 -0500 Subject: Hwa-Wei Lee appointed Chief, Asian Division, Library of Congress Message-ID: <161227072276.23782.1038017350535556895.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The following is the announcement by Carolyn Brown, Acting Director, Area Studies Collections, Library of Congress, of Dr. Lee's appointment. Allen Thrasher Senior Reference Librarian Southern Asia Section ANNOUNCEMENT I am pleased to announce the appointment of Dr. Hwa-Wei Lee, Dean Emeritus, University Libraries, Ohio University, as the new chief of the Asian Division, effective February 10, 2003. Dr. Lee graduated from National Taiwan Normal University, and received a Masters of Education from the University of Pittsburgh, a Masters in Library Science from the University of Pittsburgh and Carnegie Mellon University, and a Ph.D. from the University of Pittsburgh. For forty years he has held professional library positions at Pittsburgh, Duquesne, Edinboro (Pennsylvania), Colorado State, as well as Ohio University, where he was dean of the libraries for twenty-one years. Between 1968 and 1975, he served in the Library and Information Center of the Asian Institute of Technology and at Chulalongkorn University, both in Bangkok, Thailand. At Ohio University, Dr. Lee transformed a modest library into a library that achieved membership in the Association of Research Libraries. He also developed international collections for Southeast Asian Studies as well as for other parts of the world. He was a founding member and advisor to OhioLINK, a statewide system pooling materials of all major academic libraries into one unified entity. In 1979, he initiated a highly successful internship program that brought librarians from Africa, Asia, the Middle East, and Central America to the university. To date, over 175 librarians have participated in the program. He is known as an extremely effective fund raiser. Under his leadership, the endowments of the Ohio University libraries grew to over $8 million and other grants reached an excess of $2.5 million. Dr. Lee is well-known in international librarianship. He has served as a library consultant and lecturer in countries throughout Asia, including China, Hong Kong, Indonesia, Japan, Papua New Guinea, the Philippines, South Korea, Taiwan, and Thailand, under sponsorship from numerous organizations that include the Asia Foundation, the Food and Agricultural Organization of the UN, the Japan Foundation for Global Partnership, UNESCO, OCLC, and others. Dr. Lee has organized numerous international conferences both in the United States and abroad and has given service on international councils and committees. He is the author of three books and some sixty articles, conference papers, and consultant reports, as well as having edited conference proceedings. Throughout his career he has received awards and recognitions, including multiple year listings in various Who's Who publications. Upon his retirement many organizations presented him with awards for distinguished service, including the American Library Association, Asian/Pacific American Librarians Association, Chinese American Librarians Association, the Library Association of China (Taiwan), OhioLINK, Ohionet, and others. In 1999, Ohio University named the first floor of the Vernon R. Alden Library (the main library) the Hwa-Wei Lee Center for International Collections, and by resolution of the Board of Trustees of the University a new library building was named the Hwa-Wei Lee Library Annex. From rsalomon at U.WASHINGTON.EDU Wed Feb 12 21:07:03 2003 From: rsalomon at U.WASHINGTON.EDU (Richard Salomon) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 03 13:07:03 -0800 Subject: Stress patterns in Sanskrit Message-ID: <161227072284.23782.1135351932482050649.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Madhav, Do you think that the standard textbook rule of thumb for stress accent in Sanskrit (penultimate or antepenultimate syllable) is accurate in all cases? Is there, for example, a tendency to stress the root syllable in verb forms contrary to this rule (e.g. ku'rvanti, pratipa'dayanti)? Or can there be a double stress (primary + secondary) in some long words? Or does the pattern vary from region to region or speaker to speaker? In short, is there any real standard on this, and if so, what is it? Please send me your thoughts when you get a chance. Nothing urgent. Rich From mmdesh at UMICH.EDU Wed Feb 12 20:59:25 2003 From: mmdesh at UMICH.EDU (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 03 15:59:25 -0500 Subject: pancakanya Message-ID: <161227072281.23782.8740809719584903680.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> This verse is also typically included in the many popular praata.hsmara.na collections of verses. I was taught to recite it as I was growing up. Madhav > ---------- > From: venkat at ciefl.ac.in > Reply To: Indology > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 2:52 PM > To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk > Subject: pancakanya > > Nearly after 40 years later I hear the pancakanya sloka. My mother used to > recite this before going to bed along with another (now I realize ) Sanskrit > sloka to ward off snakes, scorpions and other harmful creatures. The verse, > from memory run like this: > > Karakotakasya naagasya ...damayanti cha rutuparanasya > rajarshi teerthanam kalinashanam > > and then > > Ahaylay draupadi kunti taara mandodari > tatha pancakanya smare nityam mahapataknashanam > > > These were recited five times before going to bed. > I now realize that they have puranic sources. > > D. Venkat Rao > > From mmdesh at UMICH.EDU Wed Feb 12 21:19:38 2003 From: mmdesh at UMICH.EDU (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Wed, 12 Feb 03 16:19:38 -0500 Subject: Stress patterns in Sanskrit Message-ID: <161227072286.23782.16829609924092990445.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Hi Rich, good to hear from you. Are you thinking about modern pronunciation of Sanskrit, or the historical accent of Sanskrit? These two are evidently completely unrelated and hence need to be looked at independently. Madhav > ---------- > From: Richard Salomon > Reply To: Indology > Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 4:07 PM > To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk > Subject: Stress patterns in Sanskrit > > Dear Madhav, > > Do you think that the standard textbook rule of thumb for stress accent in > Sanskrit (penultimate or antepenultimate syllable) is accurate in all cases? > Is there, for example, a tendency to stress the root syllable in verb forms > contrary to this rule (e.g. ku'rvanti, pratipa'dayanti)? Or can there be a > double stress (primary + secondary) in some long words? Or does the pattern > vary from region to region or speaker to speaker? In short, is there any > real standard on this, and if so, what is it? > > Please send me your thoughts when you get a chance. Nothing urgent. > > Rich > > From venkat at CIEFL.AC.IN Wed Feb 12 19:52:28 2003 From: venkat at CIEFL.AC.IN (venkat@ciefl.ac.in) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 03 01:22:28 +0530 Subject: pancakanya Message-ID: <161227072279.23782.3631057046296949215.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Nearly after 40 years later I hear the pancakanya sloka. My mother used to recite this before going to bed along with another (now I realize ) Sanskrit sloka to ward off snakes, scorpions and other harmful creatures. The verse, from memory run like this: Karakotakasya naagasya ...damayanti cha rutuparanasya rajarshi teerthanam kalinashanam and then Ahaylay draupadi kunti taara mandodari tatha pancakanya smare nityam mahapataknashanam These were recited five times before going to bed. I now realize that they have puranic sources. D. Venkat Rao From mmdesh at UMICH.EDU Thu Feb 13 10:46:01 2003 From: mmdesh at UMICH.EDU (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 03 05:46:01 -0500 Subject: pancakanya Message-ID: <161227072291.23782.11496705065969724783.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The verse I have in front of me goes like: karko.takasya naagasya damayantyaa nalasya ca / .rtupar.nasya raajar.se.h kiirtanam kalinaazanam // This is one of the many verses included under Praata.hsmara.na (p. 14), booklet titled Praata.hsmara.na, ed by J. B. Kesharkar, 5th edition, 1936, Pune. The same booklet also contains (p. 15): ahalyaa draupadii siitaa taaraa mandodarii tathaa / pancakanyaa.h smaren nityam mahaapaatakanaazanam // Also of interest may be the following verse (p. 13): pu.nyazloko nalo raajaa pu.nyazloko yudhi.s.thira.h / pu.nyazlokaa ca vaidehii pu.nyazloko janaardana.h // Madhav Deshpande > ---------- > From: Georg von Simson > Reply To: Indology > Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 4:05 AM > To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk > Subject: Re: pancakanya > > Since I am just writing an article on the Nala-and-DamayantI story, > the verse containing the names KarkoTaka, DamayantI and RtuparNa > would be interesting for me. Could you be so kind and quote a correct > sanskrit version? > > Best regards, > Georg v. Simson > > Madhav Deshpande wrote: > > >This verse is also typically included in the many popular > >praata.hsmara.na collections of verses. I was taught to recite it > >as I was growing up. > > Madhav > > > >> ---------- > >> From: venkat at ciefl.ac.in > >> Reply To: Indology > >> Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 2:52 PM > >> To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk > >> Subject: pancakanya > >> > >> Nearly after 40 years later I hear the pancakanya sloka. My mother used to > >> recite this before going to bed along with another (now I realize ) Sanskrit > >> sloka to ward off snakes, scorpions and other harmful creatures. The verse, > >> from memory run like this: > >> > >> Karakotakasya naagasya ...damayanti cha rutuparanasya > >> rajarshi teerthanam kalinashanam > >> > >> and then > >> > >> Ahaylay draupadi kunti taara mandodari > >> tatha pancakanya smare nityam mahapataknashanam > >> > >> > >> These were recited five times before going to bed. > >> I now realize that they have puranic sources. > >> > >> D. Venkat Rao > >> > >> > > From fsmith at BLUE.WEEG.UIOWA.EDU Thu Feb 13 15:12:27 2003 From: fsmith at BLUE.WEEG.UIOWA.EDU (fsmith) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 03 09:12:27 -0600 Subject: he.dhra? Message-ID: <161227072304.23782.2983894314508806282.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I have a lexical question: the 12th century Tantric text from Kerala, Iizaanazivagurudevapaddhati 42.1,15ab has the word he.dhra /he.dhraga in its account of bhuutavidyaa. 15ab reads: One possessed by a he.dhraga graha stands on his knees, keeps his head down, smiles, and holds his hands in a fist. I am unable to find this word elsewhere. Has anyone out there seen it? If so, where? I do not have here the Paaiasaddamaha.n.navo (Praak.rtazabdamahaar.nava.h). Can someone out there who might have it easily accessible please let me know if it's in there (or, as I say, anywhere else)? Thanks Fred Smith From jkirk at SPRO.NET Thu Feb 13 16:26:01 2003 From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 03 09:26:01 -0700 Subject: at risk again Message-ID: <161227072306.23782.8372507274280590255.