From pclaus at s1.csuhayward.edu Sat Oct 1 01:21:00 1994 From: pclaus at s1.csuhayward.edu (pclaus at s1.csuhayward.edu) Date: Sat, 01 Oct 94 09:21:00 +0800 Subject: statistical data Message-ID: <161227017477.23782.12546269889022221850.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The Census of India is now putting out all of its data on computer disk, too. Those who want the information on how to get these can email me directly. And there is the massive (and fascinating, as well as reasonably accurate) _People of India Project_ edited by K.S. Singh, done through the Anthropological Survey of India, and published (1992-) in 43 volumes, 72 parts available through such distributors as Vedams Books International (New Delhi). It would be great if this came out on disk. Although I have not seen the volumes (all to be completed by the end of 1994) reviews I have read (eg. India Today sometime in the Spring of 1993) all laud the quality and say that the material radically alters the stereotyped 'myths' about traditional communities and their customs, practices and beliefs. The entire series will cost about $2,000, making it easily affordable for university libraries in the US. From conlon at u.washington.edu Sat Oct 1 18:10:10 1994 From: conlon at u.washington.edu (Frank Conlon) Date: Sat, 01 Oct 94 11:10:10 -0700 Subject: Coimbatore district manual Message-ID: <161227017479.23782.6072224209694830077.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I'd check with the Ames Library of South Asia at the University of Minnesota--I seem to recall that they had a full setof the Madras Manuals except mayby South Kanara (which never actuallywas publiished. Also try Univ. of Wisconsin, and the Center for Research Libraries. Your local interlibrary loan specialist would be able to pursue this I should think. Frank Conlon On Sat, 1 Oct 1994, Ganesan wrote: > > Coimbatore District Manual > -------------------------- > > I want to borrow the following books through Interlibrary Loan > in USA. Does any library possess it? Or else I can pay for > the photocopy. Any pointers? Thanks. > > Frank A. Nicholson, Manual of the Coimbatore district, > Government press, Madras, 1887, 2 volumes. > > N. Ganesan > nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov > > From mweiss at camtwh.eric.on.ca Sat Oct 1 15:53:19 1994 From: mweiss at camtwh.eric.on.ca (mweiss at camtwh.eric.on.ca) Date: Sat, 01 Oct 94 11:53:19 -0400 Subject: Coimbatore district manual Message-ID: <161227017476.23782.2807370341814027879.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> > I want to borrow the following books through Interlibrary Loan > in USA. Does any library possess it? Or else I can pay for > the photocopy. Any pointers? Thanks. > > Frank A. Nicholson, Manual of the Coimbatore district, > Government press, Madras, 1887, 2 volumes. > > N. Ganesan > nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov > It is available on Microfiche from the Widener Library at Harvard: AUTHOR: Nicholson, Frederick Augustus, Sir, 1846-1936. TITLE: Manual of the Coimbatore district in the presidency of Madras [microform] / by F.A. Nicholson. PUB. INFO: Madras : Printed by R. Hill, at the Government Press, 1887. DESCRIPTION: xiii, 644 p. SUBJECTS: *S1 Coimbatore (India : District) LOCATION: Widener Microforms: Microfiche W 1972 Microfiche. Zug, Switzerland : Inter Documentation Co., [1982?]. 12 microfiches ; 9 x 13 cm. Microfiche Mitchell Weiss mweiss at camtwh.eric.on.ca From phil013 at csc.canterbury.ac.nz Sun Oct 2 21:38:01 1994 From: phil013 at csc.canterbury.ac.nz (phil013 at csc.canterbury.ac.nz) Date: Mon, 03 Oct 94 09:38:01 +1200 Subject: hello Message-ID: <161227017481.23782.7187437950214913728.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Nice to hear from you, Julia. How did you know I was in New Zealand? Love, Heidi Bo Sax Head of Religious Studies University of Canterbury Private Bag 4800 Christchurch-I New Zealand Tel. (03) 364-2230 FAX (03) 364-2007 e-mail: phil013 at csc.canterbury.ac.nz From jleslie%vigyan.ernet.in at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in Mon Oct 3 16:17:57 1994 From: jleslie%vigyan.ernet.in at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in (jleslie) Date: Mon, 03 Oct 94 11:17:57 -0500 Subject: Virashaivas Message-ID: <161227017483.23782.706899030048535638.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I am currently looking at the Virashaivas in Karnataka and would dearly like to know of anyone discussing the term "Protestant" in this context or in any related context. The term is used by Weber, and discussed more critically by Blake Michael in his book THE ORIGINS OF VIRASHAIVA SECTS. I am particularly interested in the changes that took place, and evidence for those changes, in the centuries after Basavanna. Any help would be most appreciated. Julia -- Dr I. Julia Leslie, Sen. Lect. SOAS, London. email: jleslie at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in (until May 1995). NB: Don't just hit "R"eturn to answer email from me. There is a glitch in my outgoing email headers. Type in the above address (or alias it), or use my UK address . Phone/FAX: +91-80-6633884 (phone before faxing) Currently on sabbatical leave in Bangalore. Original-Received: from ellis.uchicago.edu by midway.uchicago.edu for indology at liverpool.ac.uk Mon, 3 Oct 94 15:32:46 CDT PP-warning: Illegal Received field on preceding line Date: Mon, 3 Oct 94 15:28:49 CDT From: james nye To: indology at liverpool.ac.uk Subject: Re: statistical data In-Reply-To: Your message of Sat, 1 Oct 1994 01:26:09 BST Message-Id: One reliable (if not absolutely comprehensive) source of latitude and longitude information for the South Asian subcontinent is the Gazetteer series by the United States Board on Geographic Names. These have the appearance of a listing printed by computer, but I have not been able to find information on availability of the machine- readable files. The publisher in Washington has varied over time, including: United States Department of the Interior, Division of Geography and the United States Defense Mapping Agency, Topographic Center. Titles and dates of the most recent editions are: India : official standard names approved by the United States Board on Geographic Names. 1952. [Contains separate sections on Bhutan, Nepal, French India, Portuguese India, Jammu and Kashmir, and India.] Gazetteer of Sri Lanka : names approved by the United States Board on Geographic Names. 3rd ed. 1993. Gazetteer of Pakistan : names approved by the United States Board on Geographic Names. 3rd ed. 1983. Bangladesh : official standard names. 1976. > > 1. Names of towns and cities in India with their longitudes and > > latitudes. > > I too would be very interested in discovering such a database, of the > same type as the Geographic Names Server at University of Michigan > (which unfortunately only covers North America). Please let me know if > you find anything of this sort. > .... > > David Magier From dom%vigyan.ernet.in at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in Tue Oct 4 01:48:26 1994 From: dom%vigyan.ernet.in at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in (dom) Date: Mon, 03 Oct 94 20:48:26 -0500 Subject: Plague Message-ID: <161227017484.23782.16349901486811251140.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I thought I might share with you a few reflections on what it is like here in India with the plague epidemic going on. I am in South India, in Bangalore, so the outbreak in Surat seemed very far away indeed. Of course the disease spread with fleeing people, and there are now positive diagnoses in several other cities. I think there have been two (or just one?) deaths in Karnataka, and no other positive diagnoses as far as I know. Most of what I know is from three national papers I read: The Indian Express, The Hindu, and the Deccan Herald. The Express makes for more exciting and hysterical reading, whereas the Hindu seems to be more mature and balanced. But none of them are doing anything much in depth. One of the overwhelming impressions is how very nasty the reaction of foreign countries has been, in particular the Gulf states. The immediate and total ban on all travel, now extended even to mail, was a real slap in the face for India, and all those thousands of families who work part of the time in the Gulf. Personal friends of mine were on a plane for the UAE that taxied out for takeoff at Bombay, and was the first plane turned back when the ban came into force. They lost a lot of money, and were not even accommodated by the airline that night in Bombay. The ignominy was almost the worst of it. The other thing that everyone is saying is, of course, that this is a terrible indightment of the government. That people are losing their lives in 1994 to a medieval disease like this -- nearly half a century after the discovery of penicillin -- is unforgivable. This is squarely a matter of public hygiene and civic sanitation, and is a graphic example of how dangerous it is to ignore infrastructure issues. There was a curious report buried in a middle paragraph last Friday, saying that all schools and cinemas in Delhi had been closed. Then today there was a report saying that the schools were all opening again. Evidently, people in authority are unsure of what level of response is appropriate. There are processions in some towns carrying Mariamma through the streets (actually she is being called "Plagueamma"), which again seems a throwback to 18th and 19th century diarists accounts of smallpox outbreaks. In Bangalore, there are teams of people assembling roadside rubbish into piles for collection, but I didn't see any trucks to take it away. Perhaps they were coming, but one wonders if the sanitation department actually knows how to clean up a city, or has the means to do it. Although it is terrible for any of the people directly affected, the numbers are still rather small, and at present it looks as though the thing will burn itself out in the next few weeks. Almost all reported suspected cases turn out not to be plague; almost all "ratfalls" (new word for me, meaning dead rat in the street) turn out to be caused by old age, or whatever rats usually die of. To sum up, from the perspective of Bangalore it is all still (luckily) very much something that is happening elsewhere. Dominik -- Dr Dominik Wujastyk Phone: +91-80-843-5320 12/1 Meghalaya, +91-80-843-5249 Vajarahalli, Phone/FAX: +91-80-663-3884 (not auto: phone first) Kanakapura Road, email: ucgadkw at ucl.ac.uk (UK) and Bangalore 560 062 dom at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in (INDIA) -- Currently on sabbatical leave from the Wellcome Institute, London. From Peter_Scharf at brown.edu Tue Oct 4 05:49:13 1994 From: Peter_Scharf at brown.edu (Peter_Scharf at brown.edu) Date: Mon, 03 Oct 94 22:49:13 -0700 Subject: Modern Indian History Message-ID: <161227017488.23782.11954263211609564039.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Thank you for the responses to our request for information regarding specialists in Moder Indian History and International Relations involving South Asia. Let me clarify something regarding our message which read as follows: "The South Asia Faculty Committee at Brown University seeks information regarding specialists in Modern Indian History and International Relations involving South Asia interested in teaching the subject at the Assistant Professor level. The committee may seek further information from respondents. Specialists in this field are requested to please send a current curriculum vitae to arrive before the last week of October to: ... Those knowing specialists who may not access this network are requested to pass on this request for information or to e-mail information about qualified specialists an how to contact them to me. Thank you." The South Asia Faculty Committee does not have a position; it does not forsee having a position; it is not a search committee nor a department; it is not posting a job announcement, nor is it requesting applications. The members of this committee are seeking information for internal purposes. "What internal purposes?" you might ask. Let's say we would like to become well informed so that we can make an informed suggestion to other offices at Brown. I do hope this doesn't dampen the enthusiastic response we have received so far. We have the best interests of the discipline at heart. Please do continue to send us appropriate curriculum vitae. Send the curricula vitae to Dr. Peter M. Scharf Department of the History of Mathematics Brown University PO Box 1900 Providence, RI 02912 Alternatively, they may e-mail the same to me. Sincerely, Peter M. Scharf Peter_Scharf at brown.edu From S0192556 at cos.aubg.bg Tue Oct 4 01:24:24 1994 From: S0192556 at cos.aubg.bg (Mircea-Radu Luchianov) Date: Tue, 04 Oct 94 01:24:24 +0000 Subject: Atharva-Veda Message-ID: <161227017486.23782.239101147102846417.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Hello, I am a student at the American University in Bulgaria, researching for a project in comparative mythologies. Does anyone know how I can find a translation (English or French) of Atharva-Veda (or parts of it)? We have access to Internet sources, but I doubt it's on-line. All suggestions welcome. Please reply to my address and not on the list, since I am not subscribed. Thanks in advance and afterwards, Radu Luchianov From Jayant.B.BAPAT at sci.monash.edu.au Tue Oct 4 15:25:39 1994 From: Jayant.B.BAPAT at sci.monash.edu.au (Bapat Jb) Date: Tue, 04 Oct 94 15:25:39 +0000 Subject: Plague Message-ID: <161227017490.23782.16979526324098440621.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Thanks for the information ____________________________________________________________________ Dr J.B. Bapat Phone (03)9054510 Chemistry Department Fax (03)9054597 Monash University e-mail:jayant.b.bapat at sci.monash.edu.au Clayton, Victoria Australia --------------------------------------------------------------------- _ From Jayant.B.BAPAT at sci.monash.edu.au Tue Oct 4 16:38:55 1994 From: Jayant.B.BAPAT at sci.monash.edu.au (Bapat Jb) Date: Tue, 04 Oct 94 16:38:55 +0000 Subject: addresses of Mark Tatz and Noburu Karashima Message-ID: <161227017493.23782.14189122737459665774.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I need to contact Mark Tatz from Canada and Noboru Karashima (of course from Japan) rather urgently. Can anyone help me with their addresses please? Jayant Bapat Jayant.b.bapat at sci.monash.edu.au ____________________________________________________________________ Dr J.B. Bapat Phone (03)9054510 Chemistry Department Fax (03)9054597 Monash University e-mail:jayant.b.bapat at sci.monash.edu.au Clayton, Victoria Australia --------------------------------------------------------------------- _ >?From THRASHER at MAIL.LOC.GOV 04 1994 Oct GMT 09:19:09 Date: 04 Oct 1994 09:19:09 GMT From: ALLEN W THRASHER Subject: MARK TATZ'S ADDRESS According to the Association for Asian Studies Membership Directory, 1990, Mark Tatz's address is or was: 765 Ashbury Ct. San Francisco, CA 94117 off. 415-753-6100 res. 415-658-5173 Allen Thrasher Southern Asia Section Library of Congress thrasher at mail.loc.gov From yanom at ksuvx0.kyoto-su.ac.jp Tue Oct 4 22:53:27 1994 From: yanom at ksuvx0.kyoto-su.ac.jp (yanom at ksuvx0.kyoto-su.ac.jp) Date: Wed, 05 Oct 94 07:53:27 +0900 Subject: addresses of Mark Tatz and Noburu Karashima Message-ID: <161227017495.23782.10553225040837627690.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Prof. Karashima's (home) address is 3-3-38 Jyomyoji, Kamakura, Kanagawa-ken, 248 JAPAN Michio YANO From dom%vigyan.ernet.in at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in Wed Oct 5 15:11:26 1994 From: dom%vigyan.ernet.in at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in (dom) Date: Wed, 05 Oct 94 10:11:26 -0500 Subject: ITRANS for Indic text processing Message-ID: <161227017496.23782.13302843236960262010.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I have recently been in touch with Avinash Chopde about his ITRANS package. This is a set of programs for producing Indian script output from transliterated input. It supports several scripts, and integrates with TeX. You don't have to use TeX, though, and there is a formatter included which outputs PostScript directly. The new development is that Avinash will shortly be adding CS encoding as a supported input coding scheme. Avinash has included some Sanskrit texts with ITRANS, and these are mostly texts that are not (yet) on the INDOLOGY listserv. Also, Avinash has linked ITRANS to a WWW server, so one can actually view Sanskrit texts across the Internet, as long as you have Mosaic and a Postscript previewer like GhostScript (both hefty programs, but available free). Here are some extracts from our recent exchanges: =================================================================== Avinash says: Don't know if I told you this, but there are also some documents in ITRANS availabe through Mosaic. Soem 15--20 Sanskrit docs, and some 1000 Hindi Film Songs! If/when you have Mosaic access to WWW, it is possible to see the docs in the input transliterated form, and in the devenagari script (using a PostScript viewer). The site is: http://chandra.astro.indiana.edu/isongs ==== Avinash Chopde | (508) 640 3138 | Avid Technology, Inc. avinash at acm.org | avinash at avid.com | Tewksbury, Massachusetts, USA =================================================================== avid.com!achopde says: From: avid.com!achopde To: D.Wujastyk at ucl.ac.uk (Dominik Wujastyk) Subject: WWW site. >Avinash, may I forward your message about Sanskrit texts and WWW/Mosaic >to the INDOLOGY group? I'm sure nobody there knows about this. Yup, you should also point out that even though they could use ITRANS right now, it will be better to wait four months when CS encoding is built-in into ITRANS... Since they will probably be interested in Sanskrit only, here is a list of files available in the Sanskrit directory: FILE CONTENT ------------ ----------------------------------------------------- aatmasha.s aatmashhaTak.h atharva.s shrii gaNapatyatharvashiirshha bhagvad.itx shriimad.h bhagavad.h giita bhagveng.tex Bhagavadgita:The Song Celestial, English text: Sir Edwin Arnold bhajans.s Various Hindi and Sanskrit Bhajans chaaleng.tex Hanuman Chalisa, English Translation chaalisa.s shrii hanumaan chaaliisaa dkavach.s Devi kavach ganesha.s shriigaNeshastotra navagrah.s shriinavagrahastotra rraksha.s shriiraamarakshaastotra shloka.s Few common shlokas used for recitation smaanasa.s shivamaanasapuujaa surya.s Few shlokas and mantras used during Yoga/suuryanamaskaar viveka.s vivekachuDaamaNi vsahasr.s shriivishhNusahasranaama ---------------------------------------------------------------------- If users have Mosaic installed with GhostScript (a PostScript viewer), they can view these documents in ASCII (ITRANS Transliteration), or Devanagari (using Frans Velthuis's font). FTP info: | ITRANS Song Book | ---------------- | | Files: | isongs*.tar.gz: Archive contains ITRANS Song Book | | (All archives are in UNIX tar format, compressed using GNU Zip.) | | For specific file names, browse the given directories at the FTP sites. | | FTP the ITRANS Song Book from: | | Anonymous FTP site (USA): chandra.astro.indiana.edu (129.79.160.69) | Directory: /pub/isongs/ | | Anonymous FTP site (FINLAND): ftp.funet.fi | Directory: /pub/culture/music/indian/isongs/ | | For a quick look, using Mosaic (or Lynx) check out: | World-Wide-Web HTTP URL: | http://chandra.astro.indiana.edu/isongs ==== Avinash Chopde | (508) 640 3138 | Avid Technology, Inc. avinash at acm.org | avinash at avid.com | Tewksbury, Massachusetts, USA -- Dominik From nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov Wed Oct 5 15:23:57 1994 From: nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov (nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov) Date: Wed, 05 Oct 94 10:23:57 -0500 Subject: A. Vadivelu's book (1915) Message-ID: <161227017504.23782.13382450365340407931.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> A. Vadivelu's book (1915) --------------------------- I am looking for a book on South Indian biography. I have seen it in India about 20 years ago. Does any US library possess it? I want to borrow this as an interlibrary loan or a xerox copy. Thanks for any pointers, N. Ganesan nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov ******************************************************************* A. Vadivelu, The ruling chiefs, nobles and Zamindars of India, Madras: G. C. Loganathan 1915 ******************************************************************* >?From THRASHER at MAIL.LOC.GOV 05 1994 Oct GMT 11:36:11 Date: 05 Oct 1994 11:36:11 GMT From: ALLEN W THRASHER Subject: DAVID SHULMAN'S ADDRESS The address of David Shulman is: Hebrew University Jerusalem, Israel off. tel. 972-2-883 678 res. tel. 972-2-662 635 Allen Thrasher From kichenas at s5.math.umn.edu Wed Oct 5 15:26:20 1994 From: kichenas at s5.math.umn.edu (Satyanad Kichenassamy) Date: Wed, 05 Oct 94 10:26:20 -0500 Subject: ITRANS for Indic text processing Message-ID: <161227017502.23782.183456132062973828.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Regarding D. Wujastyk's information: From: dom (Dr.Dominik Wujastyk) To: Members of the list Subject: ITRANS for Indic text processing From: avid.com!achopde To: D.Wujastyk at ucl.ac.uk (Dominik Wujastyk) Subject: WWW site. [...] >Avinash, may I forward your message about Sanskrit texts and WWW/Mosaic >to the INDOLOGY group? I'm sure nobody there knows about this. Yup, you should also point out that even though they could use ITRANS right now, it will be better to wait four months when CS encoding is built-in into ITRANS... Since they will probably be interested in Sanskrit only, here is a list ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ [...] -- Dominik I am sure many people would like to know what else is available. I have seen ITRANS output for Tamil, and have been told about the Bengali version. It would be nice to maintain databases of important texts in this format or another, in the spirit of what has been done in the University of Koeln. Satyanad Kichenassamy School of Mathematics University of Minnesota kichenas at math.umn.edu From nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov Wed Oct 5 15:33:22 1994 From: nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov (nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov) Date: Wed, 05 Oct 94 10:33:22 -0500 Subject: Dr. D. Shulman Message-ID: <161227017505.23782.4444288667317526467.