From Isaacson at UNI-HAMBURG.DE Sun Aug 4 16:07:18 2002 From: Isaacson at UNI-HAMBURG.DE (Harunaga Isaacson) Date: Sun, 04 Aug 02 18:07:18 +0200 Subject: new book: Sobisch, three-vow theories Message-ID: <161227071241.23782.15579043649599418848.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dr. Jan-Ulrich Sobisch, who does not currently subscribe to this list, has asked me to post the following book-announcement. Though it is self-avowedly a Tibetological work (a revised version of Sobisch' doctoral dissertation), one of the texts translated in it is by the Indian pa.n.dita Vibhuuticandra, and in my opinion it is a publication that should be of considerable interest to those studying Indian, especially Indian tantric, Buddhism. Harunaga Isaacson Jan-Ulrich Sobisch (2002) Three-Vow Theories in Tibetan Buddhism: A Comparative Study of Major Traditions from the Twelfth through Nineteenth Centuries. (Contributions to Tibetan Studies 1). David P. Jackson (ed.). 596 pp., hardcover. Reichert Verlag, Wiesbaden. EUR 58,- (3-89500-263-1) (http://www.reichert-verlag.de/) Summary While the moral views of conventional Buddhism insists on strict avoidance of evil deeds, in the Mahayana, which puts first the welfare of others, moral rules may be annulled on occasion. In the Vajrayana practiced in Tibet, some texts mention even an obligation to transgress a given moral code. The attempts since the twelfth century to harmonize the different vows of Pratimoksha, Mahayana, and Vajrayana frequently led to harsh controversies. Some strategies for solving the conflict between vows were attempts to derive from the postulated superiority of Vajrayana either an automatic "upward transformation" of the "lower vows," or a complete "outshining" of conventional moral codes. Others explained particulars of the Vajrayana, such as "sexual yoga," as an exception in the practice of a few, exceedingly accomplished yogis, while in general passages of the Tantras referring to such practices were to be interpreted conforming with convention. The present study investigates Tibetan theories concerning the vows in their initial state as well as their subsequent interpretation. One of its results is the realization that the same term may be used by different authors in quite different ways and that positions that seem contrary originate from a differing appraisal of merely some aspects. The latter, however, appears to be the main cause for the different attitudes in the practice of Mantra. The book contains, apart from an introduction, biographical notes on all authors whose works were utilized, topical summaries of the most important works with detailed annotation, a chapter analysing the history of ideas of some key terms, documentation and translation of Tibetan texts on 227 pages, and detailed indices. Works of mainly the following authors are presented: The Indian pandita Vibhuticandra, the Tibetan masters Go-rams-pa (Sa-skya-pa), sGam-po-pa (bKa'-brgyud-pa), Karma-'phrin-las-pa and Karma-nges-don (Karma bKa'-brgyud-pa), Kong-sprul (Ris-med), 'Jig-rten-mgon-po and rDo-rje-shes-rab ('Bri-gung bKa'-brgyud-pa) as well as mNga'-ris Pan-chen and Lo-chen Dharmashri (rNying-ma-pa). From jpo at UTS.CC.UTEXAS.EDU Mon Aug 5 14:52:54 2002 From: jpo at UTS.CC.UTEXAS.EDU (Patrick Olivelle) Date: Mon, 05 Aug 02 09:52:54 -0500 Subject: Publication Announcement In-Reply-To: <17bgnh-2E67pSC@fwd04.sul.t-online.com> Message-ID: <161227071246.23782.38075839510115065.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Walter: I went on line and there was a three line statement, but no way to order the book. Thanks. Patrick >The first volume in the Halle series "Geisteskultur Indiens. Texte und Studien >(Indologica halensis)" has been released: > >Bhaskarakantha?s Moksopaya-Tika I. Vairagyaprakaranam. Revised edition in >Devanagari script by Juergen Hanneder and Walter Slaje. >(Geisteskultur Indiens. Texte und Studien. 1.) (Indologica halensis). >Aachen: Shaker 2002. ISBN 3-8322-0217-X. Euro 35,80 > >In addition to the revised text the volume contains also introductions in >Sanskrit and English outlining the present state of research in the >Moksopaya (/ >Yogavasistha) as well as an updated Moksopaya-bibliography. > >In case of interest, orders may also be placed online: > >http://www.shaker.de/Online-Gesamtkatalog/Details.asp?ID=244090&CC=2045&ISBN >=3-8322-0217-X&Reihe=275&IDSRC=1&LastAction=Search > > >With kind regards, > >Walter Slaje > > > >----------------------------------------------- >Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje >Hermann-Loens-Str. 1, D-99425 Weimar (Germany) >Tel/Fax: (+49)03643-501391 (office: (+49)0345-55-23650) >e-mail: slaje at t-online.de (office: slaje at indologie.uni-halle.de) From Slaje at T-ONLINE.DE Mon Aug 5 12:17:29 2002 From: Slaje at T-ONLINE.DE (Walter Slaje) Date: Mon, 05 Aug 02 14:17:29 +0200 Subject: Change of address, Halle Indology Message-ID: <161227071242.23782.2073144840605079386.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Our Institute has moved to a new location. Kindly note (and use) as new address: Martin-Luther-Universitaet Halle-Wittenberg Institut fuer Indologie und Suedasienwissenschaften Heinrich-u.-Thomas-Mann-Str. 22 06108 Halle (Saale) The official postal address remains the same: Martin-Luther-Universitaet Halle-Wittenberg Institut fuer Indologie und Suedasienwissenschaften 06099 Halle (Saale) With kind regards, Walter Slaje, Admin. Dir. ---------------------------------------------- Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje Hermann-Loens-Str. 1, D-99425 Weimar (Germany) Tel/Fax: (+49)03643-501391 (office: (+49)0345-55-23650) e-mail: slaje at t-online.de (office: slaje at indologie.uni-halle.de) From Slaje at T-ONLINE.DE Mon Aug 5 12:17:29 2002 From: Slaje at T-ONLINE.DE (Walter Slaje) Date: Mon, 05 Aug 02 14:17:29 +0200 Subject: Publication Announcement Message-ID: <161227071244.23782.13846145519271691827.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The first volume in the Halle series "Geisteskultur Indiens. Texte und Studien (Indologica halensis)" has been released: Bhaskarakantha?s Moksopaya-Tika I. Vairagyaprakaranam. Revised edition in Devanagari script by Juergen Hanneder and Walter Slaje. (Geisteskultur Indiens. Texte und Studien. 1.) (Indologica halensis). Aachen: Shaker 2002. ISBN 3-8322-0217-X. Euro 35,80 In addition to the revised text the volume contains also introductions in Sanskrit and English outlining the present state of research in the Moksopaya (/ Yogavasistha) as well as an updated Moksopaya-bibliography. In case of interest, orders may also be placed online: http://www.shaker.de/Online-Gesamtkatalog/Details.asp?ID=244090&CC=2045&ISBN =3-8322-0217-X&Reihe=275&IDSRC=1&LastAction=Search With kind regards, Walter Slaje ----------------------------------------------- Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje Hermann-Loens-Str. 1, D-99425 Weimar (Germany) Tel/Fax: (+49)03643-501391 (office: (+49)0345-55-23650) e-mail: slaje at t-online.de (office: slaje at indologie.uni-halle.de) From lel at LEL.MSK.RU Mon Aug 5 17:10:26 2002 From: lel at LEL.MSK.RU (Lielukhine D.N.) Date: Mon, 05 Aug 02 21:10:26 +0400 Subject: None Message-ID: <161227071249.23782.4167707203328488527.