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Yes--as a cultural anthropologist I am quite aware of phenomena of this sort, world-wide. JK ============================================================ BTW I. Koponen, our retired professor of botany, once told of New Guinea (where he did fieldwork) that the amount of exact nomenclature is widely variating. Of two peoples, living in neighbouring valleys, one was capable of naming more than 200 different plants, other perhaps 20 or so. Regards, Klaus -- Klaus Karttunen, Ph.D. Docent of Indology and Classical Ethnography Institute of Asian and African Studies PL 59 (Unioninkatu 38 B), 00014 University of Helsinki, FINLAND phone 358-0-19122188, fax 358-0-19122094 From mmdesh at UMICH.EDU Thu Feb 13 14:58:48 2003 From: mmdesh at UMICH.EDU (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 03 09:58:48 -0500 Subject: kalinAzana (was: pancakanya) Message-ID: <161227072301.23782.15525422075750854906.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> That would seem to be the idea in the mind of the composer of the verse and perhaps in the mind of one who put this verse in this prayer collection. Recitation of the verses on the other hand is rather a mechanical act and does not necessarily suggest a specific intention behind reciting a specific verse. Madhav Deshpande > ---------- > From: Georg von Simson > Reply To: Indology > Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 6:59 AM > To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk > Subject: kalinAzana (was: pancakanya) > > Dear Madhav Deshpande, > > thank you very much for your quick reply! One more question: Wouldn?t > one who learns this verse as a kind of prayer today, understand kali > as kaliyuga (and its negative effects)? In the Nala story Kali is, of > course, the demon of the worst cast of dice, and even if the author > already had some idea of its connection with the cosmic period, this > does not appear on the surface of the text. > > Best wishes, > Georg v. Simson > > >The verse I have in front of me goes like: > > > >karko.takasya naagasya damayantyaa nalasya ca / > >.rtupar.nasya raajar.se.h kiirtanam kalinaazanam // > > > >This is one of the many verses included under Praata.hsmara.na (p. > >14), booklet titled Praata.hsmara.na, ed by J. B. Kesharkar, 5th > >edition, 1936, Pune. > > > >The same booklet also contains (p. 15): > > > >ahalyaa draupadii siitaa taaraa mandodarii tathaa / > >pancakanyaa.h smaren nityam mahaapaatakanaazanam // > > > >Also of interest may be the following verse (p. 13): > > > >pu.nyazloko nalo raajaa pu.nyazloko yudhi.s.thira.h / > >pu.nyazlokaa ca vaidehii pu.nyazloko janaardana.h // > > > > > >Madhav Deshpande > > > > From g.v.simson at EAST.UIO.NO Thu Feb 13 09:05:47 2003 From: g.v.simson at EAST.UIO.NO (Georg von Simson) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 03 10:05:47 +0100 Subject: pancakanya In-Reply-To: <60D386B60521234BB917967801F3A30F62017A@lsa-m4.lsa.adsroot.itcs.umich.edu> Message-ID: <161227072289.23782.2071746031537309689.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Since I am just writing an article on the Nala-and-DamayantI story, the verse containing the names KarkoTaka, DamayantI and RtuparNa would be interesting for me. Could you be so kind and quote a correct sanskrit version? Best regards, Georg v. Simson Madhav Deshpande wrote: >This verse is also typically included in the many popular >praata.hsmara.na collections of verses. I was taught to recite it >as I was growing up. > Madhav > >> ---------- >> From: venkat at ciefl.ac.in >> Reply To: Indology >> Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 2:52 PM >> To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk >> Subject: pancakanya >> >> Nearly after 40 years later I hear the pancakanya sloka. My mother used to >> recite this before going to bed along with another (now I realize ) Sanskrit >> sloka to ward off snakes, scorpions and other harmful creatures. The verse, >> from memory run like this: >> >> Karakotakasya naagasya ...damayanti cha rutuparanasya >> rajarshi teerthanam kalinashanam >> >> and then >> >> Ahaylay draupadi kunti taara mandodari >> tatha pancakanya smare nityam mahapataknashanam >> >> >> These were recited five times before going to bed. >> I now realize that they have puranic sources. >> >> D. Venkat Rao >> >> From g.v.simson at EAST.UIO.NO Thu Feb 13 11:59:52 2003 From: g.v.simson at EAST.UIO.NO (Georg von Simson) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 03 12:59:52 +0100 Subject: kalinAzana (was: pancakanya) In-Reply-To: <60D386B60521234BB917967801F3A30F620183@lsa-m4.lsa.adsroot.itcs.umich.edu> Message-ID: <161227072296.23782.10799659546809019891.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Madhav Deshpande, thank you very much for your quick reply! One more question: Wouldn?t one who learns this verse as a kind of prayer today, understand kali as kaliyuga (and its negative effects)? In the Nala story Kali is, of course, the demon of the worst cast of dice, and even if the author already had some idea of its connection with the cosmic period, this does not appear on the surface of the text. Best wishes, Georg v. Simson >The verse I have in front of me goes like: > >karko.takasya naagasya damayantyaa nalasya ca / >.rtupar.nasya raajar.se.h kiirtanam kalinaazanam // > >This is one of the many verses included under Praata.hsmara.na (p. >14), booklet titled Praata.hsmara.na, ed by J. B. Kesharkar, 5th >edition, 1936, Pune. > >The same booklet also contains (p. 15): > >ahalyaa draupadii siitaa taaraa mandodarii tathaa / >pancakanyaa.h smaren nityam mahaapaatakanaazanam // > >Also of interest may be the following verse (p. 13): > >pu.nyazloko nalo raajaa pu.nyazloko yudhi.s.thira.h / >pu.nyazlokaa ca vaidehii pu.nyazloko janaardana.h // > > >Madhav Deshpande > From Klaus.Karttunen at HELSINKI.FI Thu Feb 13 12:15:59 2003 From: Klaus.Karttunen at HELSINKI.FI (Klaus Karttunen) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 03 14:15:59 +0200 Subject: at risk again Message-ID: <161227072299.23782.13110354704930239678.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> jkirk wrote: > > Intriguing! what got me started on this were the many terms in Kalidasa's > Meghaduta for birds and flowers. Probably nobody has gone through it to see > if they could write a "nature concordance' for that work? Perhaps you should note these, too: HENSGEN, Hans: "Die Fauna bei Ka*lida*sa", IIJ 2, 1958, 33-53, 128-148. KREYENBORG, Hermann: diss. Beitr?ge zur altindischen Zoologie. 1. ?ber die Tiere bei Ka*lida*sa. 1921, publ. 1926 (?, never seen). RYLANDS, C. A.: "The Plant Karn*ika*ra in Ka*lida*sa Works", IC 15, 1948-49, 50-52. Even if the medical viewpoint is very different from that of poetry, Meulenbeld is the starting point with plant names. BTW I. Koponen, our retired professor of botany, once told of New Guinea (where he did fieldwork) that the amount of exact nomenclature is widely variating. Of two peoples, living in neighbouring valleys, one was capable of naming more than 200 different plants, other perhaps 20 or so. Regards, Klaus -- Klaus Karttunen, Ph.D. Docent of Indology and Classical Ethnography Institute of Asian and African Studies PL 59 (Unioninkatu 38 B), 00014 University of Helsinki, FINLAND phone 358-0-19122188, fax 358-0-19122094 From deviprasad at IFPINDIA.ORG Thu Feb 13 11:02:12 2003 From: deviprasad at IFPINDIA.ORG (DEVI IFP) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 03 16:32:12 +0530 Subject: pancakanya Message-ID: <161227072294.23782.1734374012051683605.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> ahalyaa draupadii taaraa kunti mandodarii tathaa \ pancakanyaa.h smaren nityam mahaapaatakanaa"sanam \\ I this is the main verse. From which anything can be derived. regards deviprasad From witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU Fri Feb 14 02:51:20 2003 From: witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU (Michael Witzel) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 03 21:51:20 -0500 Subject: Documentary on Max Mueller Message-ID: <161227072309.23782.17720968635232142744.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> For all those who love (to hate) the Indologist Max Mueller, Deutsche Welle, Cologne (the German foreign broadcasting service) http://www.dw-world.de/english will air a 2 part documentary on Feb. 14 and 15, at 18:30 UTC, (rebroadcast at 0:30, 6:30, 12:30 UTC) (online TV: see: upper right corner), in their IN FOCUS program, see pdf at: http://www.dw-world.de/dwelle/cda/detail/dwelle.cda.detail.download/0,3830,50167 1_45725,00.pdf ----- For the Sanskrit program see: http://www.dwelle.de/sanskrit/Welcome.html and online audio: http://www.dwelle.de/sanskrit/audio.html (This week on ... Jyotisa) ENJOY! MW ============================================================ Michael Witzel Department of Sanskrit & Indian Studies, Harvard University 2 Divinity Avenue, Cambridge MA 02138, USA ph. 1- 617-496 2990 (also messages) home page: http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwpage.htm From jkirk at SPRO.NET Fri Feb 14 05:56:11 2003 From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk) Date: Thu, 13 Feb 03 22:56:11 -0700 Subject: Documentary on Max Mueller Message-ID: <161227072311.23782.894426041270171754.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Prof Witzel, Going to the URLs given here tells me nothing about the MM broadcast. This URL gets a 404 http://www.dw-world.de/dwelle/cda/detail/dwelle.cda.detail.download/0,3830,5 0167 Could you maybe refine these links a bit more? This one accessed just now says nothing about a forthcoming program on MM -- http://www.dw-world.de/english How did you find this out? maybe on short wave? Please be more specific as to where to find this program tomorrow. Thanks Joanna Kirkpatrick --------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Witzel" To: Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 7:51 PM Subject: Documentary on Max Mueller > For all those who love (to hate) the Indologist Max Mueller, > > Deutsche Welle, Cologne (the German foreign broadcasting service) > http://www.dw-world.de/english > will air a 2 part documentary on Feb. 14 and 15, > > at 18:30 UTC, (rebroadcast at 0:30, 6:30, 12:30 UTC) > (online TV: see: upper right corner), > > in their IN FOCUS program, see pdf at: > http://www.dw-world.de/dwelle/cda/detail/dwelle.cda.detail.download/0,3830,5 0167 > 1_45725,00.pdf > > ----- > > For the Sanskrit program see: > http://www.dwelle.de/sanskrit/Welcome.html > > and online audio: http://www.dwelle.de/sanskrit/audio.html > (This week on ... Jyotisa) > > ENJOY! > > MW > ============================================================ > Michael Witzel > Department of Sanskrit & Indian Studies, Harvard University > 2 Divinity Avenue, Cambridge MA 02138, USA > > ph. 1- 617-496 2990 (also messages) > home page: http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwpage.htm > > From lnelson at SANDIEGO.EDU Fri Feb 14 14:34:35 2003 From: lnelson at SANDIEGO.EDU (Lance Nelson) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 03 06:34:35 -0800 Subject: Documentary on Max Mueller In-Reply-To: <002501c2d3ed$c775c810$2930cece@JKIRK> Message-ID: <161227072316.23782.13136889127085126394.