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I have another e-mail address for Dr. David Shulman shulman at coma.huji.ac.il N. Ganesan From magier at columbia.edu Wed Oct 5 17:52:42 1994 From: magier at columbia.edu (David Magier) Date: Wed, 05 Oct 94 13:52:42 -0400 Subject: [David Magier : 5/95 Workshop on the Tamil Epic Manimekalai] Message-ID: <161227017507.23782.2619486925556089015.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Below are two event announcements for your information, forwarded from the CONFERENCES listing in The South Asia Gopher. Please contact event organizers (not me) for more information on these events. David Magier (magier at columbia.edu) The South Asia Gopher URL: gopher://gopher.cc.columbia.edu:71/11/clioplus/scholarly/SouthAsia --------------- 1) 5-Oct David Magier 5/95 Workshop on the Tamil Epi (1546 chars) 2) 5-Oct David Magier 5/95 Rural and Urban Environme (2193 chars) Message 1 -- ********************* Received: from aloha.cc.columbia.edu by mailhub.cc.columbia.edu with SMTP id AA13611 (5.65c+CU/IDA-1.4.4/HLK for ); Wed, 5 Oct 1994 13:45:36 -0400 Received: by aloha.cc.columbia.edu id AA10166 (5.65c+CU/IDA-1.4.4/HLK for magier); Wed, 5 Oct 1994 13:45:35 -0400 Date: Wed, 5 Oct 1994 13:45:35 -0400 From: David Magier Message-Id: <199410051745.AA10166 at aloha.cc.columbia.edu> Subject: 5/95 Workshop on the Tamil Epic Manimekalai Apparently-To: magier at columbia.edu Workshop on the Tamil Epic Manimekalai 18-22 May, 1995 Sunnersta Manor, Uppsala, Sweden CALL FOR PAPERS Scholars are invited to present a paper on the Tamil epic Manimekalai by Cattanar. The purpose of this workshop is to solve some fundamental problems regarding the authorship of the epic, the dating of the epic, the type of Buddhism and the genre of literature it represents, its geography, its translations from Sanskrit and Prakrit into Tamil, its prosody, its historical background, its religious concepts, its language from different aspects, etc. Among the scholars invited can be mentioned: R. Nagaswamy, R. E. Asher, Paula Richman, A. Veluppillai and David Shulman. The organiser is the Department for the History of Religions, Uppsala University. For more information about the workshop kindly write to Professor Peter Schalk: fax +46 18 241786, email Tamil.Studies at relhist.uu.se Mail address: Professor Peter Schalk Department for the History of Religions Box 1604 S-751 46 Uppsala, Sweden. Message 2 -- ********************* Received: from aloha.cc.columbia.edu by mailhub.cc.columbia.edu with SMTP id AA13641 (5.65c+CU/IDA-1.4.4/HLK for ); Wed, 5 Oct 1994 13:45:44 -0400 Received: by aloha.cc.columbia.edu id AA10181 (5.65c+CU/IDA-1.4.4/HLK for magier); Wed, 5 Oct 1994 13:45:43 -0400 Date: Wed, 5 Oct 1994 13:45:43 -0400 From: David Magier Message-Id: <199410051745.AA10181 at aloha.cc.columbia.edu> Subject: 5/95 Rural and Urban Environments in South Asia Apparently-To: magier at columbia.edu RURAL AND URBAN ENVIRONMENTS IN SOUTH ASIA Conference in Oslo, Norway 18-22 May 1995 (NASA: Nordic Association for South Asian Studies) The conference will provide a forum for discussion of social, cultural and material dimensions of "the environment". It will have themes contemplating natural and the human-made environments, the sustainable and unsustainable practices of villagers, industries, and government departments, as well as local, trans-local and international patterns of co-operation and conflict characterizing environmental issues in South Asia. MAJOR THEMES: 1. Too little: Farming and Pastoralism in Arid Zones 2. Too much: Farming, Fishing and Flooding in Wet Areas 3. Urban Fields: Industry, Pollution, and Slum 4. Political Ecology. The conference organizers have decided to combine Nordic and North American models in organizing this conference. This means that we plan participation through panels. Conference organizers and participants will cooperate to inject sub-themes relating to specific interests into the main themes. Any group of two or more paper-presenting participants may define a sub-theme by contacting the organizers in advance of the conference. For more information, please contact: Chair, Pamela Price Department of History University of Oslo Blindern Pb. 1008 N-0315 Oslo, NORWAY tel: 47 22 85 68 77 (office) 47 22 69 23 68 (res) fax: 47 22 85 48 28 email: pamela.price at iks.uio.no OR Secretary, Lars Martin Fosse Center for Eastern European and Oriental Studies University of Oslo Blindern Pb. 1030 0315 Oslo, NORWAY tel: 47 22 85 68 48 (office) fax: 47 22 85 41 40 email: fosse at hedda.uio.no From D.Smith at lancaster.ac.uk Wed Oct 5 13:48:52 1994 From: D.Smith at lancaster.ac.uk (Dr D Smith) Date: Wed, 05 Oct 94 14:48:52 +0100 Subject: e-mail address for David Shulman? Message-ID: <161227017498.23782.9281947007408433831.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> David Smith Dept of Religious Studies Lancaster University Lancs LA1 4YG UK From ami01 at rs1.rrz.Uni-Koeln.DE Wed Oct 5 14:28:10 1994 From: ami01 at rs1.rrz.Uni-Koeln.DE (Thomas Malten) Date: Wed, 05 Oct 94 15:28:10 +0100 Subject: e-mail address for David Shulman? Message-ID: <161227017500.23782.166889451956207172.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> hzusd at hujivm1.bitnet -Thomas Malten ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Institute of Indology and Tamil Studies, Pohligstr.1, 50969 Koeln, Germany Tel 0221/4705340 Fax 0221/4705151 email ami01 at rrz.uni-koeln.de ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no Wed Oct 5 09:31:29 1994 From: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no (l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no) Date: Wed, 05 Oct 94 19:31:29 +1000 Subject: ITRANS for Indic text processing Message-ID: <161227017509.23782.13540791019197611358.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Where can we obtain ITRANS? Is it for the Macintosh and/or for the IBM compatible PC? Regards, Lars Martin Fosse Lars Martin Fosse Department of East European and Oriental Studies P. O. Box 1030, Blindern N-0315 OSLO Norway Tel: +47 22 85 68 48 Fax: +47 22 85 41 40 E-mail: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no >?From THRASHER at MAIL.LOC.GOV 05 1994 Oct GMT 15:00:15 Date: 05 Oct 1994 15:00:15 GMT From: ALLEN W THRASHER Subject: VADIVELU BOOK Re: Vadivelu, A., Ruling chiefs, nobles, and zamindars of India. A search on RLIN shows that New York University has a copy (RLIN no. lsp94-278) The same author has the two vol. work The aristocracy of southern India, Madras, s.n., 1903- and reprinted Delhi : Mittal Publications, 1984 (LCCN 84-900896). Allen W. Thrasher Senior Reference Librarian Southern Asia Section Library of Congress Washington, DC 20540-4744 tel. (202) 707-5600 fax (202) 707-1724 Internet: thrasher at mail.loc.gov Any opinions expressed are mine and not those of the Library of Congress or its management. From vineet at bocaraton.ibm.com Thu Oct 6 14:33:16 1994 From: vineet at bocaraton.ibm.com (vineet at bocaraton.ibm.com) Date: Thu, 06 Oct 94 10:33:16 -0400 Subject: Info needed on Lexa Message-ID: <161227017514.23782.13714151322645708494.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Hello, I am looking for information on a program called "lexa". I was told by someone it has something for Sanskrit. He has no other details nor do I. If anyone has the details, I would appreciate if you can post to the group or directly to me. Thanks, Bye, Vineet ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Vineet Jain TELE/TIE : (407) 443-7635 IBM (Dept 1A4A) FAX : (407) 982-6403 Internal Zip 5114 INTERNET : vinet at gator.bocaraton.ibm.com 1000 NW 51st Street IBMMAIL : USIB5WKZ Boca Raton, FL 33431 VM email : vineet at bcrvmpc2 United States of America IBM email : vineet at hobbie.bocaraton.ibm.com The views expressed are mine and are not that of IBM or anybody else. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >???From THRASHER at MAIL.LOC.GOV 06 1994 Oct GMT 10:45:10 Date: 06 Oct 1994 10:45:10 GMT From: ALLEN W THRASHER Subject: PRINTING HIST. CONF. Scholars of the history of printing and of Asian American history may be interested in the following conference announcement: From @uga.cc.uga.edu:owner-sharp-l at IUBVM.UCS.INDIANA.EDU Wed Oct Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by rs8.loc.gov (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4. id AA21368; Wed, 5 Oct 1994 10:59:32 -0400 Message-Id: <9410051459.AA21368 at rs8.loc.gov> Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2 with BSMTP id 4821; Wed, 05 Oct 94 11:00:09 EDT Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV at UGA) by UGA.CC Date: Wed, 5 Oct 1994 08:17:09 CST Reply-To: "SHARP-L Society for the History of Authorship, Sender: "SHARP-L Society for the History of Authorship, From: James DANKY Subject: Print Culture Conference X-To: sharp-l at iubvm.bitnet To: Multiple recipients of list SHARP-L Status: RO THE CENTER FOR THE HISTORY OF P IN MODERN AMERICA a joint project of The State Historical Society University of Wis of Wisconsin Is Proud to Announce A Conference: PRINT CULTURE IN A DIVERSE AMERICA To be held in Madison, May 5-6, 1995 This conference will assess readers and their texts in the "other ers which illuminate the books, newspapers, periodicals, etc., pr l and ethnic minorities, women, political radicals, sexual minori since 1876 will be the focus. We welcome both case studies of s eriences and those that compare the historical sociology of print f a number of groups too often placed on the periphery of power. ourages the interdisciplinary study of print culture history and rs from all appropriate fields. The directors and advisory board number of papers for the Center's initial book publication in 199 Proposals for individual papers or entire sessions (up to 3 paper d by December 1, 1994. For information contact: Wayne A. Wiegand ky, Co-Directors Center for the Hi Culture in Modern University of Wis 4217 Helen C. Whi 600 North Park St Madison, WI 53706 (608) 264-6598 FAX (608) 263-484 James.Danky at mail. From Jayant.B.BAPAT at sci.monash.edu.au Thu Oct 6 10:58:38 1994 From: Jayant.B.BAPAT at sci.monash.edu.au (Bapat Jb) Date: Thu, 06 Oct 94 10:58:38 +0000 Subject: address of Mark Tatz Message-ID: <161227017511.23782.784293834873092144.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I think someone kindly sent me the address of Mark Tatz from Canada which I wiped out by mistake before copying it. Could you please send it again? Jayant Bapat ____________________________________________________________________ Dr J.B. Bapat Phone (03)9054510 Chemistry Department Fax (03)9054597 Monash University e-mail:jayant.b.bapat at sci.monash.edu.au Clayton, Victoria Australia --------------------------------------------------------------------- _ From I.Dawes at latrobe.edu.au Thu Oct 6 05:01:40 1994 From: I.Dawes at latrobe.edu.au (I.Dawes at latrobe.edu.au) Date: Thu, 06 Oct 94 15:01:40 +1000 Subject: conference - Australia Message-ID: <161227017512.23782.8809392198854068355.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Apologies for cross-postings RELIGIOUS/CULTURE NATIONALISM AND FUNDAMENTALISM IN SOUTH ASIA AND SOUTHEAST ASIA A conference co-hosted by Faculty of Arts, Deakin University, Monash Asia Institute, National Centre for South Asian Studies, Asian Law Centre University of Melbourne. The conference will explore the recent fracturing of established societiesinto disparate communal and fervently religious or cultural groupings - an issue that comes out of the wider discourse of 'fundamentalism'. Significantly, the papers presented will examine the relationship between religious/cultural self-assertion and emergent nationalism or claims to ethnic-based nation-state particularities, generally against the challenges of globisation in the region. Critique of fundamentalism as a socio-cultural phenomenon, its historical and philosophical roots, and the interface of society and state and their implications for secularism, minority rights and the democratic process will be examined. There will be a comparitive focus on South Asia and South-East Asia. Issues related to the broad theme of Western responses to the phenomenon of fundamentalism against the horizon of Orientalism will also be addressed. Date: Friday 21 October - Saturday 22 October 1994 Venue: Toorak Campus, Deakin University, Melbourne, Australia. Costs: 2 days $Aus 95 (Concession $50) 1 day $Aus 50 (Concession $20) For further information, please contact: Dr Purushottama Bilimoria Conference Convenor Ph. 61 3 272688 or Ph. 61 3 2445250 Fax 61 3 244 5454 Email pbilmo at deakin.edu.au ----------------------------------------------------------- Ian Dawes Information Officer National Centre for South Asian Studies 4th floor, 20 Queen St Melbourne, 3000 Victoria, Australia ph. + 61 3 629 1844 Fax +61 3 629 1001 e-mail: ncsas at latrobe.edu.au or I.Dawes at latrobe.edu.au From l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no Thu Oct 6 06:37:11 1994 From: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no (l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no) Date: Thu, 06 Oct 94 16:37:11 +1000 Subject: Info needed on Lexa Message-ID: <161227017515.23782.4261561112250558136.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> >Hello, > I am looking for information on a program called "lexa". I >was told by someone it has something for Sanskrit. Vineet, I have used Lexa extensively when working with Sanskrit. But the program is not adapted to Sanskrit. It is basically constructed for modern European languages,something which is reflected in the fact that you cannot define your own alphabet or sort order (you have a choice between five European sort orders). You can, however, define letters indirectly by *not* defining certain characters as word separators. I use the Tuebingen-Zuerich transliteration format, and this enables me to tag Sanskrit with Lexas tagger and do other things as well. If you want to sort Sanskrit in the correct manner, you should use the Oxford Concordancing Program, which gives full freedom to define your own characters and sort orders. OCP will produce all sorts of concordances and word counts. With the limitation given above, Lexa is a very useful, but somewhat capricious (if not to say difficult) program written by Raymond Hickey. It has a large number of very useful utilities and is available at a very reasonable price (about NOK 700,-) from Humanistisk Datasenter, Norwegian Computing Centre for the Humanities, Harald H}rfagres gt. 31, 5007 Bergen, Norway. (Tel: +47 55 21 29 54; fax: +47 55 32 26 56; email icame at hd.uib.no). (Lexa is freeware, the money is for the three manuals, which are absolutely necessary). Best regards, Lars Martin Lars Martin Fosse Department of East European and Oriental Studies P. O. Box 1030, Blindern N-0315 OSLO Norway Tel: +47 22 85 68 48 Fax: +47 22 85 41 40 E-mail: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no From geichle at eis.calstate.edu Sun Oct 9 17:08:35 1994 From: geichle at eis.calstate.edu (Greg Eichler) Date: Sun, 09 Oct 94 10:08:35 -0700 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017519.23782.11127590939924655873.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Indologists, I am an absolute novice in this area. Therefore, I can ask the following question without oo much embarassment: Why do some Indians object to Sanskrit's being named the official language of India? Is it not 'better' than English, which is a totally alien tongue on the Subcontinent? I appreciate your replies. Gregor ___________________________________________________________________ Gregor-Paul Eichler | geichle at eis.calstate.edu Chair - Foreign Languages | geichle at sierra.fwl.edu George Washington High School | 72143.3621 at compuserve.com 600 Thirty-Second Avenue | (415) 750 - 8400, ext. 3317 San Francisco, CA 94121 | (415) 861 - 2379 [home] ___________________________________________________________________ On Sun, 9 Oct 1994, dom wrote: > Like the boy who cried "wolf", I doubt if I will be believed now, but > here it is anyway: > > > > > > > The Hindu, Bangalore, October 7th, 1994 > ======================================= > > Make Sanskrit elective, SC tells CBSE > > >From Our Legal Correspondent > New Delhi, Oct 6. > > The Supreme Court has directed the Central Board of Secondary Education to > include Sanskrit as an elective subject in the syllabus so far as teaching > in secondary schools is concerned. Necessary amendment in the syllabus shll > be made "within of three months." > > Mr. Justice B. L. Hansaria, who delivered the judgment, noted that "in view > of the importance of Sanskrit in nurturing our cultural heritage, because of > which even the official education policy has highlighted the need to study > Sanskrit, making of Sanskrit alone as an elective subject -- while not > conceding this status to Arabic and/or Persian -- would not in any way > militate against the basic tenet of secularism." > > A Bench, which in cluded Mr. Justice Kuldip Singh, held that there was thus > "no merit" in the objection raised by the CBSE that if it (CBSE) were to > include Sanskrit as "an elective subject," it would have to make facilities > available for learning of Arabic and Persian -- these also being classical > languages. > > The two other objections raised by the CBSE -- inclusion of French and > German also in the syllabus and of language like "Lepcha" -- did "not > deserve any consideration for obvious reasons." > > The Bench adverted to the importance of Sanskrit and its role in national > ethos and cultural heritage as highlighted in the roport of the Sanskrit > Commission (1957) and also in the broad framework of the Education Policy > formulated by the Centre in 1968 and 1986. > > There was "no doubt" that "teaching of Sanskrit alone as an elective subject > can in no way be regarded as against secularism." The constitution requires > giving a fillip to Sanskrit because of what has been stated in Article 351, > in which while dealing with the duty of the Union to promote the spread of > Hindi, it had been provided that it would draw, whenever necessary or > desirable, for its vocabulary, primarily on Sanskrit. Encouragement to > Sanskrit is also necessary because of it being one of the languages included > in the Eighth Schedule. > > The bench was allowing a group of connected writ petitions seeking a > direction to the CBSE to include Sanskrit in the syllabus of the Board as an > elective subject in secondary schools. > > > > > -- > Dr Dominik Wujastyk Phone: +91-80-843-5320 > 12/1 Meghalaya, +91-80-843-5249 > Vajarahalli, Phone/FAX: +91-80-663-3884 (not auto: phone first) > Kanakapura Road, email: ucgadkw at ucl.ac.uk (UK) and > Bangalore 560 062 dom at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in (INDIA) > -- > Currently on sabbatical leave from the Wellcome Institute, London. > > > From msweet at facstaff.wisc.edu Sun Oct 9 17:14:37 1994 From: msweet at facstaff.wisc.edu (Michael J. Sweet) Date: Sun, 09 Oct 94 11:14:37 -0600 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017523.23782.7790211042567146855.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> In Message Sun, 9 Oct 1994 21:19:13 BST, Aditya Mishra writes: > Relation of Sanskrit to the modern day languages is like Latin >to Italian. Sanskrit is essentially a dead language and the only country >that has revived a dead language is Israel to make it an official >language but Israel is a theocratic state with only one religion. Needless to say, none of these statements is true. Sanskrit has a continuous living tradition, and remains a spoken language among pandits and others. Hebrew also remained a living language of scholarship and religion, and was revived as an everyday language by *secular* Zionists--religious Jews opposed this profane use of the holy tongue. Israel is a democratic state with equal rights for Islam, Christianity, and other non-Jewish religions; it is no more a "theocracy" than India. Michael Sweet Michael Sweet University of Wisconsin--Madison msweet at facstaff.wisc.edu From z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us Sun Oct 9 19:20:49 1994 From: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us (Aditya Mishra) Date: Sun, 09 Oct 94 15:20:49 -0400 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017521.23782.10277437011758726336.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> It is not a matter of one language being superior to other. As a matter of fact, a majority of Indians i.e. Hindus worship Sanskrit since Vedas are written in this language. BUT, and big BUT, not all are Hindus and India is a secular country. I myself learned Sanskrit in Jr. HS as an optional subject. I was motivated in that direction partly because I am Brahmin and am supposed to read Sanskrit for rituals. Even Hindus do not want to learn Sanskrit since it an extra burden in the curriculum. Relation of Sanskrit to the modern day languages is like Latin to Italian. Sanskrit is essentially a dead language and the only country that has revived a dead language is Israel to make it an official language but Israel is a theocratic state with only one religion. Even catholic church has to give Latin mass eventually and catholics are no less religious on that account. As a matter of fact even the language contemplated and de jure official language i.e. Hindi is resisted by a great many Hindus, and de facto official language continues to be English despite all the political fervor by the leading opposition parties. The public schools teach Hindi but any Indian who can afford sends his children to private English medium schools and English medium schooling has become one of the most profitable industry in India. It is these schools that Dominick has written about. Aditya Mishra Phone/FAX 305-746-0442 (Please leave message) email: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us PRODIGY: TVDS96A From dom%vigyan.ernet.in at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in Mon Oct 10 02:23:51 1994 From: dom%vigyan.ernet.in at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in (dom) Date: Sun, 09 Oct 94 21:23:51 -0500 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017517.23782.6512673960787146267.