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear colleagues ! Site http://indepigr.narod.ru/index1.htm updated. Here I placed two collections of epigraphy - Vakataka and Bagh' kings inscriptions, dozen my articles in html and pdf format etc. All your opinions, remarks, advices and recommendations will be helpful and very interesting for me. Lielukhine D.N. Oriental institute, Moscow, Dep. of History. Member secretary of "Epigraphy of the Orient" e-mail: lel at lel.msk.ru From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK Mon Aug 5 23:35:52 2002 From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Tue, 06 Aug 02 00:35:52 +0100 Subject: Query about Brhatparasarahorasasta verses Message-ID: <161227071252.23782.11815619237549484629.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Please send any replies directly to the author of this query, David Shields , who is not a member of the INDOLOGY list. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Sun, 28 Jul 2002 11:16:54 -0400 From: David Shields To: ucgadkw Subject: Pata?jali's Yogas?tras [...] Do you have any recommendations of where I may turn to gain a much deeper understanding of the Sanskrit in Chapter 27, verses 24-25 of Brihat Parasara Hora Sastra? Best regards, David Shields From Slaje at T-ONLINE.DE Tue Aug 6 06:19:45 2002 From: Slaje at T-ONLINE.DE (Walter Slaje) Date: Tue, 06 Aug 02 08:19:45 +0200 Subject: Publication Announcement Message-ID: <161227071255.23782.3635742539745422285.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Patrick, apologies! I uncritically forwarded the address as I had received it from the Publishers. The correct link should be: http:\\www.shaker-online.com/Online-Gesamtkatalog Best wishes, Walter ----------------------------------------------- Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje Hermann-Loens-Str. 1, D-99425 Weimar (Germany) Tel/Fax: (+49)03643-501391 (office: (+49)0345-55-23650) e-mail: slaje at t-online.de (office: slaje at indologie.uni-halle.de) From huntington.2 at OSU.EDU Tue Aug 6 13:54:24 2002 From: huntington.2 at OSU.EDU (John Huntington) Date: Tue, 06 Aug 02 09:54:24 -0400 Subject: Publication Announcement In-Reply-To: <17bxh3-1vwLbMC@fwd01.sul.t-online.com> Message-ID: <161227071258.23782.13157816286312849290.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear all the correct URL is http://www.shaker-online.com/Online-Gesamtkatalog John >Dear Patrick, > >apologies! I uncritically forwarded the address as I had received it from the >Publishers. > >The correct link should be: > >http:\\www.shaker-online.com/Online-Gesamtkatalog > > >Best wishes, > >Walter > >----------------------------------------------- >Prof. Dr. Walter Slaje >Hermann-Loens-Str. 1, D-99425 Weimar (Germany) >Tel/Fax: (+49)03643-501391 (office: (+49)0345-55-23650) >e-mail: slaje at t-online.de (office: slaje at indologie.uni-halle.de) From garzilli at SHORE.NET Wed Aug 7 14:11:20 2002 From: garzilli at SHORE.NET (Enrica Garzilli) Date: Wed, 07 Aug 02 16:11:20 +0200 Subject: a new sati Message-ID: <161227071260.23782.13289088688313243472.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> >???From Michael Witzel (everybody can check the news on the net): SATI IN PANNA, SHIELDED BY THE FAITHFUL & WITNESSED BY SONS by TAPAS CHAKRABORTY Aug. 6: Fifteen years after Roop Kanwar was forced to commit sati in Rajasthan's Deorala, Guttu Bai plunged into the leaping flames of her husband's pyre as an entire village in Madhya Pradesh erupted in celebration and her two sons stood as spectators. Moments into the incident, the village of timid onlookers in Panna district, about 300 km from Bhopal, worked up a frenzy, dancing, chanting hymns celebrating sati and virtually converting the faceless crematorium into a makeshift temple. After Mallu Nayya, 70, a backward class member of Patnatamoli village, died last night, his widow Guttu declared she would commit sati. A section of villagers from another caste informed Saleha police station, about 8 km away. Deputy superintendent of police S.H. Ghose reached the village with his team even as the pyre was being lit amid beating drums and kirtans. Ghose tried to stop Guttu as she lunged for the pyre after certain rituals. But a couple of hundred villagers helped her wriggle out. The policemen were treated to a shower of stones and brickbats, and Ghose fell unconscious. Guttu Bai's sons did nothing to save their mother. *******************************END********************************* eg ************************* Dr. Enrica Garzilli University of Macerata Editor-in-Chief, IJTS & JSAWS http://www.asiatica.org ************************* From magier at COLUMBIA.EDU Thu Aug 8 10:32:59 2002 From: magier at COLUMBIA.EDU (David Magier) Date: Thu, 08 Aug 02 06:32:59 -0400 Subject: Position in Indology In-Reply-To: <3D5233A3.15E89E53@ix.urz.uni-heidelberg.de> Message-ID: <161227071264.23782.9487683871676928266.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Prof. Emmrich, you've posted this notice on 8 August, but the deadline for applications was 30 September. David Magier At 11:02 AM +0200 8/8/02, Christoph Emmrich wrote: >The Department of Philology ? Institute of Indology ? of the University >of M?nster invites applications for a position as > >Professor (C4) for Indology >(Successor to Prof. Dr. Adelheid Mette) > >Applicants are expected to do research and teaching in the complete >field of Indology, with emphasis on intellectual history and Indian >religions (in particular Buddhism). Applicants are also expected to >participate in joint programs together with Southeast Asian Studies, >Sinology, Indo-European Studies and Religion Studies. They are also >expected to participate in all academic examinations, and take over the >duties of academic administration. > >Candidates from Germany are expected to be qualified by the >?Habilitation?. This can be replaced by equivalent scientific work of >candidates from abroad. Candidates from non-German speaking countries >are expected to be able to teach and coach students in German in due >course. > >Applications of women are specifically invited. In the case of similar >qualification, competence, and specific achievements, women will be >considered on preferential terms within the framework of the legal >possibilities. > >Priority will be given to handicapped candidates with equal >qualification. > >Applications including the pertinent documents (curriculum vitae, >academic qualifications, certifications, publications and the lists of >lectures and seminars given) should be send by September 30, 2002 to the > >Dean of the department of Philology of the University of M?nster, >Schlaunstra?e 2, 48143 M?nster, Germany. > >Please excuse cross-postings. > >-- > >Christoph Emmrich >Classical Indology >South Asia Institute >Heidelberg University >Im Neuenheimer Feld 330 >69120 Heidelberg - Germany >Tel.: 06221-54-6303 >Fax: 06221-54-6338 -- From christoph.emmrich at URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE Thu Aug 8 09:02:27 2002 From: christoph.emmrich at URZ.UNI-HEIDELBERG.DE (Christoph Emmrich) Date: Thu, 08 Aug 02 11:02:27 +0200 Subject: Position in Indology Message-ID: <161227071262.23782.4270741532857862685.