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> On 13 Feb 2003 at 22:56, jkirk wrote: > Going to the URLs given here tells me nothing about the MM broadcast. > This URL gets a 404 > http://www.dw-world.de/dwelle/cda/detail/dwelle.cda.detail.download/0, > 3830,5 0167 Try: http://makeashorterlink.com/?N27D16773 Lance ---------------------- Lance Nelson Theology & Religious Studies University of San Diego lnelson at sandiego.edu From lnelson at SANDIEGO.EDU Fri Feb 14 14:34:53 2003 From: lnelson at SANDIEGO.EDU (Lance Nelson) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 03 06:34:53 -0800 Subject: [RISA-L] FW: [ScS] Documentary on Max Mueller In-Reply-To: <000101c2d3ee$7b445c30$ece31c41@CarasGaladhon> Message-ID: <161227072319.23782.13842083045103649963.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> If you're having trouble with the long URL, try: http://makeashorterlink.com/?N27D16773 Lance On 14 Feb 2003 at 1:01, Carlos Lopez wrote: > in their IN FOCUS program, see pdf at: > http://www.dw-world.de/dwelle/cda/detail/dwelle.cda.detail.download/0, > 3830,5 0167 1_45725,00.pdf ---------------------- Lance Nelson Theology & Religious Studies University of San Diego lnelson at sandiego.edu From witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU Fri Feb 14 14:28:50 2003 From: witzel at FAS.HARVARD.EDU (Michael Witzel) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 03 09:28:50 -0500 Subject: Documentary on Max Mueller (details) In-Reply-To: <002501c2d3ed$c775c810$2930cece@JKIRK> Message-ID: <161227072314.23782.14473185687280667412.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Thanks, Prof. Kirkpatrick, I think the easiest way is to go to http://www.dw-world.de/english which allows you to access the internet broadcast of D.Welle - i f you have a player installed in your machine, such as/especially: Real Player. (freely avalaible at http://www.real.com) When you open http://www.dw-world.de/english and click on DW-TV live, in the upper right corner, this will automatically open a new, smaller window [with Real Player] with the live broadcast. (It will initially, before/while down loading, also give you the opportunity to open your own (already installed) "external player", such as Real Player. Sometimes better than the DW-window) {{ All of this is also available in other languages, such as Spanish, Hausa, Serbian, Indian langs., etc., thus: http://www.dw-world.de/spanish To choose these, go to "language selector" in upper part of first window }} *** As for short wave, it certainly is a possibility but that would be DW-Radio, not DW_TV. Radio is avaibable online as well (go to upper right corner of 1st window) I do not know current short wave frequencies. General rule : try lower ones in the evening (such as 49 m / 6 MHz) and higher ones in day time (25 m/ 11.5 MHz) for America; for Asia, generally, even higher frequencies will work, such as 13 m/25 Mhz, 16, 19 m bands, etc. PS: I now see this note on frequencies : http://www.dw-world.de/german/0,3367,4137,00.html However, it seems that the MM program is only broadcast on TV (?) *** The first MM program (saw it last night) provides some general cultural background and reports on MM's stay in Leipzig, Paris and London. You can also see some of our current Indological colleagues, in interviews, incl. A. Michaels, D. Rothermund, R. Thapar.... *** NB: I just see that later in February there will be a Radio program on Nepalese Music / G.M. Wegner, who has started a Univ. Dept. of Nepalese Music at Kathmandu a few years ago and who is a good Newari style drummer himself.... Hope this helps. MW ============= Dear Prof Witzel, > >Going to the URLs given here tells me nothing about the MM broadcast. This >URL gets a 404 >http://www.dw-world.de/dwelle/cda/detail/dwelle.cda.detail.download/0,3830,5 >0167 > >Could you maybe refine these links a bit more? This one accessed just now >says nothing about a forthcoming program on MM -- >http://www.dw-world.de/english > >How did you find this out? maybe on short wave? Please be more specific as >to where to find this program tomorrow. > >Thanks >Joanna Kirkpatrick >--------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Michael Witzel" >To: >Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 7:51 PM >Subject: Documentary on Max Mueller > > >> For all those who love (to hate) the Indologist Max Mueller, >> >> Deutsche Welle, Cologne (the German foreign broadcasting service) >> http://www.dw-world.de/english >> will air a 2 part documentary on Feb. 14 and 15, >> >> at 18:30 UTC, (rebroadcast at 0:30, 6:30, 12:30 UTC) >> (online TV: see: upper right corner), >> >> in their IN FOCUS program, see pdf at: >> >http://www.dw-world.de/dwelle/cda/detail/dwelle.cda.detail.download/0,3830,5 >0167 >> 1_45725,00.pdf >> >> ----- >> >> For the Sanskrit program see: >> http://www.dwelle.de/sanskrit/Welcome.html >> >> and online audio: http://www.dwelle.de/sanskrit/audio.html >> (This week on ... Jyotisa) >> >> ENJOY! >> >> MW >> ============================================================ >> Michael Witzel >> Department of Sanskrit & Indian Studies, Harvard University >> 2 Divinity Avenue, Cambridge MA 02138, USA >> >> ph. 1- 617-496 2990 (also messages) >> home page: http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwpage.htm >> >> ============================================================ Michael Witzel Department of Sanskrit & Indian Studies, Harvard University 2 Divinity Avenue, Cambridge MA 02138, USA ph. 1- 617-496 2990 (also messages) home page: http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwpage.htm From jkirk at SPRO.NET Fri Feb 14 16:31:16 2003 From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 03 09:31:16 -0700 Subject: Documentary on Max Mueller (details) Message-ID: <161227072322.23782.14354345498410868424.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Prof Witzel, Thanks--I will try again--the organization of DW's page is more tastefully restrained than say the BBC online and less obvious, therefore, so I missed it. Thanks to all else who told me what to do! I already have the latest RealPlayer. Clumsily yours, JK ======================== > Thanks, Prof. Kirkpatrick, > > I think the easiest way is to go to > http://www.dw-world.de/english > > When you open http://www.dw-world.de/english and click on DW-TV live, > in the upper right corner, this will automatically open a new, smaller > window [with Real Player] with the live broadcast. > > > (It will initially, before/while down loading, also give you the > opportunity to open your own (already installed) "external player", such as > Real Player. Sometimes better than the DW-window) > > > {{ All of this is also available in other languages, such as Spanish, > Hausa, Serbian, Indian langs., etc., thus: http://www.dw-world.de/spanish > To choose these, go to "language selector" in upper part of first window }} > > *** > > As for short wave, it certainly is a possibility but that would be > DW-Radio, not DW_TV. > Radio is avaibable online as well (go to upper right corner of 1st window) > > I do not know current short wave frequencies. General rule : try lower > ones in the evening (such as 49 m / 6 MHz) and higher ones in day time (25 > m/ 11.5 MHz) for America; for Asia, generally, even higher frequencies will > work, such as 13 m/25 Mhz, 16, 19 m bands, etc. > PS: I now see this note on frequencies : > http://www.dw-world.de/german/0,3367,4137,00.html > > However, it seems that the MM program is only broadcast on TV (?) > > *** > > The first MM program (saw it last night) provides some general cultural > background and reports on MM's stay in Leipzig, Paris and London. You can > also see some of our current Indological colleagues, in interviews, incl. > A. Michaels, D. Rothermund, R. Thapar.... > > *** > > NB: I just see that later in February there will be a Radio program on > Nepalese Music / G.M. Wegner, who has started a Univ. Dept. of Nepalese > Music at Kathmandu a few years ago and who is a good Newari style drummer > himself.... > > Hope this helps. > > MW > > ============= > > Dear Prof Witzel, > > > >Going to the URLs given here tells me nothing about the MM broadcast. This > >URL gets a 404 > >http://www.dw-world.de/dwelle/cda/detail/dwelle.cda.detail.download/0,3830, 5 > >0167 > > > >Could you maybe refine these links a bit more? This one accessed just now > >says nothing about a forthcoming program on MM -- > >http://www.dw-world.de/english > > > >How did you find this out? maybe on short wave? Please be more specific as > >to where to find this program tomorrow. > > > >Thanks > >Joanna Kirkpatrick > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Michael Witzel" > >To: > >Sent: Thursday, February 13, 2003 7:51 PM > >Subject: Documentary on Max Mueller > > > > > >> For all those who love (to hate) the Indologist Max Mueller, > >> > >> Deutsche Welle, Cologne (the German foreign broadcasting service) > >> http://www.dw-world.de/english > >> will air a 2 part documentary on Feb. 14 and 15, > >> > >> at 18:30 UTC, (rebroadcast at 0:30, 6:30, 12:30 UTC) > >> (online TV: see: upper right corner), > >> > >> in their IN FOCUS program, see pdf at: > >> > >http://www.dw-world.de/dwelle/cda/detail/dwelle.cda.detail.download/0,3830, 5 > >0167 > >> 1_45725,00.pdf > >> > >> ----- > >> > >> For the Sanskrit program see: > >> http://www.dwelle.de/sanskrit/Welcome.html > >> > >> and online audio: http://www.dwelle.de/sanskrit/audio.html > >> (This week on ... Jyotisa) > >> > >> ENJOY! > >> > >> MW > >> ============================================================ > >> Michael Witzel > >> Department of Sanskrit & Indian Studies, Harvard University > >> 2 Divinity Avenue, Cambridge MA 02138, USA > >> > >> ph. 1- 617-496 2990 (also messages) > >> home page: http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwpage.htm > >> > >> > > ============================================================ > Michael Witzel > Department of Sanskrit & Indian Studies, Harvard University > 2 Divinity Avenue, Cambridge MA 02138, USA > > ph. 1- 617-496 2990 (also messages) > home page: http://www.people.fas.harvard.edu/~witzel/mwpage.htm > > From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK Fri Feb 14 17:22:39 2003 From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Fri, 14 Feb 03 17:22:39 +0000 Subject: he.dhra? In-Reply-To: <3E4C428A@itsnt5.its.uiowa.edu> Message-ID: <161227072324.23782.277051346036213883.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Hi, Fred. I've got the Paiasaddamahannavo open beside me, and it doesn't have your word, I'm afraid. The nearest is he.daa strii [de] 1. gha.taa, samuuha (supaa 386; 530) 2. dyuuta aadi khelane kaa sthaana, a.khaa.daa (dhamma 12 .tii). Dominik On Thu, 13 Feb 2003, fsmith wrote: > I have a lexical question: the 12th century Tantric text from Kerala, > Iizaanazivagurudevapaddhati 42.1,15ab has the word he.dhra /he.dhraga in its > account of bhuutavidyaa. 15ab reads: One possessed by a he.dhraga graha stands > on his knees, keeps his head down, smiles, and holds his hands in a fist. I am > unable to find this word elsewhere. Has anyone out there seen it? If so, > where? I do not have here the Paaiasaddamaha.n.navo > (Praak.rtazabdamahaar.nava.h). Can someone out there who might have it easily > accessible please let me know if it's in there (or, as I say, anywhere else)? > Thanks > > Fred Smith > From fsmith at BLUE.WEEG.UIOWA.EDU Tue Feb 18 00:42:15 2003 From: fsmith at BLUE.WEEG.UIOWA.EDU (fsmith) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 03 18:42:15 -0600 Subject: he.dhra? Message-ID: <161227072332.23782.4510396224949454573.