From shailesh at cair.ernet.in  Mon May  1 04:09:23 1995
From: shailesh at cair.ernet.in (shailesh at cair.ernet.in)
Date: Mon, 01 May 95 09:09:23 +0500
Subject: 'Burning Glasses' in Ancient India, another question
Message-ID: <161227019293.23782.660176530013439690.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Hello,
	I read the following since I am also a member of the indology
mailing list:

> fyi, there is an english translation of the sutra on the HT email
> server; no mention of this concept that i saw.  btw, i have
> seen spatika lingam which were not clear (milky quartz).
> 
> aum
> sadhu
>  
>

	Could you please tell me what is this HT e-mail server.
Thanks.
Regards and best wishes.
					shailesh at cair.ernet.in
 

 





From pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU  Mon May  1 16:17:07 1995
From: pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU (pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU)
Date: Mon, 01 May 95 09:17:07 -0700
Subject: 'Burning Glasses' in Ancient India, another question
Message-ID: <161227019296.23782.10898773670004528721.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

| 
| 	Could you please tell me what is this HT e-mail server.
| Thanks.
| Regards and best wishes.
| 					shailesh at cair.ernet.in

i've responded directly to shailesh.  info about this email server has
been posted here before (the HT articles about India's timeline caused
quite a stir), but if anyone would like to be reminded of the
instructions to access the server, drop me a note.

aum
sadhu
 





From conlon at u.washington.edu  Mon May  1 20:35:55 1995
From: conlon at u.washington.edu (Frank Conlon)
Date: Mon, 01 May 95 13:35:55 -0700
Subject: Kedarnath
Message-ID: <161227019299.23782.4646349654870997593.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Tracy--

Try contacting Bo Sax <phil013 at cantva.canterbury.ac.nz> at the University 
of Canterbury, Christchurch, N.Z.  

Frank Conlon


On Mon, 1 May 1995, Tracy Pintchman wrote:

> Is anyone out there--or anyone you know or know of--doing any work on the 
> pilrimage site Kedarnath?
> 
> Tracy Pintchman
> tpintch at orion.it.luc.edu
> M
>  
> 
 





From tpintch at orion.it.luc.edu  Mon May  1 20:27:27 1995
From: tpintch at orion.it.luc.edu (tpintch at orion.it.luc.edu)
Date: Mon, 01 May 95 14:27:27 -0600
Subject: Kedarnath
Message-ID: <161227019297.23782.12957487058027106118.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Is anyone out there--or anyone you know or know of--doing any work on the 
pilrimage site Kedarnath?

Tracy Pintchman
tpintch at orion.it.luc.edu
M
 





From raja at galileo.IFA.Hawaii.Edu  Tue May  2 02:28:09 1995
From: raja at galileo.IFA.Hawaii.Edu (Narayan S. Raja)
Date: Mon, 01 May 95 16:28:09 -1000
Subject: A few indological inquiries
Message-ID: <161227019302.23782.7504241152621870954.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



On Sat, 29 Apr 1995, Gerard Huet wrote:

> Greetings to distinguished indology scholars.

Include me out!  :-)   But I will put in my
2 cents anyway...


> 1. In Orissa, the main structure of a temple, as well as its inner
> sanctuary, is usually called "deul". This does not appear to be a sanskrit
> word, although it could plausibly be derived from the root dIv/dev.
> What is the accepted etymology of this term?

Interestingly, "deuL" is also the Marathi
word for temple.  I would guess that it is
indeed from Sanskrit.

 
> 2. The room next to the deul is called "jaganmohana", which is sanskrit
> for "Illusion of the World" or "World Illusion" if I am not mistaken, although
> this word does not appear in Monet-Williams. What is the standard explanation
> for this terminology?

Although not a Sanskrit scholar, based on
my Indian background I would have understood 
"Mohana" as "enchanting" or "enchantment"
(in a positive sense), rather than "illusion."  
E.g., a popular word for Krishna is "Manmohan" 
("one who enchants the mind" -- NOT "one who creates 
an illusion")!


> 1. The halo of flames that sometimes frames idols such as Na.tarAja is
> usually called "prabhAma.n.dala" which means "Circle of Light". This
> etimology is pretty clear, although it is not clear to me whether the
> substantive prabhA comes form the verb pra-bhA or from pra-bhAs, since
> the roots bhA and bhAs have very close meanings.
> Sometimes this halo is referred to as "prabhAvali" where "vali", which
> usually means wrinkle in sanskrit, is sometimes spelled "valI" or even
> "vallI". Which is the correct spelling, and is the proper translation
> "festooned with light"?

Again, though not a Sanskrit scholar, I
would have guessed that it (I think it is
AvaLi, not VaLi) means "row" or "line."  

E.g., "DeepavaLi" is the
festival of "rows of lamps."  "Rangoli"
(actually, "Rangavali", I would guess)
is the designs one draws on the floor, 
with "rows" or "lines" of colours.

Regards,


Narayan Sriranga Raja.

 





From BAKULA at delphi.com  Mon May  1 22:57:14 1995
From: BAKULA at delphi.com (Sid Harth)
Date: Mon, 01 May 95 18:57:14 -0400
Subject: Fonts
Message-ID: <161227019306.23782.13626108665500500143.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On  1-MAY-1995 09:47:49.7 jwg2 said to BAKULA
   > Dear Sid harth:
   > I rtead your correspondence after I had read Fran's and had
   > responded to her as below, which might interest you. The Scanropm
   >people said that they woiuld eventually come up with a Mac disc, but
   >agreed in the meantime that i could try conversion if I could access
   >the fonts. Since many if not most of us with special South Asia
   >language interests use Macs, it would be good to have them in that
   >format. Thanks for your message; it gives me some hope.
   > James W. Gair
   > Dear Fran: I called Scanrom about the fonts. They have them only on
   >CD for Windows (also for DOS?). However,, the person I spoke to
   >thought that I could access that CD on my Mac, if only to get fonts in
   >there for conversion...I actually orderd a CD to see, but it hasn't
   >come yet though they said a week. Windows fonts are of course useless
   >to us Mac types, but I can try to convert at least Trutype Windows to
   >Mac if the preparatory steps go OK. Some Postscript fonts do not
   >convert, or at least I havn't been able to manage it for the Hart
   >tamil font that I downloaded from the net, despite several calls to
   >the software people. I'll let you know if i have any better luck with
   >this one...Jim Gair

     I have, after careful checking, found more unsurmountable problems. I
have written to the publishers. I received a phone call from them while I
was away. At this stage I would recommend the Indology members to exercise
patience. Like any other much touted software launches, this may have more
than a few bugs. I have downgraded my earlier product grade from A+ to C-.

Sid (Red faced) Harth


 





From BAKULA at delphi.com  Mon May  1 23:22:35 1995
From: BAKULA at delphi.com (Sid Harth)
Date: Mon, 01 May 95 19:22:35 -0400
Subject: Scanrom Sanskrit Font
Message-ID: <161227019304.23782.900957210882694786.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On  1-MAY-1995 13:55:35.2 jdwhite said to BAKULA
   > I am in the process of trying to determine what is the best and most
   >"user friendly" Sanskrit font for PC usage.  We are considering one
   >from Latitude International in Sunnyvale, California; another from
   >Intellectual Property Solution (via WeCare Technologies in Dallas,
   >Tx.); and another from Lingusit's Software in Edmonds, Washington).  I
   >would be most grateful if you would give me the details on the Scanrom
   >software you have been testing. Price, its "user-friendly" qualities,
   >font point(s), incorporation of English notes within the Sanskrit
   >text, etc.  As the computer science graduate student assistant working
   >with me is leaving for India within the week, a reply as soon as
   >possible would help him to advise me on the purchase.  I am primarily
   >interested in the product for tying Sanskrit manuscripts onto disk and
   >"manipulating the texts to create scholarly editions with textual
   >variant readings.
   > Thanks for your efforts on behalf of all of us who are not as computer
   > literate or as adventuresome as you!

     Thanks for your kind words. Now, I must prove my worth.

     I have earlier posted my deep doubts about Scanrom offer. I am glad
that some of you are depending on my dispassionate critique of this product.
I would advise you not to pay much attention to the Scanrom offer. It has
problems with individual fonts, keyboard mapping to the most familiar
IBM/Qwerty standard format, lack of support and pertinent documentation
vis-a-vis hardware compatibility. Unprofessional designing of some of the
individual fonts. This may be due to the unfamiliarity of the designer of
the aesthetic forms of the language glyphs. Some fonts are totally
unsuitable for "copy". Copy, here, is used as a technical term for
advertising copy. Some variations in a particular font may have been used
as "filler" to enlarge the final number (758+758).

Sid (VidvAn wannabe) Harth  "Svadeshe pujyate rAjA vidvAn sarvatra pujyate"


 





From adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu  Tue May  2 15:30:13 1995
From: adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu (adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu)
Date: Tue, 02 May 95 08:30:13 -0700
Subject: A few indological inquiries
Message-ID: <161227019310.23782.9287605505133164605.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

 > 1. In Orissa, the main structure of a temple, as well as its inner
>> sanctuary, is usually called "deul". This does not appear to be a sanskrit
>> word, although it could plausibly be derived from the root dIv/dev.
>> What is the accepted etymology of this term?
>
>Interestingly, "deuL" is also the Marathi
>word for temple.  I would guess that it is
>indeed from Sanskrit.

Deval, as it is used in Hindi, is probably from Skt. devalaya, house of the
god(s). The word occurs extensively in modern and premodern NIA languages.
Cf. the famous line from Kabir, "na main deval, na main masjid, na kaabe
kailas mein, moko kahan tu dhundh re bande?" ("I am not to be found in the
temple, nor the mosque, nor in the Kaaba, nor at Kailasa; where do you look
for me, O man?") The punch-line, of course, is that God is to be found in
one's own heart.


Aditya Behl
 
Department of South and Southeast Asian Studies,
1203, Dwinelle Hall,
University of California at Berkeley,
Berkeley, California 94720.

Electronic Mail: adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu
Telephone: 1 (510) 642-1610 (O), 843-1264 (R) 
Facsimile: 1 (510) 642-3582

 





From yanom at ksuvx0.kyoto-su.ac.jp  Tue May  2 03:50:13 1995
From: yanom at ksuvx0.kyoto-su.ac.jp (yanom at ksuvx0.kyoto-su.ac.jp)
Date: Tue, 02 May 95 12:50:13 +0900
Subject: e-text of Arthazaastra available
Message-ID: <161227019308.23782.9648371238581696923.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear colleagues,

I have put the e-text of KauTilya's Arthazaastra
at the ftp site of my university: 
ccftp.kyoto-su.ac.jp.
You can ftp it by anonymous login.
The file is located at the directory:
pub/doc/sanskrit/dharmas
by the name kaz.dhz.Z

As the extension '.Z' indicates the file was compressed
by the 'compress' command of unix, so you can uncompress
it on your host machine.
The attribute of the file is

-rw-r--r--  1 yanom        1066 May  2 12:35 readme.001
-rw-r--r--  1 yanom      213873 May  2 12:24 kaz.dhz.Z

Michio YANO
Professor of Sanskrit
Kyoto Sangyo University
yanom at cc.kyoto-su.ac.jp
 





From BAKULA at delphi.com  Wed May  3 00:18:38 1995
From: BAKULA at delphi.com (Sid Harth)
Date: Tue, 02 May 95 20:18:38 -0400
Subject: South Asian Fonts from Scanrom
Message-ID: <161227019312.23782.4148970465849564975.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On  2-MAY-1995 09:09:05.2 jwg2 said to BAKULA
   > Dear Sid Harth:
   > Thanks for your message. As a matter of fact my disc from Scanrom
   >arrived yesterday, and i haven't had much time to play with it yet.
   >The manual is a bit quirky, with a lot of information that we don't
   >need about how great the fonts are, but missing a great deal we do
   >need, not the least of which is a clear indication of the keyboard(s)!
   >I talked with Irving Green on the phone, and he does not mind my
   >playing around with the fonts to convert them to Mac. As I mentioned,
   >most South Asian linguist types that I know have used Macs right
   >along, owing largely to  the ease of font making and handling. In
   >fact, I did manage to make initial conversions on two fonts, and with
   >some further twiddling  they should be OK, but are unusable with their
   >present keying. Also, the fonts have the vowel diacritics written
   >together with the consonants, which makes it a real doozie to type,
   >unless one sets up an extended and complicated series of macros.
   >Another problem is that the coding for the font titles is not really
   >spelled out, so that, on a Mac at least, I have to hunt through and
   >open them one by one to see what I have (time consuming, and
   >temper-inducing),and on my copy at least, all come up as Trutpe (TTF)
   >on the icon, but sometimes come up Postscript in reality. It is much
   >easier to use the Ecolinguistics fonts, though they are much more
   >costly. On the other hand, these include Trutype Tamil, which I
   >haven't found elsewhere, as well as aome others that I might use
   >occasionally., especially Malayalam. They are also very nice in
   >appearance...at least the ones that I accessed. Since Mr. Green has
   >been very nice about letting me fiddle about, I will continue to play
   >as soon as I have time. If it is not too much trouble and you have the
   >inclination,I would be interested in knowing what the "unsurmountable
   >problems were that you found, since i might (?) be able to avoid or
   >dodge them. Hoping to hear from you...Jim Gair

     I have had an interesting conversation with Mr. Irving Green today. He
mentioned to me, casually, that on account of my negative review he had
received some cancellations. I regret such outcome. I am not out to get the
publisher, Scanrom, or the author, Dr. S. Kalyanraman. My expressed or
suppressed views are only to aid the respectable community which subscribes
to Indology-l. Mr. Irving Green, on his own account, is a controversial
figure in software industry. His honest concern was that he is fighting his
natural competitors, designers and publishers of language fonts. He has been
taken to task for selling fonts at, literally, pennies a font. He is a brave
man and would survive professional criticism.

     I, however, insisted that he acknowledge and act upon the legitimate
needs and problems of an average 'Joe Blow', who is not sophisticated enough
to solve problems which are inherent in "Bharat Lipi". He assured me that he
is trying to get in touch with Dr. S. Kalyanraman, who he thinks, is on his
way to India. He promised to provide keyboard utility to map various
language fonts to IBM/Qwerty keys. If this was not readily possible, he said
that he would notify the buyers of any and all such utilities available
commercially or for free.

     I found him, personally, innocent of the difficulties of the product.
For instance when I mentioned that Urdu font writes from right to left, he
said, "but isn't it the function of one's word processor?" "If I had Urdu
word processor why would I buy an Urdu font?" was my reply.

     His another argument was that nobody is going to use all fonts anyway,
so why worry whether they work or not? Logically, it was a false argument.
People like me paid whatever price for all that was offered in a package,
not for piecemeal sections of it, which, willy-nilly, worked.

Sid (Soloman) Harth


 





From sjohar at library.usyd.edu.au  Wed May  3 01:44:21 1995
From: sjohar at library.usyd.edu.au (sjohar at library.usyd.edu.au)
Date: Wed, 03 May 95 11:44:21 +1000
Subject: Address query - Sudeshna Guha
Message-ID: <161227019314.23782.10146648292750926579.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Hi,

I am trying to track down an old friend of mine who did her Ph D from Deccan
College Pune. Her name is Sudeshna Guha. When I last spoke to her, I was
rather sick, and was unable to retain the name of her husband, but I do
remember that she had married a Sanskritist in U K. 

Would someone out there know her whreabouts, and an e-mail address for her ?
Thanking everyone in advance


Ta

Sugandha

 





From tpintch at orion.it.luc.edu  Wed May  3 19:04:47 1995
From: tpintch at orion.it.luc.edu (tpintch at orion.it.luc.edu)
Date: Wed, 03 May 95 13:04:47 -0600
Subject: Kedarnath
Message-ID: <161227019316.23782.11527424906419875180.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

> 
> 
> 
> 
> / FROM:  Tracy Pintchman <orion.it.luc.edu!tpintch at ucsd.UUCP>, May 1 20:30 1995
> | ABOUT: Kedarnath
> |
> | Is anyone out there--or anyone you know or know of--doing any work on the 
> | pilrimage site Kedarnath?
> | 
> | Tracy Pintchman
> | tpintch at orion.it.luc.edu
> |  
> 
> What sort of work are you interested in?  I believe there is a swami
> currently visiting the US who lives near there.
> 
> om
> sadhu

> I'm thinking about possibly undertaking a book length manuscript that 
would approach the site from a variety of angles--historical, 
mythological, anthropological, and so forth.  I will be doing some 
preliminary research at the site this fall for about six weeks.  Any 
advice about contacts?  Do you know how I can get a in touch with this 
swami?

Tracy Pintchman  

 





From czm1 at cornell.edu  Wed May  3 20:12:46 1995
From: czm1 at cornell.edu (czm1 at cornell.edu)
Date: Wed, 03 May 95 16:12:46 -0400
Subject: Sanskrit mangalas in Indonesian texts
Message-ID: <161227019318.23782.6029873517858551875.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Friends on the list who work on Sanskrit in Indonesian texts:
        A student of music here has brought me a text about Gamelan music
based on a palm leaf manuscript in Indonesian which has an unmistakeably
Sanskritic beginning.  It reads: om awighnam astu nama siddham.  A few
lines later it reads:  "om sidhingastu nama ciwaya."  I know nothing about
Sanskrit in Indonesia.  avighnam astu is clear enough.  The question is:
what is this "Nama Siddham ?"  nama for namaH is clear, but what of siddham
? nama ciwaya suggests that dative with namaH is still possible, although
siddhiM astu suggests that case endings have in general lost some of their
distinctions.
        Any immediate reactions ?  Any reference works to turn to ?
Thanks,
C. Minkowski,  Cornell

 





From ZYSK at ACFcluster.NYU.EDU  Wed May  3 23:04:49 1995
From: ZYSK at ACFcluster.NYU.EDU (ZYSK at ACFcluster.NYU.EDU)
Date: Wed, 03 May 95 18:04:49 -0500
Subject: Sanskrit mangalas in Indonesian texts
Message-ID: <161227019319.23782.8181258975005313249.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I recall some discuss about a year ago on the topic of Namah Siddham, as it
is found at the beginning of grammatical works. Perhaps Madhav or
Ashok recalls and can give you the precise information.
Ken
 





From breusch at students.wisc.edu  Thu May  4 00:20:05 1995
From: breusch at students.wisc.edu (breusch at students.wisc.edu)
Date: Wed, 03 May 95 19:20:05 -0500
Subject: Armenia
Message-ID: <161227019321.23782.3045736567098544825.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I was asked to forward the following message to your list. Thank you very much.

Dear Scholars,
I am a member of the Department of Sanskrit and Indian Studies at Harvard
University, and I am writing to plead for your help in stopping terrible
atrocities which are being committed against innocent persons in Armenia
who have chosen to follow the Vaisnava religious faith. I think the
accompanying report from Armenia is self-explanatory, and I urge you to
show that scholars are not only theoretical and detached, but are also
human and real.
My most earnest gratitude for your help.
Sincerely,
Howard J. Resnick

Repression of Religious Freedom in Armenia.
Woman and Invalid Injured in Attack on Krishna Temple.
Hare Krishna followers in Armenia have been violently attacked for the
third time in six months.
The most recent attack, which took place on the 18th of April, destroyed
the Krishna temple in Yerevan and left twelve Krishna followers, including
one woman and an invalid requiring hospital treatment. Devotees are now in
hiding and in fear of further beatings.
The attack on the Hare Krishna community was the most brutal assault of
many assaults which have involved various minority religious organizations
in the last two weeks of April.
Marina Kutzian, senior lecturer in Sociology at Yerevan University has
stated, " I want to underline that in all of these cases one finds the same
handwriting. One or two cars with people in military uniform, at least some
of them in that kind of clothing, drive up to a place and attack people. No
reaction by the police."
"In the case of Hare Krishna, victims had bloody wounds, the temple was
destroyed, all property was stolen. According to my impression and informal
information which I was able to collect, a para-military group did this.
This para-military group was organized in Armenia before our national Army
was established."
"But after that, this group was not disorganized nor included in the
regular Army. So, on the one hand, it is not official, but on the other had
it is well known that they are supervised by government officials,
especially by the Minister of Defense. I have the very strong impression
that this group is now used by officials against their ideological
opponents."
The Armenian daily newspaper "Golos Armenyi", wrote on 27th. April, "It
seems that in our society there is a group of absolutely defenseless
people, who can be constantly beaten and terrorized". Further on in his
report the journalist asserts, "In other words we are dealing with a case
of pre-planned and widespread assault [on various religions].
The Pentecostal, Baptist, 7th Day Adventist, Bahai, and Charismatic
Churches were also attacked and harassed. Hallmark features of all the
attacks are:
The involvement of para-military forces.
The fact that the police ignore complaints and fail to offer any protection
to vulnerable communities.
The neglect of the Armenian Church to offer protection to minority
religions and their false accusations which lend sympathy to the
motivations of assailants.
The failure of the government to offer any security to minorities or to
apprehend or control attackers.
We appeal for your help. This barbarous campaign against legally registered
religions in Armenia must be stopped. Pressure and support from the
international community is the only approach that will make any impression
on events within Armenia. Please register your objection to these events by
contacting your local Armenian Embassy or Consulate. You could address your
objection to the Armenian President:
Mr. Levon Ter-Pertosian
President of Armenia
Fax: +7 (8852) 521581.
We would very much appreciate copies of any correspondence you have with
Armenian authorities on this issue. Copies may be sent to the address
below.
The American Embassy in Yerevan have also compiled a background report on
the recent attacks. This is available by contacting the American Embassy
directly by Telephone at +7-8852-151144 and by Fax at +7-8852-151138.

ISKCON Report on the Attack:
On the 18th April, 1995 at 3PM (local time) twenty or twenty-five unknown
men stormed into the ISKCON (Hare Krishna) temple in Yerevan.
At the time of the attack seventeen people were present in the temple
(eleven males, four females and three children). The thugs were armed with
automatic weapons, submachine guns, guns, metal rods and metal chains. They
arrived at the temple in three cars with no registration plates.
The intruders immediately started to severely beat all the people present,
kicking them and hitting them with metal rods. After a short time the
ladies and children were thrown out of the house but the male members
continued to be beaten. Amongst those singled out for a more vicious
assault were one invalid and a Russian national.
As these assaults were taking place other members of this group were
destroying the temple. They desecrated and destroyed the altar, the
paraphernalia for worship, scriptures, paintings etc. All the windows and
household fixtures were also damaged.
The raid lasted about forty-five minutes and before they left the intruders
stole everything of value that they could find. Three thousand US dollars
in cash was stolen as were telephones, the fax machine, a computer,
printer, modem, a video-camera, two video recorders, foodstuff, a small
marble table and even pots from the kitchen. They robbed individuals'
passports, wristwatches and even whatever small change they found in the
pockets of their victims. They also tried to steal a car outside the temple
but failing to do so they siphoned the petrol from it instead.
The police were alerted several times by various people but, although they
said that they would come no one arrived. In an effort to appeal for help
one Hare Krishna member, covered in blood, went to the police station, but
his petitions were ignored, except for one policeman who commented that
this happened because the Hare Krishna members were deviating from the
national tradition.
Shortly after this incident a well-dressed man walked into the temple and
announced that this attack happened because the Hare Krishna followers did
not adhere to the national Church. He then left in a Russian made Volga car
without registration plates.
Most of the people beaten were severely injured and had to receive hospital
treatment. All of the male members sustained head injuries.
For further information and updates on this campaign please contact ISKCON
Communications Europe:
premarnava.hks at com.bbt.se
or
6 Quarry Court, Helen's Bay, Co. Down
BT19 1TY, Northern Ireland
Tel/Fax: +44-1247-852796

The following files are available for the asking. You may contact
breusch at students.wisc.edu to have a (some) file(s) sent to your e-mail
address.
[1] History of the Armenian situation up to April 1995.
[2] A presentation document to introduce the issue.
[3] Translation of an Armenian news report.
[4] The Henderson report on attacks on Christian Churches.
[5] Report by Armenian Sociologist.



 





From BAKULA at delphi.com  Thu May  4 00:58:34 1995
From: BAKULA at delphi.com (Sid Harth)
Date: Wed, 03 May 95 20:58:34 -0400
Subject: Scanrom fonts
Message-ID: <161227019323.23782.7490020303246832604.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On  3-MAY-1995 19:16:04.1 dnn4745 said to BAKULA
   > Sid:
   > I appreciate all your comments on the fonts from Scanrom. My disk just
   > arrived today after a several week wait. I actually cancelled yesterday
   > because of the unfavorable reviews. I really want the various true type
   > fonts for the languages advertised, although the price is such that if
   > several fonts worked well, I would be happy and would then supplement
   >with probably from Ecological Linguistics. Thus the question:
   > do the fonts work or not? SHould I return the package unopened. Does
   > Devanagari work well with all the maatras or are there oddities, e.g.
   >the long ii is squeeze next to ch but ok next to a smaller width
   >character?
   > Also, the diacritics for the Roman script. Is there a dead key for
   >adding diacritics to letters?
   > How easy is it to install? I simply want to select the font and go.
   >Do I have to mess around with assigning keys?
   > Your information will be greatly appreciated. I don't have the time
   >to do anything but install the fonts and if they aren't what they are
   >advertised to be, than I will look elsewhere.
   > Thanks
   > David Nelson
   > David Nelson                                           phone:
   >409-845-1342 Head, Cataloging
   >FAX:  409-862-1166 Evans Library
   >email: davidnelson at tamu.edu
   > Texas A&M University
   > College Station, TX  77843-5000

     Thank you David, for your kind enquiry. Please do not open the package.
The common answer to all your questions is a big "NO". For the uninitiated
in the legal aspect of product warranty, Scanrom warranty is foolproof. I
take liberty to quote part of it here:

     THE SOFTWARE AND RELATED DOCUMENTS ARE PROVIDED "AS IS". SCANROM
PUBLICATIONS DISCLAIMS ALL OTHER WARRANTIES, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED,
INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO IMPLIED WARRANTIES, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED,
INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND
FITNESS FOR PARTICULAR PURPOSE, WITH RESPECT TO THE SOFTWARE AND THE
ACCOMPANYING WRITTEN MATERIALS. THE ENTIRE RISK AS TO THE QUALITY AND
PERFORMANCE OF THE PROGRAMS IS WITH YOU. SHOULD THE PROGRAM PROVE DEFECTIVE,
YOU (AND NOT THE SCANROM PUBLICATIONS OR AUTHORIZED COMPUTER DEALER) ASSUME
THE ENTIRE COST OF ALL NECESSARY SERVICE, REPAIR, OR CORRECTIONS. THIS
LIMITED WARRANTY GIVES YOU SPECIFIC LEGAL RIGHTS. YOU MAY HAVE OTHERS, WHICH
VARY FROM STATE TO STATE.

     Note: Above is a verbatim copy, including the choice of capital
letters. As the warranties go this is no more scary than any others. I,
however, point to the owner's risk "ALL".

     Once again, in the interest of the members of this group who suffered
my off colored postings, laughed at my contrived humor, I would not make you
cry because of this offer. Trust me, this product should have been beta
tested before full fledged launch. It may, subsequently, prove to be a star
but I categorize it as "Not yet ready for prime-time appearance".

Sid Harth  "By the way, who is this dude Hermann Hesse?"


 





From pclaus at s1.csuhayward.edu  Thu May  4 13:12:17 1995
From: pclaus at s1.csuhayward.edu (pclaus at s1.csuhayward.edu)
Date: Thu, 04 May 95 06:12:17 -0700
Subject: Worldreligions compared (;-)
Message-ID: <161227019340.23782.7110726045747569662.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Puritanism: Let's get the shit out of here!
 





From svagah at sb.su.se  Thu May  4 06:21:36 1995
From: svagah at sb.su.se (svagah at sb.su.se)
Date: Thu, 04 May 95 07:21:36 +0100
Subject: Worldreligions compared (;-)
Message-ID: <161227019326.23782.18439570529234622398.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Sir
If you do not intend to offend anybody, why send such nonsens and such
offending and tasteless jokes on a serious network such as this?

I, for one find this distasteful and are seriously considering leaving the
network. If our work as indologists and social scientists are to be kept at
this level then I am not interested.

