C.R. Selvakumar selvakum at VALLUVAR.UWATERLOO.CA
Fri Jul 3 15:11:52 UTC 1998

@Jacob Baltuch wrote:
@>[in Drav. langauges?] locatives can be raised to subject position in a
@>passive context, whereas this is impossible in Indo-european languages,
@>like Sanskrit. There only indirect and direct objects can be raised =
@>like in English, Dutch etc.
@>Could you give some examples of this raising business?
@I don't know what your knowledge on generative grammar business is, but =
@let's assume it's almost zero, regarding your word `business'.
@There are two options to analyse passive sentences: with raising and =
@with movements. If you are fond of Deep Structures, both are an option, =
@if you prefer Surface Structures only, only movements are an option. =
@Maybe I should have given here the term movements or move-x instead of =
@raising. But that are matters of definition (plus a bit more).
@John gave a book to Mary
@SU - verb - DO - IO
@A book was given to Mary by John
@Mary was given a book by John
@You see, both original objects can occupy subject position. This is a =
@common phenomenon in a number of IE languages (English, Sanskrit) and =
@non-IE languages (Japanese), but not all languages. All languages permit =
@DO to SU.
@Languages which do not allow movement/raising of IO to SU are IE Hindi, =
@German, Dutch and non-IE Tamil, Kannada.
@1) rAmo nalAya pustaka.m dadAti
@2) nalAya pustaka.m dIyate
@3) nalo pustaka.m dApyate
@1) john-ga mari-ni hon-o atae-ta
@2) hon-ga john-ni (yotte) mari-ni atae-rare-ta
@3) mari-ga john-ni (yotte) hon-o atae-rare-ta
@1) nAn avan-ukku oru pustukam ko.tu-tt-E.n
@2) oru pustukam avan-ukku enn-Al ko.tukkap-pa.t-.t-atu
@3) * avan oru pustakam enn-Al ko.tukkap-pa.t-.t-An

      Why not the following?

      mErikku 'John'aal nUl kodukkappattathu.


      mEri 'John'aal puththakkam peRRaaL(/peRRuk koNDaaL)

      If you want to use your example of tamil, the following appears

      avanukku oru puththakam ennaal kodukkappattathu

      (sorry my transliteration scheme is not the same).
@1) mai.mne usko ek kitAb dI
@2) ek kitAb usko mujhse dI gayI
@3) * vah mujhse ek kitAb dI gaya
@In Tamil some locative phrases can move to subject position in a passive =

     May be my examples fall under this category ?
@1) ta.n.nIr to.t.ti(y)-il niramp-i(y)-atu
@water - tank-LOC - fill-PAST
@2) to.t.ti enn-Al ta.n.nIr-Ati ko.n.tu nirappa-pa.t-.t-atu
@tank me-BY water-WITH fill-PAST-PASS
@More examples and ample discussion in
@K. Rangan: `Some Problems in Tamil passive structures', Indian =
@Linguistics 40-4:218-229
@(and of course my own book `The Bhasa Problem etc.)
@Sandra van der Geer
@email info at

    C.R.(Selva) Selvakumar

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