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Many thanks to Robert and Dominik. Yes, I have encountered a number of demonesses with non IA names, including in the texts Domimik mentions. My impression from the medical and tantric texts I have been examining is that there was, on the ground, a very short distance between Sanskritic and non-Sanskritic cultures. This, of course, is increasingly well-known. Now see Ronald Davidson, Indian Esoteric Buddhism: A Social History of the Tantric Movement (Columbia Univ. Press, 2002). regards Fred >===== Original Message From Dominik Wujastyk ===== >On Mon, 17 Feb 2003, Robert Zydenbos (by way of Robert Zydenbos ) wrote: > >> Am 13 Feb 2003 um 9:12 schrieb fsmith: >> > I have a lexical question: the 12th century Tantric text from Kerala, >> > Iizaanazivagurudevapaddhati 42.1,15ab has the word he.dhra /he.dhraga >> > in its account of bhuutavidyaa. 15ab reads: One possessed by a >> > he.dhraga graha stands on his knees, keeps his head down, smiles, and >> > holds his hands in a fist. I am unable to find this word elsewhere. > >Zydenbos's reply reminds me, Fred, that the names of the demonesses in >Susruta and the Ravanakumaratantra etc. are often not really Sanskrit >either. "Pilipicchika" etc. > >Dominik From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK Mon Feb 17 23:00:43 2003 From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 03 23:00:43 +0000 Subject: he.dhra? In-Reply-To: <200302171716.42420.zydenbos@lrz.uni-muenchen.de> Message-ID: <161227072330.23782.17476343908649184274.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> On Mon, 17 Feb 2003, Robert Zydenbos (by way of Robert Zydenbos ) wrote: > Am 13 Feb 2003 um 9:12 schrieb fsmith: > > I have a lexical question: the 12th century Tantric text from Kerala, > > Iizaanazivagurudevapaddhati 42.1,15ab has the word he.dhra /he.dhraga > > in its account of bhuutavidyaa. 15ab reads: One possessed by a > > he.dhraga graha stands on his knees, keeps his head down, smiles, and > > holds his hands in a fist. I am unable to find this word elsewhere. Zydenbos's reply reminds me, Fred, that the names of the demonesses in Susruta and the Ravanakumaratantra etc. are often not really Sanskrit either. "Pilipicchika" etc. Dominik From cln at SAS.UPENN.EDU Tue Feb 18 17:07:23 2003 From: cln at SAS.UPENN.EDU (Christian Lee Novetzke) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 03 12:07:23 -0500 Subject: None Message-ID: <161227072334.23782.10306093575105068679.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Hello, I am forwarding this announcement on behalf of Madhu Kishwar. Please respond directly to her. Christian Deadline Extended for Indian Scholars We have received many requests from interested scholars in Indian Universities and research institutions for an extension of the deadline for submission of proposals from January 31 because they received information about this conference very late, and that too only through hearsay. We had sent posters to hundreds of academic institutions announcing the conference "Call for Papers". However, in a number of cases these posters were never put up. Hence the communication gap. We regret very much that we failed to advertise our Conference through academic journals with a wide reach and relied mainly on wall posters and email postings. Even though the response to our conference is already overwhelming, we are extending the deadline for submission of panel/paper proposals for Indian scholars to make amends for our lapse. All those who have submitted their proposals by January 31, will be informed about the decision of the Selection Committee in February itself. Those sending proposals late, will be informed accordingly. Extended Deadline for submission: March 10, 2003. Christian Lee Novetzke Assistant Professor of South Asia Studies University of Pennsylvania, 820 Williams Hall 36th and Spruce Streets Philadelphia, PA 19104-6305, USA Email: cln at sas.upenn.edu Website: http://www.sas.upenn.edu/~cln Tel: (215) 898-7475 Fax: (215) 573-2138 From fsmith at BLUE.WEEG.UIOWA.EDU Tue Feb 18 21:17:22 2003 From: fsmith at BLUE.WEEG.UIOWA.EDU (fsmith) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 03 15:17:22 -0600 Subject: Helsinki Message-ID: <161227072336.23782.16204908574506875770.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> It may be a little early to begin inquiries, but I wonder if we can report publicly here any good deals on airfare to the conference in Helsinki this summer, as they may arise... regards, Fred Smith From asg at U.WASHINGTON.EDU Wed Feb 19 00:18:23 2003 From: asg at U.WASHINGTON.EDU (Andrew Glass) Date: Tue, 18 Feb 03 16:18:23 -0800 Subject: Catalogue of the Gandhari Corpus Message-ID: <161227072339.23782.15987376918395890442.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The British Library/University of Washington Early Buddhist Manuscripts Project has made available an electronic catalogue of Gandharan inscriptions, coins, manuscripts, and secular documents, as well as a bibliography of secondary literature and studies relating to Gandhari. http://depts.washington.edu/ebmp/inscriptions.php These pages represent a work in progress. Scholars are invited to send in additions and corrections to the data in the hopes that this will eventually become a comprehensive catalogue of all known materials in and relating to the Gandhari language. Andrew Glass Research Assistant Dept. of Asian Languages and Literature Box 3535321 University of Washington Seattle, WA 98115 From vielle at ORI.UCL.AC.BE Wed Feb 19 19:36:08 2003 From: vielle at ORI.UCL.AC.BE (Christophe Vielle) Date: Wed, 19 Feb 03 20:36:08 +0100 Subject: 2 956 900 vessels/k.sutila/ku.duba In-Reply-To: <000701c2d7ac$6d278b10$df00a8c0@c1526004d> Message-ID: <161227072341.23782.11023025550824534203.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear colleagues, could someone help me in giving the Sanskrit text of Vaagbha.ta (the Elder)'s A.s.taa;ngasa.mgraha, /saariirasthaana 5.59 (reference from Meulenbeld's HIML), which gives the total amount of the vessels in the body as being 2 956 900. The number is interesting because in the Yaaj?avalkyasm.rti (III, 101) the number is slightly different, viz. 2 900 956 (ekonatri.mza.l lak.saa.ni tathaa nava zataani ca / .sa.tpa?caazac ca), clearly confirmed by the commentator Vij?aanezvara. In Caraka it is only 29 956. But in a physiological passage (which follows an embryological one) in the Jaiminiiyasa.mhitaa of the Brahmaa.n.dapuraa.na (that my colleague Sandra Smets is studying with me), which is usually very close to the text of the sm.rti or to the content of Vij?aanezvara's commentary, however in this case the total amount of the vessels is the same than in Vaagbha.ta: navottaraa.ni dehe 'smin niyutaani ca vi.mzati.h / .sa.tpa?caazat sahasraa.ni zataani nava caadhikam / siraadhamanyor milita.h zaakhaabheda udiirita.h //JaiSa 47 .58 viz. 29 niyutas (= 2 900 000) and 56 900 = 2 956 900 In addition to that, two little things: - the JaiSa says that when the embryo is going out of the uterus, he has "the form of a k.sutila" ni.hsaare k.sutilaakaaro vaasanocchvaasamaatraka.h / what is this k.sutila (given by all the manuscripts)?? - the JaiSa in its measurement of each substance of the body (a passage quite original in comparison with other sources) uses the term ku.duba : instead of the more classical ku.dava? (a dialectal/dravidian variant?) Thank you very much for your help Dr. Christophe Vielle Centre d'Etudes de l'Inde et de l'Asie du Sud Institut orientaliste Place Blaise Pascal 1 B - 1348 Louvain-la-Neuve BELGIUM Tel. +32-(0)10-47 49 54 (office)/ -(0)2-640 62 66 (home) E-mail: vielle at ori.ucl.ac.be From harunaga at SAS.UPENN.EDU Thu Feb 20 07:51:42 2003 From: harunaga at SAS.UPENN.EDU (Harunaga Isaacson) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 03 02:51:42 -0500 Subject: 2 956 900 vessels/k.sutila/ku.duba In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227072344.23782.18122802924008787844.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Quoting Christophe Vielle : > - the JaiSa says that when the embryo is going out of the uterus, he has > "the form of a k.sutila" > ni.hsaare k.sutilaakaaro vaasanocchvaasamaatraka.h / > what is this k.sutila (given by all the manuscripts)?? With the proviso that I have hardly read literature of this type (I'd like to see a little more of the text), I'm willing anyway to suggest, since I have seen no responses yet from knowledgeable people, that you may not be dividing the words correctly. k.sutila would indeed be a strange word (for which you, I suppose from your query, found no parallel); and the locative ni.hsaare that your word-division seems to yield is also strange to me (though, again, I'd want to see more of the context; this is clearly not the complete sentence). But the first paada can be read as one compound of perfectly common Sanskrit words: ni.hsaara+ik.su+tila+aakaaras. And this is interpretable (tila presumably being used not in the sense of 'sesame-seed' but of 'a small particle (roughly the size of a sesame-seed)'), and seems much more likely to be correct than the word-division you have assumed (if you have considered this possibility and rejected it in favour of the other I wonder why). > - the JaiSa in its measurement of each substance of the body (a passage > quite original in comparison with other sources) uses the term ku.duba : > instead of the more classical ku.dava? (a dialectal/dravidian variant?) ku.duba is recorded as a variant orthography for ku.dava in Apte's dictionary. Apte gives no references to texts, but ku.duba (as a kind of measure) occurs I believe in the Artha"saastra (I do not have Kangle's edition with me as I write, so am forced to rely on the e-text input and generously made publicly available by Prof. Tokunaga). Of course one should bear in mind that b and v are homograph in many Indian (manu)scripts, though by no means all, and that 'doublets' with them are often found; keep your eye out for ku.duva too, therefore; and since ku.dapa seems to be attested as yet another orthography (at least in Monier-Williams), ku.dupa, which seems to be recorded in MW and Apte only in another sense, might conceivaby also occur as a spelling of your word. I shall not speculate on dialectical/Dravidian influences/sources (I have not so much as Mayrhofer's etymological dictionary at hand, let alone anything on dravidian). Harunaga Isaacson -- Harunaga Isaacson South Asia Studies University of Pennsylvania 820 Williams Hall 36th and Spruce Streets Philadelphia, PA 19104-6305 USA tel. +1 215 898 6047 From harunaga at SAS.UPENN.EDU Thu Feb 20 11:40:42 2003 From: harunaga at SAS.UPENN.EDU (Harunaga Isaacson) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 03 06:40:42 -0500 Subject: 2 956 900 vessels/k.sutila/ku.duba In-Reply-To: <000701c2d8d2$fe4bafa0$3fc809c0@indoc> Message-ID: <161227072349.23782.8239314851970154475.