Elizabeth Hole
Ph.D. Student, Cultural and Religious Anthropology


>Some time ago, I saw this excerpt from some magazine as a copy on a pinwall,
>please enjoy (absolutely NO intend to flame anybody, anything or whatever..):
>
>WORLDRELIGIONS COMPARED
>
>Taoism: Shit happens
>
>Hare Krishna: Shit happens Rama Rama ding ding.
>
>Hinduism: This shit happened before.
>
>Islam: If shit happens, take a hostage.
>
>Zen: What is the sound of shit happening?
>
>Buddhism: When shit happens, is it really shit?
>
>Confucianism: Confucius says: "Shit".
>
>Protestantism: Shit won't happen, if I work harder.
>
>Catholicism: If shit happens, I deserve it.
>
>Judaism: Why does this shit always happen to me?
>
>Rastafarianism: Let's smoke this shit.
>
>
>Thank you,
>
>Yours, Johannes
>


 

Original-Received:  from mega.cs.umn.edu 
                   (mega.cs.umn.edu [128.101.224.14]) by mail.cs.umn.edu 
                   (8.6.11/8.6.6) with ESMTP  for <indology at liverpool.ac.uk>
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From: bandi at cs.umn.edu (VB)
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          Thu, 4 May 1995 01:41:23 -0500
Message-Id: <199505040641.BAA06105 at mega.cs.umn.edu>
Subject: Re: A few indological inquiries
To: indology at liverpool.ac.uk
Date: Thu, 4 May 1995 01:41:23 -0500 (CDT)
In-Reply-To: <Pine.SUN.3.91.950501161050.19604C-100000 at galileo> from "Narayan S. Raja" at May 2, 95 08:20:58 am
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL22]
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> 
> 
> 
> 
> > 1. In Orissa, the main structure of a temple, as well as its inner
> > sanctuary, is usually called "deul". This does not appear to be a sanskrit
> > word, although it could plausibly be derived from the root dIv/dev.
> > What is the accepted etymology of this term?
> 
> Interestingly, "deuL" is also the Marathi
> word for temple.  I would guess that it is
> indeed from Sanskrit.
>
	I'm going to make some wild connections. Please bear with me :)
my contention: 'deul' is very likely a derivation from root 'dev'.

here's why:
	In telugu, a temple is called 'devAlayam' (deva+Alayam) abode of gods.
The other corrupt (if I may) and/or shortened forms are:
	dEvalam, dEvaLi etc. Of these dEvalam is quite popular in areas 
boardering tamilNadu, and probably is used by tamils as well.
	'duel' looks like another such derivation related to 'dev'.
Comments are welcome.

-vijay
 





From Max.Nihom at oeaw.ac.at  Thu May  4 08:14:05 1995
From: Max.Nihom at oeaw.ac.at (Max.Nihom at oeaw.ac.at)
Date: Thu, 04 May 95 10:14:05 +0200
Subject: Worldreligions compared (;-)
Message-ID: <161227019329.23782.6744597128493458743.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

>Dear Sir
>If you do not intend to offend anybody, why send such nonsens and such
>offending and tasteless jokes on a serious network such as this?
>
>I, for one find this distasteful and are seriously considering leaving the
>network. If our work as indologists and social scientists are to be kept at
>this level then I am not interested.
>
>Elizabeth Hole
>Ph.D. Student, Cultural and Religious Anthropology
>
>
>>Some time ago, I saw this excerpt from some magazine as a copy on a pinwall,
>>please enjoy (absolutely NO intend to flame anybody, anything or whatever..):
>>
>>WORLDRELIGIONS COMPARED
>>
>>Taoism: Shit happens
>>
>>Hare Krishna: Shit happens Rama Rama ding ding.
>>
>>Hinduism: This shit happened before.
>>
>>Islam: If shit happens, take a hostage.
>>
>>Zen: What is the sound of shit happening?
>>
>>Buddhism: When shit happens, is it really shit?
>>
>>Confucianism: Confucius says: "Shit".
>>
>>Protestantism: Shit won't happen, if I work harder.
>>
>>Catholicism: If shit happens, I deserve it.
>>
>>Judaism: Why does this shit always happen to me?
>>
>>Rastafarianism: Let's smoke this shit.
>>
>>
>>Thank you,
>>
>>Yours, Johannes
>>
>
>
> 
>
>


O my god[s]! More PC ordure.


 





From l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no  Thu May  4 10:23:46 1995
From: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no (l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no)
Date: Thu, 04 May 95 12:23:46 +0200
Subject: Sanskrit mangalas in Indonesian texts
Message-ID: <161227019331.23782.15211197779081602468.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

C. Minkowski wrote:

>Friends on the list who work on Sanskrit in Indonesian texts:
>        A student of music here has brought me a text about Gamelan music
>based on a palm leaf manuscript in Indonesian which has an unmistakeably
>Sanskritic beginning.  It reads: om awighnam astu nama siddham.  A few
>lines later it reads:  "om sidhingastu nama ciwaya."  I know nothing about
>Sanskrit in Indonesia.  avighnam astu is clear enough.  The question is:
>what is this "Nama Siddham ?"  nama for namaH is clear, but what of siddham
>? nama ciwaya suggests that dative with namaH is still possible, although
>siddhiM astu suggests that case endings have in general lost some of their
>distinctions.
>        Any immediate reactions ?  Any reference works to turn to ?

Here are some bibliographic references to Sanskrit in Indonesian:

Jan Gonda (1971). The influence of Indian languages. Current Trends in
Linguistics 8, Linguistics in Oceania. The Hague, Mouton.  Current Trends
in Linguistics 8, Linguistics in Oceania. 955-968 955-968. 955-968.

Jan Gonda (1973). Sanskrit in Indonesia. New Delhi, International Academy
of Indian Culture. Sata-pi aka Series; Indo-Asian Literatures. 2 ed.. Vol.
99.

Harry Spitzhardt (1973). "The Lexical and Morphological Impact of Sanskrit
on Moden Indonesia." Asian and African Studies,  9: 97-113.

M. Ensink and J. A. B. van Buitenen (1964). "Glossary of Sanskrit from
Indonesia." Vak,  6: viii + 219.


Russel Jones (1984). Loan-Words in Contemporary Indonesian. Towards a
Description of Contemporary Indonesian: Preliminary Studies, Part II, NUSA.
Jakarta, Badan Penyelenggara Seri NUSA.  Towards a Description of
Contemporary Indonesian: Preliminary Studies, Part II, NUSA. Vol. 19. 1-38
1-38. 1-38.

Of these works, Gonda's is the most thorough.


Remember that the knowledge of Sanskrit in Indonesian deteriorated at the
end of the middle ages, and that Sanskrit inscriptions in Indonesian
sometimes are erronous and may not always make sense.

The text "om sidhingastu nama ciwaya" may perhaps = om siddhir astu nama.h
/siv-aya = "om may there be success, hail to Shiva". But don't quote me. I
have no experience reading inscriptions in Indonesian Sanskrit.

Best regards,

Lars Martin Fosse



Lars Martin Fosse
Research Fellow
Department of East European
and Oriental Studies
P. O. Box 1030, Blindern
N-0315 OSLO Norway

Tel: +47 22 85 68 48
Fax: +47 22 85 41 40

E-mail: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no


 





From l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no  Thu May  4 10:48:37 1995
From: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no (l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no)
Date: Thu, 04 May 95 12:48:37 +0200
Subject: Worldreligions compared (;-)
Message-ID: <161227019333.23782.3464683097572437742.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

>Dear Sir
>If you do not intend to offend anybody, why send such nonsens and such
>offending and tasteless jokes on a serious network such as this?
>
>I, for one find this distasteful and are seriously considering leaving the
>network. If our work as indologists and social scientists are to be kept at
>this level then I am not interested.
>
>Elizabeth Hole
>Ph.D. Student, Cultural and Religious Anthropology
>
>
>>Some time ago, I saw this excerpt from some magazine as a copy on a pinwall,
>>please enjoy (absolutely NO intend to flame anybody, anything or whatever..):
>>
>>WORLDRELIGIONS COMPARED
>>
>>Taoism: Shit happens etc.

May I remind Ms Hole that this is not a moderated list. This means that
anybody can send *any* message to the list. In other words, we depend upon
the sense of responsibility of the list member. I my opinion, there is no
reason that some light relief should not pass our way. Personally, I don't
feel offended.

Best regards,

Lars Martin Fosse



Lars Martin Fosse
Research Fellow
Department of East European
and Oriental Studies
P. O. Box 1030, Blindern
N-0315 OSLO Norway

Tel: +47 22 85 68 48
Fax: +47 22 85 41 40

E-mail: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no


 





From P.G.Moore at ukc.ac.uk  Thu May  4 12:10:19 1995
From: P.G.Moore at ukc.ac.uk (P.G.Moore at ukc.ac.uk)
Date: Thu, 04 May 95 13:10:19 +0100
Subject: Worldreligions compared (;-)
Message-ID: <161227019335.23782.8334273467403475621.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Probably the only genuinely offensive element in this posting is
the Hare Krishna item.

peter moore
 





From Max.Nihom at oeaw.ac.at  Thu May  4 12:43:02 1995
From: Max.Nihom at oeaw.ac.at (Max.Nihom at oeaw.ac.at)
Date: Thu, 04 May 95 14:43:02 +0200
Subject: Sanskrit mangalas in Indonesian texts
Message-ID: <161227019338.23782.14429616135106306996.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

>Friends on the list who work on Sanskrit in Indonesian texts:
>        A student of music here has brought me a text about Gamelan music
>based on a palm leaf manuscript in Indonesian which has an unmistakeably
>Sanskritic beginning.  It reads: om awighnam astu nama siddham.  A few
>lines later it reads:  "om sidhingastu nama ciwaya."  I know nothing about
>Sanskrit in Indonesia.  avighnam astu is clear enough.  The question is:
>what is this "Nama Siddham ?"  nama for namaH is clear, but what of siddham
>? nama ciwaya suggests that dative with namaH is still possible, although
>siddhiM astu suggests that case endings have in general lost some of their
>distinctions.
>        Any immediate reactions ?  Any reference works to turn to ?
>Thanks,
>C. Minkowski,  Cornell
>
> 
>
>

On the formula om awighnam astu namah siddham, see M. Klokke, Tantri reliefs 
on Javanese Candi, Leiden, 1993, p. 49 note 30: "This is a salutory formula 
often preceeding a text". It does not seem to have any necessary connection 
to grammatical treatises.


Max Nihom, Vienna

 





From BAKULA at delphi.com  Thu May  4 23:42:07 1995
From: BAKULA at delphi.com (Sid Harth)
Date: Thu, 04 May 95 19:42:07 -0400
Subject: Worldreligions compared (;-)
Message-ID: <161227019344.23782.2033634691435962235.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On  4-MAY-1995 06:52:40.0 indology said to BAKULA

     Stuff deleted..

   > >Elizabeth Hole
   > >Ph.D. Student, Cultural and Religious Anthropology

     Stuff deleted..

   > May I remind Ms Hole that this is not a moderated list. This means that
   > anybody can send *any* message to the list. In other words, we depend
   >upon the sense of responsibility of the list member. I my opinion,
   >there is no reason that some light relief should not pass our way.
   >Personally, I don't feel offended.

   > Best regards,

   > Lars Martin Fosse

     Stuff deleted...

     "Let the chips fall where they may".

     Lars, the best scatological revelation to the anal retentatives
 (au Freud) of the world, otherwise known in these United States of America
as "S*U*A*H". No pun intended on honorable Ms. Hole's last name.

Sid Harth   "My prose is gross, my verse is worse"


 





From sjohar at library.usyd.edu.au  Thu May  4 23:08:06 1995
From: sjohar at library.usyd.edu.au (sjohar at library.usyd.edu.au)
Date: Fri, 05 May 95 09:08:06 +1000
Subject: Worldreligions compared (;-)
Message-ID: <161227019342.23782.15029073586853612172.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


>>>
>>>WORLDRELIGIONS COMPARED
>>>
>>>Taoism: Shit happens etc.
>
>May I remind Ms Hole that this is not a moderated list. This means that
>anybody can send *any* message to the list. In other words, we depend upon
>the sense of responsibility of the list member. I my opinion, there is no
>reason that some light relief should not pass our way. Personally, I don't
>feel offended.
>
>Best regards,
>
>Lars Martin Fosse
>
>
>
>Lars Martin Fosse
>Research Fellow
>Department of East European
>and Oriental Studies
>P. O. Box 1030, Blindern
>N-0315 OSLO Norway
>
>Tel: +47 22 85 68 48
>Fax: +47 22 85 41 40
>
>E-mail: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no
>
>

I agree

Sugandha

 





From mmdesh at umich.edu  Fri May  5 14:38:37 1995
From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande)
Date: Fri, 05 May 95 10:38:37 -0400
Subject: Sanskrit mangalas in Indonesian texts
Message-ID: <161227019346.23782.2689765533231532700.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On 'Om namaH Siddham'.
	Last year I was editing a text in which this phrase occurs in the 
beginning and I had some occasion to think over it.  The evidence 
suggests that this may have originated in the Jain traditions of Western 
India.  Then it was adopted by grammatical traditions like that of the 
Kaatantra, which was widely studied by the Jains.  From the Jain 
traditions, it was generalized to common Indian tradition, and Hinduized 
at some point.  In Western India, many alphabets begin with a 
vernacularized form of this phrase:  'onaamaasiidham'.  This was commonly 
used in Maharashtra to begin formal teaching of writing to a boy.  
Similarly it was generalized to mark all beginnings.  In Marathi, we 
say:  He did the 'onaamaa' of something or the other.
	Madhav

On Wed, 3 May 1995, Christopher Minkowski wrote:

> Friends on the list who work on Sanskrit in Indonesian texts:
>         A student of music here has brought me a text about Gamelan music
> based on a palm leaf manuscript in Indonesian which has an unmistakeably
> Sanskritic beginning.  It reads: om awighnam astu nama siddham.  A few
> lines later it reads:  "om sidhingastu nama ciwaya."  I know nothing about
> Sanskrit in Indonesia.  avighnam astu is clear enough.  The question is:
> what is this "Nama Siddham ?"  nama for namaH is clear, but what of siddham
> ? nama ciwaya suggests that dative with namaH is still possible, although
> siddhiM astu suggests that case endings have in general lost some of their
> distinctions.
>         Any immediate reactions ?  Any reference works to turn to ?
> Thanks,
> C. Minkowski,  Cornell
> 
>  
> 
 





From conlon at u.washington.edu  Sun May  7 04:08:51 1995
From: conlon at u.washington.edu (Frank Conlon)
Date: Sat, 06 May 95 21:08:51 -0700
Subject: Worldreligions compared (;-)
Message-ID: <161227019351.23782.17125198265567104584.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I thought the original post was not very funny and I imagined it would 
offend some. It obviously did.  The reaction to the fact that it offended 
some seems oddly defensive and not unpuerile.  If Indology has no place 
for the ravings of the Hindutva crowd, perhaps it is also not an ideal 
venue for other marginalia--what someone here in Seattle calls "humor for 
the taste-impaired."

cheers,

Frank Conlon
University of Washington

 





From BAKULA at delphi.com  Sun May  7 01:50:40 1995
From: BAKULA at delphi.com (Sid Harth)
Date: Sat, 06 May 95 21:50:40 -0400
Subject: Worldreligions compared (;-)
Message-ID: <161227019348.23782.13306915775715814453.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On  6-MAY-1995 07:52:22.8 l.m.fosse said to BAKULA
   > Date: Sat, 06 May 1995 13:52:10 +0200
   > From: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no (Lars Martin Fosse)
   > Subject: Re: Worldreligions compared (;-)
   > To: BAKULA at delphi.com
   > Message-id: <199505061152.NAA16633 at hedda.uio.no>
   > MIME-version: 1.0
   > Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
   > Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT
   > >On  4-MAY-1995 06:52:40.0 indology said to BAKULA
   > >
   > >     Stuff deleted..
   > >
   > >   > >Elizabeth Hole
   > >   > >Ph.D. Student, Cultural and Religious Anthropology
   > >
   > >     Stuff deleted..
   > >
   > >   > May I remind Ms Hole that this is not a moderated list. This
   >means that >   > anybody can send *any* message to the list. In other
   >words, we depend >   >upon the sense of responsibility of the list
   >member. I my opinion, >   >there is no reason that some light relief
   >should not pass our way. >   >Personally, I don't feel offended.
   > >
   > >   > Best regards,
   > >
   > >   > Lars Martin Fosse
   > >
   > >     Stuff deleted...
   > >
   > >     "Let the chips fall where they may".
   > >
   > >     Lars, the best scatological revelation to the anal retentatives
   > > (au Freud) of the world, otherwise known in these United States of
   >America >as "S*U*A*H". No pun intended on honorable Ms. Hole's last
   >name.


   > Sid, I usually do not admit to not being omniscient, but in your case
   >I'll make an exception. How the heck am I to interpret "S*U*A*H"? Even
   >my American colleague gave up. As for the honorable Ms. Hole, I don't
   >think you drag her name into this.
   >
   >  Stuff deleted...
   >
   >
   > Best regards,
   > LM
   > Lars Martin Fosse
   >
     Stuff deleted...

     Before things get out of hand and Ms. E Hole gets upset by
                                           ^ ^^^^
misinterpretation of my mysterious four-letter word, let me spell it, at
least for the posterity.


     S*U*A*H is spelled as "Self-assured*Unrelenting*Aggressive*Hole-E's".
                                                                ^^^^^^
     The pun on the word "HOLY".

     This may be taken as a proof of why we should all spell all our four-
letter words so that nobody misinterprets them and causes more harm.

Sid Harth  "They better speak French in England" or is it "They speak better
            French in England"? It means the same, watch your semantics.



 





From BAKULA at delphi.com  Sun May  7 12:20:42 1995
From: BAKULA at delphi.com (Sid Harth)
Date: Sun, 07 May 95 08:20:42 -0400
Subject: Worldreligions compared (;-)
Message-ID: <161227019354.23782.8133919988259086000.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On #01  1995-04-28 internetindology said to BAKULA

   > Stuff deleted...

   > World Religions Compared. (Enhanced list alphabetically arranged)

     > Americanism: Cut that shit out.*
     > Bahaaism: We believe in your shit too.*
     > Buddhism: When shit happens, is it really shit?
     > Catholicism: If shit happens, I deserve it.
     > Confucianism: Confucias says: "Shit".
     > Christian Scientism: Shit only happens to us.*
     > Freemasonism: We wouldn't tell you where our shit is.
     > Hare Krishna: Shit happens Rama Rama ding ding.
     > Hinduism: This shit happened before.
     > Islam: If shit happens, take a hostage.
     > J. Krishnamurtiism: Leave that shit alone.*
     > Jehova's Witness: Shit is at your doorstep.*
     > Judaism: Why this shit always happen to me.
     > Mormanism: Shit, I can have as many wives as I want.*
     > Pentecostalism: Shit hit the roof.*
     > Protestantism: Shit won't happen, if I work harder.
     > Puritanism: Let's get the shit out of here.
     > Rastafarianism: Let's smoke this shit.
     > Reformed Judaism: Shit jumped from the fire to a pan.*
     > Sikhism: Shoot the shit from the Golden Temple.*
     > Taoism: Shit happens.
     > Unitarianism: Potpourri of everybody's shit.*
     > Zen: What is the sound of shit happening?
     > Zoroastrianism: Keep the shit burning.*

     Note: The asterick indicates the contribution of yours truly.

     As I was meditating on the Playboy centerfold, as usual, the shit hit
me. For the benefit of all and, especially, of honorable Ms. Elizabeth Hole,
whose sensitivities were tested by the original post, I am going to reveal
the true meaning of the word "shit". It is an acronym:

     SHIT: Spiritually Heightened Intellectual Trance.

     In the light of my revelation, please read the above, new and
improved, post again. I, always, talk about my shit; would you mind Ms.
Hole?
     Paraphrasing the now famous NRA slogan, "Guns don't kill, people do";
I would dare to say to honorable Ms. Hole 'Words don't mean, people do'.


   > Americanism: Cut that shit out.
   > I overheard my Vietnamese friend saying "Shit is good", he meant "Sid
   > is good".
   > Sid Harth
   > -*-

Sid Harth


 





From l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no  Sun May  7 09:18:54 1995
From: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no (l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no)
Date: Sun, 07 May 95 11:18:54 +0200
Subject: Jokes
Message-ID: <161227019353.23782.15290991746341177631.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Sid Harth recently quoted parts of a private email I sent him on the
network. This was not my intention, and I apologize for any inconvenience
that it may caused the other networkers.

Best regards,

Lars Martin Fosse



Lars Martin Fosse
Research Fellow
Department of East European
and Oriental Studies
P. O. Box 1030, Blindern
N-0315 OSLO Norway

Tel: +47 22 85 68 48
Fax: +47 22 85 41 40

E-mail: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no


 





From n.rao at rz.uni-sb.de  Sun May  7 16:54:39 1995
From: n.rao at rz.uni-sb.de (n.rao at rz.uni-sb.de)
Date: Sun, 07 May 95 18:54:39 +0200
Subject: Worldreligions compared (;-)
Message-ID: <161227019356.23782.5763441867904699914.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

>Lot of things are cut out
Sid Harth wrote
>     Paraphrasing the now famous NRA slogan, "Guns don't kill, people do";
>I would dare to say to honorable Ms. Hole 'Words don't mean, people do'.
Is it so? People can't use the words as they like if they want to say 
something. 
>   > Sid Harth
>   > -*-
>
>Sid Harth
>
>
> 
>

 





From rsalomon at u.washington.edu  Mon May  8 16:50:45 1995
From: rsalomon at u.washington.edu (Richard Salomon)
Date: Mon, 08 May 95 09:50:45 -0700
Subject: Worldreligions compared (;-)
Message-ID: <161227019361.23782.16168440871381053614.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Please, no more of this.  This is the Indology network, remember?

-RS

On Sun, 7 May 1995, Sid Harth wrote:

> On #01  1995-04-28 internetindology said to BAKULA
> 
>    > Stuff deleted...
> 
>    > World Religions Compared. (Enhanced list alphabetically arranged)
> 
>      > Americanism: Cut that shit out.*
>      > Bahaaism: We believe in your shit too.*
>      > Buddhism: When shit happens, is it really shit?
>      > Catholicism: If shit happens, I deserve it.
>      > Confucianism: Confucias says: "Shit".
>      > Christian Scientism: Shit only happens to us.*
>      > Freemasonism: We wouldn't tell you where our shit is.
>      > Hare Krishna: Shit happens Rama Rama ding ding.
>      > Hinduism: This shit happened before.
>      > Islam: If shit happens, take a hostage.
>      > J. Krishnamurtiism: Leave that shit alone.*
>      > Jehova's Witness: Shit is at your doorstep.*
>      > Judaism: Why this shit always happen to me.
>      > Mormanism: Shit, I can have as many wives as I want.*
>      > Pentecostalism: Shit hit the roof.*
>      > Protestantism: Shit won't happen, if I work harder.
>      > Puritanism: Let's get the shit out of here.
>      > Rastafarianism: Let's smoke this shit.
>      > Reformed Judaism: Shit jumped from the fire to a pan.*
>      > Sikhism: Shoot the shit from the Golden Temple.*
>      > Taoism: Shit happens.
>      > Unitarianism: Potpourri of everybody's shit.*
>      > Zen: What is the sound of shit happening?
>      > Zoroastrianism: Keep the shit burning.*
> 
>      Note: The asterick indicates the contribution of yours truly.
> 
>      As I was meditating on the Playboy centerfold, as usual, the shit hit
> me. For the benefit of all and, especially, of honorable Ms. Elizabeth Hole,
> whose sensitivities were tested by the original post, I am going to reveal
> the true meaning of the word "shit". It is an acronym:
> 
>      SHIT: Spiritually Heightened Intellectual Trance.
> 
>      In the light of my revelation, please read the above, new and
> improved, post again. I, always, talk about my shit; would you mind Ms.
> Hole?
>      Paraphrasing the now famous NRA slogan, "Guns don't kill, people do";
> I would dare to say to honorable Ms. Hole 'Words don't mean, people do'.
> 
> 
>    > Americanism: Cut that shit out.
>    > I overheard my Vietnamese friend saying "Shit is good", he meant "Sid
>    > is good".
>    > Sid Harth
>    > -*-
> 
> Sid Harth
> 
> 
>  
> 
 





From nb6 at evansville.edu  Mon May  8 16:58:11 1995
From: nb6 at evansville.edu (Edward Beach)
Date: Mon, 08 May 95 11:58:11 -0500
Subject: Help Find Puranas in Translation
Message-ID: <161227019358.23782.16301417858944030565.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


Dear Members of the Indology List:

I'm not a regular member of this list and feel very much out of my depth
in this distinguished group, but have joined temporarily in the hope that
perhaps one or two of you might be able to give me a bit of much-needed
advice.  The matter at issue concerns finding an appropriate sample of
Hindu literature in translation suitable for use in a required freshman
World Cultures class at our small midwestern college (the University of
Evansville, in southern Indiana).  My colleagues have asked me to look
into this matter because of my modest familiarity with Hindu religious
texts. 

Currently we are using the _Bhagavad Gita_, but although this is a
wonderful text of central importance for understanding Hinduism, some of
us find it rough going to get our rather provincial students to take the
Gita seriously.  In particular, we find that they are put off by (1) the
apparent advocacy of war in the name of duty against one's own kin; (2)
the stolid endorsement of the caste system; (3) dry metaphysical passages
dealing with the gunas and so on; and (4) an unappealing (to them)
insistance on the importance of transcending pleasures and desires.  Of
course we do our best to combat these objections, by pointing out (1) that
the advocacy of "war" is best understood on an allegorical level;  (2)
that the now illegal caste system parallels continuing racism in the
United States; (3) that the doctrine of the gunas has indeed a certain
aptness; and (4) that even Western thinkers, such as Luther and Kant,
worried about the validity of pursuing virtue for the sake of personal
benefit.  Nevertheless, although we do point all these things out to our
students, we often find that we are knocking our heads against the wall 
with a very unreceptive audience.

In light of these difficulties, I have suggested to my colleagues that
perhaps it would be feasible to use a different text as a optional
supplement or alternate.  Classical Hinduism, after all, has such a rich
literature, with many important and popular myths and legends, that one
should in principle be able to find other appropriate readings for the
World Cultures class.  The stories of the Mahabharata and Ramayana spring
immediately to mind, but the trouble there is that the original texts are
so very long, while our mandate is to use original text rather than
"retellings" at second or third hand.  The Upanishads, on the other hand,
are generally too esoteric and philosophical.  A third alternative might 
be to use a collection of excerpts from religious myths in the puranas,
especially those illustrating such important motifs as the meaning of
maya, karma and rebirth, the transpersonal identity of the Brahman-Atman,
the transcendence of desires, the meaning of moksha, etc., etc. 

One set of myths that I personally love are those recounted in the first
fifty-odd pages of Heinrich Zimmer's _Myths and Symbols in Indian Art and
Civilization_, especially those involving the rishi Narada when, at the
behest of Vishnu, he assumed the form of Princess Sushila in order to
learn the secret of maya; or concerning Markandeya, wandering through the
cosmic body of the sleeping Vishnu.  Zimmer's notes cite the Matsya Purana
as his source for both these myths, but I haven't been able to locate a
manageably brief translation of excerpts from this work.  Could it be that
these marvellous stories have been collected somewhere under a different
title?  Is it even possible (hoping beyond hope) that such an edition
would still be in print? 

Any suggestions or advice about locating an appropriate text would be much
appreciated.  Thanks in advance for your kind assistance.

			Edward Beach
			Department of Philosophy and Religion
			The University of Evansville
			Evansville, Indiana

 





From SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU  Mon May  8 21:25:36 1995
From: SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU (SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU)
Date: Mon, 08 May 95 15:25:36 -0600
Subject: Rig Veda
Message-ID: <161227019363.23782.4991336085243248362.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

        I know that in principle new book announcements are frowned upon
here, but I thought the following of sufficient interest to the direct
audience of this list to mention.  A few days ago I received a catalogue
from Harvard UP, in which is announced:

_Rig Veda: A Metrically Restored Text with an Introduction and Notes_, by
Barend van Nooten and Gary Holland.  ISBN  0-674-76971-6.  685pp, $50.00.
Harvard Oriental Series 50

        Since it is not my turf at all, I wrote to Prof. Witzel about this,
suggesting that he announce it on this list.  He urged me instead to do so,
and noted:

"It contains a disk with the samhita and the metrical text, and useful
search programs."

        He then suggested:

"Perhaps you could add : " on inquiry with Witzel I learned that this will
be announced, together with other news, in the new electronic Vedic
Journal (ejvs-list at husc.harvard.edu) within a week or so."

        I have yet not seen the work, but assume that it is one that will
be of deep interest to many members of this list.  The advertisement notes
that the text is in Roman letters, and "in its original metrical
arrangement and in a form that most closely approximates the pronounciation
of the time of its original composition."

Jonathan Silk
SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU


 





From TCOB at MUSIC.STLAWU.EDU  Mon May  8 22:05:28 1995
From: TCOB at MUSIC.STLAWU.EDU (Coburn, Tom)
Date: Mon, 08 May 95 18:05:28 -0400
Subject: Help Find Puranas in Translation
Message-ID: <161227019365.23782.4065496896813437486.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

What an interesting series of issues you raise.  My first question
has to be: do you need a SINGLE text or an anthology?  If the latter,
I think the most serviceable is Cornelia Dimmitt and J. A. B. Van
Buitenen (ed. and trans.), Classical Hindu Mythology: A Reader in
the Sanskrit Puranas, Temple U. P., 1978--still in print and in
paperback.  It should have translated more of the epithets, and it
lacks anything from the Bhagavata Purana, but it is indeed original
texts and it has lots of the great stories.  If the former, I don't
know of anything, although Motilal Banarsidass has been translating
the Puranas seriatim for 20 years and there are lots of older trans-
lations.  The problem is any Purana is eclectic and takes editing to
be accessible, esp. to undergrads.  Here's an alternative tack.  Per-
suade your colleagues that fixation on a classical text is an in-
appropriate hermeneutic for India (there's some good bibligraphy on
this) and that contemporary retellings are, in fact, part of what the
tradition is.  The extreme case of this would be to use comic books
(including one of the Gita!)to teach the tradition, but there are a
number of less provocative alternatives.  Happy debating!
Tom Coburn, St. Lawrence University
 





From bhagavam at ccwf.cc.utexas.edu  Tue May  9 01:13:32 1995
From: bhagavam at ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (manu bhagavan)
Date: Mon, 08 May 95 20:13:32 -0500
Subject: SAGAR 2:1
Message-ID: <161227019367.23782.17225619314031117309.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

SAGAR: South Asia Graduate Research Journal Volume 2, Number 1 will be 
released shortly in hardcopy, email, and World Wide Web editions.  