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The Department of Philology ? Institute of Indology ? of the University of M?nster invites applications for a position as Professor (C4) for Indology (Successor to Prof. Dr. Adelheid Mette) Applicants are expected to do research and teaching in the complete field of Indology, with emphasis on intellectual history and Indian religions (in particular Buddhism). Applicants are also expected to participate in joint programs together with Southeast Asian Studies, Sinology, Indo-European Studies and Religion Studies. They are also expected to participate in all academic examinations, and take over the duties of academic administration. Candidates from Germany are expected to be qualified by the ?Habilitation?. This can be replaced by equivalent scientific work of candidates from abroad. Candidates from non-German speaking countries are expected to be able to teach and coach students in German in due course. Applications of women are specifically invited. In the case of similar qualification, competence, and specific achievements, women will be considered on preferential terms within the framework of the legal possibilities. Priority will be given to handicapped candidates with equal qualification. Applications including the pertinent documents (curriculum vitae, academic qualifications, certifications, publications and the lists of lectures and seminars given) should be send by September 30, 2002 to the Dean of the department of Philology of the University of M?nster, Schlaunstra?e 2, 48143 M?nster, Germany. Please excuse cross-postings. -- Christoph Emmrich Classical Indology South Asia Institute Heidelberg University Im Neuenheimer Feld 330 69120 Heidelberg - Germany Tel.: 06221-54-6303 Fax: 06221-54-6338 From aklujkar at INTERCHANGE.UBC.CA Fri Aug 9 17:41:10 2002 From: aklujkar at INTERCHANGE.UBC.CA (Ashok Aklujkar) Date: Fri, 09 Aug 02 10:41:10 -0700 Subject: Finite karman/destiny patterns? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20020809172220.0088b850@pop.lu.se> Message-ID: <161227071268.23782.14359974872200668941.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> A talk of 84 lak.sa yonis is heard in the tradition. In the foreseeable future, I would not have the time needed to determine what the textual support for this is. However, I am certain that the view is a part of the Indian tradition. Whether it necessarily implies "a limitation to the variety of karmic manifestation" I am not sure. It may stand for the extent of one possible cycle, among many, made of life forms or simply for a theoretical set made of possible variations in horoscopes (or of only the significantly different variations in horoscopes). On 09-08-2002 08:22, "Martin Gansten" wrote: > Has anyone come across, within any Indic religious tradition, a doctrine to > the effect that there exist a finite (albeit great) number of possible > human life-patterns -- or in other words, a limitation to the variety of > karmic manifestation? Such a view seems to underlie certain (late) > astrological texts which I am studying, and I would be very interested to > know of any parallels. > > Best regards, > Martin Gansten From Martin.Gansten at TEOL.LU.SE Fri Aug 9 15:22:20 2002 From: Martin.Gansten at TEOL.LU.SE (Martin Gansten) Date: Fri, 09 Aug 02 17:22:20 +0200 Subject: Finite karman/destiny patterns? In-Reply-To: <33.2b47d626.2a844db1@aol.com> Message-ID: <161227071266.23782.17625140934015440883.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Has anyone come across, within any Indic religious tradition, a doctrine to the effect that there exist a finite (albeit great) number of possible human life-patterns -- or in other words, a limitation to the variety of karmic manifestation? Such a view seems to underlie certain (late) astrological texts which I am studying, and I would be very interested to know of any parallels. Best regards, Martin Gansten From Martin.Gansten at TEOL.LU.SE Fri Aug 9 18:57:24 2002 From: Martin.Gansten at TEOL.LU.SE (Martin Gansten) Date: Fri, 09 Aug 02 20:57:24 +0200 Subject: Finite karman/destiny patterns? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227071269.23782.12834876884868356045.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> >A talk of 84 lak.sa yonis is heard in the tradition. In the foreseeable >future, I would not have the time needed to determine what the textual >support for this is. Yes; I have seen this sort of statement, in one case attributed to the Brahmavaivarta Purana, in another, to Manu (where I could not find it): jalajaa navalak.saa.ni sthaavaraa lak.savi.mzati / k.rmayo rudrasa.mkhyaakaa.h pak.si.naa.m dazalak.sa.nam / tri.mzallak.saa.ni pazavaz caturlak.saa.ni maanu.saa.h // But these are, as you say, yonis -- 'species', in a broad sense -- not human life-patterns of the kind I was thinking of, where the duration and major events of a person's life are defined beforehand (though with some scope for variation). Thanks, Martin Gansten From yavass at YV1041.SPB.EDU Sun Aug 11 14:56:19 2002 From: yavass at YV1041.SPB.EDU (Yaroslav Vassilkov) Date: Sun, 11 Aug 02 17:56:19 +0300 Subject: Finite karman/destiny patterns? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20020809172220.0088b850@pop.lu.se> Message-ID: <161227071271.23782.2064359183353870338.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Martin, here are some MahAbhArata verses which may prove to be relevant: dhAtaiva khalu bhUtAnAM sukhaduHkhe priyApriyau / dadhAti sarvam IzAnaH purastAc chukram uccaran // 3, 31.21 uta santam asantaM ca bAlaM vRddhaM ca saMjaya / utA 'balaM balIyAsaM dhAtA prakurute vaze // uta bAlAya pANDityaM paNDitAyo 'ta bAlatAm / dadAti sarvam IzAnaH purastAc chukram uccaran // 5, 31.1-2 I consider it to be a theistic version of the epic (heroic) fatalism. It implies, as it seems, the idea that DhAtA fixes destinies of all living beings (limited number?) at the time of cosmic conception. Hope it helps. Regards, Yaroslav Vassilkov Fri, 09 Aug 102 18:22 +0300 MSK Martin Gansten wrote to INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk: > Has anyone come across, within any Indic religious tradition, a doctrine to > the effect that there exist a finite (albeit great) number of possible > human life-patterns -- or in other words, a limitation to the variety of > karmic manifestation? Such a view seems to underlie certain (late) > astrological texts which I am studying, and I would be very interested to > know of any parallels. > > Best regards, > Martin Gansten > --- Yaroslav Vassilkov (yavass at YV1041.spb.edu) Sun, 11 Aug 102 17:43 +0300 MSK From magier at COLUMBIA.EDU Wed Aug 14 15:08:24 2002 From: magier at COLUMBIA.EDU (David Magier) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 02 11:08:24 -0400 Subject: SARAI: event announcement Mirabai Festival Message-ID: <161227071274.23782.3456443725652714065.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The following event announcement is being forwarded to your mailing list or listserv from the EVENTS CALENDAR section of SARAI. Please contact event organizers directly for any further information. David Magier SARAI http://www.columbia.edu/cu/lweb/indiv/southasia/cuvl >A Mirabai festival and conference, entitled "Mirabai: Hindu Saint for a >Global World," is to be held October 3-8, 2002 in Los Angeles. The >program will include scholarship, art, music, and dance. The principle >venues will be UCLA and the Los Angeles County Museum of Art. > >For further information visit http://www.GERForum.org/mirabai/ From indologia at LATINMAIL.COM Wed Aug 14 20:27:27 2002 From: indologia at LATINMAIL.COM (humanidades India) Date: Wed, 14 Aug 02 16:27:27 -0400 Subject: looking Message-ID: <161227071276.23782.2666207525191544795.