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Quoting DEVI IFP : > Respected Sir, > I think instead of "kutilaa" , it is wrongly written as "k.sutila". Certainly not impossible, but (since the word you have in mind is ku.tila with a retroflex .t) this assumes corruption of not just one but two syllables (ku - -> k.su and ti > .ti). Aside from my earlier suggestion to interpret the apparently unanimously transmitted text, another possibility, involving emendation of just one ak.sara instead of two, would be ni.hsaare (taking perhaps as absolute locative) tu tilaakaaro (with a not very pleasing tu, which may however be possible in this text); and yet other conjectures are conceivable. The text-critic is often satisfied with thinking of a single conjecture, but one should not rest there but consider others as well, for one's first idea is not necessarily the best and is almost certainly not the only possible one. I am still slightly skeptical, however, of that locative. And though emendation is certainly often necessary, and may prove in the end necessary here, it is well to first consider if one can interpret the transmitted text in a satisfactory way (sthitasya gati"s cintaniiyaa). In any case I think we can probably agree that there is no very good reason to assume a lexeme k.sutila, if that is indeed, as I suspect, hitherto unattested. Harunaga Isaacson -- Harunaga Isaacson South Asia Studies University of Pennsylvania 820 Williams Hall 36th and Spruce Streets Philadelphia, PA 19104-6305 USA tel. +1 215 898 6047 From j_e_m_houben at YAHOO.COM Thu Feb 20 17:24:30 2003 From: j_e_m_houben at YAHOO.COM (Jan E.M. Houben) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 03 09:24:30 -0800 Subject: Pancakanya In-Reply-To: <3E490CD1@newman> Message-ID: <161227072357.23782.8188048346640242709.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Coming back to this query of last week: for the brahma puraa.na the edition to consult seems to be the one by Schreiner and S?hnen, T?bingen 1989, Purana research publication no. 2, with word, name and motif index. The three-numeral indication of the place (7.3.219) given in the query is apparently wrong as it does not match the common system in the brahma puraa.na, which works with adhyaaya and verse numbers (also in older editions as far as I could quickly see). Under ahalyaa I only found references to the story of ahalyaa-gautama-indra which is told in adhyaaya 87. No reference to anything similar to "our" verse. A three-numeral indication (kha.n.da - adhyaaya - verse) does suit the brahmavaivartapuraa.na but it seems that it does not go beyond kha.n.da 3. The latter puraa.na seems full of enumeration of female heroines and goddesses, but so far I did not discern anything sufficiently similar to the verse in the query. Closest is perhaps: ahalyaa'rundhatii mainaa taaraa mandodarii paraa / damayantii vedavatii ga;ngaa ca yamunaa tathaa (brahmavaiv.pur 2.16.68 in 1981 edition-plus-hindi-transl. by taari.niiza jha, Hindi Sahitya Sammelan, Prayag). Without checking I note that I found references to a puraa.nic ahalyaa-tiirtha (matsya-puraa.na 190.86-89, skanda-puraa.na 1.2.52, kuurma puraa.na 2.39.43, all to be checked) and that the quoted verse would suit the context of such a tiirtha or its maahaatmya. Best, Jan Houben --- beitel wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > I have been asked to forward the following note > from Pradip Bhattacharya, and > would, indeed, be grateful for more on the > matter myself, and for any further > references (I do not have a copy of the BP) or > information. With thanks, > Alf Hiltebeitel > > ===== > > I wonder if you could possibly help me out to > track down a reference. This is > the sloka celebrating the panchakanya, viz. > > Ahalya Draupadi Kunti Tara Mandodari tatha > panchakanya svaranityam mahapataka nashaka > > The problem is to find out where it occurs. One > reference cites the Brahma > Purana, 3.7.219. Can anyone check up this > reference? If found, can you let me > know the context in which it occurs, who utters > the sloka and why? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ From athr at LOC.GOV Thu Feb 20 19:00:46 2003 From: athr at LOC.GOV (Allen W Thrasher) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 03 14:00:46 -0500 Subject: search for a book Message-ID: <161227072359.23782.15745553317911430339.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> OCLC shows copies in University of Chicago, U. of Washington, and U. of California, Berkeley. Allen Allen W. Thrasher, Ph.D. Senior Reference Librarian Southern Asia Section Asian Division Library of Congress Jefferson Building 150 101 Independence Ave., S.E. Washington, DC 20540-4810 tel. 202-707-3732 fax 202-707-1724 athr at loc.gov The opinions expressed do not necessarily reflect those of the Library of Congress. >>> marion.rastelli at OEAW.AC.AT 02/20/03 10:50AM >>> Dear colleagues, I am searching for the following book: V.N. Hari Rao, Koil Olugu. The Chronicle of the Srirangam Temple with Historical Notes. Madras: Rochouse and Sons, 1961. Searches in the Karlsruhe Virtual Catalog achieved no results. Does any of your libraries possess this book? Yours sincerely, Marion Rastelli Institute for the Cultural and Intellectual History of Asia Austrian Academy of Sciences From pf at CIX.CO.UK Thu Feb 20 16:34:00 2003 From: pf at CIX.CO.UK (Peter Flugel) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 03 16:34:00 +0000 Subject: search for a book In-Reply-To: <3E54F960.9030509@oeaw.ac.at> Message-ID: <161227072354.23782.15590274672558804715.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Thank you for the deadline. Beginning of next week definitely! And I will send you electronic versions in rtf or ASCii at the time as well (i.e. without diacritics). Only minor stylistic changes are required, and added footnotes, not much will change. Sorry for the slight delay. Peter From marion.rastelli at OEAW.AC.AT Thu Feb 20 15:50:56 2003 From: marion.rastelli at OEAW.AC.AT (Marion Rastelli) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 03 16:50:56 +0100 Subject: search for a book Message-ID: <161227072352.23782.7345118800118160421.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear colleagues, I am searching for the following book: V.N. Hari Rao, Koil Olugu. The Chronicle of the Srirangam Temple with Historical Notes. Madras: Rochouse and Sons, 1961. Searches in the Karlsruhe Virtual Catalog achieved no results. Does any of your libraries possess this book? Yours sincerely, Marion Rastelli Institute for the Cultural and Intellectual History of Asia Austrian Academy of Sciences From deviprasad at IFPINDIA.ORG Thu Feb 20 11:27:01 2003 From: deviprasad at IFPINDIA.ORG (DEVI IFP) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 03 16:57:01 +0530 Subject: 2 956 900 vessels/k.sutila/ku.duba Message-ID: <161227072347.23782.1756571541326348776.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Respected Sir, I think instead of "kutilaa" , it is wrongly written as "k.sutila". regards deviprasad From pf at CIX.CO.UK Thu Feb 20 20:21:00 2003 From: pf at CIX.CO.UK (Peter Flugel) Date: Thu, 20 Feb 03 20:21:00 +0000 Subject: search for a book In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227072361.23782.4446237722871303170.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> sorry for the unrelated message P. From vielle at ORI.UCL.AC.BE Fri Feb 21 08:00:46 2003 From: vielle at ORI.UCL.AC.BE (Christophe Vielle) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 03 09:00:46 +0100 Subject: 2 956 900 vessels (+ "k.sutila") In-Reply-To: <1045741242.3e54bebad0d28@webmail.sas.upenn.edu> Message-ID: <161227072364.23782.13306124803991823468.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Thanks to Deviprasad and Harunaga for their suggestions. So at the moment, the propositions are: * ni.hsaare k.sutila+aakaara.h with the unprobable hapax k.sutila * ni.hsaara+ik.su-tila+aakaara.h with the problem of the too small ik.su-tila for the body of a child at his birth - but the similarity could be not in the size but in the form of the "small shoot" (tila "small particle" in the sense of dala ?) of sugar-cane when it is going out (from the earth) * ni.hsaare tu tila+aakaara.h with the same problem, even is a tila is bigger than an ik.su-tila as a particle of sugar * ni.hsaare ku.tila++aakaa.h - the "crooked form" would indeed fit well in this case I would not dare to add : * ni.hsaare k.sut-ilaa+aakaara.h with the form of a flow (ilaa) of sneezing (k.sut f. from K.SU, in MkP) * ni.hsaara+iipsu-tila+aakaara.h with the form of a sesame-seed desirous of going out I take the opportunity of this message for recalling what was the main question of my original message, assuming that there is at least some people learned in medical literature on this list... Could someone help me in giving the Sanskrit text of the verse of Vaagbha.ta (the Elder)'s A.s.taa;ngasa.mgraha, /saariirasthaana 5.59 (reference from Meulenbeld's HIML), which gives the total amount of the vessels in the body as being 2 956 900. The number is interesting because in the Yaaj?avalkyasm.rti (III, 101) the number is slightly different, viz. 2 900 956 (ekonatri.mza.l lak.saa.ni tathaa nava zataani ca / .sa.tpa?caazac ca), clearly confirmed by the commentator Vij?aanezvara. In Caraka it is only 29 956. But in a physiological passage (which follows an embryological one) in the Jaiminiiyasa.mhitaa of the Brahmaa.n.dapuraa.na (that my colleague Sandra Smets is studying with me), which is usually very close to the text of the sm.rti or to the content of Vij?aanezvara's commentary, however in this case the total amount of the vessels is the same than in Vaagbha.ta: navottaraa.ni dehe 'smin niyutaani ca vi.mzati.h / .sa.tpa?caazat sahasraa.ni zataani nava caadhikam / siraadhamanyor milita.h zaakhaabheda udiirita.h //JaiSa 47 .58 viz. 29 niyutas (= 2 900 000) and 56 900 = 2 956 900 Thank you very much for your help Dr. Christophe Vielle Centre d'Etudes de l'Inde et de l'Asie du Sud Institut orientaliste Place Blaise Pascal 1 B - 1348 Louvain-la-Neuve BELGIUM Tel. +32-(0)10-47 49 54 (office)/ -(0)2-640 62 66 (home) E-mail: vielle at ori.ucl.ac.be From dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG Fri Feb 21 16:31:52 2003 From: dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG (dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 03 11:31:52 -0500 Subject: 2 956 900 vessels/k.sutila/ku.duba Message-ID: <161227072366.23782.12394232764119019412.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> > believe in the Artha"saastra (I do not have Kangle's edition with me as I > write, so am forced to rely on the e-text input and generously made publicly > available by Prof. Tokunaga Is this available online? From harunaga at SAS.UPENN.EDU Fri Feb 21 17:34:00 2003 From: harunaga at SAS.UPENN.EDU (Harunaga Isaacson) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 03 12:34:00 -0500 Subject: 2 956 900 vessels/k.sutila/ku.duba In-Reply-To: <005b01c2d9c6$be477020$2402a8c0@WorkGroup> Message-ID: <161227072368.23782.18068767913063472102.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Quoting dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG: > > believe in the Artha"saastra (I do not have Kangle's edition with me as I > > write, so am forced to rely on the e-text input and generously made > publicly > > available by Prof. Tokunaga > > Is this available online? > Yes, both at Prof. Tokunaga's own site in Kyoto (ftp://ccftp.kyoto-su.ac.jp/pub/doc/sanskrit/dharmas/) and via the extremely valuable Goettingen Register of Electronic Texts in Indian Languages (GRETIL), which we owe to Dr. R. Gruenendahl (http://www.sub.uni-goettingen.de/ebene_1/fiindolo/gretil.htm). Harunaga Isaacson -- Harunaga Isaacson South Asia Studies University of Pennsylvania 820 Williams Hall 36th and Spruce Streets Philadelphia, PA 19104-6305 USA tel. +1 215 898 6047 From harunaga at SAS.UPENN.EDU Sat Feb 22 00:46:23 2003 From: harunaga at SAS.UPENN.EDU (Harunaga Isaacson) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 03 19:46:23 -0500 Subject: 2 956 900 vessels/k.sutila/ku.duba In-Reply-To: <200302220029.JAA26512@cc2001.kyoto-su.ac.jp> Message-ID: <161227072373.23782.16351176607639789964.