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Like the boy who cried "wolf", I doubt if I will be believed now, but here it is anyway: The Hindu, Bangalore, October 7th, 1994 ======================================= Make Sanskrit elective, SC tells CBSE >From Our Legal Correspondent New Delhi, Oct 6. The Supreme Court has directed the Central Board of Secondary Education to include Sanskrit as an elective subject in the syllabus so far as teaching in secondary schools is concerned. Necessary amendment in the syllabus shll be made "within of three months." Mr. Justice B. L. Hansaria, who delivered the judgment, noted that "in view of the importance of Sanskrit in nurturing our cultural heritage, because of which even the official education policy has highlighted the need to study Sanskrit, making of Sanskrit alone as an elective subject -- while not conceding this status to Arabic and/or Persian -- would not in any way militate against the basic tenet of secularism." A Bench, which in cluded Mr. Justice Kuldip Singh, held that there was thus "no merit" in the objection raised by the CBSE that if it (CBSE) were to include Sanskrit as "an elective subject," it would have to make facilities available for learning of Arabic and Persian -- these also being classical languages. The two other objections raised by the CBSE -- inclusion of French and German also in the syllabus and of language like "Lepcha" -- did "not deserve any consideration for obvious reasons." The Bench adverted to the importance of Sanskrit and its role in national ethos and cultural heritage as highlighted in the roport of the Sanskrit Commission (1957) and also in the broad framework of the Education Policy formulated by the Centre in 1968 and 1986. There was "no doubt" that "teaching of Sanskrit alone as an elective subject can in no way be regarded as against secularism." The constitution requires giving a fillip to Sanskrit because of what has been stated in Article 351, in which while dealing with the duty of the Union to promote the spread of Hindi, it had been provided that it would draw, whenever necessary or desirable, for its vocabulary, primarily on Sanskrit. Encouragement to Sanskrit is also necessary because of it being one of the languages included in the Eighth Schedule. The bench was allowing a group of connected writ petitions seeking a direction to the CBSE to include Sanskrit in the syllabus of the Board as an elective subject in secondary schools. -- Dr Dominik Wujastyk Phone: +91-80-843-5320 12/1 Meghalaya, +91-80-843-5249 Vajarahalli, Phone/FAX: +91-80-663-3884 (not auto: phone first) Kanakapura Road, email: ucgadkw at ucl.ac.uk (UK) and Bangalore 560 062 dom at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in (INDIA) -- Currently on sabbatical leave from the Wellcome Institute, London. From pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU Mon Oct 10 17:44:21 1994 From: pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU (pslvax!sadhu at UCSD.EDU) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 94 10:44:21 -0700 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017528.23782.1450375879615531307.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> / FROM: "Michael J. Sweet" , Oct 10 17:42 1994 | ABOUT: RE: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools | | ...Sanskrit has a | continuous living tradition, and remains a spoken language among pandits and | others. | Michael Sweet | Right! There are some mutts (monasteries) in India where Sanskrit is spoken exclusively. The priest at the Livermore, Calif. Hindu temple was trained at such a mutt. -Sadhunathan From z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us Mon Oct 10 17:24:39 1994 From: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us (The Skeptic) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 94 13:24:39 -0400 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017526.23782.9679648294390296687.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> On Mon, 10 Oct 1994, Michael J. Sweet wrote: > In Message Sun, 9 Oct 1994 21:19:13 BST, > Aditya Mishra writes: > > > Relation of Sanskrit to the modern day languages is like Latin > >to Italian. Sanskrit is essentially a dead language and the only country > >that has revived a dead language is Israel to make it an official > >language but Israel is a theocratic state with only one religion. > Needless to say, none of these statements is true. Sanskrit has a > continuous living tradition, and remains a spoken language among pandits and As I pointed out in my note it is like Latin. I am not talking of living TRADITION , I am talking about living languages. It not a spoken languages even among Pandits in India. Hebrew was also a dead language which was superseded by Yiddish and other native language until the Israeli government decided to revive it. I did not mean any offense to those who speak Hebrew now. > others. Hebrew also remained a living language of scholarship and religion, > and was revived as an everyday language by *secular* Zionists--religious You repeated my word: REVIVED > Jews opposed this profane use of the holy tongue. Israel is a democratic > state with equal rights for Islam, Christianity, and other non-Jewish > religions; it is no more a "theocracy" than India. How can other religionists have equal rights in Israel when any and only Jews who are citizens of any country can automatically become citizen of Israel but Muslims living in the same political territory are denied rights of citizenship. Israel as much a theocracy as vatican, UK or Pakistan etc all of which have a state supported religion. India does not have any state supported religion as yet but if BJP came to power then it may change. From JSHARMA at Hermes.GC.PeachNet.EDU Mon Oct 10 14:24:49 1994 From: JSHARMA at Hermes.GC.PeachNet.EDU (J.B. Sharma) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 94 14:24:49 +0000 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017530.23782.18363124181579505637.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I am not clear from Dominik's note if the scope of this curricular change is for Karnataka only. When I was a high school student in the state of Uttar Pradesh (U.P.) in the 70's , all students had a rigorous component of Sanskrit as a part of study of Hindi literature. I am certain that this is still the case in U.P. In fact news was broadcast in Sanskrit on one of All India Radio channels in Lucknow at that time. Our Sanskrit teacher would give homework assignments pertaining to translating the news from Sanskrit to Hindi. Sanskrit is very much a living language in India as I know several folks who can read write and speak in Sanskrit quite fluently, even though they are not formal scholars of the language. However, it is not a living language in a sense of being a lingua franca of the masses. From SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU Mon Oct 10 20:33:36 1994 From: SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU (SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 94 14:33:36 -0600 Subject: Politics and my two cents Message-ID: <161227017533.23782.6445234751926899426.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> We just (seem to have) finished a highly contentious discussion of politics in Indian studies. This was at least marginally connected with Indology, and might, perhaps, maybe, in some way shape or form, have had a place on this list. But I BEG you, let us not make this a forum for debating the politics of Israel!!! I am sure there are more than enough places appropriate to that sort of discourse. This is not one of them. In the spirit in which Indology is intended (as I understand it), I am posting separately a list of questions concerning classical Indology, regarding which I ask the help of specialists. Jonathan Silk SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU From magier at columbia.edu Mon Oct 10 18:46:21 1994 From: magier at columbia.edu (David Magier) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 94 14:46:21 -0400 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017531.23782.1504256289897276477.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> > Aditya Mishra writes: > > > Relation of Sanskrit to the modern day languages is like Latin > >to Italian. Sanskrit is essentially a dead language... > Needless to say, none of these statements is true. Sanskrit has a > continuous living tradition, and remains a spoken language among pandits and > others... I suspect that the original posting was employing the technical linguistics usage of the term 'dead language', which is used to refer to a language which no longer has any native speakers. (A native speaker of a particular language is someone who speaks that language as their first or 'mother' tongue.). Of course, no such definitions are completely airtight, but Sanskrit is generally understood to be a dead language in this sense (as Latin is), although it is certainly still very much 'alive' in the perhaps more common sense of being used and studied and spoken by many people. But I doubt there are many people anywhere in the world (even pandits) who spoke Sanskrit as their first language in the home for all their daily-life uses of language, census claims to the contrary notwithstanding. David Magier From z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us Mon Oct 10 20:11:52 1994 From: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us (The Skeptic) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 94 16:11:52 -0400 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017537.23782.670037986496428463.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Big Deal! One swallow does not make a summer. What are you trying to prove? Aditya Mishra Phone/FAX 305-746-0442 (Please leave message) email: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us PRODIGY: TVDS96A On Mon, 10 Oct 1994, Sadhunathan Nadesan wrote: > Right! There are some mutts (monasteries) in India where > Sanskrit is spoken exclusively. The priest at the Livermore, > Calif. Hindu temple was trained at such a mutt. > > -Sadhunathan > > From sunder at crystal.cirrus.com Mon Oct 10 21:23:49 1994 From: sunder at crystal.cirrus.com (Srinivas Sunder) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 94 16:23:49 -0500 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017542.23782.8966646611919882645.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> In response to Shree J. Sharma: The CBSE (Central Board of Secondary Education) is one of the 2 or 3 nationwide educational boards; as I understand it, CBSE is a part of the Ministry of Education (Human Resources?), and various schools all over the country can seek affiliation from it. As such, a directive from the Supreme Court to CBSE to include Skt. as an elective in Secondary school is a nationwide directive, not one that pertains to Karnataka only. All Kendriya Vidyalayas (KVs) as well as Central schools, and a good number of private schools all over the country are affiliated to the CBSE. The other national board is the ICSE - which is, I believe, the old Cambridge system with a new name. In addition, of course, you have the various state-level boards, run by the Education Ministries of the various states. I am sure that all CBSE schools do not use only English as the medium of instruction; some also use Hindi - this I know from the fact that our question-papers in the CBSE Board exams used to have the questions in both English and Hindi. Beats me what the fuss (esp. on this list) is all about. First of all, it must be the higher-secondary level (grades 11 and 12) that this order must pertain to; Sanskrit is already available as a core subject (2nd language) at the secondary level (10th grade) in CBSE; and many CBSE schools also offer it as a third language between the 6th and 8th grades. The effect of this SC ruling is only to force CBSE to offer it as a subject at grades 11 and 12 too. The fact that it is an elective means that it is not being forced on all CBSE students; CBSE only has to arrange for schools that request it as an elective to be provided with a syllabus, list of textbooks, qualifications for teachers, question papers for board exams and so on. Schools that then include it as an elective will offer its higher secondary students a choice between Skt. or some other subject as the 5th subject at the 11th and 12th grades, in addition to their 4 core subjects. CBSE's objection that it would also have to offer Persian and Arabic if Skt. were made an elective, is to say the least, frivolous. Persian and Arabic are not available at the 10th grade level in CBSE schools; Skt. has been, for at least 10 years now. This debate over Skt. being an unsecular language has obviously been over at CBSE for some time now. The objections raised by them now are only a reflection of the polarization, along religious lines, of India's polity. Srinivas PS: AS far as I know, AIR still has a Skt. broadcast every morning. PPS: To answer yetanudder question: Part of the reason there is so much animosity to Skt. in India is the identification of Skt. with the upper-castes (read Brahmins and "Brahminists"). This is esp. true in TN, where animosity to symbols of Brahminism (and some would say, Brahmins too) is high. There is almost as much animosity to Hindi (perhaps more). The result? English has pride of place, second to only Tamizh as the language that is emphasized the most in schools affiliated to the State Boards in TN. Foreign, yes. But not a symbol of the "bl___y Hindi-speakers" or the "snooty Brahmins." From dran at cs.albany.edu Mon Oct 10 20:38:16 1994 From: dran at cs.albany.edu (Paliath Narendran) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 94 16:38:16 -0400 Subject: Soundaryalahari Message-ID: <161227017538.23782.3878929532165647095.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I am interested in recent research/scholarship on the Soundaryalahari. Has the authorship of this poem been determined? What are the theories? I have heard that the traditional attribution of this work to Sankara is not accepted any more by scholars. Some seem to attribute it to one mUka kavi. Who is this person? Any pointers to literature will be appreciated. Narendran From z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us Mon Oct 10 21:12:58 1994 From: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us (The Skeptic) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 94 17:12:58 -0400 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017540.23782.11796645596704312459.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> On Mon, 10 Oct 1994, David Magier wrote: > and studied and spoken by many people. But I doubt there are many > people anywhere in the world (even pandits) who spoke Sanskrit as > their first language in the home for all their daily-life uses of > language, census claims to the contrary notwithstanding. That goes to prove another of my point that language is more a politics than usage. I was raised in culture which worships Sanskrit but does not speak it. The same was true for Hindi in Panjab where many people who spoke Panjabi claimed Hindi as their mother tongue causing friction in Panjab so that Panjabi has become equated with only a particular religion. As David pointed out a few people claimed Sanskrit as their mother tongue in census questions. It is in the same spirit that Hebrew was revived as national language of Israel. In retrospection and as political prudence it would have been better if India had revived Sanskrit as national language in stead of Hindi. Sanskrit would have been equally hard for north and south Indian and their would have been no complaint in 1947. Moreover, Sanskrit means Cultured or cultivated language which proves that there must be a language of the masses whether it was Pali or Prakrit. There are people who will claim Esperanto or Cobol as their mother tongues. From SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU Mon Oct 10 23:50:33 1994 From: SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU (SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 94 17:50:33 -0600 Subject: Mother / father tongues Message-ID: <161227017545.23782.6939626635464095233.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Lars Martin Fosse suggested that >In order to be considered a living language, I think the rule is that a >certain amount of people learn the language as their *first* language (on >their mother's lap, so to speak) and constitute a speech community. The distinction that I learned (how I cannot recall) is that between the sets: living / dead & mother tongue / learned language. However, another distinction to be kept in mind might be that introduced (to me, at least...?) by A. K. Ramanujan (of blessed memory), namely, that between different "levels" of "mother tongue," -- except what he distinguished is the mother tongue, father tongue, and nurse tongue. He explained that different languages were spoken on different floors of his childhood home (I think that this was not wholly metaphorical). There was a downstairs language and an upstairs, and yet another with the servants. This is quite different of course from the English gentry's Upstairs / Downstairs: we have to do in the former case not with dialects but totally distinct languages. All of these languages were Raman's "native tongues" (Sanskrit not among them!). Jonathan Silk SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU From z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us Mon Oct 10 22:25:23 1994 From: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us (The Skeptic) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 94 18:25:23 -0400 Subject: Please indulge Message-ID: <161227017543.23782.14532736889981899445.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I seek the indulgence of the list before posing this question since it has nothing even remotely connected to the list but I do not know how to reach any knowledgeable British person. You do not have to post the answer to the list but send an email to me privately. Here is the question: Yesterday while watching Rector's Wife by Joanna Trollope on Masterpiece Theatre, I am puzzled by the fact of Rector's daughter being shunned by her fellow students in the public(protestant) school. I do not know what is the function and role of a rector in UK and why did the children accept the same girl with open arms in a Catholic school? Aditya Mishra Phone/FAX 305-746-0442 (Please leave message) email: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us PRODIGY: TVDS96A From SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU Tue Oct 11 02:27:01 1994 From: SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU (SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 94 20:27:01 -0600 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017547.23782.6071913877151105601.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Aditya Mishra writes: >Moreover, Sanskrit means Cultured or cultivated language which proves >that there must be a language of the masses whether it was Pali or Prakrit. Without wanting to start a big "thang" (sic), I would just point out that Pali is by no means now nor was it ever "a language of the masses." As has been abundantly shown by many philologists, for example KR Norman and Oskar van Hinuber, Pali was / is an "artificial language." Without getting into all the implications of what this means, one of the most important things we might note is that it is virtually impossible for it ever to have been anyone's native language -- ever. This is a different case from that of Skt., which it is assumed was at least at some period (up to the time of Panini, at least??) still somebody's first language. As for Prakrit, since it is not clear what the writer intends by this term (I think, if I recall correctly, there is a good discussion of the different meanings of the term in the introduction to Woolner's Prakrit Grammar), it is difficult to say if what he suggests makes sense or not. If he intends Prakrit to simply mean "vernacular," he may be right. However, the logic that *because* "Sanskrit" (= sa.msk.rta) means "Cultured or cultivated language" *therefore* this *proves* that there must be .... whatever... is, I confess, beyond me. Anyway, I appeal to the karu.naa of linguists like Madhav Deshpande and others for my feeble response to the linguistic faux pas of Mr. Mishra, but I could not let it slide. Jonathan Silk SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU From l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no Mon Oct 10 10:48:42 1994 From: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no (l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 94 20:48:42 +1000 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017535.23782.5708408646035897053.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Is Sanskrit a living language? In order to be considered a living language, I think the rule is that a certain amount of people learn the language as their *first* language (on their mother's lap, so to speak) and constitute a speech community. I am not sure if Sanskrit is the first acquired language of anybody in India today, but the fact that some people speak and write it does not mean that it is alive in the same sense as e.g. Hindi or Urdu. Sanskrit today still seems to have some of the status that Latin had in former centuries here in Europe. Everybody learned Latin at school (that is everybody who received an education), and it was the lingua franca of all Western European states. Latin lost this status in the last century, when scholarly books increasingly were written in English, French or German (or any other modern living language). In diplomatic circles Latin went out of use already in the 17th century, when it was replaced by French. Saying that the relationship between Sanskrit and a modern language like Hindi is comparable to the relationship between Latin and a modern romance language like e.g. Italian would be rather misleading. Roughly, we might say that the relationship between Latin and Italian resembles the relationship between Sanskrit and Pali, but this does certainly not hold for all linguistic parameters, and the comparison should not be stretched. The relationship between Sanskrit and Prakrit is a bit like the relationship between Latin and French, but again: Don't put too much into the comparison. We are speaking more in terms of phonetics than in terms of structure. Modern Indian languages have developed way beyond anything comparable among romance languages, and a comparison with Sanskrit is therefore somewhat artificial. There is a genetic relationship, and the phonetics are basically the same, but structurally there is nothing left of Sanskrit grammar. NIA languages have gone through a major shift compared to Sanskrit, and the connection with Sanskrit is today more transparent on the cultural (vocabulary) level. Best regards, Lars Martin Fosse Lars Martin Fosse Department of East European and Oriental Studies P. O. Box 1030, Blindern N-0315 OSLO Norway Tel: +47 22 85 68 48 Fax: +47 22 85 41 40 E-mail: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no From jh at cubsps.bio.columbia.edu Tue Oct 11 15:19:42 1994 From: jh at cubsps.bio.columbia.edu (Jim Hartzell) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 94 11:19:42 -0400 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017550.23782.9390326141288863114.