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> -----My dear friends: > In the Mahabh?rata the Yamuna river ttha cross by Delhi is called the Ganga as the puranas??? Are there descriptions of tumeric and kunkuma powder in this Mbh.???? > Could your give me the quotes in case that exist this mentions in It???? Horacio F. Arganis J. U A de C.-- _________________________________________________________ http://www.latinmail.com. Gratuito, latino y en espa?ol. From jpo at UTS.CC.UTEXAS.EDU Fri Aug 16 14:30:21 2002 From: jpo at UTS.CC.UTEXAS.EDU (Patrick Olivelle) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 02 09:30:21 -0500 Subject: Chinese in India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227071282.23782.7829269434442993963.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Friends: Can anyone on the list shed light on when China has its first trade or other contact with India -- or at least the northwestern regions of the subcontinent? And when do you think that the term "Ciina" to refer to the Chinese could have first arisen within Sanskrit? Thanks. Patrick From mkapstei at MIDWAY.UCHICAGO.EDU Fri Aug 16 14:56:40 2002 From: mkapstei at MIDWAY.UCHICAGO.EDU (Matthew Kapstein) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 02 09:56:40 -0500 Subject: Chinese in India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227071284.23782.17337484146575547858.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> One thing is sure -- the term Ciina cannot predate the Qin dynasty, during the late 3rd c. BCE. And clear evidence of Buddhist contact -- which cannot have been the earliest contact -- dates to the 1st - 2nd c. CE. Victor Mair for one would like to push contact much further back, however, in the context of more general Indo-European - Chinese contacts beginning in the 2nd or even 3rd millenium BCE. There's a lot of relevant lit. on all this, but I'm travelling and away from my references just now. Matthew Kapstein From hhhock at UX1.CSO.UIUC.EDU Fri Aug 16 15:29:59 2002 From: hhhock at UX1.CSO.UIUC.EDU (hans henrich hock) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 02 10:29:59 -0500 Subject: Chinese in India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227071286.23782.11089921381786463353.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> As for Victor Mair's attempts, it may be worth noting that Mallory and Mair refer to work by Brian Hemphill that suggests that the earliest layer of the Tarim Mummies (ca. 2000 BC) cannot be related to any western or northwestern population and appear to result from an indigenous development. (Mallory, J. P., and Victor H. Mair. 2000. The Tarim mummies: Ancient China and the mystery of the earliest peoples from the west. London: Thames and Hudson.) This causes considerable difficulties for Mair's attempts to argue that this early population was "western", "European", or "Indo-European", and also make problematic a pre-3rd c. BC time of Chinese-Indian contact. (Hemphill and Mallory are now preparing a full-scale report on this issue, to appear in the American Journal of Physical Anthropology.) Hans Henrich Hock >One thing is sure -- the term Ciina cannot predate the >Qin dynasty, during the late 3rd c. BCE. And clear evidence >of Buddhist contact -- which cannot have been the earliest >contact -- dates to the 1st - 2nd c. CE. Victor Mair for one >would like to push contact much further back, however, in >the context of more general Indo-European - Chinese contacts >beginning in the 2nd or even 3rd millenium BCE. There's a lot >of relevant lit. on all this, but I'm travelling and away >from my references just now. >Matthew Kapstein From jkirk at SPRO.NET Fri Aug 16 17:52:40 2002 From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 02 11:52:40 -0600 Subject: Chinese in India Message-ID: <161227071289.23782.6708588638488166627.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Excuse a non-expert question, but since they are mummies, how come there has been no DNA testing, or if they've done it, why is it not mentioned? Joanna Kirkpatrick From hhhock at UX1.CSO.UIUC.EDU Fri Aug 16 17:58:27 2002 From: hhhock at UX1.CSO.UIUC.EDU (Hans Henrich Hock) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 02 12:58:27 -0500 Subject: Chinese in India In-Reply-To: <005901c2454d$b7ce63b0$2930cece@JKIRK> Message-ID: <161227071291.23782.681742132315982534.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> From what I understand, permission from the Chinese authorities to take DNA samples has been difficult to get; beside, DNA tends to degrade--even tests conducted on samples about 1000 years later yield only very tentative results. Hemphill's study is based on craniometry. >Excuse a non-expert question, but since they are mummies, how come there has >been no DNA testing, or if they've done it, why is it not mentioned? >Joanna Kirkpatrick From ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK Fri Aug 16 14:32:04 2002 From: ucgadkw at UCL.AC.UK (Dominik Wujastyk) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 02 15:32:04 +0100 Subject: Finite karman/destiny patterns? In-Reply-To: <3.0.6.32.20020809172220.0088b850@pop.lu.se> Message-ID: <161227071279.23782.13111054207837998345.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> A place to check might be the introductory remarks in such works as the Mahakarmavipaka (Surya-Aruna-samvada), which give thousands of individual potted biographies. I don't think this is quite what you mean, i.e., these are presented as actual lives, not templates. title = "{Vrddha-Suryarunakarmavipaka}", publisher = "Khemaraja Srikrsnadasa", year = "1909", address = "Bombay" David Pingree has written about this work, author = "David Pingree", title = "{Two \emph{Karmavipaka} texts on curing diseases and other misfortunes}", journal = jeas, year = "1997", volume = "5", pages = "46--52" I also cited the MKV and gave one of the biographies in my chapter in title = "Religion, health, and suffering", publisher = "Kegan Paul International", year = "1999", editor = "John Hinnells and Roy Porter", address = "London" See also author = "Ludo Rocher", crossref = "doni-karm", title = "{Karma and rebirth in the Dharma??stras}", booktitle = "{Karma and rebirth in classical Indian traditions}", year = "1980", pages = "61--89", Which gives comparative tabulation of the various sinners and their destinies as given in Manu, Yajnavalkya and Visnu. Finally, NB the doctrine that crops up in various places (including medical and yoga texts) that a person has a certain predestined number of breaths. Best, Dominik From GthomGt at CS.COM Sat Aug 17 02:40:38 2002 From: GthomGt at CS.COM (George Thompson) Date: Fri, 16 Aug 02 22:40:38 -0400 Subject: Chinese in India Message-ID: <161227071293.23782.12083070256203345101.