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Quoting Michio YANO : > Actually the following is my ftp server. > > Harunaga> Yes, both at Prof. Tokunaga's own site in Kyoto > Harunaga> (ftp://ccftp.kyoto-su.ac.jp/pub/doc/sanskrit/dharmas/) > > Michio YANO Tel +81-75-705-1781 > Faculty of Cultural Studies Fax +81-75-705-1799 > Kyoto Sangyo University e-mail: yanom at cc.kyoto-su.ac.jp > Kyoto 603-8555 Japan http://www.kyoto-su.ac.jp/~yanom/ Thank you for the correction---and for putting those very useful files up there. Harunaga Isaacson From mmdesh at UMICH.EDU Sat Feb 22 01:00:31 2003 From: mmdesh at UMICH.EDU (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Fri, 21 Feb 03 20:00:31 -0500 Subject: 2 956 900 vessels/k.sutila/ku.duba Message-ID: <161227072376.23782.11323187548649687252.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Another possible interpretation of k.sutila-aakaara may be "of the shape of a mustard seed (k.su, V.S. Apte) or sesame seed (tila)." Best, Madhav Deshpande -----Original Message----- From: Harunaga Isaacson [mailto:harunaga at SAS.UPENN.EDU] Sent: Fri 2/21/2003 7:46 PM To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk Cc: Subject: Re: 2 956 900 vessels/k.sutila/ku.duba Quoting Michio YANO : > Actually the following is my ftp server. > > Harunaga> Yes, both at Prof. Tokunaga's own site in Kyoto > Harunaga> (ftp://ccftp.kyoto-su.ac.jp/pub/doc/sanskrit/dharmas/) > > Michio YANO Tel +81-75-705-1781 > Faculty of Cultural Studies Fax +81-75-705-1799 > Kyoto Sangyo University e-mail: yanom at cc.kyoto-su.ac.jp > Kyoto 603-8555 Japan http://www.kyoto-su.ac.jp/~yanom/ Thank you for the correction---and for putting those very useful files up there. Harunaga Isaacson From yanom at CC.KYOTO-SU.AC.JP Sat Feb 22 00:29:34 2003 From: yanom at CC.KYOTO-SU.AC.JP (Michio YANO) Date: Sat, 22 Feb 03 09:29:34 +0900 Subject: 2 956 900 vessels/k.sutila/ku.duba In-Reply-To: <1045848840.3e566308348ea@webmail.sas.upenn.edu> Message-ID: <161227072371.23782.12921437947949485284.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Actually the following is my ftp server. Harunaga> Yes, both at Prof. Tokunaga's own site in Kyoto Harunaga> (ftp://ccftp.kyoto-su.ac.jp/pub/doc/sanskrit/dharmas/) Michio YANO Tel +81-75-705-1781 Faculty of Cultural Studies Fax +81-75-705-1799 Kyoto Sangyo University e-mail: yanom at cc.kyoto-su.ac.jp Kyoto 603-8555 Japan http://www.kyoto-su.ac.jp/~yanom/ From athr at LOC.GOV Mon Feb 24 17:01:18 2003 From: athr at LOC.GOV (Allen W Thrasher) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 03 12:01:18 -0500 Subject: The Number 2 956 900 Message-ID: <161227072378.23782.7742452328054542687.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I am if anyone has any ideas why the text would have fixed upon this as the number of vessels. I have tried dividing by 108 (a number I have played around with already), 365 (days of year), 360 (ibid. approximately), and gotten numbers with fractions. Allen Allen W. Thrasher, Ph.D. Senior Reference Librarian Southern Asia Section Asian Division Library of Congress Jefferson Building 150 101 Independence Ave., S.E. Washington, DC 20540-4810 tel. 202-707-3732 fax 202-707-1724 athr at loc.gov The opinions expressed do not necessarily reflect those of the Library of Congress. From JFStaal at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU Tue Feb 25 18:55:10 2003 From: JFStaal at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU (Frits Staal) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 03 10:55:10 -0800 Subject: jaya = 108? In-Reply-To: <005e01c2dcda$a410a250$f1b68283@tibet.univie.ac.at> Message-ID: <161227072390.23782.8312091583031926588.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Rather, in kaTapayaadi, ka, Ta, pa ya all stand for "1", kha, pha, etc. for "2" etc. After the nasals come ca, ta, Sa for "6" and this takes one to ja, da, ha for "8". Zero, of course, cannot be ignored. The expressions are decimal, with the units placed on the left. This implies that "jaya" stands for "81" since we write our units on the right. It does not support Frederic's theory. At 03:31 PM 2/25/03 +0100, you wrote: >Dear Indologists, >without revealing his source Louis Frederic claims in his book "Borobudur" >(p. 75 of the German version published by Hirmer Verlag, M?nchen in 1995; >the French original is from 1994) that "jaya" stands for the number "108", >because the Sanskrit letters "ja" and "ya" denote respectively "1" and >"8", and the "zero inbetween can be ignored". >Is this explanation for "108" found elsewhere? >What is the source for this (to me new) equation of "ja" and "ya" with "1" >and "8"? > > >With many thanks and regards, > Alexander v. Rospatt Frits Staal http://philosophy.berkeley.edu/staal/ From JFStaal at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU Tue Feb 25 19:10:37 2003 From: JFStaal at SOCRATES.BERKELEY.EDU (Frits Staal) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 03 11:10:37 -0800 Subject: jaya = 108? In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.2.20030225103725.009f9560@socrates.berkeley.edu> Message-ID: <161227072393.23782.8944029169963769765.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Just received my own E-mail. I apologize for introducing more confusion by typing "81" for "18"... Please read my last two sentences as follows: The expressions are decimal, with the units placed on the left. This implies that "jaya" stands for "18" since we write our units on the right. It does not support Frederic's theory. At 10:55 AM 2/25/03 -0800, you wrote: >Rather, in kaTapayaadi, ka, Ta, pa ya all stand for "1", kha, pha, etc. >for "2" etc. After the nasals come ca, ta, Sa for "6" and this takes one >to ja, da, ha for "8". > >Zero, of course, cannot be ignored. The expressions are decimal, with the >units placed on the left. This implies that "jaya" stands for "81" since >we write our units on the right. It does not support Frederic's theory. > >At 03:31 PM 2/25/03 +0100, you wrote: >>Dear Indologists, >>without revealing his source Louis Frederic claims in his book >>"Borobudur" (p. 75 of the German version published by Hirmer Verlag, >>M?nchen in 1995; the French original is from 1994) that "jaya" stands for >>the number "108", because the Sanskrit letters "ja" and "ya" denote >>respectively "1" and "8", and the "zero inbetween can be ignored". >>Is this explanation for "108" found elsewhere? >>What is the source for this (to me new) equation of "ja" and "ya" with >>"1" and "8"? >> >> >>With many thanks and regards, >> Alexander v. Rospatt > >Frits Staal >http://philosophy.berkeley.edu/staal/ Frits Staal http://philosophy.berkeley.edu/staal/ From Scharf at BROWN.EDU Tue Feb 25 19:07:56 2003 From: Scharf at BROWN.EDU (Peter M. Scharf) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 03 14:07:56 -0500 Subject: Editions of Vik.rti-paa.thas of Vedic texts Message-ID: <161227072396.23782.7330467779585217728.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> >From: ukmvu at xs4all.nl >Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 12:55:09 -0500 >To: "Peter M. Scharf" >X-Brown-MailScanner: Found to be clean >X-Brown-MailScanner-SpamScore: s > >Regarding the 8 Vikritis below--is anyone aware of any editions of Rig, >Sama, Yajur (Taittiriya or Shukla), Atharva appearing in print showing one or >more of the different Paathas--methods of recitation: > >Pada Paatha >Krama Paatha >Jata Paatha >Ratha Paatha >Danda Paatha >Dhvaja Paatha >Mala Paatha >Ghana Paatha > >Thank you. -- ************************************************** Peter M. Scharf (401) 863-2720 office Department of Classics (401) 863-2123 dept Brown University PO Box 1856 (401) 863-7484 fax Providence, RI 02912 Scharf at brown.edu http://www.brown.edu/Departments/Classics/Scharf/ http://sanskritlibrary.org/ ************************************************** From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK Tue Feb 25 14:51:24 2003 From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 03 14:51:24 +0000 Subject: 2 956 900 vessels/k.sutila/ku.duba In-Reply-To: <1045848840.3e566308348ea@webmail.sas.upenn.edu> Message-ID: <161227072385.23782.2344495665921053153.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> And in the INDOLOGY website's file collection: ftp://ftp.ucl.ac.uk/pub/users/ucgadkw/indology/texts/ D On Fri, 21 Feb 2003, Harunaga Isaacson wrote: > Quoting dean_anderson at SACARI.ORG: > > > > believe in the Artha"saastra (I do not have Kangle's edition with me as I > > > write, so am forced to rely on the e-text input and generously made > > publicly > > > available by Prof. Tokunaga > > > > Is this available online? > > > > Yes, both at Prof. Tokunaga's own site in Kyoto > (ftp://ccftp.kyoto-su.ac.jp/pub/doc/sanskrit/dharmas/) > and via the extremely valuable Goettingen Register of Electronic Texts in > Indian Languages (GRETIL), which we owe to Dr. R. Gruenendahl > (http://www.sub.uni-goettingen.de/ebene_1/fiindolo/gretil.htm). > > Harunaga Isaacson > > -- > Harunaga Isaacson > South Asia Studies > University of Pennsylvania > 820 Williams Hall > 36th and Spruce Streets > Philadelphia, PA 19104-6305 > USA > tel. +1 215 898 6047 > From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK Tue Feb 25 15:06:32 2003 From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 03 15:06:32 +0000 Subject: 2 956 900 vessels (+ "k.sutila") In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227072387.23782.11899138679053450893.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> On Fri, 21 Feb 2003, Christophe Vielle wrote: > I take the opportunity of this message for recalling what was the main > question of my original message, assuming that there is at least some > people learned in medical literature on this list... > > Could someone help me in giving the Sanskrit text of the verse of > Vaagbha.ta (the Elder)'s A.s.taa;ngasa.mgraha, /saariirasthaana 5.59 > (reference from Meulenbeld's HIML), which gives the total amount of the > vessels in the body as being 2 956 900. In my edition of AS, Vaidyanaatha Aayurveda Bhavana Praaivet. Li., Naagapura, 1989 (1st printing)), with vyaakhyaa by Laalacandra"saastrii Vaidya and intro. by Raghuviiraprasaada Trivedii, the vers you want is in Sarirasthana 5.93: siraadhamaniimukhaanaa.m tva.nu"so vibhajyamaanaanaamekonatri.m"sacchatasahasraa.ni nava ca "sataani .sa.tpa~ncaa"saani bhavanti| taabhirida.m "sariira.m gavaak.sita.m pinaddhamaatata.m ca ||93|| In Kimjavadekar's 1938 ed, this is verse "saa.5.115, and it reads the same. Best, Dominik From gast.itb at UNIVIE.AC.AT Tue Feb 25 14:31:07 2003 From: gast.itb at UNIVIE.AC.AT (Alexander v. Rospatt) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 03 15:31:07 +0100 Subject: jaya = 108? Message-ID: <161227072380.23782.14080588224359407325.