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> would anyone be able to supply, or direct me to, a list of places in India where Sanskrit is spoken exclusively, or primarily? Jim Hartzell From raja at galileo.IFA.Hawaii.Edu Tue Oct 11 13:53:44 1994 From: raja at galileo.IFA.Hawaii.Edu (raja at galileo.IFA.Hawaii.Edu) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 94 13:53:44 +0000 Subject: Questions concerning Classical Indology: Help Wanted Message-ID: <161227017558.23782.18143871888628159226.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> > Does anyone know of references in Indian literature to the idea > that ancient kings gifted the world to ascetics? The story of Vamana (Trivikrama), an incarnation of Vishnu, who was gifted the whole world by the emperor Bali... Also in stories of King Vikramaditya, I think there are some such events... Good luck, Raja. From SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU Tue Oct 11 21:58:41 1994 From: SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU (SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 94 15:58:41 -0600 Subject: Questions concerning Classical Indology: Help Wanted Message-ID: <161227017555.23782.12043377609011377424.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> In the process of writing my doctoral dissertation I have run into a few questions which I have been unable to answer. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated, and of course acknowledged. 1 There is a classic pun on ka.saaya "impurity" and kaa.saaya "monastic, ochre colored, robe." It occurs in many Buddhist texts, and in MBh. It also seems to appear in a number of Jaina texts, to which unfortunately I do not have access. The references I have are to the _Tri.sa.s.ti'salaakaapuru.sacaritra_ Parva 1 sarga 6 'sloka 1-52 (Nagarajaji p. 178), _AAdi-puraa.na_ parva 18, and _AAva'syakasuutra-niryukti_ Malayagiri v.rtti pp. 232.2-234.1. None of these texts are available to me. Does anyone have these at hand? 2 The term yogaacaara is common in Buddhist texts, not only as the name of a philosophical school but also as indicating a monk specializing in meditation. Skt. dictionaries quote the word, but I have not been able to find examples. BR quotes it in the meaning "die Observanz des Joga," but the reference to Mallinaatha's commentary to _Kumaarasambhava_ 3.47 is an error (correctly Yogasaara, not Yogaacaara). Does the term actually occur in Sanskrit other than that of Buddhist texts? (Apte and MW (= yogin, which I think is correct) both cite it, without any references however). Has anyone seen this word? 3 I have investigated the word vaiyaap.rtyakara (v.l. vaiyaav.rtyakara, vaiyaav.rttyakara, vaiyaav.rttikara, vaiyaapatyakara etc.). The word is not common, apparently, in Buddhist sources, but occurs in the text I am studying (_Ratnaraa'sisuutra_) in the meaning of "supervisor." It occurs e.g. in Kautilya but apparently in a (somewhat) different sense. MW cites the word vaiyaav.rttyakara from _Kalpasuutra_ (which refers to what, exactly?) and _Naaradasm.rti_. Can anyone confirm these instances (e.g. the learned editor of the latter)? In addition, the word occurs in _Mankhako'sa_ 454c, and the commentary (Zachariae 1897: 60) refers to or quotes _Bhalla.ta'sataka_ 37. What is this? According to S.B. Deo (History of Jaina Monachism p. 371) the _Oghaniryukti_ commentary explains v.r.sabha as viayaav.rtyakara.nasamartha.h. I do not have any access to this text. Can anyone check this reference? 4 In the Buddhist text _Mahaavutpatti_ we find the term karmadaana as the name of a monastic officer. In the _Vinayasuutra_ of Gu.naprabha appears the form karmaadaana. Has anyone seen either of these elsewhere in an Indic text? (The former form apparently appears in Yijing's "Diary," but that text at any rate is Chinese). 5 Has anyone seen the word u.d.dara? Edgerton BHSD quotes it only from the passage I am trying to understand. 6 Most of the _Ratnaraa'sisuutra_ is extant only in Tibetan and Chinese translations. There are several places where I cannot understand these versions. One place has to do with a reference to the (Tibetan kha phyis) of an outcaste: "High class people do not touch and do not use an outcaste's ** or garments, everything used by him." A subsequent sentence says: "An outcaste hold up his ** and goes to another's home in a timid, shrinking way." In Tibetan kha phyis means a cotton handkerchief or napkin. What Sanskrit term might be behind this? 7 In a comparison of the evil 'srama.na he is compared to a kura.n.taka flower. I have been unable, despite my best efforts, to clearly identify this plant because of the description in the text: "Now, Kaa'syapa, what is the kura.n.taka-like 'srama.na? By way of example, Kaa'syapa: If one looks at the color of the flowers called "kura.n.taka" they are agreeable, but if one touches them they are rough, they stink of dung-flies, and they stink of the root of the shi la bar ka." The term kura.n.taka is discussed in Rahul Peter Das 1988: 255 (note 4), 434, 460. There the identification with barleria prionitis l. is suggested. This plant is said to be a small spiny bush with plentiful buff colored flowers, yellow when fresh, and of bitter or sour taste. Das (or the appendix's author, G.J. Meulenbeld), as well as Prof. Michio Yano (personal communication), also refer to celosia argentea l., but Yano at least concludes that the identifications so far offered by specialists are all inconclusive. Nothing is mentioned in the sources I have seen about the odor of any of these plants, which must be a very noticeable feature of the plant being referred to here in the _Ratnaraa'sisuutra_. Notice also that further confusion is suggested by the entries in the Amaarako'sa and its commentaries. 4.74ab (Vanau.sadhivarga) reads tatra 'so.ne kuravakas tatra piite kura.n.taka.h. I have check most of the standard works (Roxburgh etc.) without any significant clues. I am also very puzzled by (Tibetan) _shi la bar ka_, an equivalent for which is lacking in Chinese. I suspect the word is Indic (?) -- it seems almost impossible that it is Tibetan. It must refer, of course, to some plant with an odoriferous root; more than that I cannot say. In the context of the discussion of kura.n.taka, Das 1988: 460, 454 refers to 'sitivaaraka; is this even conceivably connected? What might this _shi la bar ka_ be?! 8 The _Ratnaraa'sisuutra_ also has the following: "If that one who while not a 'srama.na, Kaa'syapa, falsely claims to be 'srama.na, while not a follower of the practice of purity falsely claims to be a follower of the practice of purity, should not obtain on this wide earth so much as that [space] to eject a glob of spit, how much less [should he expect] a place to lift up and set down his foot. Why? Because this wide earth, Kaa'syapa, was given by kings of old to those who uphold the precepts, those who are virtuous and those worthy of veneration, in order for them to carry out their practice." Does anyone know of references in Indian literature to the idea that ancient kings gifted the world to ascetics? Any and all responses, hints, clues, etc. very gratefully accepted and acknowledged! Many thanks, jonathan Jonathan Silk SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU From cejka at praha1.ff.cuni.cz Tue Oct 11 15:17:45 1994 From: cejka at praha1.ff.cuni.cz (cejka at praha1.ff.cuni.cz) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 94 16:17:45 +0100 Subject: PALI JATAKAS PLEASE Message-ID: <161227017551.23782.4113173288876383671.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Help please!!! I am in an urgent need of an electronical version of at least some of the buddhist j-atakas in pali. I am not able to create it myself in time. Any help or info is greatly appreciated. Even if someone is only working on it and would agree to share with me what is already done, I would be grateful. Thanks in advance -- cejka at praha1.ff.cuni.cz From hsa01dk at goldsmiths.ac.uk Tue Oct 11 15:47:21 1994 From: hsa01dk at goldsmiths.ac.uk (hsa01dk at goldsmiths.ac.uk) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 94 16:47:21 +0100 Subject: Journal of Buddhist Ethics Publication News Message-ID: <161227017553.23782.2279080342940598523.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Journal of Buddhist Ethics Publication News The Journal of Buddhist Ethics is pleased to announce the publication of the following Research Paper. Title: BUDDHIST ETHICS IN WESTERN CONTEXT: THE "VIRTUES" APPROACH Author: James Whitehill Publication Date: October 7th 1994 ABSTRACT Contemporary Buddhism increasingly seeks to make itself understood in modern terms and to respond to contemporary conditions. Buddhism's legitimation in the West can be partially met by demonstrating that Buddhist morality is a virtue-oriented, character-based, community-focused ethic, commensurate with the Western "ethics of virtue" tradition, an interpretation of ethics most recently associated with thinkers like Alasdair MacIntyre and Stanley Hauerwas. By keeping its roots in a character formed as "awakened virtue" and a community guided by an integrative soteriology of wisdom and morality, Western Buddhism can avoid the twin temptations of rootless liberation in an empty "emptiness," on the one hand, and universalistic power politics, on the other. On this basis some predictions are made as to preferable future directions and limits for Buddhism in a post-modern world. ABOUT THE AUTHOR James Whitehill teaches at Stephens College in Columbia, Missouri, USA. His E-mail address is: whitehill at womenscol.stephens.edu RETRIEVAL INSTRUCTIONS Material published by the Journal of Buddhist Ethics may be read and retrieved via the World Wide Web, Gopher, or anonymous FTP. 1) World Wide Web: a hypertext version is available via the following URL: http://www.cac.psu.edu/jbe/jbe.html 2) Gopher: An ASCII text version is available from Penn State's Gopher: Type: 1 Host: ftp.cac.psu.edu Port: 70 Selector: 1/jbe or from Goldsmiths' Gopher: Type: 1 Host: scorpio.gold.ac.uk Port: 70 Selector: 1/jbe 3) Anonymous FTP: An ASCII text version is available from ftp.cac.psu.edu in the directory /pub/jbe or ftp.gold.ac.uk in the directory /pub/jbe. If you have difficulty in obtaining any item, please contact the Journal's Technical Editor Dr. Wayne R.Husted (jbe-ed at psu.edu). ************************************************* Damien Keown hsa01dk at gold.ac.uk Department of Historical & Cultural Studies University of London, Goldsmiths London UK, SE14 6NW Voice (+44) 071 692 7171 Ext.2153 Fax: (+44) 071 694 8911 ************************************************* From SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU Wed Oct 12 00:16:03 1994 From: SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU (SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 94 18:16:03 -0600 Subject: Clarification of my intent re: yogaacaara Message-ID: <161227017556.23782.8332975477307069047.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Regarding my recent posting concerning Questions on Classical Indology: In item 2, I am looking for uses of yogaacaara in non-Buddhist Sanskrit materials OTHER THAN in its meaning of a Buddhist philosophical school. Sorry for the confusion. jonathan Jonathan Silk SILK at AC.GRIN.EDU From SHALIN at commerce.otago.ac.nz Tue Oct 11 20:10:28 1994 From: SHALIN at commerce.otago.ac.nz (Shalin) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 94 20:10:28 +0000 Subject: Error Condition Re: subscribe Shalin Message-ID: <161227017548.23782.9463754546872298366.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> >Date sent: Tue, 11 Oct 1994 07:54:39 BST >Send reply to: indology at liverpool.ac.uk >From: indology at liverpool.ac.uk >To: shalin at commerce.otago.ac.nz >Copies to: c.wooff at liverpool.ac.uk >Subject: Error Condition Re: subscribe Shalin > >We are sorry, but this system sensed the following request which may have been >inadvertently sent to this list: > >SUBSCRIBE SHALIN > >If your posting was intentional, please accept our apologies and resend your >mail message, making sure you do not include anything that may look like a >request in the first line of the body of the actual message. If this was >indeed a request please resend it to listproc at liverpool.ac.uk >Your entire message >is copied below. > >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >subscribe Shalin > > From pclaus at s1.csuhayward.edu Wed Oct 12 13:16:11 1994 From: pclaus at s1.csuhayward.edu (pclaus at s1.csuhayward.edu) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 94 06:16:11 -0700 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017559.23782.15569025591816171920.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> There is a village in the Malnad region of Karnataka (Shimoga Dist. I think) where I am told the language is Sanskrit. The name of the village slips my mind at the moment, but I could find it out for you if you need it. It is a relatively recent village decree, and the village is largely (entirely?) made up of members of the Brahmin community. How strictly it is enforced I don't know. Peter J. Claus >?From THRASHER at MAIL.LOC.GOV 12 1994 Oct GMT 10:35:10 Date: 12 Oct 1994 10:35:10 GMT From: ALLEN W THRASHER Subject: SANSKRIT SPEAKING VILLAGE I think the Sanskritophone village was the subject of an article in the last year or two in either of the two newsweeklies Frontline or India Today, both of which I get for current reference but which I don't have time to search now. Allen Thrasher From magier at columbia.edu Wed Oct 12 13:45:32 1994 From: magier at columbia.edu (David Magier) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 94 09:45:32 -0400 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017561.23782.6012229076199074116.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> > There is a village in the Malnad region of Karnataka (Shimoga Dist. > I think) where I am told the language is Sanskrit. Do the housewives haggle with the vegetable vendors in Sanskrit? Do they scold their little children in Sanskrit? Do the kids discuss the latest cricket matches in Sanskrit? In other words, apart from the official decree and the use of Sanskrit in various religious and official contexts (and possibly an enforced subject of study in school), is Sanskrit really "the language" of daily life in this village? Is it anyone's first language that they learn from birth? David Magier From z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us Wed Oct 12 15:36:06 1994 From: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us (The Skeptic) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 94 11:36:06 -0400 Subject: SANSKRIT SPEAKING VILLAGE Message-ID: <161227017563.23782.15429705134448004609.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I would like to see the article if anyone has it. How many people live in the village and what is their means of livelihood? I understand there may be a few communities of esparanto speakers also. Aditya Mishra Phone/FAX 305-746-0442 (Please leave message) email: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us PRODIGY: TVDS96A From pclaus at s1.csuhayward.edu Wed Oct 12 22:55:26 1994 From: pclaus at s1.csuhayward.edu (pclaus at s1.csuhayward.edu) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 94 15:55:26 -0700 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017568.23782.13063399820935416541.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> What a lot of interest in a Sanskrit-speaking village! I will gather all of your questions and send them off to some friends who live in nearby villages, with whom I correspond regularly. So ask away and I should have answers in a month and a half or so. Perhaps best to send mail to me at pclaus at csuhayward.edu I pass the village often -- and will do so in December. This time I'll stop and check it out: I wonder if they speak Kannada. Peter J. Claus From Peter_Scharf at brown.edu Thu Oct 13 05:26:25 1994 From: Peter_Scharf at brown.edu (Peter_Scharf at brown.edu) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 94 22:26:25 -0700 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017569.23782.5679074191141362496.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Dominik, I'm not sure I understand your reference introducing the news that Sanskrit will be an elective subject in High Schools: >Like the boy who cried "wolf", I doubt if I will be believed now, but >here it is anyway: > >The Hindu, Bangalore, October 7th, 1994 >======================================= Do you find anything objectionable to Sanskrit being made an elective subject? Is there anything objectionable to Latin being reinstated as an elective subject in many American schools recently after a period of its absence? Because Latin has been introduced does that imply any prejudice against Greek? Or is a matter of degree immediately prejudice? Peter Scharf Lecturer of Sanskrit Dept. of Classics Brown University Providence, RI 02912 From mhcrxlc at dir.manchester-computing-centre.ac.uk Wed Oct 12 23:20:01 1994 From: mhcrxlc at dir.manchester-computing-centre.ac.uk (mhcrxlc at dir.manchester-computing-centre.ac.uk) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 94 23:20:01 +0000 Subject: Questions concerning Classical Indology: Help Wanted Message-ID: <161227017566.23782.5629045904723896777.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> >3 I have investigated the word vaiyaap.rtyakara (v.l. >vaiyaav.rtyakara, vaiyaav.rttyakara, vaiyaav.rttikara, vaiyaapatyakara >etc.). The word is not common, apparently, in Buddhist sources, but occurs >in the text I am studying (_Ratnaraa'sisuutra_) in the meaning of >"supervisor." It occurs e.g. in Kautilya but apparently in a (somewhat) >different sense. MW cites the word vaiyaav.rttyakara from _Kalpasuutra_ >(which refers to what, exactly?) and _Naaradasm.rti_. Can anyone confirm >these instances (e.g. the learned editor of the latter)? In addition, the >word occurs in _Mankhako'sa_ 454c, and the commentary (Zachariae 1897: 60) >refers to or quotes _Bhalla.ta'sataka_ 37. What is this? According to >S.B. Deo (History of Jaina Monachism p. 371) the _Oghaniryukti_ commentary >explains v.r.sabha as viayaav.rtyakara.nasamartha.h. I do not have any >access to this text. Can anyone check this reference? My PTS Dictionary gives the Jaataka and the Vimaanavatthu Commentary as references for veyyaavaccakara: J iii 327 and VvA 349. I can not check these references, although going by Masefield's translation it appears to be used to explain pesiyo. It occurs more than eight times in the Vinaya commentary. See Samantapaasaadikaa Vol VIII = Index Vol. The sense in Pali seems to be someone who performs service e.g. a lay helper for monks (kappiyakaaraka), but I have not checked all the references. I hope this may be of some help. Lance Cousins MANCHESTER, UK Telephone (UK): 061 434 3646 (International) +44 61 434 3646 Fax (UK): 061 275 3613 (International) +44 61 275 3613 From z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us Thu Oct 13 03:22:47 1994 From: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us (The Skeptic) Date: Wed, 12 Oct 94 23:22:47 -0400 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017572.23782.12781069666792187978.