This issue of SAGAR will contain the following articles:

RECASTING KARBALA IN THE GENRE OF URDU <MARSIYA>
	Syed Akbar Hyder, Harvard University

GENDER IDEOLOGIES AND PRACTICES AMONG SOUTH INDIAN IMMIGRANTS IN PITTSBURGH
	Aparna Rayaprol, University of Hyderabad

THE CHANGING ROLE OF THE INDIAN STATE IN THE DEVELOPMENT OF POSTWAR 
SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY
	Joel R. Campbell, St. Edward's University/Austin Community College

SOUTH ASIAN AMERICAN STUDIES: A WORKING BIBLIOGRAPHY, 1975-1994
	Rosane Rocher, The University of Pennsylvania

BOOK REVIEW
	WIVES AND OTHERS By Manik Bandyopadhyay/Tr. Kalpana Bardhan
			Sagaree Sengupta, University of Texas at Austin

To subscribe to SAGAR:

hardcopy: Please send US$25 (individuals), US$30 (institutions), +US$5 
(all non-US subscriptions per order) to Center for Asian Studies; The 
University of Texas at Austin; Campus Mail Code G9300; Austin, TX 
78712-1994. Please make checks payable to the Center for Asian Studies.

email: Please send an email message with a blank subject line and this body:
subscribe sagar-journal
subscribe sagar-journal-discussion
to majordomo at bongo.cc.utexas.edu and you will receive a message informing 
you of your subscription.  This edition of the journal comes in Text 
with Layout and BinHexed Word 5.1 formats. The email edition of the 
journal is free.

World Wide Web: You may view SAGAR on the Web at the following URL:
http://wwwhost.cc.utexas.edu/ftp/pub/das/.html/south.asia/sagar/sagar.main.html
The World Wide web edition of the journal is free of charge.

Please direct questions or comments to:
sagrj at uts.cc.utexas.edu
 TEL: (512) 471-5811
 FAX: (512) 471-4469
 

Original-Received:  by bronze.ucs.indiana.edu 
PP-warning: Illegal Received field on preceding line
Date: Mon, 8 May 1995 22:11:26 -0500
From: edeltraud harzer clear <eclear at bronze.ucs.indiana.edu>
To: indology at liverpool.ac.uk
Subject: Re:  Help Find Puranas in Translation
Message-ID: <"mailhub.live:270990:950509031132"@liverpool.ac.uk>

Hello Professor Beach, I wondered whether you would consider
showing a video to your students.  I am experimenting with
the idea of showing Peter Brook's The Mahabharata in my
summer course on Hinduism (apart from a number of other
videos).  Since even Brook's Mahabharata is very long,
I will break it up into several segments.  It is modern,
upbeat and perhaps quite attractive (but then it may too
stylized for your students).

As for the recommendation of Dimmit's and van Buitenen's
Purana Reader, I am enjoying it with my students.

I also find the translation of the Ramayana by Laksmi Lal
very legible. The book is available from South Asia Books
in Missouri. Very inexpensive paperback.

In the past I engaged professional storytellers, who 
either specialize in Indian materials or have one or
two stories or episodes well mastered to perform.

What translation of the Bhagavadgita were you using?
I personally prefer the one by the late Barbara Stoler
Miller.

I thought I would like to share a few ideas with you since
we are neighbors, I am at Indiana University in Bloomington.
Best of luck. Edeltraud Harzer Clear.
 





From kichenas at math.umn.edu  Tue May  9 05:27:57 1995
From: kichenas at math.umn.edu (kichenas at math.umn.edu)
Date: Tue, 09 May 95 00:27:57 -0500
Subject: Help Find Puranas in Translation
Message-ID: <161227019369.23782.3271848408385933966.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Regarding E. Beach's query on suitable material for his course,
it may be useful to contact the Ramakrishna Mission, which publishes
a variety of books, some of them for youngsters, with abundant
quotations from classical texts. They have a bookstore near the
University of Chicago, and one in New York. I am sure other people
on the list will be able to give the exact address. The work of the
Ramakrishna Math, both in India and outside India needs of course no
introduction.


                                Satyanad Kichenassamy
                                School of Mathematics
                                University of Minnesota
                                kichenas at math.umn.edu
 





From rsalomon at u.washington.edu  Tue May  9 15:48:10 1995
From: rsalomon at u.washington.edu (Richard Salomon)
Date: Tue, 09 May 95 08:48:10 -0700
Subject: Memories
Message-ID: <161227019372.23782.1854927309742992289.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



I am interested in tracking down further details concerning a report that
I saw myself in the press some time ago, that of a young Indian man who,
having already memorized the value of pi to 31,811 places, has now
declared his intention to memorize it (the value of pi) to the millionth
place. I was able to locate the name of a Mr.  Rajan Mahadevan, who is
reported to have memorized the value of pi to the 31,811th place, but I am
not sure if he is the one who wishes to go on to one million.  I am
prompted to check this because of two things:  one of my students brought
to me a press report of a Chinese schoolboy who has recited the value of
pi to 4,000 places "from memory, astonishing witnesses and smashing a
record set by another Chiense boy."  The other reason is that I think that
this ability to memorize things seems to be highly valued in Indic culture
in many ways, and can of course be observed in many other contexts, such
as the traditional memorization of texts.  It is hard to imagine another
culture on earth where anyone would even want to do memorize the value of
pi to so many places (even though we have the report from China); in Indic
culture it seems not at all extraordinary, given such feats as the
traditional memorization of Vedic texts etc.  If anyone has any more
information about Mr.  Mahadevan, or anybody else's (non-traditional)
memorization feats in the Indian context, I would appreciate hearing from
you. 

Please reply directly to haroldfs at u.washington.edu (Hal Schiffman, Asian 
Languages, U. of Washington, Seattle.)

 





From pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU  Tue May  9 18:05:51 1995
From: pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU (pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU)
Date: Tue, 09 May 95 11:05:51 -0700
Subject: Memories
Message-ID: <161227019378.23782.2300784657884548639.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

| having already memorized the value of pi to 31,811 places, has now
| declared his intention to memorize it (the value of pi) to the millionth
| place. 

hmmm.  i suppose its feasbile.  if he were to 10 key it pretty fast,
say 5 digits per second, it would take 2.3 days of continuous typing.
 





From asher at maroon.tc.umn.edu  Tue May  9 17:31:04 1995
From: asher at maroon.tc.umn.edu (Frederick M Asher)
Date: Tue, 09 May 95 12:31:04 -0500
Subject: Memories
Message-ID: <161227019376.23782.4017403137285525313.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Rather than report this just to Hal, I'd like to see the data on 
memorization on the list.  Rich Solomon is right about the regard for 
memorization in the Indian context, and it helps frame notions about what 
is a text in India.  Rick Asher

 





From asher at maroon.tc.umn.edu  Tue May  9 17:33:36 1995
From: asher at maroon.tc.umn.edu (Frederick M Asher)
Date: Tue, 09 May 95 12:33:36 -0500
Subject: Hindi language study (fwd)
Message-ID: <161227019374.23782.6920708469728693949.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


I received the following message from one of my daughter's friends.  I 
wonder if anyone on the list has ideas they could share with Joshua.  
Perhaps it would be best to write him directly.  Thanks, Rick Asher

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Fri, 05 May 1995 15:45:34 -0500 (CDT)
From: Joshua M Godine <GODINE at AC.GRIN.EDU>
To: ASHER at maroon.tc.umn.edu
Subject: Hindi language study

Hi Mr. Asher, 
	My name is Josh Godine. I am a friend of Alice's and I'm a sophomore
at Grinnell. Alice told me she spoke to you earlier today about taking 
Hindi and/or Tibetan classes in the Boston area this summer. I want to 
prepare for the Antioch Buddhist Studies program in Bodh Gaya next semester.
Any information you could help me find would be greatly appreciated. 
Thanks a lot for your time and help. 
				-Josh
			     [Godine at ac.grin.edu]





 





From ZYSK at ACFcluster.NYU.EDU  Tue May  9 20:12:18 1995
From: ZYSK at ACFcluster.NYU.EDU (ZYSK at ACFcluster.NYU.EDU)
Date: Tue, 09 May 95 15:12:18 -0500
Subject: Memories
Message-ID: <161227019380.23782.15036205746847136854.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Richard: I share your interest in this subject. Curious would be to
find out the method of memorization. Was (Is) it by sight or by sound?
I should like to know what you discover. Keep us posted. Ken Zysk
 





From n.rao at rz.uni-sb.de  Tue May  9 19:45:43 1995
From: n.rao at rz.uni-sb.de (n.rao at rz.uni-sb.de)
Date: Tue, 09 May 95 21:45:43 +0200
Subject: Vedic Text?
Message-ID: <161227019382.23782.18334926815742851526.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Does anybody know whether Rgveda sung in the
 traditional Vedapatha is available recorded in a cassett?  

 





From shailesh at cair.ernet.in  Wed May 10 04:21:55 1995
From: shailesh at cair.ernet.in (shailesh at cair.ernet.in)
Date: Wed, 10 May 95 09:21:55 +0500
Subject: Vedic Text?
Message-ID: <161227019385.23782.10349442482588234722.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

> 
> Does anybody know whether Rgveda sung in the
>  traditional Vedapatha is available recorded in a cassett?  
> 
>  
>

Yes, Bhartiya Vidya Bhavan (Banglore) sells, two cassettes:
	RIGVEDIC SUKTAS and
	RIGVEDIC PRAYERS & HYMNS
These might be available at any Bhartiya Vidya Bhavan office in India.
Regards and best wishes.
 

 





From a018967t at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us  Wed May 10 14:12:41 1995
From: a018967t at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us (Aditya, The Hindu Skeptic)
Date: Wed, 10 May 95 10:12:41 -0400
Subject: Hindi language study (fwd)
Message-ID: <161227019387.23782.6336773123180366692.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

The Government of India used to conduct a correspondence course a few 
years ago and my daughter took one. I am not sure if it is still 
available but I still have the record (45rpm) and the text. They may have 
updated it by now.

*************************************************************************
  Aditya Mishra          | The opinions expressed herein are absolutely *
Phone/FAX 305-746-0442   | not immutable and might have already changed *
Internet: aditya at gate.net| by time you read them due to the new evidence*
Prodigy:  TVDS96A        | or data that has come to my attention.       *
*************************************************************************


 





From vidynath at math.ohio-state.edu  Wed May 10 16:12:51 1995
From: vidynath at math.ohio-state.edu (Vidhyanath K. Rao)
Date: Wed, 10 May 95 12:12:51 -0400
Subject: Would like info on CSX encoding.
Message-ID: <161227019388.23782.12439596804886336414.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


Hello,

I have tried to get the descriotion of the CSX encoding, with no success.
Archie, Veronica and South Asia Gopher give no pointers to it. There is
a partial description in the ITRANS package; it also refers to a file
called iass.zip whose existence archie and veronica deny.

If CSX is some kind of properitary format that is not meant to public,
then also please let me know so that I would not pursue this any further.

I greatly appreciate any help.

 





From lnelson at pwa.acusd.edu  Thu May 11 05:21:52 1995
From: lnelson at pwa.acusd.edu (Lance Nelson)
Date: Wed, 10 May 95 22:21:52 -0700
Subject: uttara-mImAMsA???
Message-ID: <161227019393.23782.13432126317773910734.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

A question for those familiar with the literature of advaita vedAnta: Do 
any of the classical advaitins refer to what they are doing, or to 
themselves as a school of thought, as uttara-mImAMsA?  It is often 
pointed out that the pUrva- and uttara-mImAMsAs are sister sytems, and 
were perhaps originally a single system.  But I don't recall coming 
across the term uttara-mImAMsA in any of the readings in advaita I've 
done.  Has anyone?  How about the vedAntasUtras, a.k.a. brahmasUtras?  Has 
anyone seen them being referred to as the uttaramImAMsAsUtras?

I know the term zArIraka-mImAMsA, but that is something else.

Thanks for your thoughts,

LN
---------------------------
Lance Nelson
Religious Studies    
University of San Diego
lnelson at pwa.acusd.edu
---------------------------


 





From mmdesh at umich.edu  Thu May 11 13:55:23 1995
From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande)
Date: Thu, 11 May 95 09:55:23 -0400
Subject: uttara-mImAMsA???
Message-ID: <161227019400.23782.6975710756740843452.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

The terms 'puurva' and 'uttara' Miimaamsaa should also be compared with 
the terms Hiinayaana and Mahaayaana.  Indeed, those who used the term 
'puurva' miimaamsaa to refer to the 'other' system wanted to imply that 
theirs was the 'uttara' or higher system.  No texts referred to 
themselves as belonging to Hiinayaana or Shraavakayaana.  This is 
probably also true of 'puurva' Miimaamsaa.  
	Perhaps someone could elaborate on the earliest use of these terms.
		Madhav Deshpande

On Thu, 11 May 1995, Lance Nelson wrote:

> A question for those familiar with the literature of advaita vedAnta: Do 
> any of the classical advaitins refer to what they are doing, or to 
> themselves as a school of thought, as uttara-mImAMsA?  It is often 
> pointed out that the pUrva- and uttara-mImAMsAs are sister sytems, and 
> were perhaps originally a single system.  But I don't recall coming 
> across the term uttara-mImAMsA in any of the readings in advaita I've 
> done.  Has anyone?  How about the vedAntasUtras, a.k.a. brahmasUtras?  Has 
> anyone seen them being referred to as the uttaramImAMsAsUtras?
> 
> I know the term zArIraka-mImAMsA, but that is something else.
> 
> Thanks for your thoughts,
> 
> LN
> ---------------------------
> Lance Nelson
> Religious Studies 
> University of San Diego
> lnelson at pwa.acusd.edu
> ---------------------------
> 
> 
>  
> 
 





From P.Magnone at agora.stm.it  Thu May 11 10:16:50 1995
From: P.Magnone at agora.stm.it (P.Magnone at agora.stm.it)
Date: Thu, 11 May 95 10:16:50 +0000
Subject: Help Find Puranas in Translation
Message-ID: <161227019395.23782.10394998303986505828.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


Dear Prof. Beach,

I must say I am rather perplexed about the general attitude which is
reflected in your post. Your students seem to find fault with 1) the
idea of the svadharma of the warrior and with 2) the caste system, on
the basis, however, of some sort of uncritical feeling of cultural
self-righteousness, as they are unwilling to cope with 3) the
metaphysics of the guNas etc. and 4) the ethics of renouncement in
which lies the foundation thereof. If metaphysics are "dry" and ethics
are "unappealing", with what else are we left to judge whether the
advocacy of war is misconceived or the endorsement of the caste system
is "stolid"? If pacifism and egalitarism are to be affirmed with more
cogency than supine acquiescence in the received values, we must indeed
be able to critically come to grip with other cultural models supporting
different views.

I wouldn't make any efforts to make the classical hindu Weltanschauung
more palatable by any helplessly awkward attempts at showing that it is
not so extravagant after all. For the advocacy of war is there, and has
to be understood in its own right, although we may well read allegory
into it for our own edification. One should carefully discriminate about
the original purport of any cultural construct and its so called
"modernity" or "fortune", which usually means putting it to some other
use which wasn't originally intended. The construct may be well capable
of it, and we are certainly justified in making the most of it for the
sake of our development, but should contextually be aware that this
actually means "exploiting", as distinct from understanding, the
construct. Of course, this "exploitation" is the very essence of Bildung
-- but we cannot build on what we do not understand. So in any case a
correct appraisal of the original purport, insofar as we can ascertain
it, must come first.

Even for the doctrine of the castes, paralleling the degenerate jaati
system, which is nowhere acknowledged in the Giitaa, with racism in the
States will not shed any light on the original doctrine of the four (not
thousands) varNas issuing from the body of the primordial Male, which is
indeed endorsed in the Giitaa.

In any case, for myself I can hardly think of any classical text that
would be more appealing to an open-minded Westerner than the Bhagavad
Giitaa. In my opinion, what needs to be changed is your students'
apparently shallow, prejudiced and unsympathizing approach to an alien
culture, failing which they will not fare any better with the epics or
the PuraaNas, except that they content themselves with the simple
pleasure of the colourful narratives. Or the narratives may be
interpreted; but again, although Zimmer is certainly very inspiring, I
would beware of relying solely on his presentations, as he is explicitly
bent on squeezing out of the myths themselves whatever sense can be
contrived by the wonder-stricken "dilettante". For, in his own words, "our
primary task is to learn, not so much what they are said to have said,
as how to approach them, evoke fresh speech from them, and understand
that speech". A certainly exalting, but dangerous enterprise, if not
guided by constant critical historical and philological alertness.

This said, if you nevertheless want to tackle the PuraaNas, I would
recommend the ViSNu rather than the Matsya, as being probably the least
disappointing to the western layman in terms both of structure and of
contents in the whole range of PuraaNas. A very enjoyable translation by
H. H. Wilson is available in beautiful old-fashioned English, with
copious notes.

       Paolo Magnone
       Catholic University of Milan
       p.magnone at agora.stm.it


------------------------------------------------------------------------
On 8-May-95 Edward Beach wrote:

 (...)
 > Currently we are using the _Bhagavad Gita_, but although this is a
 > wonderful text of central importance for understanding Hinduism, some
 > of us find it rough going to get our rather provincial students to
 > take the Gita seriously.  In particular, we find that they are put
 > off by (1) the apparent advocacy of war in the name of duty against
 > one's own kin; (2) the stolid endorsement of the caste system; (3)
 > dry metaphysical passages dealing with the gunas and so on; and (4)
 > an unappealing (to them) insistance on the importance of transcending
 > pleasures and desires.  Of course we do our best to combat these
 > objections, by pointing out (1) that the advocacy of "war" is best
 > understood on an allegorical level;  (2) that the now illegal caste
 > system parallels continuing racism in the United States; (3) that the
 > doctrine of the gunas has indeed a certain aptness; and (4) that even
 > Western thinkers, such as Luther and Kant, worried about the validity
 > of pursuing virtue for the sake of personal benefit.  Nevertheless,
 > although we do point all these things out to our students, we often
 > find that we are knocking our heads against the wall with a very
 > unreceptive audience.  In light of these difficulties, I have
 > suggested to my colleagues that perhaps it would be feasible to use a
 > different text as a optional supplement or alternate.  Classical
 > Hinduism, after all, has such a rich literature, with many important
 > and popular myths and legends, that one should in principle be able
 > to find other appropriate readings for the World Cultures class.  The
 > stories of the Mahabharata and Ramayana spring immediately to mind,
 > but the trouble there is that the original texts are so very long,
 > while our mandate is to use original text rather than "retellings" at
 > second or third hand.  The Upanishads, on the other hand, are
 > generally too esoteric and philosophical.  A third alternative might
 > be to use a collection of excerpts from religious myths in the
 > puranas, especially those illustrating such important motifs as the
 > meaning of maya, karma and rebirth, the transpersonal identity of
 > the Brahman-Atman, the transcendence of desires, the meaning of
 > moksha, etc., etc.  One set of myths that I personally love are those
 > recounted in the first fifty-odd pages of Heinrich Zimmer's _Myths
 > and Symbols in Indian Art and Civilization_, especially those
 > involving the rishi Narada when, at the behest of Vishnu, he assumed
 > the form of Princess Sushila in order to learn the secret of maya; or
 > concerning Markandeya, wandering through the cosmic body of the
 > sleeping Vishnu.  Zimmer's notes cite the Matsya Purana as his source
 > for both these myths, but I haven't been able to locate a manageably
 > brief translation of excerpts from this work.  Could it be that these
 > marvellous stories have been collected somewhere under a different
 > title?  Is it even possible (hoping beyond hope) that such an edition
 > would still be in print?  Any suggestions or advice about locating an
 > appropriate text would be much appreciated.  Thanks in advance for
 > your kind assistance.

..


 





From kellner at ue.ipc.hiroshima-u.ac.jp  Thu May 11 11:41:30 1995
From: kellner at ue.ipc.hiroshima-u.ac.jp (kellner at ue.ipc.hiroshima-u.ac.jp)
Date: Thu, 11 May 95 11:41:30 +0000
Subject: Dates: Prabhaakara, Kumaarila, Dharmakiirti
Message-ID: <161227019391.23782.5914672513013985087.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


I would like to gather opinions on the relative chronology
of Prabhaakara, Kumaarila and Dharmakiirti, or,
even better, on that of their respective texts.

I am well aware of debates on the relationship between
Dharmakiirti and Kumaarila, and personally opt for
Frauwallner's hypothesis (S.lokavaartika - Dharmakiirti -
Br.hat.t.iikaa).

The question is, where does Prabhaakara exactly come in?
The immediate cause for this question is that I am
working on Kumaarila's abhaavapramaana, again,
and what the Br.hat.ii has to say on the matter is
simply inconclusive for the question whether Prabhaakara
knew the Shlokavaartika (i.e. the abhaavavaada) or not. He
refers to some who assume the abhaava to be a distinct
pramaana, but gives no further information on the
specific assumptions of those opponents (so it may
well have been somebody else but Kumaarila).

Answers I dream of would amount to rather
specific textual examples of the type
"dealing with subject x in the Br.hat.ii, Prabhaakara
does/does not explicitly allude to idea y,
which is known to occur in Shlokavaartika verse z."

TIA,

Birgit Kellner
Institute for Indian Philosophy
University of Hiroshima

 





From GRUENEN at mail.sub.gwdg.de  Thu May 11 12:59:31 1995
From: GRUENEN at mail.sub.gwdg.de (GRUENENDAHL)
Date: Thu, 11 May 95 12:59:31 +0000
Subject: Dandin's Kavyadarsa
Message-ID: <161227019397.23782.9928566304428158246.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Is there anyone out there who has actually laid hands on, and thus 
can prove the existence of, the following edition of Dandin's 
Kavyalaksana, commonly known as Kavyadarsa?

S. K. Belvalkar, Rangacharya B. Reddy (editors):
Dandin's Kavyadarsa. Parichchheda I. Edited with a new Sanskrit 
commentary and English notes.
Bombay 1919 (?)
(Bombay Sanskrit and Prakrit Series ; 75)

This library, and all the others I contacted over the last couple of 
months, have, if anything, Pariccheda II, parts 1 and 2, Bombay 1920.

As to Pariccheda I (and III), you can find any number of 
bibliographical notices in various sources, among them Emeneau's 
Union List and the India Office Library Catalogue, but when it 
comes to actually ordering the book, all this turns out to be 
quite unreliable (as experienced recently by a colleague when he 
tried his luck at the IOL). 

So, have these parts actually been published, or am I just chasing a 
phantom?


regards

Reinhold Gruenendahl
Niedersaechsische Staats- und Universitaetsbibliothek
37070 Goettingen
Germany
Phone: 0551/395283 
 





From nb6 at evansville.edu  Thu May 11 22:01:07 1995
From: nb6 at evansville.edu (Edward Beach)
Date: Thu, 11 May 95 17:01:07 -0500
Subject: Teaching the Giitaa vs. PuraaNas
Message-ID: <161227019402.23782.14540026850941792001.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


Dear Members of the Indology List:

About a dozen people have responded (many privately) to my earlier posting
requesting suggestions for alternative or supplementary readings besides
the Bhagavad Giitaa for possible use by our World Cultures course at the
University of Evansville. I would like to thank you all for taking the
time to share with me your knowledge and experience.  I shall definitely
look into Dimmitt and Buitenen's _Classical Hindu Mythology_, which many
of you recommended, as well as Wendy Doniger's _Hindu Myths_, a second
favorite.  There were also a number of other texts and teaching approaches
that several of you kindly suggested, for which, again, my thanks. 

There were also some useful comments and constructive criticisms with
regard to argument strategies that might serve to make our students more
receptive to the central ideas in the Bhagavad Giitaa.  I stand corrected
on the matter of the caste system in contemporary India.  Inasmuch as the
varna classification schema is both legal and thriving, and inasmuch as
this hierarchization of personal worth is endorsed by the Giitaa, I
suppose there's really no getting around the fact that this system is
woven into the very heart and soul of the Hindu religion, both now and for
the foreseeable future.  This is unfortunate, in my opinion, though I
wouldn't want to offend those learned people on the list whose religious
commitments or scholarly immersion in "contextualized" studies may make
them disagree. 

Of course, if one were teaching an entire course on Hinduism, it might be
feasible to "contextualize," and so partially to mitigate, the bad
impression that this scripturally sanctioned practice creates.  (When I
teach my Asian Religious Philosophies course, for example, the Giitaa
always figures prominently.)  But spending a great deal of time on the
Giitaa is scarcely a realistic possibility within the mandated parameters
of our freshman World Cultures course.  This is one reason why I thought
perhaps it might be worth exploring the alternative strategy of side-
stepping the difficulty altogether by simply selecting a different text.

I was also most intrigued by the comments received from Professors Tim
Cahill, Daniel White, and Paolo Magnone regarding the validity (or
invalidity) of allegorical readings of the Giitaa.  For example, Tim
Cahill wrote, in part: 

>Just a couple of remarks on your pointers. I don't think the Indians
>looked at Krsna's urging Arjuna to fight as an "allegory" until very
>modern times. Indian texts on poetics define and exemplify many figures
>of speech and other poetic devices but they never point to the Gita as an
>example. I think that the "allegorical interpretation" of Krsna's message
>is an invention of modernity.

I think Prof. Cahill's point is well taken, and I want to thank all three
gentlemen for their acute observations.  However, it's not as if I or any
of my colleagues have been engaging in facile allegorizing.  Whenever I've
raised this issue with my students, I've always presented the allegorical
interpretations as supplementary layers of meaning in addition to (not
replacing) the obvious dilemma concerning the ethics of dharma and war. 
Nevertheless, I don't think the allegorical potentialities should be
dismissed altogether.  It is well known that Mahatma Gandhi approached the
Giitaa in that way.  Similarly, Sarvepalli Radhakrishnan has encouraged a
metaphorical interpretation in the Introduction to his translation of the
Giitaa. 

Of course, Gandhi and Radhakrishnan, being "moderns," may be reading the
text quite differently from the way it was originally intended.  Yet
surely it would be wrong to rule out altogether the possibility of
allegorical elements occurring *within* the Giitaa, even granting that the
Giitaa *as a whole* probably was not originally conceived of as an
allegory.  Consider, for example, the final verses of chapter III: 

			s(')riibhagavaan uvaaca

	  (37)  kaama eSa krodha eSa
		   rajoguNasamudbhavaH
		mahaas(')ano mahaapaapmaa
		   viddhy enam iha vairiNam ...

	The Blessed Lord said:  This is craving, this is wrath, born 
	of the mode of passion, all-devouring and most sinful.  Know
	this to be the enemy here....

	  (39)  aavRtam jnaanam etena
		   jnaanino nityavairiNaa
		kaamaruupeNa kaunteya
		   duSpuureNaa 'nalena ca

	Enveloped is wisdom, O Son of Kuntii, by this insatiable fire 
	of desire, which is the constant foe of the wise.

	  (40)  indriyaaNi mano buddhir
		   asyaa 'dhiSThaanam ucyate
		etair vimohayaty eSa
		   jnaanam aavRtya dehinam

	The senses, the mind and the intelligence are said to be its 
	seat.  Veiling wisdom by these, it deludes the embodied [soul].

	  (41)  tasmaat tvam indriyaaNy aadau
	   	   niyaya bharatarSabha
		paapmaanam prajahi hy enam
		   jnaanavijnaananaas(')anam ...

	Therefore, O Best of Bharatas, control thy senses from the 
	beginning and slay this sinful destroyer of wisdom and 
	discrimination....

	  (43)  evam buddheH param buddhvaa
		   samstabhyaa 'tmaanam aatmanaa
		jahi s(')atrum mahaabaaho
		   kaamaruupam duraasadam

	Thus, knowing him who is beyond the intelligence, steadying 
	the [lower] self by the Self, smite, O Mighty-armed, the enemy 
	in the form of desire, so hard to get at.
			(Radhakrishnan trans., Harper, 1973, pp. 1480-50)

In light of these verses and others like them, I wonder if it might not be
feasible after all to see allegorical layers of meaning within the text. 
To those who worry about facile allegorizing, let me assure you that the
literal meaning stands foremost in the minds of our students here at the
University of Evansville.  Indeed, it is on the basis of the literal
meaning that many of them reject the ethics of the Giitaa out of hand. 
(Notice, I am not saying that I share their views.  Paolo Magnone is
entirely correct in deploring the "uncritical feeling of cultural
self-righteousness" many of our students seem to have.  This is the whole
problem in a nutshell.)  Yet I humbly submit that to leaven the bread of
interpretation with a bit of the yeast of metaphor and allegory can only
help, not harm, the cause of intercultural understanding. 