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Well, strictly speaking the subject of this discussion is supposed to be "Chinese in India," not "Chinese in the Tarim Basin." Of course, I understand that establishing the presence of Chinese in the Tarim Basin at an early date is a first step toward establishing their presence in India at an early date. But craniometrical analyses of early Tarim Basin mummies -- that is, the work of Hemphill -- is relevant only because it puts into question a very early contact between an early IE group in Central Asia and early Chinese. ut there is other, non-craniometrical evidence ot consider. There is, for example, the lingiuistic evidence presented by Lubotsky in Lubotsky 1998, in a collection of articles on the Tarim Basin edited by V. Mair: "Tocharian Loan Words in Old Chinese: Chariots, Chariot Gear, and Town Building." From s.hodge at PADMACHOLING.FREESERVE.CO.UK Sat Aug 17 03:31:16 2002 From: s.hodge at PADMACHOLING.FREESERVE.CO.UK (Stephen Hodge) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 02 04:31:16 +0100 Subject: Chinese in India Message-ID: <161227071295.23782.11140308949615088444.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Patrick Olivelle wrote: > And when do you think that the term "Ciina" to > refer to the Chinese could have first arisen within Sanskrit? I haven't got time to dig out the references but while "ciina" or better still "mahaa-ciina" does refer to China, it is clear from Buddhist texts dating from the early medieval period (C6-8th) that "ciina" often refers to Tibet and some Indo-Tibetan border areas to the east in Assam. Best wishes, Stephen Hodge From jpo at UTS.CC.UTEXAS.EDU Sat Aug 17 13:20:22 2002 From: jpo at UTS.CC.UTEXAS.EDU (Patrick Olivelle) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 02 08:20:22 -0500 Subject: Chinese in India In-Reply-To: <2b.2bd4b0ea.2a8fa2ac@cs.com> Message-ID: <161227071299.23782.10836719057922765339.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Thanks for all the replies to my question about China. However, the answers missed the point. I am not talking about contacts with people etc. from the region(s) we have come to call China -- even if there is a mistake, e.g. Tibet or Assam. The question is the word "chiina", which, as far as I know, could have originated only after the unification of China under the Quin (Chin) dynasty in the 3rd century B.C.E. So the question again is, when did the Indians (Sanskrit sources) come to IDENTIFY this (or any other) ethinic group as "ciina". This goes back to the further question -- when did the Chinese themselves refer to themselfs as "Chinese"? Was this an emic self-identification, or, as in "India" and "Indian" purely an etic or outsider's label? And how long did it take for this label to come to India? I have got some bibliographic references which I have still to track down. Thanks. Patrick From GthomGt at CS.COM Sat Aug 17 12:59:24 2002 From: GthomGt at CS.COM (George Thompson) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 02 08:59:24 -0400 Subject: Chinese in India Message-ID: <161227071297.23782.14090974559151089187.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Apologies to the list for my previous post, which was abrupt and unsigned. My e-mail program has started to send saved messages automatically. I had intended to think a bit more before sending the post. Here is an example of possible indirect [and possibly early] linkage between India and China. Lubotsky, in the article cited, notes a possible borrowing of a word from Tocharian into Chinese [forgive me for approximate transliterations]: Tocharian *an'kwas*, plant-name Chinese *yaangkui`*plant-name. Michael Witzel has called my attention to the fact that these may be relatable to the reconstructed Indo-Iranian form: *anc'u, plant-name [Skt. aMzu; Avest. amsu] This form is not IE, and has been attributed by Lubotsky to a possible Central Asian substrate. If the Tocharian word is related, it may have been borrowed either from that Central Asian substrate or from Indo-Iranian. This is mere speculation, of course. Perhaps more competent list members will comment. Best wishes, George Thompson From nattier at HAWAII.EDU Sat Aug 17 20:33:08 2002 From: nattier at HAWAII.EDU (Jan Nattier) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 02 10:33:08 -1000 Subject: Chinese in India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227071301.23782.5243836384621705798.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Hello Patrick, A superb source for quick references on such things is Endymion Wilkinson's _Chinese History: A Manual_, first published in 1998 and now available in an even more comprehensive revised paperback edition (2000; Harvard-Yenching Institute Monograph Series, no. 52, 1181 pages, $26.50). In his discussion of Chinese self-appellations (pp. 95-96 in the revised edition) he reports that during the Warring States period (403-222 BCE) people referred to themselves and to each other by the names of their kingdoms, e.g., Songren ["Song (kingdom) people"], Weiren, and so forth. After the Qin (= Ch'in in Wade-Giles) unification in 221 BCE, and for most of the rest of Chinese history, the Chinese "continued to refer to themselves collectively as the Xia (or Hua, Huaxia, or Zhongxia)" (p. 95). Wilkinson adds that they also used the name of a dynasty to refer to its people (and, I would add, its language: in Buddhist sources from the 2nd-4th c. CE, Chinese glosses on foreign terms are labeled "in the Han language" in the late 2nd c., "in the Jin language" in the late 3rd/early 4th c., etc.). The name "Han" enjoyed a trans-dynastic life, continuing to be used in some cases as a generic name for "China" and "the Chinese." Nowhere in the Buddhist materials I have worked with, or in the secular materials discussed by Wilkinson, does the character Qin appear, outside the Qin period itself, as a general name for "China." In fact, by the mid-2nd c. CE it is being used in the Han dynasty histories (in the form Da Qin "Great Qin") as a name for the Roman empire! (briefly discussed in my _Once Upon a Future Time_, p. 158 and n. 29) In sum: the name "Qin" appears to have been used within China as a general name for "Chinese" only during the Qin dynasty (221-207 BCE). It would therefore seem to follow that the Sanskrit term ciina could only have been coined during this period, unless we assume that the Sanskrit was based on an intermediary language in which the name "Qin" had already been borrowed during that time, which is of course a real possibility. Jan Nattier Dept. of Religious Studies Indiana University From nattier at HAWAII.EDU Sun Aug 18 00:40:46 2002 From: nattier at HAWAII.EDU (Jan Nattier) Date: Sat, 17 Aug 02 14:40:46 -1000 Subject: addition/correction on Chinese in India In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227071303.23782.11610423051544188137.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I am now reminded by a colleague that there were also two somewhat later Qin dynasties (later than the texts I work on, hence beyond the range of my peripheral vision), the Former and Latter Qin, dated 351-394 and 384-417 CE respectively (yes, there is an overlap). *If* it is the case that there is no certain use of the Sanskrit term ciina prior to the mid-4th century, these dynasties would also be possible candidates for its source. Jan Nattier Dept. of Religious Studies Indiana University From s.hodge at PADMACHOLING.FREESERVE.CO.UK Sun Aug 18 02:27:42 2002 From: s.hodge at PADMACHOLING.FREESERVE.CO.UK (Stephen Hodge) Date: Sun, 18 Aug 02 03:27:42 +0100 Subject: Chinese in India Message-ID: <161227071305.23782.14325121890929400115.