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> On Tue, 11 Oct 1994, Srinivas Sunder wrote: > > In response to Shree J. Sharma: The CBSE (Central Board of Secondary Education) > is one of the 2 or 3 nationwide educational boards; as I understand it, CBSE > is a part of the Ministry of Education (Human Resources?), and various schools > all over the country can seek affiliation from it. As such, a directive from > the Supreme Court to CBSE to include Skt. as an elective in Secondary school > is a nationwide directive, not one that pertains to Karnataka only. All > Kendriya Vidyalayas (KVs) as well as Central schools, and a good number of > private schools all over the country are affiliated to the CBSE. The other > national board is the ICSE - which is, I believe, the old Cambridge system with > a new name. In addition, of course, you have the various state-level boards, > run by the Education Ministries of the various states. I am sure that all CBSE > schools do not use only English as the medium of instruction; some also use > Hindi - this I know from the fact that our question-papers in the CBSE Board > exams used to have the questions in both English and Hindi. > > Beats me what the fuss (esp. on this list) is all about. First of all, it > must be the higher-secondary level (grades 11 and 12) that this order must > pertain to; Sanskrit is already available as a core subject (2nd language) > at the secondary level (10th grade) in CBSE; and many CBSE schools also offer > it as a third language between the 6th and 8th grades. The effect of this SC > ruling is only to force CBSE to offer it as a subject at grades 11 and 12 too. > > The fact that it is an elective means that it is not being forced on all CBSE > students; CBSE only has to arrange for schools that request it as an elective > to be provided with a syllabus, list of textbooks, qualifications for teachers, > question papers for board exams and so on. Schools that then include it as an > elective will offer its higher secondary students a choice between Skt. or some > other subject as the 5th subject at the 11th and 12th grades, in addition to > their 4 core subjects. > > CBSE's objection that it would also have to offer Persian and Arabic if Skt. > were made an elective, is to say the least, frivolous. Persian and Arabic > are not available at the 10th grade level in CBSE schools; Skt. has been, for > at least 10 years now. This debate over Skt. being an unsecular language has > obviously been over at CBSE for some time now. The objections raised by them > now are only a reflection of the polarization, along religious lines, of > India's polity. As I understand their objection is based on economic ground. If they are forced to provide education of Sanskrit even though optional they will have to hire at least one more teacher. As CBSE schools are private and for profit organizations, they want to look at their bottom line. As they see it there is no great demand for teaching sanskrit and if anyone still wants it he/she may go to non-CBSE school, as far as they are concerned. > PS: AS far as I know, AIR still has a Skt. broadcast every morning. > That is a joke. Like the discussion of a Sanskrit speaking village. I wonder who uses Sanskrit news as their only news bulletin. It is more of an entertainment or education. > PPS: To answer yetanudder question: Part of the reason there is so much > animosity to Skt. in India is the identification of Skt. with the upper-castes > (read Brahmins and "Brahminists"). This is esp. true in TN, where animosity to > symbols of Brahminism (and some would say, Brahmins too) is high. There > is almost as much animosity to Hindi (perhaps more). The result? English has > pride of place, second to only Tamizh as the language that is emphasized the > most in schools affiliated to the State Boards in TN. Foreign, yes. But not a > symbol of the "bl___y Hindi-speakers" or the "snooty Brahmins." > Whatever, the reason what is wrong with that? why should any language be imposed on anyone? It is mostly Hindi speakers who are source of this animosity since it became the official language. Aditya Mishra Phone/FAX 305-746-0442 (Please leave message) email: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us PRODIGY: TVDS96A > From dran at cs.albany.edu Thu Oct 13 13:25:15 1994 From: dran at cs.albany.edu (Paliath Narendran) Date: Thu, 13 Oct 94 09:25:15 -0400 Subject: Skt speaking village Message-ID: <161227017574.23782.12449919314170901514.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Sanskrit is still very much alive in Carnatic music. Even now there are composers who compose kritis in Sanskrit. Two names that come to mind immediately are M. Balamuralikrishna, the famous singer, and "Thulaseevanam" Ramachandran Nair. Also the majestic Sanskrit compositions of Muthuswami Dikshitar (1775-1834) are enjoying a revival these days. In a recent issue of the Malayalam magazine `Mathrubhoomi' there is a review of a recent commentary, IN SANSKRIT, of the messenger-poem `cAtakasandeSa.' The original poem is by mAntiTTa kunju namboodiri who died 60-70 years ago. (He was primarily a tArkika.) The new Sanskrit commentary, called `rasikaranjini', is by Dr. P.C. Muralimadhavan. Narendran From jage at loc.gov Thu Oct 13 13:31:13 1994 From: jage at loc.gov (jage at loc.gov) Date: Thu, 13 Oct 94 09:31:13 -0400 Subject: Sanskrit Speaking Village Message-ID: <161227017576.23782.2323860018517699290.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Thursday, October 13, 1994 Indologists, I wonder what alphabet these Sanskrit speaking villagers use when writing a note--Devanagari, Kannada or other? Regards, Jim Agenbroad ( jage at LOC.gov ) From sunder at crhc.uiuc.edu Thu Oct 13 18:00:44 1994 From: sunder at crhc.uiuc.edu (Srinivas Sunder) Date: Thu, 13 Oct 94 13:00:44 -0500 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017581.23782.16926791884927783672.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Aditya Mishra says: > As I understand their objection is based on economic ground. If they are > forced to provide education of Sanskrit even though optional they will > have to hire at least one more teacher. As CBSE schools are private and ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > for profit organizations, they want to look at their bottom line. As they ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > see it there is no great demand for teaching sanskrit and if anyone still > wants it he/she may go to non-CBSE school, as far as they are concerned. > > CBSE schools are NOT all private. There are Kendriya Vidyalayas all over the country - Madras has at least 4; almost every urban center in the South has at least one - that are Central Govt.-owned, and use the CBSE curriculum. Further, I do not know of even one privately-run CBSE school in Madras which is a for-profit institution. Thirdly, the CBSE is NOT a representative of the CBSE-affiliated schools. Even if the argument that it would cost too much to hire extra teachers is a valid argument for a school to refuse to include it as an elective, that argument is NOT for the CBSE to make. Their (CBSE's) views as represented in their brief to the Supreme Court are the views of only the CBSE, and by extension, the Ministry of Education and the Govt. of India. Further, as I understand the way CBSE operates, no school can be compelled to offer an elective. The compulsion is only on CBSE to offer it in the curriculum as an elective that individual schools may decide to offer to their students. That in turn is generally a function of student- and/or parent-demand for its inclusion in private schools, or when the body that governs the school (say a religious institution) feels it to be a part of its mission. If they can't afford it, they won't offer it. Period. CBSE's offering it or not has no economic impact on the schools. This is essentially a political/constitutional issue with cultural implications, not an economic issue. [I am puzzled by how economics got introduced into this debate, given that the article posted by Dominik W. had only mention of the Justices' opinion that Skt.-learning or Govt. encouragement of the same at the expense of Persian/Arabic would not militate against the tenets of secularism.] Regards Srinivas From z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us Thu Oct 13 18:41:51 1994 From: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us (The Skeptic) Date: Thu, 13 Oct 94 14:41:51 -0400 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017583.23782.15305640592579359969.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Srinivas is right that there are some Central Schools that are owned by the government but from what I have seen in the North, most of the English medium schools (CBSE) are privately owned either by a church or individuals. My sister-in-law teaches in one such school which is privately owned. It is my guess that the motivation for the suit had to economical even though it could have been clothed in terms of secular content by the lawyers. We know after seeing the current proceedings of OJ Simpson case, how the facts can be distorted by the lawyers. Then again, as I said, it is only my conjecture. Moreover, I am not sure whether the suit was brought by CBSE which is a (semi?)government organization or individual schools who wanted to challenge the rulings of CBSE. Aditya Mishra Phone/FAX 305-746-0442 (Please leave message) email: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us PRODIGY: TVDS96A From jleslie%vigyan.ernet.in at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in Fri Oct 14 03:02:53 1994 From: jleslie%vigyan.ernet.in at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in (jleslie) Date: Thu, 13 Oct 94 22:02:53 -0500 Subject: Sanskrit to be an elective subject in schools Message-ID: <161227017578.23782.15874610413848221450.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I spoke to Professor K.T. Pandurangi, former Professor of Sanskrit at Bangalore University, only yesterday about Sanskrit-speaking villages in Karnataka. In our fairly casual conversation, he said that there were several such villages in the state, possibly as many as half a dozen. There is also an organisation -- the HIndu Seva Pratisthanam -- which promotes Sanskrit as a spoken language: it produces simple, direct-method text books, and a newsletter. You can buy a sticker for your hall or front room saying "Sanskrit spoken here" in Sanskrit, either in Kannada or Nagari script. A contact address for those interested is: Hindu Seva Pratisthanam, "Aksharam", 8th Cross, 2nd Phase, Girinagar, Bangalore 560 085. Tel: +91 80 623189. I have yet to make contact myself, I'm afraid. Julia -- Dr I. Julia Leslie, Sen. Lect. SOAS, London. email: jleslie at vigyan.iisc.ernet.in (until May 1995). NB: Don't just hit "R"eturn to answer email from me. There is a glitch in my outgoing email headers. Type in the above address (or alias it), or use my UK address . Phone/FAX: +91-80-6633884 (phone before faxing) Currently on sabbatical leave in Bangalore. From nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov Fri Oct 14 15:45:06 1994 From: nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov (nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 94 10:45:06 -0500 Subject: Sandalwood Message-ID: <161227017586.23782.10124766498577581041.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Bibliography on Sandalwood ---------------------------- During March 1994, someone wrote about mythological associations of sandalwood tree. I found a book title on sandalwood. I don't know whether it has any references to sandalwood's association with myth. K. Gurulingaiah, Bibliography on Sandalwood (santalum album), University of Agricultural sciences, Mysore, 1977 Hope this helps, N. Ganesan From nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov Fri Oct 14 18:29:51 1994 From: nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov (nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 94 13:29:51 -0500 Subject: Nidhi Message-ID: <161227017588.23782.12511117652586387553.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Oct. 14, 1994 References on Nidhi ------------------- Dr. R. Mayer wrote that he likes to see some citations in "Nidhi". >From my notes, I found two references on "Nidhi" 1) C. Sivaramamurti Nidhis: Sankha and Padma Bharat Kaumudi, vol. 2, p.949-954, 1945 Indian press, Ahmedabad. 2) Appar/Tirunavukkarasar (7th century A.D.) has written a "Tevaram" starting with "Sankhanidhi Padhmanidhi" T. V. Gopal Iyer, F. Gros, Tevaram vol. 2, p. 369, Pondichery, 1984 The Bhakti poem says that even if one donates the two nidhis or gives the right to rule the earth and heaven, we won't respect him unless he is devoted to Siva. That particular "Tevaram" (poem no. 7193 in French Institute of Indology, Pondichery edition by T. V. gopal Iyer) begins like this: "cangkaniti patumaniti iraNTum tantu taraNiyoTu vaan aaLat taruvaarEnum ..." N. Ganesan nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov From R.Mayer at ukc.ac.uk Fri Oct 14 13:33:16 1994 From: R.Mayer at ukc.ac.uk (R.Mayer at ukc.ac.uk) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 94 14:33:16 +0100 Subject: nidhi Message-ID: <161227017584.23782.17411571572540858946.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Jan Gonda, in his volume "The Savajajn~as" (Gonda 1965:183-193) discusses the concepts of nidhi and nidhipaa, as cited in the Kaus'ika Suutra and the Gr.hyasuutras. He describes nidhi as something of spiritual value deposited in a spiritual realm. This was guarded by protectors called nidhipaa, whose function was to ensure that only those who had deposited the nidhi in the first place, or those for whom it was intended, could eventually reclaim it, when they arrived in the spiritual realm in person. Agni, Prajaapati, or Br.haspati would often act as nidhipaa. What I can not understand from Gonda is the *context* of these categories. Can any learned list members help me? Also, can anyone give me any more information or references to nidhi and nidhipaa? I am particularly interested if these categories of nidhi and nidhipaa ever had a role in scriptural transmission, as they eventually came to do in some Buddhist texts. In a Buddhist context, they seem to be as much to do with scriptural revelation as with transmission. Regards to all, Rob Original-Sender: goodall at vax.oxford.ac.uk Date: Fri, 14 Oct 1994 15:42:35 +0100 From: goodall at vax.oxford.ac.uk To: indology at liverpool.ac.uk Message-ID: <00985F02.AD1DC401.23 at vax.ox.ac.uk> Subject: a nirvacana of pums I wonder if someone might be able to suggest an interpretation of (and possibly also an emendation to) what seems to be an understated nirvacana that I have come across in Bha.t.ta Raamaka.n.tha's commentary on the Kira.nav.rtti, which I am attempting to edit. Commenting on the half-verse CIDDHARME PU.MSI NO DHARMO, YADI SYAAT PARI.NAAMAVAAN Raamaka.n.tha offers the following: cid jnaanam eva dharma.h svabhaavo yasya sa tathaabhuuta.h pum ity anubhavati sarvam iti pumaan. Raamaka.n.tha is rejecting the view that ajnaana is a natural property of the soul and so he is reinforcing his arguments with a nirukti of pumaan that demonstrates its omniscience; but it is not clear to me how the word is broken down to yield anubhavati sarvam. For this portion of the commentary I have only one Ms, and it is possible that the text here is corrupt. I would be grateful for any suggestions. Dominic Goodall. From balachan at plains.NoDak.edu Sat Oct 15 01:58:17 1994 From: balachan at plains.NoDak.edu (Chandra Balachandra) Date: Fri, 14 Oct 94 20:58:17 -0500 Subject: Call for Papers: 24th Annual Conference on South Asia, Madison, WI Message-ID: <161227017590.23782.6390188417716956310.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> *** ALL RESPONSES TO: balachan at badlands.nodak.edu *** ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Call for Papers: 24th Annual Conference on South Asia, Madison, WI ================================================================== November 1995 ------------- Every year, usually during the first weekend in November, the Center for South Asia [CSA], University of Wisconsin, Madison holds a conference on South Asia in Madison, WI. It is a very very eclectic conference with a wide range of issues and viewpoints represented. The scholarly and academic community has a vital role to play in the understanding of the issues involved in the gay/lesbian experience of South Asians -- both in the diaspora in North America and in South Asia itself. The addition of the issues that sexuality-minorities deal with, into the corpus of knowledge about cultures increases awareness on all sides of the issues. To help expand the knowledge base on this broad topic, I will be organizing the following two INTERDISCIPLINARY PANELS for the 1995 Conference on South Asia. I invite you to explore the possibility of presenting a scholarly paper in either panel under the framework outlined below. PANEL I: SPACE AND SEXUALITY IN SOUTH ASIA: TOWARDS A NEW ORDERING OF SPACE. ------- ------------------------------------------------------------------ Themes: ------ As gay/lesbian and other sexuality minorities gradually become more and more visible on the cultural landscapes of South Asia, several issues arise regarding the sharing of space among majorities who have traditionally been visible and minorities who are only now slowly becoming visible. Some topics: ----------- 1. What are the dynamics involved in the emergent gay/lesbian landscapes in the overall cultural milieu of South Asian cultural space? 2. What are the landscapes of hope, of fear, of ignorance, and of enlightenment that are emerging in that region? 3. What is the nature of the interactions among gays/lesbians in the South Asian cultural space? 4. What does the future hold for this minority whose identity is still nascent? PANEL II: TOWARDS A SENSE OF BELONGING: THE GAY/LESBIAN SOUTH ASIAN -------- --------------------------------------------------------- DIASPORA IN NORTH AMERICA ------------------------- Theme: ----- When South Asian gays and lesbians come to North America, they face a very unique set of challenges. In a nutshell, it is learning the art and science of balancing many disparate elements of their inner identities with those of the new identities they strive to craft in order to acculturate for success in a relatively more 'open' society where they are minorities in many more ways. The cultural make-up of being South Asian, of belonging to this or that religion from the region, being a person of color in North American society, trying to come out in this milieu which understands so little about the South Asian culture -- such are the challenges facing the gays and lesbians of the South Asian diaspora in North America. Some topics: ----------- 1. Facing discrimination on multiple fronts. 2. How can the gay/lesbian diaspora craft an identity in this milieu in a nourishing way? What are the challenges involved in this? 3. What are the nature and status of the organized gay/lesbian movements in the South Asian diaspora? 4. What are the issues of identity involved individually and as a group? ============================================================================== FORMAT OF PANELS: ---------------- 1. Minimum 3 papers; max. 4 papers. 2. Each presenter will have 20 min. [15 min. presentation + 5 min. Q & A] 3. An individual may not present more than one paper for the whole conference. TIME TABLE: ---------- Now - November 18: * correspond with me about your interest(s) and abstracts of papers Nov. 19 - Nov. 25: * selection of abstracts for panels * CSA guidelines for full abstract preparation sent out to the selected panelists Feb. 28, 1995: * deadline for receipt of final abstracts of papers by me, in keeping with CSA guidelines. March (??), 1995: * mailing of conference information to panelists [as soon as material is received from the CSA]. April 25, 1995 : * receipt of full papers * conference registration fees & papers Early June: * confirmation of panels by CSA November: * Conference on South Asia, Madison, WI. PUBLICATION: ----------- The Conference proceedings generally include only abstracts of papers presented. I am planning on the publication of a special issue of a journal [yet to be selected] consisting of papers presented at the panels listed here. Of course, the nature of the papers will influence which journal will be most appropriate for us to consider. The journal chosen will determine what length and format the papers have to take, and also the time frame involved in actually publishing the papers. If you are interested, please e-mail me personally at the address above with the following information: 1. your full name 2. rank and institutional affiliation 3. snail mail address 4. telephone + fax numbers (if you want) 5. title of the paper you wish to present. 6. a detailed, draft abstract of the paper you wish to present. 7. identify the panel that you think your paper would best fit in. i look forward to your enthusiastic response. chandra. **************************************************************************** * Dr. Chandra S. Balachandran Assistant Professor, Geography * * Dep. of Geosciences, North Dakota State University, Fargo, ND 58105 * * * * Tel.: (701) 231-7115 Fax.: (701) 231-7149 * *~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~* * Mac had many admirable qualities, but not tact. He was the sort of man * * who would have tried to cheer Napoleon up by talking about the Winter * * Sports at Moscow. * * --- P. G. Wodehouse * **************************************************************************** From nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov Sun Oct 16 16:11:37 1994 From: nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov (nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov) Date: Sun, 16 Oct 94 11:11:37 -0500 Subject: Nidhi Message-ID: <161227017594.23782.14850107729753420479.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I found an additional reference on "Nidhi" Senarat Paranavitana Samkha and Padma Aribus Asiae, 18, 1955, p. 121-127 *************************************************************************** OLD POSTING *************************************************************************** Oct. 14, 1994 References on Nidhi ------------------- Dr. R. Mayer wrote that he likes to see some citations in "Nidhi". >From my notes, I found two references on "Nidhi" 1) C. Sivaramamurti Nidhis: Sankha and Padma Bharat Kaumudi, vol. 2, p.949-954, 1945 Indian press, Ahmedabad. 2) Appar/Tirunavukkarasar (7th century A.D.) has written a "Tevaram" starting with "Sankhanidhi Padhmanidhi" T. V. Gopal Iyer, F. Gros, Tevaram vol. 2, p. 369, Pondichery, 1984 The Bhakti poem says that even if one donates the two nidhis or gives the right to rule the earth and heaven, we won't respect him unless he is devoted to Siva. That particular "Tevaram" (poem no. 7193 in French Institute of Indology, Pondichery edition by T. V. gopal Iyer) begins like this: "cangkaniti patumaniti iraNTum tantu taraNiyoTu vaan aaLat taruvaarEnum ..." N. Ganesan nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov From E.Crangle at mailbox.uq.oz.au Sun Oct 16 08:20:31 1994 From: E.Crangle at mailbox.uq.oz.au (Edward Crangle) Date: Sun, 16 Oct 94 18:20:31 +1000 Subject: Bodhisattva Questions (fwd) Message-ID: <161227017592.23782.6974188912874687349.