		Edward Beach
		Department of Philosophy and Religion
		The University of Evansville


 





From cardona at unagi.cis.upenn.edu  Thu May 11 22:51:50 1995
From: cardona at unagi.cis.upenn.edu (cardona at unagi.cis.upenn.edu)
Date: Thu, 11 May 95 18:51:50 -0400
Subject: Dandin's Kavyadarsa
Message-ID: <161227019405.23782.1513312787400391257.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

>Is there anyone out there who has actually laid hands on, and thus
>can prove the existence of, the following edition of Dandin's
>Kavyalaksana, commonly known as Kavyadarsa?
>
>S. K. Belvalkar, Rangacharya B. Reddy (editors):
>Dandin's Kavyadarsa. Parichchheda I. Edited with a new Sanskrit
>commentary and English notes.
>Bombay 1919 (?)
>(Bombay Sanskrit and Prakrit Series ; 75)
>
>This library, and all the others I contacted over the last couple of
>months, have, if anything, Pariccheda II, parts 1 and 2, Bombay 1920.
>
>As to Pariccheda I (and III), you can find any number of
>bibliographical notices in various sources, among them Emeneau's
>Union List and the India Office Library Catalogue, but when it
>comes to actually ordering the book, all this turns out to be
>quite unreliable (as experienced recently by a colleague when he
>tried his luck at the IOL).
>
>So, have these parts actually been published, or am I just chasing a
>phantom?
>
>
>regards
>
>Reinhold Gruenendahl
>Niedersaechsische Staats- und Universitaetsbibliothek
>37070 Goettingen
>Germany
>Phone: 0551/395283
>
A relatively recent edition of the text and commentary appeared in 1970:
Kaavyaadarza of DaNDin, first edition edited with an original commentary by
VidyaabhuuSaNa Pandit [sic] Rangacharya Raddi Shastri, second edition seen
through the press by Dr. K. R. Potdar ... Govt. Or. Series, Class A, no. 4.
Poona: BORI, 1970.  As far as I know, this is still available.  G. Cardona


 





From a018967t at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us  Fri May 12 01:16:34 1995
From: a018967t at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us (Aditya, The Hindu Skeptic)
Date: Thu, 11 May 95 21:16:34 -0400
Subject: Theosophy and the Colonel
Message-ID: <161227019412.23782.16051395166247587815.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

There is a very remarkable article in the Smithsonian Magazine (5/95) p.111
detailing the birth of theosophy and how such important figures as 
Mahatama Gandhi and Dayanand (Founder of Arya Samaj) were duped into the  
game played by Madam  Blavatsky.
It reminds me of the game played by Sai Baba who was finally caught red 
handed by a TV cameraman.
I was waiting for some one else to discuss such an important issue but it 
seems that it has missed the desired audience.
I wish I could post the entire article but it is too long for me to type.
Please get hold of the magazine and post your responses.

*************************************************************************
  Aditya Mishra          | The opinions expressed herein are absolutely *
Phone/FAX 305-746-0442   | not immutable and might have already changed *
Internet: aditya at gate.net| by time you read them due to the new evidence*
Prodigy:  TVDS96A        | or data that has come to my attention.       *
*************************************************************************


 





From B.Loturco at agora.stm.it  Fri May 12 01:46:14 1995
From: B.Loturco at agora.stm.it (B.Loturco at agora.stm.it)
Date: Fri, 12 May 95 01:46:14 +0000
Subject: Agamas
Message-ID: <161227019409.23782.13194684886162335835.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear members of the list,
recently, while I was reading something about shaiva iconology, I ran

across two names of agamas: Uttarakaamika and Puurvakaara_na (if I remember
well).
Does anyone know when they were written? How can I get some information
about them?
Thanks in advance.
Bruno Lo Turco
(graduate student, Rome)

 --- MMMR v3.60unr * Bruno Lo Turco

 





From RABE at vaxd.sxu.edu  Fri May 12 08:08:27 1995
From: RABE at vaxd.sxu.edu (RABE at vaxd.sxu.edu)
Date: Fri, 12 May 95 03:08:27 -0500
Subject: Theosophy and the Colonel
Message-ID: <161227019414.23782.14419880920627137433.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

never mind (I wish to reply privately, but can't abort)
 





From som at deakin.edu.au  Thu May 11 23:28:22 1995
From: som at deakin.edu.au (som at deakin.edu.au)
Date: Fri, 12 May 95 09:28:22 +1000
Subject: India Weekly, London
Message-ID: <161227019407.23782.14561664531583471539.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Could someone please send me the postal address for the India Weekly in London?

Thanks in advance,
Serena O'Meley

som at deakin.edu.au

 





From als1 at midway.uchicago.edu  Fri May 12 14:36:21 1995
From: als1 at midway.uchicago.edu (william j alspaugh)
Date: Fri, 12 May 95 09:36:21 -0500
Subject: Dandin's Kavyadarsa
Message-ID: <161227019418.23782.9439964574421310575.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

The Bombay Prakrit and Sanskrit Series is published in microfiche by
Interdocumentation Company (IDC) in the Netherlands.  This microfiche should
contain Parichcheda I of v. 75, Dandin's Kavyadarsa.  This is based on the
record for this fiche in online catalog of the Center for Research Libraries.
 The record notes: "Part one erroneously marked no. 74 of the series."  But
the record clearly shows that part one (Parichcheda I) is on the fiche, some
several European libraries must have purchased this microfiche set.  Bill
Alspaugh, University of Chicago Library

Bitnet:                   uclals1 at uchimvs1
Internet:         als1 at midway.uchicago.edu
 





From aklujkar at unixg.ubc.ca  Fri May 12 20:32:01 1995
From: aklujkar at unixg.ubc.ca (aklujkar at unixg.ubc.ca)
Date: Fri, 12 May 95 13:32:01 -0700
Subject: Rangoli materials
Message-ID: <161227019423.23782.9853811775935840453.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

This inquiry is especially directed to those among you who are interested
in Indian arts or who have friends and colleagues specializing  in Indian
arts.

In my last trip to India, I made the acquaintance of a very gifted artist,
Mr. R.R. Chaunde (= Chau.n.de) from Pune, who specializes in large-scale
floor drawings known as ra.ngaavalii, ra.ngolii or alpanaa and who seemed
to be one of the few individuals knowledgeable about the symbolism and
ritual of that art form. Mr. Chaunde has won recognition to the extent of
being invited by the Government of India to display his art in Delhi. He
told me that there was a strong possibility of his being invited to North
America. His problem is the weight of the principal material he needs for
his art. He normally uses marble dust or fine marble powder (colored
variously). It is very heavy. The amount he needs to decorate the whole
floor of a room or hallway, which is what he normally does,can be carried 
from place to place only with difficulty and probably with considerable
expense.  If he must, he can use sand locally ground to fineness as a
substitute.  However, before he does that, he would like to know if
sufficiently large quantities of marble dust are sold anywhere in North
America. I shall forward to him any helpful  information you can convey in
this regard (location, names of dealers, prices etc.). Thanks. 

Ashok Aklujkar, Professor, Department of Asian Studies, University of B.C.,
Vancouver, B.C., Canada V6T 1Z2. Tel: O: (604) 822-5185, R: (604) 274-5353.
 Fax O:
822-8937. E-mail: aklujkar at unixg.ubc.ca

 





From tony_stewart at ncsu.edu  Fri May 12 19:08:30 1995
From: tony_stewart at ncsu.edu (tony_stewart at ncsu.edu)
Date: Fri, 12 May 95 15:08:30 -0400
Subject: Hindi-Urdu Appointment at NCSU/UNC-CH
Message-ID: <161227019421.23782.12034790722693318989.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Colleague, 

Please post and circulate the following announcement regarding a new (but
unfortunately very late-funded) position in Hindi-Urdu languages and
literatures at North Carolina State University and the University of North
Carolina-Chapel, under the sponsorship of the Triangle South Asia
Consortium.  We need to fill the appointment as soon as possible so that
the professor can begin teaching this fall.  I am submitting this to a
number of list-servers and bulletin boards, so please excuse any
duplication.  If you know of a reflector service or bulletin board that is
not indicated above, or of individuals who might be interested, please feel
free to circulate the announcement.  

Thanks, Tony K. Stewart, Director, Triangle South Asia Consortium

                        *     *     *     *     *     

Hindi-Urdu Languages and Literatures
Beginning 15 August 1995
Triangle South Asia Consortium
North Carolina State University
Raleigh, NC 27695-8101

The Triangle South Asia Consortium and North Carolina State University
invite applications for a full-time academic appointment as Professor of
the Practice in Hindi-Urdu languages and literature effective 15 August
1995.  The Triangle South Asia Consortium is an educational cooperative of
the South Asia faculties of North Carolina State University (Raleigh), the
University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill, and Duke University (Durham).  

Qualifications.  Candidates should possess the PhD degree (although ABDs
will be considered).  Candidates should be professionally prepared to teach
Hindi/Urdu language at the beginning and intermediate levels, and one of
the languages and literatures on the advanced level.  Preference will be
given to Urdu, but either will be considered.  An alternate discipline
other than literatures is also acceptable.  The candidate must be prepared
to help develop courses and pedagogy for the interactive televideo
classsroom to take advantage of emerging "information highway"
technologies.  Because of the newness of these technologies, no prior
experience in this environment is required.  

Classes.  Initial class responsibilities will include beginning and
intermediate language classes via telecourse instruction at North Carolina
State University and the University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill.  The
professor will train and manage teaching assistants on both campuses and
will be expected to teach alternately from each campus with the second
campus connected via interactive televideo classroom.  It should be noted
that this technology is not passive television broadcast, but fully
interactive, enabling all students and faculty, regardless of location, to
engage visually, aurally, and orally.   During the second year, beginning
and intermediate courses at NCSU and UNC-CH will be integrated with
existing instruction at Duke University.  The two professors and their
assistants will then be responsible for classes on all three campuses.  As
noted below, after three years each campus will support a full-time
professor with joint responsibilities for the students on all three
campuses.  The use of telecourses is not a substitute for live instructors,
but provides the member institutions of the Triangle South Asia Consortium
with the opportunity to multiply the presence of faculty in a way that will
relieve each instructor from much of the tediousness of beginning language
instruction through shared faculty and facilities.  This in turn guarantees
that  faculty will be free to develop topical and more advanced classes in
his or her speciality, and to participate more fully in the intellectual
life of the consortium. 

Future.  The initial three year appointment at NCSU will be extended in
rolling five-year term contracts.  The initial commitment for eight years
(three plus five) is institutionally firm; future appointments (with the
possibility of future conversion to tenure track) will hinge on the success
of the program.  The University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill will make an
additional full-time, five-year appointment (to begin 1998-99) through a
separate competition contingent upon the successful completion of the first
three years of joint appointment.

Administration and funding.  Funding for the initial three years of this
appointment will be underwritten by the Undergraduate International Studies
and Foreign Language Program (CFDA 84.016) of the Center for International
Education, U.S. Department of Education.  For this initial appointment, the
successful applicant will have an administrative home in the Department of
Foreign Languages at North Carolina State University, but will also be
jointly appointed by the University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill through
Asian Studies.  

For more information, please contact 

        Prof. Tony K. Stewart
        Director
        Triangle South Asia Consortium
        Box 8101 
        North Carolina State University
        Raleigh, NC 27695-8101 USA
        tel. 919/515-6335
        fax. 919/515-7856
        e-mail <tony_stewart at ncsu.edu>

The Triangle South Asia Consortium and its constituent members--North
Carolina State University, the University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill,
and Duke University--are Equal Opportunity employers.  EO/AA.


%%% overflow headers %%%
To: south-asia at cunews.carleton.ca, scholars at southasia.upenn.edu,
        H-Asia at msu.edu, conlon at u.washington.edu, indology at liverpool.ac.uk,
        sinsler at minerva.cis.yale.edu, pko1 at columbia.edu, rac4 at columbia.edu,
        jsh3 at columbia.edu, spoulos at uclink.berkeley.edu,
        SASIANCTR at macc.wisc.edu, fleur at uclink.berkeley.edu (Ann Higgins),
        Frederick M Asher <asher at maroon.tc.umn.edu>,
        Lee Schlesinger <schlesin at umich.edu>,
        s-pollock at uchicago.edu (Sheldon Pollock),
        dludden at sas.upenn.edu (David Ludden), kaye at cicero.spc.uchicago.edu,
        plosin at neh.fed.us, Donald C Johnson <D-JOHN4 at vm1.spcs.umn.edu>,
        Nick.Dirks at um.cc.umich.edu, adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu (Aditya Behl),
        rwl at uts.cc.utexas.edu (Richard W. Lariviere), wr at soas.ac.uk,
        FFISHER at OCVAXA.CC.OBERLIN.EDU,
        "P. Lutgendorf" <plutgend at blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>,
        <agood at bluenote.demon.co.uk>, andrewc at ccl.uca.edu,
        bms at nauvax.ucc.nau.edu, Douglas Brooks <dbrk at troi.cc.rochester.edu>,
        Tim Bryson <Bryson at Harvarda.bitnet>, Rebecca Chopp <rchopp at emory.edu>,
        Richard Cohen <Cohen at ns.rhodes.edu>,
        Edward Crangle <e.crangle at mailbox.uq.oz.au>,
        "E. DeMichelis" <ead21 at cam.ac.uk>,
        Corinne Dempsey <ndgarigl at mailbox.syr.edu>, dhirc at columbia.edu,
        Wendy Doniger <don8 at midway.uchicago.edu>, drdj at mail.utexas.edu,
        Kathleen Erndl <kerndl at mailer.fsu.edu>,
        Emily Evison <indinst at vas.ox.ac.uk>,
        John Fenton <reljyf at emuvm1.cc.emory.edu>, fsmith at blue.weeg.uiowa.edu,
        David Haberman <dhaberma at ucs.indiana.edu>,
        Robert Hardgrave <rlh at curly.cc.utexas.edu>,
        Lindsey Harlan <lbhar at conn.college.edu>,
        William Harman <wharman at depauw.edu>,
        George/Kausalya Hart <ghart at garnet.berkeley.edu>,
        Brian Hatcher <bhatcher at titan.iwu.edu>,
        Jack hawley <jsh3 at columbia.edu>,
        Alf Hiltebeitel <beitel at gwuvm.gwu.edu>, I.Dawes at latrobe.edu.au,
        David knipe <dknipe at macc.wisc.edu>,
        Richard Lariviere <rwl at uts.cc.utexas.edu>,
        Gerald Larson <glarson at humanitas.ucsb.edu>,
        "I. Julia Leslie" <j.lese at ucl.ac.uk>, lightman at cais.com,
        lnelson at teetot.acusd.edu, lnelson at teetot.acusd.edu,
        Bill Mahony <bimahony at apollo.davidson.edu>,
        McKim Marriott <mmarriot at midway.uchicago.edu>,
        McDermottJ <McDermot at wehle.canisius.edu>,
        Dennis McGilgray <Dennis.Mcgilvray at colorado.edu>,
        ralph nicholas <r-nicholas at uchicago.edu>,
        Charles Nuckolls <anthcn at emuvm1.cc.emory.edu>,
        James Nye <jnye at midway.uchicago.edu>,
        Patrick Olleville <jpo at uts.cc.utexas.edu>,
        charles orzech <orzechc at turing.uncg.edu>,
        Laurie Patton <patton at levy.bard.edu>, pwilliams at uh.edu,
        rcmcdermott at barnard.columbia.edu,
        Rosanne Rocher <rrocher at sas.upenn.edu>, rwl at uts.cc.utexas.edu,
        Sagar <bhagavan at ccwf.cc.utexas.edu>,
        Bo Sax <phil013 at cantva.canterbury.ac.nz>,
        David Shulman <shulman at coma.huji.ac.il>,
        Richard Shweder <rshd at midway.uchicago.edu>,
        Frederick Smith <fsmith at blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>,
        Thomas Thangaraj <theomtt at emoryu1.cc.emory.edu>,
        David White <dgw6b at uva.pcmail.virginia.edu>,
        Raymond Williams <williamr at wabash.edu>, williams at uhdux2.dt.uh.edu,
        zysk at acfcluster.nyu.edu, Velchuru Narayanarao <nara at macc.wisc.edu>,
        Paul Courtright <relpbc at emory.edu>
%%% end overflow headers %%%
 





From n.rao at rz.uni-sb.de  Fri May 12 13:39:32 1995
From: n.rao at rz.uni-sb.de (n.rao at rz.uni-sb.de)
Date: Fri, 12 May 95 15:39:32 +0200
Subject: uttara-mImAMsA???
Message-ID: <161227019416.23782.12779736666925846408.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

The following may be of interest in this connection, even though it is not 
what is asked for. I am writing from my memory and now I am not having the 
relevant text available for consultation. Ramanuja in his BrahmasUtrabhAsya 
(in the very beginning) comments on the word  'athAto BrahmajijnAsA'. As 
against Shankara, he suggests that the word 'athah' means 'after completing 
the dharmamImAmsA' and fulfilling the relevant duties enjoined on the 
householder. That is, he clealy suggets that concerning with  'brahman'  is 
something that needs to be done after concerning oneself with the question 
of dharma. So, at least RAmAnuja appears to share the idea that Jaimini's 
dharmasUtras and brahmasUtras form a unity. But, from Ramanuja's polemics 
against Shankara, it appears that he was accusing Shankara for not sharing 
this opinion.  
>A question for those familiar with the literature of advaita vedAnta: Do 
>any of the classical advaitins refer to what they are doing, or to 
>themselves as a school of thought, as uttara-mImAMsA?  It is often 
>pointed out that the pUrva- and uttara-mImAMsAs are sister sytems, and 
>were perhaps originally a single system.  But I don't recall coming 
>across the term uttara-mImAMsA in any of the readings in advaita I've 
>done.  Has anyone?  How about the vedAntasUtras, a.k.a. brahmasUtras?  Has 
>anyone seen them being referred to as the uttaramImAMsAsUtras?
>
>I know the term zArIraka-mImAMsA, but that is something else.
>
>Thanks for your thoughts,
>
>LN
>---------------------------
>Lance Nelson
>Religious Studies    
>University of San Diego
>lnelson at pwa.acusd.edu
>---------------------------
>
>
> 
>
Dr. B. Narahari Rao
F.R. 5.1. Philosophie
Unversitaet des Saarlandes,
Postfach 15 11 50,
D-66041 Saarbr?cken

 





From vidya at cco.caltech.edu  Sat May 13 02:54:34 1995
From: vidya at cco.caltech.edu (vidya at cco.caltech.edu)
Date: Fri, 12 May 95 19:54:34 -0700
Subject: uttara-mImAMsA???
Message-ID: <161227019425.23782.13733486514240762043.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

> How about the vedAntasUtras, a.k.a. brahmasUtras?  Has
> anyone seen them being referred to as the uttaramImAMsAsUtras?

The mImAmSA sUtras are not known as pUrvamImAmSAsUtras either, even though
they have come to be applied in a restricted sense. The mImAmSakas traditionally
held the jnAnakANDa portion to be arthavAda, whereas in the Vedanta systems
the jnAnakANDa supersedes in some sense the karmakANDa. This is particularly
true of advaita, which traditionally views the two portions as being addressed
to two completely different audiences. 

Ramanuja and Vedanta Desika seem to view pUrva and uttara mImAmSAs as parts
of a whole. This seems to do primarily with their view of the role of meditation
(SravaNa, manana and nidhidhyAsana) in knowing Brahman. Sankara holds that the
upanishadic statement in this regard is not an injunction and that Brahman
knowledge is immediate, so that one either has it or one doesn't. He does this
because he does not want to make Brahman realization to be the effect of any
activity, even if that activity is only meditation. Since Ramanuja's school
does not hold the same view of Brahman as Sankara's, they have no problem in
viewing the Atma vA are Srotavya.h, mantavya.h, nidhidhyAsitavya.h statement
as an injunction to meditate. But that does not mean that they accord equal
importance to the Vaidika karmas enjoined as per a strict mImAmSA interpretationof the karmakANDa. Nor would they agree, I suppose, to the atheistic turn that
traditional pUrva mImAmSA can take. 

S. Vidyasankar

 





From B.Loturco at agora.stm.it  Sat May 13 13:56:43 1995
From: B.Loturco at agora.stm.it (B.Loturco at agora.stm.it)
Date: Sat, 13 May 95 13:56:43 +0000
Subject: Yogavasistha
Message-ID: <161227019427.23782.9481897747136106518.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I'd like to know the opinion of the members of the list about the

Yogavasistha.
When was it composed? What was its historical and philosophical milieu?
Personally, I had the following impressions (leaving out the last book,
6b):
The YV must have been written before Shamkara or at least before the spread
of Shamkara's thought.
The YV neither mentions Shamkara, nor it shows to assume a position
regarding his doctrine or other Vedanta doctrines.
Therefore the Vedanta doctrine implied by the YV must precede the great
systematic Vedanta.
The work doesn't seem to show any tantric influence: there is no cult of
the shakti, no speculation about language, no exaltation of supernatural
powers and rites, no cryptic language, no antinomism.
And, moreover, I don't see any influence from Kashmir Shaivism.
The likeness between the two doctrines was deduced from words which aren't
unusual at all in sanskrit.
For instance, the presence of the word 'spanda' in the YV cannot prove
anything.
This word recurs in Yoga, Vaisheshika, Vedanta (especially Gaudapada), with
meanings not too far from that of YV.
Furthermore, philosophically the YV is very far from Pancaratra too: no
doctrine of vyuhas is implied.
This doctrine would require a certain degree of reality of the world, but
this reality is denied by the YV.
The YV shows a great affinity with Gaudapada's doctrine, and maybe with all
that initial stage of vedantic thought (affected by Mahayana) which is
known to us only through allusions of Shantarakshita and few polemical
passages of late vedantins.
The YV has, from a literary standpoint, a puranic flavour, and seems to
accept the role of increasing importance which the maya has in the Purana.
The YV could maybe be considered a wide synthesis of the pre-sectarian
Hinduism and especially, from a philosophical standpoint, of that
idealistic mainstream which later took shape in Shamkara's works.

Bruno Lo Turco
graduate student, Rome
(B.Loturco at agora.stm.it)



 --- MMMR v3.60unr * Bruno Lo Turco



 





From l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no  Sat May 13 18:05:36 1995
From: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no (l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no)
Date: Sat, 13 May 95 20:05:36 +0200
Subject: van Nooten
Message-ID: <161227019429.23782.18120478828002513296.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Would anybody on the network happen to know the email address of Barendt
van Nooten?

Best regards,

Lars Martin Fosse



Lars Martin Fosse
Research Fellow
Department of East European
and Oriental Studies
P. O. Box 1030, Blindern
N-0315 OSLO Norway

Tel: +47 22 85 68 48
Fax: +47 22 85 41 40

E-mail: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no


 





From ucgadkw at ucl.ac.uk  Sun May 14 08:52:16 1995
From: ucgadkw at ucl.ac.uk (Dominik Wujastyk)
Date: Sun, 14 May 95 09:52:16 +0100
Subject: e-text of Arthazaastra available
Message-ID: <161227019443.23782.765386492730657266.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Michio Yano and his colleagues have made yet another Sanskrit text 
available in machine-readable form: 
> I have put the e-text of KauTilya's Arthazaastra
> at the ftp site of my university: 
> ccftp.kyoto-su.ac.jp.
> You can ftp it by anonymous login.
> The file is located at the directory:
> pub/doc/sanskrit/dharmas
> by the name kaz.dhz.Z

Many thanks, Michio, and please pass my gratitude to the team who prepared 
this text.

I have made copies of this version of the Arthasastra, as well as the 
Brhatsamhita, at the London site ftp.bcc.ac.uk:ftp/pub/users/ucgadkw/indology.
These copies are the same texts, but zipped instead of compressed.

Dominik
 





From dplukker at inter.NL.net  Sun May 14 14:10:24 1995
From: dplukker at inter.NL.net (dplukker at inter.NL.net)
Date: Sun, 14 May 95 16:10:24 +0200
Subject: IASTAM conference
Message-ID: <161227019431.23782.3983887737671083299.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

 On 27.4.95 Darshan Shankar (Director FRLHT) wrote that
 Vaidya Ram Manohar (Senior Res. Fellow, FRLHT) is proposing to
 come to the IASTAM conference, London, 16-17.11.95.


 Does anybody have more information on the above mentioned 
 IASTAM conference (e.g. participants, venue, address of the
 organizing committee)?
 What does FRLHT stand for?

 Thank you,
 
 Dick Plukker 
 India Institute, Amsterdam)
 

 





From Gerard.Huet at inria.fr  Sun May 14 17:46:06 1995
From: Gerard.Huet at inria.fr (Gerard Huet)
Date: Sun, 14 May 95 19:46:06 +0200
Subject: A few indological inquiries
Message-ID: <161227019433.23782.9228575614944972787.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I summarise the answers to my indology questions on etymology of deul and
other matters. Thanks to all who responded.

I guess the only remaining question is why the room next to the
main sanctuary in an Orissan temple is called "jaganmohana" i.e.
"enchantment of the world".
G. Huet

___________________

The word "deuL" (retroflex L) is used in Marathi also. It seems to be  
mainly a corruption of the Sanskrit devAlaya. I'm not aware of any  
alternative etymology for the term. 
S. Vidyasankar (vidya at cco.caltech.edu)
___________________

I am no Sanskrit expert, but I would imagine that  PrabhAvali should be 
divided like this: PrabhA meaning light, and Avali, meaning series or 
row; hence a string, series, or row of light(s).  As in ratnAvali, a row 
of jewels.

TiruvAci, or more completely TiruvAcikai would mean, in Tamil, the 
ornamental arch over an image, like the ring of flames, but could also 
refer to other sorts of arches, of flowers, etc.  To roughly translate 
this into IndoEuropean for  you Tiru=Sri, vAci (vAcikai)= bhAsaka (?)/vAcaka.

One of the major textual interpretations of the Cola Nataraja image is 
that of Ananda Coomaraswamy, The Dance of Siva.  I believe there is a 
whole chapter on the subject, which may answer some of your queries.  
This particular iconographic image dates from the Cola period (10th-12th 
c. AD) is associated with Saiva Siddhanta, and is perhaps most famously 
enshrined in the temple at Chidambaram (Tillai).  

"Daud R. Ali" <daudali at uclink3.berkeley.edu>
___________________

- Deul is prakrit for devakula "house of the god(s)".

- Prabhaavali(i) is from prabhaa + aavali(i) (not vali) meaning
  "range, series".

- Tiruvaaci is tamil tiru "divine" + aaci = sanskrit aazis "blessing,
  wish". The word denotes the arch over the head of a sacred image. (I
  am no specialist of tamil, though).

- In the common representation of Ziva NaTaraaja as usually seen in
  South Indian bronzes the dance is the naadaanta. This dance was
  performed by Ziva before the assembly in the golden hall of
  Cidambaram, regarded as the centre of the universe. The taaNDava, on
  the other hand, is a wild dance performed in the cremation grounds by
  Ziva accompanied by Devii and his retinue of ghosts.

- According to a myth related in the Kooyil PuraaNam, when Ziva danced
  before the hostile RSis dwelling in the Taaraka forest, the latter
  endeavoured to destroy him by various means. After several thwarted
  attempts, they drove against him a monster in the shape of a malignant
  dwarf, which the god trampled down under his foot.  Muyalaka appears
  to be the correct tamil name, but I am not sure of the etymology. As
  for the ApasmaarapuruSa, it means something like the "man of
  forgetfulness", and is usually considered as a personification of
  ignorance.

       Paolo Magnone
       Catholic University of Milan
       p.magnone at agora.stm.it
_________________________________

> 1. In Orissa, the main structure of a temple, as well as its inner
> sanctuary, is usually called "deul". This does not appear to be a sanskrit
> word, although it could plausibly be derived from the root dIv/dev.
> What is the accepted etymology of this term?

Interestingly, "deuL" is also the Marathi
word for temple.  I would guess that it is
indeed from Sanskrit.
 
> 2. The room next to the deul is called "jaganmohana", which is sanskrit
> for "Illusion of the World" or "World Illusion" if I am not mistaken, although
> this word does not appear in Monet-Williams. What is the standard explanation
> for this terminology?

Although not a Sanskrit scholar, based on
my Indian background I would have understood 
"Mohana" as "enchanting" or "enchantment"
(in a positive sense), rather than "illusion."  
E.g., a popular word for Krishna is "Manmohan" 
("one who enchants the mind" -- NOT "one who creates 
an illusion")!

> 1. The halo of flames that sometimes frames idols such as Na.tarAja is
> usually called "prabhAma.n.dala" which means "Circle of Light". This
> etimology is pretty clear, although it is not clear to me whether the
> substantive prabhA comes form the verb pra-bhA or from pra-bhAs, since
> the roots bhA and bhAs have very close meanings.
> Sometimes this halo is referred to as "prabhAvali" where "vali", which
> usually means wrinkle in sanskrit, is sometimes spelled "valI" or even
> "vallI". Which is the correct spelling, and is the proper translation
> "festooned with light"?

Again, though not a Sanskrit scholar, I
would have guessed that it (I think it is
AvaLi, not VaLi) means "row" or "line."  

E.g., "DeepavaLi" is the
festival of "rows of lamps."  "Rangoli"
(actually, "Rangavali", I would guess)
is the designs one draws on the floor, 
with "rows" or "lines" of colours.