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Jan Nattier wrote: > have been coined during this period, unless we assume that the Sanskrit > was based on an intermediary language in which the name "Qin" had > already been borrowed during that time, which is of course a real > possibility. One of my sideline interests is early Indian toponyns and in connection with that I have noted that there are extensive country lists in various Buddhist sutras. In this respect, the Tathaagata-guhyaka-suutra and the Candragarbha-suutra are interesting. The first is surely of Indic provenance though the latter is probably Central Asian in origin. The last block of countries given in the TGS runs "Agni, Charchen, Kinnara, Ciina, Lala (all given phonetically), and the Land of Wu" -- the placing of Ciina suggests it is not referring to China proper but possibly somewhere in the Gansu Corridor which is not too removed from the heartland of the ancient Qin. The CGS has a shorter list but has Kashmir, *Ambulima, Ciina and Khotan. Hence your suggestion of an intermediary language seems likely. Best wishes, Stephen Hodge From rsalomon at U.WASHINGTON.EDU Tue Aug 20 00:10:51 2002 From: rsalomon at U.WASHINGTON.EDU (Richard Salomon) Date: Mon, 19 Aug 02 17:10:51 -0700 Subject: Fw: Fw: Chinese in India Message-ID: <161227071307.23782.17247623275682441249.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> [The following response to Patrick Olivelle's question is by Jason Neelis; I am forwarding it to the list, as he is not currently a subscriber. -R.S.] > In The Rise of Civilization in India and Pakistan, Bridget and F.R. Allchin cite "evidence of trade and other more profound contacts with the Chinese world" (p. 116) in the discussion of neolithic sites in Kashmir and Swat. Perhaps more relevant to our period of interest is a reference in the 1st century CE Periplus Maris Erythraei to "Chinese pelts" and Chinese cloth traded at the ports of Barbaricon at the mouth of the Indus River and Barygaza (Skt. Bhr.gukaccha) near the mouth of the Narmada River in Gujarat. Both of these ports functioned as outlets for items traded through the northwest, some of which may have originated in China and Central Asia. > > I am not certain when "Ciina" or "Mahaaciina" first appears in Sanskrit, but people called Ciinas are linked with Kaambojas and other peoples in the northwest, with Praagjyotis.a in the northeast, and with a country near the source of the Ganges River in the Mahabharata (D.C. Sircar, Studies in the Geography of Ancient and Medieval India, p. 104, cites Mahabharata 6.9.66, 5.19.15, and 3.177.12). An early Indian epigraphical reference to Ciina is in a list of countries purportedly converted by Buddhist monks from Tam.bapam.n.a (Sri Lanka) in a third century CE Nagarjunikonda Prakrit inscription of regnal year 14 of Viirapurus.adatta: kasmiira-gam.dhaara-ciina- ... (EI 20 [1929-30]: pp. 22-3; D.C. Sircar, Select Inscriptions,vol.1: no. 101, pp. 23-6). It seems that by the late third century CE, Ciina belonged to a list of countries generally localized in the northern or northwestern frontiers of the Indian subcontinent, but not necessarily denoting China proper. > > Hope this helps, > > Jason Neelis > > > > Can anyone on the list shed light on when China has its first trade > > > or other contact with India -- or at least the northwestern regions > > > of the subcontinent? And when do you think that the term "Ciina" to > > > refer to the Chinese could have first arisen within Sanskrit? > > > > > > Thanks. > > > > > > Patrick > > > > > > > > > > From silk at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU Tue Aug 20 21:56:53 2002 From: silk at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU (Silk, Jonathan) Date: Tue, 20 Aug 02 14:56:53 -0700 Subject: suggestions for a name for a hospital Message-ID: <161227071309.23782.8033178047898914601.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Friends, the following was forwarded to me, and I pass it along in the hope that some of you might have a nice suggestion or two to make. If you have anything to offer, perhaps the best course is to send your suggestions to me, and then I will pass them along. By the way, UCSF = University of California at San Fransisco. >Hello.Your name was given to me by the Department of Eastern Languages Dept. > >I am a producer here at Imaginary Forces; a film,design, animation and >branding production company in Los Angeles. >We are involved in a project which I believe to be very special. We have >been asked to come up with a name and then a logo for The Palliative Care >Center (a new care facility) which is a sub-unit in UCSF's Children's >Hospital. The palliative care unit is an end of life care unit for >children, and it supplies physical, emotional and spiritual support to >children and their families during this very difficult time of the child's >life. It is not a hospital with the intention of healing. More for >providing care. > >This is a project that we are doing pro bono, of course. > >The director of the facility would like very much to name it a "cultural" >(or different than English) name with Sanskrit being a choice language. We >would like some choices of words that has to do with: > >comforting care, supportive care, compassion, transition with enlightenment >or enrichment. >or "Starlight" or "Guiding Star" (the Sanskrit equivelent, if one >obviously) could be a nice choice. > >I am open to the sensitive and other possibilites..... > >It would be titled: > >The xxxxxxx Care Center for Children, or, >The xxxxxx Center >A Care Center for Children and Their Families > >It would be interesting to find a word which does not have an exact >translation in English, as I am sure many asian languages provide. > >Examples: > >Yugen is a Japanese word that means, evidently, an awareness of >the universe that triggers feelings too deep and mysterious for words. > I like this meaning.... the words ("The Yugen Children's >Center" doesn't quite flow however.) > >Kiva is a Native American word for an under ground cermonial >chamber believed to be an entryway to the spirit world. (Maybe too serious >for this kind of center. Maybe not) > >A little bit of whimsy or childlike spirit to it would be great. Not over >the top whimsical. > >Anyway, I am sure that you can understand what we are trying to find in >Sanskrit as good possibilities. >If you could help with some possible words, I / we would be ever so >grateful. > >Thank you so much. I look forward to hearing from you. >I know that your time is very valuable and so will understand and appreciate >if you are able or not to spend some time on this. > >Most sincerely, > >Phyllis Weisband. >Imaginary Forces >323-957-6868 > >phyllis at imaginaryforces.com From hdehejia at CCS.CARLETON.CA Wed Aug 21 08:16:59 2002 From: hdehejia at CCS.CARLETON.CA (Harsha V. Dehejia) Date: Wed, 21 Aug 02 04:16:59 -0400 Subject: suggestions for a name for a hospital Message-ID: <161227071315.23782.4383753694263727161.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> How about Shanti Vihar: Garden of Peace? Harsha Dehejia From vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET Wed Aug 21 06:47:54 2002 From: vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET (Valerie J Roebuck) Date: Wed, 21 Aug 02 07:47:54 +0100 Subject: suggestions for a name for a hospital In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <161227071313.23782.5324810517936523045.