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I am forwarding the following enquiry from Ken O'Neill. Perhaps someone on the Indology list can help him. Peace All Ways, Eddie Crangle ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 14 Oct 1994 08:17:58 -0700 From:KONEIL at PIMACC.PIMA.EDU To: Multiple recipients of list BUDDHIST Subject: Bodhisattva Questions As far as I know, only two sutras are taught by lay bodhisattvas - those of vimalakirti and shrimaladevi. Of course, in the kegongyo bodhisattvas manifest in the world of form as various figures - but here, as with much of living Tibetan Buddhism today, emphasis is placed on the "in-former" or the bodhisattva who takes up the mask with entry into manifestation. I'm looking for information concerning the spectrum of so-called 'lay bodhisattvas' or 'householder bodhisattvas' in legend and lore, sutra and myth, and hagiography. Does anyone know of instances of mythic personae other than vimalakirti and shrimaladevi - localized (e.g., Tibet) or broadly dispersed, in sutras or lore? It would seem that bodhisattvas are born of mythogenesis of certain qualities or facets of the virtues of illumination rather than biography. While Christianity's saints, for example, seem to stem largely from hagiography, bodhisattvas seem to be born of imagination. Some traditions hold that Nagarjuna attained only the first bhuumi. Are any bodhisattva traditions rooted in lives of remarkable people? Monks, nuns, laiety? Even popular claims or recognition that so-and-so attained a certain bodhisattva ranking counts. These are very general questions seeking information from across the broad spectrum of buddhist traditions. Ken O'Neill koneil at pimacc.pima.edu From nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov Mon Oct 17 19:50:12 1994 From: nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov (nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov) Date: Mon, 17 Oct 94 14:50:12 -0500 Subject: East Indies Message-ID: <161227017596.23782.2724878981206053225.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Book Title on East Indies? --------------------------- The following question is with me for a long time. Hope some learned member of the group can answer this query. I read from a book by K. Zvelebil that some Tamils who emigrated use "cEntanAr's tiruppallANTu" during some festivals. The book he cites is G. K. Vanbrough, The peoples in the East Indies. The author and title may not be very exact, though very close. Can anybody give the exact author, title and year please? N. Ganesan nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov Original-Received: from blue.weeg.uiowa.edu by ns-mx.uiowa.edu (8.6.8.2/19940322) on Tue, 18 Oct 1994 11:49:51 -0500 id LAA08441 with ESMTP PP-warning: Illegal Received field on preceding line Original-Received: by blue.weeg.uiowa.edu (8.6.9/940408) on Tue, 18 Oct 1994 11:49:51 -0500 id LAA121050 PP-warning: Illegal Received field on preceding line Date: Tue, 18 Oct 1994 11:49:51 -0500 (CDT) From: Frederick M Smith Subject: sabhaparvan To: indology at liverpool.ac.uk Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I just downloaded Prof. van Nooten's transcription of the Sabhaaparvan and see 240,000+ bytes of gibberish. If anybody out there who uses a Macintosh has successfully downloaded this into readable text, I would be interested in the rahasya, e.g. what font did he use, what ASCII codes are necessary (though I know next to nothing about ASCII), etc.? Thanks Fred Smith Univ. of Iowa From magier at columbia.edu Tue Oct 18 17:59:49 1994 From: magier at columbia.edu (David Magier) Date: Tue, 18 Oct 94 13:59:49 -0400 Subject: Conf. on Indian Dance Message-ID: <161227017602.23782.5571820733727450089.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The following is an event announcement being reposted to your list from The South Asia Gopher. We apologize for any duplication of this posting. Please contact event organizers directly for further information. Thank you. SAG (magier at columbia.edu) -------------- Conference on Indian Dance in an International Context Carleton University, Ottawa, Canada. November 24-27 Panels on Choreography, Art & Society, Religion and art, Theatre and dance, Sahitya and Abhinaya, Yoga and dance, The Varnam ... *************************************** Registration $cdn40.00(including coffee & lunch) Student registration: $cdn25.00 Hotel accomodation at reduced rates $cdn35.00 *************************************** Dance performances of excerpts from Prof.V.Subramaniam's Buddhist Dance Dramas in Various Indian classical styles Theatre A Southam Hall, Carleton University Saturday, 26 November, 7.30 pm *************************************** Dance competition Theatre A Southam Hall, Carleton University Sunday, 27 November, 6.00 pm *************************************** Convenor Prof. V. Subramaniam Distinguished Research Professor Carleton University, Ottawa, Ontario Canada K1H 6K5 Tel: (613) 788-2600 ext 2798 Tel: (613) 731-2575 (Home) Fax: (613) 788-4064 e-mail Internet:vsubra at ccs.carleton.ca ************************************** From R.Mayer at ukc.ac.uk Tue Oct 18 17:39:00 1994 From: R.Mayer at ukc.ac.uk (R.Mayer at ukc.ac.uk) Date: Tue, 18 Oct 94 17:39:00 +0000 Subject: Bodhisattva Questions (fwd) Message-ID: <161227017597.23782.16656092651698497881.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> There are of course the list of lay-bodhisattvas lead by Bhadrapaala, sometimes eight in number, sometimes, if my memory serves me well, sixteen. They feature in early Mahaayaana suutras, including the earliest datable ones such as the Pratyutpanna-buddha-sam.mukhaa-vasthita-suutra, which was translated into Chinese in the 2nd century AD by Lokaks.ema. There seems reason to believe they influenced the Tibetan gter-ma tradition, or at least have a bearing on it. In the Pratyutpanna-suutra, the laymen lead by Bhadrapaala are prophecied as future revealers of the scriptures the Buddha intends for the future. Tibetan gter-ston were nearly always laymen, always with consorts and often with family lineages. Tibetan rNying-ma-pa evolved lists of the "Eight gter-ston called gling-pa", ie who had gling-pa as part of their name, such as Ratna gling-pa, Padma gling-pa, etc. Before long there were more than 8 gling-pa. I believe the original grouping was of 16 bodhisattvas, ie the satpurus.a sodas.a; or did the 8 come first? Forgive my poor memory. Yours, Rob From R.Mayer at ukc.ac.uk Tue Oct 18 17:45:00 1994 From: R.Mayer at ukc.ac.uk (R.Mayer at ukc.ac.uk) Date: Tue, 18 Oct 94 17:45:00 +0000 Subject: Nidhi Message-ID: <161227017599.23782.17555259413148927276.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear N. Ganesan, Thank you very much indeed for your kind help in finding references to nidhi. Rob Mayer From l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no Tue Oct 18 08:19:20 1994 From: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no (l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no) Date: Tue, 18 Oct 94 18:19:20 +1000 Subject: sabhaparvan Message-ID: <161227017600.23782.4252196854741164207.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> >I just downloaded Prof. van Nooten's transcription of the Sabhaaparvan >and see 240,000+ bytes of gibberish. If anybody out there who uses a >Macintosh has successfully downloaded this into readable text, I would be >interested in the rahasya, e.g. what font did he use, what ASCII codes >are necessary (though I know next to nothing about ASCII), etc.? > >Thanks > >Fred Smith >Univ. of Iowa > Van Nooten uses the CSX format, which means that if you use a PC, you need the wnrir - files to get an indological transliteration character set. These files you can get hold of by using ftp. Try these sites: Indology ftp: Indology FTP : ftp.bcc.ac.uk Login: anonymous Directory: /public/users/ucgadkw/indology or blackbox.hacc.washington.edu (hacc = Humanities and Computing Centre in Washington) Otherwise, with a bit of patience, you can convert van Nootens transliteration into any other kind of representation by means of search-and-replace. Best regards, Lars Martin Fosse Lars Martin Fosse Department of East European and Oriental Studies P. O. Box 1030, Blindern N-0315 OSLO Norway Tel: +47 22 85 68 48 Fax: +47 22 85 41 40 E-mail: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no From magier at columbia.edu Wed Oct 19 01:53:48 1994 From: magier at columbia.edu (David Magier) Date: Tue, 18 Oct 94 21:53:48 -0400 Subject: Economic liberalisation conference Message-ID: <161227017604.23782.3544020849342035327.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> This event announcement is being reposted to your mailing list as a service of The South Asia Gopher. Please forgive us for any cross-posting or duplication. Please contact the event organizers for any further information. Thank you. SAG (magier at columbia.edu) -------------------------------------------- AUSTRALIA SOUTH ASIA RESEARCH CENTRE Research School of Pacific and Asian Studies, Australian National University Presents An International Conference on Economic Liberalisation in South Asia 30 November - 2 December 1994 The Haydon-Allen Tank The Australian National University ECONOMIC LIBERALISATION IN SOUTH ASIA As a lead activity in 1994, its first year of existence, the Australian South Asia Research Centre (ASARC) within the Division of Economics, RSPAS, The Australian National University, is hosting an international conference on Economic Liberalisation in South Asia, the most significant economic trend in recent years in that region. The principal focus will be India which commenced gradual deregulation of industry and limited liberalisation of its trade regime in the 1980's. It introduced a long term program of structural economic reform in 1991 to lay a new foundation for rapid agricultural and industrial growth and to globalise the economy. The thrust of the reform process is to redress the balance between public and private sectors, eliminate waste and inefficiency, to impart new dynamism to India's growth processes and to remove barriers to international trade. These reforms, which will see the end of the last great closed economy, are beginning to have a far reaching impact on Australian trade and investment flows as the reforms take effect and as India's economy begins to exert an influence within the Asian region. All South Asian countries are now involved in the process of economic liberalisation. But, knowledge of the nature and extent of reforms and liberalisation in the five major South Asian countries is fragmentary and incomplete. This Conference is a first step by ASARC towards building a comprehensive knowledge of the on-going reform process throughout the region. It will also assist in guiding the Centre's planned research program. The Conference will establish and deepen ASARC and Australian linkages with a number of key research institutions within South Asia, as a basis for developing collaborative research projects in the fields of economic reform and liberalisation in international trade and investment, and internally, in infrastructural, agricultural, industrial and service industry development. Particular institutions initially include: in India, the University of Delhi, the National Council for Applied Economic Research (NCAER), the Indian Council for Research on International Economic Relations (ICRIER), the Centre for Policy Research (CPR) and the National Institute for Public Finance and Policy (NIPFP) in New Delhi, and the Centre for Economic and Social Studies in Hyderabad; in Pakistan, the Applied Economics Research Centre, University of Karachi, the Sustainable Development Policy Institute and the Pakistan Institute of Development Economics in Islamabad, and the Lahore University of Management Sciences (LUMS); in Bangladesh, the University of Dhaka, the Bangladesh Institute of Development Studies and the Centre for Research and Action on Environment and Development; in Sri Lanka, the Universities of Colombo and Peradeniya, the Institute for Policy Studies and the Marga Institute; in Nepal, the Institute for Integrated Development Studies and the Centre for Economic Development and Administration, Tribhuvan University. The Conference will also draw on the expertise of a number of economists working on South Asia in other Australian Universities, e.g. La Trobe University, the University of Queensland, Griffith University and Charles Sturt University. There will be a wide range of participants from Commonwealth and State level Departments, the business sector and non-government organisations with interests in South Asia. The Conference will be followed by an "India Looks East" workshop on 5 and 6 December at ANU to probe the implications of India as a prospective Asian power. ASARC is one of the sponsors of this workshop. General Information The "Economic Liberalisation in South Asia" Conference is being organised by Dr Ric Shand as Convenor and Ms Carolyn Sweeney as Centre Co-ordinator for ASARC. It will be held in the Haydon-Allen Lecture Theatre/Tank, Haydon-Allen Building, Kingsley Street, The Australian National University, Canberra, from Wednesday 30 November to Friday 2 December 1994 inclusive, from 9.00am-5.00pm each day. Morning and afternoon refreshments will be provided under the veranda just outside the "Tank" and a light luncheon will be served in the Karmel Rooms which are located on the first floor of the Union Building. There will be a cocktail party on 30 November at the National Gallery of Australia. Guests can tour the Australian Art galleries with voluntary guides from 6.00 to 6.45pm and then proceed to the Staff Lounge on the 9th floor of the Gallery for a further cultural activity and refreshments from 6.45 to 8.00pm. The Conference dinner is to be held in the Great Hall of University House at 7.30pm on Thursday 1 December. Papers will be distributed on arrival at the Conference and session notes will be provided where possible, and may be collected from 8.30-9.00am on the day. Proceedings from the Conference will subsequently be published in volumes entitled Economic Liberalisation in South Asia. Accommodation Conference participants from outside Canberra and within Australia are asked to arrange their own accommodation. Rooms are available at Burgmann and Ursula Colleges. Burgmann College: Ph: +61 (06) 267 5202 Fax: +61 (06) 257 2655 Ursula College: Ph: +61 (06) 279 4303 Tea/coffee in rooms Fax: +61 (06) 279 4320 and daily servicing. For any further information please contact: Dr Ric T. Shand Australia South Asia Research Centre Research School of Pacific and Asian Studies, ANU or Ms Carolyn Sweeney Centre Co-ordinator Australia South Asia Research Centre Research School of Pacific and Asian Studies, The Australian National University CANBERRA ACT 0200 Phone: +61 (06) 249 4482 Fax: +61 (06) 249 3700 ** PLEASE FEEL FREE TO REPOST THIS ANNOUNCEMENT ** From mani at srirangam.esd.sgi.com Wed Oct 19 17:33:40 1994 From: mani at srirangam.esd.sgi.com (Mani Varadarajan) Date: Wed, 19 Oct 94 10:33:40 -0700 Subject: New books on Tamil culture Message-ID: <161227017607.23782.15413184215065487751.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov writes: > These are some recent books pertaining to Tamil culture. > Interesting contributions in different fields. I thought To these I should add the following fascinating book: "The Vernacular Veda", by Vasudha Narayanan. University of South Carolina Press, 1994. The author discusses how the Tiruvaymoli, a poem of over a thousand verses by the 7th-8th century saint Nammalvar, attained the status of Veda (in the true sense) in the Srivaishnava community. She also discusses some of the sociocultural implications of this, and how the work is used in liturgy and ceremony in the major temples of South India. Mani >?From THRASHER at MAIL.LOC.GOV 19 1994 Oct GMT 14:47:14 Date: 19 Oct 1994 14:47:14 GMT From: ALLEN W THRASHER Subject: NIDHIS Re: Nidhi I remember reading in magical literature of the notion navanidhi, the 9 nidhis, and a ritual to get rich by finding them, but can't recall where I saw it. I have a vague feeling it might be a Jaina idea. Allen Thrasher thrasher at mail.loc.gov From nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov Wed Oct 19 16:30:21 1994 From: nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov (nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov) Date: Wed, 19 Oct 94 11:30:21 -0500 Subject: New books on Tamil culture Message-ID: <161227017606.23782.3975332184516765011.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> New Books on Tamil Culture ---------------------------- These are some recent books pertaining to Tamil culture. Interesting contributions in different fields. I thought I will this with you all. N. Ganesan nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov 1) K. Sadasivan, Devadasi system in medieval Tamil Nadu, Trivandrum, 1993 2) A souvneir released on the occasion of the exhibition on South Indian bronzes. Government museum: Madras, 1992 3) P. Thirugnanasambandhan, Sanskrit Tamil contact, Tiruvananthapuram, 1992 4) Hugald Grafe, Tamilnadu in the nineteenth and twentieth centuries, Bangalore, 1990 5) Marina Muilwijk, The divine Kura tribe: Kuravanci and other prabandhams. Rijkuniversiteit te Utrecht, 1992. 249 p. (PhD thesis) 6) K. Zvelebil, Lexicon of Tamil literature, E. J. Brill, 1994 7) Brenda Beck, Elder brothers story, an oral epic in Tamil 2 volumes, Institute of Asian studies, madras, 1992 8) Henriette Bugge, Mission and Tamil society: social and religious change in South India, 1840-1900. London: Curzon press, 1994 9) Victor Michael, Tamil-Islamic cultural encounter in Seerapuranam. Rome: Gregorian university, 1992 Tamil ----- 1) R. Kannan, vaTivazhakiya nampitaacar iyaRRiya sri raamaanuja vaipavam, 1988 2) co. kalaiccelvi, uraiyaaciriyar puliyurk kEcikan mutalaaNTu ninaivu malar, 1993, 102 p. From R.Mayer at ukc.ac.uk Thu Oct 20 11:17:00 1994 From: R.Mayer at ukc.ac.uk (R.Mayer at ukc.ac.uk) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 94 11:17:00 +0000 Subject: NIDHIS Message-ID: <161227017609.23782.11831637997710930593.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> There is a mass of refertence to nidhi in magical literature; in magical literature, discovery of nidhi has its own distinctive lore, and is not simply subsumed under the rubric of such standard categories as aakars.an.a, the attracting of women or wealth. On the contrary, nidhi- dars/ana or nidhaanalaabha is a distinct category. One entire text, the Nidhidars/ana, by Raama Vaajapeyin, still survives as a study of this topic and nothing other. There are numerous references to discovering nidhi in the Mahaabhaarata, the Saamavidhaana Braahman.a, the AV-paris/is.t.aan.i, the S/aktisam.gama Tantra, the Siddhanaagaarjunakaks.aput.a, the Jayadrathayaamala, the Kaamaratna, and so on and so forth: in short, accross a wide spectrum. These texts describe saadhana rites to recover nidhi, methods of finding their locations, propitiations of the goddess Nidhiis/varii (Kubera's mummy), and so forth. But what I can not fathom is the context and import of the categories nidhi and nidhipaa as mentioned in the Gr.hyasuutras and the Kaus/ikasuutra. They do not seem to be quite the same as the magical understanding of nidhi. Thanks for your help, Alan. Rob From srice at cruzio.com Thu Oct 20 19:55:16 1994 From: srice at cruzio.com (Stanley Rice) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 94 12:55:16 -0700 Subject: Advaita book list service, Ramana Maharshi, SAT... Message-ID: <161227017613.23782.8947770362729115678.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> *************************************************************** BOOKS and RESOURCES on RAMANA MAHARSHI and SPIRITUAL NONDUALITY ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Books on the priceless teaching of Sri Ramana Maharshi and pure nonduality are often hard to find. You can get a descriptive book list free, as a service of the Society of Abidance in Truth (SAT). The list is provided in two parts for electronic mailing. Part 1 now includes over 75 titles on Ramana (many of them little-known.) Part 2 includes about 75 other titles on pure nonduality, including selected Buddhist works. New translations from the great Advaita sages Ribhu and Sankara, recently published by SAT, are included. Inquiries, electronic and otherwise, concerning availability of titles listed are welcomed. A query form is provided, as an aid to requesting more information. To receive either book list free, electronically, simply reply to this message and ask for Part 1 or 2. (This is NOT an auto- mailer.) The exquisite teaching of Ramana is for us all to share. He said: "Throw your worries to the wind; turn within and find peace." Under the guidance of a Self-realized disciple of the Maharshi, SAT is becoming known as "Ramana Ashram West," a Temple fully dedicated to Sri Ramana and pure Advaita (nonduality). Information on publications is one of many services provided; Indian music and dance concerts are another. You may request electronic delivery of a booklet describing a range of SAT Services, entitled "Among the Wise." Namaste, for SAT Services ************************************************************** -- Stan Rice, Autospec Inc, srice at cruzio.com s.rice1 at genie.geis.com From mhcrxlc at dir.manchester-computing-centre.ac.uk Thu Oct 20 18:42:06 1994 From: mhcrxlc at dir.manchester-computing-centre.ac.uk (mhcrxlc at dir.manchester-computing-centre.ac.uk) Date: Thu, 20 Oct 94 18:42:06 +0000 Subject: NIDHIS Message-ID: <161227017611.23782.11121471702642541132.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> > Re: Nidhi > > I remember reading in magical literature of the notion navanidhi, > the 9 nidhis, and a ritual to get rich by finding them, but can't > recall where I saw it. I have a vague feeling it might be a > Jaina idea. > > Allen Thrasher > thrasher at mail.loc.gov > Yes, this jogged my memory. It is indeed a Jaina idea. See: K.R. Norman, "The Nine Treasures of a Cakravartin", _Indologica Taurinensia XI (1983) pp. 183-193 for references to various contexts. There is some link to naagas. Lance Cousins MANCHESTER, UK Telephone (UK): 061 434 3646 (International) +44 61 434 3646 Fax (UK): 061 275 3613 (International) +44 61 275 3613 From williams at uhdux2.dt.uh.edu Fri Oct 21 13:36:52 1994 From: williams at uhdux2.dt.uh.edu (williams at uhdux2.dt.uh.edu) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 94 08:36:52 -0500 Subject: Advaita book list service, Ramana Maharshi, SAT... Message-ID: <161227017615.23782.7910597274325619789.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Friends: Please send me the two book lists described in your mailing. Thanks very much. Pat Williams _______________________________________________________________________ Patrick S. Williams | Dept. of Social Sciences, U. of Houston-Downtown pwilliams at uh.edu | One Main Street, Houston, TX 77002-1001 | voice: (713) 221-8982, fax: (713) 221-8144 From ai927 at FreeNet.Carleton.CA Fri Oct 21 16:52:33 1994 From: ai927 at FreeNet.Carleton.CA (ai927 at FreeNet.Carleton.CA) Date: Fri, 21 Oct 94 12:52:33 -0400 Subject: Advaita book list service, Ramana Maharshi, SAT... Message-ID: <161227017617.23782.1224173173048508868.