Regards,

Narayan Sriranga Raja. <raja at galileo.IFA.Hawaii.Edu>

______________________________________

Deval, as it is used in Hindi, is probably from Skt. devalaya, house of the
god(s). The word occurs extensively in modern and premodern NIA languages.
Cf. the famous line from Kabir, "na main deval, na main masjid, na kaabe
kailas mein, moko kahan tu dhundh re bande?" ("I am not to be found in the
temple, nor the mosque, nor in the Kaaba, nor at Kailasa; where do you look
for me, O man?") The punch-line, of course, is that God is to be found in
one's own heart.

Aditya Behl
 
Department of South and Southeast Asian Studies,
1203, Dwinelle Hall,
University of California at Berkeley,
Berkeley, California 94720.

Electronic Mail: adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu
Telephone: 1 (510) 642-1610 (O), 843-1264 (R) 
Facsimile: 1 (510) 642-3582
________________________

I'm going to make some wild connections. Please bear with me :)
my contention: 'deul' is very likely a derivation from root 'dev'.

here's why:
	In telugu, a temple is called 'devAlayam' (deva+Alayam) abode of gods.
The other corrupt (if I may) and/or shortened forms are:
	dEvalam, dEvaLi etc. Of these dEvalam is quite popular in areas 
boardering tamilNadu, and probably is used by tamils as well.
	'duel' looks like another such derivation related to 'dev'.
Comments are welcome.

-vijay (bandi at cs.umn.edu)
______________________

Nataraja, an excellent source
Zvelebil, Kamil Veith. Ananda-Tandava of Siva-Sadanrttamurti (Madras: Institute
of Asian Studes, 1985)

You might also want to direct inquiries to N. Ganesan, who posts regularly on
Tamil arcana:  nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov
Michael Rabe
Saint Xavier University
Chicago
RABE at vaxd.sxu.edu

 





From ucgadkw at ucl.ac.uk  Sun May 14 20:32:21 1995
From: ucgadkw at ucl.ac.uk (Dominik Wujastyk)
Date: Sun, 14 May 95 21:32:21 +0100
Subject: IASTAM conference
Message-ID: <161227019441.23782.14867744795582551197.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

> 
>  On 27.4.95 Darshan Shankar (Director FRLHT) wrote that
>  Vaidya Ram Manohar (Senior Res. Fellow, FRLHT) is proposing to
>  come to the IASTAM conference, London, 16-17.11.95.
> 
>  Does anybody have more information on the above mentioned 
>  IASTAM conference (e.g. participants, venue, address of the
>  organizing committee)?
>  What does FRLHT stand for?

Foundation for the Revitalization of Local Health Traditions -- FRLHT -- is a
Bangalore-based organization with international aid funding whose aims
include preserving areas of special medical value due to the biodiversity
of medicinal plants; promotion and support of traditional medical systems
in India, and the scientific evaluation of Ayurveda and other local health
systems.

The next meeting of IASTAM (International Association for the Study
of Traditional Asian Medicine) will be held at the Wellcome Institute,
London, in November this year.  The title of the meeting is "Traditional
Asian Medicine in the Modern World" and it  the local organizers are
myself and Larry Conrad (Lect. Islamic Medicine, WIHM).  Invited speakers
will talk on Chinese, Indian, and Islamic traditions.  A fuller timetable
will be posted to INDOLOGY soon.

Dominik
 





From ucgadkw at ucl.ac.uk  Sun May 14 20:53:50 1995
From: ucgadkw at ucl.ac.uk (Dominik Wujastyk)
Date: Sun, 14 May 95 21:53:50 +0100
Subject: Rig Veda
Message-ID: <161227019437.23782.2180602188207757211.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Jonathan Silk said: 
>         I know that in principle new book announcements are frowned upon
> here, but I thought ...

The opposite is true: I have in the past positively begged members to
circulate information about their publications, giving bibliographical
details and a brief synopsis.  Your info about the RV publication is 
very interesting and welcome.

Thanks,
Dominik
 





From ucgadkw at ucl.ac.uk  Sun May 14 20:58:25 1995
From: ucgadkw at ucl.ac.uk (Dominik Wujastyk)
Date: Sun, 14 May 95 21:58:25 +0100
Subject: Would like info on CSX encoding.
Message-ID: <161227019439.23782.15154071079726304303.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

> 
> 
> I have tried to get the descriotion of the CSX encoding, with no success.
> Archie, Veronica and South Asia Gopher give no pointers to it. There is
> a partial description in the ITRANS package; it also refers to a file
> called iass.zip whose existence archie and veronica deny.

See ftp.bcc.ac.uk:pub/users/ucgadkw/indology/iias.zip

Dominik
 





From GRUENEN at mail.sub.gwdg.de  Mon May 15 08:21:39 1995
From: GRUENEN at mail.sub.gwdg.de (GRUENENDAHL)
Date: Mon, 15 May 95 08:21:39 +0000
Subject: van Nooten
Message-ID: <161227019435.23782.6320782006137190366.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


According to REVIEW INDOLOGY, 2.5.1995:



6VANNOOT at VIOLET.BERKELEY.EDU





> Would anybody on the network happen to know the email address of Barendt
> van Nooten?
> 
> Best regards,
> 
> Lars Martin Fosse
> 
> 
> 
> Lars Martin Fosse
> Research Fellow
> Department of East European
> and Oriental Studies
> P. O. Box 1030, Blindern
> N-0315 OSLO Norway
> 
> Tel: +47 22 85 68 48
> Fax: +47 22 85 41 40
> 
> E-mail: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no
> 
> 
>  
> 
 





From tmeadow at BearRiver.com  Mon May 15 18:48:40 1995
From: tmeadow at BearRiver.com (tmeadow at BearRiver.com)
Date: Mon, 15 May 95 11:48:40 -0700
Subject: Vedic Text?
Message-ID: <161227019447.23782.9994821425145082384.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

>Does anybody know whether Rgveda sung in the
> traditional Vedapatha is available recorded in a cassett?
>
>
Narahari,
If I remember correctly, Van Stall's _Agni_ (published 15 years ago) had
one or two cassette tapes of vedic recitation.
Tony Meadow

------
Tony Meadow
Bear River Associates, Inc., PO Box 1900, Berkeley, CA  94701  USA
Telephone: 510 644 9400   Fax: 510 644 9778
Internet: tmeadow at bearriver.com        AppleLink: D0068


 





From GRUENEN at mail.sub.gwdg.de  Mon May 15 15:45:01 1995
From: GRUENEN at mail.sub.gwdg.de (GRUENENDAHL)
Date: Mon, 15 May 95 15:45:01 +0000
Subject: Yogavasistha
Message-ID: <161227019445.23782.8979756688096988511.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



I do not allow myself the luxury of a qualified opinion concerning
THE date etc. of the Yogavasistha (or THE date of any other text of 
similar nature, for that matter). However, I may draw attention 
to a recent publication dealing with the so-called Yogavasistha:


SLAJE, WALTER:
Vom Moksopaya-Sastra zum Yogavasistha-Maharamayana : 
philologische Untersuchungen zur Entwicklungs- und 
UEberlieferungsgeschichte eines indischen Lehrwerks mit Anspruch auf 
Heilsrelevanz ; [vorgelegt von M. Gerhard Oberhammer in der Sitzung 
am 31. Maerz 1993] / Walter Slaje. - Wien : OEsterr. Akad. der Wiss., 
1994. - 338 S.
(Sitzungsberichte / OEsterreichische Akademie der Wissenschaften,
Philosophisch-Historische Klasse ; 609 : Veroeffentlichungen der 
Kommission fuer Sprachen und Kulturen Suedasiens ; 27)


regards


Reinhold Gruenendahl
Niedersaechsische Staats- und Universitaetsbibliothek
37070 Goettingen
Germany
Phone: 0551/395283
 





From WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU  Tue May 16 03:45:13 1995
From: WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU (WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU)
Date: Mon, 15 May 95 23:45:13 -0400
Subject: Rig Veda and HOS
Message-ID: <161227019449.23782.15910865648250157008.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



On Mon, 15 May 1995, Dominik Wujastyk wrote:

> I have in the past positively begged members to
> circulate information about their publications, giving bibliographical
> details and a brief synopsis.



Since Dominik has urged us to convey news of new books, I submit the 
following notice on the Rig Veda and the HOS published a few days ago in 
the new Vedic journal (EJVS, email: ejvs-list at husc.harvard.edu).


HARVARD ORIENTAL SERIES, vol. 50

has been released a few months ago:


         Rig Veda,

         a metrically restored text

         with an introduction and notes

         by BAREND A. VAN NOOTEN and GARY B. HOLLAND

         [introduction pp. i-xiii; edition, pp. 1-547, with mandala, 
         sukta, rc numbers  as well as Grassmann's numbers; and 
         including deity, author, and meter.]
 
         [Also including computer diskettes of the metrical and the
         traditional Samhita texts with a quick program for word
         searches, as well as a simple conversion program allowing
         users to choose their own style of romanization].

         [NB: the texts are unformatted. The discette is formatted in
         DOS style which is easily readable by Macintosh computers these
         days. On request, we may supply a Mac version in the near
         future.]

         1994.  Pages, xviii, 667. Royal 8. Price, $50.00.

         [ISBN 0-674-76971-6]




The Harvard Oriental Series (HOS):

Founded in 1891 by CHARLES ROCKWELL LANMAN and HENRY CLARKE WARREN.

Edited by CHARLES ROCKWELL LANMAN (1891-1934, volumes 1-37), WALTER
EUGENE CLARK (1934-1950, volumes 38-44), DANIEL H. H. INGALLS (1950-1983, 
volumes 45-48), GARY TUBB (1983-1990, volume 49), MICHAEL WITZEL
(1990-present).

Published by the DEPARTMENT OF SANSKRIT AND INDIAN STUDIES and
distributed by the HARVARD UNIVERSITY PRESS, Cambridge, Massachusetts,
United States of America.

Direct application for books of this Series may be made, with remittance,
to the Harvard University Press, 79 Garden Street, Cambridge, MA 02138,
USA (phone 617- 495 2606,  fax  617- 495 5898).  --

The new subseries HOS-Opera Minora will be available from the Department   
of Sanskrit and Indian Studies, Harvard University,
53 Church Street, Cambridge  MA 02138,  USA (phone 617-495 3295,
fax 617-496 8571, email Witzel at husc3. harvard.edu).



FROM THE AUTHORS' INTRODUCTION:

The Rig Veda has come down to us in two versions, the Samhita and the 
Padapatha, neither of which corresponds in all respects to the actual 
metrical form of the hymns... we have chosen to present the hymns in a 
format closely approximating the canonic forms of the various meters. ... 
The discrepancies between the metrical canon and the transmitted form of 
the hymn have been discussed beginning with the Pratisakhyas, and 
continuing through the works of Hermann Grassmann, Hermann Oldenberg, and 
E. Vernon Arnold, but no systematic method for restoring the text in 
conformance with the metrical canon has been devised.  ...
Our approach has been to treat the text in the first place as if it were 
a synchronic document and to use the meter as the principal criterion for 
analysis. We view this straightforward metrical restoration of the text 
as a necessary preliminary to any further investigation of the relative 
chronology of the Rig Veda. ...
          


FROM THE  PREFACE:

This volume completes the fifty volume mark of works published so far,
during the more than one hundred years of the existence of this series.
Appropriatety, this issue is devoted to the oldest Sanskrit text, the
Rgveda. In addition, it presents the text, for the first time, in the
form in which we have desired to see it for more than one hundred and
twenty years; namely, as a metrical text, and in a phonetic shape that is
very close to the form in which it was composed more than 3000 years ago 
-- which form is different from that of the later redaction of Sakalya
cum suis. ...

The publication of this volume also marks the start of a new Vedic
program of publication in the HOS. Apart from the Rgveda, the following
volumes are in various stages of preparation: Paippalada Atharvaveda,
Samaveda Samhita with commentaries, Brhadaranyaka Upanisad, Atharva
Pratisakhya. At the same time, we also envisage a significant widening of
the series to include  other, non-Sanskritic texts....

... I would like to draw the readers' attention to our new sub-series
"HOS - Opera Minora", ed. Enrica Garzilli, which will be available directly 
from the Department of Sanskrit and Indian Studies at Harvard, 53 Church 
Street, Cambridge MA 02138, USA (and, probably, from some agents in America,
Europe and India; this will be announced separately).

In the new sub-series, we plan to publish, in fairly inexpensive form,
conference volumes, such as that of the Harvard symposium of May 1994 on 
translating from Indian texts, or, finally, those of the the 1989
International Vedic Workshop. Further, we plan to print reports...., a
preliminary edition (such as that of the Paippalada Samhita of the
Atharvaveda); and we may also publish some reprints of the more expensive 
HOS volumes for the use of students, such as the long out of print 
translation of the Rgveda by K.F. Geldner. Finally, I hope to initiate in
the new series reprints of the "Opera Minora" of American Indologists.
... Like its German counterpart, the Glasenapp Series of Kleine
Schriften, we hope that the new series will not just facilitate our own
work, but that it will also stimulate reading and discussion of the often
stupendous volume and depth of work that our predecessors have carried
out, which work, however, tends to become increasingly overlooked in an
academic climate that is increasingly geared to quick, fashionable, and
trendy production.      M. W.






 





From WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU  Tue May 16 04:03:25 1995
From: WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU (WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU)
Date: Tue, 16 May 95 00:03:25 -0400
Subject: A New "Grundriss" (Buehler)
Message-ID: <161227019451.23782.16955478731986332526.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On Mon, 15 May 1995, Dominik Wujastyk wrote:

> I have in the past positively begged members to
> circulate information about their publications, giving bibliographical 
> details and a brief synopsis...



In the spirit of Dominik's  statement yesterday, the following 
preliminary announcement, copied from EJVS, (EJVS-list at husc.harvard.edu) 
is made of:



A NEW VERSION OF BUEHLER'S "GRUNDRISS":


                  INDIAN PHILOLOGY AND SOUTH ASIAN STUDIES

The German publisher de Gruyter (Berlin/New York) is ready to release the
first volume of a new, greatly enlarged and much more comprehensive
version of Buehler's famous Grundriss published around the turn of the
century (Grundriss der Indo-Arischen Philologie und Alterthumskunde/
Encyclopedia of Indo-Aryan Research).

The new series, to be announced in more detail later on, is edited by
Albrecht Wezler (Hamburg University) and Michael Witzel (Harvard
University).

The first volume is an update on the interface of archaeology,
linguistics, philology and history of early South Asia (ed. G. Erdosy,
Toronto conference of 1992). 

Other volumes in line include: Epic grammar by Th. Oberlies,  A Handbook 
of Pali Literature by O. von Hinueber (with an appendix by H.O. Pint on 
Grammatical Literature),  and a Vedic history.


The first volume has the following contents:


                   THE INDO-ARYANS OF ANCIENT SOUTH ASIA

                   LANGUAGE, MATERIAL CULTURE AND ETHNICITY

                            George Erdosy, ed.


CONTENTS

                            I. Theoretical perspectives


G. Erdosy,   Language, material culture and ethnicity:
      theoretical perspectives.

K.A.R. Kennedy,   Have Aryans been identified in the
      prehistoric skeletal record from South Asia?
      Biological anthropology and concepts of ancient races.

M. M. Deshpande,   Vedic Aryans, non-Vedic Aryans and non-
      Aryans: judging the linguistic evidence of the Veda.

M. Witzel,   Early Indian history: linguistic and textual
      parameters.

J.G. Shaffer and D.A. Lichtenstein: The concepts of
      "cultural tradition" and "palaeoethnicity" in South
      Asian Archaeology.

P.O. Skjaervo,   The Avesta as source for the early history
      of the Iranians


                              II. Historical perspectives


F.T. Hiebert,   South Asia from a Central Asian perspective
      (3500-1750 B.C.)

W.A. Fairservis,   Central Asia and the Rigveda - the
      archaeological evidence

J. M. Kenoyer,   Interaction systems, specialized crafts and
      culture change: the Indus Valley Tradition and the
      Indo-Gangetic Tradition in South Asia

F. C. Southworth,   Reconstructing social context from
      language: Indo-Aryan and Dravidian prehistory

K. R. Norman,    Dialect variation in Old and Middle Indo-
      Aryan

R. Salomon,   On drawing socio-linguistic distinctions in Old
      Indo-Aryan: the question of Kshatriya Sanskrit and
      related problems

M. Witzel,    Rigvedic history: poets, chieftains and
      polities

A. Parpola,  The problem of the Aryans and the Soma: the
      archaeological evidence

H. Nyberg,   The problems of the Aryans and the Soma: the
      botanical evidence

(end)

 





From WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU  Tue May 16 04:35:02 1995
From: WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU (WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU)
Date: Tue, 16 May 95 00:35:02 -0400
Subject: El.Journ.Vedic Stud.1-2
Message-ID: <161227019453.23782.17993166024778405260.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



NEW ISSUE OF EJVS

The second issue of the new Vedic journal described recently on this 
list  has been released via email.  It is obtainable (for those not yet 
subscribed) on request from ejvs-list at husc.harvard.edu or from 
witzel at husc3.harvard.edu.

It will also be available from our homepage shortly.
            
               <to subscribe send the following line: 
               subscribe ejvs-list  your-own-name
               to:   listproc at husc.harvard.edu>


The new issue contains the following materials:




ELECTRONIC JOURNAL OF VEDIC STUDIES, Vol. 1 (1995), issue 2 (May)

                        
                              EDITORIAL #2
                              ------------
'

                              ARTICLES
                              --------

Michael Witzel,  Looking for the Heavenly Casket

ABSTRACT: Throughout Vedic literature, from the Rgveda to the Brhadaranyaka
Upanisad, reference is occasionally made to a "heavenly  casket" (divya
kosa), from which water is poured down towards earth. Several attempts
have been made to locate this vessel in the sky. In the present article
the relevant materials are presented and a new solution is proposed which
combines, according to the well tested philological approach,
mythological facts with a keen observation of nature.


                               NEWS
                               -----

NEW BOOKS
----------

A new edition of the Rgveda  (B. van Nooten and G. Holland)

      Rig Veda, a metrically restored text, with an introduction and
      notes

     (Harvard Oriental Series Vol. 50)

The new "Grundriss" (ed. A. Wezler and M. Witzel)

    "INDIAN PHILOLOGY AND SOUTH ASIAN STUDIES"

     Vol. 1: The Indo-Aryans of Ancient South Asia (ed. G. Erdosy)


NEWS ON DISSERTATION THESES
---------------------------

A list of current Harvard theses in Vedic studies

Thesis abstracts:

     Maria Green
                 Work In Progress:
                 Paippalada Atharvaveda 17.

     Carlos Lopez
                 Work in progress:
                 Paippalada Samhita 13-15


PROJECTS
---------

Proposal for a handlist of microfilms and tape recordings of Vedic texts,
a list of films and videos of Vedic rituals, and  a list of electronic
Vedic texts.


WWW & INTERNET NEWS
----------------------

The Indo-European home page at Frankfurt


EVENTS:
------

Conference on Samaveda, planned for late fall 1995

Conference on Dowry and Bride Burning, planned for Oct. 1995

 


Editor-in-Chief: Michael Witzel        (WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU)

Managing Editor: Enrica Garzilli        (GARZILLI at FAS.HARVARD.EDU)
Technical Assistance: Ludovico Magnocavallo

        Editorial Board:

Harry Falk, 
Freie Universitaet Berlin  (FALK at FUB46.ZEDAT.FU-BERLIN.DE)

Yasuke Ikari,
Kyoto University (G54095 at SAKURA.KUDPC.KYOTO-U.AC.JP)

<et  al., exact composition to follow>

email: ejvs-list at husc.harvard.edu
home page at:  http://www.arcadia.polimi.it /~ejvslist/
= http://131.175.62.190/~ejvslist/

Previous issue:
--------------

Vol. 1 (1995) :  Issue 1 (EDITORIAL #1)                       April 22, 1995

ITI VAARTAM ||

 





From RQ021RE%TCUAMUS.BITNET at cmsa.Berkeley.EDU  Tue May 16 15:10:52 1995
From: RQ021RE%TCUAMUS.BITNET at cmsa.Berkeley.EDU (Andrew Fort)
Date: Tue, 16 May 95 10:10:52 -0500
Subject: Yogavasistha
Message-ID: <161227019455.23782.5953029237088521548.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

This is in response to Bruno Lo Turco's inquiry about the
Yogavaasi.s.tha.  I hope you find these references helpful;
my familiarity with the literature runs only through the
late 1980s.  You might look at T. G. Mainkar's _The
Vaasi.s.tharaamaaya.na: A Study_ (Delhi: Meharchand Lakshmandas,
1977), Wendy Doniger O'Flaherty's _Dreams, Illusions,
and Other Realities_ (Chicago: Univ. Chicago Press, 1984),
Chris Chapple's introduction to Swami Venkatesananda's
_The Concise Yoga Vaasi.s.tha_ (Albany: SUNY Press, 1984),
or my _The Self and Its States_ (Delhi: Motilal Banarsidass,
1990), p. 86ff.

Andrew O. Fort, Religion Dept.     A.FORT at TCU.EDU
Texas Christian University         Fort Worth TX 76129
 





From Williams at wplink.dt.uh.edu  Tue May 16 21:57:19 1995
From: Williams at wplink.dt.uh.edu (Pat Williams)
Date: Tue, 16 May 95 16:57:19 -0500
Subject: Novice needs help with manuscript
Message-ID: <161227019458.23782.3950688365342408974.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Friends:

As a favor I am helping a colleague in India with a brief manuscript that
he has written in which he deals with a story from one of the Puranas. 
My aim is to make the spelling consistent, the grammar proper, and in
general to make the manuscript easier for Americans to read.  But I am
not a scholar in this area by any means.  I am an interested lurker on this
list, so I know there are some among you who can help me in this task.  I
have several questions, and getting them answered may require several
postings.  I do not have any of the diacritical markings available by which
to indicate proper pronunciations; I must make do with yankee spellings. 
Some questions:

1. The author has left off the final #a# which is found at the end of many
names, e.g., #Shiv# rather than #Shiva,# #Puran# rather than #Purana.#  My
thought is that these ought to be spelled with the final #a.#  Is this
correct?

2. Should the following words end with a final #a#: abishek, achaman,
pradosh, prayag, tarpan, manasakhand?

3. The author has capitalized the following words: Devas, Rakshasas,
Siddhas, Nagas, Nagakanyakas, Gandharvas, Upsaras.  My thought is
that these words should not be capitalized.

4. Should the names of the yugas, e.g., kali, dwapara, be capitalized?

5. I am using #lingam# as a singular noun and #linga# as its plural.  Is this
correct?

6. Should #Mahapuranas# be capitalized?

7. When the author refers to the #Manasakhand# of the Skanda Purana,
he capitalizes this word.  Is that correct?  What is the meaning of this
word?

8. Similarly he capitalizes #Valkal.#  Is this correct?  What does this word
mean?

9. Should #Sani Pradosh# be capitalized?  Should it be one word or two?

Many thanks for whatever help you can give.
_________________________________________________________
Patrick S. Williams	| Social Sciences, U. of Houston-Downtown
pwilliams at uh.edu	| One Main Street, Houston, TX 77002-1001
			| Voice: (713) 221-8982, Fax: (713) 221-8144

 





From R.W.Perrett at massey.ac.nz  Tue May 16 21:36:37 1995
From: R.W.Perrett at massey.ac.nz (R.W.Perrett at massey.ac.nz)
Date: Tue, 16 May 95 21:36:37 +0000
Subject: uttara-mImAMsA???
Message-ID: <161227019457.23782.283583212621628948.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I don't have the desired direct citation of an Advaitin text using the term
"Uttara-Mimamsa" self-referentially.  But I do have three comments that may
be relevant.

1. My understanding is that the term "Uttara-Mimamsa" refers to Vedanta,
not Advaita.  In other words, there is nothing specifically Advaitin about
it and Visistadvaitins and Dvaitins, for instance, have just as good a
claim to being Uttara-Mimamsakas (much as Bhattas and Prabhakaras have
equal claims to being Purva-Mimamsakas).

2. I can't verify this because I don't presently have access to the text,
but I suspect the term might appear in the Sarvasiddhantasamgraha.  If this
is correct and we were also to accept the traditional (but, alas, probably
spurious) ascription of this text to Samkara, then we would have a direct
reference by an early Advaitin.

3. I don't think Samkara uses the term in the Brahmasutrabhasya. However he
does call the words of the Mimamsasutra the "former section" (purva-kanda)
(III.3.1), the "first section" (prathama-kanda) (III.3.1,33,50) and the
"first instructions" (prathama-tantra) (III.3.25;4.27).  Hajime Nakamura
argues that this probably implies an already established practice of
distinguishing between a "prior-Mimamsa" (Purva-Mimamsa) or
"former-Mimamsa" (Praci-Mimamsa) and a "later Mimamsa" (Uttara-Mimamsa):
see his A History of Early Vedanta Philosophy (Delhi: Motilal Banarsidass,
1989), Ch.9.  Ganganatha Jha makes not too dissimilar comments about the
significance of BSBh III.3.33 in his Purva-Mimamsa in its Sources
(Varanasi: Banaras Hindu University, 1942), pp.5-6.

email: R.W.Perrett at massey.ac.nz

 





From mmdesh at umich.edu  Wed May 17 15:35:33 1995
From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande)
Date: Wed, 17 May 95 11:35:33 -0400
Subject: Will be away from Michigan
Message-ID: <161227019461.23782.15991608178453523726.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

To all the interested Indology-members,

	Just to let you know that I shall be away from Michigan in Pune, 
India, for the next six weeks.  I will be back in Michigan after July 4.  
If anyone needs to reach me in Pune, you may write to me:
	c/o Dr. Manik Thakar
	Centre of Advanced Study in Sanskrit
	University of Poona
	Pune 411 007
	Maharashtra, INDIA
					Madhav Deshpande
 


>?From THRASHER at MAIL.LOC.GOV 17 1995 May EST 12:01:12
Date: 17 May 1995 12:01:12 EST
Reply-To: THRASHER <THRASHER at MAIL.LOC.GOV>
From: ALLEN W THRASHER <THRASHER at MAIL.LOC.GOV>
Subject: SHIPPING DONATED LIBRARIES

          A patron who wants to donate a large number of scholarly journals 
          to particular overseas universities has heard that there are  one 
          or  two foundations or charitable organizations who will pay  for 
          the shipping  of  donated libraries to  needy countries.  He  has 
          been unable so far  to locate them in standard directories.  Does 
          anyone know anything about such organizations? 
           
          Allen Thrasher 
          thrasher at mail.loc.gov                                             
 





From n.rao at rz.uni-sb.de  Wed May 17 11:45:18 1995
From: n.rao at rz.uni-sb.de (n.rao at rz.uni-sb.de)
Date: Wed, 17 May 95 13:45:18 +0200
Subject: uttara-mImAMsA???
Message-ID: <161227019460.23782.8886821859158609446.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

>I don't have the desired direct citation of an Advaitin text using the term
>"Uttara-Mimamsa" self-referentially.  But I do have three comments that may
>be relevant.
>
>1. My understanding is that the term "Uttara-Mimamsa" refers to Vedanta,
>not Advaita.  In other words, there is nothing specifically Advaitin about
>it and Visistadvaitins and Dvaitins, for instance, have just as good a
>claim to being Uttara-Mimamsakas (much as Bhattas and Prabhakaras have
>equal claims to being Purva-Mimamsakas).
>
>2. I can't verify this because I don't presently have access to the text,
>but I suspect the term might appear in the Sarvasiddhantasamgraha.
Perhaps you are refering to 'Sarvadarsanasamgraha' traditionally ascribed  
to Vidyaranya?

  If this
>is correct and we were also to accept the traditional (but, alas, probably
>spurious) ascription of this text to Samkara, then we would have a direct
>reference by an early Advaitin.
>
>3. I don't think Samkara uses the term in the Brahmasutrabhasya. However he
>does call the words of the Mimamsasutra the "former section" (purva-kanda)
>(III.3.1), the "first section" (prathama-kanda) (III.3.1,33,50) and the
>"first instructions" (prathama-tantra) (III.3.25;4.27).  Hajime Nakamura
>argues that this probably implies an already established practice of
>distinguishing between a "prior-Mimamsa" (Purva-Mimamsa) or
>"former-Mimamsa" (Praci-Mimamsa) and a "later Mimamsa" (Uttara-Mimamsa):
>see his A History of Early Vedanta Philosophy (Delhi: Motilal Banarsidass,
>1989), Ch.9.  Ganganatha Jha makes not too dissimilar comments about the
>significance of BSBh III.3.33 in his Purva-Mimamsa in its Sources
>(Varanasi: Banaras Hindu University, 1942), pp.5-6.
>
>email: R.W.Perrett at massey.ac.nz
>
> 
>
Dr. B. Narahari Rao
F.R. 5.1. Philosophie
Unversitaet des Saarlandes,
Postfach 15 11 50,
D-66041 Saarbr?cken

 





From williams at uhdux2.dt.uh.edu  Wed May 17 18:54:15 1995
From: williams at uhdux2.dt.uh.edu (williams at uhdux2.dt.uh.edu)
Date: Wed, 17 May 95 13:54:15 -0500
Subject: "Valkal" in Skanda Purana
Message-ID: <161227019463.23782.2462024359209036521.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

My understanding is that in the Skanda Purana, Adishesha predicts that
in the future Shiva's cave temple, which was explored by King
Rituparna, would be rediscovered by "Valkal" or "Valkala."  Some of
you have been kind enough to tell me that this word means a garment
made from the bark of a tree.  In the context of this Purana, does
this word mean that the rediscoverer of the cave would be a person
wearing such a garment?  Or is "Valkal" perhaps the proper name of the
rediscoverer?  Does the Purana also state that the rediscoverer would
be a soldier?