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Indologists, without revealing his source Louis Frederic claims in his book "Borobudur" (p. 75 of the German version published by Hirmer Verlag, M?nchen in 1995; the French original is from 1994) that "jaya" stands for the number "108", because the Sanskrit letters "ja" and "ya" denote respectively "1" and "8", and the "zero inbetween can be ignored". Is this explanation for "108" found elsewhere? What is the source for this (to me new) equation of "ja" and "ya" with "1" and "8"? With many thanks and regards, Alexander v. Rospatt From Martin.Gansten at TEOL.LU.SE Tue Feb 25 14:44:20 2003 From: Martin.Gansten at TEOL.LU.SE (Martin Gansten) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 03 15:44:20 +0100 Subject: jaya = 108? In-Reply-To: <005e01c2dcda$a410a250$f1b68283@tibet.univie.ac.at> Message-ID: <161227072382.23782.17409259083756754362.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I have never seen this explanation of 'jaya' before; but the assignment of the value 8 and 1 to ja and ya, respectively (according to the rule aGkAnAM vAmato gatiH) follows the well-known kaTapayAdi system: consonants are arranged in series beginning with k, T, p, and y, where the first letter in a series has the value 1, the second the value 2, etc. Martin Gansten From magier at COLUMBIA.EDU Tue Feb 25 21:40:04 2003 From: magier at COLUMBIA.EDU (David Magier) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 03 16:40:04 -0500 Subject: Fwd: Employment Opportunity: Visiting Lecture/Assistant Professor in Hindi-Urdu at Loyola University Chicago Message-ID: <161227072399.23782.15527761137569143585.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> >Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 13:35:52 -0600 >From: "Patricia Clemente" >Subject: Employment Opportunity: Visiting Lecture/Assistant Professor > in Hindi-Urdu at Loyola University Chgo > >Dear Faculty: > >Please post the attached position announcement in a conspicuous area >and make available to graduate students in your department. > >Thank you, > >Patricia Clemente, Admin. Secy. >Modern Languages and Literatures >Loyola University Chicago ----------- Plain Text ----------- Loyola University Chicago Department of Modern Languages and Literatures Visiting Instructor/Assistant Professor in Hindi-Urdu: 2003-2004 Academic Year The Department of Modern Languages and Literatures at Loyola University Chicago invites applications for a visiting instructor/assistant professor position in Hindi-Urdu for the 2003-2004 academic year. The person hired will be required to teach three courses per semester - two language and one literature-in-translation. To be considered, the candidate must have at least an ABD (Ph.D. in hand preferred) and the ability to teach Hindi-Urdu at all levels. Previous teaching experience and familiarity with technology-based instruction are highly desired. Salary is competitive and dependent upon qualifications. Qualifications include education and related work-experience. Send letter of application, curriculum vitae, and three current letters of recommendation by March 15, 2003, to: Paolo Giordano, Chair Loyola University Chicago Modern Languages and Literatures 6525 N. Sheridan Rd Chicago, IL 60626 From fsmith at BLUE.WEEG.UIOWA.EDU Wed Feb 26 01:24:01 2003 From: fsmith at BLUE.WEEG.UIOWA.EDU (fsmith) Date: Tue, 25 Feb 03 19:24:01 -0600 Subject: Editions of Vik.rti-paa.thas of Vedic texts Message-ID: <161227072401.23782.8523911294238485355.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Hi Peter, See the RV edition of Satavalekar, 1940 ed., pp. 792-808. .rgveda-sa.mhitaa bha.t.taacaarye.na zriipaadazarma.naa daamodarabha.t.tasuununaa saantabalekarakulajena sa.mpaaditaa Fred Smith >===== Original Message From "Peter M. Scharf" ===== >>From: ukmvu at xs4all.nl >>Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 12:55:09 -0500 >>To: "Peter M. Scharf" >>X-Brown-MailScanner: Found to be clean >>X-Brown-MailScanner-SpamScore: s >> >>Regarding the 8 Vikritis below--is anyone aware of any editions of Rig, >>Sama, Yajur (Taittiriya or Shukla), Atharva appearing in print showing one or >>more of the different Paathas--methods of recitation: >> >>Pada Paatha >>Krama Paatha >>Jata Paatha >>Ratha Paatha >>Danda Paatha >>Dhvaja Paatha >>Mala Paatha >>Ghana Paatha >> >>Thank you. > > >-- >************************************************** >Peter M. Scharf (401) 863-2720 office >Department of Classics (401) 863-2123 dept >Brown University >PO Box 1856 (401) 863-7484 fax >Providence, RI 02912 Scharf at brown.edu >http://www.brown.edu/Departments/Classics/Scharf/ >http://sanskritlibrary.org/ >************************************************** From A.Griffiths at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL Wed Feb 26 08:18:42 2003 From: A.Griffiths at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL (Arlo Griffiths) Date: Wed, 26 Feb 03 10:18:42 +0200 Subject: Editions of Vik.rti-paa.thas of Vedic texts In-Reply-To: <3E6B13F0@itsnt5.its.uiowa.edu> Message-ID: <161227072404.23782.11205042689157012650.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I must add Madhav Deshpande's "Recitational Permutations of the ;Saunakiiya Atharvaveda" [HOS 61, 2002], also advertised on this list by Witzel, which has an elaborate introduction as well. Arlo Griffiths > From: fsmith > Reply-To: Indology > Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 19:24:01 -0600 > To: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk > Subject: Re: Editions of Vik.rti-paa.thas of Vedic texts > > Hi Peter, > > See the RV edition of Satavalekar, 1940 ed., pp. 792-808. > .rgveda-sa.mhitaa > bha.t.taacaarye.na zriipaadazarma.naa daamodarabha.t.tasuununaa > saantabalekarakulajena sa.mpaaditaa > > Fred Smith > >> ===== Original Message From "Peter M. Scharf" ===== >>> From: ukmvu at xs4all.nl >>> Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 12:55:09 -0500 >>> To: "Peter M. Scharf" >>> X-Brown-MailScanner: Found to be clean >>> X-Brown-MailScanner-SpamScore: s >>> >>> Regarding the 8 Vikritis below--is anyone aware of any editions of Rig, >>> Sama, Yajur (Taittiriya or Shukla), Atharva appearing in print showing one > or >>> more of the different Paathas--methods of recitation: >>> >>> Pada Paatha >>> Krama Paatha >>> Jata Paatha >>> Ratha Paatha >>> Danda Paatha >>> Dhvaja Paatha >>> Mala Paatha >>> Ghana Paatha >>> >>> Thank you. >> >> >> -- >> ************************************************** >> Peter M. Scharf (401) 863-2720 office >> Department of Classics (401) 863-2123 dept >> Brown University >> PO Box 1856 (401) 863-7484 fax >> Providence, RI 02912 Scharf at brown.edu >> http://www.brown.edu/Departments/Classics/Scharf/ >> http://sanskritlibrary.org/ >> ************************************************** From vielle at ORI.UCL.AC.BE Wed Feb 26 09:24:36 2003 From: vielle at ORI.UCL.AC.BE (Christophe Vielle) Date: Wed, 26 Feb 03 10:24:36 +0100 Subject: 2 956 900 vessels (+ "k.sutila") In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227072407.23782.6745413603317458955.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Thank you very much, Dominik, for the reference, and also Madhav Deshpande for the previous suggestion. Yours Christophe Vielle >On Fri, 21 Feb 2003, Christophe Vielle wrote: > >> I take the opportunity of this message for recalling what was the main >> question of my original message, assuming that there is at least some >> people learned in medical literature on this list... >> >> Could someone help me in giving the Sanskrit text of the verse of >> Vaagbha.ta (the Elder)'s A.s.taa;ngasa.mgraha, /saariirasthaana 5.59 >> (reference from Meulenbeld's HIML), which gives the total amount of the >> vessels in the body as being 2 956 900. > >In my edition of AS, Vaidyanaatha Aayurveda Bhavana Praaivet. Li., >Naagapura, 1989 (1st printing)), with vyaakhyaa by Laalacandra"saastrii >Vaidya and intro. by Raghuviiraprasaada Trivedii, the vers you want is in >Sarirasthana 5.93: > >siraadhamaniimukhaanaa.m tva.nu"so >vibhajyamaanaanaamekonatri.m"sacchatasahasraa.ni nava ca "sataani >.sa.tpa~ncaa"saani bhavanti| >taabhirida.m "sariira.m gavaak.sita.m pinaddhamaatata.m ca ||93|| > > >In Kimjavadekar's 1938 ed, this is verse "saa.5.115, and it reads the >same. > >Best, > >Dominik >Another possible interpretation of k.sutila-aakaara may be "of the shape >of a mustard seed (k.su, V.S. Apte) or sesame seed (tila)." Best, > > >Madhav Deshpande > Dr. Christophe Vielle Centre d'Etudes de l'Inde et de l'Asie du Sud Institut orientaliste Place Blaise Pascal 1 B - 1348 Louvain-la-Neuve BELGIUM Tel. +32-(0)10-47 49 54 (office)/ -(0)2-640 62 66 (home) E-mail: vielle at ori.ucl.ac.be From mkapstei at MIDWAY.UCHICAGO.EDU Thu Feb 27 10:28:56 2003 From: mkapstei at MIDWAY.UCHICAGO.EDU (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 03 04:28:56 -0600 Subject: XML/TEI-Sanskrit texts, anyone? In-Reply-To: <9898062.1046369295@[192.168.2.0]> Message-ID: <161227072416.23782.16990879629445179475.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> A model Tibetan language project using XML is the Samantabhadra archive project at the University of Virginia. You can find it through www.thdl.org Matthew Kapstein From rbm49 at EXT.CANTERBURY.AC.NZ Wed Feb 26 21:21:17 2003 From: rbm49 at EXT.CANTERBURY.AC.NZ (Richard Mahoney) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 03 10:21:17 +1300 Subject: XML/TEI-Sanskrit texts, anyone? In-Reply-To: <9898062.1046369295@[192.168.2.0]> Message-ID: <161227072413.23782.16122796074310477000.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> On Thu, Feb 27, 2003 at 06:08:15PM +0100, Birgit Kellner wrote: > The potential of XML/XSLT, in combination with the TEI guidelines, > is really amazing. I'm just starting to look into all these things > ... ditto > I would appreciate any information about similar projects. Although not based on TEI the following system is perhaps worth testing: http://tbookdtd.sourceforge.net/ It can generate high quality LaTeX, HTML, XHTML, and DocBook output from a single UTF8 XML source file. The author is also open to suggestions. When I first used the system it didn't support the standard diacritics needed for romanized Sanskrit. I asked the author if support could be added and a few hours latter it was there. It is also simple to add support for additional characters oneself. Best regards, Richard Mahoney -- Richard Mahoney | E-mail: rbm49 at ext.canterbury.ac.nz 78 Jeffreys Road | r.mahoney at comnet.net.nz Fendalton | Telephone: 0064-3-351-5831 CHRISTCHURCH 8005 | Cellular: 0064-25-829-986 NEW ZEALAND | http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK Thu Feb 27 10:47:40 2003 From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 03 10:47:40 +0000 Subject: XML/TEI-Sanskrit texts, anyone? In-Reply-To: <9898062.1046369295@[192.168.2.0]> Message-ID: <161227072418.23782.808191235606332074.