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> >this message and ask for Part 1 or 2. (This is NOT an auto- >mailer.) The exquisite teaching of Ramana is for us all to share. Dear Stan Rice, please send both parts. Thanks very much. I am reassured to hear that you have not become an auto- mailer! namaste noel evans ai927 at freenet.carleton.ca >?From THRASHER at MAIL.LOC.GOV 21 1994 Oct GMT 17:14:17 Date: 21 Oct 1994 17:14:17 GMT From: ALLEN W THRASHER Subject: DUTT'S MBH.: UNUSUAL FORMAT Any library with more money to spare than LOC may be interested in acquiring this title from Grant and Shaw, Edinburgh: Valmiki. Ramayana. Translated into English prose from the original Sanskrit.... Published (edited and translated) by Manmatha Nath Dutt. Calcutta, 1889-94 BOUND FROM THE ORIGINAL MONTHLY PARTS, 7 VOLS. IN 4, 8vo. This is item no. 141 in catalogue 23. The address is: Grant & Shaw, Ltd. 62 West Port Edinburgh EH1 2LD tel. 031-229-8399 fax 031-229-8393 The preservation of the original publishing history might be of interest, though there may well be several copies bound the same way in various libraries. Allen Thrasher From LEHMANN at VAX2.CONCORDIA.CA Sat Oct 22 14:18:24 1994 From: LEHMANN at VAX2.CONCORDIA.CA (LEHMANN at VAX2.CONCORDIA.CA) Date: Sat, 22 Oct 94 09:18:24 -0500 Subject: sabhaparvan Message-ID: <161227017619.23782.15800732019506660829.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dear Fred. The same thing happened to me so I can empathize. The problem in my case was the font I was using which was not encoded as per the International Association of Sanskrit Studies system. I had no problem when I switched to Washington Indic Roman regular which does have the correct encoding. I believ you can find this at the Indology ftp site though you may have to covert the PC Truetype to Mac Truetype before you start. There is a shareware Called TT Converter (and another called Font Clerk I believe) that does this. Good luck. From nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov Mon Oct 24 20:36:19 1994 From: nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov (nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov) Date: Mon, 24 Oct 94 15:36:19 -0500 Subject: Pudukkottah History Message-ID: <161227017621.23782.4094217680982793305.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Pudukkottah History --------------------- I glanced through the recent book: Joanne Punzo Waghorne The Raja's magic: re-visioning kingship and and divinity in England's India. Penn State University press, 1994 Splendid photos from colonial era and a thorough study of Thondaman kings. This follows Nicholas Dirks' work, The Hollow Crown. But Pudukkottah came into being only very late and a British creation. Far more important is Ramnad Sethupatis' contribution. They have much older history. Their patornage to Tamil letters/poets and culture is truly great. They founded the Madurai Tamil Sangam, started the first research journal in Tamil called Senthamizh. Recently some good works in Tamil on Ramnad have come out. The main researcher is S. M. Kamaal. "1) viTutalaip pOril cEtupati mannar, cennai, 1987" "2) iraamanaatapuram maavaTTam: cila varalARRuk kuRippukal" Other books I have seen are: "M. Ragahva AiyankAr, cEtunaTum tamizhum" "R. Raghava AiyankAr, centamizh valartta tEvarkaL" "cirancIvi, cEtupatikal varalaru" "Ira. Ilankumaran, Nankam Tamilc cankam" "Je. Rajamukamatu, putukkOTTai mAvaTTa varalARu" Somalay's "Ramanathapuram Mavattam" is good. In English, I also have read papers by Dr. Pamela Price. By the way, Pudukkottah Raja is one of the first Tamils to marry an European by name Molly Fink. A book has come on this. Edward Duyker, Coralie Younger Molly and the Rajah: Race, Romance and the Raj. Sylvania: Australia, 1991 (Australian Mauritian press) Another earlier interracial marriage is Ananada K. Coomaraswamy's parents. Then Bharatanatyam exponent Rukminidevi's wedding to Dr. Arundale come to my mind. I think one urgent need is to preserve the photographs from the families of Zamins, Nobles, Rich Merchants etc., Since then, times have changed, properties got divided or lost. For example, the photo albums of Sethupathis of Ramanad, Sivaganga should contain rare portraits of many poets,etc., We know only their books, but not the faces! Hope someone like Dr. Price can write a book (with pictures) on Ramnad and Sivaganga. Do you have J. P. Waghorne's address? Thanks a lot. N. Ganesan nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov Original-Received: from ccMail by ccmail.GSFC.NASA.GOVid AA783114039 Tue, 25 Oct 94 12:40:39 EST PP-warning: Illegal Received field on preceding line Date: Tue, 25 Oct 94 12:40:39 EST From: ashok_sharma at ccmail.GSFC.NASA.GOV Message-Id: <9409257831.AA783114039 at ccmail.GSFC.NASA.GOV> To: indology at liverpool.ac.uk Subject: Origin and symbology of "Monsoon rain" October 26, 1994 I am working on a fiction book titled : Cry before the Monsoon Gods. In that context, I would like to have some indological views and ideas regarding the source origin, myths, symbology and rituals associated with word "monsoon rains", beginning from Sanskrit and early Vedic literature to more contemporary era. Ashok Sharma ashok_sharma at ccmail.gsfc.nasa.gov From z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us Tue Oct 25 19:24:55 1994 From: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us (The Skeptic) Date: Tue, 25 Oct 94 15:24:55 -0400 Subject: Origin and symbology of "Monsoon rain" Message-ID: <161227017626.23782.842471649729856424.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I understand it derived from the same root as "Mausam" or season. This word is probably from Persian but some one else can give you better etymology. Aditya Mishra Phone/FAX 305-746-0442 (Please leave message) email: z900672a at bcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us PRODIGY: TVDS96A From adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu Tue Oct 25 23:57:32 1994 From: adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu (adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu) Date: Tue, 25 Oct 94 16:57:32 -0700 Subject: Origin and symbology of "Monsoon rain" Message-ID: <161227017628.23782.10796524687642959341.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The English "monsoon" does come from "mausam", which is not Persian but Arabic in origin. "Mausam" is the Arabic word for season or time, and is a loan-word in Persian, Hindi and several NIA languages, but is not found in Sanskrit. Aditya Behl Department of South and Southeast Asian Studies, 1203, Dwinelle Hall, University of California, Berkeley, California 94720. Electronic Mail: adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu Telephone: 1 (510) 642-1610 (O), 843-1264 (R) Facsimile: 1 (510) 642-3582 From CHANDRA at ksg1.harvard.edu Tue Oct 25 23:18:56 1994 From: CHANDRA at ksg1.harvard.edu (KARTHIK ANAND CHANDRAMOULI) Date: Tue, 25 Oct 94 18:18:56 -0500 Subject: Asian American Policy Review -- Call for Papers Message-ID: <161227017848.23782.10334522901173359764.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Dr. Hawley, Hi, I am sending this to you in hopes that you might be able to help us out. I am on the staff of the Asian American Policy Review and we are looking for articles for our upcoming issue on Immigration. Enclosed is the Call for Papers for the Asian American Policy Review. If you are interested, submit something. We are accepting student submissions. Please pass this on to everyone you think might be qualifed or interested, or, if you can, please send me email/call me and put me in touch with people, even if you've only heard of/read their work. I would appreciate it if you could canvas your colleagues and friends who are practitioners in these areas or advocates for these issues. We really need to get articles soon so we can go to print by the end of the semester. In any case, I'd appreciate it if you could tell me who you send this to so we can keep them in mind for future issues. Thanks for the help. Email me if you have any questions. MOST IMPORTANT: WE ARE TRYING TO GET SOUTH ASIAN AMERICAN POLICY ISSUES OUT INTO THE MAINSTREAM AND THIS IS ONE OF THE BEST WAYS TO DO IT. IF YOU CAN STRESS THIS TO THE SOUTH ASIANS THAT YOU KNOW, THAT WILL HELP US TO BROADEN THE ASIAN AMERICAN POLICY REVIEW TO INCLUDE THOSE COMMUNITIES Karthik Chandramouli South Asia Caucus Kennedy School of Gov't. Harvard University -------------- ASIAN AMERICAN POLICY REVIEW CALL FOR PAPERS VOLUME 5: A SPECIAL INVESTIGATION ON IMMIGRATION AND THE LIFE OF IMMIGRANTS The Asian American Policy Review is a non-partisan, academic journal devoted to the critical examination of political, economic, and social policy issues affecting Asian Pacific America ns. The AAPR is produced by graduate students at the John F. Kennedy School of Government at Harvard Univ ersity and the Graduate School of Public Policy at the University of California-Berkeley. Submissions focusing on the following issues will be given high priority: -- social and cultural adjustment issues (domestic violence, identity crises, assimilation, bilingualism, political empowerment) -- health care delivery -- welfare reform -- affordable housing -- primary and secondary education in underprivileged communities -- labor -- legal immigration issues We are concerned with specific policy issues as well as some survey research on broad areas of policy as they relate to recent immigrants (i.e., 1st, 1.5, and 2nd generation APAs). We are looking for scholarly work but it does not have to be from the perspective of an academic. Articles from practitioners or advocates in the community are always encouraged. We are also looking for articles that explore the diversity within the Asian American group. Articles that target specific Asian American subgroups (e.g., Indian Americans, Vietnamese Americans, etc.) rather than all Asian Americans as a whole would be preferred, but there is no formal restriction. Submissions should follow the following guidelines: -- the paper must be ORIGINAL and UNPUBLISHED and include both a hard copy and a copy on disk (preferrably Microsoft Word for the Macintosh) -- Suggested length: 8-10 pages for commentaries, 15-25 pages for articles -- Please send us a two to three paragraph abstract of the paper ASAP, preferrably by fax or email Email: chandra at ksg1.harvard.edu (contact: Karthik Chandramouli) Fax #: (617) 496-9027 Asian American Policy Review c/o John F. Kennedy School of Government 79 John F. Kennedy Street Taubman 269 Cambridge, MA 02138 (617) 495-1311 (Office Telephone) From l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no Tue Oct 25 09:38:45 1994 From: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no (l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no) Date: Tue, 25 Oct 94 19:38:45 +1000 Subject: Printing CSX Message-ID: <161227017622.23782.11892892700405926284.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Does anybody know how you can print CSX characters on a laser printer? I can run my computer in CSX mode and get all the right characters on screen, but I cannot print them. (I don't use Windows, by the way). Is there a way to get correct printout without Windows, or for that matter: is it possible to get correct printouts *with* Windows. And if so: Where do I get the right print files, if such files exist. Best regards, Lars Martin Fosse Lars Martin Fosse Department of East European and Oriental Studies P. O. Box 1030, Blindern N-0315 OSLO Norway Tel: +47 22 85 68 48 Fax: +47 22 85 41 40 E-mail: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no From hsa01dk at goldsmiths.ac.uk Tue Oct 25 18:59:42 1994 From: hsa01dk at goldsmiths.ac.uk (hsa01dk at goldsmiths.ac.uk) Date: Tue, 25 Oct 94 19:59:42 +0100 Subject: Journal of Buddhist Ethics Publication News Message-ID: <161227017624.23782.15526957983425657894.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> The Journal of Buddhist Ethics is pleased to announce the publication of the following Discussion Article: Title: Vinaya in Theravaada Temples in the United States Author: Paul David Numrich Publication Date: October 24th 1994 ABSTRACT //Vinaya// (the monastic discipline) plays an essential role in defining traditional Theravaada Buddhism. This article examines the current state of //vinaya// recitation and practice in the nearly 150 immigrant Theravaada Buddhist temples in the United States, and also speculates on the prospect of traditional Theravaada's firm establishment in this country. Specific //vinaya// issues discussed include the //paatimokkha// ceremony, the discussion about //vinaya// adaptation to the American context, adaptations in the areas of monastic attire and relations with women, and principles of adaptation at work in Theravaada temples in the United States. ABOUT THE AUTHOR Paul David Numrich teaches at the University of Illinois at Chicago. His E-mail address is: U25818 at UICVM.UIC.EDU RETRIEVAL INSTRUCTIONS Material published by the Journal of Buddhist Ethics may be read and retrieved via the World Wide Web, Gopher, or anonymous FTP. 1) World Wide Web: a hypertext version is available via the following URL's: http://www.cac.psu.edu/jbe/jbe.html http://www.gold.ac.uk/jbe 2) Gopher: An ASCII text version is available from Penn State University's Gopher: Type: 1 Host: ftp.cac.psu.edu Port: 70 Selector: 1/jbe or Goldsmiths' Gopher: Type: 1 Host: scorpio.gold.ac.uk Port: 70 Selector: 1/jbe 3) Anonymous FTP: An ASCII text version is available from ftp.cac.psu.edu in the directory /pub/jbe or ftp.gold.ac.uk in the directory /pub/jbe. If you have difficulty in obtaining any item please contact the Journal's Technical Editor Dr. Wayne R.Husted (jbe-ed at psu.edu). ************************************************* Damien Keown Department of Historical & Cultural Studies University of London, Goldsmiths London UK, SE14 6NW ************************************************* From ST3A8 at Jetson.UH.EDU Wed Oct 26 05:54:35 1994 From: ST3A8 at Jetson.UH.EDU (ST3A8 at Jetson.UH.EDU) Date: Wed, 26 Oct 94 00:54:35 -0500 Subject: Could you answer these questions, please? Message-ID: <161227017630.23782.12305596903290215304.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Hello: I was wondering if you would be able to answer two questions for me: 1) What is the research going on the city of Dwarka (the one Indian archaeologists claimed to be Krishna's city)? 2) Is there any evidence in favor of Krishna's historicity? I have been looking for these answers intensenly in the past two to three days: any and all help will be greatly appreciated. Sincerely yours, Binoy K. Samuel From magier at columbia.edu Wed Oct 26 13:18:13 1994 From: magier at columbia.edu (David Magier) Date: Wed, 26 Oct 94 09:18:13 -0400 Subject: Origin and symbology of "Monsoon rain" Message-ID: <161227017632.23782.16448258338361549949.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> > I understand it derived from the same root as "Mausam" or season. This > word is probably from Persian but some one else can give you better > etymology. American Heritage Dictionary lists monsoon as deriving from the obsolete Dutch word monssoen, from the Portuguese mon,c~ao, from the Arabic mausim. My PLATTS Urdu, Classical Hindi and English Dictionary (never far from my side) also shows the Urdu word mausim deriving from Arabic mausim (time, season), from the root wasama ('brand, describe'). Apparently, Persian does not use this word for the meaning of time or season. David Magier Original-Received: from ellis.uchicago.edu by midway.uchicago.edu for indology at liverpool.ac.uk Wed, 26 Oct 94 11:10:35 CDT PP-warning: Illegal Received field on preceding line From: david carl swain Resent-Message-Id: <9410261610.AA27975 at midway.uchicago.edu> Date: Wed, 26 Oct 94 11:08:48 CDT Resent-To: indology at liverpool.ac.uk Resent-Date: Wed, 26 Oct 94 11:08:48 CDT Resent-From: david carl swain Message-Id: Apparently-To: >> I understand it derived from the same root as "Mausam" or season. This >> word is probably from Persian but some one else can give you better >> etymology. > American Heritage Dictionary lists monsoon as deriving from the > obsolete Dutch word monssoen, from the Portuguese mon,c~ao, from the > Arabic mausim. My PLATTS Urdu, Classical Hindi and English Dictionary > (never far from my side) also shows the Urdu word mausim deriving from > Arabic mausim (time, season), from the root wasama ('brand, > describe'). Apparently, Persian does not use this word for the meaning > of time or season. > David Magier Haim's Shorter Persian-English Dictionary (Tehran, 1982) lists "mausim" (A.), meaning "Season. Time." However, another Arabic loan word, "fasl," may be more common (in Persian) for "season." David Swain From adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu Wed Oct 26 16:29:30 1994 From: adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu (adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu) Date: Wed, 26 Oct 94 09:29:30 -0700 Subject: Origin and symbology of "Monsoon rain" Message-ID: <161227017634.23782.17969133906795135495.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> >> I understand it derived from the same root as "Mausam" or season. This >> word is probably from Persian but some one else can give you better >> etymology. > >American Heritage Dictionary lists monsoon as deriving from the >obsolete Dutch word monssoen, from the Portuguese mon,c~ao, from the >Arabic mausim. My PLATTS Urdu, Classical Hindi and English Dictionary >(never far from my side) also shows the Urdu word mausim deriving from >Arabic mausim (time, season), from the root wasama ('brand, >describe'). Apparently, Persian does not use this word for the meaning >of time or season. Persian does use mausam as a loan word from Arabic, cf. Steingass, p. 1344, to mean time, season, place of meeting, the season of the Hajj, etc., as well as in izafat constructions such as mausam-i bahaar, the season of spring, mausam-i khizaan, autumn, and so on. The Persian usage is probably the intermediate step for the Urdu borrowing from the Arabic, and then, as you've shown, the word goes through Portuguese into European languages. Aditya Behl From entwistl at u.washington.edu Wed Oct 26 22:47:04 1994 From: entwistl at u.washington.edu (Alan Entwistle) Date: Wed, 26 Oct 94 15:47:04 -0700 Subject: Origin and symbology of "Monsoon rain" Message-ID: <161227017636.23782.16856729412616853167.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Do we need to propose Persian as an intermediary? See "Hobson-Jobson", which suggests that the Portuguese adopted it directly from Arab pilots. Alan Entwistle On Wed, 26 Oct 1994, Aditya Behl wrote: > >> I understand it derived from the same root as "Mausam" or season. This > >> word is probably from Persian but some one else can give you better > >> etymology. > > > >American Heritage Dictionary lists monsoon as deriving from the > >obsolete Dutch word monssoen, from the Portuguese mon,c~ao, from the > >Arabic mausim. My PLATTS Urdu, Classical Hindi and English Dictionary > >(never far from my side) also shows the Urdu word mausim deriving from > >Arabic mausim (time, season), from the root wasama ('brand, > >describe'). Apparently, Persian does not use this word for the meaning > >of time or season. > > Persian does use mausam as a loan word from Arabic, cf. Steingass, p. 1344, > to mean time, season, place of meeting, the season of the Hajj, etc., as > well as in izafat constructions such as mausam-i bahaar, the season of > spring, mausam-i khizaan, autumn, and so on. The Persian usage is probably > the intermediate step for the Urdu borrowing from the Arabic, and then, as > you've shown, the word goes through Portuguese into European languages. > > Aditya Behl > > > From nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov Thu Oct 27 14:31:42 1994 From: nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov (nas_ng at lms420.jsc.nasa.gov) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 94 09:31:42 -0500 Subject: Ramnad History Message-ID: <161227017637.23782.4723005556819002859.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> History of Ramanathapuram ************************* Prof. Pamela Price is writing a book on Ramnad and Sivaganga. It will be published by Cambridge university press. These are some references on Maravar country/ Ramnad district S. M. Kamal ("es. em. kamAl") is a very good researcher. His "cEtupati mannar ceppETukal" (copper plate grants issued by cEtupathis, a work collected and edited by him). I have seen his "irAmanAtapuram mAvaTTam: cila varalARRuk kuRippukal", ""viTutalaip pOril cEtupati mannar". Other books of imporatance are: "M. Ragahva AiyankAr, cEtunaTum tamizhum" 1930's "M. Raghava AiyankAr, centamizh valartta tEvarkaL" 1930's "cirancIvi, cEtupatikal varalaru", 1981, Apirami Paplikesans, Madras, 174 p. "Ira. Ilankumaran, Nankam Tamilc cankam" "Je. Rajamukamatu, putukkOTTai mAvaTTa varalARu" Somalay's "Ramanathapuram Mavattam" is good. K. C. Kamaliah, Iramappaiyan ammAnai: Or ArAycci, Madras, 1980 K. C. Kamaliah, pANTitturait tEvar pATiya kAvaTiccintu, 1984, 70 p. Ira. NirmalatEvi, muttu vicaya rakunAta cEtupati mItu cokkanAtak kavirAyar pATiya paNaviTu tUtu. Madras, International Institute of Tamil Studies, 1980, 116 p. Given Ramnad's patronage to and interest in Tamil culture, I am sure in 6 to 10 hands, there are very rare pictures of important people, say, in the period 1880-1930. Also, good photos of the palaces of Ramnad and Sivaganga, the murals of Ramalinga vilasam, Rameswaram temple pictures, the temple contains Setupathi portraits in pillars, the coins struck by Sethupatis can be included in a book on Ramnad. I have seen a nice picture of Bhaskara Setupathi in 'Vivekananda, a biography in pictures', Calcutta, 1977, 119 p. R. Nagaswamy has a paper on Ramalinga Vilasam murals in Robert Skelton, Facets of Indian art. London: V & A museum. 1986 Madurai university PhD thesis on cEtupatis exists. I think it is by K. Seshadri. Also, Tamil university published R. Raghava Aiyangar's "irArAcEcuvara cEtupati mItu orutuRaikk kOvai" putukkOTTai history ******************* Joanne Punzo Waghorne The Raja's magic: re-visioning kingship and and divinity in England's India. Penn State University press, 1994 Splendid photos from colonial era and a thorough study of Thondaman kings. This follows Nicholas Dirks' work, The Hollow Crown. Sincerely, N. Ganesan nas_ng at lms461.jsc.nasa.gov From adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu Thu Oct 27 17:06:30 1994 From: adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu (adi at uclink2.berkeley.edu) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 94 10:06:30 -0700 Subject: Origin and symbology of "Monsoon rain" Message-ID: <161227017639.23782.13610905090001732657.