Any help will be appreciated.

Thanks!
_______________________________________________________________________
 Patrick S. Williams | Dept. of Social Sciences, U. of Houston-Downtown 
 pwilliams at uh.edu    | One Main Street, Houston, TX 77002-1001               
                     | voice: (713) 221-8982, fax: (713) 221-8144      

 





From TCOB at MUSIC.STLAWU.EDU  Wed May 17 19:55:57 1995
From: TCOB at MUSIC.STLAWU.EDU (Coburn, Tom)
Date: Wed, 17 May 95 15:55:57 -0400
Subject: SHIPPING DONATED LIBRARIES
Message-ID: <161227019465.23782.15594245788115649267.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I suggest your patron contact Prof. William Hunt, Dept. of History,
St. Lawrence University, Canton, NY 13617, phone: 315-379-5212.  He
has arranged massive book shipments, first to Poland, more recently
to Sarajevo, and is very much on top of the logistics of such matters.
I have been unable to find out if he is on e-mail.
T. Coburn

 





From SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU  Wed May 17 23:11:04 1995
From: SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU (SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU)
Date: Wed, 17 May 95 17:11:04 -0600
Subject: existence of a skt. word
Message-ID: <161227019468.23782.13948759826435967027.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

The "Sanskrit" form  *yogyaacaarya is cited as equivalent to Pali
yoggaacariya (which does exist).  My question:  does this Skt. term
actually exist?  I have not been able to find it.

Jonathan Silk
SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU


 


>?From PMEHTA at hdc.harvard.edu 18 95 May EDT 10:49:55
Date: 18 May 95 10:49:55 EDT
Subject: "Bharat"
From: PMEHTA at hdc.harvard.edu (Mehta, Pratap Bhanu)
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII



In which text is the term "Bharat" first used to denote a geographical 
entity? Could someone provide the exact citation?
 





From R.W.Perrett at massey.ac.nz  Wed May 17 20:54:19 1995
From: R.W.Perrett at massey.ac.nz (R.W.Perrett at massey.ac.nz)
Date: Wed, 17 May 95 20:54:19 +0000
Subject: uttara-mImAMsA???
Message-ID: <161227019466.23782.11785075944769023129.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Narahari Rao writes (5/17/95) to suggest that my earlier reference to the
Sarvasiddhantasamgraha was a slip and that what I perhaps intended was the
Sarvadarsanasamgraha.  Since I received a private posting suggesting much
the same, it may be worth reprinting my reply:

No, I am referring to the Sarvasiddhantasamgraha (also known as the
Sarvadarsanasiddhantasamgraha), ed. by Prem Sundar Bose, Calcutta 1929. A
brief extract (translated by Bose) dealing with the Carvaka is reprinted in
S.Radhakrishnan & C.A.Moore (eds.), A Source Book in Indian Philosophy
(Princeton, 1957), pp.234-5.  For further bibliographic references see K.H.
Potter, Encyclopedia of Indian Philosophies: Volume 1, Bibliography, 2nd
revised ed., (Delhi: Motilal Banarsidass, 1983), pp.151,378. However, as I
indicated, the traditional ascription to Samkara is very probably spurious.


email: R.W.Perrett at massey.ac.nz

 





From pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU  Fri May 19 15:41:00 1995
From: pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU (pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU)
Date: Fri, 19 May 95 08:41:00 -0700
Subject: Thirukkural on-line
Message-ID: <161227019471.23782.1717275344631220954.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

/ FROM:  Ganesan <lms420.jsc.nasa.gov!nas_ng at ucsd.UUCP>, May 19 14:58 1995
| ABOUT: Thirukkural on-line
|
| 
| May 19, 1995
| 
| The Thirukkural is available in American English
| and Tamil from World Wide Web.
| 
| For Tamil original, the WWW address is:
| http://mathsun1.math.utk.edu:8000/~siddhart/thirukkural
| 
| For the American English (Hinduism Today, Hawaii) verison:
| http://uts.cc.utexas.edu/~janahan/kural/kural-body.html
| They have done a fairly good job of translation. Only
| aRattuppAl and poruTpAl are there. They leave out kAmattuppAl.
| 
| n. ganesan
| nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov
| 
|  
|
\ END: Ganesan


The English version can also be found from the HT home page at:

     http://hookomo.aloha.net/~htoday/htoday.html


-sadhu
 





From nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov  Fri May 19 13:45:35 1995
From: nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov (nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov)
Date: Fri, 19 May 95 08:45:35 -0500
Subject: Thirukkural on-line
Message-ID: <161227019469.23782.1607592595650670127.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



May 19, 1995

The Thirukkural is available in American English
and Tamil from World Wide Web.

For Tamil original, the WWW address is:
http://mathsun1.math.utk.edu:8000/~siddhart/thirukkural

For the American English (Hinduism Today, Hawaii) verison:
http://uts.cc.utexas.edu/~janahan/kural/kural-body.html
They have done a fairly good job of translation. Only
aRattuppAl and poruTpAl are there. They leave out kAmattuppAl.


n. ganesan
nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov

 





From pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU  Fri May 19 22:56:26 1995
From: pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU (pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU)
Date: Fri, 19 May 95 15:56:26 -0700
Subject: Query: Sadhu's e-mail
Message-ID: <161227019474.23782.7256448628043544979.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

/ FROM:  Ganesan <lms420.jsc.nasa.gov!nas_ng at ucsd.UUCP>, May 19 22:49 1995
| ABOUT: Query: Sadhu's e-mail
|
| 
| Sri. Sadhu Nadesan's e-mail address has a "!" in it. Because of this,
| I could not send any e-mail to him. I request him to send an
| e-mail address which will work for Unix machines. Thanks.
| 
| Yours
| n. ganesan
| nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov
|  
|
\ END: Ganesan


Namaste:

OK.  Will do.  So sorry for the inconvenience!  Pardon me for boring
others, but allow me to exlain.

You mention that you are using a unix system.  Normally any mail
client, such as mush, mailx, /bin/mail, pine, etc, will process the
bang correctly, if you are composing the mail from within the client
program.  But perhaps you are trying to send mail directly from the
shell?  In that case, simply preface the bang with a backslash and that
will keep your shell from trying to interpret it.

eg:
	% mail -s "test message" pslvax\!sadhu at ucsd.edu


On the other hand, if it is your mail agent, or the mail agent on any
intermediate machine between yours and ours, that will not help.

Yes, it is unfortunate that bang addressing is not universally
processed correctly.  It often depends upon how the local unix systems
administrator has configured sendmail or whatever mail agent they may
be using.  Newer sites may be less familiar with it?

We are a UUCP node off the net, rather than a direct net site.  The
bang notation is a long established form for uucp connections, which
used to be more prevalent than direct net (PPP, SLIP, TCP/IP,..)
connections.  In my approximately 13 years of using this email address,
I have found the bang notation to be the best variation.  In other
words, it is acceptable to more mail systems than any other variation
I've tried.  (Save machines in England, which seem to have the most
trouble.)

The usual problem is that some mail systems try to be "helpful" by
_processing_ the bang notation, but, they manage instead to mangle it
up.  So, a few people do have trouble, in which case, I recommend this
alternative using % notation:

	sadhu%pslvax.uucp at ucsd.edu


If that doesn't work, email to my mci address is autoforwarded to me.
There is a greater delay, but the address is:

	0003254561 at mcimail.com

Om Namasivaya
sadhu
 





From nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov  Fri May 19 21:08:22 1995
From: nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov (nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov)
Date: Fri, 19 May 95 16:08:22 -0500
Subject: Query: Sadhu's e-mail
Message-ID: <161227019472.23782.571331658084467965.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



Sri. Sadhu Nadesan's e-mail address has a "!" in it. Because of this,
I could not send any e-mail to him. I request him to send an
e-mail address which will work for Unix machines. Thanks.

Yours
n. ganesan
nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov
 





From treich at midway.uchicago.edu  Sun May 21 18:10:36 1995
From: treich at midway.uchicago.edu (treich at midway.uchicago.edu)
Date: Sun, 21 May 95 13:10:36 -0500
Subject: Seeking panel at Madison
Message-ID: <161227019476.23782.15101675886098134518.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



I am a graduate student at the University of Chicago, SAsian Languages and
Civ., currently writing a dissertation on the Mahabharata. I have submitted
a single paper for the comming South Asia conference at the University of
Wisconsin at Madison, but would naturally very much prefer to be part of a
panel which would draw an audiance knowledgable about and concerned with
issues related to my topic. 

My paper could fit in with a variaty of panels on the Mahabharata or on the
"epics," but I would be even more pleased to join a panel concerned with
various aspects of textuality in South Asia. 

For more details, contact: Tamar Reich  <treich at midway.uchicago.edu>    

Thanks!
Tamar Reich   

 





From mchari at bcm.tmc.edu  Mon May 22 13:18:32 1995
From: mchari at bcm.tmc.edu (mchari at bcm.tmc.edu)
Date: Mon, 22 May 95 08:18:32 -0500
Subject: Thirukkural on-line
Message-ID: <161227019478.23782.2442525894728578105.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Dr. Ganesan,
Greetings to you. I have the distinct impression that
you must be annoyed with me for missing the last meeting.
We have a guest from India whom we are showing around places
in Texas. Last Saturday we drove to San Antonio and due to
circumstances we could return only in the early hours of Sunday.
Hence I could not make it to the meeting that you had so kindly
invited me to. I regret very much not attending it. I have seen 
the flyer and am so excited that you have also scheduled a lecture
by Dr. Nagaswami. I met Shri Nagan Srinivasan during the Chitra
Visweswaran program. He had asked me to oversee the getting together
of the plaques for the performers. Please confirm whether this is
really so. I would be more than happy to do so. There is a trophy
shop near us where I get all the plaques for my wife's school and
he is reliable and prompt. The plaques for the Visweswaran show were
made there.
Best regards,
Mohan
 





From pslvax!siva!sadhu at UCSD.EDU  Mon May 22 08:21:15 1995
From: pslvax!siva!sadhu at UCSD.EDU (pslvax!siva!sadhu at UCSD.EDU)
Date: Mon, 22 May 95 08:21:15 +0000
Subject: Raja Raja Chola Chola
Message-ID: <161227019482.23782.8299224935711198821.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Namaste Members of the list:

I am very interested in finding out about the life and dynasty of
the Chola emperor "Raja Raja Chola Chola".  He had built a Siva
temple about 1,000 years ago, with 1008 lingams; it is still in
use.  Can anyone direct me towards materials that would outline 
his life and times?

Many thanks in advance,
Om Namasivaya
sadhu
email: pslvax!sadhu at ucsd.edu
or
sadhu%pslvax.uucp at ucsd.edu
 





From vidya at cco.caltech.edu  Mon May 22 23:30:53 1995
From: vidya at cco.caltech.edu (vidya at cco.caltech.edu)
Date: Mon, 22 May 95 16:30:53 -0700
Subject: Raja Raja Chola Chola
Message-ID: <161227019488.23782.2291886968195167675.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

"A History of South India from prehistoric times to the fall of
Vijaynagar" by K. A. Nilakanta Sastri is a good start. Sastri
discusses the fortunes of the later Chola dynasty in great detail. 

Vidyasankar

 





From HP at soas.ac.uk  Mon May 22 17:08:46 1995
From: HP at soas.ac.uk (HP at soas.ac.uk)
Date: Mon, 22 May 95 17:08:46 +0000
Subject: South Asia Research (journal subscription info)
Message-ID: <161227019480.23782.1466273709634674750.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


SUBSCRIPTION INFORMATION
FOR
SOUTH ASIA RESEARCH

Dear Friends and Colleagues,

The latest issue of SOUTH ASIA RESEARCH (Vol. 15 No 1) is available now.  
This announcement provides information about the contents of this issue and 
how to subscribe to the journal.

SOUTH ASIA RESEARCH is an interdisciplinary journal that is concerned with 
the history, ecology, anthropology, architecture, languages, literatures, 
legal systems, religions and visual arts of South Asia (the Indian 
subcontinent). It was established at the School for Oriental and African 
Studies in London in 1980 and is published twice a year, in May and November. 
The primary aim is to give rapid access to current research work, and on 
occasion the journal publishes the work of promising research students as 
well as established scholars.  Special issues have also been devoted to 
particular conferences and workshops in the past.  In addition to four 
articles per issue, plus conference reports and book reviews, the journal 
aims to publish interpretive essays that discuss in a more general manner the 
issues and problems that arise from research on South Asia.

--------------Contents of Vol. 15 No. 1----------
PHILIP DESAI: "Colonial and Indigenous Urban Morphologies in India"
G.H.R. TILLOTSON: "Architecture and Anxiety: the problem of pastiche in 
recent Indian design"
SANJOY BHATTACHARYA: "The Colonial State and the Communist Party of India 
1942-45: a reappraisal"
FREDERIQUE APFFEL-MARGLIN: "Gender and the Unitary Self: looking for the 
subaltern in coastal Orissa"

BOOK REVIEWS
"Communal Riots in Bengal, 1905-1947" by Suranjan Das
"Public Health in British India: Anglo-Indian preventive medicine, 1859-1914" 
by Mark Harrison
"Changing India: Bourgeois Revolution on the Subcontinent" by Robert W. Stern
"The Cilappatikaram of Ilanko Atikal: An Epic of South India" translated by 
R. Parthesarathy
"Tidings of the King: A Translation and Ethnohistorical Analysis of 
theRayavacakamu" by Phillip B. Wagoner
"Shankara and Indian philosophy" by Natalia Isayeva
"Claiming the High Ground: Sherpas, Subsistence, and Environmental Change in 
the Highest Himalaya" by Stanley F. Stevens
"Bangladesh: Reflections on the Water" by James J. Novak
"Hindu Children in Britain" by Robert Jackson and Eleanor Nesbitt

--------------Contents of previous issue14.2-----------------------------
W. H. McLEOD: "Cries of Outrage: History versus Tradition in the Study of the 
Sikh Community"
MARZIA BALZANI and VARSHA JOSHI: "The Death of a Concubine's Daughter: Palace 
Manuscripts as a Source for the Study of the Rajput Elite"
PETER SCHALK: "Women Fighters of the Liberation Tigers in Tamil Ilam.  The 
Martial Feminism of Atell Palacinkam"
KARIN KAPADIA: "Impure Women, Virtuous Men: Religion, Resistance and Gender"
DENIS VIDAL, GILLES TARABOUT and ERIC MEYER: "On the Concepts of Violence and 
Non-Violence in Hinduism and Indian Society"

BOOK REVIEWS
"External Compulsions of South AsianPolitics" edited by Shelton U. 
"All the Mothers Are One.  Hindu India and the Cultural Reshaping of 
Pschyoanalysis" by Stanley Kurtz.
"Cassette Culture - Popular Music andTechnology in North India" by Peter 
Manuel.
"Towards a New Formation; South Indian Society under Vijayanagar Rule" by 
Noboru Karashima.
"Symbols of Substance; Court and State in Nayaka Period Tamil Nadu" by 
Velcheru Narayana Rao, David Shulman and Sanjay Subrahmanyam.
"A Reference Grammar of Classical Tamil Poetry (150 B.C. - pre-fifth/sixth 
century A.D.)" by V. S. Rajam.
"The Emptiness of Emptiness, An Introduction to early Indian Madhyamika" by 
G. W. Huntington, Jr. with Geshe Namgyal Wangchen.
"Fire of Bengal" by Hozsa Hajnocey (translated by Eva Wimmer and David Grant, 
edited by William Radice)


------------------------------------------------------------

Members of the Editorial Committee:
Michael Hutt (Editor), Michael Anderson, David Arnold, Stuart Blackburn, 
Nigel Crook, Andrew Grout, Heidi Pauwels, Christopher Phinney, Peter Robb, 
David Taylor, Giles Tillotson.

Corresponding Editors:
Christopher A. Bayly (Cambridge), Indira Chowdhury Sengupta (Calcutta), Wendy 
Doniger (Chicago), Alan Entwistle (Seattle), Robert E. Frykenberg 
(Wisconsin), David Ludden (Philadelphia), Pratapadiya Pal (Los Angeles), 
Gloria Goodwin Raheja (Minneapolis), Barbara N. Ramusack (Cincinnati), Tanika 
Sarkar (Delhi), Sanjay Subrahmanyam (Delhi), Romila Thapar (Delhi), Gauri 
Viswanathan (New York), John Whelpton (Hong Kong)


--------------------------------------------------------------
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(Please print, fill out and send to: Journals Marketing, Oxford University 
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Tel: +44 (0) 1865 567677 Fax: +44 (0) 1865 267773)

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(Prices are for two issues)

Institutions: #23 / US$40
Individuals: #12 / US$20
(Please note: # sterling rates apply in Europe, US$ rates elsewhere)

Please enter my/our subscription to SOUTH ASIA RESEARCH
Name:
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1) I enclose the correct remittance, a cheque / Eurocheque (payable to Oxford 
University Press) /UNESCO coupon for the amount of .... #/$
OR
2) Please debit my account  (Mastercard, Visa, American Express, Diners' 
Card)  for ... ....... #/$
Credit card number:
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(If card address differs from delivery address please give details)

 





From WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU  Mon May 22 22:34:51 1995
From: WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU (WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU)
Date: Mon, 22 May 95 18:34:51 -0400
Subject: Summer Sanskrit at Harvard
Message-ID: <161227019484.23782.10818721870080504967.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



---------- Forwarded message ----------

Subject: Summer Sanskrit at Harvard 

Since I got several inquiries regarding our offering of Introductory 
Sanskrit this summer, -- taught here since 1988 --I repeat the most 
important items for those still interested to join us or those who could 
not find an opportunity elsewhere.

  SANS S-101 Elementary Sanskrit  (30221)
  (8 units)  Monday-Thursday 3:30 - 6 p.m.
  (June 26 - August 10; exam period Aug. 15-18)   
  Instructor: Michael Witzel 
   
  This course, equivalent to two semesters of course work, will 
  enable students to acquire the basic reading skills in Sanskrit. Stress
  will be placed on learning the Devanagari script, basic grammar and 
  essential vocabulary. Emphasis will also be given to correct 
  translation of passages from simple narrative literature to the epics.
  
Fees: Application feee (nonrefundable $35)      
Tuition (credit or non-credit): 8 unit course: $ 2,650 
      Health insurance  $95 (required if not covered by an American 
             carrier) 
      On-campus housing (if desired):  room and board, eight week session:
             $ 2,175     <June 24, 9 a.m. - August 19, noon>
             (Housing deposit $460)  

Registration by mail, fax (credit card only, with full tuition and fees)
through Wednesday June 7.
Late registration June 8-June 30 ($50 late fee).

Catalogues/Information 
from Harvard Summer School, 51 Brattle Street, Cambridge MA 
02138, USA
phone 617- 495 4024 (general information)
617 495 0519 (24 hour line for catalogues)

On-line catalogue:
gopher.harvard.edu

via Telnet:  courses.harvard.edu  (at the login type: courses and RETURN)
 
via modem:  617 496 8500, 
            at the access 3> prompt, choose option 4: 
            vine/course catalogs and RETURN    
            at the login: prompt, type courses and RETURN      



Good luck!  Michael Witzel


 





From vidynath at math.ohio-state.edu  Mon May 22 22:47:31 1995
From: vidynath at math.ohio-state.edu (Vidhyanath K. Rao)
Date: Mon, 22 May 95 18:47:31 -0400
Subject: gerund of sammizrayati
Message-ID: <161227019486.23782.6147424584661249794.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


A quick question to the grammarians on this list: How does one form the
gerund of a tenth class/causative compounded with an upasarga if the
root ends in a conjuct consonant? In particular, is the gerund of
-mizr (mix together) -mizrya?

Whitney and Macdonnel state the rule as ``if the radical vowel is
>short<, then the causative affix aya is retained, except for the final
a''. Should the word `short' be replaced by `light'? A quick search
through the grammar books failed to turn up any definitive example.

Of course, the stem mizraya is said to be really a denominative, even
though it is listed in the dhaatupaaTha among the curaadi class. Are such
roots treated like denominatives or like tenth class verbs in this
situation?

Thanks in advance for your help

Nath Rao (natharao+ at osu.edu)		614-366-9341
 





From nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov  Tue May 23 13:26:19 1995
From: nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov (nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov)
Date: Tue, 23 May 95 08:26:19 -0500
Subject: Cholas
Message-ID: <161227019496.23782.16287382684025571753.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



This is a very preliminary bibliography on Cholas

1) K. A. Nilakanta Sastri, The Cholas (with over 100 illustrations),
1975

2) S. R. Balasubrahmanyam a) Early Chola Art, London, 1966
b) Early Chola temples (907-985 A.D.), Orient Longman, 1971
c) Middle Chola Temples (985-1070 A.D.) Faridabad, 1975
d) Later Chola Temples (1070-1280 A.D.) Madras, 1979

3) Vidya Dehejia, Art of the Imperial Cholas, Columbia University
press, 1991

4) B. Venkataraman, Temple art under Chola queens, Faridabad, 1976

5) Blandine Legrand, Kilaiyur-Melappaluvur. epanouissement d'une dynasties 
princiere en Inde a l'epoque Cola. Paris 1987

6) K. R. Hall, Trade and Statecraft in the age of Cholas, Abhinav, Delhi, 1980

7) G. W. Spencer, The politics of expansion: the Chola conquest of Sri Lanka
and Sri Vijaya. New Era, Madras, 1983


Compiled by
n. ganesan
nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov

 





From peterg at icpsr.umich.edu  Tue May 23 12:39:57 1995
From: peterg at icpsr.umich.edu (Peter Granda)
Date: Tue, 23 May 95 08:39:57 -0400
Subject: Raja Raja Chola Chola
Message-ID: <161227019490.23782.12659343823622010055.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Might I also suggest Nilakanta Sastri's volume, THE COLAS (University
of
Madras, 1955) and the early volumes of the SOUTH INDIAN INSCRIPTIONS
series
which contain many of the temple inscriptions carved during the reign
of
Rajaraja.

Peter Granda
University of Michigan
 





From rkornman at pucc.Princeton.EDU  Tue May 23 12:50:19 1995
From: rkornman at pucc.Princeton.EDU (Robin Kornman)
Date: Tue, 23 May 95 08:50:19 -0400
Subject: Help Find Puranas in Translation
Message-ID: <161227019494.23782.708962993328771276.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Tom Coburn assures us that the Dimmit and van Buitenen text on the Puranas
is in print. Was my bookseller just making a mistake or is it indeed
out-of-print?

But to more serious things. Here is his most interesting proposition:

>  The problem is any Purana is eclectic and takes editing to
>be accessible, esp. to undergrads.  Here's an alternative tack.  Per-
>suade your colleagues that fixation on a classical text is an in-
>appropriate hermeneutic for India (there's some good bibligraphy on
>this) and that contemporary retellings are, in fact, part of what the
>tradition is.  The extreme case of this would be to use comic books
>(including one of the Gita!)to teach the tradition, but there are a
>number of less provocative alternatives.  Happy debating!
>Tom Coburn, St. Lawrence University

Many of us in comparative literature are interested in the propogation of
epic literature into popular media.  I have discussed this with colleagues
in anthropology and comp lit over the years and research in this area goes
forward.  I would be more than happy to have my classes read comic books
which use material drawn from the Mahaabhaarata, etc. but how I can purchase
them?  Where does my university bookstore write to get them and where can I
get catalogues of them?  I saw these comics when I was in India and have
often heard of the Indonesian ones which continue the Ramaayaana, but how
can I get aholt of enough copies to teach a class?

And there is a nice book on contemporary treatments of the Ramayana:
Richman, Paul  (ed.), Many Ramaayaanas: The Diversity of a Narrative
Tradition in South Asia, (Berkeley: University of California Press, 1991).  

Robin Kornman
 





From rkornman at pucc.Princeton.EDU  Tue May 23 12:50:23 1995
From: rkornman at pucc.Princeton.EDU (Robin Kornman)
Date: Tue, 23 May 95 08:50:23 -0400
Subject: Help Find Puranas in Translation
Message-ID: <161227019493.23782.6228763520218788779.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Re: the _Vi.s.nu Puraa.na_

>This said, if you nevertheless want to tackle the PuraaNas, I would
>recommend the ViSNu rather than the Matsya, as being probably the least
>disappointing to the western layman in terms both of structure and of
>contents in the whole range of PuraaNas. A very enjoyable translation by
>H. H. Wilson is available in beautiful old-fashioned English, with
>copious notes.

You know what? Emerson cites this Puraa.na in his essay on Plato!!! I'm
going to get H.H. Wilson's translation, but I would very much like to know
which one Emerson read, as well. 

Robin Kornman
 





From dambuel at s850.mwc.edu  Tue May 23 14:35:29 1995
From: dambuel at s850.mwc.edu (David Ambuel)
Date: Tue, 23 May 95 10:35:29 -0400
Subject: Help Find Puranas in Translation
Message-ID: <161227019502.23782.2099924544190122037.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Although I haven't used them in class, I've noticed that Nataraj books in 
Springfield VA keeps a good supply of Ramayana comics and others.  I'd 
guess they could meet class needs.  Their phone is 703 455 4996.

David Ambuel
Mary Washington College
 





From skjain at server.uwindsor.ca  Tue May 23 22:26:32 1995
From: skjain at server.uwindsor.ca (S Jain)
Date: Tue, 23 May 95 18:26:32 -0400
Subject: Help Find Puranas in Translation
Message-ID: <161227019499.23782.10928869391110623052.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On Tue, 23 May 1995, Robin Kornman wrote:

> forward.  I would be more than happy to have my classes read comic books
> which use material drawn from the Mahaabhaarata, etc. but how I can purchase
> them?  Where does my university bookstore write to get them and where can I
> get catalogues of them?  I saw these comics when I was in India and have
> often heard of the Indonesian ones which continue the Ramaayaana, but how
> can I get aholt of enough copies to teach a class?
> 
<stuff deleted>
> 
> Robin Kornman
>  
> 
RE: Indian Classics in Comic book format

The following may be of interest to you:

1. _A Treasury of Indian Illustrated Classics_ (English tr. of _Amar 
Chitra Katha_) in three + volumes. Published by IBH Education Trust, 
Bombay. In Colour.

Vol. 1 includes: Krishna, Shakuntala, the Pandava princes, Savitri, Rama, 
Nala Damayanti, Harishchandra, the sons of Rama, Hanuman, and Mahabharata.

Vol. 2 includes: Chanakya, Buddha, Shivaji, Rana Pratap, Prithviraj 
Chauhan, Karna, Kacha Devayani, Vikramaditya, Shiva Parvati, and Vasavadatta.

Vol. 3 includes: Sudama, Guru Gobind Singh, Harsha, Bheeshma, Abhimanyu. 
Mirabai, Ashoka, Prahlad, Panchatantra, and Tanaji.

2. _Tales from Indian Classics_ 3+ vols. published by Children's Book Trust.

Vol 1; Ganatpati, the House of Lac, Bakasura, Drapudi's Swayamwara, Bhima 
and Hanuman, Cousins and enemies. Vol. 2: Bhasmasura, Vali and Ravana, 
Kaliyan, Satya's marriage, Syamantakam, and Gyan. Vol. 3: Kacha and 
Devayani, Banasura, Arjuna and the Kirata, Vishvamitra, Sundan and 
Upasundan, and king Shibi.

3. _Legends from Indian history_ Children's Book Trust.
Contents: the tale of a republic, a prince's revenge, Yasodharman, 
Prthviraj Chauhan, The qazi judgement, and the Story of Goh.

4. Sons of Pandu_ by Mathuram Bhoothalingam. A Dolton Publication. 

5. Children's Ramayana retold by M. bhoothalingam. Publications Division 
(govt. of India).

6. The Children's Mahabharata. by Shanta rameshwar Rao. Orient Longmans.

hope this is of interest to you.

<Sushil Jain>

 





From reimann at uclink.berkeley.edu  Wed May 24 07:11:59 1995
From: reimann at uclink.berkeley.edu (Luis Arnold Gonzalez-Reimann)
Date: Wed, 24 May 95 00:11:59 -0700
Subject: Help Find Puranas in Translation
Message-ID: <161227019501.23782.4644264076145365612.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


For obtaining copies of the comic books you might try:

South Asia Books
P.O. Box 502
Columbia, Missouri 65205

Tel.: 314 474-0116


Luis Gonzalez-Reimann
UC Berkeley
 





From P.Magnone at agora.stm.it  Wed May 24 00:59:25 1995
From: P.Magnone at agora.stm.it (P.Magnone at agora.stm.it)
Date: Wed, 24 May 95 00:59:25 +0000
Subject: ViSNu PuraaNa
Message-ID: <161227019504.23782.14132411423116945673.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


Horace Hayman Wilson's translation, bearing the title _The ViSNu
PuraaNa. A System of Hindu Mythology and Tradition Translated from the
Original Sanskrit and Illustrated by Notes Derived Chiefly from Other
PuraaNas_, was published in 1840, the first complete translation of a
PuraaNa into a European language. I assume it must be the translation
read by Emerson, as being the only one available in the philosopher's
lifetime.