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Yves Codet offered the Venisamhara by Bhattanarayana for sharing and I mounted the files on the INDOLOGY website last September. See http://www.ucl.ac.uk/~ucgadkw/xml/venisamhara/venisamhara.xml This is an XML file encoded using TEI guidelines. Includes accented scholarly transliteration and Devanagari, using Unicode. Be aware that different web browsers and versions of browsers do startlingly different jobs of displaying files like this. I have regularly had good experiences with Opera versions 6 and (recently) 7. MSIE 6, sp1, seems to be doing a reasonable job, but in general Opera has in the past been more trustworthy on issues like XML/Unicode conformance. Best, Dominik On Thu, 27 Feb 2003, Birgit Kellner wrote: > The potential of XML/XSLT, in combination with the TEI guidelines, is > really amazing. I'm just starting to look into all these things, and > therefore my question: > > Are there already any Indic e-texts available which make use of these > technologies? Or are such projects under way, anywhere? > > For those who are interested: I experimented a little with perl and XML. I > used Tilman Vetter's edition of the first chapter of the PramANavinizcaya > by DharmakIrti (Tibetan text) as an example. This has no XSLT background; > just a simple perl script using perl XML modules to translate XML markup > into HTML entities. I used Andrew Glass' Gandhari Unicode font for the > diacritics: > > http://mailbox.univie.ac.at/Birgit.Kellner/cgi-bin/xmldom.cgi?file=pvin1&pa > ge=30 > > I would appreciate any information about similar projects. > > Best regards, > > Birgit Kellner > From garzilli at ASIATICA.ORG Thu Feb 27 14:25:29 2003 From: garzilli at ASIATICA.ORG (Enrica Garzilli) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 03 15:25:29 +0100 Subject: XML/TEI-Sanskrit texts, anyone? Message-ID: <161227072425.23782.2402899200254277912.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> In June 2000 we have published in the IJTS the paper Magically Storming the Gates of Buddhahood: Extensible Text Technology (XML/XSLT) as a Simulacrum for Research by John Gardner. It might be useful to understand the new tools, I think. http://www.asiatica.org/ijts/vol4_special/paper1.php Best, eg ********************** University of Macerata, Italy Asiatica Association www.asiatica.org ********************** ----- Original Message ----- From: "Matthew Kapstein" To: Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 11:28 AM Subject: Re: XML/TEI-Sanskrit texts, anyone? > A model Tibetan language project using XML is > the Samantabhadra archive project at the > University of Virginia. You can find > it through www.thdl.org > > Matthew Kapstein > From magier at COLUMBIA.EDU Thu Feb 27 20:52:17 2003 From: magier at COLUMBIA.EDU (David Magier) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 03 15:52:17 -0500 Subject: position announcement: S.Asia Curator Message-ID: <161227072428.23782.13928297350904296140.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The following job posting is being forwarded to your listserv or mailing list from the ACADEMIC POSITIONS section of SARAI. Please contact job posters directly for any further information. David Magier http://www.columbia.edu/cu/lweb/indiv/southasia/cuvl ======= POSITION ANNOUNCEMENT: Curator, South Asia Collection (Cornell University Library) Cornell University Library (CUL) seeks a curator for its South Asia Collection. Housed on the main level of the innovative Carl A. Kroch Library for Special Collections, the South Asian Collection holds over 300,000 volumes and serves as the principal information resource for Cornell's South Asia Program, a Title VI National Resource Center. The curator manages the collections and services for a diverse community of students and scholars working on India, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Bangladesh and Nepal. The successful candidate will work closely with colleagues who curate the Library's East Asian (Wason) and Southeast Asian (Echols) collections and as a member of the newly-formed CUL organization, Instruction, Research and Information Services (IRIS). IRIS is the largest of the CUL organizations, with over 150 staff members from Olin and Uris Libraries who work collaboratively to support instruction and learning, public services, research, preservation, collection development and public programming. The world renowned Asia Collections plus the Africana, Fine Arts, and Music Libraries round out the membership of IRIS. Responsibilities: The curator will report to the Director of World Area Collections. Responsibilities include selection of print and digital information resources, identifying materials for housing in the Library Annex, making preservation decisions, liaison with faculty and students, fund raising, specialized reference and instruction, budget management and staff supervision. Requirements: M.L.S. or significant experience in library, archival or academic administration and an appropriate advanced degree. Demonstrated academic strength in relevant subject areas; knowledge of the languages, histories, cultures and book markets of South Asia; appreciation of digital developments in the region. Excellent communication skills. Desired: At least three years experience in an academic library. Supervisory experience. Active participation in professional organizations. Application: Applications requested by April 15, 2003. Review of applications will begin immediately, and continue until the position is filled. Salary and rank will be dependent upon qualifications and experience. Please send cover letter, resume, and the names and phone numbers of three references to: Susan Markowitz, Director Library Human Resources 201 Olin Library, Cornell University Ithaca, New York 14853-5301 e-mail: libhr at cornell.edu From veerankp at IFPINDIA.ORG Thu Feb 27 10:47:15 2003 From: veerankp at IFPINDIA.ORG (Veeranarayana Pandurangi) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 03 16:17:15 +0530 Subject: XML/TEI-Sanskrit texts, anyone? Message-ID: <161227072422.23782.7234459195981441642.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dears, Though I did little for TEI, I know one freind in Tirupaty, doing this. He is Srinivasa Varakhedi. He did this for anuvyakhyana using the C-DAC's Gist terminal and VI editor. contact him at srivara at india.com. It might be useful. veeranarayan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Birgit Kellner" To: Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 10:38 PM Subject: XML/TEI-Sanskrit texts, anyone? > The potential of XML/XSLT, in combination with the TEI guidelines, is > really amazing. I'm just starting to look into all these things, and > therefore my question: > > Are there already any Indic e-texts available which make use of these > technologies? Or are such projects under way, anywhere? > > For those who are interested: I experimented a little with perl and XML. I > used Tilman Vetter's edition of the first chapter of the PramANavinizcaya > by DharmakIrti (Tibetan text) as an example. This has no XSLT background; > just a simple perl script using perl XML modules to translate XML markup > into HTML entities. I used Andrew Glass' Gandhari Unicode font for the > diacritics: > > http://mailbox.univie.ac.at/Birgit.Kellner/cgi-bin/xmldom.cgi?file=pvin1&pa > ge=30 > > I would appreciate any information about similar projects. > > Best regards, > > Birgit Kellner > From magier at COLUMBIA.EDU Thu Feb 27 21:31:20 2003 From: magier at COLUMBIA.EDU (David Magier) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 03 16:31:20 -0500 Subject: job postings Message-ID: <161227072430.23782.14232698996536345729.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The following two job postings are being posted to your listserv or mailing list from the jobs section of SARAI. Please contact job posters directly for further information. David Magier SARAI ------- Communications Coordinator - Full-time (SAKHI for South Asian Women) http://www.columbia.edu/cu/lweb/data/indiv/southasia/cuvl/jobs/till3-15-03Sakhi1.html Program Assistant - Full-time (SAKHI for South Asian Women) http://www.columbia.edu/cu/lweb/data/indiv/southasia/cuvl/jobs/till3-15-03Sakhi2.html From birgit.kellner at UNIVIE.AC.AT Thu Feb 27 17:08:15 2003 From: birgit.kellner at UNIVIE.AC.AT (Birgit Kellner) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 03 18:08:15 +0100 Subject: XML/TEI-Sanskrit texts, anyone? Message-ID: <161227072410.23782.10316739612186563327.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The potential of XML/XSLT, in combination with the TEI guidelines, is really amazing. I'm just starting to look into all these things, and therefore my question: Are there already any Indic e-texts available which make use of these technologies? Or are such projects under way, anywhere? For those who are interested: I experimented a little with perl and XML. I used Tilman Vetter's edition of the first chapter of the PramANavinizcaya by DharmakIrti (Tibetan text) as an example. This has no XSLT background; just a simple perl script using perl XML modules to translate XML markup into HTML entities. I used Andrew Glass' Gandhari Unicode font for the diacritics: http://mailbox.univie.ac.at/Birgit.Kellner/cgi-bin/xmldom.cgi?file=pvin1&pa ge=30 I would appreciate any information about similar projects. Best regards, Birgit Kellner From Scharf at BROWN.EDU Fri Feb 28 22:01:21 2003 From: Scharf at BROWN.EDU (Peter M. Scharf) Date: Fri, 28 Feb 03 17:01:21 -0500 Subject: XML/TEI-Sanskrit texts, anyone? In-Reply-To: <9898062.1046369295@[192.168.2.0]> Message-ID: <161227072433.23782.8101325133031231176.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> My colleague Malcolm Hyman and I are putting the texts in our Sanskrit Library in XML using Perl scripts to convert underlying sandhi-analyzed texts. The texts include Ramopakhyana, Visnupurana Amsa 4, Purnabhadra's Pancatantra, Panini's Astadhyayi, Nirukta and may be applied to the other texts in the grammatical database assembled under the direction of George Cardona which were entered in sandhi-analyzed format a decade ago. We will be posting Whitney's Verbal Roots shortly. Peter Scharf -- ************************************************** Peter M. Scharf (401) 863-2720 office Department of Classics (401) 863-2123 dept Brown University PO Box 1856 (401) 863-7484 fax Providence, RI 02912 Scharf at brown.edu http://www.brown.edu/Departments/Classics/Scharf/ http://sanskritlibrary.org/ ************************************************** From zydenbos at LRZ.UNI-MUENCHEN.DE Mon Feb 17 16:17:49 2003 From: zydenbos at LRZ.UNI-MUENCHEN.DE (Robert Zydenbos (by way of Robert Zydenbos )) Date: Mon, 17 Feb 03 17:17:49 +0100 Subject: he.dhra? Message-ID: <161227072327.23782.708180021810401180.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Am 13 Feb 2003 um 9:12 schrieb fsmith: > I have a lexical question: the 12th century Tantric text from Kerala, > Iizaanazivagurudevapaddhati 42.1,15ab has the word he.dhra /he.dhraga > in its account of bhuutavidyaa. 15ab reads: One possessed by a > he.dhraga graha stands on his knees, keeps his head down, smiles, and > holds his hands in a fist. I am unable to find this word elsewhere. If it is not Sanskrit (or otherwise Indogermanic, e.g., Prakrit) then it could be a Sanskritised Dravidian word. Kannada has a word he.d.da, "a dull, stupid man, a fool" (Kittel's dictionary, Madras 1971 edition, vol. 4, p. 1755), with related a derived words like he.d.datana / he.d.du "stupidity, foolishness", he.d.daa.ta "stupid, foolish behaviour". Perhaps this is a description of a person's behaviour when he is possessed by a certain kind of bhuuta? RZ Prof. Robert J. Zydenbos Institut f?r Indologie und Iranistik Universit?t M?nchen