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> karuNA, "Compassion", is a good word, and I think has just the right connotations. However,it would almost certainly be mispronounced. tArA, "star", is also nice, though as it's the name of an important Goddess in MahAyAna Buddhism, people might think it was a meditation centre. But "The Tara Care Centre for Children" has a good ring--and she *is* a goddess of compassion.. At 2:56 pm -0700 20/8/02, Silk, Jonathan wrote: >Friends, > >the following was forwarded to me, and I pass it along in the hope that some >of you might have a nice suggestion or two to make. If you have anything to >offer, perhaps the best course is to send your suggestions to me, and then I >will pass them along. By the way, UCSF = University of California at San >Fransisco. > >>Hello.Your name was given to me by the Department of Eastern Languages >Dept. >> >>I am a producer here at Imaginary Forces; a film,design, animation and >>branding production company in Los Angeles. >>We are involved in a project which I believe to be very special. We have >>been asked to come up with a name and then a logo for The Palliative Care >>Center (a new care facility) which is a sub-unit in UCSF's Children's >>Hospital. The palliative care unit is an end of life care unit for >>children, and it supplies physical, emotional and spiritual support to >>children and their families during this very difficult time of the child's >>life. It is not a hospital with the intention of healing. More for >>providing care. >> >>This is a project that we are doing pro bono, of course. >> >>The director of the facility would like very much to name it a "cultural" >>(or different than English) name with Sanskrit being a choice language. We >>would like some choices of words that has to do with: >> >>comforting care, supportive care, compassion, transition with enlightenment >>or enrichment. >>or "Starlight" or "Guiding Star" (the Sanskrit equivelent, if one >>obviously) could be a nice choice. >> >>I am open to the sensitive and other possibilites..... >> >>It would be titled: >> >>The xxxxxxx Care Center for Children, or, >>The xxxxxx Center >>A Care Center for Children and Their Families >> >>It would be interesting to find a word which does not have an exact >>translation in English, as I am sure many asian languages provide. >> >>Examples: >> >>Yugen is a Japanese word that means, evidently, an awareness of >>the universe that triggers feelings too deep and mysterious for words. >> I like this meaning.... the words ("The Yugen Children's >>Center" doesn't quite flow however.) >> >>Kiva is a Native American word for an under ground cermonial >>chamber believed to be an entryway to the spirit world. (Maybe too serious >>for this kind of center. Maybe not) >> >>A little bit of whimsy or childlike spirit to it would be great. Not over >>the top whimsical. >> >>Anyway, I am sure that you can understand what we are trying to find in >>Sanskrit as good possibilities. >>If you could help with some possible words, I / we would be ever so >>grateful. >> >>Thank you so much. I look forward to hearing from you. >>I know that your time is very valuable and so will understand and >appreciate >>if you are able or not to spend some time on this. >> >>Most sincerely, >> >>Phyllis Weisband. >>Imaginary Forces >>323-957-6868 >> >>phyllis at imaginaryforces.com From vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET Wed Aug 21 09:02:26 2002 From: vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET (Valerie J Roebuck) Date: Wed, 21 Aug 02 10:02:26 +0100 Subject: suggestions for a name for a hospital Message-ID: <161227071317.23782.15399845291371193732.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Apologies for sending an unfinished and unsigned email to the list. It seems to me that they need a name that (a) has a suitable meaning; (b) is easy to pronounce, and sounds pleasant, for people unfamiliar with Sanskrit (or whatever language is chosen); and (c) doesn't sound as though it denotes a centre for one religious tradition only. Tricky! Valerie J Roebuck Manchester, UK >karuNA, "Compassion", is a good word, and I think has just the right >connotations. However,it would almost certainly be mispronounced. > >tArA, "star", is also nice, though as it's the name of an important >Goddess in MahAyAna Buddhism, people might think it was a meditation >centre. But "The Tara Care Centre for Children" has a good >ring--and she *is* a goddess of compassion.. PS Also to people who didn't know the background, "Tara" might just sound like a child's name, which would presumably be OK. > >>Hello.Your name was given to me by the Department of Eastern Languages >Dept. >> >>I am a producer here at Imaginary Forces; a film,design, animation and >>branding production company in Los Angeles. >>We are involved in a project which I believe to be very special. We have >>been asked to come up with a name and then a logo for The Palliative Care >>Center (a new care facility) which is a sub-unit in UCSF's Children's >>Hospital. The palliative care unit is an end of life care unit for >>children, and it supplies physical, emotional and spiritual support to >>children and their families during this very difficult time of the child's >>life. It is not a hospital with the intention of healing. More for >>providing care. >> >>This is a project that we are doing pro bono, of course. >> >>The director of the facility would like very much to name it a "cultural" >>(or different than English) name with Sanskrit being a choice language. We >>would like some choices of words that has to do with: >> >>comforting care, supportive care, compassion, transition with enlightenment >>or enrichment. >>or "Starlight" or "Guiding Star" (the Sanskrit equivelent, if one >>obviously) could be a nice choice. >> >>I am open to the sensitive and other possibilites..... >> >>It would be titled: >> >>The xxxxxxx Care Center for Children, or, >>The xxxxxx Center >>A Care Center for Children and Their Families >> >>It would be interesting to find a word which does not have an exact >>translation in English, as I am sure many asian languages provide. >> >>Examples: >> >>Yugen is a Japanese word that means, evidently, an awareness of >>the universe that triggers feelings too deep and mysterious for words. >> I like this meaning.... the words ("The Yugen Children's >>Center" doesn't quite flow however.) >> >>Kiva is a Native American word for an under ground cermonial >>chamber believed to be an entryway to the spirit world. (Maybe too serious >>for this kind of center. Maybe not) >> >>A little bit of whimsy or childlike spirit to it would be great. Not over >>the top whimsical. >> >>Anyway, I am sure that you can understand what we are trying to find in >>Sanskrit as good possibilities. >>If you could help with some possible words, I / we would be ever so >>grateful. >> >>Thank you so much. I look forward to hearing from you. >>I know that your time is very valuable and so will understand and >appreciate >>if you are able or not to spend some time on this. >> >>Most sincerely, >> >>Phyllis Weisband. >>Imaginary Forces >>323-957-6868 >> >>phyllis at imaginaryforces.com From rbm49 at EXT.CANTERBURY.AC.NZ Wed Aug 21 06:36:29 2002 From: rbm49 at EXT.CANTERBURY.AC.NZ (Richard Mahoney) Date: Wed, 21 Aug 02 18:36:29 +1200 Subject: Of the Progresse of the Bodhisattva Message-ID: <161227071311.23782.2830000782169926663.