   Paolo Magnone
   Catholic University of Milan
   p.magnone at agora.stm.it

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
On 23-Mag-95 Robin Kornman wrote:

> Re: the _Vi.s.nu Puraa.na_

>>This said, if you nevertheless want to tackle the PuraaNas, I would
>>recommend the ViSNu rather than the Matsya, as being probably the
>>least disappointing to the western layman in terms both of structure
>>and of contents in the whole range of PuraaNas. A very enjoyable
>>translation by H. H. Wilson is available in beautiful old-fashioned
>>English, with copious notes.

>You know what? Emerson cites this Puraa.na in his essay on Plato!!!
>I'm going to get H.H. Wilson's translation, but I would very much like
>to know which one Emerson read, as well.

..



 





From KHB12400 at niftyserve.or.jp  Tue May 23 16:08:00 1995
From: KHB12400 at niftyserve.or.jp (Yasuhiro Okazaki)
Date: Wed, 24 May 95 01:08:00 +0900
Subject: About CakrapaaNidatta
Message-ID: <161227019498.23782.7351398358522407593.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Members
I am interested in CakrapaaNidatta, who is one of the commentaters of 
Carakasamhitaa. I am not a specialist of AAyurvedic texts, but of VaizeSika. 
So
I have few information about CakrapaaNidatta. As far as my recognition, he
may preserve early or medival VaizeSika theory. I want to get more information
 
about him, his works, articles on him. If someone have such an
infromation, please teach me.
Best regards
Yasuhiro Okazaki
Yasuhiro Okazaki (khb12400 at niftyserve.or.jp)
 





From jdwhite at unccvm.uncc.edu  Wed May 24 17:44:24 1995
From: jdwhite at unccvm.uncc.edu (jdwhite at unccvm.uncc.edu)
Date: Wed, 24 May 95 13:44:24 -0400
Subject: Indian Archival Contacts?
Message-ID: <161227019506.23782.15225526843205484936.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I shall be in india later this summer to photograph some Sanskrit
manuscripts (with GOI permission).  Though several archival libraries have
responded over the past six months to my request to be allowed to photograph
these manuscripts, I have had no response from others.  If anyone on the
list knows of a particular contact for the following repositories, please
let me know at my email address above.

University of Madras Oriental Manuscript Library

Asiatic Society of Bombay

Scindia Oriental Institute, Ujjain

Sajjan Vani Vilas Library, Udaipur

I also would like to photograph some manuscripts which V. Raghavan's
catalogue says are in the Department of Archaeology at Jodhpur.  As I have
had no response from the Department of Archaeology, it is possible that
their manuscripts are now in another repository.  Does anyone have any
experience with these manuscripts?

Thanks!

 





From aklujkar at unixg.ubc.ca  Thu May 25 01:13:22 1995
From: aklujkar at unixg.ubc.ca (aklujkar at unixg.ubc.ca)
Date: Wed, 24 May 95 18:13:22 -0700
Subject: Suuta-sa.mhitaa
Message-ID: <161227019508.23782.8788390042525676106.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On 17 April 95, Andrew Fort inquired regarding the availability of the
Suuta-sa.mhitaa text. Helpful responses from R. Torella, J. Silk and D.
Wujastyk followed. Unable to attend to my e-mail then because of the
pressure of other work, I could read these postings only today. 

There is a very expertly produced edition of  Suuta-sa.mhitaa in my
personal collection. I bought it, I think in 1977, in an old book shop in
Madras. The edition in my view is a model of beautiful Devanaagarii type.
It also contains the Taatparya-diipikaa commentary mentioned by Dr.
Torella. In my copy the beginning and the end are slightly damaged and the
title pages are missing, but nothing of substance is lost. From the last
page, that is, p. 1066 (yes, the text is that extensive), it is evident
that the edition was printed at  'Srii-baala-manoramaa Press, Mailaapuur,
Madras. The type confirms this specification. Sanskrit texts produced by
the Shribalamanorama Press of Madras deserve the same recognition for
neatness in the history of Indology as the texts produced by the
Nirnaya-sagara Press of Bombay. 

Ashok Aklujkar

 





From pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU  Thu May 25 15:30:42 1995
From: pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU (pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU)
Date: Thu, 25 May 95 08:30:42 -0700
Subject: reference to Hindu Gods
Message-ID: <161227019514.23782.2367790778402074463.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

/ FROM:  Suresh Madhu <WPI.EDU!suresh at ucsd.UUCP>, May 25 14:56 1995
| ABOUT: reference to Hindu Gods
|
| 
| Hello,
| 
| I was given information that everyday of the week is linked to a
| particular Hindu God. Does anyone have more information regarding this
| reference? Does any such reference exist?
| 
| I would really appreciate it if someone could point me to sources for
| such information.
| 
| Thanks in advance,
| -Suresh
|  
|
\ END: Suresh Madhu


Namaste

ah, somewhere i have this info, not sure where at the moment.  as
i recall, its embedded in the source code for a program i wrote to
determine the kalas (time periods) for san diego local time.  the
kala periods re-occur, as i recall, on a weekly cycle exactly because
each day of the week is linked to a particular planet  (eg, rahu
kala is always bout noon on wednesday), and in turn, each planet
is linked to a hindu god, so that would give you the correspondence.
each planet is also representative of a chakra.  if no one else
comes up with it shortly, i'll dig it up for you.  or ask one of
my jotish friends.

aum
sadhu

oh, ps, aside from the planetary link, there may be other reasons,
differing with local customs.  for example, siva's day is monday
in the north, but friday in the south of india.
 





From RQ021RE%TCUAMUS.BITNET at cmsa.Berkeley.EDU  Thu May 25 14:13:26 1995
From: RQ021RE%TCUAMUS.BITNET at cmsa.Berkeley.EDU (Andrew Fort)
Date: Thu, 25 May 95 09:13:26 -0500
Subject: epic tellings
Message-ID: <161227019511.23782.15701048584079690762.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Just a note to those interested in a variety of epic
"versions" or "tellings": I teach a course called
"India: Texts and Traditions" which focuses on different
versions of the Raamaayana and Mahaabhaarata.  After
introducing "Hinduism," I start them off with Ed
Dimock et al.'s _The Literatures of India_, and
then use Buck's (cheap) MBh translation, Peter Brook's
video version (alerting them to some of its problems), then
Barbara Stoler Miller's Gita translation and the Amar
Citra Katha comic book telling of the Gita.  I also show
a short portion of the Hindi TV Mahabharata.  We then
turn to R. K. Narayan's Ramayana translation, and Paula
Richman's wonderful _Many Ramayanas_.  We close the epic
section with Phil Lutgendorf's great piece "Ramayan: the
Video" (The Drama Review or TDR 34:2 [summer, 1990]).
For those interested, the course then turns to poetry
and drama.  I use John Brough's Penguin _Poems from the
Sanskrit_ and some of Miller's _Theatre of Memory_.
The course ends with _Songs of Saints of India_ by Hawley
and Juergensmeyer, and parts of Gandhi's _Autobiography_.
I'd certainly be interested in hearing comments on
other tellings which have worked in the classroom.

Andrew O. Fort, Religion Dept.     A.FORT at TCU.EDU
Texas Christian University         Fort Worth TX 76129
 





From suresh at WPI.EDU  Thu May 25 13:25:42 1995
From: suresh at WPI.EDU (Suresh Madhu)
Date: Thu, 25 May 95 09:25:42 -0400
Subject: reference to Hindu Gods
Message-ID: <161227019509.23782.8093757904836388027.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


Hello,

I was given information that everyday of the week is linked to a particular Hindu God. Does anyone have more information regarding this reference? Does any such reference exist?

I would really appreciate it if someone could point me to sources for such information.

Thanks in advance,
-Suresh
 





From tart at iastate.edu  Thu May 25 15:26:04 1995
From: tart at iastate.edu (Gary M Tartakov)
Date: Thu, 25 May 95 10:26:04 -0500
Subject: stupa rituals
Message-ID: <161227019512.23782.11175579588751074808.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

At Sanchi this winter I noticed some pilgrims, probably Tibetans, doing
things, as they processed around the stupas, that I do not understand.
They went in groups and as they proceeded around some individuals seemed
to be picking out or leaving bits of sand, or I don't know what, from
between stones at iregular intervals.  

I am interested in the fact of going in groups as well as the touching /
picking activity.  I am also interested in the doing of repititive
prostrations that I witnessed here as well as in Bodh Gaya.

Can anyone tell me anything about this or lead me to literature on
rituals associated with stupa pradakshina?  

Gary Tartakov
 





From thrapp at helios.nosc.mil  Thu May 25 18:02:07 1995
From: thrapp at helios.nosc.mil (thrapp at helios.nosc.mil)
Date: Thu, 25 May 95 11:02:07 -0700
Subject: Mahabharata shloka
Message-ID: <161227019516.23782.11304027717878164489.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Indologists,

I would like to ask a grammar question about
a shloka from the Mahabharata.

satyasya vacana.m "sreya.h satyAdapi hita.m vadet |
yadbhUtahitamatya.mtametatsatya.m mata.m mama ||

In the second paada, satya appears in the ablative case.
Does this mean that "one should speak what is beneficial
*from* the set of things that are true" or is the ablative
for comparison as in "one should speak what is beneficial
rather *than* what is true"?

Thank you for any help you can provide.

-------------------------------------------------------------

Gary R. Thrapp
thrapp at nosc.mil
 





From vidya at cco.caltech.edu  Thu May 25 20:40:13 1995
From: vidya at cco.caltech.edu (vidya at cco.caltech.edu)
Date: Thu, 25 May 95 13:40:13 -0700
Subject: Mahabharata shloka
Message-ID: <161227019523.23782.13440099116624107192.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

> satyasya vacana.m "sreya.h satyAdapi hita.m vadet |
> yadbhUtahitamatya.mtametatsatya.m mata.m mama ||

To me the second pada means a comparison. One should speak what is 
beneficial rather than what is true. The second line seems to justify 
this by saying that what is most beneficial (atyanta.m hita.m) is 
true, in the opinion of the poet. Thus something "becomes" true by 
virtue of its being beneficial to bhUtAni, even if it were not 
rigorously true. 

Am I mistaken in this? 

S. Vidyasankar

 





From CJPOWERS at DESIRE.WRIGHT.EDU  Thu May 25 19:20:17 1995
From: CJPOWERS at DESIRE.WRIGHT.EDU (CJPOWERS at DESIRE.WRIGHT.EDU)
Date: Thu, 25 May 95 14:20:17 -0500
Subject: Stupas
Message-ID: <161227019518.23782.3826624324294431519.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

A few observations on Tibetan stupa practices: the most common practice 
is circumambulation, which Buddhists do in a clockwise direction, with 
their right shoulders toward the stupa. Bonpos go in the opposite 
direction. The use of prostrations is very common. It is generally done 
by way of making full-length prostration around a sacred site, and is 
considered to bring greater merit than just walking. Some Tibetans even 
make complete circuits around places like Mt. Kailash doing prostrations.

As for the picking described, I'm not sure what that is. I have seen 
Tibetan nomads making small offerings while circumambulating a stupa, but 
have not observed Tibetans picking up things while walking around a 
stupa. Does anyone else have an insights on this?

John Powers
Wright State University
cjpowers at desire.wright.edu
 





From asher at maroon.tc.umn.edu  Thu May 25 19:36:42 1995
From: asher at maroon.tc.umn.edu (Frederick M Asher)
Date: Thu, 25 May 95 14:36:42 -0500
Subject: Stupas
Message-ID: <161227019520.23782.12599885963057272234.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

My example doesn't come from a Buddhist tradition, and it may not be 
true, but I've been told in Rajgir that the magnficent stucco sculptures 
that adorned the Maniyar Math disappeared not when the were excavated and 
exposed to weather but when they were eaten pinch at a time by devotees 
who sought the power that ingesting them would bring.  Gary, did you see 
fingers heading toward the mouth?  Rick Asher

 





From ckw1 at columbia.edu  Thu May 25 19:56:38 1995
From: ckw1 at columbia.edu (Christian K. Wedemeyer)
Date: Thu, 25 May 95 15:56:38 -0400
Subject: Stupas
Message-ID: <161227019522.23782.3303248053957537076.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


	The Tibetan pilgrims were most probably "picking" things up at 
the stupa, not leaving them.  In 1990, I went on a day trip to Nalanda 
and Rajgir with a group of Tibetan pilgrims.  They also would stop every 
once in a while and pick up fragments of the bricks or soil from the 
premises of the holy sites.  This is one of the more unfortunate 
devotional acts common among Tibetans.  They are collecting pieces of 
sacred ground so that they may keep them as relics.  These may be placed 
on an altar and are very often encased in statues, stupas, or reliquary 
boxes (ga'u) for devotional reverence and its derivative good karma and 
protection.  
	You may also have noticed them touching their rosaries to
particularly sacred monuments at pilgrimage sites.  This is based on a 
similar regard for the power of holy sites (like Frazer's "sympathetic" 
or "contagious" magic).

 





From WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU  Fri May 26 02:13:46 1995
From: WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU (WITZEL at HUSC3.HARVARD.EDU)
Date: Thu, 25 May 95 22:13:46 -0400
Subject: address change/EJVS (fwd)
Message-ID: <161227019525.23782.16695739492765710380.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


---------- Forwarded message ----------

For those intersted in the new 
Electronic Journal of Vedic Studies 

          
The second issue is available on request and also available on WWW now, at 
Milano:


        http://www.arcadia.polimi.it /~ejvslist/ 
      = http://131.175.62.190/~ejvslist/


To simplify matters we have now shifted the whole operation to Milano.

The new address is:

              ejvs-list at arcadiax1.arcadia.polimi.it . 

If you have technical problems or if a prospective new member wants to 
register please write to:

              majordomo at arcadiax1.arcadia.polimi.it


For general information just send the message:    help
to  majordomo at arcadiax1.arcadia.polimi.it, and the machine will send you 
some standard information.

New subscribers should send the following message:

                     subscribe ejvs-list

to:         majordomo at arcadiax1.arcadia.polimi.it.

They will then receive a welcome message to show that they are subscribed.

I thank Dr. L. Magnocavallo for all of his assistance with regard to this 
change and for his designing and maintaining our homepages as well!


I will shut down EJVS-list at husc.harvard.edu  as of now. But for a while,  
EJVS-LIST at husc will send you error messages etc. if you attempt to  
contact the old address.

You can always reach me at my private address: witzel at husc3.harvard.edu 
for any questions.

Thanks for your interest!


Michael Witzel
Editor


 





From jnye at midway.uchicago.edu  Fri May 26 14:20:08 1995
From: jnye at midway.uchicago.edu (james nye)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 09:20:08 -0500
Subject: Suuta-sa.mhitaa
Message-ID: <161227019538.23782.2591253388714823168.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Ashok Aklujkar wrote:
> There is a very expertly produced edition of  Suuta-sa.mhitaa in my
> personal collection. .... From the last
> page, that is, p. 1066 (yes, the text is that extensive), it is evident
> that the edition was printed at  'Srii-baala-manoramaa Press, Mailaapuur,
> Madras. ....

This edition is available from the University of Chicago and Harvard.
The OCLC cataloging record follows.
James Nye

---------------------------------------------------------------------

    TITLE: Srimatsutasamhita : Tatparyadipikasahita.
    PLACE: Mylapore, Madras :
PUBLISHER: Sri Balamanorama Press,
     YEAR: 1932     
 PUB TYPE: Book
   FORMAT: 8, 1066 p. ; 22 cm.
   SERIES: Sri Balamanorama series ; no. 19.
    NOTES: In Sanskrit.
           Consists of Sivamahatmyakhanda, Jnanayogakhanda, Muktikhanda and 
           Yajnavaibhavakhanda.
           Microfilm. Cambridge, Mass. : Harvard University Library 
           Microreproduction Service, 1990. 1 microfilm reel : negative ; 35 
           mm.
ALT TITLE: Puranas. Skandapurana. Sutasamhita.
    OTHER: Madhava, d. 1386. Sutasamhitatatparyadipika.
 





From navrang at bev.net  Fri May 26 03:49:03 1995
From: navrang at bev.net (Manisha Singal)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 09:49:03 +0600
Subject: Internet-resources on Asian Studies - repeated query
Message-ID: <161227019535.23782.8791632029403835957.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Would you please send me a copy?  Thanks.

Manisha

At 11:06 AM 5/26/95 BST, you wrote:
>
>        Some of the recipients of this list might remember the posting I
>sent out some months ago - requesting information on Internet-related
>resources on Asian Studies in general, Tibetan and Buddhist Studies in
>particular. The background was to provide the participants in the 7th
>Seminar of the International Association of Tibetan Studies (IATS), which
>will take place from 17th-24th of June in Seggau/Austria with an initial
>directory of such resources, thereby not only documenting how the Internet
>can be of scholarly use, but also presenting a "snap-shot" of the state of
>the art. 
>
>        I received a lot of information and would like to thank all those
>who contributed. Second, for those who did not receive my original query, I
>would like to re-state it and call for further information (mailing-lists,
>ftp-sites for e-texts, software etc., Web-pages, e-mail-addresses for
>research institutions) on the subject. 
>
>        The document I have compiled so far comprises ca. 110 entries. I
>made use of already existing directories such as Dr. Matthew Ciolek's
>Buddhist Electronic Resource Directory (BERD), and his Tibetan Electronic
>Resource Guide (TERG), which I up-dated and checked, and added a number of
>resources which I personally deemed useful. Ultimately, the document shall
>be made available on-line, although at the present stage, it is not yet
>clear in which form. The idea is to somehow make it into an interactive
>database, which will be made accessible through a Web-page of the Institute
>for Indian Philosophy of Hiroshima University, which shall manifest itself
>in course of the summer. 
>
>        For the time being, if anybody is interested in an ASCII-file of the
>database, feel free to e-mail me, and I will send it (zipped and uuencoded). 
>
>        
>
>
>                
>Birgit Kellner
>Institute for Indian Philosophy
>University of Hiroshima
>
> 
>

 





From magier at columbia.edu  Fri May 26 13:50:10 1995
From: magier at columbia.edu (David Magier)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 09:50:10 -0400
Subject: Internet-resources on Asian Studies - repeated query
Message-ID: <161227019537.23782.17992047211146469339.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Further to your message:
you mentioned that you will be bringing this list online 'possibly as a
web page' via Hiroshima sometime this summer. Allow me to offer the
South Asia Gopher (and the "South Asia Gopher/Web") here at Columbia as
an alternative or mirror site, to reduce the load on the Hiroshima
server. (If the ftp archive of Prof. Tokunaga's Mahabharata files is
any indication, those of us in North America will find the Hiroshima
server a very slow link, perhaps too slow for us to use effectively for
a web page. So a North American mirror site might be a good idea). What
do you think of this proposal?
Thanks.
David Magier
"The South Asia Gopher"
magier at columbia.edu
 

Date: Fri, 26 May 1995 10:25:06 -0400 (EDT)
Date-warning: Date header was inserted by UNCWIL.EDU
From: wilsonj at UNCWIL.EDU (Joe Wilson)
Subject: Re: Internet-resources on Asian Studies - repeated query
X-Sender: wilsonj at vxa.ocis.uncwil.edu (Unverified)
To: indology at liverpool.ac.uk
Message-id: <v01520c0aabeb5871eb0a@[152.20.52.1]>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

=========== At 11:07 AM 5.26.95, Birgit Kellner wrote
> ... requesting information on Internet-related
>resources on Asian Studies in general, Tibetan and Buddhist Studies in
>particular. The background was to provide the participants in the 7th
>Seminar of the International Association of Tibetan Studies (IATS), which
>will take place from 17th-24th of June in Seggau/Austria ...

After I had communicated with Ms. Kellner privately in regard to her recent
posting, it occurred to me that there might be some utility in conveying
some of what I had said to the entire list.

The International Association of Buddhist Studies is in the process of
constructing a web site, to include links to sites such as the one
mentioned above in addition to others.  When that site goes online, I will
inform this list of its URL in hopes of receiving suggestions and
critiques.

Perhaps those of us who will be at the June IATS meeting could get together
at some point and talk about these matters.

[This will be cross-posted to Indology and Tibet-L.  Apologies in advance.]

Joe Wilson
Associate Professor of Philosophy and Religion
Treasurer, International Association of Buddhist Studies
Editor, Dharma Vajra Series on Himalayan Buddhist Studies
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Office: (910) 395-3410  |  Home: (910) 791-2250  |  Fax: (910) 350-7010
Department of Philosophy and Religion            |  wilsonj at uncwil.edu
University of North Carolina at Wilmington
Wilmington NC  28403-3297  U.S.A


 





From morpurgo at vax.ox.ac.uk  Fri May 26 10:25:26 1995
From: morpurgo at vax.ox.ac.uk (ANNA MORPURGO DAVIES)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 11:25:26 +0100
Subject: Next week
Message-ID: <161227019528.23782.15516238196455539274.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Sorry to bother you, but is there any way in which
I could avoid receiving things from Indology  while
I am away.? I am leaving now and coming back on June
17.   Thank you, Anna Morpurgo Davies
 





From G.Samuel1 at lancaster.ac.uk  Fri May 26 11:24:16 1995
From: G.Samuel1 at lancaster.ac.uk (Prof G Samuel)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 12:24:16 +0100
Subject: Internet-resources on Asian Studies - repeated query
Message-ID: <161227019533.23782.6650004733267423411.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Dr Kellner

Re the latest report on your database - I would appreciate a copy of the
ASCII file. I'm not sure if I can handle uuencoding etc - is plain ASCII
possible? 

Is this the same as the list of Tibetan etc material in electronic form
that you were asking for contributions to at an earlier stage?

Later in the year, I hope to have a www page for this department with
some local material and
links to resources on Asian religions etc elsewhere - will keep you
posted about developments.

Hope to see you shortly at the IATS conference.

Geoffrey Samuel
Department of Religious Studies
Lancaster University
Lancaster LA1 4YG, UK
fax 01524 847039
email G.Samuel1 at lancaster.ac.uk
 





From r.l.schmidt at easteur-orient.uio.no  Fri May 26 10:32:58 1995
From: r.l.schmidt at easteur-orient.uio.no (r.l.schmidt at easteur-orient.uio.no)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 12:32:58 +0200
Subject: Hindi-Urdu Appointment at NCSU/UNC-CH
Message-ID: <161227019530.23782.11991765509849124749.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Tony K. Stewart
Director, Triangle South Asia Consortium
Hindi-Urdu Languages and Literatures
Beginning 15 August 1995
Triangle South Asia Consortium
North Carolina State University
Raleigh, NC 27695-8101

Dear Dr. Stewart:

This letter is written in support of the application of Tehsin Siddiqi for
the position as Professor of the Practice in Hindi-Urdu Languages.

I worked with Tehsin at the University of Wisconsin in 1984, writing a book
of exercises and drills to accompany G.C. Narang's Readings in Literary
Urdu Prose.  I found Tehsin to be very knowledgeable, hardworking, and
cooperative.  In addition, he possesses an excellent working control of the
principles of second-language pedagogy, and is fully competent in both
Hindi and Urdu.

I have kept in touch with Tehsin since then, and have on a number of
occasions met students of his, both from the University of Wisconsin and
the University of Michigan.  They invariably praised his skill as a
teacher, and their own Urdu language skills demonstrated that he is
effective as well as appreciated.

I highly recommend him for this position.

Sincerely,

Ruth Laila Schmidt
Senior Lecturer in Urdu

P.S.  A hard copy of this recommendation will be sent by post.

Ruth Schmidt
Dept. of East European and Oriental Studies
University of Oslo
P.O.B. 1030 Blindern
N-0315 OSLO, Norway
Phone:  47-22-85-55-86 (office)
        47-22-85-67-78 (Dept.)
Fax:    47-22-85-41-40
Email:  r.l.schmidt at easteur-orient.uio.no  (OR: lailasc at hedda.uio.no) 



 





From r.l.schmidt at easteur-orient.uio.no  Fri May 26 10:36:52 1995
From: r.l.schmidt at easteur-orient.uio.no (r.l.schmidt at easteur-orient.uio.no)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 12:36:52 +0200
Subject: Hindi-Urdu Appointment at NCSU/UNC-CH
Message-ID: <161227019531.23782.3861593262411882316.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

DEAR INDOLOGY SUBSRIBERS:

The email I just sent was supposed to go to Tony Stewart, not to everyone.

I apologize most profusely to everyone concerned, especially to Dr. Stewart
and to Tehsin Siddiqi.

I am new to email use and it was a beginner's mistake.

Ruth Schmidt

 





From bprecia at colmex.mx  Fri May 26 18:53:12 1995
From: bprecia at colmex.mx (Benjamin Preciado Solis)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 12:53:12 -0600
Subject: Indian Archival Contacts?
Message-ID: <161227019542.23782.7920900962209088027.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Dr. White,

regarding your enquiry on Sanskrit Manuscripts at Jodhpur you should know 
that the whole collection of Sanskrit manuscripts is preserved at 
PURATATTWA VIBHAGA, located in front of Jodhpur University. You should 
write to the Director, Puratattwa Vibhaga, Jodhpur, Rajasthan. They have 
published several fascicles of a descriptive catalogue.

R.V. Joshi c/o B. Preciado 

On Wed, 24 May 1995, J. Daniel White wrote:

> I shall be in india later this summer to photograph some Sanskrit
> manuscripts (with GOI permission).  Though several archival libraries have
> responded over the past six months to my request to be allowed to photograph
> these manuscripts, I have had no response from others.  If anyone on the
> list knows of a particular contact for the following repositories, please
> let me know at my email address above.
> 
> University of Madras Oriental Manuscript Library
> 
> Asiatic Society of Bombay
> 
> Scindia Oriental Institute, Ujjain
> 
> Sajjan Vani Vilas Library, Udaipur
> 
> I also would like to photograph some manuscripts which V. Raghavan's
> catalogue says are in the Department of Archaeology at Jodhpur.  As I have
> had no response from the Department of Archaeology, it is possible that
> their manuscripts are now in another repository.  Does anyone have any
> experience with these manuscripts?
> 
> Thanks!
> 
>  
> 
 





From dbak at unixg.ubc.ca  Fri May 26 22:19:14 1995
From: dbak at unixg.ubc.ca (dbak at unixg.ubc.ca)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 15:19:14 -0700
Subject: Dravidians of Bharat vs Branch Dravidians
Message-ID: <161227019545.23782.2195484747481725460.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

What is the origin of the the Branch Dravidian group of Texas? Any relation
to the Dravidian people of India?







Bakul I. Dalal MD FRCPC FCAP
Division of Hematopathology, LSP1
Vancouver Hospital and Health Sciences Center,
910 West 10th Avenue,
Vancouver, BC, CANADA

 





From PNICHOLAS at worldbank.org  Fri May 26 20:25:00 1995
From: PNICHOLAS at worldbank.org (Peter Nicholas SA2CI 80420)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 15:25:00 -0500
Subject: Milarepa
Message-ID: <161227019540.23782.12668368175695711857.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

	I saw your message about Milarepa, and wondered if you knew if "The 
Hundred Thousand Songs of Milarepa, Volume One" was available anywhere outside 
of the US (it's no longer in print here).

	Thanks

	Peter Nicholas (pnicholas at worldbank.org)

 





From SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU  Fri May 26 23:41:04 1995
From: SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU (SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 17:41:04 -0600
Subject: Dravidians of Bharat vs Branch Dravidians
Message-ID: <161227019547.23782.8308872006349082955.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

 Branch *Davidian*, as in DAVID; no -r-

Jonathan Silk
SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU


 





From kellner at ue.ipc.hiroshima-u.ac.jp  Fri May 26 18:58:52 1995
From: kellner at ue.ipc.hiroshima-u.ac.jp (kellner at ue.ipc.hiroshima-u.ac.jp)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 18:58:52 +0000
Subject: Internet-resources on Asian Studies - repeated query
Message-ID: <161227019527.23782.14831605062015155710.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


        Some of the recipients of this list might remember the posting I
sent out some months ago - requesting information on Internet-related
resources on Asian Studies in general, Tibetan and Buddhist Studies in
particular. The background was to provide the participants in the 7th
Seminar of the International Association of Tibetan Studies (IATS), which
will take place from 17th-24th of June in Seggau/Austria with an initial
directory of such resources, thereby not only documenting how the Internet
can be of scholarly use, but also presenting a "snap-shot" of the state of
the art. 

        I received a lot of information and would like to thank all those
who contributed. Second, for those who did not receive my original query, I
would like to re-state it and call for further information (mailing-lists,
ftp-sites for e-texts, software etc., Web-pages, e-mail-addresses for
research institutions) on the subject. 