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> >Do we need to propose Persian as an intermediary? See "Hobson-Jobson", >which suggests that the Portuguese adopted it directly from Arab pilots. That seems eminently possible too. The word was obviously borrowed by several different languages. Aditya Behl From thrapp at helios.nosc.mil Fri Oct 28 00:05:40 1994 From: thrapp at helios.nosc.mil (thrapp at helios.nosc.mil) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 94 17:05:40 -0700 Subject: Yoga Sutra verse differences Message-ID: <161227017642.23782.3244001057340039913.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I have noticed a discrepancy between versions of the Yoga Sutras in chapter 1, verse 35. The last word of the verse in some versions is 'sthitinibandhanii' and and in others it is 'sthitinibandhinii'. 'nibandhanii' appears to the nominative singular of a feminine noun meaning 'bond'. 'nibandhinii' seems to be the nominative singular, feminine form of the adjective 'nibandhin' meaning 'producing'. The entire verse is "vi.sayavatii vaa prav.rttirutpannaa manasa.h sthitinibandh[a|i]nii." I am a beginning student of Sanskrit and there are many things about the grammar of this verse that confuses me. In some ways 'nibandhinii' seems to fit making the last part of the verse "producing steadiness of mind" but then I wonder if the adjective of 'sthiti' would appear at the end of the compound and if the compound would be in the nominative. The alternative with 'nibandhanii' seems to be "the bond of steadiness of mind." Perhaps this could be an equivalence with the first part of the verse meaning " is the bond of steadiness of mind" which would explain the nominative case. I would greatly appreciate your thoughts on which version is accurate, and any comments on the whole verse. Thank you very much. ------------------------------------------------------------- Gary R. Thrapp thrapp at nosc.mil From czm1 at cornell.edu Thu Oct 27 22:36:37 1994 From: czm1 at cornell.edu (czm1 at cornell.edu) Date: Thu, 27 Oct 94 18:36:37 -0400 Subject: maitraksajyotika Message-ID: <161227017641.23782.15800564348500894092.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Friends on this list who work on the dharmasastras: Manusmrti 12.72 predicts that a vaisya who slips from dharma will be reborn as a maitraaks.ajyotika, which at least one commentator renders as a being who has an eye in his anus. [What is more, he will be puuyabhuk, a pus-eater, although how he gets the pus into his mouth when his eye is around behind is difficult to imagine, or perhaps one doesn't wish to imagine.] The question is this - are there other Sanskrit or Indic sources that refer to a creature with this unusual ocular endowment ? In medieval european sources there is reference to Satan being so endowed, and so I wonder how well-attested the notion is in ancient India. Thanks, C. Minkowski, Cornell From E.Crangle at mailbox.uq.oz.au Fri Oct 28 04:52:52 1994 From: E.Crangle at mailbox.uq.oz.au (Edward Crangle) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 94 14:52:52 +1000 Subject: New book announcement. Message-ID: <161227017644.23782.1423648301780779219.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Please excuse cross-posting. This posting announces the following publication: Crangle, Edward F. _The Origin and Development of Early Indian Contemplative Practices_, Volume 29 in the _Studies in Oriental Religions_ series, edited by Walther Heissig and Hans-Joachim Klimkeit, Wiesbaden: Harrassowitz Verlag, 1994. XIII, 314 pages. (ISBN 3-447-03479-3) ABSTRACT: Historical studies concerning the origin and development of early Indian contemplative practices fall into two main camps. One major school of thought argues for a Vedic origin developing linearly through the _Upani.sads_ to the Buddhist canonical literature; the other postulates a synthesis of Vedic/Aaryan methods and ideas with indigenous yogic practices. This work seeks to contribute to an eventual resolution of this problem by examining certain of the most relevant textual evidence from a critical historical perspective. The study is restricted to the practices of the earliest significant and formative periods, as portrayed in the _.Rg Veda_, the principal _Upani.sads_ , and the _Paali Sutta Pi.taka_. The source texts are examined in the original Sanskrit or Paali and in English translation. The Vedic and Upani.sadic traditions are covered in Chapters 2 and 3 while the Buddhist is dealt with in Chapter 4. In Chapter 2, the contemplative dimension of the hymns of the _.Rg Veda_ is analysed. This is done to determine if, and to what degree, there exist likely Vedic antecedents for meditative practices found in the principal _Upani.sads_ and the _Paali Suttas_. In Chapter 3, the principal _Upani.sads_ are similarly examined. The possiblity of cross-fertilisation of ideas with early Buddhism and other heterodox systems is considered. A major focus of this chapter is the practices of _upaasanaa_ and _yoga_, which together encompass most aspects of Upani.sadic contemplation. The ultimate synthesis of _upaasanaa_ and _yoga_ techniques in later_Upani.sads_ is examined. Chapter 4 appraises the extent of possible influences on Buddhist practices from Braahma.nic sources. This chapter aims mainly to gauge the extent to which _vipassanaa_, _pa~n~naa_ etc. were practices and concepts independently developed in Buddhism. In doing so, it also determines to what extent these practices may be a carry-over from orthodox sources. The concluding chapter 5 summarises the evidence and offers a discussion regarding the origin and the development of meditative practices in India noting possible influences, cross-fertilisations, etc. The method of the early Vedic contemplative, the _.r.si_, provides the basis for the development of orthodox contemplative praxis: the practice of the _.r.si_ foreshadows the later practice known as _upaasanaa_ (worship/meditation), first referred to in the _Braahma.nas_. The mental performance of the sacrifice represents an embryonic stage in the growth of _upaasanaa_, which becomes fully developed in the _Upani.sads_. The data derived from this examination of Vedic texts suggest an influence on Vedic contemplatives by pre-Aaryan _yogins_ of aboriginal origin. Further, the data reveal an early distinction between two meditative approaches which later merge. This undermines theories arguing for a purely Vedic/Aaryan origin for Indian contemplative practices; as well, it reinforces the view that yogic disciplines were practiced initially as a separate method from those documented in the early Vedic hymns. The evidence derived from the _Upani.sads_ suggests that the ideas and fundamental techniques of _yoga_ have been appropriated by the _Upani.sads_ from heterdox sources. Buddhism is the most probable source. This conclusion further undermines the theory of a purely linear development. The sudden appearance of explicit detailed references to _yoga_ in the post-Buddhist _Upani.sads_ lends support to the theory of a synthesis of indigenous, yogic practices with the Aaryan methods and ideas. The practice and progression of _vipassanaa_ and _pa~n~naa _in Buddhism have clearly developed independently of orthodox contemplative practices. These practices in no way represent a carry-over from orthodox sources. Similarly, the _yoga_ practices, involving jhaanic techniques taken up by the later Upani.sadic sages and extensively documented by the Buddhist contemplatives, appear to be heterdox practices probably of indigenous origin. The antecedent practice of _upaasanaa_ resembles a contemplative technique of early Buddhism, namely mindfulness (_satipa.t.thaana_) As the method of _upaasanaa_ predates early Buddhism, Buddhist _satipa.t.thaana_ techniques probably owe their genesis to the Vedic stream of contemplative practice, while also owing an indirect debt to the early non-Vedic contemplatives. The objects of _satipa.t.thaana_, however, are peculiarly and entirely Buddhist in origin. The evidence indicates that early Indian contemplative practices developed neither in a simple linear fashion nor as a result of a single synthesis. It indicates, rather, a zigzag progression wherein Aaryan/Braahma.nical contemplative practices both influenced, and were influenced by, indigenous yogic disciplines. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Dr Edward F. Crangle E-mail: e.crangle at mailbox.uq.oz.au Department of Studies in Religion Phone: (7) 3652154 University of Queensland Home: (7) 3719687 St Lucia Fax: (7) 3653071 Queensland 4072 Australia +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From SALENDER at delphi.com Fri Oct 28 21:18:29 1994 From: SALENDER at delphi.com (SALENDER at delphi.com) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 94 17:18:29 -0400 Subject: Modern Bengali; multimedia Message-ID: <161227017646.23782.3148369428384921629.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> As a newbie, I should like to know if anyone here can help with availability of any multimedia/audio/video materials for learning Bengali. I'm quite eager to find something; otherwise, I may have to think about developing my own! Yikes! Thanks. Bruce Salender e-mail SALENDER at DELPHI.COM From breusch at students.wisc.edu Fri Oct 28 23:33:51 1994 From: breusch at students.wisc.edu (breusch at students.wisc.edu) Date: Fri, 28 Oct 94 18:33:51 -0500 Subject: The laryngeal theory Message-ID: <161227017648.23782.15140315184545838447.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I would like to request for help with the laryngeal theory. I am a graduate student and, after reviewing some of the relevant litearture, am still not certain about the status and significance of the theory. [1] To my knowledge, some of the aspirated sounds in IE have been analyzed by some scholars in terms of the "laryngeal" sound(s) found in Hittite, which are denoted by "h" (one or more) and whose phonological expression is uncertain. [2] On the other hand, Panini has stated that the "external effort" added to the pronunciation of language sounds includes aspiration (or lack of it), voicedness (or lack of it), and nasalization (or lack of it). [3] In many western languages, such as English for example, aspiration only makes for allophones (not for different phonemes, as is the case in Sanskrit). [4] The logic of the "added or external effort" is applied to add "h" to some sounds and thus create new sounds (this is done by western scholars). But nobody has proposed yet a theory that would imply add voicedness or nasalization, as far as I know (I may be wrong), because voicedness and nasalization in western languages go beyond the point of allophone-ness, i.e. they make different phonemes. [5] A far as I know, in Sanskrit the voiced aspirates are phonemes, wiht the same status as unvoiced unaspirated sounds, for example. I would appreciate it if someone could take the time to clarify this issue for me. Thanks. Beatrice Beatrice Reusch breusch at students.wisc.edu 311 North Hancock # 111 Madison, WI 53703 608-256-6268 (voice & fax) From fp7 at columbia.edu Sat Oct 29 12:02:01 1994 From: fp7 at columbia.edu (Frances Pritchett) Date: Sat, 29 Oct 94 08:02:01 -0400 Subject: Modern Bengali; multimedia Message-ID: <161227017650.23782.6034004856995610305.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> Bengali is a lucky language, because it has Clint Seely's excellent materials for the Mac. They are available from him for a modest fee . They are also listed, along with other teaching materials, on the ILM list. Most people on the INDOLOGY network know what that is by now, so I won't bore them, but if you want me to send you a description of how to find it on our South Asia Gopher, let me know. On Fri, 28 Oct 1994 SALENDER at delphi.com wrote: > As a newbie, I should like to know if anyone here can help with > availability of any multimedia/audio/video materials for learning > Bengali. I'm quite eager to find something; otherwise, I may have > to think about developing my own! Yikes! > Thanks. > > Bruce Salender > e-mail SALENDER at DELPHI.COM > > From l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no Sat Oct 29 04:43:21 1994 From: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no (l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no) Date: Sat, 29 Oct 94 14:43:21 +1000 Subject: The laryngeal theory Message-ID: <161227017655.23782.15616738740301236586.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> >I would like to request for help with the laryngeal theory. I am a graduate >student and, after reviewing some of the relevant litearture, am still not >certain about the status and significance of the theory. > ....... >Thanks. >Beatrice >Beatrice Reusch >breusch at students.wisc.edu >311 North Hancock # 111 >Madison, WI 53703 >608-256-6268 (voice & fax) > In comparative linguistics, the laryngeal theory is used to explain parts of the phonological development of the indo-european languages. Three original laryngeals are posited, often called H1, H2 and H3. These phonemes are used to explain such phenomena as e.g. the lengthening of short vowels (compensatory lengthening) such as eH, iH, uH > ee, ii, uu. In Sanskrit, the root dam, for instance, has the ppp daanta < *dmHta (the m is sonantic). A comprehensive introduction to the theory is given by Fredrik Otto Lindeman: Introduction to the 'Laryngeal Theory', Norwegian University Press, 1987, ISBN 82-00-02628-0 Pbk. Be adviced that there is a certain amount of discussion going on about the theory, and some scholars might disagree with some of Lindeman's views. However, to my best knowledge, the theory has not been discarded, even if details and points of interpretation are controversial. Best regards, Lars Martin Fosse Lars Martin Fosse Department of East European and Oriental Studies P. O. Box 1030, Blindern N-0315 OSLO Norway Tel: +47 22 85 68 48 Fax: +47 22 85 41 40 E-mail: l.m.fosse at easteur-orient.uio.no From mmdesh at umich.edu Sun Oct 30 21:51:51 1994 From: mmdesh at umich.edu (Madhav Deshpande) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 94 16:51:51 -0500 Subject: The laryngeal theory Message-ID: <161227017657.23782.11303639228257606663.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> One may offer some clarification concerning Reusch's second point. It is more accurate to say that it is the Paninian tradition as enshrined in the different versions of the Paniniya Siksa which regards aspiration, voicing and nasality as produced by baahya-prayatna or external efforts. Panini's own view can be only indirectly inferred. These features are indeed phonemic in modern terms and cause a difference between Varnas even in the ancient Indian phonetic systems. Within the Paninian system, the term baahya-prayatna simply means that these features do not prevent two sounds from becoming savarNas or homogeneous class-members as defined by P.1.1.9 (tulyaasyaprayatnam savarNam). Beyond this limited purpose, there is nothing 'external' signified by the term baahya. Madhav Deshpande Fri, 28 Oct 1994, Beatrice Reusch wrote: > I would like to request for help with the laryngeal theory. I am a graduate > student and, after reviewing some of the relevant litearture, am still not > certain about the status and significance of the theory. > > [1] To my knowledge, some of the aspirated sounds in IE have been analyzed > by some scholars in terms of the "laryngeal" sound(s) found in Hittite, > which are denoted by "h" (one or more) and whose phonological expression is > uncertain. > > [2] On the other hand, Panini has stated that the "external effort" added > to the pronunciation of language sounds includes aspiration (or lack of > it), voicedness (or lack of it), and nasalization (or lack of it). > > [3] In many western languages, such as English for example, aspiration only > makes for allophones (not for different phonemes, as is the case in > Sanskrit). > > [4] The logic of the "added or external effort" is applied to add "h" to > some sounds and thus create new sounds (this is done by western scholars). > But nobody has proposed yet a theory that would imply add voicedness or > nasalization, as far as I know (I may be wrong), because voicedness and > nasalization in western languages go beyond the point of allophone-ness, > i.e. they make different phonemes. > > [5] A far as I know, in Sanskrit the voiced aspirates are phonemes, wiht > the same status as unvoiced unaspirated sounds, for example. > > I would appreciate it if someone could take the time to clarify this issue > for me. > > Thanks. > Beatrice > Beatrice Reusch > breusch at students.wisc.edu > 311 North Hancock # 111 > Madison, WI 53703 > 608-256-6268 (voice & fax) > > > From lnelson at pwa.acusd.edu Mon Oct 31 06:12:11 1994 From: lnelson at pwa.acusd.edu (Lance Nelson) Date: Sun, 30 Oct 94 22:12:11 -0800 Subject: VHP and United Way (fwd) Message-ID: <161227017662.23782.11908971031342623527.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I'm forwarding the following forwarded message, FYI. LN ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Lance Nelson Phone: 619/260-4054 Theological & Religious Studies FAX: 619/260-2260 University of San Diego E-mail: lnelson at pwa.acusd.edu San Diego, CA 92110-2492 U.S.A. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Ms. Jo-Anne Johnson Campaign Director, AT&T United Way Dear Ms. Johnson, I am unhappy to learn that the Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP) -- "World Hindu Council" -- has established a Donor Choice Agency code with the United Way, so that United Way donors can direct their tax-deductible donations to the VHP. The VHP has a well documented record of aggressive activities to aggravate social conflict in India. In the guise of an organization that merely fosters the Hindu culture, the VHP has fostered religious hate and attacks on Muslims. The demolition of the Babari Mosque in Ayodhya, on December 6, 1992, symbolizes the goals and the results of VHP organizing efforts, which I hate to think are being supported by the United Way. It is doubtful that the United Way has undertaken the association with the VHP that is represented by the establishment of a donor choice agency code with full knowledge of the VHP's activities in India and of the important role that donations in America play in fomenting religious conflict in India. I think it is likely, in fact, that the VHP has represented itself to the United Way as a purely "cultural organization" supporting such events as musical concerts and dance performances. In India, too, the VHP represents itself as a cultural organization, but in that guise it propagates a cultural program that describes Muslims as foreign invaders of India who deserve to be second class citizens if they are not expelled from the country as potential traitors. If you are interested in having more information on the nature of the VHP, I would be happy to put you in contact with scholars who are specialists on the subject. Last summer, I believe, AT&T decided to withdraw an offer for donations to VHP when the nature of the VHP was clarified. I look forward to hearing from you on this matter. It is a grave concern for all of us who respect the integrity of the United Way and work to make its campus fund-raising campaigns successful. Sincerely, David Ludden Chair, Department of South Asia Regional Studies University of Pennsylvania From rsalomon at u.washington.edu Mon Oct 31 18:40:57 1994 From: rsalomon at u.washington.edu (Richard Salomon) Date: Mon, 31 Oct 94 10:40:57 -0800 Subject: Origin and symbology of "Monsoon rain" Message-ID: <161227017661.23782.17126587128081850328.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> My understanding of Ashok Sharma's query is that he was not really asking for the etymological replies that he got, but rather for more general literary and cultural information. If this is the case, a good place to start, from the classical Sanskrit side, might be the collection of verses on the rainy season in Section 10 of Vidyaakara's Subhaa.sita-ratnakos'a, translated by D.H.H. Ingall's as An Anthology of Sanskrit Court Poetry (abridged edition: Sanskrit Poetry from Vidyakara's "Treasury"). -Richard Salomon On Tue, 25 Oct 1994 ashok_sharma at ccmail.GSFC.NASA.GOV wrote: > > > October 26, 1994 > > I am working on a fiction book titled : Cry before the Monsoon Gods. > In that context, I would like to have some indological views and ideas > regarding the source origin, myths, symbology and rituals associated > with word "monsoon rains", beginning from Sanskrit and early Vedic > literature to more contemporary era. > > > Ashok Sharma > > ashok_sharma at ccmail.gsfc.nasa.gov > > > From alok at hyundo.pufs.ac.kr Mon Oct 31 15:48:15 1994 From: alok at hyundo.pufs.ac.kr (alok at hyundo.pufs.ac.kr) Date: Mon, 31 Oct 94 15:48:15 +0000 Subject: Help Message-ID: <161227017659.23782.11134748282415482028.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> I'm trying to subscribe/connect with your discussion forum for Sanskrit, Pali, etc. Could you please send me information about how to do so, Thank you, Alok Roy, Professor of Hindi Alok at hyundo.pufs.ac.kr From marcus.banks at anthropology.oxford.ac.uk Mon Oct 31 22:49:45 1994 From: marcus.banks at anthropology.oxford.ac.uk (marcus.banks at anthropology.oxford.ac.uk) Date: Mon, 31 Oct 94 22:49:45 +0000 Subject: VHP and United Way (fwd) Message-ID: <161227017664.23782.8176965082687945040.generated@prod2.harmonylists.io> >I'm forwarding the following forwarded message, FYI. LN [...] >Ms. Jo-Anne Johnson >Campaign Director, AT&T United Way > >Dear Ms. Johnson, > > I am unhappy to learn that the Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP) -- >"World Hindu Council" -- has established a Donor Choice Agency code with >the United Way, so that United Way donors can direct their tax-deductible >donations to the VHP. And for the non-North Americans amongst us, what is 'the United Way'? Marcus Banks, Oxford