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear All, I have made my thesis available: Mahoney, R.B., ``Of the Progresse of the Bodhisattva: the Bodhisattvamaarga in the "Sik.saasamuccaya'', M.A. Thesis (Dept of Philosophy & Religious Studies, University of Canterbury, March 2002) Two files (one PDF, one gzipped PostScript) live at: http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney/ma_thesis/ma_thesis.html Many regards, Richard Mahoney P.S. If anyone would prefer a hard copy please feel free to contact me. -- +--------------- r i c h a r d . m a h o n e y ----------------+ 78 Jeffreys Road telephone:+64-3-351-5831 Christchurch New Zealand cellular:+64-25-829-986 +----- r b m 4 9 @ e x t . c a n t e r b u r y . ac . n z -----+ From tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU Thu Aug 22 02:59:14 2002 From: tbt7 at COLUMBIA.EDU (Tenzin Bob Thurman) Date: Wed, 21 Aug 02 21:59:14 -0500 Subject: suggestions for a name for a hospital Message-ID: <161227071319.23782.2556616191694306109.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I agree with Valerie Roebuck's suggestion to use the name of Tara, which Tibetan folk etymologies associate with "saving" in a spiritual sense as well as "star." A very good suggestion. Also, since Tara is a common Irish name - no doubt with good connotations in Gaelic, it won;t seem overly exotic to folks in LA. From jkirk at SPRO.NET Sat Aug 24 20:08:01 2002 From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk) Date: Sat, 24 Aug 02 14:08:01 -0600 Subject: suggestions for a name for a hospital Message-ID: <161227071323.23782.4816387568739152480.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I also suggested Karuna, easy to pronounce even if someone doesn't get the N in the middle of it. In the USA nobody pronounces anything right anyway--how about "nuculer" instead of nuclear in the highest echelons? As long as it is not mixed up with kahuna! Joanna K ========================= > > Also, since Tara is a common Irish name - no doubt with good > > connotations in Gaelic, it won;t seem overly exotic to folks in LA. ------------------------------ > But expect puzzled expressions from Japanese folk for whom "tara" means > 'cod' :) > > Best wishes, > Stephen Hodge > From s.hodge at PADMACHOLING.FREESERVE.CO.UK Sat Aug 24 16:36:08 2002 From: s.hodge at PADMACHOLING.FREESERVE.CO.UK (Stephen Hodge) Date: Sat, 24 Aug 02 17:36:08 +0100 Subject: suggestions for a name for a hospital Message-ID: <161227071321.23782.9974455728706178266.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> > I agree with Valerie Roebuck's suggestion to use the name of Tara, which > Tibetan folk etymologies associate with "saving" in a spiritual sense as > well as "star." A very good suggestion. > Also, since Tara is a common Irish name - no doubt with good > connotations in Gaelic, it won;t seem overly exotic to folks in LA. But expect puzzled expressions from Japanese folk for whom "tara" means 'cod' :) Best wishes, Stephen Hodge From vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET Sun Aug 25 05:36:38 2002 From: vjroebuck at MACUNLIMITED.NET (Valerie J Roebuck) Date: Sun, 25 Aug 02 06:36:38 +0100 Subject: suggestions for a name for a hospital In-Reply-To: <001101c24ba9$f32e4fd0$2930cece@JKIRK> Message-ID: <161227071325.23782.4324470258065821747.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> But won't they also stress it on the "u" instead of the first "a"? Valerie J Roebuck Manchester, UK PS What's "kahuna"? >I also suggested Karuna, easy to pronounce even if someone doesn't get the N >in the >middle of it. In the USA nobody pronounces anything right anyway--how about >"nuculer" instead of nuclear in the highest echelons? >As long as it is not mixed up with kahuna! Joanna K >========================= > >> > Also, since Tara is a common Irish name - no doubt with good >> > connotations in Gaelic, it won;t seem overly exotic to folks in LA. >------------------------------ >> But expect puzzled expressions from Japanese folk for whom "tara" means >> 'cod' :) >> >> Best wishes, >> Stephen Hodge >> From jkirk at SPRO.NET Sun Aug 25 18:00:19 2002 From: jkirk at SPRO.NET (jkirk) Date: Sun, 25 Aug 02 12:00:19 -0600 Subject: suggestions for a name for a hospital Message-ID: <161227071327.23782.14502657190871578529.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Who cares if they don't stress it correctly? It's a nice musical word full of vowells and its meaning is so appropriate. As I recall, kahuuna is a Hawaiian word meaning shaman (or something like). It has become slang in English as "the big kahuna" meaning the big shot, the boss, and so on. JK =================== > But won't they also stress it on the "u" instead of the first "a"? > > Valerie J Roebuck > Manchester, UK > > PS What's "kahuna"? > > >I also suggested Karuna, easy to pronounce even if someone doesn't get the N > >in the > >middle of it. In the USA nobody pronounces anything right anyway--how about > >"nuculer" instead of nuclear in the highest echelons? > >As long as it is not mixed up with kahuna! Joanna K > > > > >========================= > > > >> > Also, since Tara is a common Irish name - no doubt with good > >> > connotations in Gaelic, it won;t seem overly exotic to folks in LA. > >------------------------------ > >> But expect puzzled expressions from Japanese folk for whom "tara" means > >> 'cod' :) > >> > >> Best wishes, > >> Stephen Hodge > >> > From Ernst.Steinkellner at UNIVIE.AC.AT Tue Aug 27 12:13:26 2002 From: Ernst.Steinkellner at UNIVIE.AC.AT (Ernst Steinkellner) Date: Tue, 27 Aug 02 14:13:26 +0200 Subject: AW: Of the Progresse of the Bodhisattva In-Reply-To: <20020821063629.GB263@ext.canterbury.ac.nz> Message-ID: <161227071329.23782.15767426600822619246.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Colleague, It would be great, indeed, if we could have a hard copy of your work for our library. Expenses will be covered if you send an invoice. Address: Prof. Ernst Steinkellner c/o Institut f?r S?dasien-, Tibet- und Buddhismuskunde Universit?t Wien Universit?tscampus Spitalgasse 2 A-1090 Wien Thank you very much in advance and for your kind offer. With best wishes, Ernst Steinkellner > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: Indology [mailto:INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk]Im Auftrag von Richard > Mahoney > Gesendet am: Mittwoch, 21. August 2002 08:36 > An: INDOLOGY at liverpool.ac.uk > Betreff: Of the Progresse of the Bodhisattva > > Dear All, > > I have made my thesis available: > > Mahoney, R.B., ``Of the Progresse of the Bodhisattva: the > Bodhisattvamaarga in the "Sik.saasamuccaya'', M.A. Thesis (Dept of > Philosophy & Religious Studies, University of Canterbury, March 2002) > > Two files (one PDF, one gzipped PostScript) live at: > http://homepages.comnet.co.nz/~r-mahoney/ma_thesis/ma_thesis.html Many regards, Richard Mahoney P.S. If anyone would prefer a hard copy please feel free to contact me. -- +--------------- r i c h a r d . m a h o n e y ----------------+ 78 Jeffreys Road telephone:+64-3-351-5831 Christchurch New Zealand cellular:+64-25-829-986 +----- r b m 4 9 @ e x t . c a n t e r b u r y . ac . n z -----+