        The document I have compiled so far comprises ca. 110 entries. I
made use of already existing directories such as Dr. Matthew Ciolek's
Buddhist Electronic Resource Directory (BERD), and his Tibetan Electronic
Resource Guide (TERG), which I up-dated and checked, and added a number of
resources which I personally deemed useful. Ultimately, the document shall
be made available on-line, although at the present stage, it is not yet
clear in which form. The idea is to somehow make it into an interactive
database, which will be made accessible through a Web-page of the Institute
for Indian Philosophy of Hiroshima University, which shall manifest itself
in course of the summer. 

        For the time being, if anybody is interested in an ASCII-file of the
database, feel free to e-mail me, and I will send it (zipped and uuencoded). 

        


                
Birgit Kellner
Institute for Indian Philosophy
University of Hiroshima

 





From rwl at uts.cc.utexas.edu  Sat May 27 00:05:37 1995
From: rwl at uts.cc.utexas.edu (rwl at uts.cc.utexas.edu)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 19:05:37 -0500
Subject: Dravidians of Bharat vs Branch Dravidians
Message-ID: <161227019552.23782.4709442536453892600.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

No, Purushottam, I think the name comes from the practice of some older
elements in Texas society of a ritual activity involving drinking bourbon
and *branch* water (cf. the career of Sam Rayburn).  I'm pretty sure there
is no connection between that and any Hebrew traditions.  What I would like
to know relates to the place names--is there any connection between Waco
and the common English slang term "whacko".  I know that Baylor University
is located there, but that may bring us back to "oxymoron."  What do you
think?




>It's like asking, what is the conn ection between oxymoron and oxygen? It
>is Branch Dravid anyway, which is from Hebrew and not of any Dravidic or
>Indo-European stock as far as I can tell.
>
>On Fri, 26 May 1995, Bakul I. Dalal MD FRCPC FACP FASCP wrote:
>
>> What is the origin of the the Branch Dravidian group of Texas? Any relation
>> to the Dravidian people of India?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Bakul I. Dalal MD FRCPC FCAP
>> Division of Hematopathology, LSP1
>> Vancouver Hospital and Health Sciences Center,
>> 910 West 10th Avenue,
>> Vancouver, BC, CANADA
>>
>>
>>
>
>


 





From srice at cruzio.com  Sat May 27 03:07:19 1995
From: srice at cruzio.com (Stanley Rice)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 20:07:19 -0700
Subject: Internet-resources on Asian Studies - repeated query
Message-ID: <161227019560.23782.12786560435617599158.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Birgit,
I would be very intereted in getting copy of your database in its
present form. Thanks,
  Best wishes, Stan Rice


-- 
Stan Rice, Autospec Inc, srice at cruzio.com  



 





From magier at columbia.edu  Sat May 27 00:33:39 1995
From: magier at columbia.edu (David Magier)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 20:33:39 -0400
Subject: Dravidians of Bharat vs Branch Dravidians
Message-ID: <161227019553.23782.15874797554884386977.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

> What is the origin of the the Branch Dravidian group of Texas? Any relation
> to the Dravidian people of India?

Perhaps they are a branch of the (P.N.) oak?   ;-)
 





From breusch at students.wisc.edu  Sat May 27 01:35:52 1995
From: breusch at students.wisc.edu (breusch at students.wisc.edu)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 20:35:52 -0500
Subject: Ancient rivers
Message-ID: <161227019557.23782.1424115542181688394.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

In connection with my work on the Sarasvati River I'd like to know whether
there is any textual evidence from non-Vedic-related traditions for changes
in river courses motivated by the river's personal relationship with
certain people. Specifically, the ancient rivers I have in mind are: Amu
Darya (Oxus), Volga, Dniepr, Yang-tse-kiang (Chang Jiang), etc.
I'd appreciate any help in this regard.
Thank you very much.
Beatrice


Beatrice Reusch
breusch at students.wisc.edu
311 North Hancock # 111
Madison, WI 53703
608-256-6268 (voice & fax)


 





From patton at bard.edu  Sat May 27 02:44:16 1995
From: patton at bard.edu (Laurie Patton)
Date: Fri, 26 May 95 22:44:16 -0400
Subject: History of terms
Message-ID: <161227019558.23782.11924702637546112707.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Just for clarification:
The name "Davidian" was given to a break-away group of the Seventh Day 
Adventist church, led by a man in Victor Houteff.  In 1930, he wrote
"The Shepherd's Rod," a book that argued that the apocalypse would come 
after the reign of a king who was appointed by god, as David was in the 
Hebrew Bible. In 1938 he and his followers established Mt. Carmel in Waco.
Houteff believed himself to be a modern King David.
	The name "Branch" comes from a theological formulation by Ben 
Roden, leader of a splinter group of the Davidians that formed in 1959.
The new, expanded name was in part based on a prophecy of Ellen White, early 
leader of the 
Seventh Day Adventists, and in part on a passage from Zechariah (6.12-13), 
which 
declares that the man who builds the temple of lord shall be called the 
branch, and shall sit on the throne as the priest of god.

Ben Roden's widow, Lois, was involved with Vernon Howell, or David Koresh.

A far cry from Indology, but it's amazing what you have to teach (learn)
at liberal arts colleges in the USA.

Laurie L. Patton
Bard College
 





From kellner at ue.ipc.hiroshima-u.ac.jp  Sat May 27 05:53:16 1995
From: kellner at ue.ipc.hiroshima-u.ac.jp (kellner at ue.ipc.hiroshima-u.ac.jp)
Date: Sat, 27 May 95 05:53:16 +0000
Subject: Internet-resources on Asian Studies - repeated query
Message-ID: <161227019543.23782.4690900934667136460.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

>Further to your message:
>you mentioned that you will be bringing this list online 'possibly as a
>web page' via Hiroshima sometime this summer. Allow me to offer the
>South Asia Gopher (and the "South Asia Gopher/Web") here at Columbia as
>an alternative or mirror site, to reduce the load on the Hiroshima
>server. (If the ftp archive of Prof. Tokunaga's Mahabharata files is
>any indication, those of us in North America will find the Hiroshima
>server a very slow link, perhaps too slow for us to use effectively for
>a web page. So a North American mirror site might be a good idea). What
>do you think of this proposal?

 A great idea, indeed. (Although I myself have no speed problems with North
American Web-sites) I will come back to you once the Hiroshima-efforts have
yielded results.

Thanks a lot, 

Birgit Kellner
Institute for Indian Philosophy
University of Hiroshima

 





From pbilmo at deakin.edu.au  Fri May 26 23:25:32 1995
From: pbilmo at deakin.edu.au (purushottama bilimoria)
Date: Sat, 27 May 95 09:25:32 +1000
Subject: Dravidians of Bharat vs Branch Dravidians
Message-ID: <161227019548.23782.4307685798805494655.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



It's like asking, what is the conn ection between oxymoron and oxygen? It 
is Branch Dravid anyway, which is from Hebrew and not of any Dravidic or 
Indo-European stock as far as I can tell.

On Fri, 26 May 1995, Bakul I. Dalal MD FRCPC FACP FASCP wrote:

> What is the origin of the the Branch Dravidian group of Texas? Any relation
> to the Dravidian people of India?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Bakul I. Dalal MD FRCPC FCAP
> Division of Hematopathology, LSP1
> Vancouver Hospital and Health Sciences Center,
> 910 West 10th Avenue,
> Vancouver, BC, CANADA
> 
>  
> 

 





From pbilmo at deakin.edu.au  Fri May 26 23:29:40 1995
From: pbilmo at deakin.edu.au (purushottama bilimoria)
Date: Sat, 27 May 95 09:29:40 +1000
Subject: Sabbatical location
Message-ID: <161227019550.23782.18390838683917629866.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



I am presently in California (Los Angeles and ascending later to 
Berkeley). e-mail address is: pbilimor at lmumail.lmu.edu
Fax (310) 338 1947; tel (310) 338 2857; home (310) 641 5542.

I would love to darshan of my friends and colleagues in the area.
Cheers

Purushottama Bilimoria



 





From pdb1 at columbia.edu  Sat May 27 13:34:46 1995
From: pdb1 at columbia.edu (Peter D Banos)
Date: Sat, 27 May 95 09:34:46 -0400
Subject: Dravidians of Bharat vs Branch Dravidians
Message-ID: <161227019562.23782.2555658599885110830.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On Fri, 26 May 1995, Jonathan Silk wrote:

>  Branch *Davidian*, as in DAVID; no -r-

Actually when the first news about the Waco people came over the radio, I 
thought I heard "Dravidians." I said to myself, "Liberation Tigers of 
Texas Eelam?" 
						-Peter D. Banos
						pdb1 at columbia.edu
 





From pbilmo at deakin.edu.au  Sat May 27 00:54:53 1995
From: pbilmo at deakin.edu.au (purushottama bilimoria)
Date: Sat, 27 May 95 10:54:53 +1000
Subject: Dravidians of Bharat vs Branch Dravidians
Message-ID: <161227019555.23782.3679086176957231818.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



Thanks Richard, some students of mine had done a class paper after the 
incident and related the "origins" of the name Davidian in this way. 
Isn;'t David in any case a Hebraic name? I never thought of relating 
Branch to anything more than, say, Branch as in Division of IRS or INS. 

Australians don't know how to pronounce Waco so we kept hearing "whacko", 
though I doubt if there are related. Cheers



On Sat, 27 May 1995, Richard W. Lariviere wrote:

> No, Purushottam, I think the name comes from the practice of some older
> elements in Texas society of a ritual activity involving drinking bourbon
> and *branch* water (cf. the career of Sam Rayburn).  I'm pretty sure there
> is no connection between that and any Hebrew traditions.  What I would like
> to know relates to the place names--is there any connection between Waco
> and the common English slang term "whacko".  I know that Baylor University
> is located there, but that may bring us back to "oxymoron."  What do you
> think?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> >It's like asking, what is the conn ection between oxymoron and oxygen? It
> >is Branch Dravid anyway, which is from Hebrew and not of any Dravidic or
> >Indo-European stock as far as I can tell.
> >
> >On Fri, 26 May 1995, Bakul I. Dalal MD FRCPC FACP FASCP wrote:
> >
> >> What is the origin of the the Branch Dravidian group of Texas? Any relation
> >> to the Dravidian people of India?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Bakul I. Dalal MD FRCPC FCAP
> >> Division of Hematopathology, LSP1
> >> Vancouver Hospital and Health Sciences Center,
> >> 910 West 10th Avenue,
> >> Vancouver, BC, CANADA
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> 
> 
>  
> 

 





From tart at iastate.edu  Sat May 27 17:15:01 1995
From: tart at iastate.edu (Gary M Tartakov)
Date: Sat, 27 May 95 12:15:01 -0500
Subject: Dravidians of Bharat vs Branch Dravidians
Message-ID: <161227019564.23782.9749295042950503049.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


I think you have a spelling problem.  The Texas community is the Branch
Davadians. 
 





From bhasin at UMDNJ.EDU  Sat May 27 17:27:39 1995
From: bhasin at UMDNJ.EDU (pramit bhasin)
Date: Sat, 27 May 95 13:27:39 -0400
Subject: Hindi
Message-ID: <161227019565.23782.819155328059291042.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Namaste,

Could anyone be kind enough to post the origins ( time frame ) of the Hindi
language?

Just recently a friend of mine told me that spoken Hindi has been in
existance for only a 100 odd years or so, while I dont agree I have no
resources at my disposal to prove this otherwise.

Your input into this matter will be greatly appreciated.

Thank You

Sincerely

Pramit Bhasin
 





From mitra at aecom.yu.edu  Sat May 27 19:04:17 1995
From: mitra at aecom.yu.edu (Joydeep Mitra)
Date: Sat, 27 May 95 15:04:17 -0400
Subject: Hindi
Message-ID: <161227019567.23782.15269731154614620633.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Hindi originated from a combination of Persian, Urdu and Sanskrit during the 
Moghul rule in northern India.    -Joydeep Mitra.

On Sat, 27 May 1995, pramit bhasin wrote:

> Namaste,
> 
> Could anyone be kind enough to post the origins ( time frame ) of the Hindi
> language?
> 
> Just recently a friend of mine told me that spoken Hindi has been in
> existance for only a 100 odd years or so, while I dont agree I have no
> resources at my disposal to prove this otherwise.
> 
> Your input into this matter will be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Thank You
> 
> Sincerely
> 
> Pramit Bhasin


 





From Kalyans at aol.com  Sun May 28 05:58:55 1995
From: Kalyans at aol.com (Kalyans at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 28 May 95 01:58:55 -0400
Subject: South asian language computing
Message-ID: <161227019569.23782.10774989814059221933.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Recently published computing tool (1) for South Asian languages on CD-ROM may
be of interest to indologists:

(1). Fonts for Bengali, Cyrillic, Gujarati, Hindi, Kannada, Oriya, Malayalam,
Punjabi, Sinhala, Tamil, Telugu, Thai, Urdu, Vietnamese; these fonts
numbering over 1500 in a variety of typestyles work under any Windows word
processor/program which uses ANSI code.

(2). Comparative multi-language dictionary of 25+ South asian languages
(Forthcoming).

Contact: Scanrom Publications, POBox 72, Cedarhurst, NY 11516, USA. Tel.
516-295-2237; Fax. 516-295-2240; Compuserve 73769,1005
 





From malaiya at ravi.CS.ColoState.EDU  Sun May 28 17:27:41 1995
From: malaiya at ravi.CS.ColoState.EDU (malaiya at ravi.CS.ColoState.EDU)
Date: Sun, 28 May 95 11:27:41 -0600
Subject: origins (time frame) of Hindi
Message-ID: <161227019570.23782.137779559405791636.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Pramit Bhasin asked:
>Could anyone be kind enough to post the origins ( time frame ) of 
>the Hindi language?
>Just recently a friend of mine told me that spoken Hindi has been in
>existance for only a 100 odd years or so, while I dont agree I have no
>resources at my disposal to prove this otherwise.

Joydeep Mitra replied:
>Hindi originated from a combination of Persian, Urdu and Sanskrit during 
>the Moghul rule in northern India. 

It should be recognized that languages change slowly. Because the change 
is gradual, is is rather hard to say exactly when the language swithched
from being Apabhransha to Hindi. 

Remember that the standard Hindi (Khadi boli), as used in books, is
just a dialect of Hindi. The Khadi boli (Urdu/Hindi) is the dialect of the Delhi-
Meerut region.

The history of evolution of Hindi can be represented in this way:

Early Sanskrit
 |
Prakrits (6th cent BCE-4th cent AD)
 |
Apabhranshas (6th cent AD to 12th cent AD)
 |
Modern North Indian languages (12 cent AD- )

Note that composition in Prakrits and Apabhranshas continued after
they ceased to be spoken languages.

You can find 12-13th century works in a language that  can only be
called Hindi. However the transition from Apbhransha to Hindi is
gradual, thus you can go back further. The word "Hindi" (i.e. the 
language of Hind) was coined by Muslims in 13th century.

Bengali, Gujrati, Marathi similarly can be considered to have
come into existence around 10-13th cent. AD.

Note that Hindi (or Punjabi or Bengali) is not directly derived
from Sanskrit, but through Prakrit/Apabhransha chain. Many Persian
word have entered Hindi, but Persian (Farsi) did not affect the
evolution of the basic structure or the basic set of words. 

Urdu is basically the Delhi-Meerut dialect of Hindi, with liberal
usage of Persian and Arabic words.

Even elementary school children learn verses written by authors
several centuries ago, as part of Hindi. One would have to be truly
insulated from the ordinary Indians (perhaps grown up in an Anglicised
atmosphere, which now is the case for some) to claim that Hindi is
only 100 years old.

Resources to convince you frined? Many. Try a good encyclopaedia or 
look up some books on history of languages.

Yashwant K. Malaiya

 





From fp7 at columbia.edu  Mon May 29 14:27:51 1995
From: fp7 at columbia.edu (Frances Pritchett)
Date: Mon, 29 May 95 10:27:51 -0400
Subject: development of Hindi/Urdu
Message-ID: <161227019576.23782.2575675247627428269.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

On this topic a good general overview is C. Shackle and R. Snell, 
*Hindi and Urdu Since 1800:  A Common Reader* (London:  SOAS, 1990).  It 
has brief historical and linguistic accounts, followed by illustrative 
examples (with notes and glossaries).

The vocabulary problem is also considerable:  Hindii, Hindavii, Rextah 
are all old names that have at times been used for what we now would call 
Urdu.  KhaRii bolii suggests the grammar, Hindustani a modern spoken form 
of this grammar.  Sometimes "Bhaakhaa" and even "Braj Bhaakhaa" are used 
very confusingly by early sources to refer not just to the modern Braj 
but to, in effect, "the colloquial speech of North India."  Then of 
course there is "Dakhini."  "Gujri" and other occasional terms occur as 
well.  Then elements of this terminological mishmash are often used 
selectively to make arguments that are naive or tendentious or both...

Even modern uses of the terms "Hindi" and "Urdu" are often somewhat 
ambiguous:  do they refer only or chiefly to script differences, or do 
they also invoke vocabulary choices--which are shifting and subjective in 
extent and definition anyway?  In spoken language, is there any 
conceptual room left for a "Hindustani" middle ground?  What do we call 
the (spoken) language of the "Hindi film" industry?  So many "Hindi" film 
songs have been written by popular Urdu poets...

On the literary-historical side even more than the linguistic, we need to 
ask what a term like "Hindii" or "Bhaakhaa" in each particular instance 
is actually referring to.  And of course sometimes it's almost 
impossible to tell.  (So what else is new...?)

Wishing everyone a good summer,
Fran Pritchett
 





From l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no  Mon May 29 11:20:48 1995
From: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no (l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no)
Date: Mon, 29 May 95 13:20:48 +0200
Subject: origins (time frame) of Hindi
Message-ID: <161227019572.23782.14153146594763687184.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Development of Hindi:

>Remember that the standard Hindi (Khadi boli), as used in books, is
>just a dialect of Hindi. The Khadi boli (Urdu/Hindi) is the dialect of the
>Delhi->Meerut region.
>
>The history of evolution of Hindi can be represented in this way:
>
>Early Sanskrit
> |
>Prakrits (6th cent BCE-4th cent AD)
> |
>Apabhranshas (6th cent AD to 12th cent AD)
> |
>Modern North Indian languages (12 cent AD- )

The idea that Hindi originated a hundred years ago (actually I think 150
years ago) is related to the kha.r-i bol-i standard. Before that you had
literary dialects like avadh-i and braj with rich literatures, but these
dialects are somewhat different from the kha.r-i bol-i version. As is often
the case with Indic languages/dialects, we have a kind of definition
problem: What is a language and what is a dialect? The answer to this
question is, I think, often more political than linguistic, compare the
Scandinavian languages Norwegian, Swedish and Danish that are mutually
intelligible and could very well be regarded as dialects of the same
languages, but that for political reasons are treated as separate
languages.

Best regards,

Lars Martin Fosse



Lars Martin Fosse
Research Fellow
Department of East European
and Oriental Studies
P. O. Box 1030, Blindern
N-0315 OSLO Norway

Tel: +47 22 85 68 48
Fax: +47 22 85 41 40

E-mail: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no


 





From Gerard.Huet at inria.fr  Mon May 29 14:02:38 1995
From: Gerard.Huet at inria.fr (Gerard Huet)
Date: Mon, 29 May 95 16:02:38 +0200
Subject: reference to Hindu Gods
Message-ID: <161227019574.23782.17136546844091129016.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Re "I was given information that every day of the week is linked to a 
particular Hindu God. Does anyone have more information regarding this 
reference? Does any such reference exist?"

Every day of the week is traditionally assigned to a celestial body, i.e. the
sun, the moon, or a planet. I am not sure what is the exact origin of this 
tradition, but I suspect that it is not Indo-european, but originates in 
Babylonian astrology, where the 7-day week comes from.

Now, in Indian tradition, each of these celestial bodies is
assigned to a "regent" god. Those are called in sanskrit "graha",
from the root "grah", which means "to grab", from which derives
the latin "prehendo", the english "grab", the german "greifen", the french
"griffe" and "prehension". "Graha" is thus the action of grabbing, or
possession, or in a figurative sense a magical influence. There are 9 of them
in mythology, collectively known as "navagraha". The navagraha motif is well
known in traditional Hindu architecture - very often it appears as the 
decoration of the lintel of the entrance to the main sanctuary of a temple.
A most beautiful one may be seen for instance in Konarak.

The navagraha comprises the Sun "sUrya", the Moon "candra", 
Mars "a.ngAraka", Mercury "budha", Jupiter "b.rhaspati", 
Venus "'sukra", Saturn "'sani", and two demons responsible for eclipses,
called "rAhu" and "ketu". The latter two are two parts of an "asura" which
tried to fool Visnu into giving them the drink of immortality Soma, and thus
they do not qualify as "gods". The others are either major Vedic Gods,
such as sUrya and b.rhaspati, or minor deities such as 'sukra "The bright",
a son of the .r.si bh.rgu.

This explains the connexion between certain vedic deities and the days of
the week in sanskrit, whose term for day is "vAra". vAra is the substantive
form of the root "v.r", meaning to choose; thus a sanskit day is the 
(time of the week/location in the sky) chosen by a "grabber". These are:
sUryavAra - day of sUrya the Sun
somavAra - day of candra the Moon, also known as soma since the moon was
used as the mythic cup of the drink of immortality Soma
ma.ngalavAra - day of ma.ngala regent of Mars
budhavAra - day of budha regent of Mercury (not to be confused with Buddha)
guruvAra - day of the god b.rhaspati regent of Jupiter, also known
as "guru" since he was the teacher and religious leader of the gods
'sukravAra - day of 'sukra
and 'sanivAra - day of 'sani.

This connection is very close to the one we have in various languages:
Sun-day, Mo(o)n-day, Mar(s)-di, Merc(u)re-di, Ven(us)[dre]-di, Satur(n)-day.
Thursday comes I believe from the Nordic Thor, god of the storm among other
things, and thus linkable to Jupiter which gave its name to the french Jeudi.
Now Jupiter may be linked etymologically in an obvious way to Dyaus-pitar,
the old Sky-god of Vedic times, or mythologically to the king-god Indra
master of lightning, but I see no direct connection to b.rhaspati, chaplain
of the gods. It is amusing to remark that "guru", which means first "heavy",
is well-chosen for the heaviest of our planets, but I do not wish to venture
into vedic science.
 
All of the above is well-known and discussed at length in numerous 
knowledgeable sources, but the above digest should be enough to answer your
query.

Concerning Sadhunathan Nadesan's answer to your query, the fact that monday
is 'siva's day in the north of India may be explained from the fact that the 
Moon is one of the attributes of 'siva (he wears its crescent in his hair). 
I do not know what is his relationship with friday in the south - perhaps 
from the link between bh.rgu and agni?

Gerard Huet

 





From garzilli at husc.harvard.edu  Wed May 31 01:33:11 1995
From: garzilli at husc.harvard.edu (Enrica Garzilli)
Date: Tue, 30 May 95 21:33:11 -0400
Subject: electronic *INTERNATIONAL JOURNAL OF TANTRIC STUDIES*
Message-ID: <161227019578.23782.16914057944704352671.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



Friends and Colleagues,

This is to inform you of the new electronic INTERNATIONAL JOURNAL OF TANTRIC 
STUDIES.

Subscription is free and open to all. Articles, news etc. 
submitted to the journal are subject to review before publication.



                INTERNATIONAL JOURNAL OF TANTRIC STUDIES

   Editor-in-Chief: Enrica GARZILLI (Harvard University)
   Co-Editor: Michael WITZEL (Harvard University)
   Editorial Board: <exact composition to follow>
   
   e-mail: ijts-list at arcadiax1.arcadia.polimi.it
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   Technical Assistant: Ludovico MAGNOCAVALLO (Politecnico of Milan)
   
                       ---------------------------------

1) This journal is open to all *bona fide* scholars in Tantric Studies in 
Sanskrit. Particular attention is paid to the Trika schools of Kashmir.
2) It is monitored for style and content by the Editor-in-Chief.
3) There is copyright but with automatic permission to publish anywhere else 
later on when the author wishes to do so. Our aim is to disseminate our 
work quickly.
4) We include unpublished articles, abstracts, and news (such as on 
published books, on papers, conferences, meetings, events, 
Ph.D. projects, etc.)
5) We plan to publish once a year a hard copy of all the contributions 
to this Journal. It will be distributed under request. 

> The address for submissions is:
ijts-list at arcadiax1.arcadia.polimi.it

> To subscribe, send a message to:
ijts-list-request at arcadiax1.arcadia.polimi.it

 With this subject and/or content:
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                 Subscriptions are open from now, May 30, 1995.

> To get a list of the available commands send a message to:
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With this subject and/or content:
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> To get information on submissions and how to format them, 
send a message to: 
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Only with this subject:
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                   * Submissions are always welcome! *


Dott. Enrica Garzilli
garzilli at husc.harvard.edu

 

 





From garzilli at husc.harvard.edu  Wed May 31 02:12:08 1995
From: garzilli at husc.harvard.edu (Enrica Garzilli)
Date: Tue, 30 May 95 22:12:08 -0400
Subject: INTERNATIONAL JOURNAL OF TANTRIC STUDIES correction
Message-ID: <161227019580.23782.2543077700781059516.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>


Friends & Colleagues of the ijts are required to send submissions 
ONLY with the subject header:

subscribe (your-name)


Please do NOT write in the body of the msg!

For example:
subscribe (Joseph Green)

This is due to technical reasons.
Sorry for any inconvenience!

eg
 





From garzilli at husc.harvard.edu  Wed May 31 02:21:24 1995
From: garzilli at husc.harvard.edu (Enrica Garzilli)
Date: Tue, 30 May 95 22:21:24 -0400
Subject: ijts correction
Message-ID: <161227019582.23782.4012851881475201147.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



Subscriptions with the body of the msg are actually accepted...but a bit 
slower!
We are still monitoring the new software for the Journal.

All possible changes will NOT affect your subscriptions.

Thank you for your endless patience!

eg
 





From garzilli at husc.harvard.edu  Wed May 31 11:35:31 1995
From: garzilli at husc.harvard.edu (Enrica Garzilli)
Date: Wed, 31 May 95 07:35:31 -0400
Subject: To Ms. Kellner
Message-ID: <161227019586.23782.5286981643614228611.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Dear Birgit,
Sorry I lost your address (and 100 others!)...
Could you please tell me the locus of the WWW Index?
Thanks
enrica


 





From nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov  Wed May 31 12:47:36 1995
From: nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov (nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov)
Date: Wed, 31 May 95 07:47:36 -0500
Subject: Indira V. Peterson
Message-ID: <161227019590.23782.170907792474791265.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>



        Re: Indira V. Peterson
        ----------------------

Her e-mail address: ipeterso at mhc.mtholyoke.edu

She is writing a book on Bharavi's Kiratarjuniyam which will 
be published by SUNY press and also on Kuravanji, a tamil
literary genre. 

n. ganesan
nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov

 





From ISAACSON at let.rug.nl  Wed May 31 08:27:38 1995
From: ISAACSON at let.rug.nl (H. Isaacson)
Date: Wed, 31 May 95 09:27:38 +0100
Subject: I.V. Peterson's address
Message-ID: <161227019583.23782.6902361643065843462.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

I should be most grateful if someone could provide me with Indira V. 
Peterson's current postal or e-mail address.

Harunaga Isaacson
isaacson at let.rug.nl
 





From giuseppe at imiucca.csi.unimi.it  Wed May 31 10:12:46 1995
From: giuseppe at imiucca.csi.unimi.it (giuseppe at imiucca.csi.unimi.it)
Date: Wed, 31 May 95 10:12:46 +0000
Subject: Internet-resources on Asian Studies - ASCII Index
Message-ID: <161227019585.23782.7819012167793592070.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

 Dear dr. Kellner,

	I would be very obliged to you if you could mail me
	a copy of your Index. WWW is still hard to manage
	on modem-only servers, anyway.
	With my very best regards,

	Alex Passi

	giuseppe at imiucca.csi.unimi.it 
	passi at biblio.cineca.it
	
	(University of Bologna - 
	Istituto di Glottologia)
	

 





From Max.Nihom at oeaw.ac.at  Wed May 31 12:29:41 1995
From: Max.Nihom at oeaw.ac.at (Max.Nihom at oeaw.ac.at)
Date: Wed, 31 May 95 14:29:41 +0200
Subject: Address Dr. Hans Bakker
Message-ID: <161227019588.23782.3529934581121472476.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Would anyone know the E-mail address of Dr. Hans Bakker of the 
Rijksuniversiteit Groningen, The Netherlands?

Thank You,


Max Nihom
Nihom at oeaw.ac.at

 





From garzilli at husc.harvard.edu  Wed May 31 21:55:57 1995
From: garzilli at husc.harvard.edu (Enrica Garzilli)
Date: Wed, 31 May 95 17:55:57 -0400
Subject: ijts-list
Message-ID: <161227019593.23782.16102867897558792946.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io>

Due to technical problems with a new software new subscriptions have been 
refused. 
Now everything works fine. If you still have problems please 
write directly to me and I will subscribe you manually.

SOme addresses cannot be reached by our machine. We will tune the 
sendmail configuration in the next few days. We keep a log of them and we 
will subscribe them. They DO NOT need to do anything but trying to 
subscribe once.

Thank you for your patience.

eg